Spoilers and Speculation

[Emily Thrace]

Walking Dead decided to change things up.  Add characters not in the comic.  Switch out roles characters play in the story.  That makes the backlash blow back on the show.  The show fears the backlash, I'm convinced of that.

I don't know about that I think the show is ridiing pretty high right now that does tend to translate into TPTB being willing to take risks. Plus I'm not a hundred percent convinced Carol would be that popular with the overall audience. She's certianly popular with the online one but that doesn't always translate to popular with the larger audience. Shows still tend to weigh more heavily on market research than inernet forums for feedback. Lana Lang is classic example she was hated online but TPTB promoted her like crazy because their market research showed she was popular. I wonder about Carol being popular with casual veiwers since she had such a small role prior to this season. Plus she's not an Action girl or love interest or any one of the types that tend to be popular with wider audiences in any case. In the end I would rather TPTB kill someone cuz thier story has ended rather than anything else. In the end the internet portion of a fandom is usually only a sample anyway.(plus it tends ot be a specific set of demos that don't always match up with audeince of the show)

 

I actually think Carol's story is over in any case, her only real freind left is Darryl and he has moved in a completely different direction from her. Plus as Team Mom she didn't really interact with the other characters enough to make that a viable option for her going forward. Either for her character having room to grow or for her being a character that is vital to the story. She doesn't really another she can believeably take over either the show already has three Lancers and she sure as hell isn't the Big guy or the smart guy. She's not the heart or an action girl shes not really anything. The only thing I could see her being is The medic and if Bob is around they don't even need her for that. That's why I think Carol's goin to die she's just run out of room to grow.

 

Plus I wonder if she actually got the message that she isn't a law unto herself. I think in the Grove she realized killing Karvid was wrong because she hurt Ty but I wonder if she really undertands that she really isn't as good as she thinks she is. More than anything that arrogance will make it impossible for her to intergrate back into the group. Especially out on the road the group needs to be cohesive Carol trying to do her own thing and go against Rick is just going to cause trouble.

[kikismom]

Although it may not be ideal for any group to have a "troublemaker", it's important for a television series!

 

I think that Shane, Lori, and Merle were not "cohesive", but the conflicts they caused were fascinating...I think when the show got rid of them, and Carl got Good and Helpful and Daryl stopped using smart-ass vernacular (and even when Herschel stopped being delusional and adversarial and became Good and Helpful and then dead) that's when it started blanding out.

 

Glenn's first line in the show was "Hey Dumb-Ass! You! Dumb-Ass in the tank! Gettin' cozy in there?!" He then turned into nervous "I-I-I-I'm not looking at the barn!", then "I knooooow my heart wiiiiilll go on lalala"

 

If the group just becomes Sad but Plucky Overgrown Children, and the only conflict is everyone else in the world, we're going to have The Bobbsey Twins and How They Slew (walkers).

I really miss:  yelling at the screen.

I would really love: the boxcar with Lori, Shane, and Merle still in the group. I'd be drooling over the possible dialogue.Who cares if it's optimum group dynamics; it's a laugh and a shriek of fear at the same time.

[eejm]

I actually think Carol's story is over in any case, her only real freind left is Darryl and he has moved in a completely different direction from her. Plus as Team Mom she didn't really interact with the other characters enough to make that a viable option for her going forward. Either for her character having room to grow or for her being a character that is vital to the story. She doesn't really another she can believeably take over either the show already has three Lancers and she sure as hell isn't the Big guy or the smart guy. She's not the heart or an action girl shes not really anything. The only thing I could see her being is The medic and if Bob is around they don't even need her for that. That's why I think Carol's goin to die she's just run out of room to grow.

 

I see your point, although I don't think Carol's completely without friends.  Assuming Carol/Tyreese/Judith are reunited with the larger group this season, I think Tyreese will be the one to vouch for Carol to come back to the group.  And aren't Rick and Tyreese the only ones who knew that she killed David and Karen anyway?  As for being the medic, Bob would be the likely candidate to serve as one, but much of the group (aside from Sasha and Maggie) really don't trust him due to the incident at Big Sp!t and at the vet college.  Bob hasn't been with the group all that long; although no one thinks he's "bad," per se, he's still somewhat of a loose cannon due to his alcoholism. I still think he needs to prove himself a bit more. 

 

I think that Shane, Lori, and Merle were not "cohesive", but the conflicts they caused were fascinating...I think when the show got rid of them, and Carl got Good and Helpful and Daryl stopped using smart-ass vernacular (and even when Herschel stopped being delusional and adversarial and became Good and Helpful and then dead) that's when it started blanding out.

 

I think Merle was let go too soon.  In the beginning I figured he'd be recurring kind of in the same way Morgan is recurring.  I thought Merle would kind of act as the devil on Daryl's shoulder - always bringing Daryl back down to the "little brother" level and trying to get him to join The Dark Side.  He'd have made a great ongoing bad guy in the way The Governor could never be, and he's someone for whom Daryl would always have a soft spot.

[Cheshrkat]

Keeping Merle on longer was not an option - even the character recognized that he had no place in the group.  They were never going to trust him.  And in the Zombie Apocalypse, you cannot afford to keep people in your group if you don't trust them. 

