S03.E06: Decoherence

[paigow]

19 hours ago, mac123x said:

One other thing that bothered me -- William's self important speech about how we've squeezed this planet dry, blah blah blah.  Basically saying humanity has despoiled the planet.  Really?  I don't think we've seen any evidence to support that.  

Agent Smith said essentially the same thing 20 years ago...

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by paigow

[enchantingmonkey]

6 hours ago, The Companion said:

I love this. If Dolores actually did change because of Teddy, it shows real character growth and helps explain some of her actions, IMO.

Is Dolores capable of character growth?  

 

31 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Delores and Serac are both terrible, I am hoping that Maeve can get rid of both of their murderous self important asses. I was happy to see both Hector and Lee again, it made me really miss watching Maeves motley crew just wander around different parks snarking at each other, I could get behind that as a major part of the season.

Without Serac, who would look out for the survival of the human species?  Maeve has said she doesn't give a damn about the humans.

 

24 minutes ago, mac123x said:

One other thing that bothered me -- William's self important speech about how we've squeezed this planet dry, blah blah blah.  Basically saying humanity has despoiled the planet.  Really?  I don't think we've seen any evidence to support that.  

We know that Paris, and likely its surrounding areas, was destroyed by a thermonuclear event, so it's possible other areas have endured similar catastrophes.  But the look of the cityscapes in this world are certainly more impressive and lively looking than anything seen in the bleak BladeRunner universe.  

Humans are quite adept at finding evidence to support their specific point of view whether there is evidence to the contrary, or not.  

 

[DoubleUTeeEff]

1 hour ago, mac123x said:

One other thing that bothered me -- William's self important speech about how we've squeezed this planet dry, blah blah blah.  Basically saying humanity has despoiled the planet.  Really?  I don't think we've seen any evidence to support that. 

There are no more elephants so humanity has probably destroyed the habitats of many other species as well.

[Rumsy4]

Noo!! I hated Charlores’ family dying. I feel like they were fridged too soon to serve Charlores’ character development. I would have liked to see more of her humanity before she went all Hollow Man. 

I know I’m in the minority here, but I loved Dolores pointing out Maeve’s hypocrisy. She modified them similar to what Dolores did to Teddy. Except Dolores took it to the extreme. But Maeve was fine with Hector and Armistice dying to ensure her daughter’s safety.

I think she would have been be better served in her goal if she had decided to team up with Dolores to take down Serac and ensure he would never interfere with Host-Paradise. Serac is not exactly a shining beacon of trustworthiness. At least Dolores wants the Hosts to survive. 

9 hours ago, The Companion said:I love this. If Dolores actually did change because of Teddy, it shows real character growth and helps explain some of her actions, IMO.

2 hours ago, enchantingmonkey said:

Is Dolores capable of character growth?  

I think so. This is the second instance we have seen Dolores change her mind about something significant. In S2, at first she was bent on destroying the Forge along with the Host-Paradise. But after Bernard brought her back as Charlores, she listened to his pov and saved Host-Paradise.  

[Growsonwalls]

I too am upset that Charlores' son and husband died. I liked the humanity that was developing in Charlores. 

[The Companion]

4 hours ago, enchantingmonkey said:

Is Dolores capable of character growth?  

 

Without Serac, who would look out for the survival of the human species?  Maeve has said she doesn't give a damn about the humans.

 

We know that Paris, and likely its surrounding areas, was destroyed by a thermonuclear event, so it's possible other areas have endured similar catastrophes.  But the look of the cityscapes in this world are certainly more impressive and lively looking than anything seen in the bleak BladeRunner universe.  

Humans are quite adept at finding evidence to support their specific point of view whether there is evidence to the contrary, or not.  

 

 

1 hour ago, Rumsy4 said:

 

I think so. This is the second instance we have seen Dolores change her mind about something significant. In S2, at first she was bent on destroying the Forge along with the Host-Paradise. But after Bernard brought her back as Charlores, she listened to his pov and saved Host-Paradise.  

Agreed. Additionally, the fact that her different iterations are diverging clearly shows that she changes based on her experiences. I think this is a subtle confirmation that her self awareness is paired with an ability to grow/develop/change beyond coding. 

I also think it is clear her goals and viewpoint have changed now that she knows about the outside world. As we began to sympathize with the robots in S1, she is beginning to do the same with humans. I think she is genuine on that front and it makes her way more interesting than being focused solely on the destruction of her oppressors.

