International Soccer/Football & UEFA Champions League

[proserpina65]

So today's matches were just as exciting as yesterday's, yay.  But boy, was Steve McManaman killing himself to avoid saying that Gareth Southgate's tactics were right for this match.

[DoctorAtomic]

I don't know that England and Germany really went for it until after 75' though. After the game opened up it was more exciting. 

England holds their shape in the back well though. I don't see that side of the bracket holding them back. 

I'm rooting for Belgium, but I think the winner of Belgium - Italy still wins. Belgium probably has the tactics to break England down. 

Sweden kind of got a break on the goal, but that game was more open. I'm glad Ukraine really went for it in ET after the red card. Waiting for penalties would have been weak. 

I liked how everyone was so gassed. That's really what I want to see - 1-1 or 3-3, I just want them going for it. 

[DoctorAtomic]

I may have to revise my prediction. I've been impressed with Italy, but quick strike England might have something to say. 

Granted, they have to deal with Denmark, and they shouldn't look past them. 

I'm not seeing if England are playing with the lead that they're going to squander it. 

[galaxygirl76]

So with England making the final four again, is it finally coming home? 

[DoctorAtomic]

Not if the Great Danes take them to penalties. Denmark is going to have to come out throwing haymakers and make England chase. That's a tall order. 

I can't see Italy beating them though. The Germany game showed England can be patient. 

[proserpina65]

On 7/3/2021 at 6:09 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

Not if the Great Danes take them to penalties. Denmark is going to have to come out throwing haymakers and make England chase. That's a tall order. 

I think England would be fine with penalties.  The World Cup showed that the crazy notion of actually training for them at the end of a training session works.

[proserpina65]

Damned if that Italy-Spain semi wasn't a nail biter.  I literally couldn't look during the penalty shootout and had to listen for the crowd reaction before rewinding to watch each kick.

[AimingforYoko]

On 7/5/2021 at 7:21 PM, proserpina65 said:

I think England would be fine with penalties.

England is very glad it didn't go to PKs. That said, that penalty was soooooft.

[DoctorAtomic]

Denmark had no hops after maybe 105'. They basically packed it in and let England try to break them down. That's fine if you're going to counter, but they couldn't even run out to the circle. 

It's tough to call a penalty in ET, but I didn't look to me that either defender got anywhere near the ball. It's not like Sterling immediately took a dive either. After the first contact he still beat the defender and push the ball ahead. The second guy basically just whiffed and got him in the leg.

Still - you had plenty of time to tie it up. 

On a neutral field, it may have been a different story. I'm giving the edge to England on Sunday. 

[proserpina65]

14 hours ago, AimingforYoko said:

England is very glad it didn't go to PKs. That said, that penalty was soooooft.

I think they are only from the pov of not extending the night longer.  They've actually been good with penalties since the 2018 World Cup.  'Cause Southgate actually makes them train for penalty shootouts.  Radical notion.

I think Sunday's game is either going to be wild and free-flowing, or one team is going to score and the park the bus.  I'm hoping for the former.

 

[DoctorAtomic]

I think it's going to be tight the whole time. 

[galaxygirl76]

Happy to see that Lionel Messi finally got his big tournament win with Argentina. 

[Danny Franks]

The England players? I like. Most of them are humble and empathetic and starting to realise that they have voices which can be used to make the lives of millions better. They also represent a diverse, modern and inclusive England. The fans, the media and the politicians looking to glom onto this success as a way to validate their own divisive, nationalist policies? Not so much.

Edited July 11, 2021 by Danny Franks

[galaxygirl76]

Seeing prince George so excited made my cold heart a little warmer. 

[emmawoodhouse]

I married an Italian, so I am rather obligated to say FORZA AZZURRI! 👽

[DoctorAtomic]

Here's a wild idea - kick the ball! 

All these hoppings up and down and standing there for 5 minutes don't score goals. 

[stealinghome]

Wow, PKs are in England’s head.