[Emily Thrace]

Keeping Merle on longer was not an option - even the character recognized that he had no place in the group.  They were never going to trust him.  And in the Zombie Apocalypse, you cannot afford to keep people in your group if you don't trust them. 

And I think this is exactly how Carol is going to end up this season. Tyrese himself said he forgives her but I don't think he trusts her. I can see already the rest of the group having similar issues.  Putting aside the morality of what Carol did the fact that she did it herself may be what really bites her in the end. I'm also not convinced Carol really deserves that trust in any case.  I'm not convinced she really understands how truly arrogant killing Karvid was in the first place. I think she undertands it was wrong to kill two people but I'm not sure she got the message that it wasn't her call to make and that isn't quite as smart as she thinks she is.  Until Carol realizes her own limits she will continue to be a danger to herself and the group as a whole.

 

I see your point, although I don't think Carol's completely without friends.

I don't see any real solid bonds though at least not anything shown onscreen. That's been a big issue with her character since the ned of season 2. This show is trying to be a character drama and the fact is the more people you can interact with the more storylines you can be involved in. I wouldn't call Tyrese her frined in any case, he has forgiven but he doesn't seem to want to speak to her.

 

Although it may not be ideal for any group to have a "troublemaker", it's important for a television series!

I don't think Carol fits that role though, I actually suspect that's why they brought in Abraham and Co. Carol acts behind the scenes, even killing Karvid only amounted a few scenes of real conflict, (And 900,000 online discussions.)

[eejm]

Keeping Merle on longer was not an option - even the character recognized that he had no place in the group.  They were never going to trust him.  And in the Zombie Apocalypse, you cannot afford to keep people in your group if you don't trust them.

 

I don't think Merle could or would have stayed with the group, but it didn't mean he had to be killed off.  He was presumably on his own from the time he escaped from the roof until he got to Woodbury.  Merle wasn't exactly a people person, but he could have met up with another group.  Joe's group would have been a perfect place for Merle's charming personality.

[NurseGiGi]

Kikismom, I forgot how much I missed that Glen.  The show has definitely gotten away from having any kind of realistic levity.  People are going to have moments of gallows humor and I liked when the characters weren't so one sided.  I'm thinking the first season will always be my favorite.  I still love most of the characters that are left, though. Well, I don't care much for Beth.  I cringe every time they ask her to sing.

[Watcher0363]

Kikismom, I forgot how much I missed that Glen.  The show has definitely gotten away from having any kind of realistic levity.  People are going to have moments of gallows humor and I liked when the characters weren't so one sided.  I'm thinking the first season will always be my favorite.  I still love most of the characters that are left, though. Well, I don't care much for Beth.  I cringe every time they ask her to sing.

Well I think the writers may have grown up with Robotech. I think of Beth as the "Linn Minmei" of the ZA. Her singing may save them all in the end or at least allow them to survive longer than most.

[kikismom]

 I suggest that it becomes less and less of an option to only have a group composed of people you are friends with; as the human population keeps dwindling, and the walkers keep increasing, survivors are going to have to be less picky. Then consider how many of the remaining live humans are rapey robber types, and a group has to be tolerant to keep enough people to survive. Or go it alone and die for one's principles.

 

I could go through all the characters mistakes, but we've been over that; at this point none of them really have the moral high ground.

It's becoming apparent in this phase of the ZA, that we're seeing "mega-groups"---very large numbers gathering to rule turf. Numbers will count more and more. Are the issues with Carol bigger than the issues with the Termites, the Merletones, the Would-bury-u's, or God knows who comes next?

 

What if they get rescued from the boxcar by Carol? Does that make a difference?

 

When Herschel pleaded to leave the prison, let the Governor have it---and Carol and Beth and Daryl thought Herschel was right and even Carl thought so and Tyreese didn't want war with the Governor---Rick made a unilateral decision, there was still no democracy, he thought it was best and it didn't matter what the majority of the group thought was right. How many people died in that battle? More than 2.

If Rick can be forgiven for that, I don't feel he can banish Carol because she's "dangerous to the group".

[ArctisTor]

 When Herschel pleaded to leave the prison, let the Governor have it---and Carol and Beth and Daryl thought Herschel was right and even Carl thought so and Tyreese didn't want war with the Governor---Rick made a unilateral decision, there was still no democracy, he thought it was best and it didn't matter what the majority of the group thought was right. How many people died in that battle? More than 2.

 

If Rick can be forgiven for that, I don't feel he can banish Carol because she's "dangerous to the group".

 

The difference there is it wasn't Rick who pulled the trigger and it's doubtful the group would ever see it that way regardless if Rick held culpability in that situation.  Carol went behind the council and killed among their own, viewed as reprehensible by everyone we saw react to it and a lot of them really strong reactions.  

 

I'm with Emily Thrace.  Though I do think her and Tyreese helping save Judith and Tyreese's forgiveness, maybe also helping rescue them at Terminus, will open the door for her back into the group, it's dubious if they're ever going to trust her again.  However, her getting killed off seems too obvious or easy, instead I can see her leaving the group voluntarily.  Maybe believing there's no place for her in Alexandria so leaves before they get there, Carol never experiencing the promised land, or she gets there and she's never able to fit in.  Because the character she's become can work alone and, I feel, maybe more interesting alone than in a group, I could see Carol become some mysterious, lone wanderer like some of Clint Eastwood's Western characters or something.

