S07.E07: Andante

[atlantaloves]

Great episode, however I too fast forward through all the domestic scenes, and I really do not care about scenes with that kid of hers. Okay, are we in agreement that Dante has not been flipped. I am a little confused.  Thanks. 

[Addlepated]

We are 7 episodes in and I still am not sure what the plot is this season.  

[slowpoked]

9 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

All I remember them saying is that she's a doctor but I don't think they've ever specified what kind of doctor she is.

I think she is a psychiatrist - I think I remember seeing a sign on Episode 1 (was it), when Carrie stuffed Dante in the trunk and let him out to talk at her sister's office.

15 minutes ago, Addlepated said:

We are 7 episodes in and I still am not sure what the plot is this season.

That there is a plan to overthrow Keane and that it may be the Russians, or domestic forces, behind it?

Edited March 27, 2018 by slowpoked

[mxc90]

Franny's best line was "What work?"

[SuprSuprElevated]

6 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Franny's best line was "What work?"

Yes!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

23 hours ago, slowpoked said:

I think she is a psychiatrist - I think I remember seeing a sign on Episode 1 (was it), when Carrie stuffed Dante in the trunk and let him out to talk at her sister's office.

Dante asks, "Who's Margaret Mathison, MD?" when they enter Maggie's office, but the sign is not in focus. This is the only shot of the sign in S7.E1 (I took this screencap from Showtime's youtube channel at the maximum quality of 1080). There are no other signs on the door, in the parking lot, or inside the office with Maggie's name on them.

[AmyBre]

On 3/26/2018 at 11:46 AM, jrlr said:

I don't either, and when I read the post mentioning autism I was wondering if I completely missed something very important.  Has autim even been mentioned?  I thought the show was dealing with Carrie being bi-polar, not autistic.  Have to say Claire Danes does a scarily convincing job of conveying bi-polar disorder. 

I incorrectly grouped bipolar disorder and autism to highlight the inclusion of psychiatric disorders in the series.  Though these two sometimes overlap, they are not the same.

[AmyBre]

On 3/26/2018 at 11:07 AM, JocelynCavanaugh said:

Are you trying to say that we’re supposed to view Carrie as an autistic character? I don’t see that. 

No, but the series wants us to keep her psychiatric disorder (bipolar) in the back of our minds, as it aids the plot of the series in how she gets obsessed with certain situations/persons.

On 3/26/2018 at 12:07 PM, WaltersHair said:

Have been mulling over the idea that Dante is a good guy, not  a bad guy. If he is a good guy, then the ex-wife must be the bad guy because someone is lying in that old coupling.

Not necessarily.  Some couples  just don't work out in the long run for a number of reasons, not necessarily for lies.  You may have a great guy and a great gal and for some reason his clipping of his toenails in public just irks the shit out of her.  Or her constantly saying LOL when finding something funny just pisses off the guy.  Perhaps one is a devoted democrat and the other loves Trump.    You never know but to assume the breakup is caused by one of them being the "bad guy" excludes perfectly good reasons why certain couples end up going separate ways.

[AmyBre]

Now, did Carrie have to screw Dante?   Was it necessary?

I'm thinking of her thing with Brodie and how it started as she "getting to him" and next thing you know, she has feelings for the guy.   Carrie is one hot mess of a woman.

Let's recap on Dante.   Saul helps her see that Dante is playing her and utilizing her to further someone's agenda.   She drugs him and invites her crew to comb his apartment.  Then she not only moves in with the guy but brings her daughter along and ultimately screws him.    I know that girlfriend wants to get to the bottom of Dante (literally) but couldn't she have gone to 2nd base or 3rd base instead?     Also, did she have to do him in the living room and risk her daughter running into them?  I mean, daughter is in an unfamiliar environment and can wake up scared and try to find Mom, but Mom is devouring Dante like she just came of jail and being loud about it.  Carrie?!!  Jesus, take the wheel!!  Please!!!

On second thought, it's been a while since Carrie got any, I guess she was salty and went for it.

[AmyBre]

On 3/27/2018 at 3:21 AM, Tom2008 said:

Autism has nothing to do with Bipolar Illness. They are completely seperate illnesses.

The person posting this is unfamiliar with psychological diagnoses and the DSM V.

