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Hive Mind: Speculation


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10 hours ago, Tatum said:

ETA: if DNA can be used from a torso, then with or without the tattoo, I think Misty was wrong to be so cavalier about the possibility of the body being discovered, funny as it was.

The thing is that there are around 15,000 missing people in the U.S. at any time. And actually Adam's gender and age puts him in the biggest group of missing people (contrary to what we might think from media coverage). So while a torso provides DNA, in the absence of not having a reason to run it against a specific missing person's DNA, Misty was correct, because the bandwidth is not there to run a torso against the DNA of every missing person who remotely fits the parameters of the torso. But the tattoo, as an identifying mark, does give police a reason to run the torso against Adam's DNA to confirm.

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So, if Shauna had not killed Adam, but found out that 1. Jeff was not cheating on her, and actually did still love her, and 2. Jeff was the blackmailer and Adam was guilty of no more than possibly being a rubbernecker but did legitimately like her, and all the cards were on the table and she had to choose...who do you guys think she would have picked? I still think she would have chosen Jeff.

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On 1/18/2022 at 4:21 PM, peachmangosteen said:

Well, except how for some reason they won't admit the Jackie diary thing was just kind of a prop fail.

I JUST saw an article on this! They said it was not a mistake, but we will have to wait and find out why not.

 

Given that someone noticed the Spice Girls reference within the episode taking place in 1996 (technically the group formed in 1994 but did not have a single (in England) until summer 1996, and that's quite a reach that Van and Tai would have known about them before Wannabe was released, enough to have opinions on who is underrated)...I am little inclined to think the writers are just saving face on this one and are now going to back into the journal, vs. purposely putting in the post 1996 references and hope an eagle eyed viewer noticed it.

 

https://screenrant.com/yellowjackets-jackie-movie-journal-no-mistake-response/

Edited by Tatum
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21 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I JUST saw an article on this! They said it was not a mistake, but we will have to wait and find out why not.

 

Given that someone noticed the Spice Girls reference within the episode taking place in 1996 (technically the group formed in 1994 but did not have a single (in England) until summer 1996, and that's quite a reach that Van and Tai would have known about them before Wannabe was released, enough to have opinions on who is underrated)...I am little inclined to think the writers are just saving face on this one and are now going to back into the journal, vs. purposely putting in the post 1996 references and hope an eagle eyed viewer noticed it.

 

https://screenrant.com/yellowjackets-jackie-movie-journal-no-mistake-response/

Maybe they saw the Spice Girls on MTV? I know, it’s a reach 🙂.

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1 minute ago, Cinnabon said:

Maybe they saw the Spice Girls on MTV? I know, it’s a reach 🙂.

So, according to Wikipedia, the Spice Girls did come to LA in 1995 to meet with record executives, so it's possible Van and Tai would be aware of their existence, but they didn't record any albums until mid 1996.

 

That said, I am a little surprised Van would have an opinion on them in any time period. Clearly, a large number of people were listening to them, based on record/merchandising/ticket sales, but no one in my school would cop to liking them :). I remember in 1997 either Cracked or Mad magazine did an entire issue devoted to making fun of the Spice Girls, which we all read gleefully.

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25 minutes ago, Tatum said:

So, according to Wikipedia, the Spice Girls did come to LA in 1995 to meet with record executives, so it's possible Van and Tai would be aware of their existence, but they didn't record any albums until mid 1996.

 

That said, I am a little surprised Van would have an opinion on them in any time period. Clearly, a large number of people were listening to them, based on record/merchandising/ticket sales, but no one in my school would cop to liking them :). I remember in 1997 either Cracked or Mad magazine did an entire issue devoted to making fun of the Spice Girls, which we all read gleefully.

Yes, I think they made an error there including the Spice Girls. Do you remember “Sassy” magazine?

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23 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

Yes, I think they made an error there including the Spice Girls. Do you remember “Sassy” magazine?

I do! I never read it though, I liked Teen and YM and eventually Seventeen much better. Sassy was a little more fashion focused I think, which was never a huge interest of mine.