Edited July 22, 2014 by ArctisTor

[Nutjob]

 

And aren't Rick and Tyreese the only ones who knew that she killed David and Karen anyway?

Rick told Daryl, right? That, right there, might bring more conflict for Carol... there might still be some pent-up hostility and mistrust from Pookie because of what she did.

 

Here's some spoilery stuff: http://thestir.cafemom.com/entertainment/174992/walking_dead_season_5_spoilers

 

I think it's a lock we see Gabriel this season.

[kikismom]

I still think the show doesn't want to deal with the complication, so Carol will die in some self-sacrificing way that benefits the group and Rick forgives her; I'm just really afraid of any scene resembling Andrea's death/reconciliation with Rick and Michonne!

Or, maybe the unexpected direction that Kirkman refers to---is Tyreese (and possibly Carol if she lives, and some others: Tara? Maggie--alone after Glenn dies? Beth?) staying at a cleaned-up Terminus...running it like a mission house. They raise orphaned children, run a refugee center, defend it with their skills but not interested in traveling hundreds of miles for Eugene's probable wild-goose chase. Bob could decide to stay with them; he likes security and he is a medic...Maggie knew some medical assisting from her father and maybe she discovers she's pregnant?

Then the moving north group would be Rick, Michonne, Carl, Abraham, Eugene, Rosita, Daryl...Sasha?

[ArctisTor]

Maggie knows Carol murdered Karen and David as well.  I kind of suspect the reason Carol is helping Daryl find Beth in the first place is her means to atone with Daryl, try to mend their friendship or the distrust there.  Though I've suspected Daryl's reaction, as he has familiarity with unhealthy or negative relationships among family (and eventually moving on from those relationships), ultimately may not be far removed from Tyreese's.  That he can forgive her, but the relationship will never be the same.  It'll probably go that direction if indeed the writers intend, as they've diverged pretty significantly, to continue to move on the characters to separate arcs.  That seems to have started last season since Daryl and Carol didn't interact much.  That would probably function to close out the Daryl-Carol arc if we are in MMB's last season, just with Daryl-Carol squared away first.  I wouldn't be too surprised Carol may have significant, complicated arcs with Tyreese as the season goes on and then maybe Rick towards the end of the season and maybe within any final arc for her.  Like kikismom and a lot of others have speculated, I could see a Redemption Equals Death arc happening, maybe sacrifices her life to save Judith or something.  Like she'd rather die than allow one more little girl in her charge to die.  Though I still think death would be a too easy end for that character's arc, even if death is what the writers usually fall back on.

 

There have been set photos of Seth Gilliam in priest/pastor garb, so he's definitely been filming for awhile.  Rumors are he has clues on Beth's whereabouts/those who took her.

Edited July 22, 2014 by ArctisTor

[kikismom]

1.  Carol is helping Daryl find Beth?

2. Could split the difference...Carol dies, Father Gabe and Beth and Tyreese and Sasha stay to help children? Remember the guy on the tracks said it was safe to take children there...Kirkman said some of the deal with Terminus fans had kindasorta figured out but some of it would be unexpected...maybe they thought they were going to save kids but they got short of food and people were getting attacked by bad guys so they killed enemies and used them for food...Daryl is bound and Michonne is handcuffed because they will be tortured for information on if they were connected to people who harmed the children or Termites in the past...

 

I think the powdered milk might be used by Rick and co. for an explosive...but it would be wild if they find that Terminus has some giant baby nursery!!

 

I can't see Maggie leaving Beth if it turns out Glenn has died.

[ArctisTor]

1.  That's the most logical deduction based on filming spoilers.  Beth was abducted by a car with a white cross.  Daryl and Carol are chasing after cars with white crosses on them, one of which the exact same car that was speeding off (with Beth) in "Alone".  There was also a scene filmed on location in Atlanta where Carol is wearing the clothes she was banished in, standing next to the car she drove off in and she's watching a car with a white cross drive off.  Suggesting this is a Carol flashback during her banishment, that she saw a car with a white cross, probably contributes why she's helping Daryl and why Daryl and Carol are wandering around downtown Atlanta as per filming spoilers.  

 

2.  I'm not convinced anyone is staying at Terminus as yet.  Kirkman has all but confirmed the place is a cannibal colony, not really somewhere anyone would probably want to hang-out, regardless if they kill or chase out all the cannibals.  I do think the entirety of the cast move off to Alexandria either by midseason or at season's end and there's some big end of one chapter and the start of another story in the midseason finale.  I think that includes Beth too, partly for that anvil-dropping clue spoon she picked up in "Still" (the spoon had Washington DC on it) and my doubts they'd separate the Greene daughters after Hershel's ugly demise.  They're going to want to keep the last of that family together as a sign of hope for the future or something.

[tv echo]

Next week's TV Guide (featuring Under the Dome on the cover) includes a pic of Rick and Darryl looking out from the railcar and a short article, which includes the following tidbits.

 

Scott Gimple:  "The season is about who these characters have become... They have survived getting out of the prison, they've been on these journeys and they're going to be facing some pretty heavy stuff that is going to define who they are as people moving forward."

 

Gimple:  Rick reassumes his position as the group's leader.  "He does feel affection for a great number of people in the railcar, so he's going to harness his more savage and brutal side to protect them."

