S04.E08: 408 Request Timeout

[mxc90]

Quote

First Aired: November 24, 2019

Janice wants all the deets; Elliot is shook.

Source: https://www.tvguide.com/tvshows/mr-robot/episode-8-season-4/408-request-timeout/678250/

[mxc90]

Finally! A win for Dom! I still think she should have ambushed Janice and the two when they arrived at the apartment if she already had a plan to get her family out of town. The no look shot was a little over the top!

I thought she was going to die once she took the knife out.

I would have loved to seen how Deegan's people took out all the Dark Army goons and not get any of the Dom's family members injured/killed. I wonder how big of a loss the Dark Army took with members going down?

"They went down with dignity", "Ah! The Dark Army Lass" and "Tata for now, you flange" were funny!

See ya Janice. You were creepy and definitely not normal. I wonder with her now gone, will Irving return?

First Vera, now Janice!!!!! Merry Christmas!! 

I hope there is no more story with Javi and Peanut. I don't want to see a "let's get revenge for Vera" on Krista and Elliot.

Janice is lazy. She is by the kitchen counter, on the cell phone talking to her man outside Krista's apartment, then walks over to the living room and then orders her man to bring her phone. Just keep it with you!!!

I didn't think they would have Christmas go on for 5 or 6 episodes.

I knew the Dark Army was watching Dom. Next time go by memory with the lights out.

Was" Summer Slam" an influence on Darlene's language too? Her mouth should have gotten her killed tonight!

No guard at the museum to tell grown Elliot to be quiet?

When this is all done and if Elliot is alive, I hope he goes back to Krista for help. Nice goodbye scene between those two at the police station.

So at the end of last season, it was "Little" Elliot who Darlene told Vera is back in town? So who was 'Little" Elliot expecting to show up when he was sitting in the E Corp conference room?

I like the Mr. Robot/Elliot ending! Well done! 

Seeing the actor who plays Philip Price in the commercial break, I almost forgot he was on the show.

Did USA make a mistake and played the preview for next week before this episode ended?

Edited November 25, 2019 by mxc90

[Cardie]

That little Elliot was the other alter was pretty clear from the Back to the Future episode. It was fun to speculate that people who seem real in the present are not but we’ve all seen the contortions necessary to explain away their being known and seen by objective observers. Like Mr. Robot, neither  of  the alters exists in that form in 2015. 

[Slovenly Muse]

Damn, this show seems determined to go out with a bang, and I am here for it!

The last episode freaking HAUNTED me all week, and I was really hoping we'd get to see Krysta and Elliot in the immediate aftermath of Vera's death. I am so, SO happy that Krysta helped him and is still trying to take care of him, even after everything that happened. She's such a genuinely good person, and those little story touches, where Elliot is having a shutdown in the presence of someone who is willing and able to stave off their own impending mental and physical collapse long enough to reassure him, and protect him, and be kind to him when he needs it... those bright moments are such a stark contrast to the darkness and brutality and pain that suffuses this series that I find them profoundly affecting, and I'm so grateful that we got that one tonight, because I really needed it! (And the scene with Mr. Robot holding Elliot at the end - My heart!)

I don't believe the young Elliot is the third alter. He felt more like a temporary visitor to help adult Elliot process what he was remembering. Beyond that, he has no reason to exist, and no agenda to enact through Elliot. Having it spelled out for us, where Mr. Robot came from and why he was created and when... that was really useful in helping us understand how Elliot's fractured mind manages reality. After episode 2, I theorized that the new alter might be Angela, since her death is the kind of massive, traumatic, triggering event that could cause an alter to form, and would give that alter a reason to exist and an agenda to accomplish: Avenge Angela's death in more brutal and devastating way than Elliot would be capable of on his own (the way Mr. Robot was attempting to avenge Mr. Alderson's death when we first "met" him). But since that episode there hasn't been a single reference to Angela (a small one tonight - hooray!) and I'm concerned that she really is gone for good. I still hold out hope, though. Darlene encountered the third alter after Angela's death, and I can't pinpoint what other big, life-changing event Elliot has experienced in the meantime that could cause another alter to either be created or step in and start taking control. (Though I can't remember everything that happened at the end of last season. I need to do a rewatch.) I don't think Esmail is trying to pull the rug out from under us by, say, having a character that's been on the show the whole time secretly be an alter - that seems like a cheap gimmick and the show repeating itself. But I am definitely on the hook to find out who it is!