Tom, I corrected myself on a recent post and noted that my intent was to highlight the role of psychiatric disorders in the series.   I own an old copy of the DSM but let's remember that this forum and these posts are for leisure and entertainment purposes and not to be critiqued with such academic rigor.  It so happens that bipolar and autism in general are some of the most common disorders familiar to the world at large.    Thanks for pointing that out.

[Son of Saul]

I'm also antagonised by the apparent need to include some family back story in the show. It's unnecessary and takes away from precious Saul and Carrie time.

BTW, I rewound the scene when Saul glides to the door and looks at Carrie half a dozen times. It was superb. 

Edited March 28, 2018 by Son of Saul

[scrb]

3 hours ago, AmyBre said:

Now, did Carrie have to screw Dante?   Was it necessary?

I'm thinking of her thing with Brodie and how it started as she "getting to him" and next thing you know, she has feelings for the guy.   Carrie is one hot mess of a woman.

Let's recap on Dante.   Saul helps her see that Dante is playing her and utilizing her to further someone's agenda.   She drugs him and invites her crew to comb his apartment.  Then she not only moves in with the guy but brings her daughter along and ultimately screws him.    I know that girlfriend wants to get to the bottom of Dante (literally) but couldn't she have gone to 2nd base or 3rd base instead?     Also, did she have to do him in the living room and risk her daughter running into them?  I mean, daughter is in an unfamiliar environment and can wake up scared and try to find Mom, but Mom is devouring Dante like she just came of jail and being loud about it.  Carrie?!!  Jesus, take the wheel!!  Please!!!

On second thought, it's been a while since Carrie got any, I guess she was salty and went for it.

For whatever reason, they wanted to show her hitting bottom, which is not having a home and not having many options so she recklessly takes the kid there and then ends up with the humiliation of being pulled off him (or him being pulled off her) while they were doing it.

Besides the humiliation, if the kid heard the commotion and then ran out to her naked mother, that's an unpleasant memory from childhood.

Most normal parents would simply give up spying once they have a kid.  Problem is that Carries thinks only she can save the world.

So besides bipolar or whatever the clinical diagnosis, she has delusions of grandeur.  Or maybe that's one of the symptoms.

At least Jack Bauer actually saved the country from disaster a few times.  

[Milburn Stone]

6 minutes ago, scrb said:

Most normal parents would simply give up spying once they have a kid.  Problem is that Carries thinks only she can save the world.

But, but...the storyline of every season proves her right!

[Mindthinkr]

I just really didn’t like when those guys came in on Dante and Carrie and poor Frannie was seemingly traumatized (again) by dealing with things that no child of that age should be subjected to. Then that long pause of Saul at the door with the ‘you brought this on yourself look’. Poor child. 

[suomi]

2 hours ago, Son of Saul said:

BTW, I rewound the scene when Saul glides to the door and looks at Carrie half a dozen times. It was superb. 

That it was.

Dante got the naked bum's rush before Frannie was brought into the living room, but jeeeez. One of Saul's crew grabbed her off the bed while Dante's heinie was disappearing out the front door. If she saw anything it was a flash, but jeeeez.

A little kid whose mother snatched her from the only family and stability she knows, in the early stages of sleep, in a strange bed, in a strange place, awakened by shouting men with masks and huge guns. The nice chocolate chip pancake-making man is gone, the world has gone nuts, Mommy smells like sex and is stark naked on the couch behind a fairly small throw pillow.

Meanwhile, the disgust on Saul's face looks like it smells like ozone.

[AmyBre]

On 3/26/2018 at 10:19 AM, Milburn Stone said:

I already "liked" this post but I just had to say how awesome it is.

Thanks Milburn

[Sentient Meat]

For me Claire Danes is like the female De Niro of acting... at least the young Bobby anyway... she's a reasonably attractive woman like De Niro is a decent looking guy, who absolutely kills it when doing the dramatic scenes, like the revelation scene with Saul, but all her lovemaking scenes range from uninteresting to cringeworthy... and I'm talking all the way back to Brody.  Seeing as she's an executive producer, maybe she insists on putting in plenty of lovemaking scenes with men with whom she likes to work, maybe the showrunners feel like she is incredibly alluring, but while I thoroughly enjoy watching her outsmart the world as well as her incredible portrayal of bipolarism, I mentally check out when she has her obligatory tryst with which ever tortured soul of the season has decided he can't live without her.  At least De Niro has the sense to minimize these type of roles and work in his wheelhouse.  Personally, I'd rather watch Saul hook up with his Russian expert, or see her involved with Max then act like she's some female James Bond who men cannot resist.  Gal Gadot... sure, Claire Danes, not so much.