 

Gimple:  "The premiere is "epic, intimate, emotional, insane, bloody and - hopefully - surprising.'

[dannymoon]

I like the "hopefully surprising" part. He knows how much speculation takes place during and in between seasons.

 

I'm pretty psyched to see the trailer tomorrow! The SDCC panel too, once it's on youtube. Lots of speculation and spoilery goodness I'm hoping.

[ArctisTor]

SDCC time so looks like spoilers are starting to trickle in.  Here are some spoilers The Spoiling Dead Fans are currently "tracking":

 

https://www.facebook.com/SpoilingDeadFans/posts/345471175608027?notif_t=notify_me

[kikismom]

I had seen the note about the hospital location filming (on another site). That sounds like a great place for some action with lots of walkers, or gunfights, or people with parts harvested--so is that where they meet the young guy with one leg (Burton?) or will it be the guy Beth has hooked up with I wonder?

 

Thanks for the link, Arctis Tor!

[ArctisTor]

The second I read about that Burton character, the first thing that popped into my head was, "He sounds like a caricature of Beth and Hershel."  Like an over-exaggerated version of a blindly optimistic person. Which could be why he and Beth might get along at first and for the reminder of her dad (missing leg), that they connect from that hopeful angle, but Beth is also not really the stalwartly blind, naive optimist she used to be either.  No character can be if they're expected to survive, if Beth is expected to live longer than her dad did, and that'll probably be what her arc is all about.  To not succumb in the dangerous temptation of blind hope and optimism, not fall back on old, bad habits, and the importance of keeping her eyes open to reality.  As her arc progresses, I can see a conflict growing with this Burton (if he is representing the blind optimist, the more she might try to open his eyes, the harder he might fight her.  The blindly optimistic and delusional will fight hard to protect their comforting delusions just like Hershel did Rick in season 2 regarding the zombie pandemic and the situation with the barn) and through that, the more she'll contrast and distance herself from the person she used to be (and arguably her dad was from time to time).  Like she told Daryl, "You've got to stay who you are, not who you were."  Burton sounds like he typifies who Beth was, but, evolving into a better survivor, she isn't and can't be anymore.

 

Not to say she loses that humane, hopeful side of her character and it's suggested she's going to take up the role as moral center of Rick's group at some point in the future.  However, she's got to do it better and smarter than her father.  If for anything, simply to not be a Hershel-clone and to be her own character.

[RedBaron]

New trailer for season 5.  Very spoilery about Beth and how the group gets out of Terminus.  

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4GAs9TJVjM#t=182

[eejm]

Based on the trailer, I'm thinking Bob doesn't make it out of Terminus.  A friend of mine and I were discussing Bob today based on what was in the trailer; he thinks Bob is going to be a zombie snack too.  Bob was not well-liked after the Big Sp!t and vet college incidents, and for good reason.  He seemed to get his act together after the prison fell and he ended up with Maggie and Sasha - he was insistent on them staying together instead of splitting up.  That ended up being a good thing in that they found Glenn and later the rest of the group (albeit at Terminus).  We thought this was the beginning of Bob's "redemption."

 

We figured Bob wouldn't make it out of Terminus alive, but he would do something heroic to make sure the rest of the group does survive.  After doing something so selfless, Bob is definitely seen as "one of us," and he doesn't die alone as he feared.  I'm wondering if the death scene being filmed that was rumored to be Glenn kicking it was actually Bob.

 

Speaking of Glenn, he certainly doesn't die early in the season.  He's all over the trailer in various different scenes.

[kikismom]

I'm told that Father Gabriel can be seen at 2:21.

I can't tell if it is. Anyone?

ETA: Okay, it is, saw him a couple times.

There are only the men from the group at the abbatoir. Separated from the women at that point?

Edited July 26, 2014 by kikismom

[bunnyblue]

 

Based on the trailer, I'm thinking Bob doesn't make it out of Terminus.

 

Looks to me like he does make it out of Terminus. He's with the group in the woods at 0:43 into the trailer. And Carol's in that group shot, so it must be outside of Terminus. I don't see Bob with the group when they're in the church, though. Maybe he bites it before they meet up with Father Gabriel. 

 

 

I'm told that Father Gabriel can be seen at 2:21.

 

I saw him. It is a super quick shot of him. He appears to be crying inside his church. 

 

What I want to know is, who is Maggie tending to at 1:36 in the trailer? The group seems to be in a room and Maggie is sitting down looking concerned at someone. I thought it was Glenn but he's standing next to Tyreese. Could it be Beth? Or Bob? Any ideas?

[kikismom]

I did see Carol when they are walking through the woods almost single file.

 

It appears that Bob gets pulled down by the neck of his shirt by a walker, so maybe that's who Maggie is looking at.

 

The walker that is chomping on something, has a partly eaten furry animal that seems to be black and white. Dog?

 

At the nurse's station, a male cop is down on the floor, and one of the other "nurse's aides" is eating him with a bloody mouth and zombie eyes while Beth tries to intervene or something. Then they show that nurse on a gurney, then Beth aiming a gun at some chaos in the doorway.

 

Who is up on the roof hosing down the walkers?

 

Although this is trivial, Rosita first made me happy she was wearing more appropriate clothing, like a real shirt not around the midriff Daisy Duke style...then I saw that she has the shirt unbuttoned to nipple level. Seriously?

