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The Starling City Times: News and Media about Arrow

Grammaeryn

By Grammaeryn
in Arrow

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bijoux

bijoux

It's a good analysis although I raise two points. One is factual. Curtis is not Felicity's assistant. The second depends on your point of view, but I truly don't see Oliver sleeping with every woman under 30 for three years. By my count, he slept with three in the first season and two in the second, while being celibate for practically the entirety of the third season. Now, I may think only one of those five women was a somewhat sane choice (McKenna), but they were all grown-ups and none of them were involved with other people at the time. It does not tell a tale of a Lothario to me after the island. Dude who makes seriously unwise choices in chosing bedmates? Yes. Bedhopping? No.

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Morrigan2575
Morrigan2575

I always find it odd when people blame the writing for LLs failure. I'll give them that for Lauiver because of the whole cheating thing but, let's be honest if SA/KC had the chemistry that SA/EBR had,

lemotomato
lemotomato

Sorry, that argument rings really hollow when the show has had a history of killing off/mistreating other female characters without a peep of protest from those same "concerned" people. Moira Queen, S

ComicFan777
ComicFan777

I know that this is supposed to be Felicity's dark arc, but...Felicity desperately doing whatever she can to save people (damn the consequences down the road) doesn't make me think that she's losing w

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Starfish35

Starfish35

Yeah agreed.

I'd have to go back and read some of her older posts, but IIRC (and I may not be) she was one of the ones who had a fit about Sara and Oliver getting together. So she and I weren't on the same page at all. Not that I thought that Sara and Oliver was a great love, but I didn't view it as the great character-destroying disaster that it seemed like some people did. But then....Sara fan all the way here. *shrug*

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

She did get pissed off at Sara/Oliver but she quit because of Suicide Squad, she also hated the Flashback episode because it added nothing to the story or Oliver's journey that we didn't already know (which I agree with her)

I don't remember all of her reasons but it went beyond shipper goggles.

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catrox14

catrox14

This bothered me as well. It didn't seem like something Laurel would say, I could see it as more as a Thea comment.

 

YES!!!! I thought the exact same thing. It made NO sense coming out of Laurel's mouth. That is a Thea line ALL the way.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

Oh I'm not arguing against you or saying she's right, just trying to remember the circumstances that lead to her quitting Arrow.

Ah ok. Yeah I don't remember why - I just remember people saying she'd quit.

Edited by Starfish35
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

She did get pissed off at Sara/Oliver but she quit because of Suicide Squad, she also hated the Flashback episode because it added nothing to the story or Oliver's journey that we didn't already know (which I agree with her)

 

 

IIRC, she thought the show was losing the thread a bit, becoming too plot driven, and a lot of things weren't making sense to her anymore. I think Time of Death really sent her over the edge - she really hated Oliver and Sara that ep, but not because of the hookup I don't think.

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Guest

Guest

(edited)

I had no problems with O/S hooking up (I thought them being in a relationship was a bit far) but to be fair, Arrow did lose its way a bit in the middle of s2. I marathoned the show at that point in time and I remember thinking it felt a bit lost. All the greatness and momentum built in the first 9/10 episodes came to a halt and it didn't pick up again until 219/220. Seems like it's an Arrow pattern though.

Edited by Guest
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kismet

kismet

Her review is a little ranty and you can tell her bias from time to time. It doesn't seem like the most balanced and impartial review, like a lot of theses reviews are. But I did appreciate her passion and conviction for leaving the reviews if she lost faith in the show. That being said, I don't recall really ever reading much of her other stuff, so I can only go based upon what you guys report.

 

I will say from my personal experience, s2 did get a little lost which started around the same time of the SL/OQ lunge. And I have to admit, the show fell off my need to watch radar a few episodes after ToD. I kept up with the show eventually... but it really did lose itself there for a bit. Which sadly seems to be the trend when I look at s3 & even s1. Here's hoping for better in s4.

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statsgirl

statsgirl

She hated Time of Death (didn't so many of us?) and I think that's when she quit.

 I truly don't see Oliver sleeping with every woman under 30 for three years.

IIRC, except for Joanna and Dinah, he slept with every woman that he wasn't related to.   It was much commented on at the time.

 

I think the EPs were going through their James T. Kirk./fantasy wish fulfillment period.  It was SA who fought for Oliver not sleeping around so much.

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Password

Password

Nah she quit after Diggle's episode. The show went off the rails in terms of story telling and yes IMO ToD was the start of that.

