S21.E12: The Longest Night of Rain

[dttruman]

This description is from Googling "SVU season 21 episode 12 "The Longest Night of Rain".

Benson investigates a police officer's accusations of sexual assault; Capt. Tucker's retirement party ends in tragedy.

This cast information comes from Fandom

Main cast

Mariska Hargitay as Captain Olivia Benson

Kelli Giddish as Detective Amanda Rollins

Ice-T as Sergeant Odafin Tutuola

Peter Scanavino as A.D.A. Dominick Carisi, Jr.

Jamie Gray Hyder as Detective Katriona Tamin

Recurring Cast

Robert John Burke as Ed Tucker

Bill Irwin as Dr Peter Lindstrom

Guest Cast

Michael Gaston as Gary Wald

Cora Vander Broek as Marie Morris

Saul Stein as Ralphie Morris

Edited January 26, 2020 by dttruman

[Xeliou66]

For clarification, the title is “The Longest Night of Rain” not “The Longest Night of the Rain”. 

As for the episode, I’m curious about the direction it will take, but I’m very concerned they will trash Tucker given what the promo showed. I really don’t know why SVU likes to make their characters look bad, I guess it’s just for shock value and drama, but it’s really lousy and cheap writing, it’s like they can’t come up with original plots so they resort to crapping on characters for drama. 

I kind of doubt Tucker will turn out to be a villain given that he dated Benson, but I’m afraid they will tarnish his character in some way. Then again, they had Barba kill a baby and Stone present false evidence, so who’s to say they won’t completely throw Tucker under the bus.

[dttruman]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

For clarification, the title is “The Longest Night of Rain” not “The Longest Night of the Rain”. 

As for the episode, I’m curious about the direction it will take, but I’m very concerned they will trash Tucker given what the promo showed. I really don’t know why SVU likes to make their characters look bad, I guess it’s just for shock value and drama, but it’s really lousy and cheap writing, it’s like they can’t come up with original plots so they resort to crapping on characters for drama. 

I kind of doubt Tucker will turn out to be a villain given that he dated Benson, but I’m afraid they will tarnish his character in some way. Then again, they had Barba kill a baby and Stone present false evidence, so who’s to say they won’t completely throw Tucker under the bus.

My bad again.

His "retirement party ends in tragedy", so I am assuming his reputation won't be tarnished, but he will probably be taking a dirt nap.

Edited January 26, 2020 by dttruman

[The Wild Sow]

On 1/25/2020 at 5:39 PM, Xeliou66 said:

so who’s to say they won’t completely throw Tucker under the bus.

Along with Dale Stuckey, Chester Lake, Judge Kofax, and (infuriatingly!) Dana Lewis.  Damn, it's getting pretty crowded under that bus!

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, The Wild Sow said:

Along with Dale Stuckey, Chester Lake, Judge Kofax, and (infuriatingly!) Dana Lewis.  Damn, it's getting pretty crowded under that bus!

Don’t forget ME Rudnick becoming a serial killer!! and the CSU tech “rope guy” that was friends with Fin being blackmailed into tampering with evidence.They’ve thrown tons of characters under the bus just for drama and I think it’s cheap and lousy writing, and I really hope Tucker doesn’t become the next casualty. 

[The Wild Sow]

4 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Don’t forget ME Rudnick becoming a serial killer!! and the CSU tech “rope guy” that was friends with Fin being blackmailed into tampering with evidence.They’ve thrown tons of characters under the bus just for drama and I think it’s cheap and lousy writing, and I really hope Tucker doesn’t become the next casualty. 

Oh Lordy, I forgot all about Rudnik!  I got distracted looking up name of the judge.

[Xeliou66]

2 minutes ago, The Wild Sow said:

Oh Lordy, I forgot all about Rudnik!  I got distracted looking up name of the judge.

They sure have thrown so many characters under the bus. But nothing is worse than how they trashed Barba and Stone. If they make Tucker into a villain I will be furious. 

[dttruman]

On 1/28/2020 at 12:11 AM, Xeliou66 said:

They sure have thrown so many characters under the bus. But nothing is worse than how they trashed Barba and Stone. If they make Tucker into a villain I will be furious. 

