SEAL Team - General Discussion

[Raja]

On 10/3/2019 at 5:50 PM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

It's insane that the Navy did not break up the team.   The show did hint at a stand down/evaluation period.  No way would Blackburn have retained command.  You may have noticed the many reports of out-of-control SEAL Teams in the news?  Jason?  He'd be lucky to still wear the uniform and retain his rank, let alone be brought back.  Moving heaven and earth to make a brand-spanking new Ensign an intel officer with her old team?  Never in a million years.  Mandy was done as done can be.

But, this is the land of TV.  All ye about to enter give up all hopes of reality.  😉  

Especially with an insubordinate Master Chief around who fails to understand that she ain't "Davis" anymore. She is Ensign Davis, and she outranks you.

[dwmarch]

Another decent outing although I see some characters are back on their bullshit again. Jason and Ray, that means you and honorable mention to Sonny as well. And Davis, when Mandy said build barriers she didn't mean in just one place. You'd be messed up if you lost one of the other guys, not just Sonny.

I think they might have addressed this by hinting or saying that Jason got into Special Forces early in his career (although I am pretty sure one cannot just straight up join the Navy SEALs, I think you have to go through the regular Navy first) but yeah, Jason is mad old to be a SEAL. If he has dodged bullets up to this point he picked a weird time to get all panicked about his mortality. They hung a lampshade on it well enough having him remember a teammate who was killed the same way he almost was. But at the end he re-enlists for two more years. So... did he get over it?

Also delete those numbers from your phone you morbid bastard!

What the show could do that would be realistic enough is to have him move (with Mandy) to CIA's Special Activities Division. That would keep him in the action and actually be much more reflective of his age.

The plot with Ray being nominated for a Master Chief position was a little out in left field. Wasn't his last big interaction with the military the time he confessed to lying about his injury which resulted in him tossing a grenade that killed a civilian kid? Or was it when the military was coming down on the whole team for various bullshit and he was off playing around on his wife? Real Master Chief material right there.

I worry about the background players when they start getting lines. There was one grizzled old soldier in the background who spoke for what I think was the first time and I was sure he was going to get killed in one of the raids.

Everyone has a cell phone so if Jason wants to sleep better I think he should take that super loud clock off the wall and maybe take the batteries out of it! I'm surprised he didn't shoot the damn thing. No wonder he thinks the footsteps of death are after him.

[Raja]

5 hours ago, dwmarch said:

I think they might have addressed this by hinting or saying that Jason got into Special Forces early in his career (although I am pretty sure one cannot just straight up join the Navy SEALs, I think you have to go through the regular Navy first) but yeah, Jason is mad old to be a SEAL. If he has dodged bullets up to this point he picked a weird time to get all panicked about his mortality. They hung a lampshade on it well enough having him remember a teammate who was killed the same way he almost was. But at the end he re-enlists for two more years. So... did he get over it?

.

Actually like the Army Rangers you can enlist with the intention of going directly to the SEALs. That is where Petty Officer Spenser came from  when he was in the selection phase to join the Development Group (DEVGRU), what used to be  SEAL Team 6.  Just like Army Special Forces and the Delta Force have a prior enlistment so there are no Lieutenants or Privates in those units. 

If I remember correctly on The Unit Sergeant First Class Brown was among the few who did not come from the Army Rangers to become Special Forces but came from the US Cavalry since Delta has its own independent selection process from the regular Special Forces I don't think you can go to DEVGRU without finishing BUDS. or regular SEAL qualification course first.

Going to the end and the empty house and his kids not calling back Jason's seems to think his only family is the team he leads. Although you would think that the boss Lt Commander Blackburn should be about due for a new job.

[FakeItTil]

7 hours ago, dwmarch said:

The plot with Ray being nominated for a Master Chief position was a little out in left field. Wasn't his last big interaction with the military the time he confessed to lying about his injury which resulted in him tossing a grenade that killed a civilian kid? Or was it when the military was coming down on the whole team for various bullshit and he was off playing around on his wife? Real Master Chief material right there.

Yeah, but they really didn't care about the innocent child Ray killed or him lying about his health. Jason was the only one who was shown to be pissed about the shoulder and the kid after it happened, in a rare reasonable thing from him. Then Alana died and he didn't care anymore. At least that one general was coming down on them last season and it wasn't bs on his part. 

I have a hard time believing anyone in that group would be getting a promotion considering their constant drama. It's not like they fly under the radar with it and it involves clashing with people higher up the food chain often enough. If they're too super special to be broken up, everyone still knows they're a mess even if they only know about half of it. I can barely accept that Jason is still left to his own devices, never mind his equally bad bff getting a promotion and his own team. It's just manufactured drama that doesn't make the most sense and ends with Ray staying or returning to his Bravo 2 spot.

