Avaleigh

Hardy har, I'm just going to pretend that you're doing the writing for Eric's character because what you've proposed makes a hell of a lot more sense than this bullshit they've thrown at us in the form of Sylvie and her thwarted art history ambitions. It's hard to believe that multiple people on the writing staff apparently thought that this would come across as must see tv. I was so sad for Eric when he lost Godric, and I had a very similar reaction to Nora's death. With Sylvie, I felt nothing during that Sophie's choice moment and I can't imagine that's what the writers would have been hoping for from viewers. If the choices are Sookie, Sylvie, and Nora, Nora makes the most sense by a mile in terms of Eric just not being able to get over it. Sure they'd taken a break from each other's company but we're talking about a bond that lasted hundreds of years over a relationship that was probably two years tops with little indication that there was any depth to it apart from fucking and feeding. With Nora we saw bonds on multiple levels and from day one I understood that she was a VIP in his life. I mean, just come the hell on, show if you really expect me to believe that it makes any sort of sense to introduce a character like Sylvie when they could have gone in this direction with the already established character of Nora. YMMV ofcourse.

My impression was that the guru is successful and would gain attention in terms of attracting followers like her and/or some level of media attention. I felt like it seemed typical Sarah Newlin--being the lady in the life of a high profile man. Steve, the governor, and now the guru. At any rate, it certainly didn't take the Yakuza corporation very long to catch up with her and I feel like this might not have been the case if she'd been working in a boutique or something like that.

Nicki's storyline during the third season is riveting (if totally unrealistic) but there was one moment that was so hard for me to understand no matter how I spin it in my head. Pushing her father down the stairs and not hiding the fact that she did it so that all of the horrible choices and sacrifices she made were for nothing. She shouldn't have helped him in the first place but going with the idea that she's been brainwashed since birth, maybe we can give her a pass for getting involved in the first place. But then she hears Kathy's true and horrifying story, she sees that she was put in the joy book, she's hurt, she's in the perfect position to help put her father away and gain sympathy from the man she's crushing on, but she chooses to side with and help her father instead. So after all of that she pushes him down the stairs, doesn't hide the fact that she did it, then actually expects loyalty from him a couple of episodes later knowing perfectly well what sort of person he is. I guess all of the contradictions are what made Nicki such a great character but this was a moment that wash hard for me to understand. Similarly, I never really understood all her waffling back and forth about having another baby and or having extra nights especially in the later seasons. Suddenly in the fourth season she wants one so much that she's willing to go to the Big Bad JJ's son's clinic?

In maybe the fourth or fifth episode of the first season Alby throws it in Nicki's face that Bill married her only to get a loan from Roman and he acts surprised that she didn't know this. He goes on to call her collateral and Nicki looks hurt but doesn't address the matter again in that conversation. It's hinted at again by Bill, Barb, and Roman at various points so it does seem that something of the sort took place. Nicki also asks Bill indirectly about whether or not he actually loved her when he married her and seems insecure about his answer and the implication is that she's thinking about how her father helped secure her marriage since they're at the compound during this scene and Roman's presence is especially felt. Bill claims that he loved her but I've always been fairly skeptical as to whether or not this is true.

I guess I need to watch the episode again because I thought that the lead guy who came to the guru's house was supposed to be from the Yakuza (sp?) corporation. I'm sure they're pissed about the Hep V as well but I definitely think Sarah is going to have to pay for killing that woman so viciously. She can't even claim self defense, it was just all in all one of the worst human on human murders the show has ever shown us IMO so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this isn't just about what Sarah has done to vampires but what she's done to humans as well. DollEyes I agreewith your entire post. I'm glad other people wondered why Sam shifted into an owl rather than a fly. I loved Jason not feeling ashamed for being a "modern" man. Fuck off already, Violet. Re Eric being over a 1,000 years old and of course he would have experienced other loves---that's fair enough but why, if this girl's death was so recent for him did he or Pam not at least mention her name at some point? I also agree that plausible or not I rolled my eyes that it took until the 1980s for Eric to find true love in the form of a French art history student. Seriously, could they come up with anything less interesting? I swear they didn't make it someone from longer ago because it would have cost more money to create the complete look of a period that is set back further. So much word about his love for Nora being more believable and she came out of nowhere as well but the Godric connection worked for me. I wonder if this is the last we'll be hearing of Sylvie? What's the point in us learning about this past relationship of Eric's? Is it simply to give him and Pam more depth? I was already convinced of their love and loyalty to each other.

