Designing Women - General Discussion

[Keywestclubkid]

I know the name of every man in this city who has money! I know the names of the men who are THINKING about having money! Has a matter of fact I even know the names of little boys who are good at playing Monopoly!  So don’t tell me about the men who have money in Atlanta okay? 

[hiisa]

Im rewatching Designing Women and I'm in Season 1. JD is kinda pushy. The first night he goes on a date with a Mary Jo he pushed for sex, she said no and he storms off. A handful of eps later Mary Jo and JD have been dating for 3 months--hes the first man she's dated since Ted and she's not ready. He tells her he's 34 and he's not gonna sit around waiting and holding hands  and taking cold showers. But his mean ex just came down last episode demanding Mary Jo step aside because they are getting back together! Why would she be eager to jump into bed with him?

I still love Julia Sugarbaker. Goodness I wish I could be like her. In this episode she just gave Charlene's doctor quite a set down. The girls encouraged Charlene to get a second opinion when her doctor was dismissive of a lump she found in her breast and then dropped her as a patient when she pursued a second opinion. 

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, hiisa said:

D is kinda pushy. The first night he goes on a date with a Mary Jo he pushed for sex, she said no and he storms off. A handful of eps later Mary Jo and JD have been dating for 3 months--hes the first man she's dated since Ted and she's not ready. He tells her he's 34 and he's not gonna sit around waiting and holding hands  and taking cold showers. But his mean ex just came down last episode demanding Mary Jo step aside because they are getting back together! Why would she be eager to jump into bed with him?

They really messed with that storyline by, as was common practice then and still sometimes happens today, airing episodes in a very different order than they were filmed for a larger purpose; the trajectory of Mary Jo and J.D.'s relationship winds up nonsensical and contradictory.  If aired in production order, it would play much better.

[hiisa]

Oh why do they do that? So annoying! Also, my introduction to Designing Women was Nick at Nite when I was a kid. I may have watched an EP here or there with my mom when it first came out but mostly, Nick at Nite. When JD said he was a 34 year old man I nearly fell out of my dang chair! I always thought they were so old! Now, watching this as a 39 year old woman I'm like...something changed between the way they adult and the way I adult. Something.... significant!

[Taryn74]

2 hours ago, hiisa said:

When JD said he was a 34 year old man I nearly fell out of my dang chair!

I'm 48 and had the same reaction when I read it LOL. Holy f@#k they were young on this show, looking back at it now.

[annzeepark914]

JD was so cute and fun. I wish they'd allowed Mary Jo & JD to marry. Instead we got that wussy marriage between Charlene & Bill (Mr. Blandly Perfect). Life was so much more interesting when Charlene was dating Shadow!  

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

Life was so much more interesting when Charlene was dating Shadow!  

I'd have preferred a happy medium.  Season one Charlene was too often downright stupid instead of naive, and had terrible taste in men.  But, while I think they evened things out nicely on that first front starting with season two, they swung way too far in the opposite direction when it came to the taste in men part, and married her off to a guy who's as dull as dishwater.

[ljenkins782]

On 6/21/2022 at 9:11 PM, annzeepark914 said:

JD was so cute and fun. I wish they'd allowed Mary Jo & JD to marry. Instead we got that wussy marriage between Charlene & Bill (Mr. Blandly Perfect). Life was so much more interesting when Charlene was dating Shadow!  

Yeah, JD and Mary Jo were great together, I don't know why they had to split up. Much as I enjoy the Manhunt episode, it makes me side-eye the casual breakup of her and JD. He was pretty much exactly what she was looking for. Was it just cause he had to move for his job? 

I've been binging this lately, so many great episodes in different ways, but Miss Trial might be one of my favorite Julia episodes ever. I love it when she's partly in Terminator-mode, but also being kind of a snide asshole at the same time (see also, her interactions with Big Edie and Mickey Jr in The Wilderness Experience). Her comment to Janice the mime "but you do feel comfortable smearing your face with white greasepaint and annoying pedestrians all over Atlanta, interesting..." is so perfectly delivered, it makes me laugh out loud no matter how many times I've seen it.

