Spoiler Discussion Thread: The Sequel

[calliope1975]

But the FF are fixed, right? I'm so confused. I'd laugh if Oliver's sacrifice was Star City, though, and that's why it's so shitty in the future. 

[Trisha]

8 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

When 710 begins, I expect Felicity to know everything Oliver talked about with the Monitor. EVERYTHING.

From your lips to god’s ears. I’m wondering if whatever he promised/sacrificed to the Monitor somehow ties into the bleak flashforwards? His toast about “appreciating what you have...for however long you have it” makes him sound super pessimistic about the future. 

[scarynikki12]

I think the crossover confirmed that all the DC CW shows will be renewed. Otherwise how can they do Crisis the way it truly needs to be done? 

[apinknightmare]

Just now, Trisha said:

From your lips to god’s ears. I’m wondering if whatever he promised/sacrificed to the Monitor somehow ties into the bleak flashforwards? His toast about “appreciating what you have...for however long you have it” makes him sound super pessimistic about the future. 

It's probably because he agreed to die in Kara and Barry's place. 

[Chaser]

Oliver dying for Barry is my worse nightmare.

[Morrigan2575]

So, you guys think they set up Oliver's forever death for 809? Cause that seems pretty unlikely to me

[lemotomato]

Oliver offering his life for the sake of characters who don’t deserve his sacrifice makes me want to scream “WE JUST WENT THROUGH THIS, YOU DUMBASS’l

Edited December 12, 2018 by lemotomato

[Mary0360]

I didn't watch. What did Oliver promise?

[Mellowyellow]

So how is this going to work on Arrow? He lies to Felicity again but this time he'll be dead for good so they can't work out the same problems again cuz she's a widow?

How are they going to explain the lie to Felicity again? 

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

So, you guys think they set up Oliver's forever death for 809? Cause that seems pretty unlikely to me

No. I think they set up his temporary death in 8X09, but he doesn't know that - idiot, LOL.

ETA just to clarify that idiot = Oliver, as per usual.

Edited December 12, 2018 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

I don’t think it’s forever death, just hiatus death.

Cause we haven’t seen that before.

[Mellowyellow]

I didn't watch so help me out with the facts

Did he just sacrifice himself to save Barry and Kara (Felicity still exists) or was reality warped anyway and he couldn't go home to Felicity and William (they don't exist)?

[insomniadreams88]

1 minute ago, Mary0360 said:

I didn't watch. What did Oliver promise?

We don't know. Just speculating since it was set up that someone has to die in Barry and Kara's places, and while I love Oliver, I don't see how his death would balance out a meta and alien's deaths. 

[Morrigan2575]

2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

No. I think they set up his temporary death in 8X09, but he doesn't know that - idiot, LOL.

Ah, OK. That makes a lot more sense. Way you guys were talking i thought you meant SA departure in 809.

Yeah, I can see that. Anything that happens in crisis will get reverted anyway

Edited December 12, 2018 by Morrigan2575

[JamieLynn832002]

I definitely ended the crossover with the "Oliver, I don't know what your dumb ass just agreed to but I'm pretty sure I need your wife to yell at you" feeling.

[insomniadreams88]

Also, can I just say that the CW promo promised me a 710 trailer on the CW app and it's not there. CW, you lied to me. (I'm assuming it'll be up after the West Coast airing, but the promo did not tell me that, unless I missed it.) 

[apinknightmare]

I wonder how they'd set it up in an even remotely believable fashion - I can't believe we wouldn't get any hints about him in the flash forwards until a full year from now. Unless they tease a cataclysmic rewriting of everything we know to be true and then at the end it's a LOL, JK

[Chaser]

10 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Oliver dying for Barry is my worse nightmare.

Quoting myself because this is a Villain Felicity orgin story I can buy.

[Trisha]

2 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I didn't watch so help me out with the facts

Did he just sacrifice himself to save Barry and Kara (Felicity still exists) or was reality warped anyway and he couldn't go home to Felicity and William (they don't exist)?

Basically he realizes that Barry and Kara are going to die with their current plan of running around the globe to slow time, so while they’re doing it he goes to talk to the Monitor and says “I’m filled with darkness. Barry and Kara are different - they inspire hope.” The Monitor says that if they don’t die “balance must be maintained. One change requires another one. How would you propose I keep the balance?” And then it cuts off and we don’t see what Oliver answered, but Barry and Kara are fine so he sacrificed...something?

[calliope1975]

1 minute ago, Chaser said:

Quoting myself because this is a Villain Felicity orgin story I can buy.