 

Fun tidbit about me, since Jackie's diary references Scream- Rose McGowan was my idol in the late 90s, and my username here (all the way back when Television Without Pity was Mighty Big TV in the late 90s) is a nod to her Scream character.

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5 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I do! I never read it though, I liked Teen and YM and eventually Seventeen much better. Sassy was a little more fashion focused I think, which was never a huge interest of mine.

 

Fun tidbit about me, since Jackie's diary references Scream- Rose McGowan was my idol in the late 90s, and my username here (all the way back when Television Without Pity was Mighty Big TV in the late 90s) is a nod to her Scream character.

I was about 10 years away older than these girls and my friends and I absolutely loved Sassy’s grunge prom edition! (Maybe 1992?) the editor then created Jane magazine and I subscribed to that for years in my 20s. I don’t know if this show’s Natalie would have, or if she would’ve been too cool for that 😆

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29 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

It seems pretty obvious to me they’re bullshitting about the diary because they don’t want to admit it was just a mistake. They’re lucky the audience gave them a good idea in it having been Shauna that was writing in it.

Oh, they absolutely are. The writers already admitted they didn't expect the fan base to be so rabid in their quest for Easter Eggs. I think some production assistant wrote a list of movies off the top of his/her head and that was it. My guess is they'll retcon the mistake and draw from the fan boards. Shauna will write the entries post-rescue.  

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1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

It seems pretty obvious to me they’re bullshitting about the diary because they don’t want to admit it was just a mistake. They’re lucky the audience gave them a good idea in it having been Shauna that was writing in it.

I do think the idea of Shauna having written the post 1995 entries is a good one. I’m sure the show creators never imagined that rabid fans would be freeze framing the shots🤣
 

here’s what they said about it:

A.L.: I will say, we did not necessarily anticipate people screen-shotting that the way they did. So to our minds, it was a character Easter egg, and not a plot Easter egg.

Shauna at some point does return from the wilderness, as we know, because we see Melanie Lynskey. So we felt like we could potentially dramatize her initial experience of that survivor’s guilt, and we thought there was something really compelling, to us at least, about this ritual of having to go to Jackie’s parents’ house every year and be this surrogate daughter figure to them, while having this intense feeling of complicity in Jackie’s death. What would that be like for her? How would she manifest those feelings of guilt? And so again, it’s something we didn’t fully dramatize this season, and we did not necessarily anticipate people locking onto those very, very tiny details and then assuming Jackie’s a time traveler.

https://www.vulture.com/amp/article/yellowjackets-season-1-finale-explained-showrunners-interview.html

Edited by Cinnabon
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I also get a kick of what they said here:

Jackie is not a time traveler,” Lyle says, before Nickerson adds, “If we ever start, like, a Jackie time-traveling storyline, that is a cry for help from the creative team. Like, someone is holding us [hostage]. We’re in trouble.” 

Edited by Cinnabon
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One thing I'm curious about is how many adult survivors we'll see in S2. Just doing a running tally we have:

Misty, Tai, Shauna and Nat as "knowns."

Travis, Jackie, Laura Lee are deceased, albeit in different time periods.

The unnamed redshirts are goners, unless the writers pull a Lost and start giving them random plotlines.

Lottie is a given.

No one mentioned Javi when Travis was murdered, so I'm writing him off as dead in 96/97. 

That leaves us with Coach Scott, Akilah, Mari and Van. 

Mari is the only one who fits the description of pit girl, so it's down to Akilah, Van and Coach Scott. Hopefully we get all three!

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3 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

I’m sure the show creators never imagined that rabid fans would be freeze framing the shots🤣

I don’t know how they didn’t realize this since it’s been happening for years lol. Like have they been living under a rock?

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32 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I don’t know how they didn’t realize this since it’s been happening for years lol. Like have they been living under a rock?

For what shows? Maybe they weren’t quite expecting quite so many YA types? I don’t know. 

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1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

I mean, Lost comes to mind lol.

And just, you know, literally any mystery show.

I didn’t watch Lost, and now I’m so glad, given the reactions I’ve seen to its ending. 

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2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I don’t know how they didn’t realize this since it’s been happening for years lol. Like have they been living under a rock?

