S04.E07: Gods of War

[Lisin]

Quote

Veronica debates coming clean to NIcole. Veronica's fidelity is tested. Veronica and Keith discover they aren't the only ones who believe they've found the bomber. A surprising potential client tries to hire Mars Investigations

[AudienceofOne]

God I spent this whole episode going, "Veronica, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it".

I found it interesting that during the whole sex dream sequence, it wasn't Logan she dreamed found her out but Wallace.

Getting engaged because she got through the temptation and nearly died seems a really bad idea. This season has done quite a good job of convincing me these two have some issues they need to resolve before having a successful relationship - right before they get engaged. Not the least of which is her not actually wanting to get married at all. 

Edited July 21, 2019 by AudienceofOne

[Miles]

"The beauty of being friends with me is that wwhatever you've done, I've done something worse."

Except making sure that somebody with a strong motive and opportunity didn't commit a bunch of murders, apperently. That went too far!

Girl what's the worst thing you've done, really? Stole a pack of gum?

I get that this is a massive breach of trust. But is it worse than cheating on somebody, for example, something you seemed to be fine with. I don't think so. She didn't even bug your flat or your bedroom, she just bugged your office. Seems to me like you are fine with your friends betraying somebody, unless you are the victim of said (minor) betrayel, then it's unforgivable. That's called being a hypocrite.

[bettername2come]

17 hours ago, AudienceofOne said:

I found it interesting that during the whole sex dream sequence, it wasn't Logan she dreamed found her out but Wallace.

Because he's her moral center!

God, that scene was hot. I'm sitting here loving it and yelling, "Don't do it! Please be a dream." And also, damn, Kristen, looking good.

Logan and Veronica getting engaged probably means he's gonna die, doesn't it.

Weevil, you beautiful, heroic, protective man. The minute the friend is in danger, he forgets the fight and runs to the rescue. 

Love the episode title. Because Mars is the god of war. Because this show loves is Roman/planetary themes.

[festivus]

Not usually a big fan of sex scenes because they never look realistic but look somehow awkward anyway but damn Veronica and Leo. That shit was on fire.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Dodie and Alonzo's conversations continue to crack me up. But they ceased to amuse me when they started shooting at Veronica and Keith. 

Yay, finally some Wallace/Veronica time! I know he's married with a kid and a full time job so he doesn't have time to go running around solving cases with Veronica anymore. It was just so great to see them together again for more than a few seconds.

I am so glad that Veronica didn't actually hook up with Leo and cheat on Logan, but DAMN that was hot!

Awwww, Weevil to Veronica's rescue once again. I knew that once he knew she was in danger, he would put their feud on hold - and he even brought the cavalry with him. Of course, my question was how the hell he knew that she was up at Carol's cabin. Heh, maybe he put a tracker on her car too!

I had no issue with Clyde turning over that recording to Alonzo and Dodie. He's been playing Big Dick's errand boy with the expectation that Dick would actually follow through and be a man of his word and of course Dick screwed him over the first chance he had. Even though Dick didn't intend to kill anyone with the Sea Sprite bomb, he had no remorse about the four people who died.

Edited July 22, 2019 by ElectricBoogaloo
Typos - cheap is not the same as cheat!

[joanne3482]

13 hours ago, bettername2come said:

Weevil, you beautiful, heroic, protective man. The minute the friend is in danger, he forgets the fight and runs to the rescue. 

I don't know if there's going to be a Season 5.  I hope not in some ways.  But I really hope him threatening the cartel's hitmen isn't going to bite him in the butt in the future. 

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Awwww, Weevil to Veronica's rescue once again. I knew that once he knew she was in danger, he put their feud on hold and brought the cavalry with him. Of course, my question was how the hell he knew that she was up at Carol's cabin. Heh, maybe he put a tracker on her car too!

Well, he knew Dodie and Alonzo were going to go after her, maybe he followed Dodie and Alonzo but couldn't roll up until the rest of his boys showed up? 

That was some scene, the shootout with Dodie and Alonzo and Keith's hands shaking loading the gun. This show isn't above killing off beloved characters like Keith. 