Just so I'm clear, the people in this episode who were after Sarah are there because she killed that woman in the vamp camp, right? So Sarah has two groups looking for her, the vampires and the people from the corporation. Considering how many people are looking for her, why she wouldn't want to be lower profile is beyond me but then I guess she wouldn't be Sarah Newlin. I'm wondering if Sookie's blood is going to factor in at all to making a cure for the virus. I did enjoy the scenes with Lafayette and James. My only problem is that I don't really see this guy as the James who is with Jessica. The casting change really didn't do this story any favors IMO.

I so wanted Maxine Fortenberry's heart to be pitch black. On a show like this they could have made that happen. Hate watching is exactly the way to describe slogging through this mess. Sookie just continues to suck and be stupid and I'm inclined to agree that she helped kill Alcide. I don't have anything against Alcide and I'll certainly miss looking at his body but I was completely underwhelmed with his death just as I was with Tara's . I can't put my finger on why these deaths are having no effect on me whatsoever because I'm pretty sure I would have been bummed and sad if these characters were killed a couple of seasons ago.. I don't even hate Bill and Sookie together but they are boring to me and if they're the end game, it's not a dealbreaker for me so much as I'm amazed that they think we should care. The one damn character whose story I was looking forward to seeing this season was Eric's and I'm already disappointed with what they're doing. What is so special about Sylvie and why are we just now hearing about her? Eric came off almost foolish and immature in those scenes. He puts them in a deadly situation because he doesn't want to fuck indoors? This show is really too ridiculous. A couple of small moments I liked: I did LOL upon getting the info that Lettie Mae's booze of choice is apparently Captain Morgan. Loved Pam and Nan in their 80s ensembles and liked the moment where they contemplate how they might have been friends. Best moment--Eric wanting to hang on long enough to deal with the injustice of Sarah Fucking Newlin still being alive. The only thing that bothered me about that scene is that Pam made it seem like Jason let Sarah live as some kind of betrayal and I didn't see it that way and I say this as someone who is totallyfine with her character being taken out by whichever vamp gets to her first.

Another curious detail about Cersei's thought process when she's wondering how she might get Margaery out of the picture--she notes IIRC that Loras and Margaery look even more alike than she and Jaime do and she finds this to be irritating for some reason. It's funny, it's like she wants to think that they're infected with the same sort of narcissism that she and Jaime have, that it's somehow normal for look alike siblings to want to fuck each other--but then at the same time she clearly resents the idea of the Tyrell siblings being as close or even closer than she and Jaime are and would be happy to see them punished for it even though it's the same sort of behavior that she finds to be acceptable from herself. I agree too that her internal thoughts here are indications of her growing madness and instability. That being said, Taena also helped feed Cersei's delusions about various things including certain behavior from the Tyrells.

I have to agree with those who feel the show never really quite recovered after Jimmy's death. It could have, it wasn't impossible by any means, but for me personally, I feel that seasons 1 and 2 of this show were the best by far. Season 3 worked for me at various points but it ultimately felt like there were a lot of missed opportunities to say nothing about perplexing character scenes and motivation. I still don't understand why we had to watch Margaret and that doctor, I don't think Emily getting polio added anything to the story, indeed we hardly see her and spend more time with Teddy; Emily's polio in retrospect seems like a cheap way to gain instant sympathy for Margaret and her choices. They also didn't really need to make her give that land away. Gyp Rosetti simply did not work I don't care if they gave that guy an Emmy. Agreed that he was an over the top cartoon of a character who sometimes made it a chore for me to keep my eyes and ears open. He was a pointless horror show and I am not uptight when it comes to violence. (Never had an issue with the Sopranos on that score.) Gillian's brothel storyline could have been a lot more interesting too but it was mainly used to fulfill HBO's T&A quota rather than to tell interesting stories. Deadwood was a great example of a show that knew how to use brothel life to give great insight into its characters even characters like Alma who who didn't necessarily frequent those sorts of places. Chalky IMO was the strongest part about the fourth season but I even find, myself feeling disappointed with choices they sometimes make for his character. The failed hit on Narcisse in particular was hard to swallow because Chalky is smarter than that from what we've seen. I also think they understand the strength of scenes with Chalky and his family but then they only give us a few of them, meanwhile we have to put up with things like Gillian going through heroin withdrawal, Eli's son adjusting to life at college, Nucky slapping around some woman in Florida and him getting slapped in return or vice versa, Margaret feeling guilty about something, too much of Billie Kent, etc. The other problem to me is that the show has lost its best fictional characters. Jimmy, Owen, Richard, and Angela were all tough losses that the show couldn't quite fill IMO. The best of the remaining fictional characters are the Van Aldens, Chalky, and Gillian, and Gillian is so far outside of the story at this point it's hard to iimagine how they'll go about reintroducing her if they plan on doing so. Nucky is technically a fictional character but I'll be surprised if his end isn't all that similar to the real life Enoch Johnson. We more or less know what will happen with characters like Capone, Luciano, Rothstein, Lansky, and Masseria so that's another reason I think it's important to keep the fictional characters as compelling as the the historical ones since that's often where we end up getting the surprises.