Well, and also...if you didn't think people would look at it why would you write it? It's not like it takes that much time to google when a movie came out if you're already probably looking up the name of the main character in the movie you're writing down. 

It's such a simple thing that I really hope they weren't lying when they said they did it on purpose. The Spice Girls thing suggests it could be just laziness, though.

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9 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

Well, and also...if you didn't think people would look at it why would you write it? It's not like it takes that much time to google when a movie came out if you're already probably looking up the name of the main character in the movie you're writing down. 

It's such a simple thing that I really hope they weren't lying when they said they did it on purpose. The Spice Girls thing suggests it could be just laziness, though.

I don’t think they did it on purpose, that’s why they said they weren’t expecting viewers to scrutinize it like that:

And so again, it’s something we didn’t fully dramatize this season, and we did not necessarily anticipate people locking onto those very, very tiny details and then assuming Jackie’s a timetraveler.

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19 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

I don’t think they did it on purpose, that’s why they said they weren’t expecting viewers to scrutinize it like that:

And so again, it’s something we didn’t fully dramatize this season, and we did not necessarily anticipate people locking onto those very, very tiny details and then assuming Jackie’s a timetraveler.

Oh yeah, I'm with them on that. I just thought it was great when they said that it was part of the backstory - it makes sense to me. Plus it's a good character thing, which is a much better story than Jackie being a timetraveler.

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2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I mean, Lost comes to mind lol.

And just, you know, literally any mystery show.

Yes! Lots of shows throw "Easter eggs" in now just for the people who pause and screenshot. The Good Place had tons (most notably all the business/product names). Loki included a bunch of Marvel in-jokes (including The Revengers and Throg). Fringe hid an Observer, glyphs (that made up a cypher), and hints for the next episode in every ep. Person of Interest embedded codes that referenced famous literature. Mr. Robot made the entire show "hackable":

Quote

Conceptually, the idea seems simple: Any number, QR code, bar code, host name, or IP address that appears on the show also has a counterpart in real life. Plug that information into a browser, and you’ll go to a website. Freeze frame a scene, scan the code, and it will lead somewhere. (Decider has a good breakdown of many of these Easter eggs here.) Though the phone numbers are fake — Adana says NBCUniversal warned him of the risks of using real phone numbers — everything else is accessible in some form. “I wanted to give the viewer as much control of this story as possible, and have them really feel like they are a part of this narrative,” says Adana.

He continues, “You can log on to these sites, and then recreate and relive some of the hacks you see on the show. You can solve problems, and find codes hidden in the source code, or you can take answers from different Easter eggs and put them together, which will lead you somewhere else. It might give you a little bit of a hint for what is to come in the story. And usually, it doesn’t stop at the first page. Even if it is an ad for something, or if it is a very simple page, there is something else on that page that will lead you somewhere else.”

It's something showrunners should expect at this point, especially on a mystery show.

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No one seems to talk about what is going to happen with Shauna's baby? I assume that the baby would be due maybe 7-8 months after the crash, which would be 11-12 months before they are rescued. The chances of the baby surviving birth AND a year of life before rescue would be extremely minimal, I imagine. The baby would not be Callie since she is probably 17, and born 7-8 years after the rescue, though it would be her full sibling. I guess the craziest thing would be for that person to emerge in the modern story as a 24 year old. That would be crazy, though extremely unlikely.

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57 minutes ago, BigDfromLA said:

No one seems to talk about what is going to happen with Shauna's baby? I assume that the baby would be due maybe 7-8 months after the crash, which would be 11-12 months before they are rescued. The chances of the baby surviving birth AND a year of life before rescue would be extremely minimal, I imagine. The baby would not be Callie since she is probably 17, and born 7-8 years after the rescue, though it would be her full sibling. I guess the craziest thing would be for that person to emerge in the modern story as a 24 year old. That would be crazy, though extremely unlikely.

I’m assumIng she’s going to miscarry very soon. 

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12 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Well, and also...if you didn't think people would look at it why would you write it? 

