S05.E12: Back From the Future - Part 2

[Trini]

Supergirl helps Winn (guest star Jeremy Jordan) face his greatest fear. After Alex sets out to find evidence against Lex, Brainy must decide between helping his friend or continuing to secretly work for Lex.

Alexis Ostrander directed the episode written by Rob Wright & J. Holtham.

Airdate: 2/16/2020

[scarynikki12]

The Anointed One? Just shove her outside at high noon and go about your day. Problem solved. 

Part of me thought Winn would die but I’m glad I’m wrong. He’ll be great at turning the Toyman name into a symbol for good. 

They would do better to have Kara casually date a bunch of guys for a whole season and then bring back the best to be a relationship in the next one. Not a fan of the current formula.

[Lady Calypso]

Once again, this episode, just like the last, proved why they underutilized Jeremy Jordan, and Winn, since at least late season 2. And I'm bitter about it, because we could have gotten more Winn-centric episodes.

Henry Czerny! I did NOT expect him to reappear but am so happy that they got him back. We only got one episode with him in season 1 and I've always been bitter that they not only never brought him back, but that they also killed him off. So thank you, show, for bringing him back and giving us some amazing Winn scenes. 

Seriously, I am going to miss Winn again. These last two episodes just makes my heart ache for him. He even started out as one of my least favourites in early season 1...and then became my favourite. I am kind of glad he's going to turn the Toyman legacy into something of good, rather than evil. 

Too. Much. Lex. Luthor. I just don't care anymore. I just cannot with him getting his own separate scenes with other non-regulars. I don't mind JJ getting his own separate scenes because he's a vital part of the show, even though he's not a part of it anymore. 

William/Kara? I can't help but cringe. I tried to give it a chance, and I am fully on Winn's side when he told Kara that she deserved to be happy and take it slow. But...William? The show just needs to find a better actor for Melissa to act alongside. They screwed it up with Mon-El and the shitty writing, but they actually had me coming around by the end of season 3...and then they sent him away. 

But now, along with the shitty writing, we also have an actor who doesn't have chemistry with Melissa. And I don't think Kara ending things with William before it starts is going to stick. I kind of wish that it would. 

And finally.... THOMAS LENNON! Hello! I haven't seen you on my television screen in a while. 

[Writing Wrongs]

Thank you show for featuring one of my favorite Monkees songs:

 

[thuganomics85]

I always wonder how hard it is for performers like Melissa Benoist; who are great at singing in real life; to pretend not be good singers on a show, heh.  I guess it similar to acting, but I can still imagine her thinking "Oh, I can crush this easily" during the bad karaoke.  Complete with Jeremy Jordan off screen all "You know, I'm here for a few weeks, so why don't we just do a musical episode here, guys?!"

Good second parter, and a great send-off (again?) for Winn.  I liked how they not only worked a way to have him face off against Evil Winn again, but also his father as well.  Glad they were able to get Henry Czerny back one more time, and he was great as always.  But now Winn is going back to the future (heh), and while it is understandable, I will miss him here.  Again, the turn around they did with him compared to what he was like in the first season has been great to watch.

Brainy continues to realize how much he's been screwing things up by joining Team Lex, but is still deluded himself into thinking that this is the only way to save everyone.  Boo!  On the other hand, he actually yelled "Leroy Jenkins!" when he charged the Possessed Lex Suits, so cool Brainy is still somewhere in there!

Lex and Lena continue their plotting, and now have Andrea accepting their help, which is probably not going to be good for everyone.  Well, except Leviathan, since it sounds like Gemma actually wanted all of this to happen?  The Luthors are getting played?!

Speaking of which, I'm almost willing to forgive Lena's attitude this season, since her guilt-tripping apparently has caused Kara to not want to pursue anything with boring William.  Thanks, Lena!

Barely any J'onn and Kelly only got one insignificant scene, but I'm not happy that Nia disappeared once again.  It feels like they haven't been using her much this season.

Thomas Lennon as Mxyzptlk?!

 

[Trini]

Gonna have to watch this again online because my local CW affiliate was being a MESS.

Anyway, good use of Jeremy Jordan and Winn; was surprised and delighted to see Henry Czerny back! Eh - I don't know if 'Toyman' is a name you really want to 'reclaim', but good for you, Winn!

So... Brainy's not going to come clean to anyone else?

This episode was entertaining enough, but I did notice the TV writing tropes of various macGuffins, and 'here's this very specific problem - oh look- right here is the specific thingy that solves said specific problem'.

It's interesting how they just decided to change Brainy's personality to fit this arc with him and Lex. But props to the talented Jesse Rath for being versatile and making it work.