I would watch that show.

[Morrigan2575]

He sacrificed Maya?

[scarynikki12]

It also means we’re not going to see Oliver in the future any time soon. I think he’ll survive but this season’s big reveal will be Felicity and next year’s will be Oliver. I think it will also be Arrow’s last season. 

[Mary0360]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

He sacrificed Maya?

"You must give up your first born daughter. PS your wife's totally pregggers. Mwahaha"

[Mellowyellow]

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

He sacrificed Maya?

But he doesn't have a Maya to sacrifice?

1 minute ago, Mary0360 said:

"You must give up your first born daughter. PS your wife's totally pregggers. Mwahaha"

Well that's going to go down well with Felicity! 

[insomniadreams88]

But I still don't get how Oliver's death would balance out Barry and Kara's. Why would The Monitor accept that deal? Maybe we'll find out that part of it this year on Arrow -- that Oliver's sacrificing himself, and Felicity will know, so we won't repeat the whole "Oliver keeps a big secret from Felicity again" -- but there's a second part to it that they'll only hint at (if that) until next year? 

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

It also means we’re not going to see Oliver in the future any time soon. I think he’ll survive but this season’s big reveal will be Felicity and next year’s will be Oliver. I think it will also be Arrow’s last season. 

The thought of William vaguely and petulantly alluding to the terrible thing that caused this rift between them until late 2019 at the very least makes me want to rip out my eyelashes one by one

[Mary0360]

Honestly I'm not too happy if the stupid flash forwards are all to service next years crossover. Can't Supergirl or Flash get stuck with this crap if that be the case.

[Morrigan2575]

5 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

It also means we’re not going to see Oliver in the future any time soon. I think he’ll survive but this season’s big reveal will be Felicity and next year’s will be Oliver. I think it will also be Arrow’s last season. 

IMO only way Arrow ends in S8 is if SA refuses to sign on for S9. Since he's got nothing else going for him I don't see him quitting any time soon.

[Chaser]

1 minute ago, insomniadreams88 said:

But I still don't get how Oliver's death would balance out Barry and Kara's. Why would The Monitor accept that deal? Maybe we'll find out that part of it this year on Arrow -- that Oliver's sacrificing himself, and Felicity will know, so we won't repeat the whole "Oliver keeps a big secret from Felicity again" -- but there's a second part to it that they'll only hint at (if that) until next year? 

Reminds me of a plot in Angel (I Will Remember You): Angel gets turned human, he and Buffy enjoy sexy bliss, he realizes as a human he can’t help Buffy/innocent lives so he visits these Gods and begs for them to turn him back sacrificing his happiness with Buffy. They recognize that makes him more then lower being and agree to turn him back.

I’m thinking Monitor sees a similar thing in Oliver.

[Guest]

IDK what has happened but can I ignore it? 😂

[Chaser]

Just now, Angel12d said:

IDK what has happened but can I ignore it? 😂

For about a year.

[JJ928]

Could Crisis take place in the future? Maybe Nora messes up the timeline and Crisis happens later?

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, JJ928 said:

Could Crisis take place in the future? Maybe Nora messes up the timeline and Crisis happens later?

As in they just set next year's crossover sometime in the future? Maybe, but my guess is probably not. 

[Primal Slayer]

Why does TheCW tell us to go to the CW app to view the trailers for all the shows only for them not to be uploaded....

[Morrigan2575]

BTW don't Supergirl and Flash/Barry Allen die in Crisis? 

[BkWurm1]

29 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

So, you guys think they set up Oliver's forever death for 809? Cause that seems pretty unlikely to me

 

24 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I wonder how they'd set it up in an even remotely believable fashion - I can't believe we wouldn't get any hints about him in the flash forwards until a full year from now. Unless they tease a cataclysmic rewriting of everything we know to be true and then at the end it's a LOL, JK

It's the rewriting thing that I wonder about.  I think they will have us believe he will die but they will find a way around that while still demanding a sacrifice of some kind.  And that opens all kinds of awful.  Though on the other hand, maybe they could just erase  Star City's future then.  

4 minutes ago, JJ928 said:

Could Crisis take place in the future? Maybe Nora messes up the timeline and Crisis happens later?

I'm thinking earlier.  

[JJ928]

@apinknightmare I know it's unlikely, but doesn't Barry die in Crisis (though on Flash he just disappears)? Let's be real, they're not gonna kill off any of the heroes permanently. So I was wondering if it could be set in the future, since Arrow already is doing FF, and Flash has Nora from the future.