[CerealKiller813]

Keith’s voice breaking made me tear up. Just let him eat his fried pie in peace! 🥺🥺🥺🥺

Of course Weevil came to help Veronica. I’m not even gonna break my brain trying to figure about how he knew where she was. I’m just thankful he was there cause it wasn’t looking too good for the Mars clan. 

I’m too scared to watch episode 8...but I will. Just let me get my security blanket. Lol I feel the tears coming. 

Edited July 22, 2019 by CerealKiller813

[Jediknight]

16 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I had no issue with Clyde turning over that recording to Alonzo and Dodie. He's been playing Big Dick's errand boy with the expectation that Dick would actually follow through and be a man of his word and of course Dick screwed him over the first chance he had. Even though Dick didn't intend to kill anyone with the Sea Sprite bomb, he had no remorse about the four people who died.

Yeah, Clyde didn't want anybody to die.  He wanted Big Dick to offer up more money, and get his classic car dealership.  He did seem to genuinely consider Keith to be a friend.  If he didn't consider Keith a friend, and wanted people dead, he would have done something to Keith.

[tennisgurl]

Awww Weevil, you marshmellow. I knew he wouldn't actually let Veronica and Keith die, even if he and Veronica arent in a good place now. And with a whole parades worth of bikers to boot! I especially loved him trying to low key weedle answers out of Clyde, subtlety is very much not his strong suite. 

I was just as relived as Veronica that the Veronica/Leo hook up was just a dream! It WAS pretty hot though, not gonna lie. Wallace showing up  in her dream with a stern look on his face was perfect, I think he would be even more disappointed in her than Logan would be. I am glad that she realized how important Logan was to her before she messed things up, but they have a TON more work to do, as a couple and as individual people, to go, especially if they want to get married or even have kids. Well, non fur kids 😉 

I am actually kind of sad that the Keith and Clyde bromance has to end. Yeah Clyde is sketchy, but they did seem to get along really well, and I do think that Clyde really did like Keith and consider him a friend, certainly more than Big Dick.  And Clyde was the one who actually seemed upset that people died in the bombing, while Big Dick was just like "meh, whatever". 

Oh that break when Keith was at the station and realized that his memory problems almost got Veronica killed, and that it was time to give up! Oh my heart!

Cliff is, as always, the best. "The world stopped making sense after Prince died."

[Mockingbird]

Weevil showing up made me cry all the happy tears. Then Keith broke my heart. This episode felt a lot like my favorite Veronica Mars episodes. 

[Affogato]

On 7/23/2019 at 12:55 AM, Jediknight said:

Yeah, Clyde didn't want anybody to die.  He wanted Big Dick to offer up more money, and get his classic car dealership.  He did seem to genuinely consider Keith to be a friend.  If he didn't consider Keith a friend, and wanted people dead, he would have done something to Keith.

Yes I thought Keith should have stayed friends. A gray area perhaps?

[CerealKiller813]

3 hours ago, Affogato said:

Yes I thought Keith should have stayed friends. A gray area perhaps?

That actually could work because we know that Mars clan doesn’t do gray unless it pertains to themselves. Everyone else be damned to the Land of NO Morals. Lol

[Melina22]

On 7/22/2019 at 9:07 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Heh, maybe he put a tracker on her car too!

Everyone's homes and cars must be bristling with bugs and trackers! 😁

I I love this show so much! How do they cram so much into one episode. One minute I'm laughing, then I'm tearing up at Veronica and Keith, then I'm muting the tv because it helps me deal with the unbearable tension. Awesome. 

Just one negative thing. I don't like Matty at all. I find her rude and charmless. I know she's supposed to be mini-Veronica but she sure doesn't have her charisma or humour. 

I loved Weevil saying to his friend, "That's just you calling me fat!" I love him saving Veronica even after she called him a lowlife loser. I want to see her apologize to him. Well, thank him at least. 

Edited July 25, 2019 by Melina22

[Melina22]

On 7/22/2019 at 12:51 PM, CerealKiller813 said:

I'm too scared to watch episode 8...but I will. Just let me get my security blanket. Lol I feel the tears coming. 