[shapeshifter]

6 hours ago, Slovenly Muse said:

Damn, this show seems determined to go out with a bang, and I am here for it!

The last episode freaking HAUNTED me all week, and I was really hoping we'd get to see Krysta and Elliot in the immediate aftermath of Vera's death. I am so, SO happy that Krysta helped him and is still trying to take care of him, even after everything that happened. She's such a genuinely good person, and those little story touches, where Elliot is having a shutdown in the presence of someone who is willing and able to stave off their own impending mental and physical collapse long enough to reassure him, and protect him, and be kind to him when he needs it... those bright moments are such a stark contrast to the darkness and brutality and pain that suffuses this series that I find them profoundly affecting, and I'm so grateful that we got that one tonight, because I really needed it! (And the scene with Mr. Robot holding Elliot at the end - My heart

ITA with all of this WRT the episode just barely balancing the literally gut-wrenching violence with brilliantly shining goodness —and, I will add: As symbolized by the Christmas lights and city lights sparkling in a concrete world ruled by violent thugs of all colors and economic means. 
 

But I see no reason to doubt that little Elliot is an alter of adult Elliot. 
 

I did a mental double take when Elliot said he wished he could go back in time. 

[truthaboutluv]

Will probably have more to say later but just had to mention that I see Rami's determined to go for that second Emmy. The scene with Elliot and Mr. Robot at the end was amazing.

Also, for those who were concerned about their Mr. Robot cosplay, now that we know Elliot's father sexually molested him, nice of Esmail to put in that moment of Elliot making it clear that the whole reason he created Mr. Robot is so he could be the father he didn't have. I also agree with others that the scene with Elliot and Krista was sweet. That Krista still wants to help him even after everything she went through with nutty Vera. 

I agree with others that I don't think young Elliot is the second alter. I thought he was but this episode made me think otherwise. I thought it was interesting that we weren't shown who young Elliot was speaking to in 1995. It's obvious it was an alter, but it was interesting we weren't shown Mr. Robot, since we know he's been around for years. That makes me think it was the second alter. 

eta: Good for you Dom, you bad ass. Hopefully she somehow makes it, since she did call for help. I cracked up when Janice said to the Irish guy, "could you speak English". 

Edited November 25, 2019 by truthaboutluv

[benteen]

Christian Slater did some good work at the end and it was nice to see Dom get a badass win, killing annoying Janice in the process.  But I'm tired for the drawn out storyline for this season and for Elliot.  Do we really need another five episodes this season?

[marcee]

Just happy to have a couple of wins in a row. Goodbye Vera. Goodbye Janice.

Totally shipping Darlene & Dom. ❤️

[scrb]

If Dom was such a badass with a collapsed lung, making 4 kill shots while bound and lying down in a pool of her own blood, why did she let herself get controlled all this time?

She gave Janice photos of Elliot and Darlene at that town where the DA operative was killed.

The DA has been doing whatever it wanted up to this time, while the FBI looked weak.  Now one compromised and broken agent turns the tables on them?

It's exhilarating to see but have they established that Dom was capable of these moves, making a deal with the Irish gangster to take out the DA and save her family while waiting until it was almost too late to take out the taxidermist and her DA goons?

[Cardie]

4 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

That makes me think it was the second alter. 

In that scene we see Elliot’s reflection in the glass. I took that as the reveal that he was talking to his more defiant self. 