[PreBabylonia]

On 28/03/2018 at 4:35 PM, AmyBre said:

Now, did Carrie have to screw Dante?   Was it necessary?

I'm thinking of her thing with Brodie and how it started as she "getting to him" and next thing you know, she has feelings for the guy.   Carrie is one hot mess of a woman.

Let's recap on Dante.   Saul helps her see that Dante is playing her and utilizing her to further someone's agenda.   She drugs him and invites her crew to comb his apartment.  Then she not only moves in with the guy but brings her daughter along and ultimately screws him.    I know that girlfriend wants to get to the bottom of Dante (literally) but couldn't she have gone to 2nd base or 3rd base instead?     Also, did she have to do him in the living room and risk her daughter running into them?  I mean, daughter is in an unfamiliar environment and can wake up scared and try to find Mom, but Mom is devouring Dante like she just came of jail and being loud about it.  Carrie?!!  Jesus, take the wheel!!  Please!!!

On second thought, it's been a while since Carrie got any, I guess she was salty and went for it.

Unless I had the completely wrong impression, I thought Dante lived in a one bedroom condo - and the bedroom had a pretty flimsy separation from the living room anyway. The only other option would be the bathroom - although it probably locks, it would be pretty inconvenient if Franny had to go pee in the middle of the night.

I agree that it's been a while for Carrie, especially since she turned down Quinn. (???!) It may have been her boyfriend in Berlin or at least I don't remember seeing anyone else afterwards. I also think the main reason for writing this in is to illustrate Carrie's lack of impulse control. It seems that extreme stress brings that out in her.

10 hours ago, Sentient Meat said:

For me Claire Danes is like the female De Niro of acting... at least the young Bobby anyway... she's a reasonably attractive woman like De Niro is a decent looking guy, who absolutely kills it when doing the dramatic scenes, like the revelation scene with Saul, but all her lovemaking scenes range from uninteresting to cringeworthy... and I'm talking all the way back to Brody.  Seeing as she's an executive producer, maybe she insists on putting in plenty of lovemaking scenes with men with whom she likes to work, maybe the showrunners feel like she is incredibly alluring, but while I thoroughly enjoy watching her outsmart the world as well as her incredible portrayal of bipolarism, I mentally check out when she has her obligatory tryst with which ever tortured soul of the season has decided he can't live without her.  At least De Niro has the sense to minimize these type of roles and work in his wheelhouse.  Personally, I'd rather watch Saul hook up with his Russian expert, or see her involved with Max then act like she's some female James Bond who men cannot resist.  Gal Gadot... sure, Claire Danes, not so much.

I like that her love scenes are extremely awkward and cringeworthy - it seems like a natural progression of her illness. Unlike de Niro, Danes is still young. The last thing I want to see is de Niro doing any kind of love scene, especially naked. Oh wait - the last thing I want to see is Saul naked. His love scenes make me feel worse. He's like your strange old grandpa that you want to imagine has never had sex. I think he's great as a father figure to Carrie and a fantastic source of authority but seeing him make out with forty something women makes me deeply uncomfortable. It's not just an age thing - it's because he is so hairy and really out of shape. I would rather see a hundred scenes of Carrie making out with all kinds of men that THAT. I DO love Max though. I wouldn't mind him as the romantic protagonist next time. With anybody but Carrie, since that's a death sentence.

[Sentient Meat]

47 minutes ago, PreBabylonia said:

Unless I had the completely wrong impression, I thought Dante lived in a one bedroom condo - and the bedroom had a pretty flimsy separation from the living room anyway. The only other option would be the bathroom - although it probably locks, it would be pretty inconvenient if Franny had to go pee in the middle of the night.

I agree that it's been a while for Carrie, especially since she turned down Quinn. (???!) It may have been her boyfriend in Berlin or at least I don't remember seeing anyone else afterwards. I also think the main reason for writing this in is to illustrate Carrie's lack of impulse control. It seems that extreme stress brings that out in her.