[emmawoodhouse]

Prince William consoles England.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRNCV5ClZqv/?utm_medium=copy_link

[proserpina65]

On 7/11/2021 at 5:57 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

Here's a wild idea - kick the ball! 

All these hoppings up and down and standing there for 5 minutes don't score goals. 

The concept is the extra stuff helps mess with the goalkeepers' ideas of which way the kick is going to go.  Sometimes it works (see Jorgino in the shootout against Spain) and sometimes it doesn't (see Jorgino against England).  Honestly, a lot of it is just luck, which you really can't train for.

[DoctorAtomic]

The fact that there's significant enough risk that it doesn't work all the time is reason enough that it's silly. And, sure, a lot is luck. So just kick the ball. 

In this set of PKs, one of them just roofed it into the upper 90, and another, even when the keeper went the right way, still blew it by him. 

The keeper isn't really looking at the player anyway, only when they plant their foot to kick. 

[proserpina65]

On 7/14/2021 at 6:08 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

The fact that there's significant enough risk that it doesn't work all the time is reason enough that it's silly. And, sure, a lot is luck. So just kick the ball. 

In this set of PKs, one of them just roofed it into the upper 90, and another, even when the keeper went the right way, still blew it by him. 

The keeper isn't really looking at the player anyway, only when they plant their foot to kick. 

I guess the players think it works often enough to be worth doing.  I don't play, so I couldn't really say for sure, but I think players do whatever they think will give them some advantage.  I do admit that it looks pretty silly, and I tend to hate it when the penalty kicks look really tentative as well.  As you say, just kick the ball, but I would add "hard".

[galaxygirl76]

FIFA has lost their minds

 

https://www.espn.com/soccer/fifa-world-cup/story/4471415/world-cup-every-two-years-european-club-body-firmly-opposes

[DoctorAtomic]

I doubt this would fly. I'm not a 'traditionalist' in most cases; typically, that's just an excuse not to do anything new because this is the way it's always been done. Practically, this would ruin player's careers. On top of the pro season and various champions' leagues, it's too many miles on their legs. 

They're not addressing how a qualifying schedule would go either. You'd have to effectively eliminate the continental tournaments. 

[wanderingstar]

Roman Abramovich confirms Chelsea are for sale and writes off £1.5bn loans

Russia suspended from all Fifa and Uefa competitions until further notice

[proserpina65]

On 3/3/2022 at 9:49 PM, Gillian Rosh said:

Russia suspended from all Fifa and Uefa competitions until further notice

Good.

[Lamb18]

Does anyone know anything about the Australian Football League or if games can be watched in the US? My new employer is headquartered in Australia and every year they have a Footy Tipping contest for employees. Part of signing up is picking your team so I picked the Geelong Cats because they have the best logo/mascot. There's no money involved here but whoever does the best gets prizes.

I have Fubo and they cover a lot of football/soccer but not Australian.

[proserpina65]

3 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Does anyone know anything about the Australian Football League or if games can be watched in the US? My new employer is headquartered in Australia and every year they have a Footy Tipping contest for employees. Part of signing up is picking your team so I picked the Geelong Cats because they have the best logo/mascot. There's no money involved here but whoever does the best gets prizes.

I have Fubo and they cover a lot of football/soccer but not Australian.

It looks like maybe FOX Sports covers it?

Geelong, eh?  I was a fan of the Essendon Bombers back when I watched in the 80s.  Sat up until the wee small hours to watch them win the Grand Final in 1984.

[Lamb18]

1 hour ago, proserpina65 said:

It looks like maybe FOX Sports covers it?

Geelong, eh?  I was a fan of the Essendon Bombers back when I watched in the 80s.  Sat up until the wee small hours to watch them win the Grand Final in 1984.

Well it looks like the Cats' first game is against the Bombers on the 18th, 10:10 pm. I don't know which time zone.

[emmawoodhouse]

1 hour ago, Lamb18 said:

Well it looks like the Cats' first game is against the Bombers on the 18th, 10:10 pm. I don't know which time zone.