[truthaboutluv]

1 minute ago, Cardie said:

In that scene we see Elliot’s reflection in the glass. I took that as the reveal that he was talking to his more defiant self. 

Hmm, I missed that. Good point. 

[tennisgurl]

Way to go Dom! Finally getting one over on Janice and the Dark Army, saving her family and taking all of the Dark Army goons, including totally not normal Janice, at her place out, while zip tied and bleeding out! Thats some serious bad ass stuff right there! The look on Janice's smug face when the Irish guy told her how he and his guys took her goons out and just laughing off her "your meddling with cosmic forces!!" bullshit was just the early Christmas present I wanted! 

Last episode was so haunting and traumatic, I was glad to spend some time doing follow up from this huge revelation, although I still fear that the show just doesent have the time to dive into this topic and give it the treatment that it deserves. It was so sweet that Kristina was still looking out for Elliot despite everything that happened, she is just such a good person. I think that Little Elliot isnt the third alter, just someone who Elliot needs right now to guide his older self through this. Elliot apologizing to Little Elliot for "not protecting him" was so sad, poor Elliot, it was so tragic how he felt like he should have done more to fight his dad, oh Elliot. Rami is really working for that second Emmy. 

The bit where they really hammered in that, yes, Mr. Robot isnt Elliots father but someone he created as a child to be the father he really wanted and not the abusive monster he was, was much appreciated. So did Elliots mom know about the abuse? Did Darlene? Was she also being abused, or did Elliot stop him the one time he tried that led to him jumping out the window? 

With how depressing this show can get and how inescapable the Dark Army and the forces of evil can seem, it was great to see some real wins this week and moments of real human connection and kindness. 

[Avaleigh]

Dom's triumph made the episode for me. It was so good to see that taxidermist get her comeuppance. I only wish her death hadn't been so quick and that she'd had longer to process the fact that she got outplayed in every sense.

I do feel like a couple of these episodes could have been condensed. I feel like the big meeting with Price and Whiterose is long overdue.

[Donder]

Its hard to take anything we see "through Elliot" seriously. Since the beginning not trusting the author has been the main focus of this show. I suspect the last 5 episodes will rewrite the story yet again. Was Elliot really sexually abused??? Does Darlene really exist?????? Does Dark Army really exist as we see it on screen?????

[shapeshifter]

So an inner child cannot be an alter?

[possibilities]

9 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

So an inner child cannot be an alter?

They most certainly can.

[Anela]

Finally!! That was clever of Dom, I liked "Lucky Irish Bastard", and I was into this episode. I hope help gets to Dom in time. I wonder if she set that up, once they killed that man, when she said she was something like 99% sure that they were okay. If she'd tipped them off in any way, her family would have been dead. She had Darlene fooled, too - it does go against the week before, when she was begging her to kill her. How long were they missing? 

I'm glad they had that part at the end, with Mr Robot and Elliot. Damn, I think Christian Slater did well with that, and poor Elliott. 

I'm glad that Krista is okay, and that they got in that hug. I agree with everything said above about them, and Dom's win. Janice was much too smug - like Vera - and I'm glad to see them both gone. 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Anela

[tennisgurl]

I admit I laughed at the easy joke when one of Doms aunts (probably) was complaining about her son swearing. “I don’t know where he hears this stuff, it must be his father, the son of a bitch!” 

[hnygrl]

I owe Dom an apology. Man, I did not see that. At all. The woman had a plan. And went along for the ride until she knew her family was safe. And then it was ON!  Man, even with a collapsed lung and tied up she managed to take out everyone in the room. I was and am so damn proud of her. She did the damn  thing. 

Edited November 26, 2019 by hnygrl

[shapeshifter]

So in the last scene when Elliot seemingly had lost the will to do his grand hack, does that mean Vera succeeded in having Krista "break" him like Vera broke some bully with a bat, and if so, did Vera expect this outcome? Or was it a side effect?
  
  

5 hours ago, Anela said:

I hope help gets to Dom in time.