I don't think they will make Tucker a prime villain, after all he was going out with Benson and no one directly associated with her is a real bad guy. He'll probably be a member of the "Good Old Boys" club with no direct knowledge of the sexual assault and a loyalty to the club, which keeps him from getting involved. Benson will probably give one of her speeches and guilt him into getting involved even though she knows someone is definitely guilty (w/o investigating) at the beginning.

[dttruman]

On 1/27/2020 at 5:32 PM, The Wild Sow said:

Along with Dale Stuckey, Chester Lake, Judge Kofax, and (infuriatingly!) Dana Lewis.  Damn, it's getting pretty crowded under that bus!

It wouldn't surprise me if they brought Stuckey back and he had his sentence reduced on a technicality (after all, technicalities follow him around), given a parole, and released from prison.

[Xeliou66]

5 hours ago, dttruman said:

I don't think they will make Tucker a prime villain, after all he was going out with Benson and no one directly associated with her is a real bad guy. He'll probably be a member of the "Good Old Boys" club with no direct knowledge of the sexual assault and a loyalty to the club, which keeps him from getting involved. Benson will probably give one of her speeches and guilt him into getting involved even though she knows someone is definitely guilty (w/o investigating) at the beginning.

That is exactly my prediction as well. I don’t see them making Tucker into a true villain given his relationship with Benson but I’m thinking he will try to protect the real villain, one of his friends, and Benson will confront him about it. 

5 hours ago, dttruman said:

It wouldn't surprise me if they brought Stuckey back and he had his sentence reduced on a technicality (after all, technicalities follow him around), given a parole, and released from prison.

They will never bring Stuckey back IMO, most fans hate that storyline and the character and I don’t see how he could get out of prison or what the point would be of it. It still pisses me off how they killed off O’Halloran in such a cheap way and then didn’t even have the decency to mention his death or have the characters pay tribute to him in any way, he was a good recurring character and killing him off was a big mistake. 

[ChristiKRN]

3 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

That is exactly my prediction as well. I don’t see them making Tucker into a true villain given his relationship with Benson but I’m thinking he will try to protect the real villain, one of his friends, and Benson will confront him about it. 

They will never bring Stuckey back IMO, most fans hate that storyline and the character and I don’t see how he could get out of prison or what the point would be of it. It still pisses me off how they killed off O’Halloran in such a cheap way and then didn’t even have the decency to mention his death or have the characters pay tribute to him in any way, he was a good recurring character and killing him off was a big mistake. 

I also hated how they never acknowledged O’Halloran’s death on the show outside of Stabler looking at his dead body on the floor.  Loved his character;  he added technical expertise  to cases and brought some humor to the show. Haha... I always thought he had a crush on Stabler.   FYI... Mike Doyle, who played O’Halloran, has a recurring role on New Amsterdam as Iggy’s husband.  I’m with the majority who hated Stuckey. 

I’m really hoping they don’t destroy Tucker’s character in this episode.  I actually liked how they portrayed his and Benson’s relationship on the show; ironic considering that I used to hate Tucker in earlier episodes and don’t care for too much focus on personal lives.  There weren’t gratuitous scenes like there is with Noah.  I really hope this isn’t Bobby Burke’s last episode.  

[SarahPrtr]

On 1/26/2020 at 9:39 AM, Xeliou66 said:

I kind of doubt Tucker will turn out to be a villain given that he dated Benson, but I’m afraid they will tarnish his character in some way. Then again, they had Barba kill a baby and Stone present false evidence, so who’s to say they won’t completely throw Tucker under the bus.

They threw shit all over Cragen, so nobody is safe.  And they also made Cassidy look bad and he is the one who had the closest romantic relationship with Benson.  How long before they do the same to Carisi and Fin????

[Xeliou66]

43 minutes ago, SarahPrtr said:

They threw shit all over Cragen, so nobody is safe.  And they also made Cassidy look bad and he is the one who had the closest romantic relationship with Benson.  How long before they do the same to Carisi and Fin????

When are you talking about them shitting on Cragen? The storyline where he was framed for the hooker’s murder? Other than it being revealed that he had been with prostitutes I didn’t think that was all that bad. And Cassidy has always been something of a screw up from the start. But yeah they do love shitting on characters just for cheap drama, what they did to Barba and Stone are the worst examples of it.

Edited January 29, 2020 by Xeliou66

[dttruman]

43 minutes ago, SarahPrtr said:

They threw shit all over Cragen, so nobody is safe.  And they also made Cassidy look bad and he is the one who had the closest romantic relationship with Benson.  How long before they do the same to Carisi and Fin????