[mojoween]

I hope this mission made Jason all better because the constant ticking clock sound was driving ME insane.

Bummer they are back in the US because that means Emma and her drama might show up.

Sonny and Davis still do not work as a couple at all so hopefully they realize it’s too difficult and part as friends and coworkers.

[b4pjoe]

On 7/9/2019 at 10:03 PM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

My understanding is that the VA is enjoined from providing care for non service-related issues.  I could be verrrrry wrong about that.  So, yes, Swanny had to go elsewhere for any possible care.  

Yeah that is not accurate at all. I use the VA for all of my health care and none of it is service-related.

[nittany cougar]

I have worked as a veterans advocate. The purpose of documenting injuries in service records is to support a claim for service-related compensation.  If a veteran's disabilities are adjudicated as service related, the veteran will get monthly payments from the VA and receive VA medical care for those disabilities at no cost.  

I think Sonny and Davis are playing with fire.  If they cannot refrain from touching each other, they shouldn't stay in the same unit.  They could be charged with violating the UCMJ.

Edited October 11, 2019 by nittanycougar

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Ray back to standing mute when operational integrity is, per Bravo usual, shattering.  Promote him!

I am truly at a complete loss as to how Jason's killing Vadim was a good thing.  The team was in almost no danger.  It would have been incredibly easy to disarm Vadim, or better yet, prevent him from handling the weapon.  Were they not all smacked upside the head time and time again as to the value of these HVTs being taken alive?!  Jason's kill shot was reckless and selfish.

Nice to go against Imperial Storm Troopers on the tarmac.

Didja notice the muzzles when they took out the first two dudes at the palace completely silenced when the shots were taken?  From that moment forward, every shot made noise, despite the same muffling device (silencer) attached to each weapon.  

The Navy went against all known protocol to being back Davis, despite the FACT they knew of the previous emotional attachment/baggage.  Blackburn would not have been warned about this?  Blackburn would then not have gone to Jason and to Ray demanding hyper-awareness and vigilance for such issues to potentially crop up?   On top of them being on triple non-secret probation as it was? 

I was kinda hoping we would get a Twelve O'Clock High ending with Jason in the Gregory Peck role falling asleep for a full day after what was to have been his final mission as Group Commander.  

[Raja]

On 10/11/2019 at 11:04 PM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

I am truly at a complete loss as to how Jason's killing Vadim was a good thing.  The team was in almost no danger.  It would have been incredibly easy to disarm Vadim, or better yet, prevent him from handling the weapon.  Were they not all smacked upside the head time and time again as to the value of these HVTs being taken alive?!  Jason's kill shot was reckless and selfish.

The exact scene happened on Jack Ryan.  It is almost like I respect your honor fellow black ops warrior so I will grant you your wish and keep you out of the CIA's hands.

[dwmarch]

Well, looks like it's one step forward and two steps back for Clay. At least his dad wasn't a dick about it.

I liked the grenade explosion. Most of the time, hand grenades on TV and in movies are filled with gasoline or something and they make a huge fireball. This one was dust and debris which is what I imagine a real hand grenade would actually look like.

I'm not sure if Davis should be beating herself up over the intel fail or not. On the one hand, I feel like that CIA Special Ops guy might be playing them somehow (because that is typically what happens in these kinds of shows when some previously-unseen specialist from the Agency shows up). On the other hand, they mentioned in the briefing that they were kinda sorta right on the Iranian border. It did not occur to anyone that the Iranians might come say hi?

I hope Sonny got his deposit back on the fancy hotel. And I was looking forward to see what his idea of a classy place was! Well, that's SEAL relationships in a nutshell I guess. Plans big and small ruined by constant deployments.

Did I miss a scene with the new Captain? How does he instantly know what Clay is up to? Clay did the end run around the Navy by getting his dad to advocate on his behalf. Did the new Captain read about that and decide "hey, I know how these guys think, he's probably still up to something"? And if he is psychic, when is he going to figure out that Sonny and Davis are getting it on? Or that Jason's head isn't on straight?

[Lonesome Rhodes]

What a refreshing and (mostly) satisfying ep.

The pre-op portion depicted perfectly normal interactions with congruent characters saying rational things and acting out well within known motivations.  The meeting between Clay and the new CO was fantastic.  Lots of nuance and super deep, and unspoken, meaning/consequences.  Lindell is a fascinating addition.  I really do not know if he is to be a villain.  I suspect he is, but he could be a conduit for really sharp insights about the military.

The op seemed to be reasonably staged/depicted.  What I did not understand is why they would have been ex-filled with no other good guys to protect, or even operate, the plant.  The concerns of the original mission still stood.  