Meshach Taylor was so under-rated, IMO, he added so many tiny nuances to Anthony and made the character blend so well with the main cast. He had a special relationship with Suzanne, of course, but he had genuine and specific relationships with each of them, including Bernice.

[sugarbaker design]

49 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

but Miss Trial might be one of my favorite Julia episodes ever.

It's a good one!

49 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Meshach Taylor was so under-rated, IMO, he added so many tiny nuances to Anthony and made the character blend so well with the main cast.

No one delivered a one-liner like MT.  "San Sucky, here we come!" and "Cindy, Cindy Birdsong" immediately come to mind.

[mmecorday]

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JD was so cute and fun. I wish they'd allowed Mary Jo & JD to marry. Instead we got that wussy marriage between Charlene & Bill (Mr. Blandly Perfect). Life was so much more interesting when Charlene was dating Shadow!  

Amen and hallelujah to this! Bill may as well have been a living Ken doll. He had no personality whatsoever and the actor had zero chemistry with Jean Smart.

[ljenkins782]

26 minutes ago, mmecorday said:

Amen and hallelujah to this! Bill may as well have been a living Ken doll. He had no personality whatsoever and the actor had zero chemistry with Jean Smart.

I wasn't bothered by Bill when I watched these back in the day, but compared to the rest of the characters, he is a bit of a dud. The writing mostly let him off the hook, in cases like Reservations for Eight, JD, Reese, and Dash all have interesting, impassioned dialogue, but Bill just sits there cuddling with Charlene and the writing explains it away.

Jean Smart did her best to inject some life into the relationship and it produced some good moments, like when he breaks up with her and her response to that. But overall, the actor was pretty wooden.

Quote

I'd have preferred a happy medium.  Season one Charlene was too often downright stupid instead of naive, and had terrible taste in men.  But, while I think they evened things out nicely on that first front starting with season two, they swung way too far in the opposite direction when it came to the taste in men part, and married her off to a guy who's as dull as dishwater.

Yeah, season 1 Charlene's taste in men was godawful, to the point of being embarrassing.  And that's not even counting the Big Cookie, Mason. That storyline is problematic in its own ways with her acting like she's doing him the world's biggest favor by not vomiting at the sight of him. I was glad when they ended that story arc.

[JAYJAY1979]

Charlene season 2 till she leaves has intelligence..and her humor comes more from being fascinated by nothing and being sentimental.  

Suzanne, on the other hand, seemed almost intelligent yet shallow in season 1...before she starts to become camp in season 3.

Julia was almost too harsh in season 1...but season 2 through season 7 is more deadpan with occasional dramatic outbursts.  No way Julia of season 1 would have done 'Sweet Georgia Brown'...drunk or sober.

[hiisa]

I watched the ep where Suzanne randomly (so completely randomly) fosters a little Vietnamese girl who is waiting to get adopted and y'all I dont know what flew in my eye and died there but  I was absolutely tearing up that episode. When Suzanne called Julia and said she didn't want to give her back? And she told Julia that Li asking was the only person who ever loved her for her? And Julia said no, their mother and Julia (and I would add Julia's son) all loved Suzanne.  But when little Li Sing was going away with her new family (who totally seemed like creepy baby collectors) and she told them that she could sing and sang Oh Susannah? I cried tears! 

[Taryn74]

5 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

Meshach Taylor was so under-rated, IMO, he added so many tiny nuances to Anthony and made the character blend so well with the main cast. He had a special relationship with Suzanne, of course, but he had genuine and specific relationships with each of them, including Bernice.

I adored Anthony. "They're gonna exfoliate me!"

57 minutes ago, hiisa said:

I watched the ep where Suzanne randomly (so completely randomly) fosters a little Vietnamese girl who is waiting to get adopted and y'all I dont know what flew in my eye and died there but  I was absolutely tearing up that episode.

That is a beautiful episode. Turning Li Sing into a mini Suzanne was sweetly hilarious. "Oh my heart and soul!"

[SanDiegoInExile]

10 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

Yeah, JD and Mary Jo were great together, I don't know why they had to split up.

Richard Gilliland was hired to star in another CBS sitcom in 1989.  "Heartland" lasted all of 10 episodes.