Since Tucker had a romantic relationship with Benson, like Cassidy did, will they turn Tucker into a quivering mess like they did to Cassidy?

[dttruman]

47 minutes ago, SarahPrtr said:

They threw shit all over Cragen, so nobody is safe.

 

4 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

When are you talking about them shitting on Cragen

I think Cragen was catching a lot of flack from his superiors, because he was always backing  Benson, so I am assuming he got a lot of reprimands. So this new Deputy Chief Garland will probably be fired at the end of this season, so should we be congratulating Benson on her new promotion to deputy chief?

[SarahPrtr]

34 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

When are you talking about them shitting on Cragen? The storyline where he was framed for the hooker’s murder? Other than it being revealed that he had been with prostitutes I didn’t think that was all that bad.

Yeah, that one.  Just before retirement too, when they threw in that storyline.  Not as bad as Barba or Stone, but still.  It was a massive amount of humiliation on Cragen's part.

[wknt3]

13 hours ago, dttruman said:

It wouldn't surprise me if they brought Stuckey back and he had his sentence reduced on a technicality (after all, technicalities follow him around), given a parole, and released from prison.

 

8 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

They will never bring Stuckey back IMO, most fans hate that storyline and the character and I don’t see how he could get out of prison or what the point would be of it.

True the fans hated that story, but this show has done a lot of things the fans don't want. What's more important is that the NBC executives hated the later Baer years and gave Leight specific orders to go darker and "more realistic" which lead to the grimdark excesses of the Amaro years and that Leight seemingly took it to heart. The show still seems to avoid humor or camp, maybe because the show doesn't have the writers or actors to do it anymore (with the exception of Ice-T and maybe Scanavino) or maybe because the current star is both bad at it and really wants to do overwrought "serious" drama where the self-parody is strictly accidental. Chernuchin seemed to dip a toe in the water sometimes, but it mostly showed that they forgot how to do it well. And as you said it would be pointless - the character has served his purpose (to give us a shocking twist by beating us over the head with an annoying comic relief character who actually turns out to be a murderer) and as he has no real deep emotional connection with Benson there is no point in trying to extend that story beyond it's natural conclusion..
 

Quote

That is exactly my prediction as well. I don’t see them making Tucker into a true villain given his relationship with Benson but I’m thinking he will try to protect the real villain, one of his friends, and Benson will confront him about it. 

And of course by "try to protect the real villain" you mean tell Benson that she needs to investigate and gather evidence before arresting someone even though she knows in her heart they are an evil misogynistic rapist...

[dttruman]

10 hours ago, wknt3 said:

True the fans hated that story, but this show has done a lot of things the fans don't want. What's more important is that the NBC executives hated the later Baer years and gave Leight specific orders to go darker

I am a little confused here, concerning the classification of the Stucky character. Was his level of evil up there with Benson's arch-nemesis William Lewis or was he just annoying as hell? I don't know exactly what the motivation was for the hatred for Stucky by the viewers.

[ChristiKRN]

2 hours ago, dttruman said:

I am a little confused here, concerning the classification of the Stucky character. Was his level of evil up there with Benson's arch-nemesis William Lewis or was he just annoying as hell? I don't know exactly what the motivation was for the hatred for Stucky by the viewers.

Stuckey was annoying as hell; he also thought he knew everything about forensic science but didn’t and was schooled by O’Halloran on a number of occasions.  He was not even remotely close to the same scale of William Lewis-evil, but killing  O’Halloran, a popular recurring character, was the final nail on the coffin.  He became unhinged in his last episode; to be fair, he was bullied and demeaned by Stabler on a routine basis.   If my memory serves me correctly,  he killed multiple  people In reaction to a mistake he made in court; his error led to the exoneration of a criminal.  He was attempting to frame the criminal to “correct” the error; O’Halloran figured out what he did and Stuckey  killed him.  I haven’t seen this episode(? “Zebras”) in awhile, so please correct me if I’m wrong.  

