S36.E14: The Best of Enemies

[peachmangosteen]

Quote

When two rivals becomes partners, they fear that their bad blood will keep them from winning. After losing what seems like thousands of partners and constantly being the Rogue Agent, Cory hopes to finally break his own curse.

Airs March 17th.

[Michichick]

Fucking CT. What an asshole. I wish Big T didn’t seem so quick to forgive his stupid ass.

I was very happy to see Aneesa win the mission. 

[AntFTW]

Amber loses a partner but is in the safest position anyone could be in, rogue with a skull. She can’t be voted into elimination or picked by the DAs. However, I feel she’s probably the easiest person for Big T to beat. Now I’m wondering who exactly would they put her against, Aneesa maybe?

...and Fessy kicks Nany in the face 🙄

Kyle had the right idea. BLOW UPTHE HOUSE! GOLD SKULL VS GOLD SKULL!

I think Kam complements Cory, but not vice versa. I think Cory drags down Kam. I think Cory would have been better off with Kaycee.

Edited March 18, 2021 by AntFTW

[Eolivet]

Fessy is such an ass. All brawn, no brains, walking around like he owns the place after two seasons.

Team chemistry is becoming a more interesting variable in these challenges as the season progresses.

[Lantern7]

I think the Skull system was good. The problem is that too many people are gone . . . so instead of the have-nots scrapping for their shot in the Crater, you got Cory as the only outsider. And then Aneesa convinced Kyle not to pit Darrell against another Skull-holder. My thinking is that if there had been leftover Skulls at the end, they wouldn't go to the needy. That would be a free ride, and Teege friggin' hates that shit.

Instead of a Darrell/CT rematch, Cory ends up beating Darrell. As always, Darrell takes it so well. I heard a few people suggest that the Crater was rigged against him, and I hope that isn't true. While I see Cory as a potential "face" for the franchise for the next few years, I don't think Darrell would automatically have been put out the pasture. He plays the game, he smacks around the English language like it owes him money, and he competes. He doesn't bring a shitload of drama. One thing: should we take his four titles with a grain of salt? He got those in the span of six seasons, but that was long, long ago. I think at least two seasons aren't easily streamed.

Mission was fun. Deep diving always puts nerves on edge. I'm happy Aneesa got the W. I'm not a huge fan and I think she should hang it up, but I don't think she's that huge a burden for any partner. CT & Kam could have gotten the win, but they talked over each other. Now CT is back with Big T . . . and while I like those two as a team, he did her dirty in terms of bailing on her for Kam. She managed to hold up in the mission while Cory failed. Last season, I was irritated that everyone wound up getting a shot at a Red Skull. This time, I'm hoping Tula gets her shot next week. I don't think she could win, but I know she's been enough fun to warrant her finishing this season.

Fessy steps to CT next week? Down, boy. I mean, Fessy has talent, but he's getting more irritating with each passing week. We're not talking Josh levels, but he's getting closer.

[angelamh66]

Very sorry to see Darrell go. I was hoping Cory would be the house vote then Aneesa and Kyle could have sent in Nany and Fessy as revenge for the partner switch.  Then I was hoping it would be a double elimination and Big T would take out Nany’s entitled ass in addition to Cory taking out Fessy. I think Cory would have won that elimination against anyone currently left in the house. 

[AntFTW]

16 minutes ago, angelamh66 said:

Very sorry to see Darrell go. I was hoping Cory would be the house vote then Aneesa and Kyle could have sent in Nany and Fessy as revenge for the partner switch.  Then I was hoping it would be a double elimination and Big T would take out Nany’s entitled ass in addition to Cory taking out Fessy. I think Cory would have won that elimination against anyone currently left in the house. 

I’ve wanted Fessy to be thrown in for quite some time now. This is his second season and he’s been getting a pass. He goes in and gets his skull and everybody leaves him alone because other people wanna go in... and he has numbers on his side.

As far as Cory being the house vote, I want drama but at the same time I’m kinda proud of them for being smart (specifically Leroy) and throwing in someone with a gold skull. The easy thing is to have the house vote be Cory but then that would mean EVERYBODY is up for grabs by the double agents. They left the team that’s easiest to pick for the DAs, ensuring that the DAs have a reason to pick Cory and Big T over the other teams.

Edited March 18, 2021 by AntFTW

[AntFTW]

Kam seems to be playing for her AND for Leroy. I would worry that she would be willing to let Leroy win over her or that she wouldn’t be as motivated to beat Leroy. I would feel like she’s playing for another team.