[mmecorday]

Quote

I watched the ep where Suzanne randomly (so completely randomly) fosters a little Vietnamese girl who is waiting to get adopted and y'all I dont know what flew in my eye and died there but  I was absolutely tearing up that episode. When Suzanne called Julia and said she didn't want to give her back? And she told Julia that Li asking was the only person who ever loved her for her? And Julia said no, their mother and Julia (and I would add Julia's son) all loved Suzanne.  But when little Li Sing was going away with her new family (who totally seemed like creepy baby collectors) and she told them that she could sing and sang Oh Susannah? I cried tears! 

Delta Burke is so good in this episode. I just want to hug her.

[Lois Sandborne]

On 6/23/2022 at 11:19 AM, sugarbaker design said:

No one delivered a one-liner like MT.  "San Sucky, here we come!" and "Cindy, Cindy Birdsong" immediately come to mind.

Yes! They all had pretty amazing line delivery in my book, but Meshach Taylor really made things stick. I love how he'd say "No, but thank you very much for asking!" whenever anyone asked him something racist, or asked him to do something outlandish.

I rewatched Season 4 this past weekend because it's my favorite and I really needed the pick me up. I haven't seen this show in a while, but I think they were just firing on all cylinders at this time.  I guess it's because of the writing, but the show generally seems so fresh and creative to me, different to the same old plots you see on every sitcom, even when they were doing the same old plots. Like there are probably a dozen shows with characters getting their heads stuck in something, but I'll always remember the Abbot Bannister and Miss Betts the usherette at the Governor's mansion. Or in one of my very favorites, "Tornado Watch." A storm is a trope as old as time, but they put a great spin on it with all the randoms showing up and Charlene filming it all. ("Happy anniversary, LOIS AND SHIMMY!!!") Or the mistress episode! ("Well, I guess she knew.") They just had a way of making things pop.

On 6/23/2022 at 12:17 PM, ljenkins782 said:

Jean Smart did her best to inject some life into the relationship and it produced some good moments, like when he breaks up with her and her response to that. But overall, the actor was pretty wooden.

I think Bill had some spark in the episode where Charlene thinks he's having an affair because his copilot is a woman, and the one where he comes back from overseas and Mary Jo is being a big third wheel while they're trying to reconnect. When I was a kid I had a little crush on Bill because the actor is handsome and he pretty much is Charlene's fantasy, but no there really isn't much to him. I don't think any of her love interests were much to write home about though. I guess Other Bill had a sense of humor.

On 6/23/2022 at 10:26 AM, ljenkins782 said:

Yeah, JD and Mary Jo were great together, I don't know why they had to split up. Much as I enjoy the Manhunt episode, it makes me side-eye the casual breakup of her and JD. He was pretty much exactly what she was looking for.

They were great together. I do love JD's line in I think the Nightmare from Hee Haw episode when he says to Mary Jo that she doesn't have to keep inviting him on those group trips since they've broken up.

[mmecorday]

Quote

When I was a kid I had a little crush on Bill because the actor is handsome and he pretty much is Charlene's fantasy, but no there really isn't much to him.

Although he looked nothing like the guy in the poster that Charlene thought was the best looking guy on the face of the earth.

Quote

Or in one of my very favorites, "Tornado Watch." A storm is a trope as old as time, but they put a great spin on it with all the randoms showing up and Charlene filming it all. ("Happy anniversary, LOIS AND SHIMMY!!!")

I love this episode. The best part is the montage at the end with the television announcer's monotone narration over all the crazy stuff Charlene videotaped. Especially Mr. Pease dancing in Reese's underwear and getting cake smushed.

[Taryn74]

39 minutes ago, Lois Sandborne said:

and the one where he comes back from overseas and Mary Jo is being a big third wheel while they're trying to reconnect.

That episode is hysterical! I especially loved that they kept portraying Mary Jo as being so clueless (which quickly got into 'come on, nobody is that stupid' range) but then she admitted she had heard on Oprah that it's a difficult transition time when the spouse comes back from military duty and she was trying to make things easier on them. Soooo funny and sweet of her to do.