Oh wow, what sort of person am I that I kind of laughed when the actor delivered Oberyn's Inigo Montoya line? I don't know what to think about his comments about how he's Dorne. What about his father and elder sister? He mentions that Oberyn isn't the only Prince of Dorne and it's like Trystane is some next door neighbor Quentyn has forgotten about. I really hope they don't give him any facial hair. I think his youth should be emphasized. I am keeping my fingers crossed that they're auditioning for Euron. So curious as to what that audition scene would be and what all would be included.

I get the argument that TB was always kind of bad and was basically always a guilty pleasure, but at some point in each season I have a moment where I'm like, "and that's why I still put up with and occasionally even love ahis show." Stuff like "I love you...Jason Stackhouse." I can't quit this show even when it gives me an episode like this one. I enjoyed the Eric and Jason scene and agree that it was the best part of the episode but isn't that a sad commentary even for this show. That being said I also don't think there's anything wrong with fans getting that sort of pointless pay off since this show is really just really just trying to be entertaining and campy at the end of the day. I concur though that the last two episodes were terribly boring and I feel like the show is limping through this last season. I only really care what happens to Eric, Lafayette, Jessica, and Jason. I like Andy and Adalyn but I don't care that much. The rest I can't say that I really give a damn.

I've never believed in Robert's love for Lyanna. My thoughts on this are similar to Barristan's - -I think Robert wanted Lyanna, I'm sure he even enjoyed her company, but I don't think his love for her had any more depth than some idealized crush that likely would have turned ugly if she spurned his advances or flipside, she returns them and then he goes back to being the sexually incontinent person we all know him to be. Obviously this is my opinion and maybe I'm judging Robert harshly, but I can't think of anything from his behavior that would lead me to believe he would have lived happily ever after as he so insists if he'd only had Lyanna by his side. I fully expect that he would have disrespected Lyanna too only it wouldn't have happened on day one as it did with Cersei. I think Robert remained immature and never experienced a romantic relationship where he had to give. He didn't even really have a relationship with Lyanna. I also firmly believe that that he probably wouldn't have accepted it. Another way I compare Robert and Jaime is how different they are in their desire to be loved. Cersei doesn't have too many insightful quotes in the series, but one quote where she is so absolutely dead on was when she told Sansa, I think, about Robert having I feel like Robert got pleasure out of superficial love and worship. He liked smiles and tourney applause and sycophantic laughter. He wouldn't sacrifice in order to earn someone's love, he expects it to be given and given en masse I might add. IMO Robert valued quantity over quality and I think this is apparent in his attitude towards many things in his life. There's no way I can see Robert remaining silent about Aerys plans to blow up the city. Robert would want everyone to know that he'd saved their asses so that they'd love him for it. The love of a lover and brother wouldn't have been enough for Robert whereas Jaime could deal with being despised as long as he had the love of Cersei and IMO Tyrion. Jaime values quality over quantity in this sense I feel. Robert would never be able to understand how Jaime has been happy to practice sexual loyalty to one person his entire life. He doesn't even understand it of his friend Ned Wylla claims aside for a moment. I even think a man like Robert would be the type to assume that he has had the better sex life all his years as king simply because he has variety and that it would never actually occur to him that some of the best sex can happen between two people who have been sexually devoted to each other long term. Ultimately, Robert enjoyed fighting and wouldn't have only needed the Rhaegar/Lyanna situation to get him to be okay with going to war. I'm not saying that a situation as inflammatory would necessarily have presented itself but that "love" of Lyanna wouldn't have been Robert's primary reason for fighting or continuing to fight. I just think that's what he tells himself to make himself feel all tragic, romantic, and heroic. Gah, with the wonky spoiler tags, my apologies!