Sara and Oliver was something the show didn't have to do and I agreed with her. But mostly I think she couldn't connect with Oliver anymore because he was unrelatable.

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hogwash

hogwash

(edited)

Those episodes going nowhere was so much worse because they gave us Slade's plan in 209 and we got none of it. Only the Roy thing kinda happened. Maybe the annoying LOT setup means they might actually have stuff for the episodes after the mid-season?

 

When you actually lay them all out, Oliver hasn't had that many romantic relationships. But there were few  women who were off limits even if there were very good in show reasons for him not to bone these women. The lunge continued that pattern. TOD decided to make it worse by vividly reminding us of the sister swapping and that Sara/Oliver kinda sucked. I honestly would've bet that Oliver wouldn't start sleeping with Sara in the present. I realized halfway through 213 that I lost that bet. 

Edited by hogwash
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tv echo

tv echo

Arrow Season 4: 19 WTF Moments From ‘Brotherhood’
Andrew Pollard   21 NOV 2015
http://whatculture.com/tv/arrow-season-4-19-wtf-moments-from-brotherhood-2.php

Brotherhood opened up with another chase sequence over the same generic piece of land that is used for any and all similar moments, with a nameless, faceless driver attacked by the Ghosts only for Team Arrow to come to the rescue.
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Whilst present-day Ollie has a calmer head and a stronger moral compass, the flashback Ollie is a little more edgy when it comes to doing what needs to be done. Even then though, it was a surprise to see Oliver rearing back on an Indiana Jones-esque bullwhip and lashing Conklin.
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The battle itself took place over several floors and even continued in an elevator. It was a brutal, flowing, fantastically-choreographed sequence that concluded with Thea firing a tranquillizer arrow into her opponent.
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tv echo

tv echo

Product review of Felicity Smoak Funko POP figure...

 

Pop! TV: Felicity Smoak from Funko
20.11.15
http://toysrevil.blogspot.com/2015/11/pop-tv-felicity-smoak-from-funko.html?spref=tw

Personally, the "heroine" of the series - not just because "Ms Smoak" is utterly smoking' (*goes weak at the knees*), but she is rocking! With the absence of a "Oracle"-character, I've always felt Felicity filled the requirement very well indeed!
 

FUNKO PRESS: "Felicity fans, we got the message loud and clear! This brilliant tech genius is beautiful, strong, witty, prone to accidentally speaking in double-entendres, and did we mention brilliant? We all know Felicity is the real hero of Arrow! Add this you-know-what with wifi to your Team Arrow collection today! Coming in January!"
 

Felicity-Smoak-Shrine.jpg
*Disclaimer: The above image montage is purely for visual references only and does not constitute my devotion or potential stalkerish notion towards Felicity "Smoak" or any deviation thereafter… errmm… yeah! :)

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tv echo

tv echo

Media picking up on what SA said at Heroes & Villains FanFest on Nov. 21...

 

Stephen Amell Promises Unbridled Rage If Something Happens To Felicity On Arrow
Joe Comicbook- 11/22/2015
http://comicbook.com/2015/11/22/stephen-amell-promises-unbridled-rage-if-something-happens-to-fe/

During an appearance at Heroes & Villains Fan Fest on Saturday, Stephen Amell was asked how Oliver Queen would react if something bad were to happen to Felicity Smoak on Arrow. Amell didn’t mince words when explaining how Oliver would take it.
 

“Somewhere between confusion, desperation, complete and utter sadness, and unbridled rage,” replied Amell. “Let’s hope that doesn’t happen.”

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tv echo

tv echo

More praise for Bamford...

 

INTRODUCING ANDY DIGGLE: ARROW’S “BROTHERHOOD“ TACKLES FAMILY DYNAMICS
Verena Cote | November 21, 2015
http://www.4ye.co.uk/2015/11/introducing-andy-diggle-arrows-brotherhood-tackles-family-dynamics/

