Roswell, New Mexico Spoilers and Speculation

[phoenics]

1 minute ago, ParadoxLost said:

Wyatt coming after Liz and Grant Green creates a lot of questions.

Outside of a scenario where he was mind controlled just that once because of proximity to Grant Green's place some stuff now doesn't make a lot of sense retroactively.

If he has some knowledge of what really happened with Rosa that night then what was his real motive for shooting up the Crashdown /Liz?  Was he aiming at Liz?  Was he aiming at Max?  Did he specifically target them when they were together? Was he in control of himself or was someone else?

Yeah - I was thinking about that too - but wondered if I was going just a little too crazy with my theory, lol.

But thinking about it logically - if he wasn't mind-controlled, then that means he knows that Rosa had nothing to do with what happened to his sister.  That she was killed too and didn't kill his sister in a car crash.

And his "All you had to do was not talk!  I shoulda known!" makes it sound like he WANTS to keep all of that secret.  Why?

And if that's the case - he has no motive for shooting up the Crashdown Cafe - unless it was just to keep the ruse going.  But WHY keep the ruse going?

I can only think of two reasons:  1) Wyatt is an alien and 2) another alien is mind-controlling him.

[ParadoxLost]

5 minutes ago, phoenics said:

And his "All you had to do was not talk!  I shoulda known!" makes it sound like he WANTS to keep all of that secret.  Why?

And if that's the case - he has no motive for shooting up the Crashdown Cafe - unless it was just to keep the ruse going.  But WHY keep the ruse going?

I can only think of two reasons:  1) Wyatt is an alien and 2) another alien is mind-controlling him.

The human explanation is that Wyatt was recruited by some shadowy alien hunter/government organization after his sister's death and they know a lot about Max and have credible suspicions and shot Liz to force Max into exposing himself.

But that kind of flies in the face of wanted to keep things covered up.  Maybe they thought the shooting at Liz / Max while they were alone at the Crashdown was a controlled enough situation that it would confirm something for them (like Max is an alien) but not let the secret (that aliens are real) out to the world.

Although that all begs the question of why they wouldn't just disappear M/M/I if they suspected since murder isn't a big deal to them.

I'm also still wondering if "Rosa" stopping Isobel's mind control at the drive in was a manifestation of Isobel's psyche or if another alien put a "Rosa" firewall in Liz's brain.

[phoenics]

7 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

The human explanation is that Wyatt was recruited by some shadowy alien hunter/government organization after his sister's death and they know a lot about Max and have credible suspicions and shot Liz to force Max into exposing himself.

But that kind of flies in the face of wanted to keep things covered up.  Maybe they thought the shooting at Liz / Max while they were alone at the Crashdown was a controlled enough situation that it would confirm something for them (like Max is an alien) but not let the secret (that aliens are real) out to the world.

Although that all begs the question of why they wouldn't just disappear M/M/I if they suspected since murder isn't a big deal to them.

I'm also still wondering if "Rosa" stopping Isobel's mind control at the drive in was a manifestation of Isobel's psyche or if another alien put a "Rosa" firewall in Liz's brain.

If Wyatt knows about the aliens (there is no way they could suspect Max and NOT suspect Michael and Isobel), then Wyatt's "What the hell?" reaction when Michael used his powers to fling Max away from him doesn't track, imo.

And here's the thing - Project Shepherd IS the shadowy alien hunter/government organization - so why doesn't Manes seem to know ANYTHING?  He's clueless.  

Unless that org is a sham and there's a real one?  I could go with that...  maybe?

But Wyatt seemed to truly hate Liz and her family and blamed them.  If he knows aliens exist then  - ?  Unless the group didn't tell him about the alien part?  But then him going all crazy on Grant Green and Liz still makes no sense.  As Max said, he's a coward.  He might know he can get away with hurting Arturo because he's undocumented, but Liz?  Grant?  Nah - the cops would be all over that.

I just don't think this has a human solution - I don't want it to have one either - this is Roswell.  If Rosa's death doesn't lead to the existence of more aliens, I'm gonna be really mad.  To me, this leading to a reveal of another government agency would be lame as hell and ground already trodden to death by the OG series.  Plus we already know about Project Shepherd - which is a government alien hunting org.

Heh - maybe Manes is the alien, lol.