[aghst]

Bill Maher:  I don't know it for a fact ... I just know it's true ... that Kyle and Aneesa did not win that daily challenge.

The other teams which finished got through the water a lot faster than Aneesa and they didn't figure out the puzzle right away either.

It sure creates more drama in this episode because it would have been the easiest vote to throw in Kyle and Aneesa.  Instead, you had Leroy basically telling his "friend" that he was voting him in and Darrell says he's going to steel Kaycee then.

Then this event, they made the rope longer so that there would never be a tug of war.  Corey is fast but it was never close, no tug?  No drama!

Then you had Amber crying when Darrell was going around telling everyone in "Headquarters" that he was going to dump her ass for another partner.

Cory "I gotta feed my kids" Wharton looks Big T in the eyes right before stealing Cam.  He wins one elimination and now he's talking about his legacy.🤣

Then CT picks Big T.  But they kind of tipped it with CT saying Big T would have been better on that puzzle than Cam because she would have stood out of the way.  Kind of makes you think he was either prescient or this whole thing is scripted.

TJ says there's a long way to go but there are now 11 players and 10 skulls, all currently held.  So one more Daily and either Big T gets a shot or doesn't?  Because are there going to be 5 teams in the Final or just 3 teams?  In the past they've gone to the Final with 5 and then winnow it down to 3 in the second stage or day of the Final.  But maybe they won't do a protracted Final with them competing over two days and just go with 3 teams?

OK the wiki says there will be 16 episodes and then the Finale (and then presumably a reunion?).  So two more episodes!

Imagine if they had a double elimination in one of the last 2 episodes before the Finale!

 

 

[RedbirdNelly]

this show needs more game drama. I wanted Kyle and Aneesa to blow it up. Aneesa didn't seem to be considering "best impact on my game" besides not pissing people off and we're down to the end. 

I like Big T but she doesn't seem to think about game much. We're down to the end and she's still thinking about avoiding going against her friend. It's a game. 

[Jess14]

Yeah, the show needs to throw some twists in to get some drama. They could at least throw in a double elimination or scramble all of the partners - something. While I don’t really actively dislike anyone who is left (some annoy me more than others for sure), the contestants left either don’t bring the drama or they’re just not in a position to need to do anything at this point.

I’m not usually one who even cares about hook-ups, but beyond the bland Fessy/Gabby story, we haven’t even had drama on that front this season.  

ETA: Amber being rogue next week isn’t great for Big T. Just in terms of size, she is probably the easiest to beat (she or Nany). Now, I think Aneesa would be very beatable in the elimination that Leroy won. That elimination game is worst case scenario for Aneesa, but otherwise, l don’t think Big T would want to face her in an elimination. 

Edited March 18, 2021 by Jess14

[AntFTW]

32 minutes ago, Jess14 said:

Yeah, the show needs to throw some twists in to get some drama. They could at least throw in a double elimination or scramble all of the partners - something. While I don’t really actively dislike anyone who is left (some annoy me more than others for sure), the contestants left either don’t bring the drama or they’re just not in a position to need to do anything at this point.

I’m not usually one who even cares about hook-ups, but beyond the bland Fessy/Gabby story, we haven’t even had drama on that front this season.  

ETA: Amber being rogue next week isn’t great for Big T. Just in terms of size, she is probably the easiest to beat (she or Nany). Now, I think Aneesa would be very beatable in the elimination that Leroy won. That elimination game is worst case scenario for Aneesa, but otherwise, l don’t think Big T would want to face her in an elimination. 

Exactly! That’s been my whole gripe since Devin left. All the shit starters and pot stirrers are gone. I need a good balance of game and drama.

Everybody that’s left play a low key and straightforward game except for Kyle. But nobody’s willing to play dirty with Kyle.

...and ditto about Big T and Amber being rogue. I think she’d have a good shot against Aneesa in the elimination you mentioned and I also think she would have an even shot against Nany. I don’t think she would have enough numbers on her side to get Nany in though.

[shantown]

19 hours ago, Eolivet said:

Fessy is such an ass. All brawn, no brains, walking around like he owns the place after two seasons.

Quote

Fessy steps to CT next week? Down, boy. I mean, Fessy has talent, but he's getting more irritating with each passing week. We're not talking Josh levels, but he's getting closer.

I was just coming in here to say that with Josh gone it seems like Fessy has taken over the "big dumb oaf" in the house role!
 

19 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

I think the Skull system was good. 

