S01.E10: The Androcles Option/S01.E11: These are the Names 06.09.2018

[CooperTV]

 

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“The Androcles Option” – Jude and Nestor form a plan to break the refugees out of the camp, but it’s complicated when Sophie arrives with information on Reece’s whereabouts. Not content to wait, Marshall takes matters into his own hands.

“These are the Names” – The lives of the refugees hang in the balance as Jude and Nestor team up with an unlikely ally. Meanwhile, Eve and Lindauer move forward with their ruthless effort to tie up loose ends.

 

Promos

Edited June 5, 2018 by CooperTV

[fellini]

I'm glad it had a happy ending Reece gets her daughter back, the ruthless F.B.I. lady is killed , the doctor heals herself and the rest get to move on.

[mertensia]

Not so happy. Doctor lady just started the whole Apex takeover.

I love the deputy. Nothing fazes him. He's ridiculously efficient.

I knew Paul was a goner.

[Suzysite]

It's too bad Rachel's mother (name?) decided to run off before she could be reunited with her daughter.   The meet up with dad (Caleb?) was nice, though

[Free]

24 minutes ago, mertensia said:

Doctor lady just started the whole Apex takeover.

Yeah, I sort of had a feeling with the way they were doing the whole 'mad scientist' trope with her dying and desperate to live.

Edited June 10, 2018 by Free

[dbklmt]

As the episode moved closer to the end I thought to myself they're going to give it closure but I was wrong.  They gave closure to most of the main story, but as icemiser69 said, "it was about as good of an ending as anyone could expect given the cancellation".  I'm sorry to see it end with still so many questions that still need to be answered:

How and why did the people disappear;

The five people that left with the Apex slave, one of them being Grace, the wife of the woman that Brooke Smith played. (Still don't know character's names after 10 episodes and there were too many to follow.)  Were they selected by the apex slave who knew what was ahead for humanity? 

Best scene in the episode was when the BIG BAD EVIL Doyle got killed.  Only wish that the equally EVIL Eve could have been killed and preferably by Reece!

It was obvious to me several episodes ago that Sophie would be Patient Zero and I will miss the confrontation that was being set up between two Terminators, her and Reece.  Oh well,  I'll just have to imagine what would have happened.  Maybe the producers will give some ideas now that the show is Dead!  

[KaveDweller]

12 hours ago, Suzysite said:

It's too bad Rachel's mother (name?) decided to run off before she could be reunited with her daughter.   The meet up with dad (Caleb?) was nice, though

I think I missed Rachel's background. How did she end up in the present timeline? I thought she got separated from her family back in the past, and if she was part of the earlier migration, she'd have been too young to be on her own.

[kili]

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I think I missed Rachel's background. How did she end up in the present timeline? I thought she got separated from her family back in the past, and if she was part of the earlier migration, she'd have been too young to be on her own.

Diana mentioned that there was one child in the earlier migration. It must have been Rachel and it looks like Lindhauer became her surrogate father in the new timeline.

All that snow should have made it easy to track people. I bet the producers were thrilled that happened. 

Speaking of ice, Eve has ice in her veins. I suspect she'll be watching Lindhauer's surrogate daughter. Caleb will need to be careful. 

[Free]

4 hours ago, dbklmt said:

It was obvious to me several episodes ago that Sophie would be Patient Zero and I will miss the confrontation that was being set up between two Terminators, her and Reece. 

Agreed, especially once they set up her condition a while ago.

[Dowel Jones]

On the bright side, we don't have to watch any more promos for Steve Harvey and the Kardashians.

[Ziggy]

There's just one thing that bugs me about Sophie being Patient Zero.  What caused Apex to begin with?  It's a paradox, because Reese brought it back from the future.  But where did Reece get it?  If we assume Reece got it from Sophie, where did Sophie get it?  I understand the concept of a closed loop, but that loop still has to start with an independent person discovering it on their own and not because of someone from the future.

[Efzee]

I was fully expecting Hannah to die from that electric shock, to ensure she and Marshall (?) wouldn't hook up as he's her ancestor... and that, like Reece > Sophie, Hannah had to go back in time to make sure Marshall would help everyone escape.