[ParadoxLost]

2 minutes ago, phoenics said:

And here's the thing - Project Shepherd IS the shadowy alien hunter/government organization - so why doesn't Manes seem to know ANYTHING?  He's clueless.  

He has been banned form joining for using "Ancestors" one time to many, which was one time, to try to recruit people to his cause.  So instead he is being used as a distraction from the real org like Grant Green (I want to type Green Giant every time I type that name)

[phoenics]

28 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

He has been banned form joining for using "Ancestors" one time to many, which was one time, to try to recruit people to his cause.  So instead he is being used as a distraction from the real org like Grant Green (I want to type Green Giant every time I type that name)

He does seem to be in the alien bunker all by himself, lol.  That's why he had to recruit Cam.

I dunno - I just don't buy that this doesn't involve another alien hiding in plain sight somewhere.  Isobel's blackouts mean something and it's not anything to do with a super secret gov agency - unless they found someway to "fake" abduct her like Lois was in that Lois & Clark episode.  Which I completely doubt - unless they've been studying an alien in captivity and the blackouts are the result of experiments on that alien and Isobel's blackouts are them experimenting on her to do stuff for them.  The only issue is - this doesn't tie all of the elements together for me.  Too many loose ends to force this into a "only humans are responsible" scenario.

The showrunner said that this Rosa thing is a mystery thread for the whole season - and I can't see the big reveal at the end of all of this being "surprise!  There's a new, real secret alien hunting organization - no, not Project Shepherd - something else!" 

What doesn't work for you with the mind-control and another alien theories?

[ParadoxLost]

7 hours ago, phoenics said:

What doesn't work for you with the mind-control and another alien theories?

Nothing really.  I'm more of a mind that there are two factions at work  (maybe three ) and some of the separate actions are being conflated into a "big bad". Some lines will strike me as "that doesn't fit a single theory" so then I go to Occam's razor.  If something doesn't quite fit the another alien theory and we know for sure there is an alien hunting/government aspect to this show with Manes, then maybe there is more to that than we know.

Another alien is definitely involved in the situation with Isobel and Rosa's death.

But there have been some things that feel more like non- alien cover up for nefarious purposes.  Like all the doctors who knew about the crash being killed.  Is this alien long lived and seeking revenge?  Will he be CW young when revealed?  (Sorry digressing)

With Wyatt, the questions he was asking didn't lend to the idea that he was given a "suggestion" that he had to complete.  He didn't go robotically to try to murder GG and Liz.  He was doing exactly what GG was afraid of, silencing people.  He was asking Liz what she knew and who she told.  Why do that if under mind control unless another alien is wearing him as a suit?  But I have to think if that ever happens, there will be a "wrongness" to it and I saw no hints of that.  With Wyatt, I'm on the fence of mind control/alien or human alien hunter.

Edited February 14, 2019 by ParadoxLost

[Sakura12]

I agree usually with mind control they show something is slightly off about the person. Wyatt looked in control, which leads me to believe he's an alien or part of the conspiracy/cover up. Grant said people are after him to keep quiet and then someone shows up to keep him quiet. To me it looked like he was under surveillance. Maybe Wyatt thinks Rosa was an alien and his telling Liz and her father to go back to where they came from meant their planet. 

With Isobel her blackouts and not knowing what happened leads more to the side effects of mind control. 

Or maybe Isobel is being used by another alien for her mind control abilities. She could've been the one to send Wyatt after Grant and Liz. That's why she has no memories of the whole day. She was Wyatt. 

[Cristofle]

On 2/13/2019 at 8:27 AM, phoenics said:

I think there is going to be a combination Elsevan/Nicholas character and right now, my money is on Noah or Wyatt. Wyatt seems obvious because he came for Liz and Grant, but that's TOO easy!  I think Wyatt was being mind controlled by another alien.  He could also be an alien - but I still think he's being mind controlled.  He's now been shot though, so we'd find out pretty fast if he wasn't human.

But Noah knew Liz was going to see Grant Green - because he sent her there.  I think Noah is going to be some combo of Elsevan and Nicholas.  He's playing the part of the dutiful husband - but I just don't think that's it.  It's too simple and just leaves dead weight to be killed off at some point.  Plus - I cannot explain that weird and random meeting with Liz and Noah - I think he was looking for Grant Green already and just happened to come across Liz there because she was looking for Grant too.  I think he knows Liz was shot and Max healed her.  I think he knows just about everything.