I think I don't like the skull format only because it doesn't mesh with a voting format how they have it set up. It goes from everyone fighting not to be the vote to everyone begging to be the vote when they don't have one yet. I also think if you DQ in a mission you shouldn't be allowed to compete for a skull that day. I don't know - I guess having two gameplay formats mashed together does provide some drama but I think it just makes things overly vague and prone to meddling as the season progresses and it's hard to care. I like secret "twists" but not when they're without solid reasoning/merit.

I'm really sad to see Darrell go. Happy to see Aneesa get another win. She'll probably never win a final but she's not the horrible competitor everyone makes her out to be. Glad CT is still in the game even though he's kind of a dope these last couple episodes.

Edited March 18, 2021 by shantown
clarity

[Eolivet]

And another thing: what's with the recycled eliminations this season? "Yes, it's the same elimination from three weeks ago, but look! Now the poles are taller/there are more of them/you hit this cool button instead." I half-expect the final to be all the eliminations set up in a field in the Icelandic countryside a mile apart: first, throw balls through a wall. Then swing from a rope and collect puzzle pieces. Then you'll be tethered together and have to put rings on a pole and hit a button. Then it'll just be a hall brawl, except the ball will be on fire.

Either they were on a shoestring budget, or I'm seriously underestimating how much prior eliminations were comprised of "producer has a random idea, sends PAs running to the local home improvement store, challenge built that night," which the pandemic made impossible.

[LaurelleJ]

This episode made me nervous from start to finish. I like Leroy and Darrell, so seeing them at odds was tough, especially since Darrell said he would take Kaycee. I think Kam and Darrell would be a really strong team. Sad to see Darrell go, would have preferred him to stay over Corey, but I do like Corey. All through the elimination I was also nervous thinking that if Cory didn't stay with Big T, someone else would have picked Amber B, leaving Big T to be the rogue agent and without an opportunity to go into the next elimination. Then I was shocked when Cory picked Kam. Then I was shocked when CT picked Big T again. I thought that CT would go for Kaycee. 

It was a little sad watching Amber cry about Darrell going home, when he was saying that he would have stolen Kaycee If he won the elimination. I think at that point Leroy would not have chosen Kam, they needed to stay separate for a better chance to win. Leroy probably would have chosen Nany. It was interesting to hear Nany say that she wished she would have stayed with Kyle. That's why at this point, Leroy and Kaycee are the strongest team, they have been together the longest and have the best chemistry, which is extremely important in the final. 

So funny that Anessa and Kyle won, when Fessy and Nany were disqualified. TJ did a good fat when he said it was down to Kaycee/Lee and CT/Kam, then said that Anessa and Kyle won. Kyle dancing in front of Cory saying you can't have this was hilarious. 

[AntFTW]

Spoiler

So Aneesa lets slip on the Challenge podcast for this episode that the next girls' elimination, Amber was gonna the house target for the girls since the other girls with skulls obviously don't wanna go in. The girls were pissed because now Amber B is off the table. Obviously Big T was gonna be chosen to go in either way, so the person at the bottom of the totem pole was Amber.

 

[AntFTW]

8 minutes ago, LaurelleJ said:

This episode made me nervous from start to finish. I like Leroy and Darrell, so seeing them at odds was tough, especially since Darrell said he would take Kaycee. I think Kam and Darrell would be a really strong team. Sad to see Darrell go, would have preferred him to stay over Corey, but I do like Corey. All through the elimination I was also nervous thinking that if Cory didn't stay with Big T, someone else would have picked Amber B, leaving Big T to be the rogue agent and without an opportunity to go into the next elimination. Then I was shocked when Cory picked Kam. Then I was shocked when CT picked Big T again. I thought that CT would go for Kaycee. 

It was a little sad watching Amber cry about Darrell going home, when he was saying that he would have stolen Kaycee If he won the elimination. I think at that point Leroy would not have chosen Kam, they needed to stay separate for a better chance to win. Leroy probably would have chosen Nany. It was interesting to hear Nany say that she wished she would have stayed with Kyle. That's why at this point, Leroy and Kaycee are the strongest team, they have been together the longest and have the best chemistry, which is extremely important in the final. 

So funny that Anessa and Kyle won, when Fessy and Nany were disqualified. TJ did a good fat when he said it was down to Kaycee/Lee and CT/Kam, then said that Anessa and Kyle won. Kyle dancing in front of Cory saying you can't have this was hilarious. 

Well I think Darrell saying he would pick Kaycee was moreso a political move. Now, he may have actually done it if he got the chance but that wasn't really in the game plan for him because he intended on staying out of elimination if he could help it, meaning the opportunity to pick Kaycee wouldn't have been apart of the bigger picture.