[dttruman]

1 hour ago, ChristiKRN said:

Stuckey was annoying as hell; he also thought he knew everything about forensic science but didn’t and was schooled by O’Halloran on a number of occasions.  He was not even remotely close to the same scale of William Lewis-evil, but killing  O’Halloran, a popular recurring character, was the final nail on the coffin.  He became unhinged in his last episode; to be fair, he was bullied and demeaned by Stabler on a routine basis.   If my memory serves me correctly,  he killed multiple  people In reaction to a mistake he made in court; his error led to the exoneration of a criminal.  He was attempting to frame the criminal to “correct” the error; O’Halloran figured out what he did and Stuckey  killed him.  I haven’t seen this episode(? “Zebras”) in awhile, so please correct me if I’m wrong.

Your whole comment is wrong! In your statement "he killed multiple  people In reaction...", the "I" in the word "In", should not be capitalized. Therefore your entire premise is invalid.

All kidding aside, well said!

 

[CrystalBlue]

3 hours ago, dttruman said:

Your whole comment is wrong! In your statement "he killed multiple  people In reaction...", the "I" in the word "In", should not be capitalized. Therefore your entire premise is invalid.

All kidding aside, well said!

 

I noticed that too!  It took me right out of the post.

Kidding, of course.

[Xeliou66]

4 hours ago, ChristiKRN said:

Stuckey was annoying as hell; he also thought he knew everything about forensic science but didn’t and was schooled by O’Halloran on a number of occasions.  He was not even remotely close to the same scale of William Lewis-evil, but killing  O’Halloran, a popular recurring character, was the final nail on the coffin.  He became unhinged in his last episode; to be fair, he was bullied and demeaned by Stabler on a routine basis.   If my memory serves me correctly,  he killed multiple  people In reaction to a mistake he made in court; his error led to the exoneration of a criminal.  He was attempting to frame the criminal to “correct” the error; O’Halloran figured out what he did and Stuckey  killed him.  I haven’t seen this episode(? “Zebras”) in awhile, so please correct me if I’m wrong.  

Yes you got everything right regarding Stuckey. I hated the Stuckey character all around, he wasn’t as evil as the likes of William Lewis but he was just a terrible character because he was incredibly over the top and annoying and really detracted from the episodes he was in, he was a cartoonish character, and then using him to kill off O’Halloran just took my dislike of the whole Stuckey character-storyline to the next level. The writing from about seasons 9-12 was just awful, a bunch of over the top, ridiculous plots and storylines with a handful of decent episodes in the mix. 

Bringing the discussion back to tonight’s episode - Tucker has always been one of my favorite recurring characters on SVU, even before he switched from being antagonist to “good guy”, and he’s always gone after dirty cops so I hope they don’t smear him as now covering for dirty cops, which is where I’m worried this episode will go.

I see that Dr Lindstrom will also be in this episode, that should be interesting, we haven’t seen him since season 18 I believe. I wonder if Benson still sees him on her own time.

[dttruman]

6 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Bringing the discussion back to tonight’s episode - Tucker has always been one of my favorite recurring characters on SVU, even before he switched from being antagonist to “good guy”, and he’s always gone after dirty cops so I hope they don’t smear him as now covering for dirty cops, which is where I’m worried this episode will go.

I agree. I got a feeling Tucker will be conflicted. It will probably be a longtime friend, who he considers above suspicion, but as always it will take a Benson whisper speech to set him right. What bothers me is, he is retired, so what authority does he have? Are they going to go with the old standby, where he wears a wire and gets the guy to confess?

Edited January 31, 2020 by dttruman

[ChristiKRN]

6 hours ago, dttruman said:

Your whole comment is wrong! In your statement "he killed multiple  people In reaction...", the "I" in the word "In", should not be capitalized. Therefore your entire premise is invalid.

All kidding aside, well said!

 

 

3 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

I noticed that too!  It took me right out of the post.

Kidding, of course.

Haha... I must work on my proofreading!! I just had lumbar spinal fusion surgery; can I blame it on that?  Lol...wasn’t even sure if I would make a coherent comment.  I’m hoping to stay awake during tonight’s episode;  I just watched the last episode yesterday.   🤪

[Gigi43]

Oh Jesus. There's only one way this episode is ending for Tucker, isn't there? 

 

I'll say i called Bullshit from the jump on the confidentiality claims when NYC actually rolled out the program the episode is referencing. It won't be. Too many Bensons with disregard for any law/procedure in the way no matter why they exist. Lindstrom isn't in the wrong. 