[mythoughtis]

I think Hannah becomes Marshall’s wife.  Someone in Marshall’s line most likely gives the locket to Hannah in the future, with the picture of Marshalls wife removed.  She has always said someone gave it to her.  So I don’t think she’s a descendent of Marshall. 

Sophie started APEX by using  Reese’s blood. Reese tried to prevent that by breaking the vial, but it was the wrong vial.  If Sophie didn’t use it, someone else might have done what Sophie did since Reese will be alive in this time for decades. Easy enough for someone to do that same research. 

Even with that, it’s Eve and her single minded fanactic goal of killing the 7% that will really ensure the rise of Apex and their desire to wipe out  humans. Lindhauer finally got that idea at the end. 

It was a pretty good first season. They did their best to summarize things and give some closure. 

Edited June 12, 2018 by mythoughtis

[Mahamid Frauded Me]

I am bummed this got cancelled, I thought it was pretty good - would have been interesting to see what lies ahead unfold

[HerkyJerky]

I'm going to miss this show.  It was entertaining and relevant.  I loved the speech Sheriff Ellis gave about how these "immigrants" from the future just wanted what we all want: a place to work and raise a family.  Then when the little girl told him that his name kept recurring in the Apex writing, it hit me that he was our modern-day "Ellis Island".

[peachmangosteen]

8 hours ago, HerkyJerky said:

Then when the little girl told him that his name kept recurring in the Apex writing, it hit me that he was our modern-day "Ellis Island".

Oh wow, I din't think about that. 

Ugh, I'm bummed it was cancelled. I really liked most of these characters a lot.

[ursula]

Between my exams, the news of cancellation and the uninteresting JudeFlashback episode, I fell out watching and I'm just caught up. I called the Paradox pretty early on and I'm glad they more or less confirmed it. Sequelitis is the death of a good paradox story. (I'm looking at you, original Terminator).  Plus there were some choices the story made that gave me the jeebies. (Count how many Black People don't fit the Scary Black Person stereotype. Hint: you don't need any fingers to do so). 

Basically, I more or less enjoyed what aired, and I'm glad on many counts that it was cancelled. 

 

On 6/11/2018 at 8:54 AM, Ziggy said:

There's just one thing that bugs me about Sophie being Patient Zero.  What caused Apex to begin with?  It's a paradox, because Reese brought it back from the future.  But where did Reece get it?  If we assume Reece got it from Sophie, where did Sophie get it?  I understand the concept of a closed loop, but that loop still has to start with an independent person discovering it on their own and not because of someone from the future.

That's why it's a loop - it doesn't start anywhere. 

Quick question: Diana is the only Person from the Future who doesn't have a Biblical name, right? 

[Ziggy]

40 minutes ago, ursula said:

That's why it's a loop - it doesn't start anywhere. 

I thought a closed loop meant that you cannot change the past by going back in time because going back in time, what you planned to do is exactly what you did.

in Back to the Future, Marty changed things. But a closed loop says that Marty wouldn’t be able to change things, he would simply be doing everything that already happened.

Edited June 14, 2018 by Ziggy

[ursula]

10 minutes ago, Ziggy said:

I thought a closed loop meant that you cannot change the past by going back in time because going back in time, what you planned to do is exactly what you did.

 

Yes exactly. The people from the Future thought they were going back into the past to change The Bad Times (the Rise of the Apesx, the wars, the genocide, etc) --- turns out that their going back into the past was what made The Bad Times happen. Their time travelling adventures was already part of their own history.

Regarding the speculation about Hannah and Marshall: There's a nice little love triangle between Hannah, Marshall and Ray. There's still a chance she'll end up as Ray's wife and her own (great-great-great-)grand-mother.

Edited June 14, 2018 by ursula

[paulvdb]

On 11-6-2018 at 2:54 PM, Ziggy said:

There's just one thing that bugs me about Sophie being Patient Zero.  What caused Apex to begin with?  It's a paradox, because Reese brought it back from the future.  But where did Reece get it?  If we assume Reece got it from Sophie, where did Sophie get it?  I understand the concept of a closed loop, but that loop still has to start with an independent person discovering it on their own and not because of someone from the future.

It's called a causal loop. From the Wikipedia entry: "A causal loop in the context of time travel or the causal structure of spacetime, is a sequence of events (actions, information, objects, people)[1][2] in which an event is among the causes of another event, which in turn is among the causes of the first-mentioned event.[3][4] Such causally-looped events then exist in spacetime, but their origin cannot be determined."