I thought it was a good move on Darrell's part because Leroy has made it known that he wants to keep Kaycee as a partner. Everyone, and Leroy specifically, knows not to sleep on Darrell so everyone figures that Darrell just might come back from an elimination and pick Kaycee, which Leroy really doesn't want to happen.

Lastly, why do you think that CT would have chosen Kaycee?

Edited March 18, 2021 by AntFTW

[LaurelleJ]

16 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

Well I think Darrell saying he would pick Kaycee was moreso a political move. Now, he may have actually done it if he got the chance but that wasn't really in the game plan for him because he intended on staying out of elimination if he could help it, meaning the opportunity to pick Kaycee wouldn't have been apart of the bigger picture.

I thought it was a good move on Darrell's part because Leroy has made it known that he wants to keep Kaycee as a partner. Everyone, and Leroy specifically, knows not to sleep on Darrell so everyone figures that Darrell just might come back from an elimination and pick Kaycee, which Leroy really doesn't want to happen.

Lastly, why do you think that CT would have chosen Kaycee?

Yeah I forgot to write that. I thought it was a way for him to keep Leroy from trying to send him down, seeing as how he knew that Leroy wanted to keep Kaycee. I had lots of thoughts on the episode. He would be better off with Kaycee or Kam as a partner versus Amber. Saying it was a great political move, but it also would have been a good game move. Had he kept Amber, the next elimination she was surely going down against Big T, and if they pulled anything funny like a double elimination, his skull would also be in jeopardy. At that point in the game, anything could happen. 

I think that CT would have chosen Kaycee since Corey chose Kam for the same reason that CT ditched Big T and chose Kam. He wanted a strong partner with a skull to run the final. If Kam was taken from him, Kaycee was his next best option. 

[AntFTW]

2 minutes ago, LaurelleJ said:

I think that CT would have chosen Kaycee since Corey chose Kam for the same reason that CT ditched Big T and chose Kam. He wanted a strong partner with a skull to run the final. If Kam was taken from him, Kaycee was his next best option. 

I may have framed my question the wrong way, however CT was not able to pick Kaycee. He could only pick between Amber and Big T. He didn't have the option of picking Kaycee. Only the person that wins the elimination can steal a partner. The person who has their partner stolen can only pick from the "leftovers."

For CT, I thought it was a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation regarding picking between Big T and Amber because Big T is clearly going back down to the Crater and I thought it was very likely that Amber was gonna be the one going down against her.

[MaggieG]

51 minutes ago, LaurelleJ said:

So funny that Anessa and Kyle won, when Fessy and Nany were disqualified. TJ did a good fat when he said it was down to Kaycee/Lee and CT/Kam, then said that Anessa and Kyle won. Kyle dancing in front of Cory saying you can't have this was hilarious. 

I laughed at Nany saying she regrets picking Fessy. After she was all gung ho about picking him.

[ImpinAintEasy]

Sad to see Darrell go. He was the one I was rooting for. Now it’s down to LeRoy,Kyle, and Big T. I’ll be happy if any of them win. 
 

I think it’s obvious MTV favors Cory. They do tailor the eliminations to the players they want to win, and this one was clearly about speed. If I had to guess, I bet the final won’t include swimming in order to give LeRoy a better chance, as he’s clearly the preferred winner. 

[LaurelleJ]

30 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

I may have framed my question the wrong way, however CT was not able to pick Kaycee. He could only pick between Amber and Big T. He didn't have the option of picking Kaycee. Only the person that wins the elimination can steal a partner. The person who has their partner stolen can only pick from the "leftovers."

For CT, I thought it was a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation regarding picking between Big T and Amber because Big T is clearly going back down to the Crater and I thought it was very likely that Amber was gonna be the one going down against her.

Shows how much I paid attention to the game. For some reason I thought it was a move he could make. Oh well, then given the choice between the two, better to stick with what you know, and what he knew was Big T. 

I agree that whichever one CT picked, they would be going down to the crater in the next elimination. All the more reason, in my opinion, for Darrell to switch partners had he won. 

[angelamh66]

I think CT picked Big T because if she had been rogue she would have had no opportunity for a skull. As others have pointed out, whomever he picked was going to land him in the crater next week so he chose to help out Big T to make up for how he treated her. 

[AntFTW]

49 minutes ago, MaggieG said:

I laughed at Nany saying she regrets picking Fessy. After she was all gung ho about picking him.

The one thing that the Challengers aren't saying every time they pick him is that he comes with numbers. Fessy comes with a certain amount of safety. They pick Fessy for safety.