 

ETA : I knew it. They couldn't let Tucker go live a happy life leaving a recurring character played by a solid actor in reserve. We just had Simon for Bensons pain drama. Last time John Robert Burke died on a show i watch (person of interest ) I cheered, I cheered hard in one of my favorite scenes ever on a TV show. This one just sucks for many reasons. 

Edited January 31, 2020 by Gigi43

[CrystalBlue]

5 hours ago, ChristiKRN said:

 

Haha... I must work on my proofreading!! I just had lumbar spinal fusion surgery; can I blame it on that?  Lol...wasn’t even sure if I would make a coherent comment.  I’m hoping to stay awake during tonight’s episode;  I just watched the last episode yesterday.   🤪

Yikes!  Hope you heal and recover soon!  I just noticed I made a typo in another show's thread.  Can I blame it on my cataracts?  (Starting surgeries in March.)

[ShortyMac]

5 hours ago, dttruman said:

I agree. I got a feeling Tucker will be conflicted. It will probably be a longtime friend, who he considers above suspicion, but as always it will take a Benson whisper speech to set him right. What bothers me is, he is retired, so what authority does he have? Are they going to go with the old standby, where he wears a wire and gets the guy to confess?

Man, you guys are good!

[Xeliou66]

This episode was extremely predictable and I didn’t like the fact that they killed Tucker off, he was a good recurring character and killing him off was unnecessary.

The storyline was extremely predictable, the villain was obvious from the minute he appeared onscreen, and it was obvious how the story would play out with Tucker eventually turning on him and getting the evidence against him. I didn’t see the twist of Tucker being sick coming, that was better than making him complicit in a cover up but the episode still didn’t make him look good by having him believe the perp’s story originally, but it still pissed me off that they’ve now killed off another good recurring character. 

On the positive side, Fin was really good, he works well with everyone and I liked seeing him looking out for both Benson and Rollins and his scenes with Kat and Carisi were good as well. His comments to Lindstrom about confidentiality and whether the higher ups would hear what was said in therapy reminded me of how Munch would go on similar rants about the higher ups. 

Carisi was good as well but he didn’t have a lot of screentime. He seems to have settled in to his role as ADA well though.

I liked seeing Lindstrom again and I liked how he stood by not revealing what the patients said to him, I thought he was right to do so, and I was annoyed with Benson as I don’t think she would want what she’s said to Lindstrom to be divulged to others.

I was unsure why Kat’s mentor killed himself and I thought they they didn’t really explore what really drove him over the edge, apparently he had issues for a long time, but was it all because of what happened to Rachel or was other stuff going on? 

Overall this was a very predictable episode with another uninteresting rich white powerful rapist who was taken down in a very predictable way, and killing off Tucker, one of my favorite recurring characters, left a bad taste in my mouth, it’s another good character gone that they can’t bring back anymore, I don’t know why they did this. 

[ChristiKRN]

2 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

Yikes!  Hope you heal and recover soon!  I just noticed I made a typo in another show's thread.  Can I blame it on my cataracts?  (Starting surgeries in March.)

Thank you! Good luck on your surgeries!

[ChristiKRN]

I agree with Xeliou66’s post.  It was obvious who the culprit was from the beginning.  I also didn’t understand why Ralphie committed suicide outside of worrying his wife was going to find out about his infidelity; I’m guessing it was supposed to be a red herring.

 I did think that it was appropriate to have Fin consoling Benson at the end of the episode.  It was sad for them to kill off Tucker.  I was surprised that he committed suicide; I would have thought he would have been a fighter.  Having  cancer as a result of being a first responder on 9/11 seemed appropriate considering how many first responders have dealt with  cancer.  I believe Bobby Burke was a first responder on 9/11; hopefully, he is healthy.  

Carisi still seems like he is understandingly trying to get his confidence as an ADA.  I bet Rollins would have loved to have perp-walked Tucker.  I’m not sure why Rollins seemed so shaken in the squadroom with the announcement that Lindstrom was going to provide assistance; was she upset about the suicide or her hostage situation? I still think she is due to go off the rails soon.  

[EtheltoTillie]

4 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

Yikes!  Hope you heal and recover soon!  I just noticed I made a typo in another show's thread.  Can I blame it on my cataracts?  (Starting surgeries in March.)

Good luck. I just had mine and the results were fantastic. Probably won’t help my proofreading either, though. 

[dttruman]

11 hours ago, ChristiKRN said:

Haha... I must work on my proofreading!! I just had lumbar spinal fusion surgery; can I blame it on that?  Lol..