Ray is making a mistake, imo.  It's impulsive, which is precisely the type of thinking those with issues of substance abuse often make.  With the two incomes they have, they would find very nice quarters.  Yet, it is very much in character.  Good job, TPTB.

The father/son conversation toward the end was excellent.  No TV contrivances.  It was two decent folks trying to make good decisions where lots of gray existed.  There was/is no obvious ultimate solution.  Clay's decision to give Lindell a chance was wise.  His father's response was unlike so much of what we have seen on this show.  TPTB may yet make him out to be a butthole, but on this night at least, he was a dad.

Finally, I LOVED hearing the comms traffic as the team approached their jump.  Bad. A$$.     

[nittany cougar]

I think that Sonny should tell Davis that Ray had suspicions about their relationship.  She was clearly confused by his odd plan to go 100 miles away for dinner.  Did anyone else think that Sonny and Davis were going to be in a wreck when they showed him driving and looking at her.  Good fake out, show!

I absolutely love Jason and his daughter together.  It was very sweet that she fixed up his place for him.  

Jason looked to be in rough shape when he returned home and found out that his daughter threw some things out.  How long before Jason just loses it?  Every time it seems like he is better, something happens to trigger his symptoms. 

[Lunula]

So... what happened to Jason’s son? I literally don’t remember his name, but he is gone and no one even mentions him? Was he shipped off? Totally confused.

[Kelda Feegle]

Jason's son went off to some hockey highschool place I believe. 

I totally thought Davis and Sonny were going to be in a car accident and have to explain why they were together. 

If Davis is in her off time does she have to still stay close in case she is called back to base for a briefing?  I wasn't a fan of the watch checking and subtle shaming for her being late. If she'd been fine with a hotel 100 miles away then surely it was downtime? 

You know you might be in trouble when you turn on the microwave just so you have some ambient sound Jason. 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

28 minutes ago, Kelda Feegle said:

If Davis is in her off time does she have to still stay close in case she is called back to base for a briefing?  I wasn't a fan of the watch checking and subtle shaming for her being late. If she'd been fine with a hotel 100 miles away then surely it was downtime? 

I may be wrong about this, but I believe she was put on notice that something was brewing and told Sonny that when she explained how in her new role she now got heads-up well before any spin ups/Team alerts.  If this is what happened, she used poor judgment - especially as a newbie, in not making herself readily available for any sudden developments.  This would also play into the guilt she was experiencing after the fact.

[FakeItTil]

We're going to get Ray's financial problems 2.0, aren't we? The guy has a real self destructive streak and it probably just popped up again. He might flame out trying to become an officer, Jason might have a meltdown if he does (which will set Ray off) or he might spiral on his own because he hates it. Of course, it raises the question of why he'd get a promotion or become an officer again, but whatever. It's consistent if nothing else. Naima is an idiot for immediately agreeing, tbh. She should know that Ray is volatile and doesn't make the best decisions. I mean, he's about 6 months or so removed from almost destroying their marriage. A sudden change in his career path and plans to buy an expensive house should sound all the alarms.

I kind of just want the Jason arc to come to a head already. So many people can see he's not right but are brushing it off or doing the bare minimum. Considering Clay is so invested in Swanny, you think he'd at least be taking it seriously. They've been ineffectively nudging at this since day 1 of the show and it can't keep getting magically patched until the next time. There might be some realism in it but I don't think that's been the intent of the show as a slow burn. Someone's mental health needs real treatment on this show. Emma was good in this episode, but in way over her head as always.

Ash's character growth has been both good and surprising... hopefully he doesn't revert back. Clay now has the most interesting "home" life on the show between that relationship, what could happen with the new captain and his TBI awareness crusade. The show's turnover rate on people who aren't main characters means the new captain won't last all that long but I actually want him to be one of the good guys.

Sonny not telling Davis that Ray knows is going to blow up in his face one way or another. 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Nice profile of Boreanz in the Parade magazine supplement today.  He mentioned that he wears an actual helmet given to him by a SEAL, instead of a more lightweight prop.  Nice nod to our warriors, imo.

[mojoween]

Sonny and Davis still just does not work for me.  And if they get caught, she has the most to lose.

Emma may or may not have been making good points to Jason, but I could not pay attention because her outfit looked incredibly out of proportion to her body.  

[Kel Varnsen]

So what is the deal with Ray being a Warrant Officer? Does he have to go to officer training like Davis. I have worked with Warrant Officers in the Canadian Military but it is something different and only the Army and the Airforce have them.