I prefer to think that she just went out in style, but I might also be down for the further misadventures of Dom --or not.
  

5 hours ago, Anela said:

If she'd tipped them off in any way, her family would have been dead. She had Darlene fooled, too - it does go against the week before, when she was begging her to kill her.

Dom begging Darlene to kill her doesn't necessarily go against her plans --her family's rescue was already in motion, right? But you raise an interesting point about Darlene being fooled: Dom probably was sure Darlene wouldn't kill her, and so the begging was in part to ensure that Darlene went along with believing the psychos were all powerful (so they wouldn't catch on to the plan to rescue Dom's family). 

Edited November 26, 2019 by shapeshifter

[scrb]

Dom had PTSD, from the massacre in China, from seeing her FBI colleagues assasinated.

She was having nightmares about the DA.

That whole season where she's in her apartment talking to Alexa and everything since, she seemed broken.

When she came to get Darlene, I don't think it was in her plans for both of them to be caught, bound and stabbed.

If she didn't have the knife, how was she going to take out Janice and the DA henchmen?

She was badass but nothing in her character development showed she was capable of this kind of planning or being so lethal.

And she had to plot with a gangster, not the FBI or any of the US intel community.

[Ottis]

If this wasn't the last season, I would stop watching.

Don't need the torture porn. Not interested in Elliott's continued self discovery. Sort of curious about interesting visuals and filmography, but that's not enough to hold my interest.

What happened to this show.

It only became interesting when Deegan talked to Janice. 

[possibilities]

I think some people liked the show for the action adventure aspect, some for the psychological drama, and some for both. It's really only the third group who's likely to still find it compelling. They've leaned more toward the psychological elements this season, but I think there was always torture porn. Tyrell was all about that in the beginning. All he really did, actually. Plus the Shayla debacle.

[truthaboutluv]

4 minutes ago, possibilities said:

It's really only the third group who's likely to still find it compelling.

Honestly I don't think it's even that deep. I just think the long period between S3 and S4 just made some people lose interest in the show. It happens. And the truth is, this show has never been a mass appeal type of show. 

It's always been the definition of a cult classic, where it had this niche of hardcore fans. But it's always been a show that's confused and frustrated and hell bored some people. I saw plenty of comments when Rami won his Oscar, from people saying they remember him from Mr. Robot but how they only saw a few episodes of the first season and could never really get into it. 

The show is just simply not your mass appeal type of show. And with shows like that, much like most art, you find those who absolutely love it, those who hate it and those who are in the middle where they can objectively see it's a quality show but can't truly love it.

To go back to the example of comments after Rami won the Oscar. I remember many of the ones who said they couldn't get into the show, saying that objectively though, they could still see how good he was and how amazing he was in the role.  

And all of that's fine. Same as those who have simply moved on and lost interest. 

[possibilities]

I like it, and I agree it's never been a mass appeal kind of thing. But the people who've been watching for 4 seasons and now are saying they don't like it anymore, to me seem like people who used to like it, so their loss of interest seems to come from something other than it not being a mass appeal kind of show. They've been watching this long, so they used to like it.

I do think the emphasis has shifted, and I don't mind, but the complaints I hear are coming from people who liked it the way it used to be, when it was more about the hack and less about Elliot's psychological integration.

I agree it's all fine either way.

[truthaboutluv]

19 minutes ago, possibilities said:

But the people who've been watching for 4 seasons and now are saying they don't like it anymore, to me seem like people who used to like it, so their loss of interest seems to come from something other than it not being a mass appeal kind of show. They've been watching this long, so they used to like it.

That's why the first thing I mentioned was some losing interest from the long period between S3 and S4. I was referring to those people who once watched and now say they're not interested or don't like it anymore. 

YMMV but the impression I get is that for some of those, there's almost a bit of hate watching going on because of the loss of interest during the long wait period between seasons. And so naturally if you're hate watching a show, you're going to be way more critical and cynical about it. Personally, I've never gotten hate watching myself because life is too short and there are too many shows out there for me to waste time on something I don't care about anymore. But that's just me.