[kili]

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Quick question: Diana is the only Person from the Future who doesn't have a Biblical name, right? 

Her wife's name was Grace. I don't think that is technically a biblical name.  "Grace" is derived from the Latin word "gratia" and wasn't used as a name in biblical times. Reese is also not a biblical name (Welsh in origin), but that was probably to demonstrate that she is different than the others. Diana and Grace (who escaped from the camp) were also different in that they invented the time machine. So, perhaps that is why they have Latin based names?

[ursula]

2 hours ago, kili said:

Reese is also not a biblical name (Welsh in origin), but that was probably to demonstrate that she is different than the others.

This, and also not a coincidence that she's named after Kyle Reese.

Diana and Grace definitely break the naming rule. I wonder if that was supposed to be a clue to something (that they might not have been Commons after all, but turned Apex, not unlike Reese herself?)

Also interesting that of all the "present-day" characters, Jude was the only one with a Jewish/Biblical name. 

Considering the significant role he plays in the events that shape the Future, it might not be a coincidence.

[Clanstarling]

On 6/10/2018 at 6:50 AM, icemiser69 said:

The ending was predictable, especially with Lindauer becoming a big old softy.  That said, it was about as good of an ending as anyone could expect given the cancellation and all.

He did seem to be the only one of the original time travelers who had much of a conscience. Plus, he'd raised a daughter in this timeline - even if she was a stolen daughter. But who did he steal her from - her parents or Apex?

On 6/10/2018 at 4:58 PM, icemiser69 said:

I was expecting that barometer that is in with the police evidence to go bonkers before the final episode ended.  I think that was supposed to signal another migration.

Given that the Doc had just injected herself, that migration should be happening sooner rather than later.

I was totally disappointed. But I expect that it would have gone off eventually, if the series had gone on. That newer, sooner migration you mention, of course.

On 6/10/2018 at 6:29 PM, kili said:

Diana mentioned that there was one child in the earlier migration. It must have been Rachel and it looks like Lindhauer became her surrogate father in the new timeline.

We actually saw them holding a child in Marshall's flashback scenes. So I was wondering who the kid was well before Eve spoke of her.

On 6/11/2018 at 5:54 AM, Ziggy said:

There's just one thing that bugs me about Sophie being Patient Zero.  What caused Apex to begin with?  It's a paradox, because Reese brought it back from the future.  But where did Reece get it?  If we assume Reece got it from Sophie, where did Sophie get it?  I understand the concept of a closed loop, but that loop still has to start with an independent person discovering it on their own and not because of someone from the future.

IIRC, in the very beginning of the show, they had some kind of a yadda yadda that scientists had developed cures for this and that, improving human beings until it went a step further and created Apex. I don't quite recall how they said it. But of course, like many histories (especially given they called this era The Long Peace), the actual beginnings were garbled as it passed through time. At least for the humans, it looked like Apex did keep track. Maybe that was why Reese was so insistent about not leaving her blood behind (and unfortunately failed).

I thought the show kept improving, and it's unfortunate it got cancelled. Far worse shows have carried on for years. I really got to like Deputy Beard at the end. Oh well.

[mythoughtis]

The name Reese always makes me think of Persons of Interest.  Both Reeses were seemingly made of steel. 

Besides the Ellis name being all over the cabin - What other unanswered questions do you wish had gotten answered? Besides how they were all going to live now? 

[ursula]

I think there's also a significance to Ellis. Harlan Ellison was the writer eventually credited for Terminator right?

Edited June 15, 2018 by ursula

[peachmangosteen]

On 6/14/2018 at 7:24 PM, Clanstarling said:

Plus, he'd raised a daughter in this timeline - even if she was a stolen daughter. But who did he steal her from - her parents or Apex?

It had to have been Apex since he didn't realize Caleb and Rebecca were Rachel's parents until Caleb brought up losing a child named Rachel.

[mythoughtis]

3 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

It had to have been Apex since he didn't realize Caleb and Rebecca were Rachel's parents until Caleb brought up losing a child named Rachel.

Plus she had the Apex brand,so Apex had her at some point. Maybe we would have learned how she got away in another season. 

Edited June 16, 2018 by mythoughtis