Also I hate the whole thing with Ray acting like he can't leave the team because they won't survive without him. Because anytime a show does this it comes across as super arrogant. As if there is no one else in the entire US Navy who can do what Ray does. And actually more specifically he is kind of saying that if he left, no one on his team would be able to rise to the challenge and take over for him.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

So what is the deal with Ray being a Warrant Officer? Does he have to go to officer training like Davis. I have worked with Warrant Officers in the Canadian Military but it is something different and only the Army and the Airforce have them.

Also I hate the whole thing with Ray acting like he can't leave the team because they won't survive without him. Because anytime a show does this it comes across as super arrogant. As if there is no one else in the entire US Navy who can do what Ray does. And actually more specifically he is kind of saying that if he left, no one on his team would be able to rise to the challenge and take over for him.

With the exception of US Army Aviators who might go from high school to Warrant Officer Candidate and Flight school Warrant Officers in the US forces are promoted from the Non Commisioned Officer ranks. The Sergeants and naval Chief Petty Officers. While an officer because they are so specialized at best they might become the second in command of a special forces team, to the Major/Lieutenant Commander.

But though they outearn the newest commissioned Ensign or 2nd Lieutenant they are outranked by them. And being in a middle ground even though they outrank them they don't receive the respect as the backbone of the force that those who rise to the top of the NCO ranks like the Master Chief.

So some accept a commission, or chance at Officer Candidate School like Ensign Davis. A few accept their Warrant but most remain NCOs.

[Kel Varnsen]

17 hours ago, Raja said:

With the exception of US Army Aviators who might go from high school to Warrant Officer Candidate and Flight school Warrant Officers in the US forces are promoted from the Non Commisioned Officer ranks. The Sergeants and naval Chief Petty Officers. While an officer because they are so specialized at best they might become the second in command of a special forces team, to the Major/Lieutenant Commander.

But though they outearn the newest commissioned Ensign or 2nd Lieutenant they are outranked by them. And being in a middle ground even though they outrank them they don't receive the respect as the backbone of the force that those who rise to the top of the NCO ranks like the Master Chief.

So some accept a commission, or chance at Officer Candidate School like Ensign Davis. A few accept their Warrant but most remain NCOs.

That is interesting, although I found it a bit confusing that WO Ray would outrank Jason but still be considered Bravo 2. How exactly does that work especially in any kind of situation where Jason might be giving orders to his team.

[Raja]

32 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

That is interesting, although I found it a bit confusing that WO Ray would outrank Jason but still be considered Bravo 2. How exactly does that work especially in any kind of situation where Jason might be giving orders to his team.

He would no longer be Bravo 2 but the number 2 to Commander Blackburn or his counterpart on another SEAL team. But more likely an operations or training officer on a Special Warfare HQ staff.

But then they are special force and exact rank doesn't always match position thus Clay's deployment to India as Bravo 2.

Edited October 22, 2019 by Raja

[Kel Varnsen]

On 10/22/2019 at 6:21 PM, Raja said:

He would no longer be Bravo 2 but the number 2 to Commander Blackburn or his counterpart on another SEAL team. But more likely an operations or training officer on a Special Warfare HQ staff.

But then they are special force and exact rank doesn't always match position thus Clay's deployment to India as Bravo 2.

But I thought the whole point of Ray not becoming Master Chief was that being an MC would mean leaving the team. But if a WO would also leave the team it makes no sense. Does the US military ever just appoint senior enlisted people into commissioned officers? Or do they have to go to the school? Because if Davis hadn't become an officer the logical progression for the show and the current plots would be for Jason to get appoint an officer upon his reenlistment and have Ray become MC and Bravo 1.

[Raja]

14 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

But I thought the whole point of Ray not becoming Master Chief was that being an MC would mean leaving the team. But if a WO would also leave the team it makes no sense. Does the US military ever just appoint senior enlisted people into commissioned officers? Or do they have to go to the school? Because if Davis hadn't become an officer the logical progression for the show and the current plots would be for Jason to get appoint an officer upon his reenlistment and have Ray become MC and Bravo 1.

I think team in this case means Team 6 or the DEVGRU, not Bravo specifically. Direct "battlefield commissions" are possible but almost unheard of since the Korean War 

There is also the pay issue officers earn more than NCOs. And with around 20 years of service the Senior Chief becoming either a commissioned or Warrant Officer would greatly outearn most new officers 

[nittany cougar]

I thought Davis was pretty harsh to Sonny.  I felt sorry for him in the last shot when he was driving away.  I think we know where this is going. They will be nasty to each other and then be jealous.  Not sure how I feel about that.

I hated the physiologist.  She was way too much of a know-it-all and really serves no purpose for the team.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Did not like this ep at all - except for some reality fiiiiiinally coming into play with Sosa (Sonny/Lisa).  