 

6 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

Yikes!  Hope you heal and recover soon!  I just noticed I made a typo in another show's thread.  Can I blame it on my cataracts? 

 

1 hour ago, GussieK said:

Good luck. I just had mine and the results were fantastic. Probably won’t help my proofreading either, though. 

With all of my punctuation blunders, misspelled words, and somewhat incoherent sentences over the years, puts me in the class of a Frankenstein type body.

[wknt3]

The Good:
The recurring cast. Robert John Burke and Bill Irwin really nailed it this week even if the material they had to work with was a mixed bag. Burke in particular continues to bring out the best in Mariska in a way that few other actors do, no matter how talented they might be. This episode was a great example of why the shows apparent mandate to reduce or eliminate recurring characters is such a bad idea.
Another good week for Kat. Especially since they didn't feel the need to have Rollins schooling her on following procedure.
Fin. They actually gave him some decent material this week and it really highlights how much Ice-T performance rises or falls according to the quality of the writing. He was really engaged this week instead of just tossing off lines while thinking of his side projects. I was glad that they decided to show him as Benson's confidant at the end rather than Rollins.
It was nice to see something resembling a nuanced exploration of issues like police suicide and confidentiality and somebody standing up to Benson without becoming a total villain.
The Good Place finale was forking incredible and it means that we'll finally get a great show about a detective squad on NBC Thursday nights. Nine-Nine!

The Bad:
Boy was this predictable. It's bad when we called just about all the plot points as soon as the summary came out. And the "shocking" twist ending was anything but.
Speaking of predictable the one thing we missed was that they would use their favorite trick for writing someone out of character by giving them a convenient medical excuse. I guess maybe we should be grateful they decided to throw Tucker under the bus after all since if they wanted to keep him around we would have had to deal with Lindstrom suddenly announcing he was bipolar?
Holy crap could they have had anybody else in the opener reminding us Benson got promoted? We know! Everybody watching knows! You've driven off all the casual viewers.
Benson's shocked face when they get bad news. First it's ridiculous that they feel the need to show us an OTT reaction from someone who is supposed to be a veteran cop and jaded leader. Secondly even without that the open mouthed catatonic stare is bad just on it's own terms. I know you can't act with your eyes when you can't move the top half of your face, but you can still do better than that.
Another cardboard cutout perp. And a boring one at that. This big time player and experienced cop didn't realize he was being set up? You want a twist? Have him realize it was a set up and then reveal that it was a feint to keep him occupied while the rest of the squad was getting the evidence another way. But I guess they had to wrap it up quickly so that they could kill off Tucker and Benson could Take!It!Personally!

Overall this was another competent episode that took a decent idea and turned it into a C- script that the cast managed to elevate to a B-. It was probably better than last week by virtue of the recurring guest stars' performances and slightly better writing, but it could have been a really good episode if they had the courage to do it right. Hopefully next week's episode manages to escape the gravity well of mediocrity they seem to be trapped in.

[dttruman]

As for this episode it was kind of predictable, but I thought there were still some good points to it. I also thought there were a moment or two that were literally the direct opposite of some of the Mothership's courtroom scenes.

I thought it was a harbinger of Benson's ego when right after she introduced Dr Lindsrrom as the "grief guy" and he starts to talk, Benson interrupts him and says what he would have said.

I like that little discussion Fin had with Linstrom, pointing out the Catch 22 situation.

Once again Benson makes another paranoid assumption and thought Tucker lied to her about Wilson, because Wilson threw a drink at him at the party. It never occurred to Benson she was throwing it at the guy standing next to Tucker, Wald.

In almost all of the Mothership courtroom scenes, when someone dies their doctor-patient privilege is no longer in effect and the doctor starts talking. This is why I thought the courtroom scenes were irrelevant. I'd like a ruling on that please from you guys.

I was disappointed with the way they obtained the confession from Wald using the wire. I thought that was too "same old, same old".

I thought it was imaginative giving Tucker "brain cancer". It explained a lot and I thought it was a good way to send out the character, by letting him pass away with dignity. But they decided to change it and stick to the "suicide message" they were trying to put forth. I thought this was bad because it sends Tucker out in a bad way and Wald's attorney can argue that Tucker offed himself because he felt guilty for setting Wald up. The writers (and producers) just want to show Benson in more misery reacting to another suicide that was close to home.