The only question is what's his endgame?

Oh wow, you are correct. Noah knew exactly where Liz was going. The things I don't tie together when I'm watching the episode late at night after a long day at work and a long evening working on school stuff. That definitely puts him higher on the suspect list. 

[phoenics]

33 minutes ago, Cristofle said:

Oh wow, you are correct. Noah knew exactly where Liz was going. The things I don't tie together when I'm watching the episode late at night after a long day at work and a long evening working on school stuff. That definitely puts him higher on the suspect list. 

I also think there is some kind of transportation (from a wormhole) happening to her at the end of her blackouts - that's how the symbol was on the dirt patch Isobel woke up on.  I mention it in the episode thread.

[Cristofle]

So this gif from the promo may give some credence to my suspicion that Liz and Max meant a lot more to each other than Liz remembers. That or Max needs therapy immediately, lol. Or possibly both.

[Sakura12]

At most they may have had something going on for the 2 weeks before everything happened. Then Liz leaving without saying goodbye to a guy she spent 2 weeks with in high school is not that big a deal. Max whining about it being abandonment is a bit much. 

That was 10 years ago. Still it looks like Max was way more into her then she was to him. His looks more like obessison than love.

Plus Max saying he trusts Liz and she won't tell anyone their secret, then she immediately goes and tells someone the second she got mad at him. I completely see why Michael and Isobel don't trust his judgment when it comes to Liz. 

[Cristofle]

44 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

At most they may have had something going on for the 2 weeks before everything happened. Then Liz leaving without saying goodbye to a guy she spent 2 weeks with in high school is not that big a deal. Max whining about it being abandonment is a bit much. 

That was 10 years ago. Still it looks like Max was way more into her then she was to him. His looks more like obessison than love.

Plus Max saying he trusts Liz and she won't tell anyone their secret, then she immediately goes and tells someone the second she got mad at him. I completely see why Michael and Isobel don't trust his judgment when it comes to Liz. 

As teenagers, I agree that he seems way more into her (although I guess that would change with the secret flashbacks - I'm distracted by Nathan's scruff-free face though). As adults, she seemed pretty hysterical when he got shot and I was a little surprised. I mean, Max and Liz have always started hard and fast, lol, especially in the books - I do remember she was telling him she was in love with him by the end of the first book even though they were casual friends at the beginning of it. 

[Sakura12]

I think I'd be hysterical if someone I knew got shot trying to save me. That doesn't mean I'm in love with them, it means I just watched someone get shot in front of me. 

[shantown]

1 hour ago, Cristofle said:

So this gif from the promo may give some credence to my suspicion that Liz and Max meant a lot more to each other than Liz remembers. That or Max needs therapy immediately, lol. Or possibly both.

There better be, otherwise Max being infatuated with his high school not-girlfriend for this long is just creepy and sad!

[Cristofle]

40 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

I think I'd be hysterical if someone I knew got shot trying to save me. That doesn't mean I'm in love with them, it means I just watched someone get shot in front of me. 

I definitely agree, but I don't think that's what the tone of the scene was going for, it was more like she was terrified to lose him. I'm not sure how the writers are viewing the tone of Liz's scenes though, because I'm also not sure it was supposed to look bad that she stole stuff from Kyle's box. 

I was TOTALLY weirded out by Max's language in the scene with Isobel and Michael this past episode, so I hope at least something more than we know happened. 

[Sakura12]

It was still only 2 weeks though. That's all Isobel seemed to have erased or changed. Kyle was Liz's boyfriend all through high school at least until prom which is usually the last week or so. 

Max becoming obsessed with Liz because she was nice to him, is a whole issue in itself. It's not helping that all he talks about are his feelings for her whenever they are together. Its putting off warning bells in my head and making it uncomfortable to watch for me. 

[tessaray]

I'm willing to give Max the benefit of the doubt for a bit longer. We don't know how the aliens process emotions and the events of 10 years ago obviously ended in trauma for a lot of people. If humans can still be dealing with the fallout, why not the aliens too?

That said, it can be a bit cringe-y to watch.