That's probably Aussie time. The games tend to be on here overnight. I'm on the west coast and can sometimes catch an early game because I'm a night owl and the games are played on the weekend. 

Yes, it's FS1 and FS2 that covers them. 

[Danielg342]

Italy is out of the World Cup...again. Asleep at the wheel moments before the final whistle allows the North Macedonians to get their goal...*sigh*

As an Italian myself I couldn't be more disappointed. This team needs a major overhaul from the top down because this is inexcusable.

[bosawks]

13 hours ago, Danielg342 said:

Italy is out of the World Cup...again. Asleep at the wheel moments before the final whistle allows the North Macedonians to get their goal...*sigh*

As an Italian myself I couldn't be more disappointed. This team needs a major overhaul from the top down because this is inexcusable.

That goal was shocking it was like watching a car accident in slow motion and not being able to do anything.

As a non-partisan watcher it was a "wow" moment.

[Danielg342]

37 minutes ago, bosawks said:

That goal was shocking it was like watching a car accident in slow motion and not being able to do anything.

As a non-partisan watcher it was a "wow" moment.

Maybe one day I'll be able to admit that Alex Trajkovski (the goal scorer) simply made a good shot. I'm not sure it had any business going in from where it did, but the Italians only have themselves to blame for putting themselves in that situation in the first place. They may have been tired and waiting for extra time, but it's no excuse.

[proserpina65]

So the World Cup 2022 draw is done.

Group A: Qatar, Ecuador, Senegal, Netherlands

Group B: England, US, Iran, the winner of the Wales/Scotland/Ukraine playoffs

Group C: Argentina, Mexico, Poland, Saudi Arabia

Group D: France, Denmark, Tunisia, the winner of Peru/Australia/United Arab Emirates

Group E: Spain, Germany, Japan, the winner of Costa Rica/New Zealand

Group F: Belgium, Croatia, Morocco, Canada

Group G: Brazil, Switzerland, Serbia, Cameroon

Group H: Portugal, Uruguay, South Korea, Ghana

I'll have to think on it a bit, but the closest I see to a group of death is Group E.  England's got a pretty good group, even if Wales wins the last spot.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm hopeful for the US. That actually is a winnable group. 

[Just Here]

• So, the USMNT is back and they get England again (2010, 1950) and Iran again (1998), but narrowly missed out on the LOL trifecta by getting a UEFA play-off team instead of Ghana.
• The USA-ENG match will be on Black Friday (November 25th)!
• I'm not looking forward to the domestic political circus surrounding USA-Iran.
• Group B will likely be the toughest on paper, based on FIFA rankings, with England at #5 and the other three teams between 15 and 21 (USA and Iran, respectively), if #18 Wales gets in.
• MEX-ARG (Group C) looks to be the highest ranked match-up at the moment (#4 vs #9).
• Ghana gets a potential rematch against Suarez (2010 QF handball) with a group match against Uruguay.

 

Edit:  I'm choosing to interpret "established place in soccer" as shade.

Edited April 1, 2022 by Just Here

[proserpina65]

30 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I'm hopeful for the US. That actually is a winnable group. 

For England, it is.  Not so much for the US.  I can see them being safely in second, though.

 

[Just Here]

English tabloids never learn...

 

Edit: And the pièce de résistance...

 

Edited April 6, 2022 by Just Here
added tweet

[Just Here]

The preliminary match schedule for the men's World Cup is now available: FWC-2022-Match-Schedule.pdf.

All of the USMNT's group matches will be at 22:00 local time, which I guess translates to 2:00 pm Eastern time (using this time calculator).