Also this. It's like when writers act surprised when a ship takes off and becomes more popular than the ship the writers prefer (I'm looking at you, HIMYM writers). Like, why write a relationship in the show if you supposedly never thought about it becoming popular lol.

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13 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Well, and also...if you didn't think people would look at it why would you write it? It's not like it takes that much time to google when a movie came out if you're already probably looking up the name of the main character in the movie you're writing down. 

It's such a simple thing that I really hope they weren't lying when they said they did it on purpose. The Spice Girls thing suggests it could be just laziness, though.

That's what I can't figure out. The screenshot pages show a lot of different colored pens and drawings of popcorn buckets and other illustrations to theme the written lists. If some production assistant created that- that was a lot of work (way more work than googling "most popular movies 1995-1996). It's like they grabbed the actual diary of a 12 year old circa 2001, added Shauna's name to the journal entry, and called it good.

 

I have a hard time believing, even if Shauna is consciously trying to imitate a tween Jackie, that her character would ever be able to be so like, bubblegum-ish. I'd have an easier time believing Jackie's crazy mother wrote it. Actually, Jackie's mom would be the type to think Angela from American Beauty was aspirational.

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29 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

It's like when writers act surprised when a ship takes off and becomes more popular than the ship the writers prefer

Hee, I heard JK Rowling was Not Amused by the high level of Hermione/Draco erotica available on fanfiction.net.

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12 minutes ago, Tatum said:

I'd have an easier time believing Jackie's crazy mother wrote it. Actually, Jackie's mom would be the type to think Angela from American Beauty was aspirational.

Oh, that's a good idea. Maybe they'll go with that to cover their mistake lol.

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1 hour ago, Tatum said:

 

I have a hard time believing, even if Shauna is consciously trying to imitate a tween Jackie, that her character would ever be able to be so like, bubblegum-ish. I'd have an easier time believing Jackie's crazy mother wrote it. Actually, Jackie's mom would be the type to think Angela from American Beauty was aspirational.

That one's been making me think too. If her mom wrote it it would be purely delusional. 

If Shauna did it...it's a great insult!

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14 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

That one's been making me think too. If her mom wrote it it would be purely delusional. 

If Shauna did it...it's a great insult!

Well, the thing is, if you didn't watch the movie and just saw the movie posters or maybe saw a part of the trailer, you would maybe think Angela's character is the titular American Beauty. Perhaps Jackie's mom thought the whole movie was about how beautiful Mena Suvari was? If so that is slightly hilarious.

 

ETA: I'm totally kidding on this- Mia from Pulp Fiction and Sydney from Scream don't fit in and unlikely prissy Junior Leaguer Jackie's mom would even know about Pulp Fiction. The only thing all these characters have in common is they are the main person on the promotional movie poster, I believe.

Edited by Tatum
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36 minutes ago, Tatum said:

ETA: I'm totally kidding on this- Mia from Pulp Fiction and Sydney from Scream don't fit in and unlikely prissy Junior Leaguer Jackie's mom would even know about Pulp Fiction. The only thing all these characters have in common is they are the main person on the promotional movie poster, I believe.

But interesting if it's Shauna writing it if her feelings about Jackie are going through phases. Especially since Sydney is unkillable and Mia dramatically does not die after accidentally being given something fatal. Was the Bring it On Character Kirsten Dunst? Because that character is the leader of a team who finds out she's coasting on somebody else's work and tries to win on her own and isn't as creative as the people she was unintentionally stealing from iirc? But she acknowledges that.

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The production assistant responsible for this journal entries must have been too young to remember those movies and too lazy to do some simple research. Most of us here knew immediately which movies were post 1996.

Edited by Cinnabon
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1 hour ago, sistermagpie said:

But interesting if it's Shauna writing it if her feelings about Jackie are going through phases. Especially since Sydney is unkillable and Mia dramatically does not die after accidentally being given something fatal. Was the Bring it On Character Kirsten Dunst? Because that character is the leader of a team who finds out she's coasting on somebody else's work and tries to win on her own and isn't as creative as the people she was unintentionally stealing from iirc? But she acknowledges that.