Everything is still revolving around Benson. I wish they would give it a rest sometimes.

 

[TV Diva Queen]

I was surprised that Holly Peete was on the show for such a short time.  I was like "they're not going to kill her off before the credits"  Wrong.  

[Gigglepuff]

3 hours ago, dttruman said:

As for this episode it was kind of predictable, but I thought there were still some good points to it. I also thought there were a moment or two that were literally the direct opposite of some of the Mothership's courtroom scenes.

I thought it was a harbinger of Benson's ego when right after she introduced Dr Lindsrrom as the "grief guy" and he starts to talk, Benson interrupts him and says what he would have said.

I like that little discussion Fin had with Linstrom, pointing out the Catch 22 situation.

Once again Benson makes another paranoid assumption and thought Tucker lied to her about Wilson, because Wilson threw a drink at him at the party. It never occurred to Benson she was throwing it at the guy standing next to Tucker, Wald.

In almost all of the Mothership courtroom scenes, when someone dies their doctor-patient privilege is no longer in effect and the doctor starts talking. This is why I thought the courtroom scenes were irrelevant. I'd like a ruling on that please from you guys.

I was disappointed with the way they obtained the confession from Wald using the wire. I thought that was too "same old, same old".

I thought it was imaginative giving Tucker "brain cancer". It explained a lot and I thought it was a good way to send out the character, by letting him pass away with dignity. But they decided to change it and stick to the "suicide message" they were trying to put forth. I thought this was bad because it sends Tucker out in a bad way and Wald's attorney can argue that Tucker offed himself because he felt guilty for setting Wald up. The writers (and producers) just want to show Benson in more misery reacting to another suicide that was close to home.

Everything is still revolving around Benson. I wish they would give it a rest sometimes.

 

And for a show that's supposed to be so progressive, why didn't they have Tucker seek out physician assisted suicide instead of blowing his brains out of they were going to kill him off? This could have been handled so much better but the show, once again, went cheap, lazy, and predictable. 

This is the first episode I tuned into nearly all season and I see nothing's improved, it's still the St. Benson hour filled with mostly terrible, terrible acting and storylines. 

[DB in CMH]

I know it's just for reasons of cinematography, but I always laugh at how these characters choose the most random spots to meet up, like an out-of-the-way dock that just happens to have a view of the statue of liberty. Like really, they couldn't just meet at a Starbucks?

[dttruman]

6 hours ago, TV Diva Queen said:

I was surprised that Holly Peete was on the show for such a short time.  I was like "they're not going to kill her off before the credits"  Wrong.  

Agreed. I think they were just paying her by the minute. She played the distraught trouble former officer, but only in a superficial manner and she wasn't given enough time, IMO. This maybe very callous of me, but I wonder was she really raped back then. I may have missed some important fact during the show so please correct me, but I thought she made it a habit of sleeping around with some of the guys in Vice. She also wanted them to get a divorce and threatened to tell their wives if they didn't. Was the threat of a "rape" charge also part of that threat. Did Wilson have some mental issues and was very possessive of the men she slept? I find this confusing or inconsistent since she was considered a very good cop.

4 hours ago, DB in CMH said:

like an out-of-the-way dock that just happens to have a view of the statue of liberty. Like really, they couldn't just meet at a Starbucks?

They could have made a deal with Starbucks for some product placement ads.

Edited January 31, 2020 by dttruman

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, dttruman said:

Agreed. I think they were just paying her by the minute. She played the distraught trouble former officer, but only in a superficial manner and she wasn't given enough time, IMO. This maybe very callous of me, but I wonder was she really raped back then. I may have missed some important fact during show so please correct me, but I thought she made it a habit of sleeping around with some of the guys in Vice. She also wanted them to get a divorce and threatened to tell their wives if they didn't. Was the threat of a "rape" charge also part of that threat. Did Wilson have some mental issues and was very possessive of the men she slept? I find this confusing or inconsistent since she was considered a very good cop.

They could have made a deal with Starbucks for some product placement ads.

She was raped, Wald confessed to Tucker at the restaurant that he raped her. There was somewhat of a contradiction it seemed about how she was supposedly a good cop yet she was also having affairs with several officers - I wonder if she had mental health issues, I suspect she did given what we saw and heard about her. I also wonder what was up with Kat’s mentor, did he have mental health issues as well, given what his wife said about him? It just seemed like a lot packed into one episode and 3 officers killing themselves just seemed like overkill to me. 

