Black Widow (2020)

[tv echo]

Shang-Chi Box Office Reportedly Factored Into Black Widow Lawsuit Settlement
BY SANDY SCHAEFER  October 4, 2021
https://www.cbr.com/shang-chi-box-office-black-widow-lawsuit/ 

Quote

... According to Puck News, John Berlinski, Johansson’s lawyer, pushed for information regarding the financials of the previous four Avengers movies (all of which Johansson starred in) and Disney+, which Disney resisted.

The studio's position was weakened when Shang-Chi grossed $94.7 million in its first four days of release, shattering the all-time Labor Day weekend box office record while surpassing Black Widow's opening in July. "The difference? Shang-Chi was a theatrical exclusive," as Puck News put it. This placed added pressure on Disney to agree to the "key deal terms" of Johansson's lawsuit, which Disney CEO Bob Chapek was relatively quick to approve. Disney and Johansson later announced they had settled their lawsuit on Sept. 30.

Scarlett Johansson's Tower of Terror Role Tied to Black Widow Settlement
BY SANDY SCHAEFER  October 5, 2021
https://www.cbr.com/scarlett-johansson-tower-of-terror-tied-to-black-widow-settlement/ 

Quote

In its breakdown of the settlement, Puck News wrote that Disney Studios chairman Alan Bergman "knew that if he was gonna pay Johansson a chunk of her lost box office bonuses, he should roll the money into a deal for another Disney movie." This is allegedly why Bergman name-dropped Tower of Terror in his statement announcing that Disney and Johansson had come to terms over their legal dispute.

Disney's Tower of Terror movie was only announced a month before Johansson filed her lawsuit over Black Widow's hybrid release. The A-lister is attached to produce and potentially star in the film, which is being written by Toy Story 4 co-writer/helmer Josh Cooley but has yet to lock down a director. Based on Puck News' report, Johansson is all the more likely to headline Tower of Terror now, assuming the movie receives a green light to start production.

 

Edited October 6, 2021 by tv echo

[Spartan Girl]

Finally watched this in its entirety on Disney+ and…Captain Marvel was better.

I’m sorry, I know I’m probably biased because I’ve always been ambivalent about Natasha and resent how the MCU writers siphoned off character development that could have been equally used for other female characters in the Captain America/Avengers films just because ScarJo was a bigger name. But even with all that aside, it just felt hollow giving her a solo movie only after she’d been killed off.

Can’t help feeling that any of the MCU characters (Fury, Maria Hill) could have been swapped for Nat’s rando guy friend that helped her go off the grid. The What If? finale A/U in of her and Peggy teaming up reminded me that she and Sharon were actually really good friends in the comics—another squandered opportunity that I’ll never forgive the MCU for.

As much as I adore Rachel Weisz and David Harbour…yeah, I can’t get behind buy them reconciling with Nat and Yelena after they handed them over to the Red Room, despite knowing how traumatized Natasha was already. Then again, the MCU loves redemption arcs whether they’re deserved or not—look at Loki.

So…yeah. I expected nothing and I was still left disappointed. Glad I waited til it was free to watch.

I kind of wish Valentina has sent Yelena to kill Ross instead of Clint. I’m so sick of that asshole I could vomit.

[Starfish35]

36 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

As much as I adore Rachel Weisz and David Harbour…yeah, I can’t get behind buy them reconciling with Nat and Yelena after they handed them over to the Red Room, despite knowing how traumatized Natasha was already.

I just watched it last night on Disney+, and….yeah.  I was uncomfortable with that.  More Alexei then Melina, I think, because Melina was a product of the Red Room just like Nat and Yelena were.  And I think she did feel remorse over it.  Alexei…I got so many mixed signals there.  He does care for the girls, I think, in his own strange way, but….that doesn’t make him a good person.

I do wonder who the Captain America was that Alexei thinks he fought in the 80s?

Edited October 10, 2021 by Starfish35

[Racj82]

7 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

I just watched it last night on Disney+, and….yeah.  I was uncomfortable with that.  More Alexei then Melina, I think, because Melina was a product of the Red Room just like Nat and Yelena were.  And I think she did feel remorse over it.  Alexei…I got so many mixed signals there.  He does care for the girls, I think, in his own strange way, but….that doesn’t make him a good person.

I do wonder who the Captain America was that Alexei thinks he fought in the 80s?

He wasn't telling the truth and that's why he got called for it 

[Zuleikha]

I finally saw Black Widow and liked it a lot. Like most, I think it should have been made and released years before it was, but I'm glad it happened.