And I will say that as with everything, it depends on where you're reading comments. Because the Reddit Mr. Robot section is still as active as ever and the fans still as intense and positive about the show. The critical reception for the season has been extremely positive, with Decider declaring last week's episode one of the best television episodes of the year and AV Club calling it one of the best episodes of the show's entire run. 

[possibilities]

41 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

 the Reddit Mr. Robot section is still as active as ever and the fans still as intense and positive about the show. The critical reception for the season has been extremely positive, with Decider declaring last week's episode one of the best television episodes of the year and AV Club calling it one of the best episodes of the show's entire run. 

That's cool to know. I really liked the last few episodes myself; I'm glad I'm not the only one.

Edited November 28, 2019 by possibilities

[Anela]

I just have to be in the right mood for it, and the two-year absence did affect it a bit. I usually watch something again, when it's been that long, before the new season starts, but I didn't this time.

I also used to love reading all the time. I still feel happy over a new pile of library books - but due to personal stuff over the last several years (like losing my mother), and before that, I have trouble focusing. I can't relax. Two nights ago, I finally relaxed enough to read for hours. Found just the right spot, the right mood... it's the same with the TV. 

Edited November 28, 2019 by Anela

[Slovenly Muse]

I agree about the time between seasons. I was lukewarm on the show in season 1, and every season I think I've appreciated it more and more to the point where I think I finally fell full-on in love with the show this season, but honestly, I start every new season with very little memory of what happened in the previous one, and it really dampens my enthusiasm. It's a bit slow-moving, its tone can be flat, it doesn't do the kind of splashy stuff that sticks in your mind, and I find it does kind of drift away as soon as the season is done. I'm not saying that's a bad thing: I'm actually really into its tone and the way it tells its story, but the long breaks between seasons do not serve it well. I'm planning to do a full-series rewatch leading up to the last couple of episodes to see how the whole thing holds together as one cohesive unit. I don't think I'll know how to feel about the show as a whole until I see it as a whole.

[Tachi Rocinante]

I was half expecting Mr. Robot to turn out to be the name for, you know, that big fucking robot in the back room with the Tomorrowland stuff where they hid.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm kind of over the tactic (for lack of a better term) of the pleasant music playing over a tragic/violent scene. It's a little played out.

I did have a good laugh on Janice ripping Dom to jerking to Darlene. And Darlene calling her cuntstick. heee. I would love Darlene in real life.

On 11/26/2019 at 5:57 PM, Ottis said:

If this wasn't the last season, I would stop watching.

On 11/28/2019 at 11:27 AM, truthaboutluv said:

That's why the first thing I mentioned was some losing interest from the long period between S3 and S4. I was referring to those people who once watched and now say they're not interested or don't like it anymore. 

Same here on both. And I actually liked the last 2 episodes. Shows like this need to grasp the context of postmodern television. There is a fuck ton of content out there. I watched probably 250 shows at least in the meantime. I'm not rewatching. Then 57 years go by and it's like, 'hey watch our show again.' I didn't know it was back on until like episode 5.

I don't mind the torture, violence, or even Elliot being an unreliable narrator. I do have a genuine interest in seeing how it ends. I like the skewed camera angles. Back when things actually happened I thought it was a cool twist that Angela was working with Mr. Robot. But the long break was one factor and this season has just been overly ponderous with a lot of people opining in rooms. I bet if they only had 6 or 8 hours to wrap up the series, this season would have been way way more compelling.

I think the show bought too much into its own bullshit. I think there are legit criticisms of the narrative direction of the show, which I think stems from just not having a lot of plot to stretch over 13 episodes.

If I was hatewatching (which I think is dumb but I'll concede the point) then at least I'd have some emotional investment. It's just something I'm getting through because I know there's only a month left. The show has basically in a holding pattern since episode 2. I mean, this episode - basically was for the last scene.