I like that her love scenes are extremely awkward and cringeworthy - it seems like a natural progression of her illness. Unlike de Niro, Danes is still young. The last thing I want to see is de Niro doing any kind of love scene, especially naked. Oh wait - the last thing I want to see is Saul naked. His love scenes make me feel worse. He's like your strange old grandpa that you want to imagine has never had sex. I think he's great as a father figure to Carrie and a fantastic source of authority but seeing him make out with forty something women makes me deeply uncomfortable. It's not just an age thing - it's because he is so hairy and really out of shape. I would rather see a hundred scenes of Carrie making out with all kinds of men that THAT. I DO love Max though. I wouldn't mind him as the romantic protagonist next time. With anybody but Carrie, since that's a death sentence.

I meant when De Niro was young not now of course...As far as Saul goes, I thought the Russian expert was pretty deep into middle age... she's heavy set so maybe I'm wrong and she's a lot younger.

I don't mind the awkwardness of the scenes themselves... I have trouble believing that she has the power to manipulate many handsome men with her overwhelming charms.  I think Danes works as the ugly duckling type... I don't think she works as a femme fatale type... YMMV.  Remember, I like the actress... just think they should take a different angle with the character.  Like I think Maggie Gyllenhaal was great in Secretary, but poorly cast in The Dark Knight.  JMO

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

Mommy smells like sex

How would Frannie know that?

[gallimaufry]

Oh, Carrie.  It's painful to see Carrie's decision-making with regard to Frannie be so poor and, to be honest, I find it hard to credit.  Carrie does a lot of things wrong but deliberately putting her infant daughter in the home of a possible Russian spy who the National Security Advisor is gunning for really pushes credibility.

Although when they introduced Frannie, I thought she was a terrible idea, she's actually been good for the show on balance.  A tether for Carrie to stop her going completely off the deep end and I don't find her overused or annoying.  This was the first time she's been in the spotlight much at all and I didn't find her a problem so much as the credibility of Carrie's situation.  That said, I can't see how this ends with her alive.  With the show entering its final season, the character is too much of a lead weight on them.

Dante is a great character and I enjoy his ambiguity.  They've done a good job of bottling the mystery with Brody that made Series 1 tick and I hope, like Brody, they don't rush to pin him down.  (Incidentally, someone mentioned Dana upthread.  Probably a really unpopular opinion, but I'd quite like to see what became of Dana and Jessica.  They were such a huge part of the first season and Dana is Frannie's sister-in-law.  Did they even know about Frannie?  That said, I can't see any logical reason for them to turn up so perhaps it's as well they're kept off-screen.

I don't get why Max put himself at risk of jail time for Carrie in the first place so I don't have much sympathy for him here.  In fact, in 7 years, I've never understood his character really.

Wellington though... that plot isn't working for me at all.  I can't get over the strike he ordered over her explicit instructions and I just don't see how he's that essential.  Where was he last season? 

The Keane plot is floundering again.  It feels like they're giving her things to do to justify her role such as manipulate the funeral arrangements or bicker with the Veep.  And I have to say, the Vice-President didn't interest me as a character one bit which is a real shame because offing Keane and installing a new character might have been their best course-correct at this point.  It's not that the actress is bad but trying to write in the Trumpian elements feels increasingly difficult to sustain with her underlying characterisation.

Saul is good value as ever but feels like he's going through the motions at the moment.  The man has gone from prison to the top of government but is still acting like a spy kingpin and through it all I really don't have much of a sense of who he is.

I hoped we might get more follow-up on the siege but I guess that's died a death.  If this was Moscow's big play, it's hardly succeeded.  I hope we get some closure on O'Keefe at least.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Clip: go after Dante

[PreBabylonia]

On 29/03/2018 at 9:41 PM, Sentient Meat said:

I meant when De Niro was young not now of course...As far as Saul goes, I thought the Russian expert was pretty deep into middle age... she's heavy set so maybe I'm wrong and she's a lot younger.

I don't mind the awkwardness of the scenes themselves... I have trouble believing that she has the power to manipulate many handsome men with her overwhelming charms.  I think Danes works as the ugly duckling type... I don't think she works as a femme fatale type... YMMV.  Remember, I like the actress... just think they should take a different angle with the character.  Like I think Maggie Gyllenhaal was great in Secretary, but poorly cast in The Dark Knight.  JMO

Sorry, I missed your previous first line. I don't actually see any kind of connection here. I've never seen de Niro in a TV show, just films, and many of them were in similar types of roles - a ruthless criminal type with violent tendencies. I don't see the role of Carrie as a femme fatale at all. She's sexy (as a blonde) and would appeal to many men, might even be amazing in bed so that's part of her appeal, and I think her bipolar nature makes her unpredictable and exciting.