USMNT / England

• Monday, November 21st: USA vs. EUR winner (WAL/SCO/UKR); England vs. Iran (16:00)
• Friday, November 25th: USA vs. England
• Tuesday, November 29th: USA vs. Iran; England vs. EUR winner (22:00)

Canada

• Wednesday, November 23rd: Canada vs. Belgium (22:00)
• Sunday, November 27th: Canada vs. Croatia (19:00)
• Thursday, December 1st: Canada vs, Morocco (18:00)

Mexico

• Tuesday, November 22nd: Mexico vs. Poland (19:00)
• Saturday, November 26th: Mexico vs. Argentina (22:00)
• Wednesday, November 30th: Mexico vs. Saudi Arabia (22:00)

Other notable matches:

• Wednesday, November 23rd: Germany vs. Japan (16:00)
• Thanksgiving Thursday, November 24th: Brazil vs. Serbia (22:00)
• Sunday, November 27th: Germany vs. Spain (22:00)
• Monday, November 28th: Brazil vs. Switzerland (19:00); Portugal vs. Uruguay (22:00)
• Wednesday, November 30th: Tunisia vs. France (18:00)
• Friday, December 2nd: Ghana vs. Uruguay (18:00)

All knock-out matches have kick-offs at 18:00 and 22:00 local time.

[DoctorAtomic]

Do the English not have the concept of 'bulletin board material'? 

[Lamb18]

I wonder if Ukraine will be a sentimental favorite.

[proserpina65]

On 4/1/2022 at 4:49 PM, Just Here said:

English tabloids never learn...

Is it the spelling?  Or the assertion that England got a pretty good draw?  Because the second thing is true; it's a really good draw.

On 4/1/2022 at 8:29 PM, Just Here said:

Friday, November 25th: USA vs. England

I won't even have to take the day off.  I get Black Friday off anyway.  But finding someplace showing the match that won't be filled with USMNT fans will be a real trick.  Even the pub I've gone to before, which is owned by an Englishman, will be problematic.

[Just Here]

1 hour ago, proserpina65 said:

Is it the spelling?  Or the assertion that England got a pretty good draw?  Because the second thing is true; it's a really good draw.

My "English tabloids never learn" comment was referring back to a well-known (at least among USMNT fans) December 2009 cover of "The Sun" (embedded below) from the day after the draw for the 2010 World Cup.

The main issue wasn't with whether the draw was 'good' or 'bad', but the choice of words like "easy"*, "lucky", and "dream", especially given the unpredictable aspects of soccer, such as injuries, players making costly gaffes (whether leading to goals or red cards), and questionable officiating.

*While searching for an image of that cover to embed, I found a tweet from the Sun that actually used the word "easy" to describe England's 2022 group draw, which I added to my previous post above.

Additionally, the use of "lucky" and "dream" both seem extra-hyperbolic as England did not get any of the lower-ranked teams from Pots 3 and 4.  To me, either Korea (29) and Ghana (60) -or- Tunisia (35) and Saudia Arabia (49) would have been more favorable.  Instead, England will face Iran and the UEFA play-off winner, both of which will have strong motivations to overperform against England:  Iran (politicized nationalism with a bonus of playing in the Middle East), Wales (Home Nations rivalry), Scotland (same), and Ukraine (national pride with a bonus of being a sentimental underdog).  The USMNT will also have a strong motivation as an underdog that has never lost to England in a World Cup.

 

(alternate link if embedded Flickr image doesn't show up)

But, the group didn't end up being "easy" for England, as they only had 2 points after two matches -- a 1:1 draw with the USA (due in part to Green's infamous howler on Dempsey's goal) and a scoreless draw with Algeria -- and needed a win against Slovenia to ensure advancement if the USA won their match against Algeria.  The USA did win that match (thanks to a now-legendary second-half stoppage time goal from Landon Donovan), thus forcing England to play Germany in the first knockout round, rather than Ghana.

(2010 World Cup Group C - Wikipedia)

[DoctorAtomic]

Is England-USA on Black Friday? Brilliant.

But that's what I meant by bulletin board material. Especially in a region of the world that leaves it wide open. 

[CheshireCat]

On 4/1/2022 at 2:06 PM, proserpina65 said:

So the World Cup 2022 draw is done.