I'm glad Dom got one over on Janice, but she's just a ridiculously incompetent villain, it makes Dom look even dumber that she didn't execute it in like 45 seconds after she first met Janice.

[Ottis]

15 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I think the show bought too much into its own bullshit. I think there are legit criticisms of the narrative direction of the show, which I think stems from just not having a lot of plot to stretch over 13 episodes.

I think that's my problem. The show started out as a hack to bring society down (which was silly but there was a plot), and interesting looks at the haves and the have nots of this society, and some of the shadowy organizations who muck around with the rules. It was done well, and that alone intrigued me.

And oh, BTW, the guy we saw Elliott talking to throughout the season WAS ONLY IN ELLIOTT'S HEAD. That was the mind bender at the end of the season that made Mr. Robot must see for me.

Then White Rose and the Dark Army became a centerpiece to what was happening, and that was interesting. It had real consequences, with characters dying, freaking out or on the run. The original hack turned out to be not especially thought-through by the hackers, but it had awakened other forces that maintained my interest. And White Rose herself was a great character. And Dom and the FBI were on the trail.

Meanwhile, we had Elliott and his various personalities - who else was only real to Ellliott? Interesting, I guess, but only meaningful if it impacts the overall mythology.

Cut to this season ... aside from poor Angela being whacked, what has happened? We had a vanity episode where no one talked, we've had multiple speeches from Big Bird and his quest to make Elliott his teammate (which ended with a whimper), we've had a brief bit of intrigue with crazy Janice (who is now dead) ... and we've had this looooong, stretched out quest around Elliott, his personalities and his integration which, as a reveal, had the least surprising cause ever.

Where is White Rose? Why does WR say she and E are on the same side, and what is WR's secret project? What is next for society and how does the DA figure into it? Who is combating the DA aside from Elliott? If Elliott does the Cypress Bank hack, what will happen?  What is Darlene's fate? What, ultimately, will be Elliott's fate?

THAT is what I want more of, and it feels like most of this season after the first two episodes has been running in place.

15 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

The show has basically in a holding pattern since episode 2. I mean, this episode - basically was for the last scene.

Exactly right.

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, Ottis said:

Cut to this season ... aside from poor Angela being whacked, what has happened? We had a vanity episode where no one talked, we've had multiple speeches from Big Bird and his quest to make Elliott his teammate (which ended with a whimper), we've had a brief bit of intrigue with crazy Janice (who is now dead) ... and we've had this looooong, stretched out quest around Elliott, his personalities and his integration which, as a reveal, had the least surprising cause ever.

YMMV but one, we have had more than Angela being killed in my opinion and two, is this season really any different than the previous seasons? Season 1 took almost the entire season for the big 5/9 hack to happen. We kept hearing about the plan to do it throughout the season but it didn't actually happen until the penultimate episode of the season.

And in the waste of time vein, how much time was spent away from Elliot and F-Society, to show Tyrell's crazy. Tyrell having sex with men, murdering the CFO's wife that pretty much went nowhere. Season Two spent at least three or four episodes showing Elliot doing virtually the same thing over and over, just to have a big "reveal" late in the season that he'd really been in jail the whole time. 

This season has had Angela killed, the end of Tyrell (assuming one believes he's real), the reveal about the Deus Group, which had previously not been exposed to viewers, Elliot working to bring down the Deus Group, more reveal about Elliot's life and basically why he ended up so fucked up, Dom figuring out how to get herself out of the mess she was in, etc. 

[DoctorAtomic]

Most of us here knew Elliot was in jail though, so there was suspense as to when we'd know for sure. Same thing with the hack. We were working to something. And there was the Mr Robot and Darlene reveal. Elliot also had tried to stop blowing up all the buildings and got rope a doped. They also had Elliot and Mr Robot fighting by angrily typing on a terminal, which I found entertaining. Don't forget, there's a lot of world building that had to be done in the early stages of the show.