[JAYJAY1979]

39 minutes ago, Taryn74 said:

That episode is hysterical! I especially loved that they kept portraying Mary Jo as being so clueless (which quickly got into 'come on, nobody is that stupid' range) but then she admitted she had heard on Oprah that it's a difficult transition time when the spouse comes back from military duty and she was trying to make things easier on them. Soooo funny and sweet of her to do.

I remember Mary Jo tried to excuse herself at first..but Bill/Charlene both insisted on her staying.

I always blamed all of them because Mary Jo should have listened to her instincts while Bill/Charlene shouldn't have insisted on Mary Jo staying.

Season 5 was an odd year since Delta and the Bloodworths were not getting along...so Suzanne almost did a walk on for some of the episodes.  The balance was off, but I think even if there wasn't tension..season 5 wouldn't have topped season 4 in terms of quality 

[ljenkins782]

54 minutes ago, JAYJAY1979 said:

Season 5 was an odd year since Delta and the Bloodworths were not getting along...so Suzanne almost did a walk on for some of the episodes.  The balance was off, but I think even if there wasn't tension..season 5 wouldn't have topped season 4 in terms of quality 

Jean Smart literally did a walk-on in several episodes (I guess due to pregnancy and the time just after). I swear there was one episode where she walks in, apologizes for being late, and then gets her purse and leaves 1 minute later. Hardly seemed worth the bother, but I guess that was to give her a paycheck for appearing? And then there are the ones where she's filmed completely separately from the rest of the cast for most of the episode, like when she's at the DMV.

Season 5 is actually better than it probably should have been, given the real life complications behind the scenes (Delta's issues plus Jean's need for time off). Although most of the really good episodes are front-loaded into the beginning of the season and more of the duds come later (High Noon in the laundry room, How long has this been going on?, etc, those episodes aren't among my favorites). 

An episode that hits with a clunk for me is My Daughter, Myself, where 17-year-old Claudia brings home a 34-year-old man for a date (neither of them knew how old the other was). Although they do address the absurdity of the age gap at first, a couple of troubling bits follow. Like where Mary Jo says "this is the place where you tell me what a nice guy you are, etc" and the guy (who now knows that Claudia is 17) says "would that work?" 

And then the misunderstanding at the end where Claudia asks the guy back to go out with Mary Jo but she still thinks he's there for Claudia and she's going to allow it. Like, what the hell? 

Quote

I remember Mary Jo tried to excuse herself at first..but Bill/Charlene both insisted on her staying.

I always blamed all of them because Mary Jo should have listened to her instincts while Bill/Charlene shouldn't have insisted on Mary Jo staying.

Yeah, there was a middle ground that would have still been polite without being misleading, but Mary Jo should have been able to pick up on some cues too.

[Cetacean]

"The man should have to kill the bug".

I still use that one complete with the hand gestures.

[annzeepark914]

4 hours ago, Lois Sandborne said:

They were great together. I do love JD's line in I think the Nightmare from Hee Haw episode when he says to Mary Jo that she doesn't have to keep inviting him on those group trips since they've broken up.

I loved that line! And it made me sad that JD was really gone from the storyline. When his new show was cancelled, they should've brought him back (but maybe he didn't want to return...actors aren't as into their characters as we are, I guess; look at us, still talking about Mary Jo & JD 🤓). 

[Bastet]

5 hours ago, JAYJAY1979 said:

I remember Mary Jo tried to excuse herself at first..but Bill/Charlene both insisted on her staying.

Exactly; she tried to do the natural thing, but they insisted, and, given what she'd seen on Oprah, she got stuck in a mindset that they needed her as a buffer while they got used to each other again.

[Bastet]

On 6/27/2022 at 10:59 AM, JAYJAY1979 said:

Season 5 was an odd year since Delta and the Bloodworths were not getting along...so Suzanne almost did a walk on for some of the episodes.  The balance was off, but I think even if there wasn't tension..season 5 wouldn't have topped season 4 in terms of quality

Yeah, they never knew if Delta was going to be able to work (she was having panic attacks, but no one - including her - knew that's what was going on at the time), so they had to write Suzanne's scenes so they could be excised or given to someone else at the last minute, but even if that wasn't going on, Linda's attention was on Evening Shade (which premiered that season) far more than DW, so it was inevitably going to be a lesser season.  Pam Norris was a great writer, but it just wasn't the same as when Linda wrote everything.