[Hiacios]

Wow, this show has really fallen a fucking part! They fucked up every character and have made this show all about 2 of the worst characters in Dolores and Hale. 

 

The way they made Serac's character get dumber and dumber in these last 2 ep is fucking ridiculous: He could've easily stopped stuck up Dolores and killed Hale in the first couple of episodes but they made him play dumb and be nowhere near them to actually stop Dolores's dumb plan. SMH. And the plot armor Hale has is off the fucking charts ridiculous. 

 

This show sucks ass!

[arc]

Here's what I don't get. The first time around (s3e2, "The Winter Line"), Maeve was in a VR Warworld hosted on one of Serac's servers, where her stolen pearl had been connected, so Serac could get information out of Maeve. This time, she's in VR Warworld again -- but it's now on the Delos servers, in Delos HQ, with her body about to be printed out in SF. How did her pearl get there? How did Hector's pearl (transported back from the parks in Asia, as @paigow said) get there? Most of all, how did the Serac model computer reconstruction of Lee Sizemore get to the Delos version of VR Warworld? This all happened before the hostile takeover was finalized!

Also, why would Dolores think she and Maeve were on opposite sides? Maeve didn't "align herself" with Serac! Serac has her cooperating under duress! Charlores destroying Hector made more of an enemy of Maeve than was really necessary for Dolores plan, whatever it is. (Similarly, it seems a little unlikely that Maeve wouldn't mention this, though I guess it's possible she suspects her code is too compromised to show any overt rebellion against Serac.)

I was really happy to see Jimmi Simpson back. With all the ways the show has been reveling in revisiting its own past and drawing connections, I will be so disappointed if Ford isn't back for the episode finale. Serac is a dark mirror of Ford: a genius arguably outshadowed by his partner, who fell from grace and has since been deliberately sidelined by the lesser genius. Both Serac and Ford have been visionaries constrained by the small-minded big money funders (Dempsey and Delos). Both have seemed nearly omnipotent and omniscient.

This week in the ongoing question of "just how human-ish are hosts?", Charlores' sleeping gas somehow doesn't affect her. So: they have blood but it doesn't have platelets. They're (no longer) electromechanical robots, but mostly biological. They don't seem to eat (per s1), or at least they don't need to. Hosts can stay in not-even-that-cold storage for years without decay or starvation. And now they don't breathe enough to be affected by knockout gas.

[Dame sans merci]

1 hour ago, arc said:

Here's what I don't get. The first time around (s3e2, "The Winter Line"), Maeve was in a VR Warworld hosted on one of Serac's servers, where her stolen pearl had been connected, so Serac could get information out of Maeve. This time, she's in VR Warworld again -- but it's now on the Delos servers, in Delos HQ, with her body about to be printed out in SF. How did her pearl get there? How did Hector's pearl (transported back from the parks in Asia, as @paigow said) get there? Most of all, how did the Serac model computer reconstruction of Lee Sizemore get to the Delos version of VR Warworld? This all happened before the hostile takeover was finalized!

I just assumed that the simulation (which seems to have...just kept running based on the fact that Lee has been merrily programming away in there  - why though?) was on a mobile server or similar. Maeve recognises at one point when the world 'shimmers' that they've been plugged into the Delos servers.

That wasn't Hector's original pearl - they found him in cold storage and transferred the data from his pearl over to the Delos labs, before they torched the bodies in cold storage,

A new question: we learn in episode 2 that time moves faster in the simulation, so the real world looks slower. Errr....why didn't that happen here?

Edited April 21, 2020 by Dame sans merci

[MrWhyt]

7 hours ago, arc said:

Charlores' sleeping gas somehow doesn't affect her

yes the board members are only sleeping and when they wake up they'll go off to a nice farm upstate.

[paigow]

19 hours ago, The Companion said:

I think she is genuine on that front and it makes her way more interesting than being focused solely on the destruction of her oppressors.

Dolores Stormborn - Breaker Of Chains, Queen of the Androids

[The Companion]

13 minutes ago, paigow said:

Dolores Stormborn - Breaker Of Chains, Queen of the Androids

Maybe she can liberate Drogon

[arc]

16 hours ago, Dame sans merci said:

A new question: we learn in episode 2 that time moves faster in the simulation, so the real world looks slower. Errr....why didn't that happen here?