I didn't even remember about the bank hack now until it was posted here. The heist itself was entertaining and there was actual action. I didn't hate the episode, but I thought it was dumb to have *no* dialogue at all. You can't make a tv show by saying 'hey doing _________ would be cool.' And then figure out what that episode would be. Now, there certainly was a stretch of the episode where they had to be silent, and if they stuck to that it would have been cool. Forcing the whole thing to be silent just seemed insulting to the viewers and kind of ridiculous. The plot to threaten the woman into making the phone call was good too but I felt it stretched on too long. I'll give them credit for switching the v/o to Mr Robot as a narrative choice because I think it doesn't spell out a good ending for Elliot - like I think he's going to 'die' and Mr Robot will 'be Elliot' by the end. 

I kind of liked the Pine Barrens episode because I like Tyrell, but I think they ran out of what to do with him too. White Rose is great too, but I don't think they actually knew what to do with her either this season except wait around. I don't actually mind if the 'project' turns out to be a red herring. To be fair, I am looking forward to it likely doing her in. 

So it's yes and no. Some of it was the long break. Some of it is 'oh here we go again with Elliot wandering around'. A lot of it is, well, we have 13 episodes and I can't think of much else to do with the show. They wrote Dom and Janice poorly to fill time imo. I think there was a little lack of foresight into this last season overall. I'm sure they know how they wanted it to end, and I think they'll stick the landing, but it's a hard show, it's always been, and I think some of us just don't have that much in the tank anymore. 

[truthaboutluv]

26 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Most of us here knew Elliot was in jail though, so there was suspense as to when we'd know for sure. Same thing with the hack.

That may be, but the point is, one could argue that there was the same "holding pattern" some are complaining about now. Yes we may have known the jail reveal was coming and that the 5/9 hack was coming but it doesn't change the fact that multiple episodes went by where these things didn't happen. Instead we saw Elliot at the same basketball court again, talking to Leon again, etc. 

26 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

And there was the Mr Robot and Darlene reveal. Elliot also had tried to stop blowing up all the buildings and got rope a doped.

That was two separate seasons. The first happened in Season 1 and the buildings blew up in Season 3. 

26 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Don't forget, there's a lot of world building that had to be done in the early stages of the show.

Yes and similarly, there are a lot of questions still to be answered now because unless the show wrapped in one episode, of course viewers will be held in suspense until the end. If when the show wraps, viewers are still saying, this and that was never explained or answered, then I guess we can make the argument that the season was a waste of 12/13 episodes. 

26 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I didn't hate the episode, but I thought it was dumb to have *no* dialogue at all. You can't make a tv show by saying 'hey doing _________ would be cool.' And then figure out what that episode would be.

YMMV at the end of the day it's all subjective which is why writers can never please everyone. Because for me personally, I loved the episode and thought it was absolutely brilliant, particularly because I felt it was organic to the show.

If this were some other show (can't think of one at the moment) that tried this, it would seem gimmicky to me. But IMO, the concept worked because this show has always as I noted in another post, employed a lot of silence.

Elliot, our main character and predominant narrator rarely speaks. That's why he has whole conversations in his head, i.e. to the viewer. This show has always had drawn out silences, long pauses, etc. So for me, a silent era homage if you will, made a lot of sense. 

Edited December 2, 2019 by truthaboutluv

[DoctorAtomic]

There were long stretches where being silent was entirety justified in the episode and within character for both Darlene and Elliot. Forcing silence the whole time wasn't the right narrative choice more than it was stylistic. You can have both and still achieve what you were going for. 

I don't want to watch Homages to Classic Films. I want to watch Mr. Robot. 

I mean, even with this episode, it's been a lot of People In Rooms Talking and way too much Dom and Janice filling air time. I'd rather see Elliot sulking around breaking down the bank hack. 