My two quibbles are: all the actors were good, but why not hire actors who actually speak Russian for roles that require Russian? (but I don't speak Russian, so maybe they all nailed the Russian. It just seems strange.)

Why not establish as canon, finally, that the Black Widows are altered and have super powers? The stunts that Yelena and Natasha do in the movie are ridiculous for non-powered people. Also, they soak ridiculous amounts of damage.

[Starfish35]

2 hours ago, Racj82 said:

He wasn't telling the truth and that's why he got called for it 

I did initially think Alexei was lying in the prison scene, but then when he asked Natasha later if Cap ever mentioned him, that seemed to indicate that he really does believe he fought Captain America. 

[shantown]

9 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

I think it should have been made and released years before it was, but I'm glad it happened.

It would have been a lot better for me if this had been released in the time frame when it was supposed to have taken place. I liked the movie but it definitely seems like a "throwaway" movie being released after the character already died.
 

18 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Can’t help feeling that any of the MCU characters (Fury, Maria Hill) could have been swapped for Nat’s rando guy friend that helped her go off the grid. The What If? finale A/U in of her and Peggy teaming up reminded me that she and Sharon were actually really good friends in the comics—another squandered opportunity that I’ll never forgive the MCU for.

This really frustrated me - almost all the other movies/shows have had at least one other established MCU character in them. A cameo from Maria Hill would have been amazing IMO. I know the premise was that she was off the grid/on the run in this but it just rubs the wrong way when combined with the movie being after the initial "Infinity War Saga" and not getting a full theater release. 

 

[Spartan Girl]

24 minutes ago, shantown said:

This really frustrated me - almost all the other movies/shows have had at least one other established MCU character in them. A cameo from Maria Hill would have been amazing IMO. I know the premise was that she was off the grid/on the run in this but it just rubs the wrong way when combined with the movie being after the initial "Infinity War Saga" and not getting a full theater release

I would have loved a movie with Natasha and Sharon on the run together; like I said, they were really close in the comics. Then they could have made up some non-villain explanation for why she didn’t show up in IW/Endgame. But I guess Feige had his mind made up for what he did to Sharon in TFAWS even though that plot had more holes than Swiss cheese. 

[cambridgeguy]

3 hours ago, shantown said:

This really frustrated me - almost all the other movies/shows have had at least one other established MCU character in them. A cameo from Maria Hill would have been amazing IMO. I know the premise was that she was off the grid/on the run in this but it just rubs the wrong way when combined with the movie being after the initial "Infinity War Saga" and not getting a full theater release. 

It did have another established character - Thaddeus Ross.  1.5, actually, since I think that was Jeremy Renner as Hawkeye over the radio when younger Nat blew up Dreykov's daughter.  True, Ross was barely in it, but he still got a pretty high billing out of it.  This movie was more interested in establishing Yelena as Nat's potential successor than it was in having a buddy movie between two characters we already know.  That's what happens when you release a movie after the main characters's death

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

It did have another established character - Thaddeus Ross.  1.5, actually, since I think that was Jeremy Renner as Hawkeye over the radio when younger Nat blew up Dreykov's daughter.  True, Ross was barely in it, but he still got a pretty high billing out of it. 

Pretty sure that the original poster meant a Marvel character that we actually liked.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[tv echo]

Edited October 21, 2021 by tv echo

[Danny Franks]

I finally got around to watching this and... I don't know, I was kind of disappointed.

I loved the characters they put around Nat - Alexei and Melina and, especially, Yelena. They were fun, there was some pathos Florence Pugh has a great opportunity with this character, if she wants.

The little sister energy was palpable, and her resentment and love for Natasha shone through in every moment. All the teasing and trying to get a rise, Pugh's comic timing is excellent and I thought her Russian accent was pretty good. Better than Rachel Weisz and David Harbour's, that's for sure.

But I didn't like the Americanisation of Nat's past. Why did she need to have lived in Ohio (or was it Iowa? I can't remember). Why did she need to have an idealistic but fake American life? I'll also be happy if I never have to hear the word "Budapest" again.

I also think the idea of a movie centred on Nat was a way of lowering the stakes and the action set pieces to something approaching realistic levels. A Cold War espionage movie, dealing with her past in a low down, gritty kind of way. Nat has no superpowers so we don't need to see her doing superpowered things, just being a spy/assassin/expert fighter is enough. 

But no, we get Nat literally leaping from chunks of debris to chunks debris in mid-air, as the gigantic flying fortress her nemesis owns is destroyed. We get her doing insane things that no human being could do and it ends up looking completely silly and stakes-free. I didn't like this version of Taskmaster at all, and felt they turned a fun comic book character into a Sony Entertainment level villain.