The firefight with the barricaded dudes through the hatch window?  They are taking serious rounds and returning the same.  Then, after more of this, they then decide to toss grenades before the breach.  In a million years, why would they choose to keep taking fire like that?

Where the hell was Blackburn when the chokepoints became obvious (inability to breach two hatches)?  There comes a time when Plan B must be looked at.  We were waaaaaay past it.  If I am Lindell, I am questioning them all verrrrrry closely as to how the mission evolved.  I don't trust Jason at all, not Blackburn. for that matter.  The AA (after-action report) would have been a doozy.  That's the Lindell we have seen, right?

Ray's failure to notify Jason of his plans did not raise any red flags with his mentor/sponsor?   Of course not.  Ugh.

Remember how broke Jason was?  How is he affording these hundreds of dollars worth of bar runs?  

Jason is correct about Natalie.  She cares not for his career.  If she sees he is broken down to X extent, he is done.  He is obvious well past X.  However, bringing her aboard is a smart move and it affirms Lindell's statements to Clay we saw last week.  Jason is the bad guy here.  No question.

When they rescued the hostages, did anyone see any evidence that Loch had received medical attention?  The pirates were not fools.  If it was about keeping their meal tickets in good health, the hostages would not have been looking as rough as they did.

The bottom line is the very real fracturing of the team, which several posters have well documented in here, is too much to overcome.  The Navy recognized, but then failed to re-constitute the Team.  Now we'll watch as Natalie forces Lindell's hand.  Then our lying eyes and ears will be told it never happened.

[FakeItTil]

Way too much drama in that episode, even for this show. You can't have all 20 stupid things they're doing dominating in one episode. All it did was highlight that the team should be broken up, Sonny and Davis has been stupid, Jason should be retired and in therapy, and Ray shouldn't be promoted even in a decent episode for him. I can already smell the Clay drama coming again, too.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

I am glad to see the further repercussions from the fraternization.  Davis is a special kind of stupid if she continues to try to ameliorate the situation.

I would truly hate duty protecting an insane Ambassador.  I liked the realism of the State Department trumping the very clear and imminent mortal threats.  

The tactics of the firefight were, unfortunately absurd.  First, Clay has a clear shot at the bad guys as they were leaving their vehicle.  One, or two, of them would have easily been taken out.  Clay does not even fire.  Later, the baddies were deploying around the SE (master locked) entrance.  Ray had clear shots at them.  He does not fire.

We had the old SEAL chestnut where grenades are scarce as hen's teeth - for both sides.  You think an attack that well co-ordinated would not have had, at the least, half a dozen RPG's?  There was something heavy-duty in that first plastic case which Ray/Clay spotted.  Never used.  Ray's position was the only one returning fire and the baddies did not send a grenade or missile to take it out?  Then, the baddies have the most precise mortars imaginable as they took out cars, one after the other.  Well,  they did not have that ability earlier?  Riiiiight.

The best, aka a new low, was when Clay did not instantly shoot out the lock.  Beyond laughable.  Surreal?  Utterly incredible.  

Why did the Captain even wait a few seconds for Blackburn to describe the live fire?  He would not have instantly shouted the order for Jason to get his team to the compound pronto?  He needed a conversation?  Remember, he had been primed to give that order, anyway when the stand-down order originally came down.  He stood mute.  Joke.Now, if he had ordered them to standby awaiting a go-ahead from higher-ups?  Cool.  Not on him.  Yet, as we saw, that was not at play.

It would be interesting to see what further military response has been triggered.  There is little chance, imo, that Bravo would be forced to hold out alone for more than 8 hours.  Then again, with the mortars the enemy has?  They'd all be gone within a couple hours, anyway.

[nittany cougar]

This episode showed real problems for Jason and Sonny.  They are both showing some self-destructive tendencies.  Jason is sleeping on a mattress on the floor and getting drunk all the time;  Sonny lost his shit because Davis ended their relationship,and now he is at some gym getting beat up.  Would an active duty SEAL even be allowed to participate in violent boxing matches?  I would think the injuries that Sonny had would raise an alarm with the commanding officers.

I really hate the physiologist. I dislike the actress and the dialogue with Jason. I hope this is not a recurring character. 

Edited October 31, 2019 by nittanycougar

[dwmarch]

Well I have to say I enjoy this show more as an action show than as a drama.

I will miss the Ambassador. She was a great character and it would have been nice to see her in other situations in the future.

I'm glad Clay finally has his head on straight with regards to the new guy. Meanwhile Jason buries his head deep in his own ass. You can't fight on a bum knee, Jason. Go see the lady who can help you with that. She's right there and when she sees you hobbling she will come to you!