Edited February 17, 2020 by Trini

[BaggythePanther]

Jeremy Jordan did such a great job playing two distinct characters. I didn’t realize how much I missed Winn until he came back for these two episodes. I’m glad they were able to get Henry Czerney back and give Winn closure with his father.

The fight scenes were CGI heavy but I still enjoyed watching Brainy flip around and I love it when Kara does the thunderclap move. 

I’m glad Alex is leaving the DEO, they never really let her be Director. Someone else always came in to take the power from her. Curious to see what it will mean for Alex to work at The Tower. 

53 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

I'm not happy that Nia disappeared once again.  It feels like they haven't been using her much this season.

It’s because they’ve been using William in her place. Kara was supposed to be mentoring Nia and it would have made sense for the two of them to work on a news story exposing Lex’s evil deeds on Earth Prime. But nope, William has to be the one person in the world (outside of the Superfriends) who doesn’t trust Lex. So it gives Kara an excuse to spend time with William, but leaves Nia with nothing to do but have relationship drama with Brainy.

I guess I haven’t been paying attention, because I thought the alien bar was just a spot for aliens and their friends. In past seasons they never invited Lena and I always assumed it was because Kara ordered alien drinks and the bar served mostly alien clientele. But after one good experience at game night William is invited to the bar? Ok.

 

1 hour ago, thuganomics85 said:

The Luthors are getting played?!

I hope so. Lex needs to lose. Since he came back from the dead everything has worked out well for him. And Lena needs to fail so she can make up with Kara.

[Lantern7]

It's a shame we had a two-part story with two weeks between the episodes. Stuff happened, but I didn't feel too invested. Having a Legion of Super Heroes established on Earth-Prime just means I'd want the Legends to visit their era one day. After the Gen X'ers laugh at Val Armorr for calling himself Karate Kid, they can give verbal noogies to Winn for calling himself Toyman. @Trini . . . you're right about how the name can't be redeemed, but he'd be doing that in the 31th Century.

Brainy being sketchy isn't the best of looks. Brainy performing Brainy-Fu and shouting out a long-dated meme? That makes up for it.

I'm also "meh" on William. He and Kara looked good performing Toto . . . but isn't the appeal of Melissa Benoist is that she can have chemistry with anybody?

[tennisgurl]

This just reminds me how much I miss Winn and Jeremy Jordan, and how sad I am that the show so often put him on the backburner when he was still around. He was one of my favorite characters and JJ one of its best performers, and while I miss him on the show, I am thrilled that at least we got to see him again and he got a really good two partner. Not only did we get to see more of evil Toyman Winn (and Jeremy is eerie good at playing evil) AND lots of good scenes with Winn and Winn and Kara, but we got an appearance from Henry Czerny as Toyman! I always thought he was rather underused, so I am glad that he got to come back, and that Winn got some closure with his father, and is even going to reclaim the Toyman name! Its not the coolest name for a superhero, but its sure as hell better than Computer Lad at least! 

I really wish that Brainy would finally tell everyone what he has been up to, him sneaking around and working with Lex freaking Luthor, albeit for the greater good, is already old. I guess he shouldn't have taken those inhibitors off or listened to the other Brainys. Has he not learned that keeping secrets from your friends never ends well?! Its also kind of weird that the show is implying that Brainy really was better off with a chunk of his personality suppressed. Yeah, thanks Brainys for giving this Brainy painfully unhelpful advice that is quickly sending his life down the sinkhole and then fucking off to the matrix or whatever! But I guess it was for the best, as according to the most recent Batwoman, having two of the same person from different universes will cause them to both get sick until one dies, so if the other Brainys didn't choose to join their coding, I guess they would have to pick a Brainy! The flipping through the killer drones was pretty cool at least. 

It sucks for Kara that she feels like she cant get close to anyone because of Lena's total meltdown, but I cant say that I am that sad about them not being a thing now. William isn't a particularly character and I dont see any chemistry between him and Kara, despite the show suddenly pushing him and their romance super hard basically out of nowhere. Plus, he seems to have taken Nias place as Kara's work buddy, and that really sucks as I miss Nia. 

Alex at the tower could be interesting, even though her not being at the DEO will be kind of weird, she has been there since the start of the show. 

Its Mister Mxyzptlk! Now this I can get behind!

Edited February 17, 2020 by tennisgurl

[Trini]

Alex leaving the DEO: I was surprised; the DEO has been Alex's main 'thing' from the start. It'll be odd to have her away from it. Outside of that, she only really has her relationships (mainly Kara and Kelly). Her working at the Tower is cool, but it's not the same level as the DEO - at least in terms of resources. I assume this is only temporary until they get Lex out of the DEO. But I welcome more Alex/J'onn scenes, and more J'onn in general.