Also, Ray Winstone is a fucking awful actor and I will never be impressed by anything he does. Even when playing a Russian crimelord he still sounds like a cockney thug.

I think there was a much, much better movie to be made about the Black Widow programme and the Red Room and Natasha having to put an end to it. And it definitely should have come out in 2015, after Winter Soldier.

[tv echo]

Black Widow won The Movie of 2021 and Scarlett Johansson won The Female Movie Star of 2021 at the People's Choice Awards last night...

2021 People's Choice Awards: See the full list of winners
By Lauren Huff and Oliver Gettell    December 07, 2021
https://ew.com/awards/peoples-choice-awards-2021-winners-list/ 

Quote

The Movie of 2021
WINNER: Black Widow
Coming 2 America
F9: The Fast Saga
Dune
No Time to Die
Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
The Tomorrow War
Venom: Let Their Be Carnage
*  *  *
The Female Movie Star of 2021
Awkwafina (Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings)
Charlize Theron (F9: The Fast Saga)
Florence Pugh (Black Widow)
Jennifer Hudson (Respect)
Leslie Jones (Coming 2 America)
Margot Robbie (The Suicide Squad)
Salma Hayek (Hitman's Wife's Bodyguard)
WINNER: Scarlett Johansson (Black Widow)

Scarlett Johansson Wins Female Movie Star Award at 2021 PCAs | E! People's Choice Awards
E! Red Carpet & Award Shows    Dec 8, 2021

 

Edited December 8, 2021 by tv echo

[Fool to cry]

I liked the movie and and am surprised it's low rated on IMDB compared to other MCU movies and that some fans were disappointed. I think it's because it was delayed too long that expectations were high. Also that for people watching it at home all the action and intended spectacle was underwhelming on a smaller screen while those who did see it in theaters felt the story and stakes were too low for their money's worth. Finally people were somehow surprised her backstory to be such a bummer despite all indications from previous movies.

Setting the movie after Civil War when she was on the run but Cap's side was still imprisoned was a great way to have her be on her own without calling help from allies.

[rmontro]

Finally got around to seeing this and you know what?  I liked it.  A worthy sendoff to Scarjo's Black Widow character (if that's what it was).  Nice exploration of family dynamic of a family that wasn't really a family, but turns out it kind of really was.  Nice feels, lots of action, pace seemed perfect.  What's not to like?

Edited to add:  Now I really want to see the Crimson Dynamo in the MCU.

Edited December 26, 2021 by rmontro

[tv echo]

Disney Promotes Scarlett Johansson & Other Black Widow Stars for Awards
By Russ Milheim   Jan 6, 2022
https://thedirect.com/article/black-widow-scarlett-johansson-disney-awards

Quote

Black Widow's "For Your Consideration" campaign for the 2022 Academy Awards has officially begun, as Disney has released a list of over 30 top actors and filmmakers who shared their talents working on the film.

The list contains many names, among them being Scarlett Johansson for Best Actress, Florence Pugh for Best Supporting Actress, and composer Lorne Balfe for Best Original Score.

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by tv echo

[Matt K]

I finally got a chance to watch this and while it wasn't bad, it was easily one of the lower tier MCU movies.  Pugh was good and Harbor stole the show (SJ was good enough but not one the same level) and I liked the smuggler too.  Rachel Weisz was good but very underutilized.  Really wish we could have seen more of her.  I actually would love to see more of all of them. 

One of my main issues was the action scenes.  Black Widow takes way too much damage and walks away unscathed for someone who is seemingly non-powered.  The explosions, especially at the prison, looked really bad. 

Taskmaster was okay.  I guessed at her identity once they mentioned the little girl but that's okay since her identity wasn't really much of a plot point.  I wish we would have seen more of Taskmaster doing her thing though.  We really don't get much of her move copying and her being mute meant we didn't get any of the "I predicted that" type stuff.  Her dad was okay at what he was supposed to be storywise.  He's just some dude running the Red Room who saw others (including his daughter) as tools and really anything else would have been kind of disappointing.  

The story as presented was not great though.  It frequently felt like we were missing something.  Like why did Nat fight Yelena at the safehouse or the ending with Nat seemingly about to get captured and then flash forward a little bit and now she's not.  Also, there's a ton of Widows going after them and they take a break for food and talk openly around a bunch of civilians (and knowing the Widows would kill all those kids nearby if necessary).  Nat's grave bothered me too.  Like it seemed visited but in the middle of nowhere with no real reason given for it's placement.  Hawkeye's farm would have made sense or even Stark's cabin as a grave site for the three Avengers who were lost.  If they wanted somewhere more anonymous, it might have worked better if she was in like Arlington or some other site for SHIELD operatives.  Instead it kind of looked like some old abandoned place.  