Chandler Riggs voice now sounds exactly like the Jake kid on Two and A Half Men, Angus Somesuch.

[ArctisTor]

New trailer for season 5.  Very spoilery about Beth and how the group gets out of Terminus.  

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4GAs9TJVjM#t=182

 

Beth's arc couldn't get more young adult dystopia story if it tried.  It'll probably work too, that trend still makes a lot of money.  I admit, it's working on me so far.  I'm intrigued.

 

I also agree about Bob probably the top name in the death pool.  Having a big dramatic speech like that at Gareth in this show?  Not a great sign.

 

Gareth comes off like a giant bucket of sleaze, he needs to die a lot.  It can be getting his throat bit out, but I'm not picky.

 

Did Rick turn on the Termites in that scene he's mowing down a bunch of dudes with guns in alley/next to that chain link fence?  If so?  Fucking A, Rick!  To hell with those Termites-that-are-obviously-cannibals.

 

Either Abraham is crying because he's discovered Eugene's "cure" is phony baloney or he's reminiscing about his family and what happened to them.  I thought Rosita died or something for a minute there and that's why he was upset, but she's in that shot with the group in the forest.

[ParadoxLost]

What is going on with the zombies?  There are a couple of scenes where they are less decomposing and almost waxy?  The one at 1:18 looks like a human dog hybrid zombie.  The one at 2:15 looks like its skin is falling off the bones.  Is this the advance stages of zombification?  Are we going Warm Bodies boneys with this?

 

Nevermind, this appears to be the zombie version of pruning when in water too long.

Edited July 26, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[kikismom]

I think Abraham hits his knees crying because he used to be all killin these things is fun and Is that all you got? Now he's been caught and trapped helplessly and bound and gagged on his knees and in a very tragic, grim, disgusting fight with walkers and people who left humans in pieces and maybe it wasn't such a chest-thumping adventure anymore.

[Ripley68]

So, we know Rick gets Judith back....looks like Daryl is looking for Beth at one point.  Looks awesome!

[Pixel]

I think Abraham hits the ground because at some point it becomes apparent that this mulleted scientist is full of shit.

[SimoneS]

Damn, that trailer is exciting. I cannot wait for October.

 

Rick looks like he has gone total bad ass. His reunion with Judith must be intense. 

 

Poor Beth. I  think that she is a survivor though.

Edited July 26, 2014 by SimoneS

[kj4ever]

I'm not sure if we are allowed to do this, but on another forum they have the entire thing frame by frame:

 

http://spoilthedead.com/forum/showthread.php/13385-Season-5-Trailer-Shot-by-shot!-9-9

 

Please remove if we aren't allow to reference other boards.

 

One new thing that I saw was the room where there are clothing racks and the hole in the floor with the bloated walkers,

it looks like the same ceiling where Beth is being held.

[tv echo]

A bit spoilery...

 

"Walking Dead" Season 5 Preview at Comic-Con 2014 - TVLine

Edited July 28, 2014 by tv echo

[kikismom]

kj4ever:

The room with the racks and the hole in the floor has a suspended ceiling.
As does the place where Beth is.

As does the church!! Freeze when Rick and co. are entering the church weapons raised...and you see the same ceiling.
Interesting!

[kikismom]

1. The person Abraham is hitting with the stock of his firearm has a black leather jacket with tight cuff at the wrist. I'm only aware of two possibles: Gareth, or Daryl! 

Sasha is down in the water, so is Bob, so is Michonne.but so is Rick--it's Rick who pushes the metal shelving over.

If as we see, Rick goes up to the hole in the floor, and Michonne is running up behind him, why would they go down into the water unless someone was calling for help? Otherwise you'd just leave the walkers down there, no?

San Antonio Examiner says Mary is seen at the fence stabbing walkers. I can't tell, I see some girls, and a woman with a skirt---?

I  think the shot of Carl and Rosita(?) aiming over a desk with telephone, binder, and big soft-cover books---is the same as the nurse's station, but from the opposite POV as the shot of Beth and the bodies on the floor.

When Beth shoots the head off the walker coming through the door, is that walker wearing a stethoscope?

When Beth is holding the other girl down on the gurney(?) the back of a black male medic(?) is toward the camera. When she's running from the hospital, a black male in same uniform is behind her---do we know if there is a description of Burton?

[kj4ever]

 

1. The person Abraham is hitting with the stock of his firearm has a black leather jacket with tight cuff at the wrist. I'm only aware of two possibles: Gareth, or Daryl! 
2. Sasha is down in the water, so is Bob, so is Michonne.but so is Rick--it's Rick who pushes the metal shelving over.
3. If as we see, Rick goes up to the hole in the floor, and Michonne is running up behind him, why would they go down into the water unless someone was calling for help? Otherwise you'd just leave the walkers down there, no?
4. San Antonio Examiner says Mary is seen at the fence stabbing walkers. I can't tell, I see some girls, and a woman with a skirt---?
5. I  think the shot of Carl and Rosita(?) aiming over a desk with telephone, binder, and big soft-cover books---is the same as the nurse's station, but from the opposite POV as the shot of Beth and the bodies on the floor.
6. When Beth shoots the head off the walker coming through the door, is that walker wearing a stethoscope?
7. When Beth is holding the other girl down on the gurney(?) the back of a black male medic(?) is toward the camera. When she's running from the hospital, a black male in same uniform is behind her---do we know if there is a description of Burton?