Also, Toyman Sr. proves that if TPTB like an actor enough, any character can come back for a redemption arc! (yes, I know it was the virtual version.)

[Oreo2234]

Quote

This just reminds me how much I miss Winn and Jeremy Jordan, and how sad I am that the show so often put him on the backburner when he was still around. He was one of my favorite characters and JJ one of its best performers

 I agree. Jeremy Jordan is great and Winn was often not given enough to do while he was here. 

Alex leaving the DEO was a little abrupt. I hope it will lead to more stories for her but I fear it will have the opposite effect. 

I wish they would just let Kara date casually and get one or two episode love interests. William isn't working and we don't need more main characters. 

 

Edited February 17, 2020 by Oreo2234

[shantown]

I'm pretty over Lex and him taking over so much screentime. I hope he loses big to Leviathan and skulks off over to the new Superman show. One Luthor is more than enough for this show.

I was hoping they would scrap the DEO a year ago when J'onn started his private eye agency since the DEO was already a bit played out then. I hope after this season ends it's done for good. I wouldn't mind the combo of J'onn/Alex with some more "on the street" style investigations and fighting moving forward. Brainy in charge at the DEO now is an interesting choice but obviously not long term.

Jeremy Jordan was great here. I get some characters getting shorted this week (Nia, Kelly, J'onn) with a big guest. But I need them all to be tied a little more closely to what's going on moving forward. It's a bummer for so many characters to be MIA so often.

As far as William... my grandma (my DeariE Old grandma, haha) always said if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all, so I won't say anything!

[angora]

Nice wrap-up for Jeremy Jordan's return. I was bummed to see Winn leave again, but cool that he was able to face some of his biggest demons.

Some cool action here. I loved Kara's thunderclap move with the flying monkeys (of COURSE there are electronic flying monkeys!), the Winn-on-Winn fight (especially when our Winn realized the possibilities of the digital space,) and Brainy's acrobatics fighting Lex's suits.

I'm cautiously hopeful about Alex leaving the DEO. I worry that it could reduce her screentime, but in the best case scenario, it'll INCREASE J'onn's by giving him someone to have plots with. I loved the idea of him starting his own thing last season, but the show has avoided doing practically anything with it - other than giving him some really cool sets. Let's see J'onn and Alex freelancing together!

Which I guess puts Kara as the next most likely person to figure out what Brainy is up to, since she's the only other one left at the DEO. I think that secret coming out will obviously be hard, but hopefully Kara's recent experiences with Lena will give her some perspective and she'll focus on helping Brainy with the quagmire he's gotten himself into rather than cut him out for keeping secrets from her.

Or else, is there any way for Brainy and Lena to team up? They're both people who are ill-advisedly working with Lex for what they think is the greater good, and it'd be nice to see them help pull one another back from the brink somehow. And again with the Kara-Lena parallels, maybe seeing how much pain it's causing Brainy to keep secrets from his friends (in order to protect them, he thinks) will help Lena get over the whole Kara thing, and she can in turn give him the deceived-friend perspective to convince him to come clean on his own before the others find out in other ways (especially Lex dramatically revealing it at some point just to be a dick, ugh.)

We got a (brief) Kelly sighting, but where's Nia again? Has Nicole Maines been busy with other projects this season? I don't want the show to have full access to her and not be using her, especially if it's so they can give screentime to William instead.

[Starry]

It was nice getting Winn back for a couple episodes. I find it comforting and empowering that he's going to reclaim the Toyman name. The future generations will now think of Toyman as a hero. I am also glad that Winn got some closure with his dad before "deleting" him.

Alex and Brainy seem to be going somewhere with their storylines but Kara is stuck. I didn't find her to be particularly instrumental in the problem of the week and there was no movement on the William front either. I'd rather she wasn't lying about not feeling that way about him. I hate that she keeps beating herself up over what happened with Lena. The problem with Lena is not that Kara kept secrets from her when they barely knew each other, it's that she kept lying for years. No-one expects her to disclose all her secrets to William after half a date. Winn gave Kara sensible advice and she didn't take it because she just can't lie to a guy she likes but barely knows. I need this drama between Kara and Lena to end so Kara can stop punishing herself and can start living her life.

Why wasn't Kelly hanging out with the group in the opening scene? And add me to the list of people who are not happy with the sidelining of Nia. 

I hope that now that Alex left the DEO we can have more scenes with her and J'onn working together. They are one of the show strongest duo.

This is a nitpick or maybe there's something that I am forgetting but didn't the musical crossover establish that Kara can sing?