CT and Darrell would be great partners to win a final but they don't come with safety so they don't get picked.

Edited March 18, 2021 by AntFTW

[MaggieG]

4 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

The one thing that the Challengers aren't saying every time they pick him is that he comes with numbers. Fessy comes with a certain amount of safety. They pick Fessy for safety.

CT and Darrell would be great partners to win a final but they don't come with safety so they don't get picked.

This is true. Cory picking Kam is good in that aspect since that makes him part of that alliance as well.

[sara416]

16 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

I think the Skull system was good. The problem is that too many people are gone . . . so instead of the have-nots scrapping for their shot in the Crater, you got Cory as the only outsider. And then Aneesa convinced Kyle not to pit Darrell against another Skull-holder. My thinking is that if there had been leftover Skulls at the end, they wouldn't go to the needy. That would be a free ride, and Teege friggin' hates that shit.

Instead of a Darrell/CT rematch, Cory ends up beating Darrell. As always, Darrell takes it so well. I heard a few people suggest that the Crater was rigged against him, and I hope that isn't true. While I see Cory as a potential "face" for the franchise for the next few years, I don't think Darrell would automatically have been put out the pasture. He plays the game, he smacks around the English language like it owes him money, and he competes. He doesn't bring a shitload of drama. One thing: should we take his four titles with a grain of salt? He got those in the span of six seasons, but that was long, long ago. I think at least two seasons aren't easily streamed.

 

Bolded part is the best description I've read in a long time, and I love that expression. I will be incorproating that into my life, thank you! I do love people like Darrell who can play the game but still have a sense of humor about that. He didn't get all dude bro roid ragey when he lost that first round. Watching older seasons has reminded me of when there were more people like that who could laugh at themselves. Landon is a really good example of that. THere was a challenge outing where he got super drunk and people wrote on him with markers while he was asleep. He was able to laugh about it the next day and it was just so refreshing. 

[AntFTW]

I'm not understanding why the Challenge lifers are just letting the newbies run the game.

Why is it that Darrell, CT, Leroy, Nany, and Aneesa can't seem to get on the same page, get their shit together, run the game like the BB crew and cause havoc?

Why is it that the OGs are always splintered?

[joanne3482]

11 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

I'm not understanding why the Challenge lifers are just letting the newbies run the game.

Why is it that Darrell, CT, Leroy, Nany, and Aneesa can't seem to get on the same page, get their shit together, run the game like the BB crew and cause havoc?

Why is it that the OGs are always splintered?

I think it may be because the OGs have so much relationship bad blood between them from so much history. They seem incapable or unwilling to put some of it behind them even when it would help them.  They don't seem to grasp the enemy of my enemy is my friend concept. Although, for this season, only 10 out of the original 30 cast members were originally from Real World/Road Rules or Challenge. Everybody else had a different origin show. If 100% of the different origin show group banded together, they could completely wipe out the old school MTV crowd. 

[AntFTW]

40 minutes ago, joanne3482 said:

I think it may be because the OGs have so much relationship bad blood between them from so much history. They seem incapable or unwilling to put some of it behind them even when it would help them.  They don't seem to grasp the enemy of my enemy is my friend concept. Although, for this season, only 10 out of the original 30 cast members were originally from Real World/Road Rules or Challenge. Everybody else had a different origin show. If 100% of the different origin show group banded together, they could completely wipe out the old school MTV crowd. 

Only 4 people came from BB (I think) and they spread their tentacles. Josh took Kam and Nany, Kaycee took Leroy, Fessy was attached to Aneesa, Amber took Darrell. Fessy also had Nelson and Cory, and then made up with Cory after the Nelson thing.

There can't be that much bad blood to the point where the Lifers are incapable of doing the same thing.

Edited March 18, 2021 by AntFTW

[Jess14]

1 hour ago, AntFTW said:

I'm not understanding why the Challenge lifers are just letting the newbies run the game.

Why is it that Darrell, CT, Leroy, Nany, and Aneesa can't seem to get on the same page, get their shit together, run the game like the BB crew and cause havoc?

Why is it that the OGs are always splintered?

I definitely think the longtime vets should’ve gotten together early on, but looking at the list of people that you included, all but CT have been in an alliance for a while now. It’s just that they have all also been part of the BB Alliance. I think that’s really the question - should they have teamed up with BB or formed their own separate alliance? Given that all have made it this far, I’m not sure they would do anything differently. Even if you look at Darrell this week, it wasn’t really the BB people who got him into the crater. It was orchestrated by Leroy and Kam, and they didn’t want to throw in Fessy bc Nany (a longtime vet and friend of Leroy) would’ve also been exposed. I think had they been able to save Darrell and take a shot at Fessy without endangering Nany, they would have. 