 

 

Gareth's jacket has lines going through it, but I can't tell from the screen shot if the arm does.  They are also wearing a watch - I don't think I've seen Darly with a watch on before so hopefully it's Gareth.

 

Ohhh good catch that does look like the Carl shot could be from a different angle as the Beth shot!

[DuckyinKy]

New trailer for season 5.  Very spoilery about Beth and how the group gets out of Terminus.  

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4GAs9TJVjM#t=182

At 2:17, that's one terrific Zombie 'splosion!

[kikismom]

When Beth and the other girl are over the dead cop on the floor, he also has blood from his mouth; but not like he bit someone. It's a thin line of blood from the corner of his lip, as if he'd been shot?

 

When the female cop hits Beth, it's not in the room where they had the "greater good conversation", it's by a lot of venetian blinds and a tall file cabinet...as are the scenes with the dead male cop and Carl and Rosita aiming guns.

 

Before the female cop hits Beth, she turns to the right; either she sees something or her two-way on her collar still works and she's hearing something that makes her turn back to Beth very mad.

 

When Abraham is bashing walkers, he is outside a firehouse with glass garage doors, a red truck with red emergency light and I think a bit of a ladder visible. Later you can see Abraham Rosita and Glenn near the front of the truck.

 

Carol doesn't have blood on her face, it's Georgia clay smeared on---like camouflage?

 

In the "death watch scene the group leans against a table with a gold picture frame on the wall, later you see somebody walking up to the bed with a knife, the man's hand belongs to someone with a denim jacket with a zipper. I only know of Rick having a jacket like that...is Rick going to "dispatch" someone?

 

The walker eating a goat? is by a red metal farm gate, same gate in shot of walkers rambling as the group approaches on a dirt road behind them. Do they go back to the farm? For shelter or a brief stop to take Hershel's remains back?

 

Gareth is not having his conversation with Rick. Rick is talking about his family not getting hurt to someone in the church. Gareth is talking to someone unknown. Gareth has a wooden door with glass panes right behind him and walkers can be seen on the other side of the glass salivating. Later, those same walkers can be seen through the same glass panes of double wooden doors with brass handles in a public building made of red brick---not the church.

 

I think when Gareth is saying stuff about you have to come with us and go to Washington and cure this thing...he is meeting someone by that brick building with lots of walkers locked inside,  and snitching out what he heard eavesdropping at the doorway of the church. He's following the group? And ratting what he knows about their plans...possibly to someone that could help Gareth get revenge?
 

I'll use this even though it's the spoilers thread...I think the Termites survived not by cannibalism, but by making a deal with the Saviours to supply victims in return for more normal food (which they don't really have a way to farm).
The Termites lure them in, boxcar A is for arrivals, D for departures, shipped to Negan. The Saviours then trade food, gasoline etc.
Like a Mafia underling, Gareth is now in trouble with his capo---he has lost Terminus (although he obviously escaped alive) the supply chain is wrecked, and the Saviours still want their payoff!
To save his own skin Gareth tracks the group, spies on them from the doorway of the church sanctuary where Rick and Abraham are arguing about plans.
Gareth then goes back to tell what he overheard and where the group is sheltering.

Edited July 30, 2014 by kikismom

[tv echo]

'The Walking Dead': 10 spoilers for Season 5, courtesy of Gale Anne Hurd
http://www.zap2it.com/blogs/the_walking_dead_season_5_spoilers_gale_anne_hurd_interview-2014-08

 

The Walking Dead Season 5 Filming Spoilers: Father Gabriel in Trouble — Limping and Chased?
http://www.wetpaint.com/walking-dead/articles/2014-07-31-season-5-gabriel-trouble-chased

 

'The Walking Dead' season 5: Beth in love triangle with Andrew and Daryl?
http://www.christiantoday.com/article/the.walking.dead.season.5.spoilers.beth.caught.love.triangle.daryl.andrew/39162.htm

Edited August 2, 2014 by tv echo

[kj4ever]

I'll use this even though it's the spoilers thread...I think the Termites survived not by cannibalism, but by making a deal with the Saviours to supply victims in return for more normal food (which they don't really have a way to farm).

The Termites lure them in, boxcar A is for arrivals, D for departures, shipped to Negan. The Saviours then trade food, gasoline etc.

Like a Mafia underling, Gareth is now in trouble with his capo---he has lost Terminus (although he obviously escaped alive) the supply chain is wrecked, and the Saviours still want their payoff!

To save his own skin Gareth tracks the group, spies on them from the doorway of the church sanctuary where Rick and Abraham are arguing about plans.

Gareth then goes back to tell what he overheard and where the group is sheltering.

 

LOVE the spoiler in this post....It will be fascinating if it goes down that way.  I vote kikismom in as a writer for the show!

Edited August 3, 2014 by Dougal
Trimmed quote to the relevant part.

[kikismom]

In the shots of Gareth in front of the double doors, behind him you see walkers behind the glass, but if you look at the shot-by-shot 1;20 to 1;44 on Spoil the Dead, you can see a reflection of the face of a man facing Gareth (especially over the uppermost walker's splayed hand).

Any thoughts on who this looks like?