[Cristofle]

Yeah, I'm willing to acknowledge these were all kids who appeared to be pretty badly traumatized (right now though, I think I feel the worst for Liz's dad - he seems like a nice guy, he really loved Rosa, she's actually the product of an affair, and all the crap he's been getting for the circumstances of Rosa's death for all these years seems to be completely unjustified) and it damaged them in numerous ways. I don't think Max is completely in his own feelings or he would have gone for Liz in the pilot instead of saying he couldn't because he wasn't sure if it was his feelings or hers. But he definitely has built this relationship way, way, WAY up in his head. That said, I am interested in what Liz doesn't remember. She didn't seem to be that into Kyle in the flashback with Rosa, even though she lost her virginity to him. 

[phoenics]

Max has loved Liz his whole life - if she returned any of his feelings - that was enough.  He was about to leave town to follow her - I think that's what happened.  I think they planned for Max to go with Liz and then Liz just left (because Isobel mindwarped her).  I think they were a lot closer than anyone thought - a lot can happen in 2 weeks for high school kids.

[Sakura12]

Saw the episode title for the next one and come on that's the last song I want stuck in my head. Lol

Rosa probably found out about her true parentage and that made her spiral more out of control. Her betrayal speech could've been about Aurturo or the mother.

Of course seeing a bedroom in a secret underground bunker in an isolated cabin in the desert is all kinds of creepy, Jim Valenti. Even if you were trying to help.

[Regalbegal]

I am most curious to see how they try to make this "definitely look in their mid-late 20s" cast approximate teenagers.  Clearly with Max the dopey backwards baseball cap is supposed to be a shorthand for "younger".  

[KittenPokerCheater]

4 hours ago, Regalbegal said:

I am most curious to see how they try to make this "definitely look in their mid-late 20s" cast approximate teenagers.  Clearly with Max the dopey backwards baseball cap is supposed to be a shorthand for "younger".  

Vasoline on the lens.  Soft, soft focus.  Lots of moisturizing makeup.  And unfortunate fashion choices?

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

6 hours ago, Regalbegal said:

I am most curious to see how they try to make this "definitely look in their mid-late 20s" cast approximate teenagers.  Clearly with Max the dopey backwards baseball cap is supposed to be a shorthand for "younger".  

Vasoline on the lens.  Soft, soft focus.  Lots of moisturizing makeup.  And unfortunate fashion choices?

Botox?

[phoenics]

16 hours ago, Regalbegal said:

I am most curious to see how they try to make this "definitely look in their mid-late 20s" cast approximate teenagers.  Clearly with Max the dopey backwards baseball cap is supposed to be a shorthand for "younger".  

They're using CGI a bit.  They're photoshopping their beards/lines/etc away.  It must have taken forever to go frame by frame for some of these scenes.

[shapeshifter]

11 hours ago, phoenics said:

They're using CGI a bit.  They're photoshopping their beards/lines/etc away.  It must have taken forever to go frame by frame for some of these scenes.

Ah. So is that why it's airing a week later? I mean, are they CGI-ing as we type?

[phoenics]

25 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Ah. So is that why it's airing a week later? I mean, are they CGI-ing as we type?

LOL - no - the whole season was shot a while ago.  And the CW controls the schedule, not the show.

[Cristofle]

On 2/16/2019 at 8:45 AM, phoenics said:

They're using CGI a bit.  They're photoshopping their beards/lines/etc away.  It must have taken forever to go frame by frame for some of these scenes.

Yeah, I know Carina said they CGI-ed Nathan's facial hair away in the pilot. I think they did ask him to shave for this episode and other flashbacks. They appear to have Isobel in a somewhat unconvincing wig, lol.

[phoenics]

Okay - so I know I'm wearing ya'll out with my theories, but I have a new one and I think this really might be it.  ParadoxLost - I think you've convinced me about Noah... I'm just not clear on the 2nd shady gov org, but anyway... here is my theory (c/p from my original post on reddit - I'm phoenics1908 there):

Quote

So Noah being an alien who can mind-control others was my theory. But I'm stretching my mind for new ideas and now I have a new theory (though Noah is still suspicious in my mind). I have another person who could also be alien and who no one would ever suspect.

Grant Green.

Yes. I know he's "dead", but bear with me.