[aghst]

I'm not even convinced that the players organize their own alliances.

Like that one recent season where Johnny and Wes are on the same alliance for a change, that looked concocted to support some narrative that they wanted to play up that season.

[peachmangosteen]

3 minutes ago, aghst said:

Like that one recent season where Johnny and Wes are on the same alliance for a change, that looked concocted to support some narrative that they wanted to play up that season.

I think so too, I just think it was Wes and Johnny who concocted it lol.

[aghst]

5 hours ago, MaggieG said:

I laughed at Nany saying she regrets picking Fessy. After she was all gung ho about picking him.

She was gung ho about the daily challenge.

So were Amber and Corey, who were all jumping up and down before the challenge and caused their teams to DQ.

[AntFTW]

5 hours ago, Jess14 said:

I definitely think the longtime vets should’ve gotten together early on, but looking at the list of people that you included, all but CT have been in an alliance for a while now. It’s just that they have all also been part of the BB Alliance. I think that’s really the question - should they have teamed up with BB or formed their own separate alliance? Given that all have made it this far, I’m not sure they would do anything differently. Even if you look at Darrell this week, it wasn’t really the BB people who got him into the crater. It was orchestrated by Leroy and Kam, and they didn’t want to throw in Fessy bc Nany (a longtime vet and friend of Leroy) would’ve also been exposed. I think had they been able to save Darrell and take a shot at Fessy without endangering Nany, they would have. 

I don't disagree with any of this.

I think they could have formed their own separate alliance and also worked with BB. It didn't have to be an either-or thing. The thing is they usually sit back and let others make the big moves. They basically did this season. Darrell is low key player. He will happily fade in the background or hide in plain site. CT is a low key player. He usually plays in the middle. Leroy is usually a low key player, but not so much this season. Nany plays a scared game. She usually wants to make no moves. Aneesa used to be too stubborn to be in an alliance. The older vets that are there are not the plotters and schemers. It takes initiative to start an alliance and its usually the plotters and schemers that have that initiative to make alliances. I think Wes was the only vet of the older class that had that initiative, and the rest just seem to go wherever the wind takes them until its time to pop up for one elimination and fade back into the background. Had they been willing to take the initiative that the BB crew had, Ashley and Wes may not have been among the first people out. They could have really take charge of the game from the beginning rather than eating each other.

Kam is a plotter. I would even venture to say that Kam is the reason Leroy, and perhaps even Nany (via her and Leroy's friendship), is still there. Kam is the one that integrated herself and Leroy into the BB alliance. Leroy just went along with it.

I realize in typing this that I may be answering my own question.

[TiffanyNichelle]

I cheered so hard for Aneesa and Kyle when they won because they were set up so hard for failure that I liked that things got turned on its head. Plus it feel so odd that most of the teams just happened to DQ but not Kam/CT & Leroy/Kaycee after all that talk about how either of those teams needed to win to protect the other. Not saying anything but just saying...

I was said to see Darrell go but wow Cory was ready and really kicked some ass. My feelings for his win was how I was supposed to feel about Nany's win. I had to laugh at both Nany and CT complaining about their new partners after they were so excited to drop their other partners. Aw, Kam and Fessy aren't living up to your expectations? They won't just let you do whatever? I was hoping Big T was going to turn CT down because it would be hilarious.

Here's hoping the Cory Curse doesn't hit Kam.

[shantown]

12 hours ago, AntFTW said:

Kam is a plotter. I would even venture to say that Kam is the reason Leroy, and perhaps even Nany (via her and Leroy's friendship), is still there. Kam is the one that integrated herself and Leroy into the BB alliance. Leroy just went along with it.

I haven't ever watched any of the other shows they pull people from so I just assumed Kam came from Big Brother since she seemed to be leading that alliance. She's done a good job at the physical and the social/political game!

[Jess14]

12 hours ago, AntFTW said:

I don't disagree with any of this.

I think they could have formed their own separate alliance and also worked with BB. It didn't have to be an either-or thing. The thing is they usually sit back and let others make the big moves. They basically did this season. Darrell is low key player. He will happily fade in the background or hide in plain site. CT is a low key player. He usually plays in the middle. Leroy is usually a low key player, but not so much this season. Nany plays a scared game. She usually wants to make no moves. Aneesa used to be too stubborn to be in an alliance. The older vets that are there are not the plotters and schemers. It takes initiative to start an alliance and its usually the plotters and schemers that have that initiative to make alliances. I think Wes was the only vet of the older class that had that initiative, and the rest just seem to go wherever the wind takes them until its time to pop up for one elimination and fade back into the background. Had they been willing to take the initiative that the BB crew had, Ashley and Wes may not have been among the first people out. They could have really take charge of the game from the beginning rather than eating each other.