Edited June 28, 2022 by Bastet

[Rabbit Hutch]

The Sugerbaker sisters, some of my favorite Southern women.  😍

Edited June 28, 2022 by Rabbit Hutch

[LGraves65]

On 6/23/2022 at 11:19 AM, sugarbaker design said:

No one delivered a one-liner like MT.  "San Sucky, here we come!" and "Cindy, Cindy Birdsong" immediately come to mind.

I *still* say "I don't know, some white girl" All. The. Time.

[annzeepark914]

4 hours ago, LGraves65 said:

I *still* say "I don't know, some white girl" All. The. Time.

I can still hear Anthony saying that. One of the best (& most memorable) lines in that show 😁. Anthony & Suzanne were my favorites, especially when they were fussin' with each other.

[Bastet]

7 hours ago, LGraves65 said:

I *still* say "I don't know, some white girl" All. The. Time.

I do too.  Every once in a great while, someone gets the reference, and it's this instant OMG, that show was the best bond.

[annzeepark914]

Does anyone know the "lyrics" to Suzanne's lucky charm ditty, "Consuela, Consuela..." that was a slight (ahem) rip off of The Name Game?

[Bastet]

33 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Does anyone know the "lyrics" to Suzanne's lucky charm ditty, "Consuela, Consuela..." that was a slight (ahem) rip off of The Name Game?

"Consuela, Consuela, bobayla, bananafana fofayla, me, my, momayla, CON-SU-ELA."

[qtpye]

On 6/1/2020 at 9:27 PM, lurkerbee said:

If you have Hulu, you can watch them commercial-free.

So, I have really enjoyed watching this series on Hulu. I just came to “They Shoot Fat Women, Don’t They?” .

It is heartbreaking and as a 37 year old, I have gained a bit of weight over the last decade and understand.

However, I think it is problematic because as much as I find her hilarious, Suzanne is a very superficial character. Her points are that she is obnoxious but gets away with it because she is so pretty. I imagine that she made fun of many overweight women in her life and probably felt superior to them. I wish there was one throw away line about how she used to be judgmental about people's looks but now has a better understanding about the hurt that it can cause.

On 6/21/2022 at 4:30 PM, Taryn74 said:

I'm 48 and had the same reaction when I read it LOL. Holy f@#k they were young on this show, looking back at it now.

It was the same with a lot of shows at the time. In Roseanne the characters were only like 34-36 and seemed quite middle aged. In the reboot, the daughter's are in their 40's and seem younger than middle age. I don't know if it is because we now look at age differently or people were just more settled at earlier ages back then, so they seemed older.

[qtpye]

Still watching on Hulu.

Even though it looks dated now, I have to say that I loved the way Julia dressed. She always looked so stylish and classy.

Before Sex and the City was known for giving the four main characters very distinctive looks, this show was doing it. It was a another way the characters were defined.

Julia was classy and sophisticated.

Mary Joe went from mousy to funky/contemporary.

Charlene was flirty with the shoulder pads.

Suzanne was classic beauty queen.

I don't like fur but look how gorgeous Suzanne looks here.

Edited July 8, 2022 by qtpye

[Anela]

I watched a few episodes on hulu, and then didn't get back to it (I also watched it as a kid/teenager). One of my favourite scenes, was Julia defending Suzanne, to these awful women. "That was the night the lights went out in Georgia!"

[ML89]

10 hours ago, Anela said:

I watched a few episodes on hulu, and then didn't get back to it (I also watched it as a kid/teenager). One of my favourite scenes, was Julia defending Suzanne, to these awful women. "That was the night the lights went out in Georgia!"

Every  time I hear the song on oldies radio, I hear Julia saying that in my head...

[Hiyo]

That baton was on fire!

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, ML89 said:

Every  time I hear the song on oldies radio, I hear Julia saying that in my head...

"And THAT is the NIGHT the LIGHTS went out in Georgia".  Geez, I miss that show. Top notch writing. It's still superior to so much of the dreck that's on TV today, IMO. 