1. I think he called the police with the video of the floating girls could just to cover his arse - to give himself plausible deniability. That's the night his "fake news" alter ego was born.
2. He's the ONE person other than the podsquad and those girls that we KNOW was at the turquoise mines that night near the cave.
3. All the people "dying" who knew about the aliens - that could easily be him killing them all so he could stay in plain sight. Think about it: Wyatt showed up saying EXACTLY what GG needed him to say to corroborate his "story" to Liz. GG mind-controlled Wyatt?
4. Liz investigating and tying his video to something real happening and not just chalking it up as "fake news" may have spooked him enough to finally decide to fake his own death and go undercover as someone else (can he shapeshift?).
5. I've suspected that his alien protection bracelet with the green stone in it actually is real and the stone is one of the Stones of Midnight. In the books, when you gather enough of them, you can a) mind control, b) open wormholes and c) not die - even when you are blown apart to nothing but scraps of your body. This would explain Isobel's blackouts, her waking up in a dirt pile with an alien symbol like she was transported there through a small wormhole, and her lost time. It would also explain how Grant might not be dead and that he mind-controlled Wyatt to attack them both.
6. Grant Green's counterpart in the books is Elsevan DuPris. He was another alien who used the cover of his little fake news alien "newspaper" to appear like a cook so no one would suspect him. His whole purpose was to get ahold of the rest of the stones of midnight so he could get off the planet and go back home.
7. About Noah: If it is GG and not Noah doing the mind-control, then I agree ParadoxLost that means Noah is like some kind of secret agent possibly working with an FBI or CIA special team (since Manes seems to have no staff, no funding and no intel - he has to blackmail folks to get help, lol). I wonder if Manes tried to get funding using that picture of Rosa, but instead of giving it to him, the FBI/CIA just formed up their own group?  Maybe Noah was assigned to observe Isobel, but fell for her anyway. And either he could be working with Wyatt and tipped him off to Liz arriving up there, or he didn't and Grant mind controlled Wyatt to come up there and Noah's involvement is just a coincidence. BUT he's still shady - just secret alien hunting group shady and not alien shady.
8. There are more than 4 aliens - I think there are several we'll meet over the course of the show. Also - I'm nursing a theory that Liz's mom was an alien. Both Liz's mom and Rosa could "hear voices" - so either they tapped into some telepathy or there's something alien going on there.
9.  

Edited February 17, 2019 by phoenics

[Cristofle]

I was really surprised at how quickly they killed off Grant, so I would consider it possible he's not actually dead. IIRC, the reason Elsevan was so effective was because he'd been around town for years and no one took him seriously, just like Grant. 

In case anyone wasn't aware, Carina is very active on Twitter and often answers questions about Roswell whenever she has a moment:

Carina's Twitter

An interesting question she answered in the past couple days was that Isobel and Noah have been married for a long time. If Noah isn't what he appears, is he playing a long game with her? If so, is there a reason he just changed the stakes by leaving her or at least threatening to leave her? 

[ellieart]

On 2/15/2019 at 3:16 PM, Regalbegal said:

I am most curious to see how they try to make this "definitely look in their mid-late 20s" cast approximate teenagers.  Clearly with Max the dopey backwards baseball cap is supposed to be a shorthand for "younger".  

Based on the pictures and the promo...it's not convincing even with the CGI-ing and hair.  Why does Max have "Dawson Leery" hair in 2008?  They're 10 years too late for that.

9 hours ago, phoenics said:

Okay - so I know I'm wearing ya'll out with my theories, but I have a new one and I think this really might be it.  ParadoxLost - I think you've convinced me about Noah... I'm just not clear on the 2nd shady gov org, but anyway... here is my theory (c/p from my original post on reddit - I'm phoenics1908 there):

I love the theory on Grant Green.  I'm not so much convinced about Noah, but Grant absolutely.  I feel like there was too much information given about him in the last episode for him to already be dead.  I think he's important and from day one I thought he could end up this show's version of Elsevan DuPris.

[phoenics]

1 hour ago, Cristofle said:

I was really surprised at how quickly they killed off Grant, so I would consider it possible he's not actually dead. IIRC, the reason Elsevan was so effective was because he'd been around town for years and no one took him seriously, just like Grant. 

In case anyone wasn't aware, Carina is very active on Twitter and often answers questions about Roswell whenever she has a moment:

Carina's Twitter

An interesting question she answered in the past couple days was that Isobel and Noah have been married for a long time. If Noah isn't what he appears, is he playing a long game with her? If so, is there a reason he just changed the stakes by leaving her or at least threatening to leave her? 