Group A: Qatar, Ecuador, Senegal, Netherlands

Group B: England, US, Iran, the winner of the Wales/Scotland/Ukraine playoffs

Group C: Argentina, Mexico, Poland, Saudi Arabia

Group D: France, Denmark, Tunisia, the winner of Peru/Australia/United Arab Emirates

Group E: Spain, Germany, Japan, the winner of Costa Rica/New Zealand

Group F: Belgium, Croatia, Morocco, Canada

Group G: Brazil, Switzerland, Serbia, Cameroon

Group H: Portugal, Uruguay, South Korea, Ghana

I'll have to think on it a bit, but the closest I see to a group of death is Group E.  England's got a pretty good group, even if Wales wins the last spot.

C and G are pretty tough groups, too. Poland hasn't been playing too badly for a while now and then there are Argentina and Mexico. And Cameroon and Switzerland should also not to be underestimated.

A and F look comparatively simple.

I predict Germany will be going home. (Not that I would mind. The Klinsmann effect is gone and they've more or less returned to the old ways and they'd deserve going home).

[paulvdb]

My predictions for the groups:

A: Netherlands should win with Ecuador and Senegal battling for second.

B: England should win with the others battling for second; probably the only group where all countries have a decent chance to qualify for the round of 16.

C: Argentina should win with Poland and Mexico battling for second.

D: France and Denmark should both qualify for the round of 16.

E: Spain and Germany should both qualify for the round of 16.

F: Belgium and Croatia should both qualify for the round of 16.

G: Brazil should win with Serbia and Switzerland battling for second.

H: Portugal and Uruguay should both qualify for the round of 16.

Based on previous World Cups very few countries outside of Europe and South+Central America qualify for the round of 16 so I'm expecting only one or maybe two of them to do so this time. As you can see in my predictions above I think Senegal and one of US/Iran are most likely.

[DoctorAtomic]

I think being outside the traditional host countries is in the US' favor. 

[AimingforYoko]

Villareal gave them a start, but the quad's still alive for Liverpool.

[Just Here]

Canada's MNT just announced that they are on strike and will not play their scheduled friendly versus Panama today (Sunday, June 5th).

Here's a quick OCR of the letter (may have spelling and formatting errors):

Quote

Dear Canada

Four years ago, we set out on a mission to leave our program in a better place than we found it. At the
time, it had been over 30years since our nation was represented at the FIFA Men's World Cup. Aside
from our collective childhood dreams of playing at a World Cup. We hoped that qualifying this team
would bring a level of respect and financial opportunity that could raise the standards & opportunities
for the next generation of players in our country and change the trajectory of soccer in Canada forever
Despite the unprecedented success of both the Women's and Men's National teams in 2021/22, we
have seen no changes. Where is the progression? Where is the money?

We have recently learned that in 2018, Canada Soccer signed an agreement with Canadian Soccer
Business that has completely compromised their ability to leverage the on-field success of our senior
national teams. To have any chance of creating substantial. tasting change for all Canada Soccer
programs, we need the terms of this agreement to be disclosed and corrected. We want to know who
signed this deal that has hand cuffed our association. Why have Canada Soccer given up autonomy of
the greatest opportunity to grow our program in years?

We want to work together with our organization, but the relationship has been strained for years And
now, Canada soccer has disrespected our team and jeopardized our efforts to raise the standards and
effectively advance the game in Canada.

In March, we initiated contract discussions with Canada Soccer Due to executives delaying the process
and taking vacations, the negotiation process was unnecessarily prolonged Canada Soccer waited until
the evening of June 2nd to present an archaic offer and the general secretary & president of the
association only made themselves available for the first time to connect with the players on June 4th at
4:00pm.

For these reasons, we have reluctantly decided not to play our match today against Panama.

It's time we take a stand for the future of soccer in Canada.

Going forward, we need ..