Edited July 8, 2022 by annzeepark914

[Taryn74]

"Except Congeniality..."

😅

I miss this show.

[ML89]

2 hours ago, Taryn74 said:

"Except Congeniality..."

😅

I miss this show.

"Which is NOT something the women in my family aspire to!"

[Lois Sandborne]

Speaking of which, this week's episode of RuPaul's Drag Race had the winners perform a final lip sync challenge to Julia's iconic rant:

Monet, the queen in yellow, got extra points from me for dressing with Sugarbaker realness.

[Anela]

On 7/8/2022 at 11:19 AM, Hiyo said:

That baton was on fire!

She was fantastic.

[ButterQueen]

On 9/18/2021 at 5:41 PM, Egg McMuffin said:

Thanks for posting. What a great article and how great to see an actress over 50 continue to get work (and acclaim). She was always my favorite of the quartet, and the hoopla over Delta Burke’s departure overshadowed just how valuable Jean Smart’s contributions to the show were.

I also liked her comments about her late husband, Richard Gilliland. I always thought that guy was made to be a lead on a hit TV show, but was never in the right place at the right time (Margaret Colin is another one in that category).

I agree with everything, especially Margaret Colin.  Such a great actress.

[ButterQueen]

On 6/21/2022 at 9:11 PM, annzeepark914 said:

JD was so cute and fun. I wish they'd allowed Mary Jo & JD to marry. Instead we got that wussy marriage between Charlene & Bill (Mr. Blandly Perfect). Life was so much more interesting when Charlene was dating Shadow!  

I wanted Mary Jo and JD to marry too, but damn if I didn’t love Charlene’s excitement over getting engaged/married.

[Taryn74]

56 minutes ago, ButterQueen said:

 damn if I didn’t love Charlene’s excitement over getting engaged/married.

It was sweet. And Suzanne immediately inspecting Charlene's engagement ring was hilarious LOL.

I don't know if it's because I was a teenager when I first watched DW, but I thought Bill was really good looking and super sweet. I was surprised when I first saw the comments here that he's boring and bland LOL.

[annzeepark914]

1 minute ago, Taryn74 said:

It was sweet. And Suzanne immediately inspecting Charlene's engagement ring was hilarious LOL.

I don't know if it's because I was a teenager when I first watched DW, but I thought Bill was really good looking and super sweet. I was surprised when I first saw the comments here that he's boring and bland LOL.

I, too, thought he was handsome and a safe beau for Charlene (as opposed to her typical unappealing or unsavory boyfriends). But in retrospect...he was kind of wooden & a bit of a goody two-shoes. Not sure if this was because of the actor or the lines he was given. 

[FormerMod-a1]

12 minutes ago, Taryn74 said:

I thought Bill was really good looking and super sweet. I was surprised when I first saw the comments here that he's boring and bland LOL.

I think he's all those things - handsome and sweet, and a little bland and boring,  :) 

[bluegirl147]

Bill was Charlene's dream guy.  He was what she thought was the perfect guy.  He was a little bland but Charlene could sometimes be a little extra so I think they balanced each other out.  

Speaking of Jean Smart I did a re watch of season one of Hacks and I never once looked at Debra Vance and thought of Charlene.  Jean Smart is a fabulous actress.  

There is a scene of her and Kelsey Grammar when she was guesting on Frasier and they needed popsicle sticks for something and Jean was sucking on a popsicle and I don't remember the exact dialogue but it was something about him dreaming of her doing that in high school.  Makes me laugh every time I see it.  

[chessiegal]

30 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

they needed popsicle sticks for something and Jean was sucking on a popsicle and I don't remember the exact dialogue but it was something about him dreaming of her doing that in high school. 

He said when he was in high school, he would have paid $1,000 to see her do that. Then she promptly bit the popsicle in half. Hee!

[mmecorday]

If there's one thing I don't like about Charlene, it's her sentimental fantasies about World War II.

[bluegirl147]

8 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

He said when he was in high school, he would have paid $1,000 to see her do that. Then she promptly bit the popsicle in half. Hee!

Yes that was it.  That was one of the first things I saw her in after DW and thought wow she is a really good actress.