... The bam-tastic episode, the directorial debut of Arrow’s stunt choreographer James Bamford, included all kinds of family drama, existential crisis and an increasingly sassy Damien Darhk.
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...David Ramsey managed to tear on our heartstrings as this week’s definite MVP: whether we see him with wife Lyla – one of the strongest and most beautiful relationships on the show – bond with brother-in-arms Oliver (“My brother needed me. The green one”), or struggle with his actual brother’s betrayal, Diggle shines....
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We are aware that [Ray] is getting ready to become a Legend and fully transform into the role of super hero, but it doesn’t hurt any less to see him so lost.  His relationship with Felicity is a welcome comfort to him as well as to us. They did work as a couple but they work much better on a platonic lets-talk-tech basis.
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We love our little Olicity moments. They may be insignificant and put into the episode for the sheer purpose of making us laugh, but we can’t help enjoying them. Felicity casually listing all of Oliver’s horrible decisions? Hilarious. The reaction to Felicity publically mentioning their late-night activities including leather and tying people up? Priceless.
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tv echo

tv echo

'Arrow' S04E07: What worked and what didn't with 'Brotherhood'
Laura Hurley   November 22, 2015  8:18 AM MST
http://www.examiner.com/article/arrow-s04e07-what-worked-and-what-didn-t-with-brotherhood

David Ramsey rose to the occasion magnificently. Some of the rather repetitive dialogue given to Digg worked only thanks to the acting talents of Ramsey. He was absolutely the MVP of the episode. If nothing else, “Brotherhood” has established that Arrow is better when John Diggle has something to do.
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What is particularly wonderful about the Oliver/Felicity romance - and what "Brotherhood" demonstrated - is that their dynamic isn't all that different from how they were in their prime as friends in earlier seasons. The friendship is still very much there; now, there's just an added element of intimacy - both emotional and physical - in their scenes that elevates the stakes without warping the characters for the sake of a love story.
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Quite aside from the terrible danger now looming over all of them, the members of Team Arrow 3.0 looked positively fabulous in their formalwear in "Brotherhood." Laurel's classic hair and makeup really worked for Katie Cassidy, and Felicity's overall styling worked to age Emily Bett Rickards up a bit so that she didn't look like a teenager next to Stephen Amell as she did to a certain extent with the youthful Grant Gustin and the significantly older Brandon Routh.
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What Didn’t Work: The practical handling of “Brotherhood” from Arrow stunt coordinator James Bamford in his directorial debut was so sloppy that the camerawork actually noticeable.
*  *  *
Ambiguously Accented Woman is as blank as ever, and the development of her character feels clumsily rebooted each episode. Neither Ambiguously Accented Woman nor the dearly departed Vlad ever indicated that there was a sibling in the mix, and so Ambiguously Accented Woman’s despair in “Brotherhood” after learning of Vlad’s death felt like manufactured emotional fodder.
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tv echo

tv echo

Arrow season 4 episode 7 review: Brotherhood
Caroline Preece 23 Nov 2015 - 14:00
http://www.denofgeek.com/tv/arrow/37945/arrow-season-4-episode-7-review-brotherhood

The relationship between Oliver and Diggle, similarly pushed to the background more often than not, has always been one of the show's most interesting. Diggle represents something to Oliver that no one else ever can – he was the first to be brought into the cause, and the first to call him out when things get start to spiral.
 

To Oliver, Felicity is his girlfriend, Thea his little sister, and Laurel little more than a squatter he'd rather keep in a box at home. Besides being the only other male person on the team, it's Diggle who he views as an equal far more than the others. Oliver cares what Diggle thinks of him and, as was explored in this episode, he needs to believe that, no matter how far he goes in his quest for 'justice' etc., Diggle will still be by his side.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

To Oliver, Felicity is his girlfriend, Thea his little sister, and Laurel little more than a squatter he'd rather keep in a box at home.

You know, I am still 98% sure Laurel's not in the grave, but it's reviews like this that make me wonder, a tiny bit.  I mean, she's BC now, and she's been BC for awhile, but by and large the viewing public and reviewers still seem not to give a crap.  KC also has to be somewhat expensive.  And Guggie isn't even teasing an arc for her.  If my theory was correct and her late 4B arc was mourning her father, you would think he'd at least say "Keep watching." 

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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

Yeah no, she lost me as an Adalind supporter.

ETA: Sorry. I'm stressed and over-caffeinated right now. :(. Let's just suffice to say that I find the current Grimm storyline involving Adalind to be extremely repulsive, but more detailed discussion should probably go to the Small Talk thread.

Edited by Starfish35
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)

Yeah no, she lost me as an Adalind supporter.

ETA: Sorry. I'm stressed and over-caffeinated right now. :(. Let's just suffice to say that I find the current Grimm storyline involving Adalind to be extremely repulsive, but more detailed discussion should probably go to the Small Talk thread.