Well, I think the writers are full of shit that these post 1996 references were intentional. But hey, I am bored, I will play along :).

 

I know people will see a lot of parallels between Angela and Jackie, but I don't see it, personally. Angela was a compulsive liar who was deeply insecure and tried to cover it up with false bravado. I think Jackie is more "big fish little pond" who was arrogant, and honestly believed people were jealous of her and was actually surprised to hear that wasn't the case.

I don't really think Torrance from Bring it On has much in common with Jackie either, other than being not interested in school work and not having much of an identity outside of cheerleading, and not much interest in cultivating one. Although I can totally see Jackie saying, Hate us cause we're beautiful but we don't like you either!

 

Cher from Clueless actually has the most in common from what I can see, thinking she knows everything and needs to always expel her expert advice to everyone, whether they want it or not.

 

I guess in the case of Rose from Titanic, she is engaged to a guy she's not into at all, and her mother is super overbearing.

 

I can't think of a single thing she has in common with Vada Sultenfuss, Kat from 10 Things, or Sydney from Scream.

 

For Mia, the only thing that is notable is that it's an ensemble cast, with several (for the time) big Hollywood names, Bruce Willis and John Travolta, and yet it's Uma Thurman- alone- who is on the most prevalent movie poster and VHS cover. Kind of in line with Jackie not being the star of the soccer team but being the captain anyways.

 

ETA: Kat from 10 Things did play soccer in the movie.

 

Edited by Tatum
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On 1/20/2022 at 7:24 AM, Tatum said:

So, if Shauna had not killed Adam, but found out that 1. Jeff was not cheating on her, and actually did still love her, and 2. Jeff was the blackmailer and Adam was guilty of no more than possibly being a rubbernecker but did legitimately like her, and all the cards were on the table and she had to choose...who do you guys think she would have picked? I still think she would have chosen Jeff.

I think, if in your hypothetical scenario Jeff doesn't find out about the affair, she would have stayed married to Jeff and carried on cheating with Adam.

If she had to choose at the insistence of Adam or Jeff (if Jeff did find out about Adam somehow), then I agree she would have stayed married to Jeff, although mainly because to divorce Jeff would require too much active agency on her part. If she were willing to initiate a divorce she would have left years ago.

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41 minutes ago, Sofie Fatale said:

Kind of random but did anybody notice that the actor that plays Jeff is also in the show The wilds? You know, that other show where teenage girls crash land in the wilderness and have to survive 🤣🤣

I kept thinking he looked familiar but couldn't place it and never bothered to look lol. Glad I know why now. That's pretty funny he's in 2 very similar, niche shows.

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43 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I kept thinking he looked familiar but couldn't place it and never bothered to look lol. Glad I know why now. That's pretty funny he's in 2 very similar, niche shows.

I’ve been watched “The Wilds” this week and never even realized that was the same actor. 

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On 1/21/2022 at 12:39 AM, Cinnabon said:

I’m assumIng she’s going to miscarry very soon. 

I’m assuming the baby is born alive and dies at some point. There is a deep sadness in the character and she seems to have trouble connecting with her living daughter. I think Callie knows that somehow she isn’t living up to something, and acts out over it. 

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How far along is Shauna by the end of season 1? I’m thinking 5 months; she has a bump. So she’s beyond an “easy” miscarriage at this point. If she loses the baby now, it would be a stillbirth and would likely involve a good deal of labour. I wonder if the writers even have a plan at this point.

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37 minutes ago, Shermie said:

How far along is Shauna by the end of season 1? I’m thinking 5 months; she has a bump. So she’s beyond an “easy” miscarriage at this point. If she loses the baby now, it would be a stillbirth and would likely involve a good deal of labour. I wonder if the writers even have a plan at this point.

I think they must have at least some ideas. Since the start of the show we've had Shauna pregnant at 17, then having one child clearly born years later. 

We don't even know if when Jeff read her diary and still loved her, if it meant he'd found out about their first child there.