[dttruman]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

It just seemed like a lot packed into one episode and 3 officers killing themselves just seemed like overkill to me. 

I know this may come out morbid and a little insulting, but were the writers and producers going for a new record for suicides in an SVU episode?

[wknt3]

9 hours ago, dttruman said:

They could have made a deal with Starbucks for some product placement ads.

The only reason I could ever see a company paying good money to be associated with the zombified corpse of SVU is that they know they have a serious #metoo problem coming and want to ensure that those headlines are not ripped from due to conflict of interest.
 

7 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

There was somewhat of a contradiction it seemed about how she was supposedly a good cop yet she was also having affairs with several officers - I wonder if she had mental health issues, I suspect she did given what we saw and heard about her. I also wonder what was up with Kat’s mentor, did he have mental health issues as well, given what his wife said about him?

Remember these are detectives who were less elite than Rollins...

Edited February 1, 2020 by wknt3

[FancyRhubarb]

I hate the way this show treats IAB officers. They perform an incredibly important role on the force yet they are treated as if they spend their days plotting to rob decent, rule abiding officers of their  pensions. Now, I know Tucker always looked nefarious in the early days ( usually after Stabler had brutally beaten some perp and he had to come in and be intimidating) but he wasn't wrong. He always struck me as incorruptible which means I really don't appreciate this character turn, regardless of the brain cancer or whatever they've given him. I didn't much care for Benson trying to bully her therapist into giving her the information she wanted, either. Let SOMEONE keep their ethics on this show. And Rollins? Ugh. Just a general ugh.

[dttruman]

2 hours ago, ChateauCardboard said:

I hate the way this show treats IAB officers. They perform an incredibly important role on the force yet they are treated as if they spend their days plotting to rob decent, rule abiding officers of their  pensions.

Don't take it so hard, they have trashed every branch and employee of the NYPD with reckless disregard. So we have to complement the producers for not playing favorites. It's one of their few redeemable qualities. Even Benson has made some questionable decisions and choices, but for some unexplainable reason she is never reprimanded or punished and always gets promoted.

[SarahPrtr]

18 hours ago, dttruman said:

 

They could have made a deal with Starbucks for some product placement ads.

And gotten enough money to pay for more regular cast members!

[agentp]

My feelings about this ep, in gif form:

 

My feelings, in words:
I am not a Tuckson shipper. I still think that relationship is a big, steaming pile of nonsense. (Hell, Major Crimes did a better cop-and-their-former-Internal Affairs-antagonist love story!)

I was fully prepared to throw a goddamn parade in my mind after this ep and bask in the Tuckson shippers' pain.

But after I read about what happened, I am...torn between saying "yeah!" and "yikes!". Because goddamn, cancer AND suicide? This may be the new textbook definition of the word "overkill".

All in all, certainly not what I expected.

Edited February 2, 2020 by agentp

[Sake614]

11 hours ago, ChateauCardboard said:

I hate the way this show treats IAB officers. They perform an incredibly important role on the force yet they are treated as if they spend their days plotting to rob decent, rule abiding officers of their  pensions

But that’s how cops see IAB. Or at least that’s how the department is portrayed in every tv show and movie I’ve ever seen. I’m not a cop so I don’t know if the real police view IAB in the same manner.

[leftlane]

What a downer of an episode. Can Liv have some joy? Is that too much to ask for?

[Xeliou66]

10 minutes ago, leftlane said:

What a downer of an episode. Can Liv have some joy? Is that too much to ask for?

No, the writers want to put Benson through a ton of soapy angst just for drama. I’m sick of Benson’s personal drama, why can’t they just leave it alone and focus on writing good cases? 

[WendyCR72]

On 1/31/2020 at 10:24 AM, TV Diva Queen said:

I was surprised that Holly Peete was on the show for such a short time.  I was like "they're not going to kill her off before the credits"  Wrong.  

On the Law & Order franchise, big names mean squat. Both Joan Jett and Steven Weber (of Wings fame) were both offed before the opening credits of Criminal Intent!

[dttruman]

1 hour ago, leftlane said:

What a downer of an episode. Can Liv have some joy? Is that too much to ask for?

If they give her some joy, you know they have to reduce even more time of the investigation concerning the special victim of the episode.