What?  Not enjoying the lead playing house with the woman that raped him, tried to kiil all the cast at some time and was the catalyst that turned the love of his life into an evil monster leading to her death?   (I hope, knock on wood)

 

Ridiculous storyline but I can see the craftsmanship of the writers TRYING to rehab the character and make the viewers sympathetic (as long as they practice self amnesia)

 

Say what you will, Adalind is entertaining. 

 

Interesting article.  Liked this bit of mike dropping. 

 

I may be impatient about the whole Girl [ aka damsel] thing because romance writers solved this a long time ago. Mid-century romance heroines got rescued a lot by macho heroes, nurses fell in love with doctors, secretaries married their bosses, and agency was in short supply because it was so unwomanly. Thirty years ago we turned that around and gave our protagonists power over their own lives, so to see those passive, boring romance heroines from the fifties still showing up as love interests on the screen is maddening. We’re better than this.

 

Edited by BkWurm1
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thegirlsleuth

thegirlsleuth

Jennifer Crusie's latest look at "the Girl" on various shows: Arrow, Sleepy Hollow, The Flash, Grimm: "There's a New Girl in Town"

 

 

I'm only familiar with about 50 percent of the couples mentioned, but the article would have been worth it for the "I hope you die, Oliver" meme, if for nothing else.

 

I was thinking about how all of the failures of "the girl" she mentioned were so recent.  Is it because audiences can give feedback instantly or steadily about failed characters like "the girl" (and I think there are male versions of this characters as well), thus allowing the creators to kill what doesn't work?   Or is the rise of the superhero show a factor as well, where the comic book love interest REALLY doesn't translate well to the screen?  Although that probably wouldn't be such a big deal for Laurel since Black Canary since she is significantly more than just a love interest in the comics.  It seems like a recent phenomenon, and when I tried to do a google search on "failed love interests tv shows" to see if I could find some earlier example the first five hits were articles that mentioned Laurel or were about her exclusively, which I suppose isn't surprising.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

What?  Not enjoying the lead playing house with the woman that raped him, tried to kiil all the cast at some time and was the catalyst that turned the love of his life into an evil monster leading to her death?   (I hope, knock on wood)

 

Ridiculous storyline but I can see the craftsmanship of the writers TRYING to rehab the character and make the viewers sympathetic (as long as they practice self amnesia)

 

Say what you will, Adalind is entertaining. 

 

Interesting article.  Liked this bit of mike dropping. 

replying in small talk

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kismet

kismet

I'm just excited Sally is finally getting the props she deserves!! If OQ spends another season away from her, I'm most definitely out. Thank Goodness Sally finally made an appearance in s4. I was getting worried about her being abandoned in the defunct foundry.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

I have never watched Grimm, so I like Jennifer Crusie's article about The Girl.

 

This is weird. I wonder if the review got re-edited, because I can't seem to find the graphs quoted above and yet when I do a Google search, they show up and link to the review.

Den of Geek has two reviews of 407, one written by Mike Cecchini on Nov. 18 (posted on previous page of this thread) and one written by Caroline Preece on Nov. 23 (posted above).  I think the problem is that they both have the same title and same url address - so the site gets confused and keeps mixing them up.

Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

tv echo

'Arrow' S04E07: What needs to happen next after 'Brotherhood'
Laura Hurley  November 23, 2015 8:42 AM MST
http://www.examiner.com/article/arrow-s04e07-what-needs-to-happen-next-after-brotherhood

Arrow needs to lay off of the nepotism. The most jarring aspect of “Brotherhood” was the handling of the practical elements of the episode as stunt coordinator James Bamford took the reins of his very own 42-minute block of primetime television. He is clearly a very talented stunt coordinator, and there’s no shame in any person sticking with what he or she is best at rather than branching out into the unknown. James Bamford needs to continue to pursue directing on Arrow in his career like this reviewer needs to pursue getting her S.C.U.B.A. licensure for hers: not at all.
 

If Arrow is going to arm legions of bad guys with guns, then Arrow needs to show those guns being used with some degree of effectiveness. Even Star Wars Imperial Stormtroopers managed to hit somebody in the wrist or shoulder from time to time. It’s awfully noticeable when the bad guys apparently succumb to firearm performance anxiety and forget their weapons as soon as somebody in leather gives chase.
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Unless a great deal changes in the flashbacks, there needs to be no romance between Oliver and Ambiguously Accented Woman. Thus far, the relationship between them has been played straight, and the power differential between them is far too extreme for a relationship to be anything but gross.

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