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From what I read the show does have “a plan”.   They are not writing season to season like other shows.   There is a difference between making a few technical mistakes like getting the year wrong on when a band started or when a movie actually came out and having an overall plot for a show.   The actress who plays adult Shauna who I don’t want to look up right now whose name escapes me wouldn’t take the roll unless the show runners explained the show from start to finish to her.   It looks like a five year plan which is respectable and actually the kind of shows I like.  Not too short to tell a good story but not so long that they get crazy out of hand.

Edited by Chaos Theory
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They've kinda clarified that to say they pitched a 5 season plan to Showtime because apparently that's what networks want. They said they don't necessarily think it needs to go for that long and that they don't have it so plotted out that they can't change things if they need/want to. So, I think they have a basic idea of what they wanna do with it but not a completely mapped out plan, which I think is true for a lot of shows tbh. I'm sure Lost was the same way.

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4 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

They've kinda clarified that to say they pitched a 5 season plan to Showtime because apparently that's what networks want. They said they don't necessarily think it needs to go for that long and that they don't have it so plotted out that they can't change things if they need/want to. So, I think they have a basic idea of what they wanna do with it but not a completely mapped out plan, which I think is true for a lot of shows tbh. I'm sure Lost was the same way.

I thought it turned out Lost was pretty much lying about having a plan. Which showed.

On this show, though, so far it seems clearly planned out in a general way. We've seen clear bits of exactly what the women got up to back then. The first season ended with what was clearly the first step toward that. It's not like Lost where there's mysteries to puzzle over  for the characters. We, the audience, don't know what happened, but for the characters it's all pretty straightforward and emotionally everything tracked. 

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On 1/21/2022 at 8:39 AM, Cinnabon said:

I’m assumIng she’s going to miscarry very soon. 

I can see her miscarrying or suffering a stillbirth through malnutrition/starvation. Maybe it’s the thing that pushes her over the edge and towards cannibalism. 

Edited by Misty79
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What I think happens is that the girls do an ok job feeding themselves when weather is warm but once winter hits they completely run out of food and when Shauna’s baby is born deformed (due in part to the partial abortion she had on the early episodes) the baby screams a lot and eventually dies and becomes one of the first……uhhhh meals the girls eat that change who and what they are as a group.  

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54 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

What I think happens is that the girls do an ok job feeding themselves when weather is warm but once winter hits they completely run out of food and when Shauna’s baby is born deformed (due in part to the partial abortion she had on the early episodes) the baby screams a lot and eventually dies and becomes one of the first……uhhhh meals the girls eat that change who and what they are as a group.  

She didn’t have a “partial abortion.” Shauna screamed and stopped Tai before that wire touched her cervix and entered the uterus. It wouldn’t have caused any damage. 

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18 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

She didn’t have a “partial abortion.” Shauna screamed and stopped Tai before that wire touched her cervix and entered the uterus. It wouldn’t have caused any damage. 

Regardless my point is that I know as much about hunting as I figure these girls do…which is nothing.  But from what I can see they are hunting for food when they run out of food to eat and not keeping anything for the colder months.   Then again they are probably still hoping they get rescued “any day now” but when winter hits and snow piles up and they can’t even leave the cabin for days and even weeks and they didn’t prepare for it ahead of time they will get hungry real fast.    So I still say Shauna’s baby will either be stillborn or something will go wrong with the birthing of her baby and with no one there with real medical training it will die.   So here we are with fresh meat in the cabin and a bunch of very hungry girls……

Edited by Chaos Theory
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11 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

Regardless my point is that I know as much about hunting as I figure these girls do…which is nothing.  But from what I can see they are hunting for food when they run out of food to eat and not keeping anything for the colder months.   Then again they are probably still hoping they get rescued “any day now” but when winter hits and snow piles up and they can’t even leave the cabin for days and even weeks and they didn’t prepare for it ahead of time they will get hungry real fast.    So I still say Shauna’s baby will either be stillborn or something will go wrong with the birthing of her baby and with no one there with real medical training it will die.   So here we are with fresh meat in the cabin and a bunch of very hungry girls……

I agree that if born, that baby won’t have much of a chance. It would also be extremely tiny, so wouldn’t offer much sustenance even if they did eat it.

Edited by Cinnabon
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