Like I said, it wasn't a bad movie but I'd place it below Dr Strange which had some issues but made up for it with a great ending and fun visuals but probably above Thor 2 even though its Thor-Loki moments were great.  Part of the problem is that it came out too late.  At the latest I would have had it leading into Endgame (like Captain Marvel did).  Having it pre-Endgame (post IW) would have allowed for a bit more fleshing out of Nat right before we see her running the Avengers post blip and perhaps have allowed some references to what she's lost personally.  

I just kind of also felt something missing emotionally.  Like we know Nat dies but this is her first solo movie (and last) and didn't really work as any sort of swan song or anything.  I initially though it might have been due to watching it at home (and a took a few breaks) but I watched Shang Chi the same way and loved it.  I don't know, it just felt off to me.  That said, I did love the remaining characters and look forward to seeing Yelena in Hawkeye and hopefully more (same with Red Guardian and Melina).  

 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

On 10/10/2021 at 5:11 PM, Starfish35 said:

I just watched it last night on Disney+, and….yeah.  I was uncomfortable with that.  More Alexei then Melina, I think, because Melina was a product of the Red Room just like Nat and Yelena were.  And I think she did feel remorse over it.  Alexei…I got so many mixed signals there.  He does care for the girls, I think, in his own strange way, but….that doesn’t make him a good person.

I do wonder who the Captain America was that Alexei thinks he fought in the 80s?

If he was telling the truth, it might have been someone like Isaiah Bradley. Not Bradley himself, but someone similarly enhanced. There's every chance Alexei was lying to puff himself up, both because that's how he rolls and to establish that he was tough due to being in prison, but TFAWS established that there were others who went after Bucky with kill orders. If he was being honest about fighting with a Captain America, that might have even been why Dreykov tossed him into a Russian gulag to rot, because he also claimed not to know why he was imprisoned.

[Kel Varnsen]

23 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

If he was telling the truth, it might have been someone like Isaiah Bradley. Not Bradley himself, but someone similarly enhanced. There's every chance Alexei was lying to puff himself up, both because that's how he rolls and to establish that he was tough due to being in prison, but TFAWS established that there were others who went after Bucky with kill orders. 

It would be kind of a hilarious retcon but I would love it if there was a reveal that the "Captain America" that Alexei fought was actually Bucky. Like if the Hydra Russians were sending Winter Soldier out in the world in a Cap costume to ruin Cap's good name and US morale and those Russians and the Red Room Russians weren't coordinating at all.

[tv echo]

Black Widow got 1 SAG Awards nomination...

SAG Awards 2022: See the full list of nominees
By Lisa Respers France    January 12, 2022
https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/12/entertainment/sag-award-nominations-2022/index.html 

Quote

The ceremony will be simulcast live on TNT and TBS from The Barker Hangar in Santa Monica, California on at 8 p.m. EST / 5 p.m. PST on February 27.
*  *  *
Outstanding Action Performance by a Stunt Ensemble in a Motion Picture
"Black Widow"
"Dune"
"The Matrix Resurrections"
"No Time to Die"
"Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings"

 

[Smad]

On 1/11/2022 at 6:08 PM, Matt K said:

Like why did Nat fight Yelena at the safehouse

Because Yelena fought her. Her going inside with a gun pointed at Yelena made sense given that she didn't know 'who' she was going to encounter (like a widow-ed Yelena). But she told Yelena to stay down at the beginning of the fight but Yelena wouldn't stop.

On 1/11/2022 at 6:08 PM, Matt K said:

Nat's grave bothered me too.  Like it seemed visited but in the middle of nowhere with no real reason given for it's placement.

That actually makes sense when you connect it to her biological mother. She asked Dreykov what her mother's name was and he described to her where she was buried. That doesn't mean Nat is buried where her mother is but it's a similar place.

On 1/11/2022 at 6:08 PM, Matt K said:

One of my main issues was the action scenes.  Black Widow takes way too much damage and walks away unscathed for someone who is seemingly non-powered.  The explosions, especially at the prison, looked really bad.

I was actually expecting Yelena to ask Nat whether she got something extra in the Red Room or from her time in SHIELD. Which would also have given the audience an explanation as to how Nat can take so much damage. It's really obvious in this movie especially when compared to Yelena who seems way more fragile.