Kam is a plotter. I would even venture to say that Kam is the reason Leroy, and perhaps even Nany (via her and Leroy's friendship), is still there. Kam is the one that integrated herself and Leroy into the BB alliance. Leroy just went along with it.

I realize in typing this that I may be answering my own question.

Agreed. They could’ve picked off rookies early on and then tried to take out BB. I also think the longtime vets threw away any opportunity to really own the game when they went along with the rookies in throwing Tori/Aneesa into the crater. Teresa then further splintered the vets by getting rid of Ashley. At that point, BB had the numbers, and of course it made sense to work with them, which was largely driven by Kam. She is really one of the few people there who seemed to show any long term critical thinking. 

I do wonder if this season would’ve turned out differently if a man and woman was eliminated each week. Thus, both members of the team would have to compete for a gold skull. I think we would’ve definitely seen one partner vote to go in (if they didn’t have a skull) and the other not. Would’ve introduced an extra element of drama and surprise. The rogue agent element just took out a lot of the potential drama, IMO, because that has always been a dead giveaway about whether it would be a male or female elimination. 

[lasu]

On 3/18/2021 at 1:06 AM, aghst said:

Then CT picks Big T.  But they kind of tipped it with CT saying Big T would have been better on that puzzle than Cam because she would have stood out of the way.  Kind of makes you think he was either prescient or this whole thing is scripted.

CT is wearing the same thing in a few of those interviews, and you can tell it was filmed after he was back with Big T.  So it was pretty easy for him to give an interview about how he would love to have her back - he already did.  Same thing with Leroy seeming so generous in his interview with about Darrell, saying he hoped D came back even if cost him Kacee.  Again, easy to say because he already knew that's not how things played out.

Not saying this is evidence against it being completely scripted, lol.

[AntFTW]

8 hours ago, lasu said:

CT is wearing the same thing in a few of those interviews, and you can tell it was filmed after he was back with Big T.  So it was pretty easy for him to give an interview about how he would love to have her back - he already did.  Same thing with Leroy seeming so generous in his interview with about Darrell, saying he hoped D came back even if cost him Kacee.  Again, easy to say because he already knew that's not how things played out.

Not saying this is evidence against it being completely scripted, lol.

IIRC, cast members have said that they also do interviews once they come back to the states (for the cast members that live in the states at least).

For me, I never thought the show was scripted but rather the circumstances are manipulated. They are put in a bubble that is completely made up and the cast is made to react to the circumstances that are thrusted upon them in the bubble.

Edited March 20, 2021 by AntFTW

[lasu]

38 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

IIRC, cast members have said that they also do interviews once they come back to the states (for the cast members that live in the states at least).

Yep.  Sometimes you can tell who is going to go very deep in the game because they will have interviews with a very different look, meaning MTV wanted interviews from them after they came home.  I don't think they bother with people who go out early.

[AntFTW]

3 hours ago, Jess14 said:

Agreed. They could’ve picked off rookies early on and then tried to take out BB. I also think the longtime vets threw away any opportunity to really own the game when they went along with the rookies in throwing Tori/Aneesa into the crater. Teresa then further splintered the vets by getting rid of Ashley. At that point, BB had the numbers, and of course it made sense to work with them, which was largely driven by Kam. She is really one of the few people there who seemed to show any long term critical thinking.

I think they threw away that opportunity on the very first elimination. Kam hatched a plan to put in CT and Ashley and all of the older vets, except Wes, hopped on that bandwagon. Aneesa voted in Wes and Natalie completely leaving themselves to the whims of the new class of rookies. The older vets came in the game with the nukes aimed at each other, meanwhile, the BB crew and the rookies had theirs also aiming at the older vets.

Theresa plays a weird game. She thought she was playing with the rookie girls and the rookies ultimately ended up voting her in... twice.

Theresa plays the same game every time. She had Aneesa thinking she's her #1 but she knew the rookies were coming for her and didn't tell Aneesa that the rookies are coming for her. She burns her vote on Tori, who is also aligned with Aneesa, simply so that she can say that she kept up her end of the "alliance" by not voting for Aneesa.