 

There is a lot of talk about a photo taken of EK walking with a tall young man, in the same scrub suit get-up, with the same type white covering over his right wrist/forearm. That makes 3 people in those uniforms with something going on with the right arm/wrist (including the girl on the gurney). Could it be a pic-line with a cast type bandage? Or what is your spec?

 

Gale Ann Hurd said in an interview that there would be a "sweet surprise" at the end of the Season 5 ep 1.  Many think it is the reunion of Rick and Carl with Judith. But I feel that if the reunion is already given away in the Season 5 trailer, it will hardly come as a surprise to anyone. It could be the long-promised return of Lennie James/ Morgan?  Any other ideas?

[eejm]

Gale Ann Hurd said in an interview that there would be a "sweet surprise" at the end of the Season 5 ep 1.  Many think it is the reunion of Rick and Carl with Judith. But I feel that if the reunion is already given away in the Season 5 trailer, it will hardly come as a surprise to anyone. It could be the long-promised return of Lennie James/ Morgan?  Any other ideas?

 

Scott Gimple said that we'd see Morgan again this season, but I don't think we know which episode or even which part of the season.

[kikismom]

Scott Gimple said that we'd see Morgan again this season, but I don't think we know which episode or even which part of the season.

I'm just skeptical, because Gimple (or Kirkman, I forget) said last season that we would see Morgan then...and it never happened. I sure hope they aren't going to keep stringing us along---I love Lennie James---he was so great in Jericho (one of my faves).

[ikmccall]

I doubt we see Morgan in the first episode. But if they start to travel, I think that's when they meet him.

[kikismom]

Interesting; I prevously questioned if they are seen approaching a red farm gate with walkers nearby could it be Herschel Greene's farm. Now I wonder if before the trek north, do they revisit their early campsites? The farm, RIck's hometown (where he last saw Morgan), maybe even the quarry?

The trailer does show vastly worse deterioration of downtown Atlanta since we saw it last; perhaps a revealing glimpse of what has happened since their "adventures".

(And maybe a sly, rueful wink to the fans---one last glance at important season settings before they---and the story---move on forever?)

"DON'T LOOK BACK"

Edited August 3, 2014 by kikismom

[kj4ever]

I'm just skeptical, because Gimple (or Kirkman, I forget) said last season that we would see Morgan then...and it never happened. I sure hope they aren't going to keep stringing us along---I love Lennie James---he was so great in Jericho (one of my faves).

 

Oh I LOVED that show, still grieve it's passing, and was so excited to see Lennie James!  I so hope he comes back on the show in a more permanent fashion.

 

Also in the comics I read that he was with Michonne which I think would be the biggest bad-ass pairing ever. I know people want her to be with Rick, but I see no sexual chemistry between the two of them, just a brother/sister type relationship.

 

Interesting; I prevously questioned if they are seen approaching a red farm gate with walkers nearby could it be Herschel Greene's farm. Now I wonder if before the trek north, do they revisit their early campsites? The farm, RIck's hometown (where he last saw Morgan), maybe even the quarry?

The trailer does show vastly worse deterioration of downtown Atlanta since we saw it last; perhaps a revealing glimpse of what has happened since their "adventures".

(And maybe a sly, rueful wink to the fans---one last glance at important season settings before they---and the story---move on forever?)

"DON'T LOOK BACK"

 

It does look like Herschel's farm, and it would wrap things up nicely, especially since it seems Rick will be coming to grips with the fact that he is both brutal and humane.

[ArctisTor]

That makes 3 people in those uniforms with something going on with the right arm/wrist (including the girl on the gurney). Could it be a pic-line with a cast type bandage? Or what is your spec?

 

You can see a bite on the wrist of the girl on the gurney on the same arm that's about to get cut off.  My guess is Beth told them all a bite is survivable as long as you amputate the limb quickly enough, as that's what happened to her dad.

 

As others may have pointed out, Beth is actually wearing a cast on her lower arm, not a bandage.  Popular spec is the car that abducted Beth in "Alone" hit her while she was waiting on the road for Daryl and the cast is a result of the injury from that hit.

 

"Sweet" scene I'd guess is Rick and Carl reunited with Judith and Sasha reunited with Tyreese.  Otherwise I'd say its the reveal of wherever that hospital is Beth is being held captive isn't that far from Terminus.  Gale Anne Hurd said there are two big arcs this season, I'd say that's probably Terminus and (Beth with) the cops at the hospital.  It'd make sense whatever final reveal in the ep probably would have something to do with Beth as she's tied with the mysterious savior/abductor cops.

 

The problem with Lennie James back in TWD, despite him saying he's very keen on returning eventually, is he's currently filming a series in the UK.  It's about scheduling.  If he did show up, I can't imagine it would be for very long due to that other commitment.

Edited August 3, 2014 by ArctisTor

[kikismom]

You can see a bite on the wrist of the girl on the gurney on the same arm that's about to get cut off.  My guess is Beth told them all a bite is survivable as long as you amputate the limb quickly enough, as that's what happened to her dad.

 

As others may have pointed out, Beth is actually wearing a cast on her lower arm, not a bandage.  Popular spec is the car that abducted Beth in "Alone" hit her while she was waiting on the road for Daryl and the cast is a result of the injury from that hit.