Probably true and I can also see Sansa simply ignoring something that she might not have felt had a place in the world she'd created for herself in her head. I do wonder if Sansa had remained at Winterfell for a couple more years if she still wouldn't have picked up on the idea of same sex attraction. I can't imagine for example that there weren't any similar hints given about some gay person or people living somewhere in the North--I mean, are we to believe that there aren't any quietly gay people living in Winterfell or at least in the North? Sansa was the type who would hear gossip and all that while she was with her friends. Eleven is still young but I'm inclined to believe that she could have picked up on this if she'd remained at home for a few more years. I'm thinking now of the conversation Olenna had with Tywin and again, I can't really see that if Sansa had continuing to live at Winterfell for the next couple of years or so that she wouldn't have eventually ended up hearing some type of comment or conversation that would lead her to put two and two together. There are other things about her level of awareness that I would question. For example, it seems like a standard put down in Westerosi society to say that a man is behaving like a woman and if nothing else I feel like Sansa would have some level of understanding of the intolerance that would likely to be shown to anyone who displays any possible signs of SSA. These Northerners who basically think that they are as masculine as it gets--I feel a similar macho vibe from the IB--would Sansa really never have heard a woman or one of her father's bannermen or maybe a servant make some comment about men who are used as women, or men who aren't the marrying kind like her uncle Blackfish? For some reason this makes me think about the conversation Sansa had with Robin in the show when he's asking her why Winterfell doesn't have a moon door and wonders what they do with all of the "bad" people or people they don't like. I found Sansa's response to be a little misleading. She actually says that they don't do anything with the "bad"people at Winterfell. Right afterwards she slightly amends this statement by saying that girls wouldn't have taken part in something like that, but the vibe that she's putting forth is that Winterfell wasn't a place where things like punishment and death sentences are handed out or that Winterfell didn't have it's own prisoners. I find that Winterfell is often idealized and presented as perfection and sometimes I just want to say, yeah, it's beautiful but don't forget about x, y, and z.

Points taken about why Sansa shouldn't have necessarily known that Loras is gay. I feel like book Sansa had a few more hints but I have to remember there's also book Sansa's age to consider and I admit I sometimes forget how young GRRM made the character. It's still odd to me that GRRM wouldn't have thought it preferable to make the kids older--even if we'd had the five year gap, would it have been so terrible to read about an 18 year old Sansa in ADoS if he'd started her out as 13 in AGoT? I understand having Joffrey be younger in the books but I also like that the Lannister kids are older on the show and definitely think it makes Myrcella's story more interesting in particular since it seems she won't just be some sweet, innocent girl but might actually be given a personality and opinions. I look forward to more of Tommen with Margaery too and I'm not sure I'd necessarily feel that way if they'd kept him as an eight year old.