Miranda Otto is 51, so I suppose she would qualify as middle aged, depending on how you define it, but definitely not heavy set. I still think she looks like she did when playing Éowyn in Lord of the Rings. Mandy Patinkin is 65, but I would say he could easily pass for a man in his seventies. Although Hollywood likes to cast older stars with young co-stars, I frequently see it as creepy. I'm all for Claire Danes getting cast with male co-stars her age or younger. Other than seducing the young college student, I am not creeped out or surprised by that at all.

 

[Sentient Meat]

21 minutes ago, PreBabylonia said:

Sorry, I missed your previous first line. I don't actually see any kind of connection here. I've never seen de Niro in a TV show, just films, and many of them were in similar types of roles - a ruthless criminal type with violent tendencies. I don't see the role of Carrie as a femme fatale at all. She's sexy (as a blonde) and would appeal to many men, might even be amazing in bed so that's part of her appeal, and I think her bipolar nature makes her unpredictable and exciting.

Miranda Otto is 51, so I suppose she would qualify as middle aged, depending on how you define it, but definitely not heavy set. I still think she looks like she did when playing Éowyn in Lord of the Rings. Mandy Patinkin is 65, but I would say he could easily pass for a man in his seventies. Although Hollywood likes to cast older stars with young co-stars, I frequently see it as creepy. I'm all for Claire Danes getting cast with male co-stars her age or younger. Other than seducing the young college student, I am not creeped out or surprised by that at all.

 

I wasn't talking about Miranda Otto... I'm talking about the woman he recruited from the university this season, I think she played a guard in Orange is the New Black.  I think Claire Danes can be attractive and would do very well with the average population but they seem to pair her up with handsome leads every season like Carrie from Sex and the City would have men much more pretty than her throwing themselves at her feet.

[SuprSuprElevated]

19 minutes ago, Sentient Meat said:

I wasn't talking about Miranda Otto... I'm talking about the woman he recruited from the university this season, I think she played a guard in Orange is the New Black.  I think Claire Danes can be attractive and would do very well with the average population but they seem to pair her up with handsome leads every season like Carrie from Sex and the City would have men much more pretty than her throwing themselves at her feet.

Catherine Curtin  http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0193160/?ref_=tt_cl_t9

[John Potts]

There was a lot of good in this episode - I liked the whole "Spy v Spy" stuff with Carrie and Dante, particularly once it started involving Carrie's sister and Dante's ex. Wasn't quite sure what they were doing (beyond the obvious!) when they got together at the end - it seemed to me the were in a "I know you know what I'm up to!" type situation - but they had sex anyway? Or were about to, until Saul got in the ultimate cockblock...

Frannie is going to be one f'ed up kid - having Carrie as a mum must be bad enough, even without running to hug her (naked) when armed men burst in. Did love her "Mommy - No!" bit, though when Carrie was going off the rails (again).

On ‎26‎/‎03‎/‎2018 at 7:21 PM, scrb said:

[Frannie's] just as much an obstacle as Jack Bauer's daughter was on 24.

Come on... Frannie's way more responsible at 5(?) than Kim was at 16+ !

On ‎26‎/‎03‎/‎2018 at 4:27 AM, chocolatine said:

I'm not sure that his intentions - with Carrie and otherwise - are entirely benign, but I also don't think it's as cut and dried as him being a Russian spy/collaborator.

I agree - I think he's genuine in wanting to address the wrongs (as he sees them) of Keane's Presidency and how Carrie had screwed him (metaphorically speaking) in the past. I don't think he's knowingly working for the Russians, just some domestic reformist movement.

On ‎26‎/‎03‎/‎2018 at 4:27 AM, chocolatine said:

Did anyone get the sense that there is/was some kind of romantic relationship between Keane and Wellington?

When Keane confronted him, she implied he'd made a personal (and intimate) declaration in his letter (I forget the line).

On ‎26‎/‎03‎/‎2018 at 3:36 AM, WaltersHair said:

if the VP was anyone except Bo Bridges, I'd say he wasn't involved. He is so involved.

But he was the cuddly commander of the SGC after Jack retired (and President in one  episode)!

ETA: Miranda Otto is 51!? Wow, she looks WAY better than me (not hard, admittedly) and she's a few years older than me.