 

"Sweet" scene I'd guess is Rick and Carl reunited with Judith and Sasha reunited with Tyreese.  Otherwise I'd say its the reveal of wherever that hospital is Beth is being held captive isn't that far from Terminus.  Gale Anne Hurd said there are two big arcs this season, I'd say that's probably Terminus and (Beth with) the cops at the hospital.  It'd make sense whatever final reveal in the ep probably would have something to do with Beth as she's tied with the mysterious savior/abductor cops.

 

The problem with Lennie James back in TWD, despite him saying he's very keen on returning eventually, is he's currently filming a series in the UK.  It's about scheduling.  If he did show up, I can't imagine it would be for very long due to that other commitment.

 

Gale Hurd said it would be a "sweet surprise", not just a sweet scene, and TPTB have released a trailer that shows Rick with Judith and Tyreese with Sasha (in the woods) so I'm hoping for something--anything--bigger for a surprise.

You may be right about Beth's arm being injured by a car; but after the other girl is injured in the exact same area as Beth, and then this guy has the cast-type bandage in the same place, and the same clothes as Beth and the other girl I still suspect it's significant and not just accidental injury.

 

http://allieiswired.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Beth-Greene-Season-5-The-Walking-Dead.jpg

 

It is fun though to debate different possibilities!

[ArctisTor]

It depends on what Gale Anne Hurd would think the general audience would consider a "surprise".  Which could be anything.  We know Judith is reunited with Rick and Beth is alive as that's in the SDCC trailer, but the how of either we don't know yet.  Again, as the Terminus story is already set-up, the story involving the mystery cops still needs to officially be introduced and wouldn't surprise me it might happen in the very first ep. The Beth story alone is already being set-up as one of the bigger stories in S5 alongside Rick's group escaping Terminus and surviving the Termites.

 

I've seen it posited elsewhere that guy walking with Beth is wearing a bandage, but the photo is far away (it was literally taken quickly by a woman stalking around in the bushes at some distance as the security was so damn tight and the woman was still caught) and poor enough quality, he could easily be wearing a white, long sleeve shirt too.  The young black man running behind Beth in the promo is wearing a white, long sleeve undershirt.  The young black man also in scrubs doesn't seem to be wearing a bandage or cast on his right arm either from what I can see.  It doesn't look like the freshly zombified woman, also in the same scrubs, biting the cop's throat out seems to be wearing one either.

 

My guess was the newly zombified woman and the other woman getting her arm cut off attempted to escape together, but as I've suspected the hospital is overrun with walkers in some parts?  Probably as an escape deterrent in the areas the cops can't or won't post guards?  They unsuccessfully attempted to evade or defend themselves from the walkers.  I'd also guess Beth doesn't have the same problem and manages to escape (the image of her running is, what I think, her in the midst of escape).  Except she's either caught by the cops or that's right when the cross cops bring in a very injured Carol.  

 

Filming spoilers during downtown Atlanta filming reported Carol was hit hard by one of the cross cars, she's unconscious and two cops place her in their car and speed off.  Daryl wasn't in the scene anywhere.  A very injured Carol would (conveniently) deter Beth from any further escape attempts as Beth wouldn't be about to abandon Carol there and Carol very likely wouldn't be in any shape to be moved if, as reported, she is hit hard by a car.  When Carol regains consciousness, she'd relay to Beth the search for her and that they'd been close on the trail to find her and it's only a matter of time before a rescue group storms in.  Beth then could only be vigilant for any rescue attempt, prepare any other captives for this eventuality.  Maybe hoard any kind of guns or weapons they can to defend themselves and help Daryl, Rick and posse (Sonequa and Chad Coleman have also been spotted filming with Andrew Lincoln and Reedus recently, all of which at the hospital location).  Beth probably staying by Carol's bedside to defend/protect her and upping the suspense for both.  However, to not get in the crossfire or run into any walkers, it would make the most sense Beth, Carol and any captives awaiting rescue would be holed up in the same place and somewhere it wouldn't be too difficult to move a possibly very injured person (Carol), somewhere defensible/doors barred as best they can from cops and walkers alike.

Edited August 3, 2014 by ArctisTor

[Emily Thrace]

I wonder about the hospital types being the real cannibals because Carol gets captured by them. I've said since halfway through 4b that Carol was going to end up as tainted meat and that would fit with that for me. I can see them giving her a big death to pacify that part of the fanbase or at least justify their decision. In any case I think Carol's capture is the end of the line for her, either she dies trying to save Beth(god to be on tumblr if that happens)  or she sacrifices herself for the group. The only scenario where she lives is if she stays there because she realizes she has no place in the group anymore. (I'm so glad this board is getting more traffic it so nice to be able to discuss Carol without being accused of being fifteen and in love with Norman Reedus. Cuz apparently that's the only reason anyone would dislike Carol, I have rolled my eyes so much this summer I think I developed eyestrain.)

 

I do like that it appears Beth is taking on a more medical role, I always thought that was the best fit for her going forward given her personality.

 

It does look like Herschel's farm, and it would wrap things up nicely, especially since it seems Rick will be coming to grips with the fact that he is both brutal and humane.

 

They're not going back to Hershel's farm filming spoilers have debunked that particular rumor. It could be someplace that's like Herschel's farm though.

 

I doubt we see Morgan in the first episode. But if they start to travel, I think that's when they meet him.

I could see Rick going back home one last time before the leave. To regroup and refuel for their journey if nothing else.