On 1/11/2022 at 6:08 PM, Matt K said:

Pugh was good and Harbor stole the show (SJ was good enough but not one the same level) and I liked the smuggler too.

Harbor's character made no sense. We start with him as serious, competent, intelligent enough, calm and collected character (in the flashbacks at the beginning). We get to him in present time and he is an incompetent, unfunny idiot.

[tv echo]

Black Widow got 3 Critics Choice Super Awards nominations...

‘Spider-Man,’ ‘Shang-Chi’ Lead Critics Choice Super Awards Film Nominations
BY AARON COUCH   FEBRUARY 22, 2022 
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/critics-choice-super-awards-2022-nominations-nominees-list-1235097398/ 

Quote

Find the complete list of nominees below. Winners will be announced March 17.
*  *  *
BEST SUPERHERO MOVIE
Black Widow
Eternals
Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
Spider-Man: No Way Home
The Suicide Squad
Zack Snyder’s Justice League
*  *  *
BEST ACTRESS IN A SUPERHERO MOVIE
Gal Gadot – Zack Snyder’s Justice League
Scarlett Johansson – Black Widow
Florence Pugh – Black Widow
Margot Robbie – The Suicide Squad
Michelle Yeoh – Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
Zendaya – Spider-Man: No Way Home

 

[tv echo]

Florence Pugh won a Critics Choice Super Award for Best Actress in a Superhero Movie for her performance in Black Widow....

Winners Announced for the 2nd Annual Critics Choice Super Awards
March 17, 2022
http://criticschoice.com/2022/03/winners-announced-for-the-2nd-annual-critics-choice-super-awards/ 

Quote

(Los Angeles, CA – March 17, 2022) – The Critics Choice Association (CCA) announced today the winners of the 2nd annual Critics Choice Super Awards, honoring the most popular, fan-obsessed genres across both movies and television, including Superhero, Science Fiction/Fantasy, Horror, and Action.
*  *  *
BEST ACTRESS IN A SUPERHERO MOVIE
Florence Pugh – Black Widow (Disney)

 

[tv echo]

O-T Fagbenle's Black Widow Character Might Return In Future Projects [Exclusive]
BY JOSHUA MEYER    APRIL 4, 2022
https://www.slashfilm.com/821745/o-t-fagbenles-black-widow-character-might-return-in-future-projects-exclusive/ 

Quote

In an interview with /Film's Ryan Scott, which will be published soon, Fagbenle responded to the question of whether we could expect to see Mason again in the MCU, saying, "I mean, you know what, with Marvel, I'm never sure how much they can say about stuff, but I'll just say that it wasn't a one-and-done conversation."
*  *  *
In Marvel Comics, Rick Mason goes by the moniker of "The Agent." He was created by James Hudnall and John Ridgway and first appeared in "Marvel Graphic Novel: Rick Mason, The Agent" in 1989. When asked if he researched any of this source material or just felt the need to be loyal to the "Black Widow" script, Fagbenle said:

"I mean, to be honest, I did start to do all of that. I had conversations with Eric [Pearson], who wrote 'Black Widow,' who's become a friend of mine, he's a genius and a beautiful person. In our conversations, in some ways I feel like this incarnation of Mason is an Eric creation ... So although I did have a little peek at the original, I very soon just became focused on what Eric created for 'Black Widow.'"

 

Edited April 6, 2022 by tv echo

[tv echo]

2022 MTV Movie & TV Awards Winners List
By Benjamin VanHoose   June 05, 2022
https://people.com/movies/2022-mtv-movie-and-tv-awards-winners-list/

Quote

BEST HERO

Daniel Craig – No Time to Die
Oscar Isaac – Moon Knight
Scarlett Johansson – Black Widow (WINNER)
Simu Liu – Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
Tom Holland – Spider-Man: No Way Home

[Scarlett45]

I’m finally catching up on my MCU- and making time to see this. 
 

I agree it tried to be “too big” when it could’ve been a cool espionage movie. 

[tv echo]

Quote

Yelena has known nothing but betrayal. “Her whole life has been a lie,” actor and Executive Producer Scarlett Johansson says. “When she comes out of that Widow program, she’s never had any sense of independence. She wants to write her own story. She just thinks of things in a completely different way. She can be dangerous because she’s kind of careless at times. But she’s also incredibly capable and brave and heroic and passionate. It really is a huge, stark contrast to the way that Natasha is used to doing things. Natasha is very pragmatic. And Yelena is not. She’s all emotion and just all out there. And it’s really fun to be able to see those two characters when they’re together because it makes for a great sisterly relationship that just feels like real family.”  

Edited January 27, 2023 by tv echo