Yeah - my next question was gonna be - when did Noah show up in Roswell? If it was just after Rosa's death, then I really think that fits with the theory that he's an agent sent to Roswell to investigate for aliens by any means necessary.  I still think Liz's mom fits into this somehow - but I just don't know how... whether she's alien or not.  And there's still Valenti and his connection to Liz's mom and Rosa... 

Elesevan was terrifying, btw.  The podsquad had a hard time killing him because he had the Stone of Midnight and could basically put himself back together.  So he was unstoppable.

[ParadoxLost]

11 hours ago, phoenics said:

About Noah: If it is GG and not Noah doing the mind-control, then I agree ParadoxLost that means Noah is like some kind of secret agent possibly working with an FBI or CIA special team (since Manes seems to have no staff, no funding and no intel - he has to blackmail folks to get help, lol). I wonder if Manes tried to get funding using that picture of Rosa, but instead of giving it to him, the FBI/CIA just formed up their own group?  Maybe Noah was assigned to observe Isobel, but fell for her anyway. And either he could be working with Wyatt and tipped him off to Liz arriving up there, or he didn't and Grant mind controlled Wyatt to come up there and Noah's involvement is just a coincidence. BUT he's still shady - just secret alien hunting group shady and not alien shady.

I'm leaning towards military and private.

There is something about  how they are presenting Manes and the shared history with Valenti that makes me think that their fathers ran a military project in the years after the crash but it eventually got shutdown / unfunded because they believed all the aliens had died in or after the crash.  And Manes is just carrying on a familial obsession with no actual organization behind him.  

Frankly, my Noah theory may literally only exist because there is something evoking Orphan Black for me in the fear about being dissected and about Isobel and Noah's relationship (more Allison/Donny than Sarah/Paul).  So I'm going with Evil Corp wanting to find aliens to study them to make money.  Also, given the track record that  random characters are not throwaway characters and are actually part of the mystery.  I'm calling it now.  Liz's new boss is a dissector of aliens and part of Evil Corp. 

[shapeshifter]

3 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

Frankly, my Noah theory may literally only exist because there is something evoking Orphan Black for me in the fear about being dissected and about Isobel and Noah's relationship (more Allison/Donny than Sarah/Paul).  So I'm going with Evil Corp wanting to find aliens to study them to make money.  Also, given the track record that  random characters are not throwaway characters and are actually part of the mystery.  I'm calling it now.  Liz's new boss is a dissector of aliens and part of Evil Corp. 

Heh, yes, ever since you suggested that Noah and Isobel may have a relationship like on Orphan Black, I can't unthink the possibility. 
And now: "Evil Corp" a la Mr. Robot!

[kj4ever]

11 hours ago, ellieart said:

Based on the pictures and the promo...it's not convincing even with the CGI-ing and hair.  Why does Max have "Dawson Leery" hair in 2008?  They're 10 years too late for that.

I love the theory on Grant Green.  I'm not so much convinced about Noah, but Grant absolutely.  I feel like there was too much information given about him in the last episode for him to already be dead.  I think he's important and from day one I thought he could end up this show's version of Elsevan DuPris.

The real question is why does Max have Dawson hair in 2019?  His hair is almost as distracting as Isobel's mole.

[ellieart]

6 hours ago, kj4ever said:

The real question is why does Max have Dawson hair in 2019?  His hair is almost as distracting as Isobel's mole.

He's still so stunted because of his feeeeeelings.

Also...super distracting.  That mixed with her facial expressions and I have a hard time focusing.

Edited February 18, 2019 by ellieart

[KittenPokerCheater]

A alien who lived in the bunker and hid a piece of the ship behind drywall (which is hard to image given that the thing was built underground).  Stranger things have happened.  You think they would have stored acetone down there for him/her.

My new theory is that some alien was possessing Isabel, so while someone can argue that technically she killed the girls, it wasn't her.  I hope I am wrong, though.  It seems like an easy way out- but this is television, not rocket science.

I also looked up the episode titles on imdb, and based on this, I've grassy knolled that Michael is making alien jet fuel so he can fly to what he thinks is home.  (Hence the whole are you cooking meth thing). In other words, I have waaay to much time on my hands these days.

[Cristofle]

Something else Carina said about Michael on Twitter that might come up in subsequent episodes is that he is essentially a nail polish alcoholic - he always has it in his system, which is why he doesn't vomit when he uses his powers. 