I understand why Jaime felt he had to do that list of terrible things. I agree with Hecate7 but also want to say that in addition to Hecate's points about the taunting of Catelyn--I feel like a person would practically have to be made of stone or be frightened beyond measure to not want to call attention to that sort of hypocrisy under those circumstances. Ned gave him shit for his disloyalty and here Jaime is pointing out an area where he at least feels he's shown more honor than judgemental Ned. Catelyn is so self righteous at times that it didn't really bother me *that*much when it was thrown in her face. I was more shocked that he had the nerve than anything else. Jaime gets points with me for attempting to make things right in his life even though that road opens up all sorts of sacrifice, difficulty, and danger. He has a lot on his plate right now but he's trying to address all of the big stuff. Robert OTOH just gave up and basically coasted until he fell off a cliff. I like that Jaime doesn't think it's too late to attempt to be some sort of father to the two remaining kids. Robert doesn't seem like he ever tried with Tommen and Myrcella and he doesn't have the excuse that they're little monsters like Joffrey. I've also never got the impression that Joffrey turned out the way he did simply because of Cersei. Obviously Cersei contributed to Joffrey becoming a little asshole, but I honestly think it was a combination of two bad parents, unlimited privilege, and a sick nature at heart that would have presented itself on some level if even the Starks had been his parents. IMO the main difference would have been that Joffrey Stark would have taken more trouble to hide his sadistic nature to those powerful enough to keep him in check. Myrcella spent a lot of time with her mother and she turned out fine. Meanwhile we have Joffrey committing one of his worst acts because I feel that Robert putting Joffrey on ignore in addition to being a bad example of a human being was just as damaging as his awful human being of a mother allowing him to get away with so much terrible behavior. It's interesting to compare Jaime with Robert. Robert would never have been in a position where he'd have to kill in order to stay alive keep an affair he was having a secret. It just wouldn't have happened. It also might be unfair to say so but I don't think Robert ever experienced a love as deep as the one Jaime has had for Cersei. I don't think Robert has ever really been in a position where he's willingly sacrificed or put himself out for the love of another person. I have no problem believing that Robert could shut his eyes and push some kid out of a window if it suited his purpose, I just don't think he could ever have been in a position like that. When all is said and done if Robert could have simply pushed a button to snuff out the young lives of Viserys and Dany, I don't think he would have hesitated. Actually, I'm imagining if Robert had somehow come upon Viserys in the flesh with Viserys at the age at Bran was at his accident and I think I feel like he'd order somebody else to kill him. Jaime IMO though is more like Ned in terms of going to do it himself even when he has reservations.

Now that I've read a couple of articles I guess we won't be getting AR unless it's in a flashback. Ugh, that's a bummer. That was the one thing that had me looking forward to Margaret's storyline this year. Neurochick, the way you feel about having Gillian remain but not Richard is how I feel about having Margaret remain but not Rothstein, only my irritation at having Margaret remain has to do with the fact that I've found her to be mostly boring as opposed to being a horrible person. AR might be horrible but he certainly made for compelling television so I'm definitely going to miss his presence. According to a Time article, it also seems like the three big stories will probably involve Capone and (presumably) Van Alden, Masseria and Luciano, and Chalky, with Nucky being a presence in all of those stories in some way. I can't really see how Gillian would fit in at all anyway. Lucky wouldn't want to be bothered. Obviously Nucky was done with her years ago. She was sort of acquainted with Capone but again, why would any of these guys bother? I have to imagine that heroin will continue to be a plotline as well especially since someone like Nucky will definitely see the writing on the wall regarding Prohibition.

It's harder to make a good line up if the organizer in question is Cersei Lannister during AFFC and the two most competent people she approaches to be Hand turn her down. She basically only has Tyrell and Lannister men and bannermen to choose from but it doesn't seem like there are too many good combinations and all the best ones are Tyrell heavy. Hand = Randyll Tarly (The war isn't ending any time soon so that's why I'd choose a hard ass like him over the more likeable Mathis Rowan.) Laws = Daven Lannister Ships = Paxter Redwyne Coin = Littlefinger (command him to return) Grand Maester = Marwyn (I reason that Qyburn could have told her about him.) Whisperers = Qyburn LCKG = Jaime No matter what the scenario I find Whisperers and Coin to easily be the most difficult posts to fill.

Just to be clear, I wasn't equating cousin marriages to sibling or potential aunt/nephew or uncle/niece unions, I was just saying that the Great Houses and a couple of others have looked into their own families for suitable matches before so it might not be all that difficult for people to swallow since there are many people who are going to see having the Targaryen blood as making all the difference. Paxter Redwyne is another character who is married to a cousin. I too thought about the conversation where Victarion thought Asha would suggest a marriage with him. I didn't get the impression that either thought it was the most farfetched thing just something neither was really interested in especially since both felt there to be alternatives. I wonder how Oberyn would have felt if he'd known that his rebellious niece was secretly attracted to him. IIRC Arianne was disturbed by whatever thoughts she entertained about Oberyn. Tyrion for his part barely seemed to blink at the idea of Aegon and Dany eventually being together. Alys Karstark ran to the Wall so that she wouldn't be forced to marry her uncle. Sure, she didn't want to marry him but the idea was still put on the table in the first place, so that makes me think these types of unions aren't crazy out of the ordinary it just depends on the circumstances. I just don't think Jon/Dany would be off of the table for most people and for Jon specifically I don't see him freaking out as they have no familial bond to speak of unlike with say, Arya which truly would be a squicky pairing IMO.