I know it was for added drama but you mean to tell me the US military has no other assets in the Yemen area besides Polish helicopters? Not even a weaponized drone or two?

Bravest terrorist ever was the guy who took over driving duties after the team blasted the first driver.

[cameron]

Personally, I don't like the actress that portrayed the ambassador.  Thought she over acted in this role as well as when she starred in Scandal.  Don't know where she came up with that accent since she was born in NYC.

[nittany cougar]

11 hours ago, cameron said:

Personally, I don't like the actress that portrayed the ambassador.  Thought she over acted in this role as well as when she starred in Scandal.  Don't know where she came up with that accent since she was born in NYC.

My husband also dislikes her.  He asked why she never acts "normal."  She was funny on News Radio but was really hammy on "Scandal."

Jason is getting more and more run down, to the point that I wonder how long he can run a team.  His knee is shot.

Can anyone tell me what Mandy was saying when she was talking to Jason?  I could not make out the audio in that scene. The audio on this show can be hard to decipher.

Edited November 7, 2019 by nittanycougar

[Kelda Feegle]

I did not like the ambassador and I hate the "my mission is more important than you trying to keep us all safe" trope.

Jason is F*ckd.

Anvilled Sonny going off at Ray sometime in the future about someone getting in Davis's ear.

[Andyourlittledog2]

So glad the ambassador died because that means that actress won't be showing up again. Her acting and way of speaking is intensely annoying.  Except for that nitwit did like the episode itself however. This is the only 'action' show I ever watch.

[mythoughtis]

On 11/7/2019 at 5:47 AM, cameron said:

Personally, I don't like the actress that portrayed the ambassador.  Thought she over acted in this role as well as when she starred in Scandal.  Don't know where she came up with that accent since she was born in NYC.

She did overact and portrayed way too much emotion.  The character was over the top unbelievable.  She didn’t do that in CSI Miami.  

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Fitting that Ray and Clay bought the Ambassador's insane pursuit of the white whale (tribal peace).  At least she went down like Ahab.  Glad there was more than the one survivor in THAT story.  No, Clay, the random rocket that killed her, and easily could have wiped you and Ray out, was not your fault - unless you are now admitting it was the stoopidest move you ever made to back her vision.   It was Jason's for allowing you to question his order in that moment.  

Once again, the enemy had rocketry and RPG's, against machine guns in a fixed position.  Alamo, indeed!  Now, add in the savviest tactical tangos yet seen in such an assault.  Not a single Team casualty, save Jason's knee.  Riiiiiiight.  TPTB way oversold the ability and advantage of the bad guys and fashioned a completely unbelievable solution.

Why did they abandon the SUV after eliminating the trailing truck threat?  The bad guys had no more comms?  Oh.  I guess they did not, just like the TV trope in cop shows where it is not possible to have a unit go to a place where the intrepid detectives believe the missing person and/or super bad guy is.  Nope.  Only the on-screen characters can handle, IN PERSON.

Davis made that call?  With the commander of all the Teams right there?  And Blackburn?   Riiiiight.  They agreed with it else it be overridden instantly.  She is dumb enough to believe it was hers, though.  She had not already scoped out the maps when it became clear they had to make a run for the airport?  She had to recheck the online map she had while they were enroute?!  

I'm fine with the personal admiration most of the Team had for the crazy Ambassador.  She did have real guts.  She had an uncommon understanding of leadership, and martial leadership.   She was still bat-guano insane.

Mr. Ultimate Warrant Officer and Master Chief candidate Ray is once again standing mute when the core physical ability of his unit's commander is in grave question.  Promote him yesterday!

Sincere question:  What honors are Clay due for that truly gallant move on that heavy weapon battery?  Highest traditions, for sure!!!!!  Wow. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by Lonesome Rhodes

[nittany cougar]

I was able to rewatch.  The ambassador asked Jason why he is still out doing this SEAL operation at "this age."  Well lady, he was trying to save your annoying ass.  Mandy also talked to him once again about how long he has been operating as a SEAL and the toll it is taking.

It looks like everyone thinks Jason should give up SEAL life...except Jason.  But, if Jason gives up SEAL life, doesn't the show end?

[free2think]

5 hours ago, nittanycougar said:

It looks like everyone thinks Jason should give up SEAL life...except Jason.  But, if Jason gives up SEAL life, doesn't the show end?

I started watching this show only because David Boreanaz was staring in it after 'Bones' finished it's 12th season and I loved him on that show. But I do think he is too old for this character and it's unrealistic that he would lead a Seal team. I actually lost interest in this show after the 1st season and completely lost interest after his wife died. This show just started to feel to 'fake' and unrealistic to me but all TV is, so there is that.