I hope a future episode explains how they figured this out, lol. It makes sense they might have tasted Tabasco and realized it helped the food for them, but how did they think to DRINK nail polish? 

[phoenics]

1 hour ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

A alien who lived in the bunker and hid a piece of the ship behind drywall (which is hard to image given that the thing was built underground).  Stranger things have happened.  You think they would have stored acetone down there for him/her.

My new theory is that some alien was possessing Isabel, so while someone can argue that technically she killed the girls, it wasn't her.  I hope I am wrong, though.  It seems like an easy way out- but this is television, not rocket science.

I also looked up the episode titles on imdb, and based on this, I've grassy knolled that Michael is making alien jet fuel so he can fly to what he thinks is home.  (Hence the whole are you cooking meth thing). In other words, I have waaay to much time on my hands these days.

I think it's a foregone conclusion that Isobel was mindcontrolled - if you read through the thread you'll find us theorizing over whether it's Noah, Wyatt or - newest theory - Grant Green.  

Also - if it was an alien in the bunker, then they could have easily manipulated the space behind the wall to store something there with their powers.

39 minutes ago, Cristofle said:

Something else Carina said about Michael on Twitter that might come up in subsequent episodes is that he is essentially a nail polish alcoholic - he always has it in his system, which is why he doesn't vomit when he uses his powers. 

I hope a future episode explains how they figured this out, lol. It makes sense they might have tasted Tabasco and realized it helped the food for them, but how did they think to DRINK nail polish? 

Maybe it smelled good to them?  In the books they drank mouthwash.

[ParadoxLost]

17 minutes ago, phoenics said:

Also - if it was an alien in the bunker, then they could have easily manipulated the space behind the wall to store something there with their powers.

I think that Valenti hid the piece of the ship.  Seems more likely that Valenti left clues for Alex and/or Kyle to find it than an alien would have hidden it and then left a mark on the lampshade that matched Valenti's key chain.. 

[phoenics]

54 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

I think that Valenti hid the piece of the ship.  Seems more likely that Valenti left clues for Alex and/or Kyle to find it than an alien would have hidden it and then left a mark on the lampshade that matched Valenti's key chain.. 

Good point.

I agree that Valenti hid it.  I don't think he was as "down" with Manes as he started out being.  It looks like he might have started off being on Manes' team, but then defected - maybe he did become involved with an alien.  Helped one?

I know we've speculated about Liz's mom and Rosa - but I hope they're still human and there is another explanation for Liz's mom's disappearance.  It's very suspicious though that she left at the same time Rosa died.  And I can't forget the tidbit that both Rosa and Liz's mom "heard voices" - so much so that Liz thinks that's what drove Rosa to drugs.

I do think that Rosa found out she was Valenti's daughter and that's why she gave Liz that speech about having a cage around your heart - she found out her mother cheated on her dad with Valenti?

Man - this show started off so slow and then BAM!  Speculator's paradise!

[ParadoxLost]

9 minutes ago, phoenics said:

I agree that Valenti hid it.  I don't think he was as "down" with Manes as he started out being.  It looks like he might have started off being on Manes' team, but then defected - maybe he did become involved with an alien.  Helped one?

I think that is probably true.  I'm not sure there is anything that really points to that or if I'm just projecting fondness for OGValenti on this deceased Valenti.  I think its encouraging that he tried to help Rosa and Alex.

10 minutes ago, phoenics said:

I know we've speculated about Liz's mom and Rosa - but I hope they're still human and there is another explanation for Liz's mom's disappearance.  It's very suspicious though that she left at the same time Rosa died.  And I can't forget the tidbit that both Rosa and Liz's mom "heard voices" - so much so that Liz thinks that's what drove Rosa to drugs.

New theory because I like to cover every base.  What if Liz's Mom "heard voices" because Rosa was speaking telepathically and by the time Rosa was old enough that they could figure it out the Mother was considered schizophrenic or something and Rosa was self medicating because she feared she was too..  M/M/I had some idea that they were aliens when they left the pods.  Rosa was an infant and alone, and if she is an alien there is no reason to expect she would figure that out if her power was something like mental communication.

Completely non serious how did Rosa get the hand print speculation. She accidentally face palmed herself while watching Max try to fumble his way through declaring his feelings to her sister.