• Transparency and a review of the Canadian Soccer Business Agreement.
• A leadership team that can optimize this moment and generate revenue from corporate sponsorship that should be used to drive the game forward at all levels for years to come (grassroots, youth, para & senior programs)
• An equitable structure with our women's national team that shares the same player match fees, percentage of prize money earned at our respective FIFA World Cups and the development of a women's domestic league
• World cup compensation that includes 40% of prize money and a comprehensive friends and family package for the 2022 FIFA World Cup.
• More former players from the men's, women's and para team integrated into leadership positions within Canada Soccer Board & Organization

These are the fundamental elements we will stand on guard for, to shift soccer in our country.

We want to apologize to our fans. Playing at home with your support, is everything to us. We hope
Canada Soccer will take decisive steps to work with our team so we can be back on the field for our
match on June 9.

We also want to apologize to Panama's players, fans, staff, and association.

It's a great privilege and responsibility to represent and play for our country.

We stand on guard for you, for us and for generations to come.

The Canadian Men's National team
We are Brothers.
We Fear Nothing.
We Stand on Guard.

From yesterday:

 

Edit: The WNT has responded with a statement:

The text of statement:

Quote

The Women's National Team has been bargaining in good faith with Canada Soccer since January 29, 2022. We have been clear throughout these discussions (and before) that we are seeking an agreement with Canada Soccer that will provide equal pay to members of our team relative to the Men's National Team. The Women's National Team will not accept an agreement that does not offer equal pay.

On Friday, Canada Soccer tabled a proposal to both the Men's and Women's National Teams. We continue to review that proposal despite not yet having the benefit of all the information that we have asked Canada Soccer to provide regarding its financials, including with respect to its agreement with Canada Soccer Business. However, the Women's National Team believes that the CSA's most recent proposal represents a positive step toward pay equity between the Men's and Women's Teams, and one that provides a basis for further negotiations with the CSA.

We are happy to hear that the Men's National Team is asking Canada Soccer for "[a]n equitable structure with our women's national team". However, to be clear, the Women's National Team does not view equal FIFA percentages as between our respective teams as equal pay.

We look forward to working with both Canada Soccer and the Men's National Team towards a deal that offers true pay equity and that advances the sport of soccer in Canada, for the benefit of all of us.

The players of the Canadian Women's National Team

 

Edited June 6, 2022 by Just Here
added canwnt response

[proserpina65]

On 4/1/2022 at 2:45 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

I'm hopeful for the US. That actually is a winnable group. 

I think between England and Wales, who got the last spot, it is much less likely that the US can win it.  Get out of the group round, maybe.

On 4/1/2022 at 8:37 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

Do the English not have the concept of 'bulletin board material'? 

The English press is a weird and crazy thing.  For the 2010 World Cup, they acted like winning for a done deal, and they tore the team down when they lost in the first non-group round. For both the 2018 World Cup and the most recent Euros, they couldn't say enough bad things about the England team beforehand, and yet Gareth Southgate's group performed very well.  There's really no winning with their press.

But thanks, Just Here, for the explanation.  I was a little confused, but I get what you were going for now.

[Fukui San]

1 hour ago, proserpina65 said:

I think between England and Wales, who got the last spot, it is much less likely that the US can win it.  Get out of the group round, maybe.

The English press is a weird and crazy thing.  For the 2010 World Cup, they acted like winning for a done deal, and they tore the team down when they lost in the first non-group round. For both the 2018 World Cup and the most recent Euros, they couldn't say enough bad things about the England team beforehand, and yet Gareth Southgate's group performed very well.  There's really no winning with their press.

But thanks, Just Here, for the explanation.  I was a little confused, but I get what you were going for now.

I don't follow Football that closely, so forgive me if this is a dumb question. Can I ask how it is that Harry Maguire seems to be both a YouTube meme for comically bad defending and an unquestioned cornerstone starter for the England team? Is one or another of those assertions inaccurate? Or is his presence a reason for hope for the US team?