I did follow the actor's Instagram for a while and saw all his 'I'm getting buff for a new role' posts. And his real life son also went off to boarding school for hockey but dropped out after his first year, he could not make the U17 team. So I'm guessing David added his character's son going away to boarding school for hockey to mirror his real life. But I don't know any real man and father would make the choices his character made after the wife's death other than to keep the show going.

So ya I guess no David (Jason), no show?

[Raja]

With plenty of shoot them up squads who look just as tactically proficient as Bravo on TV does the show have any added value beyond Angel Booth? They do have the PTSD focus intertwined beyond the very special episode should characters move on and retire as happens in real life.

[FakeItTil]

On 11/13/2019 at 6:34 AM, nittanycougar said:

It looks like everyone thinks Jason should give up SEAL life...except Jason.  But, if Jason gives up SEAL life, doesn't the show end?

Pretty much. They could try to work around it with him in a different role but I don’t see it working or CBS trying. It’s why it’s annoying they’ve been doing the “Will Jason retire?!” since season 1. He’s not retiring until the end of the show and that’s if they retire him then.

They really should have been more vague with is age and given him younger kids instead of him being talked about as old since the early days of the show. Boreanaz still looks good enough that they could have dodged his age more and, you know, a stressful job and exposure to the elements are hard on your skin.

[windsprints]

Preview for 3.07: 

Longer sneak peek: 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

I liked this ep.  Not a lot of shoot 'em up.  Everyone seemed to be in character.  The beef between Ray and Sunny was reasonably quashed.  

I have to hand it to TPTB for this:  Boreanz all but literally chewed the scenery.  I seriously do wonder if Lindell would not have "suggested" in advance that Jason commit to psychotherapy to go along with his physical rehab.  Lord knows the man needs it.

The two questionable elements to me in this ep were 1) Why did the tango choose to fire at Bravo?  A fanatic like that would be much more likely to try to take out at least one of his targets, right?  2)  Ensign Davis debriefing everyone and talking about how "her" team was handling whatever.  The show is making her out to be way more than she is - a green Ensign. She had time to chat with Jason as the evac mission was hot?  

So far, Lindell is a fantastic commander.  He won't put up with a whole lot more of Hayes' attitude.  

I would love for an arc to develop with that diplomatic marketer being a plant.  Clay is ripe for the plucking.  He already went too far at the funeral.  It would be some great irony if the Sonny approach to women would actually be proven prudent!   

Edited November 21, 2019 by Lonesome Rhodes

[nittany cougar]

On 11/21/2019 at 1:18 AM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

I have to hand it to TPTB for this:  Boreanz all but literally chewed the scenery.  

I would love for an arc to develop with that diplomatic marketer being a plant.  Clay is ripe for the plucking.  He already went too far at the funeral.  It would be some great irony if the Sonny approach to women would actually be proven prudent!   

The scene where he took everything apart in his apartment was scary.  

It was interesting that Jason called Mandy just to hang out and asked her how things were with her dating life.  I was disappointed that we didn't see the rest of the conversation after he asked her to go on a road trip to Rehoboth.  I think it was an impulsive request but I still want to see what she would say.

I loved the Paris storyline, especially the dialogue about all of the people they saw in the apartment buildings and their routines.  This show is great at dry humor.

Edited November 22, 2019 by nittanycougar

[Whimsy]

On 11/21/2019 at 6:23 AM, nittanycougar said:

The scene where he took everything apart in his apartment was scary.  

It was interesting that Jason called Mandy just to hang out and asked her how things were with her dating life.  I was disappointed that we didn't see the rest of the conversation after he asked her to go on a road trip to Rehoboth.  I think it was an impulsive request but I still want to see what she would say.

I loved the Paris storyline, especially the dialogue about all of the people they saw in the apartment buildings and their routines.  This show is great at dry humor.

We did see her reaction to it.  She basically took it as a booty call.  I didn't necessarily think that was what it was, but her reaction to it and then Jason's to her made me think he did.  I can't remember specifically what she said, but it seemed clear that was the intention. But, it was so unromantic and weird.  I have the very UO of liking those two, but it seemed to come from left field. 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

This might have been the best ep I've seen.

Jason was heading for oblivion and he had to reign in his will and ego else consequences (consequences?!) claim his career.  It's ridiculous it took this long.  Yet, this was a very satisfying place for Jason to land.  For now, anyway.

I was very pleased to see Clay put up for a significant medal.  He can be a dang fool, though, can't he?  Serious question:  Do they not hammer home to these people when they are not at fault when adverse results occur?  It seems to me a pretty easy jump for a SEAL to understand and fully respect when someone goes beyond the call at great personal risk and ends up paying the ultimate price.  If Clay had bought it during his gallant actions in Yemen, would the rest of the team blamed themselves, or simply chosen to honor Clay?  I do not see how anyone in Special Ops can operate if they are prone to self-blame.  I truly do not get it.