3 hours ago, Jess14 said:

I do wonder if this season would’ve turned out differently if a man and woman was eliminated each week. Thus, both members of the team would have to compete for a gold skull. I think we would’ve definitely seen one partner vote to go in (if they didn’t have a skull) and the other not. Would’ve introduced an extra element of drama and surprise. The rogue agent element just took out a lot of the potential drama, IMO, because that has always been a dead giveaway about whether it would be a male or female elimination. 

I wonder the same. We had a lot of untimely departures from cast members. I would have really liked to see what happens when all the skulls are allocated and you send two people in that don't have skulls. I feel like we would have seen that if we didn't have so many cast member drop out for their various reasons.

[Jillibean]

On 3/17/2021 at 11:51 PM, AntFTW said:

Kam seems to be playing for her AND for Leroy. I would worry that she would be willing to let Leroy win over her or that she wouldn’t be as motivated to beat Leroy. I would feel like she’s playing for another team.

I subscribe to their patreon, and Kam has been open about the fact that to her, Leroy winning would be as good as her winning. And it’s his last season, and she’ll have other opportunities. I imagine everyone there knows that, but she’s still an attractive partner because of how well rounded she is. 

On 3/18/2021 at 9:41 AM, Jess14 said:

I’m not usually one who even cares about hook-ups, but beyond the bland Fessy/Gabby story, we haven’t even had drama on that front this season.  

Even last season, we had some shenanigans that made the show more than just a competition show. Jordan sticking a three foot long sausage in Wes’ face while ranting about his maturity, the fire extinguisher fight, Wes and Johnny “redecorating“ for Kailah, Zach and Jenna fighting over facetime, Nany drunkenly throwing a cup o’noodles. To me, it’s that craziness and stuff you just can’t make up that makes this show the Challenge. I love the format this season, but I’m honestly a bit bored. This show needs more than just politics and missions and eliminations and eyeroll worthy fights that are actually just the same fight over and over. This season has been interesting, and I’ve enjoyed some of the partner stealing twists, but it’s also been very flat on the house reality.

On 3/18/2021 at 7:00 PM, peachmangosteen said:

I think so too, I just think it was Wes and Johnny who concocted it lol.

Yup. They apparently came together at the MTV movie awards after WotW2 and devised it. It made sense for both of them gamewise and “character” wise, and both men are essentially self-producing at this point, so it all adds up to me. 

4 hours ago, lasu said:

Yep.  Sometimes you can tell who is going to go very deep in the game because they will have interviews with a very different look, meaning MTV wanted interviews from them after they came home.  I don't think they bother with people who go out early.

I love the interview analysis game! What’s crazy is when you rewatch and realize how many of the interviews about a specific event had to have been filmed weeks if not months later. I think it’s common practice for all reality shows to do pick-up interviews later into the narrative process to add bits of explanation they need to form cohesive storylines. I’ve also heard that production sometimes runs behind on interviews, at which point players can pretend to be smarter than they are and talk about how they “predict” things they didn’t know at the time, but do know now, weeks later. Wes says this is why people claimed they knew about his alliance with Bananas, because they were very behind on interviews so everyone was weeks ahead of what they were filming narration for. He claims no one actually figured it out early on. 

Edited March 19, 2021 by Jillibean

[AntFTW]

3 hours ago, Jillibean said:

Even last season, we had some shenanigans that made the show more than just a competition show. Jordan sticking a three foot long sausage in Wes’ face while ranting about his maturity, the fire extinguisher fight, Wes and Johnny “redecorating“ for Kailah, Zach and Jenna fighting over facetime, Nany drunkenly throwing a cup o’noodles. To me, it’s that craziness and stuff you just can’t make up that makes this show the Challenge. I love the format this season, but I’m honestly a bit bored. This show needs more than just politics and missions and eliminations and eyeroll worthy fights that are actually just the same fight over and over. This season has been interesting, and I’ve enjoyed some of the partner stealing twists, but it’s also been very flat on the house reality.

Agreed! It's falling flat on shenanigans this season. Last season, I did think that some of it dragged out too long, but a lot of it I was here for. I would have loved to see the rest of that Dee drama after she got voted into elimination by the (Tribunal???) after Johnny asking Rogan for permission to vote her in. I would have loved to see what happened when they got back to the house.

All the people that would do those shenanigans aren't there. Frankly I think most of the people that are left are pretty boring. They aren't usually involved in the BS that we love seeing. We haven't seen drunk Nany all season. Wes wasn't there long enough to have a 3 feet sausage wagged in his face or redecorate someone's bunk with pictures of a significant other that they're cheating on but he was there long enough to be hit in the face with a shoe 😂

Edited March 20, 2021 by AntFTW