I'm with you. I don't want to watch because 

1. I don't want it to be over! 

2. I don't want anyone I care about to die! 

But of course I'll watch anyway. 

[moonshine71]

On 7/24/2019 at 1:17 PM, Affogato said:

Yes I thought Keith should have stayed friends. A gray area perhaps?

He's paying kids to mug people at knifepoint(and this is an area where I side strongly w/ Veronica over Weavel). That is a violent crime. One that could EASILY turn deadly. Mug a few drunk college students at knifepoint, eventually that is going to go HORRIBLY bad. It's a shock no one had been injured or killed yet, as far as we know.

[moonshine71]

I haven't seen anyone else comment on this yet, but am I the only one that found Leo inviting himself over to watch The Big Lewbowski incredibly pushy and borderline creepy? I just rewatched that scene, Veronica was immediately non-responsive to the idea(and her facial expressions definitely showed it) and he kept pushing it.

I like Leo, but maybe I'm still colored by the initial creepiness of a sheriff's deputy going to a high school dance w/ a 17 yr old junior, I've never really shaken that off.

Edited July 28, 2019 by moonshine71

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, moonshine71 said:

He's paying kids to mug people at knifepoint(and this is an area where I side strongly w/ Veronica over Weavel). That is a violent crime. One that could EASILY turn deadly. Mug a few drunk college students at knifepoint, eventually that is going to go HORRIBLY bad. It's a shock no one had been injured or killed yet, as far as we know.

Even so. Redemption?

[moonshine71]

19 minutes ago, Affogato said:

Even so. Redemption?

Someday, sure. But he hasn't earned that yet. As we see, he ends up profiting off of his behavior.

[Affogato]

1 hour ago, moonshine71 said:

Someday, sure. But he hasn't earned that yet. As we see, he ends up profiting off of his behavior.

Well he’s a good contact. Favor exchange. 

[marshmallows]

On 7/28/2019 at 10:34 AM, moonshine71 said:

I haven't seen anyone else comment on this yet, but am I the only one that found Leo inviting himself over to watch The Big Lewbowski incredibly pushy and borderline creepy? I just rewatched that scene, Veronica was immediately non-responsive to the idea(and her facial expressions definitely showed it) and he kept pushing it.

I like Leo, but maybe I'm still colored by the initial creepiness of a sheriff's deputy going to a high school dance w/ a 17 yr old junior, I've never really shaken that off.

YES! This entire scene made me cringe.

Honestly, every time Leo was on screen this season made me cringe. He was very disrespectful of the fact that Veronica was clearly in a relationship with someone else. 

Back on the original show, I was actually okay with Veronica/Leo. I was even into the pairing and felt so bad for Leo when Veronica broke up with him for Logan. I mean I was team LoVe, but Leo was a good guy and had chemistry with Veronica. But in the revival he just seemed skeevy.

[possibilities]

I think that at first he genuinely did not think she was attracted to him, and hanging out with her was as innocent on her end as having Wallace as a best friend. I think she thought that, too.

But then near the end, I think they both realized there was something else going on, and neither one of them really did an exemplary job of quashing it.

I also think the ONLY reason whe was interested was because she was trying to blow up her relationship with Logan. All season she was avoiding going deeper in her intimacy with him, so having an affair would have been the prefect way to hurt him, cause him to be angry and "psychotic jackassish" again, and put some distance between herself and marriage.

Edited July 30, 2019 by possibilities

[Clanstarling]

On 7/21/2019 at 12:40 PM, Miles said:

"The beauty of being friends with me is that wwhatever you've done, I've done something worse."

Except making sure that somebody with a strong motive and opportunity didn't commit a bunch of murders, apperently. That went too far!

Girl what's the worst thing you've done, really? Stole a pack of gum?

I get that this is a massive breach of trust. But is it worse than cheating on somebody, for example, something you seemed to be fine with. I don't think so. She didn't even bug your flat or your bedroom, she just bugged your office. Seems to me like you are fine with your friends betraying somebody, unless you are the victim of said (minor) betrayel, then it's unforgivable. That's called being a hypocrite.