The firefight at the ridge was...interesting.  One, count it, ONE, grenade and the bad guys had it.  At least everyone had the shooting skills of an Imperial Stormtrooper - except for the pilot.

This time, happily, Davis' contribution to tactics felt right.  They were spitballin' and all they cared about was the best result.  Good stuff.  Of course, that all goes away with the romantic choice she later made.  SMH.

Lindell continues to impress.  I sure hope TPTB allow him to keep playing it straight.

[dwmarch]

I liked this episode too. It was funny seeing Jason develop a little bit of humility from the anesthesia. I had my wisdom teeth taken out in the hospital and that anesthetic put me in a whole different world, I tell you what.

Again, the wisdom of Jayne Cobb prevails: sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don'tcha think? The Iranians throw one or two but the SEALs didn't think to bring any (or an M203 rifle-mounted grenade launcher).

There was one shot of the IRGC helicopter that clearly showed it as a Black Hawk, which Iran does not have any of.

I don't recall Clay and Stella breaking up again although Sonny did say that Stella had broken Clay's heart more than once.

Emma should be maintaining her own records, especially if they're needed for school. She knows her dad has ADD when it comes to this kind of stuff and she's already done stuff like organizing his house for basic survival needs because he isn't capable of doing it himself. What kind of trip is she going on where she has to provide documentation like this anyhow?

I would love it if Jason's therapist ended up being played by one of the actors who was on Angel as a Wolfram & Hart boss.

[nittany cougar]

On 11/27/2019 at 7:22 PM, Whimsy said:

We did see her reaction to it.  She basically took it as a booty call.  I didn't necessarily think that was what it was, but her reaction to it and then Jason's to her made me think he did.  I can't remember specifically what she said, but it seemed clear that was the intention. But, it was so unromantic and weird.  I have the very UO of liking those two, but it seemed to come from left field. 

Thanks, Whimsy.  I did see the part where she asked exactly what he meant. I just felt like the scene had a weird edit.   I like these two as well.  I definitely prefer Jessica Pare to the actress who plays the physiologist.  The physiologist character is too over the top and pushy.  

Editing to add, I think Jason's request to go on a road trip together also concerned Mandy because she realized how lost he is right now.  Jason was all over the place in this episode.  He was also shown dropping by Ray's for beers without warning.  

Edited December 1, 2019 by nittanycougar

[nittany cougar]

This episode was a fail for me.

1) The Clay and DC lady romance rings false to me.  They have no chemistry, and I liked his ex better.

2) Sonny was a total asshole to Lisa.  I think it was out of character for Sonny to dump her in such a mean way after they just hooked up.  

3) Jason and therapist woman came out of nowhere. Even though they have been shown "flirting," I did not see any development that supported his sudden confession of feelings for her.  He has been a fucking mess lately.  Also, isn't it unethical for her to date someone she just treated? 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

The psychology of competing "selves" is a fascinating subject.  For my money, it's a real thing.  This was a more than decent portrayal.  Jason has so much more to overcome, but this was a heckuva beginning.  

Clay with outright insubordination of orders?  Well, this is precisely the type of discipline Blackburn has inculcated.  It's still a joke that he retained his position.  Clay has to go.  Will the show even emphasize the obvious point that he was actually wrong?  

It was good to see Davis finally paying a real price for her insanity.  She's been headed for this for quite some time.  She is not the first to punt a career by failing to subordinate desires.  The Navy also failed her by allowing her the familiarity of her prior duty as a newbie Ensign. 

More Imperial Stormtrooper shooting from the Bravo team.  That is a problem.   A standard truck is presented and all the tangos are clustered tightly together.  They hit exactly none of them until they began to spread out away from their "cover"  We did, however have the all-new tactic of a Bravo tossing a grenade immediately upon being shot at by a tango in an enclosed area (room).  Who knew?!  Surely, that was a new ROE.

I appreciate where the show tried to go with Jason.  They largely got there, too.  The physical recovery is too pat, though.  

[CooperTV]

2 hours ago, nittanycougar said:

Sonny was a total asshole to Lisa.  I think it was out of character for Sonny to dump her in such a mean way after they just hooked up.  

In their scene in the bar he was incredibly kind and supportive of her while trying to protect himself. Lisa wanted it both ways: be friends with him, while being intimate with him but not committing to it 100% because of her responsibilities as an officer. And Sonny clearly wants a serious, "proper", relationship with her, not a whatever surrogate that suits her right now. Sonny is clearly being wiser and more mature than her this episode.