24 minutes ago, phoenics said:

Man - this show started off so slow and then BAM!  Speculator's paradise!

I'm not sure if that is true or if a handful of us are just channeling our inner teenager.  Next thing you know, Honda is going to have Jem or a care bear sell me a car.

[theschnauzers]

This episode brought a realization to me that Max, Michael, and Isabel are going to end up with a human support team by the end of this season who will know their truth, or at least that they are aliens and will make the fight against the military and the inevitable others more even. My guess is this will be Liz, Kyle and Alex at a minimum, at least for Max and Michael. Not sure where Isabel human connections other than possibly Noah even can fit in, if she has any.

The Kyle Alex dynamic in this episode was quite interesting to say the least. So we now have all the characters in their late 20s (I assume) having gone to high school or even earlier together and a shared history of sorts. I suppose this next flashback episode is going to be very interesting to see how all of them fit into that dynamic.

Edited February 19, 2019 by theschnauzers
typo

[AnimeMania]

What is Michael's powers and when did he actually use them on the show?

[ParadoxLost]

8 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

What is Michael's powers and when did he actually use them on the show?

telekinesis.  or at least he keep showing cars and stuff with his mind.

[phoenics]

On 2/19/2019 at 1:42 AM, theschnauzers said:

This episode brought a realization to me that Max, Michael, and Isabel are going to end up with a human support team by the end of this season who will know their truth, or at least that they are aliens and will make the fight against the military and the inevitable others more even. My guess is this will be Liz, Kyle and Alex at a minimum, at least for Max and Michael. Not sure where Isabel human connections other than possibly Noah even can fit in, if she has any.

The Kyle Alex dynamic in this episode was quite interesting to say the least. So we now have all the characters in their late 20s (I assume) having gone to high school or even earlier together and a shared history of sorts. I suppose this next flashback episode is going to be very interesting to see how all of them fit into that dynamic.

Well, the human support better include Maria or I will riot.  She shouldn't be shoved to the sidelines the way she is.  I'm very concerned.  I'm trying very hard not to jump to conclusions about why Maria almost seems absent from the story, but ... 😕 

[Regalbegal]

Re-watching Ep2 last night, plus the coming attractions for the next episode, has me wondering how much Max really knows about Rosa's death and when he found it out.  It doesn't seem like he was actually there when it happened - does he just know because Michael told him? And why was he so surprised about the hand on Rosa's face - was it out of line with how Michael told him it happened?  One theory is that Michael came upon the scene and assumed Isobel did it (I think in the promo he says "what did you do?"), but really she was just there or tangentially involved - and the hand on the face was her trying to help Rosa?  I don't know, this is only episode 5 so I just can't quite buy we've already gotten to the final answer of who killed Rosa.  

[ellieart]

On 2/20/2019 at 8:12 PM, phoenics said:

Well, the human support better include Maria or I will riot.  She shouldn't be shoved to the sidelines the way she is.  I'm very concerned.  I'm trying very hard not to jump to conclusions about why Maria almost seems absent from the story, but ... 😕 

Maria isn't even in episode 6, which makes zero sense to me.  I know she apparently has her big episode coming up, but one episode won't erase the fact that she's been useless.  So useless, in fact, that she wasn't even there with her friends at prom?  I can't stand how they're writing for her.  

[phoenics]

On 2/25/2019 at 7:42 PM, ellieart said:

Maria isn't even in episode 6, which makes zero sense to me.  I know she apparently has her big episode coming up, but one episode won't erase the fact that she's been useless.  So useless, in fact, that she wasn't even there with her friends at prom?  I can't stand how they're writing for her.  

It's almost like they said, "well, Maria isn't going to be much of a factor on this show... how can we get OG fans not to care?  Oh I know!  Make her black!!"

I hate being that cynical - but look at what's happened.

[Whodunnit]

So, new theory: when people  (or just aliens) die they can possess Izzy?

If so, who has died in the present that could possess Izzy? (Because her blackouts have started again)

Is it the same entity as before or is it a new one?

[KittenPokerCheater]

I'm coming here because spoilers.  If Isobel is indeed responsible (ie, no Not-Nasedo alien possession), then I don't know how Liz will ever be able to be in the same room with Isobel and not want to kill her. 

I almost feel like Liz will be able to forgive Michael first, if indeed she is capable of  forgiving any of them.