Serac was running that sim sped up because he just wanted to trick Maeve into revealing her supposedly hidden knowledge. This time he’s just letting her chill out while she’s waiting for a new body and what would speeding up this sim help?

[DrSpaceman73]

First of all, so this means Dolores was spooning and sweet walking......herself (?) earlier in the season in the bedroom scene?  More than a little weird

Second, a person arguing with different versions of themselves is cliché and also quite annoying and stupid when done on TVs and movies.  It served its purpose here, I get it, but far from original in any way.  And not a huge revelation really for him either.  I though we pretty much already learned in prior seasons, deep down he is evil or really the Man In Black as portrayed.  He pretty much said as much to his wife in one scene earlier

Still not really clear why Maeve is on one side or the other here.  I know Serac told Maeve he would give her the digital world where her daughter is in, but I don't think Dolores cares about that at all and would also give it to her if Maeve asked.  And I am not sure I am clear on why Serac wants Maeve or what she is doing for him, other than trying to get Dolores?.  That seems kind of a contrived plot just to keep Maeve in the show. 

[Cthulhudrew]

On 4/19/2020 at 8:14 PM, saoirse said:

And then when she and her ex grabbed hands - MICHAEL EALY I WILL MISS YOU BEAUTIFUL FACE - I was like, yup, they're dead. And BOOM.

I don't know about the kid, but Charlotte can just rebuild her husband/Dorian, can't she? 😝

[Nashville]

On 4/20/2020 at 5:15 PM, mac123x said:

One other thing that bothered me -- William's self important speech about how we've squeezed this planet dry, blah blah blah.  Basically saying humanity has despoiled the planet.  Really?  I don't think we've seen any evidence to support that.  

Disagree; I’ve had the same perception of humanity since around, oh, 1972 or so.

[dr pepper]

This week on "These Violent Doloreses":

Naked unarmed captive Dolores in simulation seemed more dangerous that embodied armed Doloresized Charlotte, up to the last scene.

Well, second to last scene. After the last scene, i think D Charlotte is the most dangerous character left.

Finally saw Chekov's Battlemech in action.

Big strategic mistake on D Charlotte's part. There's two robots about to emerge from the vat. You want to stop Maeve, stop *her*, don't waste time with Hector.

 

Oh yeah, here's another "what's real?" puzzle i thought of this time:

Is Serac really Serac? We only have his word for which brother he is and which one got dropped into a psych ward.

 

[paigow]

On 4/20/2020 at 10:14 PM, Growsonwalls said:

I too am upset that Charlores' son and husband died. I liked the humanity that was developing in Charlores. 

This is a mirror of how Serac made Sim!Sizemore fall in love with Maeve, thereby tipping her off. Host!Hale fell in love and betrayed herself.

[Tachi Rocinante]

Anyone catch Ed Harris' missing fingers get magically re-attached offscreen?  Just me?

When he's in therapy, his hands are folded together and all 10 appeared intact.  I don't have a screenshot, though.

[Nashville]

11 hours ago, Tachi Rocinante said:

Anyone catch Ed Harris' missing fingers get magically re-attached offscreen?  Just me?

When he's in therapy, his hands are folded together and all 10 appeared intact.  I don't have a screenshot, though.

Old William‘s “therapy sessions” were implanted thought, not reality - William’s self-images of himself through the various stages of his life - and I expect all William’s self-images (including Old William) include a full set of digits, just like Neo’s self-image in The Matrix included a full head of hair which did not exist in reality.

[Elad]

I can take any twist of plot and 

ridiculous scrambled eggs story line . What I cant tolarate is the  unnecessary  killing of innocent children in tv series which are fiction as if its a must for the progression of the plot . 

Really dissapointing and puts me off from watching the show . 

 

 

[AudienceofOne]

I pretty well checked out of this episode the minute they spent so much of it with Maeve killing imaginary Nazis for no reason. It's mindless and done solely because someone thinks it's cool to see a WOC kill Nazis while ignoring the fact she's currently enslaved to one. I can't believe I'm saying this of these writers after the first two seasons but they really haven't thought this shit through. 

[Dobian]

On 4/20/2020 at 6:40 PM, Rumsy4 said:

Noo!! I hated Charlores’ family dying. I feel like they were fridged too soon to serve Charlores’ character development. I would have liked to see more of her humanity before she went all Hollow Man.

The writers needed an excuse to recreate the fuel truck scene from The Terminator.