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, JJ928 said:

@apinknightmare I know it's unlikely, but doesn't Barry die in Crisis (though on Flash he just disappears)? 

I'm curious whether Oliver doing this changes any of that. 

[Mary0360]

17 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

But he doesn't have a Maya to sacrifice?

Well that's going to go down well with Felicity! 

I was just making a joke lol. But I think that would end Oliver for me if he sacrificed his daughter for Barry and Kara unbeknownst to Felicity.

 

Im going to assume he either sacrificed Star City or himself. Which is still a pretty crappy thing to do for people he barely spends time with (and don't deserve it and probably wouldn't do the same for him).

[Mrs. de Winter]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

BTW don't Supergirl and Flash/Barry Allen die in Crisis? 

From what I have read, yes (supposedly hundreds die).  Which was a selling point for me.  And I laughed when I read the explanation for Barry's death was that they thought he was a boring character.  

I am so tired of the constant manipulation of Arrow and who Oliver is in the service of these stupid crossovers.  The only thing more tiring is the constant let's keep important stuff from Felicity.  I don't think I can ignore Oliver not telling Felicity the truth again.

[apinknightmare]

I'm over Oliver keeping secrets, but I'm morbidly curious about how revealing this one would turn out. "I gave myself up to save Barry and Kara's lives and the entire multiverse as we know it, and btw I think maybe I might be dying soon? IDK"

[scarynikki12]

I think Oliver sacrificing whatever (years off his life I’m guessing) saved Barry and Kara from Crisis deaths. I agree that he won’t die in the Crisis (or get revived if he does) but I expect we’ll see the collateral damage in the form of supporting and guest characters. And the doppelgängers from the multiverse. 

[BkWurm1]

5 minutes ago, Mary0360 said:

I was just making a joke lol. But I think that would end Oliver for me if he sacrificed his daughter for Barry and Kara unbeknownst to Felicity.

 

Im going to assume he either sacrificed Star City or himself. Which is still a pretty crappy thing to do for people he barely spends time with (and don't deserve it and probably wouldn't do the same for him).

To be fair, he was trying to keep Bara and Kara alive so they could save the world again when the "greater" threat shows up soon.  So whatever his sacrifice was more about saving the world and those that he loved in it, than just trading his SOMETHING for their lives.  

[Primal Slayer]

Since Superman probably wont be getting his own show, instead of Oliver dying I say kill Supes as a replacement to them killing Supergirl in the comics.

[Chaser]

1 minute ago, scarynikki12 said:

I think Oliver sacrificing whatever (years off his life I’m guessing) saved Barry and Kara from Crisis deaths. I agree that he won’t die in the Crisis (or get revived if he does) but I expect we’ll see the collateral damage in the form of supporting and guest characters. And the doppelgängers from the multiverse. 

I nominate Dinah, Rene, Curtis and Black Siren. 

[Mrs. de Winter]

1 minute ago, scarynikki12 said:

but I expect we’ll see the collateral damage in the form of supporting and guest characters.

I offer any and every member of NTA as tributes (but seriously Dinah first)!   And no give backs! 

[BkWurm1]

5 minutes ago, Mrs. de Winter said:

From what I have read, yes (supposedly hundreds die).  Which was a selling point for me.  And I laughed when I read the explanation for Barry's death was that they thought he was a boring character.  

I am so tired of the constant manipulation of Arrow and who Oliver is in the service of these stupid crossovers.  The only thing more tiring is the constant let's keep important stuff from Felicity.  I don't think I can ignore Oliver not telling Felicity the truth again.

Odd, this is one time where I could kind of understand him not saying anything.  If there really isn't anything to do about it, it would be hard to knowingly cast that pall over whatever time is left.    

[Mellowyellow]

Just now, BkWurm1 said:

Odd, this is one time where I could kind of understand him not saying anything.  If there really isn't anything to do about it, it would be hard to knowingly cast that pall over whatever time is left.    

Now will he mope in this time left with her or is he going to be oddly cheerful! 

[scarynikki12]

1 minute ago, BkWurm1 said:

Odd, this is one time where I could kind of understand him not saying anything.  If there really isn't anything to do about it, it would be hard to knowingly cast that pall over whatever time is left.    

I agree. I don’t think it’ll be secret for too long (next fall at the latest to set up Crisis if nothing else) but I get where he’s coming from if he doesn’t tell anyone. He’s probably hoping that he goes out a hero and no one will ever know. 

[Guest]

This is another reason the FF suck. Without them I could've had hope for like a whole year that some of NTA would die in the next crossover but alas, it's not meant to be. 😢😂