[possibilities]

I'm interested in Elliot's internal psychological struggles as much as in the external world struggles of the show, so I find that a lot happens even in episodes where "the plot doesn't advance". We gain access to how the external and the internal clash, and the emotional fallout. Even for people like Dom, who is in a lot of ways a plot device, her motivations and how she handles her internal conflicts, what drives her  choices, is interesting to me.

There is very little quality representation of multiples on TV. Most of what is out there is more gimmicky than what we see on this show. I think representation is important. So I don't find the show boring.

[qtpye]

On 12/2/2019 at 10:53 AM, truthaboutluv said:

YMMV but one, we have had more than Angela being killed in my opinion and two, is this season really any different than the previous seasons? Season 1 took almost the entire season for the big 5/9 hack to happen. We kept hearing about the plan to do it throughout the season but it didn't actually happen until the penultimate episode of the season.

And in the waste of time vein, how much time was spent away from Elliot and F-Society, to show Tyrell's crazy. Tyrell having sex with men, murdering the CFO's wife that pretty much went nowhere. Season Two spent at least three or four episodes showing Elliot doing virtually the same thing over and over, just to have a big "reveal" late in the season that he'd really been in jail the whole time. 

This season has had Angela killed, the end of Tyrell (assuming one believes he's real), the reveal about the Deus Group, which had previously not been exposed to viewers, Elliot working to bring down the Deus Group, more reveal about Elliot's life and basically why he ended up so fucked up, Dom figuring out how to get herself out of the mess she was in, etc. 

At the beginning, it almost seemed liked Tyrell was a married version of Christian Bale's character in American Psycho, Patrick Bateman.

They wanted him to be a corporate sociopath that at first probably just wanted to use Elliot for his gain. I think they decided they were going to make him a more decent guy and there was no longer a need for the wife and kid. I remember when Mad Men came out people were shocked that Don Draper was married with kids and they were going for something like that with Tyrell.

I think they changed up to make the psychopath that wanted to used Elliot, Vera instead of Tyrell and Tyrell became just another scared person who knew they were in great danger from a larger unseen force. 

[DoctorAtomic]

12 minutes ago, qtpye said:

On 12/2/2019 at 8:53 AM, truthaboutluv said:

At the beginning, it almost seemed liked Tyrell was a married version of Christian Bale's character in American Psycho, Patrick Bateman

Totally. I was bummed they killed off the wife. 

[qtpye]

23 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Totally. I was bummed they killed off the wife. 

She might as well of never existed. I was talking to someone who totally forgot that Tyrell even had a wife. This is saying something since they really went out of their way to make her over the top and very memorable in the first season.

[shapeshifter]

20 minutes ago, qtpye said:

She might as well of never existed. I was talking to someone who totally forgot that Tyrell even had a wife. This is saying something since they really went out of their way to make her over the top and very memorable in the first season.

Tyrell's wife's purpose was to help define Tyrell --who I am still not convinced was not an Elliot alter, heh.

[qtpye]

14 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Tyrell's wife's purpose was to help define Tyrell --who I am still not convinced was not an Elliot alter, heh.

Maybe, but it almost seemed like they were building her up to be a compelling character on her own and then dropped it.

All I know is that she was an S&M loving duck lipped sex pot who was kind of like a poor man's Angelina Jolie. She also seemed to be the brains behind their coupling but I am still not sure.

[AudienceofOne]

As much as I was tired of watching yet another episode with people monologuing at other people tied to chairs, I am really loving the way in which this show explores the idea of control and the way in which our desire for control - over ourselves, our lives, our relatives, the world, even time - influences everything we do and want and have.

At its core, this show was always about how Elliot's battle for control over himself mirrors battles he has with E-Corp, the Dark Army and Whiterose but also those battles everyone else is waging. Even the taxidermy is integrated as a small-scale desire to control death. 

So, while the last three episodes haven't been my favourite they're all thematically on point and I'm looking forward to the back half. I'm just going to take a breather I think. It's a lot to process.