Original Cyn, OMG those recaps are hysterical! I feel like sending you a case of something right now because I don't think I've ever laughed so much over a recap of anything. It's been a little over 20 years since I read the books myself. I was around ten or eleven I think when I plowed through the first three family sagas and so while I have vague recollections of the stories, it's insane how laughably terrible it is when I read the recaps. I totally ate those stories up when I was a kid too. I hope Lifetime does the Casteel series. I'd rather see that than My Sweet Audrina. She probably wouldn't do it but I could so see Sharon Stone as Jillian Tatterton.

Oh man, I am going to be pissed if we're cheated out of Rothstein's death. I too would like to see Gillian get revenge only I want her to find a way to go after Nucky somehow. He orchestrated her rape and killed her only child. I'll never feel sympathy for Nucky when it comes to Gillian.

Apart from devout followers of the Faith I doubt that many people really cared about the Targaryen incestuous marriages. Cousin marriage seems to be all over the place too at least I can think of examples from the Targaryens, Lannisters, Arryns, and Starks. As far as skipping the incest every generation or so I never really got the impression that any of the non-Targ marriages happened for the specific reason of introducing some new blood into the mix. They're convinced that their super special blood is all that and then some it's hard for me to imagine a conversation where they're admitting that it would be better long term for their House if they widen the gene pool. I also feel like in this world incest doesn't appear to have the same biological drawbacks that it has in our world. Sure, the Targaryens have madness and there was that one dude who was like a conjoined twin or something and still had the head attached to his body somehow? Something crazy, I can't recall, I'm wondering if this is something mentioned in a Dunk and Egg novella (I haven't read those yet) and I just came upon it via one of the wiki pages. Apart from that though the Targaryens are generally healthy and good looking. Even the Lannister incest produced three physically healthy, attractive kids. The group over at Craster's are also seemingly healthy, they're just abused, beaten down women in a monstous situation but I don't recall reading about a bunch of them having physical deficiencies because of being so inbred I do though recall either Jon or Sam thinking that all of the women basically looked like Craster which was a little disconcerting.

That's actually a good point. Brienne isn't stupid and she would have been around Renly and Loras more than the average person, so that suggests to me that they at least attempted to be discreet. Now that I think about it I'm pretty sure that Cersei has some internal thought about Loras's sexuality in AFFC so it seems the Lannisters had some idea. Show Tyrion certainly knows but I can't recall if book Tyrion ever thinks or talks about it. Garlan is another character who makes a vague reference to knowing. Sansa was just as blind with Loras as Brienne was with Renly.

Stannis knows. I can't recall the exact quote but it was typical Stannis humor. Renly says something about how Margaery came to him a maiden and Stannis retorts that she's likely to die a maiden in Renly's bed.

I DVR'd the episodes of season 3 that they reaired on HBO and was reminded that this was easily my favorite season of the show. It was really exciting and I felt like everything really came together or hit the fan. We got a lot of pay off in that season, so you new viewers who are just getting into the show have a lot to look forward to. Season 4...it's true that it's a letdown and particularly absurd in terms of plotlines, but the performances were still top notch and I still felt there were compelling scenes in every episode. As far as the first season, one of the things that I liked was the that we had another polygamist family living in the suburbs to compare with the Henricksons and we didn't really have that after the first season. Margene to me was very likeable in the first season. Nicki was awful then IIRC. I think I disliked/hated Nicki most during seasons 1 and 5. In season 3 she was easily my favorite. Barb breaks my heart in every season but there was something particularly heart wrenching about the conversation she has with Bill when she says to him "I feel robbed. Like they've stolen you from me." Sad. ETA They met Margene because she started working at Home Plus. Bill was attracted to her and she says she wasn't good at her Home Plus job (people were always yelling at her apparently) so Bill brought her home to be the babysitter. This is slightly retconned in the fifth season but it's still basically the gist. Nicki grew up on the compound so Lois has always known her. Plus Nicki mentions something about remembering how Bill had a "light" about him when she was a little girl, so she seems to have known him or at least known of him well before she came to the Henricksons to nurse Barb.