 

[shantown]

5 hours ago, angora said:

Or else, is there any way for Brainy and Lena to team up? They're both people who are ill-advisedly working with Lex for what they think is the greater good, and it'd be nice to see them help pull one another back from the brink somehow. 

Yes! Science Bros! Emotional Box Bros! 

I would love to see them reconnect in the back half of this season. If Lena sticks around for another season I think that's a really strong duo to anchor a setting somewhere. 

[UNOSEZ]

On 2/17/2020 at 1:53 PM, tennisgurl said:

Alex at the tower could be interesting, even though her not being at the DEO will be kind of weird, she has been there since the start of the show. 

I like Alex at the tower because it means Alex and J'onn.. The DEO hasn't felt the same since he left.. And its because they work so well together... Like when they were off looking for Alex' Dad... 

 

I don't mind this new brainy( actually I prefer him personality wise)  I just don't understand why he can't tell everyone else what he's doing with Lex... I'm not even saying he should stop... It makes sense to keep an eye on him.. But  why keep it a secret. 

 

Don't care about William 

What is the writers plan for Lena's character.. Nothing about the way she's been written is positive.. She's sabotaging ppl to get what she wants.. Still convinced she's saving the world.. Meanwhile Kara is out here like a broken record  boo-hooin over her broken friendship... Ugh

[UNOSEZ]

On 2/17/2020 at 4:24 PM, angora said:

I don't want the show to have full access to her and not be using her, especially if it's so they can give screentime to William instead.

I hope she has mechad's number.. So he can walk her thru how it goes when the show decides that not only are you not the love interest.. But you've been replaced on the screen by someone else

[Rushmoras]

The gist of the whole Lena-Kara drama: "I can't help but think, that if I made different choices along the way, things might have turned out differently". No, shit, Kara. I'm not saying that Lena is in the right, but, yes, if you'd made different choices, none of this would have happened. Also, could you imagine Lena's outrage, if Kara would have told William that she's Supergirl lol.

And, yes! Finally, the long overdue issue of Alex still being in the DEO. She quits! And all it took was change of realities. Now, if only Kara would come to understand that it is not necessary for her to work at the DEO, as well...

Also, surprisingly, a good episode.

P.S. So... should someone tell the two Winns that only one of them is supposed to be alive? I mean, judging by Batwoman series.

Edited February 19, 2020 by Rushmoras

[Rushmoras]

On 2/17/2020 at 4:59 AM, scarynikki12 said:

The Anointed One? Just shove her outside at high noon and go about your day. Problem solved. 

Ah... Buffy reference, where Spike threw that kid in to a cage and hoisted it in broad daylight lol?

[Perfect Xero]

9 hours ago, Rushmoras said:

The gist of the whole Lena-Kara drama: "I can't help but think, that if I made different choices along the way, things might have turned out differently". No, shit, Kara. I'm not saying that Lena is in the right, but, yes, if you'd made different choices, none of this would have happened. Also, could you imagine Lena's outrage, if Kara would have told William that she's Supergirl lol.

In the real world where Lena's response to Kara having lied to her is to try to mind control the planet is so over the top and disproportionate that I'd say that Lena would have snapped eventually either way and any different choices Kara made would have just been delaying the snap at best.

On this show where they dedicate an entire episode to Winn needing to forgive and trust his insane sociopath father who kidnapped him and tried to force him to murder people though? I guess Lena's a good person who just needed a little love and trust from Kara.

 

[Rushmoras]

8 hours ago, Perfect Xero said:

In the real world

Well, in the real world, since season one, there would be hundreds of top-leading scientists in the show working with alien technologies, and not just one computer geek and/or multi-billionaire philanthropist (up until Brainy shows up). 

In the real world, the DEO would have much better security and no village yokel could waltz right in there uninvited.

In the real world, everyone, who is close to Kara, would instantly recognize she is Supergirl.

In the real world etc.

The show is not the real world, though. And it's going down the Smallville route (which is the easiest route, I guess for them, cause, what else you are going to do with a Luthor. At least, in here the animosity did not stem, cause Kara and Lena both fell in love with the same guy *cough Lana cough, cough*).

[MarkHB]

23 hours ago, Rushmoras said:

P.S. So... should someone tell the two Winns that only one of them is supposed to be alive? I mean, judging by Batwoman series.

Gerry Conway actually Tweeted at MG, saying "Great job with Crisis!  And, from someone who's been there, good luck figuring out the pieces you're left with!"

[Avabelle]

Lena is just hateful. Where is all this going? Even if her and Kara make up I’m so over the friendship. As already said upthread she was clearly going to snap at some point. This is such an overreaction.