Minor betrayal? It would be a massive betrayal to me. A friendship ending betrayal, absolutely, no matter the excuse. Mileage varies.

Since she uses her office as a "bedroom" on occasion (Veronica listening to her get it on), there's no "just" to it, for me, anyway.

There's nothing hypocritical, in my opinion, about ending a friendship under those circumstances. There is a difference between not judging a friend's actions, and having the friend suspect you of a horrible crime and bugging you, all the while pretending to be your friend. Which, once V suspected her to the point of bugging her office, she wasn't a friend anymore. No matter what she told herself - she was simply acting like one. Veronica was conflicted, sure. But she crossed a huge line, and couldn't expect her friend/suspect to shrug and say "no biggie."

I love Veronica, but she's a mess and the architect of her own problems.

[Miles]

8 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Since she uses her office as a "bedroom" on occasion (Veronica listening to her get it on), there's no "just" to it, for me, anyway.

How was Veronica to know that she fucked in her office. Generally, you work in an office.

7 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

There's nothing hypocritical, in my opinion, about ending a friendship under those circumstances.

Sure if you are your avarage person, there is nothing hypocritical about ending a friendship in those circumstances. If you just bragged about how many bad things you've done, how you are totally cool with cheating on somebody and how you won't judge basically anything, you don't have a leg, arm or torso to stand on.

8 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Which, once V suspected her to the point of bugging her office, she wasn't a friend anymore. No matter what she told herself - she was simply acting like one. Veronica was conflicted, sure. But she crossed a huge line, and couldn't expect her friend/suspect to shrug and say "no biggie." 

So you can't suspect your friends of having done something bad and try to make sure they didn't? Once you suspect them of anything, freindship over?

I think a person like that would be pretty shitty and a bad friend. You just end a friendship over rumors or suspicion and then go on living convincing yourself your friend was the bad guy?

You can argue about how Veronica went about making sure her friend wasn't a murderer, But blaming her for wanting to make sure is pretty shitty.

[Clanstarling]

46 minutes ago, Miles said:

So you can't suspect your friends of having done something bad and try to make sure they didn't? Once you suspect them of anything, freindship over?

I think a person like that would be pretty shitty and a bad friend. You just end a friendship over rumors or suspicion and then go on living convincing yourself your friend was the bad guy?

You can argue about how Veronica went about making sure her friend wasn't a murderer, But blaming her for wanting to make sure is pretty shitty.

No, once you spy on them by planting bugs, the friendship is over. Your mileage may vary.

[Affogato]

On 9/6/2019 at 7:56 PM, Clanstarling said:

No, once you spy on them by planting bugs, the friendship is over. Your mileage may vary.

The only tool Veronica and Keith are given are bugs, disguises that are pretty threadbare if you are a known quantity in a fairly small beach town, and a high school kid or similar who can illegally crack computer systems.  She needed to be a cop or fbi or something and learn skills and get contacts. You know like Logan? She really is back at the time she left hearst  

Not oddly this is brought up in the first bit where Veronica is exposing th ex boyfriend’s bugs. And is one cery good reason why Veronica, who has been doing this stuff to the ‘09ers for years, will never happily set up a household next to Wallace and fit in with his new friends. Because she has bugged half of them and been hired by the rest.

so I think it is a theme.  Sadly the cure, going where no one at all knows you, isn’t the greatest

Edited September 8, 2019 by Affogato

[Tachi Rocinante]

• 7 episodes and 3 fairly explicit sex scenes = lazy writing.
• Since Leo hasn't seen The Big Lebowski, he didn't understand the White Russian reference in the movie. Her comment came across as a ham-handed invite to someone without that knowledge. (That being said, The Big Lebowski is one of the most overrated pieces of crap I've ever had to sit through.)
• Big Dick admonishing Clyde's dumb idea for a business is the smartest thing he has said all season, even if he did break his promise.
• I hope the bomber doesn't turn out to be Penn's girlfriend because she's the sister of the frat boy that died or some other lame character like that.
• Maddie's Mom is a real piece of work.