Edited April 3, 2018 by John Potts

[misstwpherecool]

Needs 2 b deleted,posted in wrong thread. Apologies

Edited July 5, 2018 by misstwpherecool

[Roseanna]

On ‎29‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 4:01 AM, suomi said:

Meanwhile, the disgust on Saul's face looks like it smells like ozone.

Saul resented Carrie for trusting wrong people who want to unermine "our system" - he is the last person who should condemn Carrie as he had an affair with a Russian spy for years.

[Roseanna]

On ‎27‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 3:31 AM, riverheightsnancy said:

Carrie's sister (she is a psychiatrist-right?) should know better. The situation is too co-dependent and enmeshed. Again, she knows better. All she does is bitch at Carrie. I get it, Carrie's bipolar is very challenging. I have dealt with patients that were so erratic as well, but she gives her no credit for when she is doing things correctly. She hovers and nags. her sister is making things worse, because she cannot actually admit that she wants Carrie out. 

Of course nagging does never makes other person to change. But I understand Carrie sister - she has simply got enough: she took care of Franny for months after her birth, and now Carrie and Franny have lived for months at her home, evidently for free. Carrie has always took for granted that her sister abandons her own work as a doctor in order to help her whereas, so far I remember, she has never done anything for her.  

In this season, Carrie has quarreled with her brother-in-law, messed her niece with her mission, couldn't even take Franny to the school and lied to her sister that she had a job interview, and didn't even bother to send an email or text message that she wouldn't come home for the night.

No wonder she and her sister behaved like a rebellious teenager and an anxious mother.   

[Roseanna]

On ‎26‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 4:44 PM, AmyBre said:

Carrie is bipolar and she's also brilliant.  A bipolar person can be super caring and at the same time, detach from the she doesn't care about in a matter of seconds.  You need to know about Autism and those mental disorders to understand how someone could devote themselves to a task until it consumes them, but also be a loving mother or a great father.   Carrie has no malice and all those people (Saul especially know that, despite her methods, she means well)

The people who truly know her (Saul, Sister, Max Piotrowsky, Quinn) also love her and sometimes you love someone so much, that you accept them 100% automaticaly and without question, and forgive them over and over.  This is also the case of certain mothers and children who they forgive after they have fallen to drug/alcohol addition.

You can't just turn off the love you feel for someone just because they piss you off.  Even if they do it over and over.  You may think that this constant forgiveness just enables the person to continue fucking up, but it's much more complicated than that.

Part of you knows that in their heart of hearts, they are good people.

If somebody constantly hurts you physically or mentally, he doesn't love you, whatever he says, for love is proven by the way he treats you. And if you have any self-worth, or love your children, you do turn off from him.  

No doubt some characters love Carrie, but not because she is a good person. Carrie has murdered people and she constantly lies and manipulates them. But more than that, to her to her the end justifies all means. She lacks basic decency that was elemental f.ex. in Bernard Samson by Len Deighton.  

[Roseanna]

On ‎26‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 10:39 PM, Bannon said:

Yeah, the kid is just a lazy plot device, deployed by the writers, to ratchet up.....DRAMATIC CONFLICT.....whenever deemed necessary. 

Only there was no conflict in Carrie's mind. She simply didn't care about Franny's wellbeing (taking her suddenly from her sister's home - after she had promised that it was her home, too) nor safety (bringing her to Dante's although she suspected him - has she ever thought that Franny could be taken to a hostige). In Berlin she at least sent Franny away from harm's way, but last season she was completely unable to undestand how the attack and Quinn's behavior had influenced on Franny.

Now, I am not in principle against Carrie having and keeping a baby, but then she should have married a nice, stable man who could have taken care of her daughter when she was out "saving the world". Or she could hired a full-time nanny (if such persons still exists) for her.

It's not enough to feel love, hug and say "I love you" thousand times, one must also do things. And sometimes the greatest love is to admit that one is not good for a person one loves and give her over.  

[Roseanna]

On ‎26‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 5:42 PM, Milburn Stone said:

Part of me feels that way too, but in the case of last night, the scene was necessary in order to get to a point where Carrie was desperate enough to go live with Dante, which set up his opportunity to search her room and confirm she was spying on him, her opportunity to search his apartment some more, his opportunity to confront her with why she talked to his ex-wife, etc. So IMO it wasn't exactly shoehorned, it was necessary to set up the spy vs. spy.

All this could have happened also when Carrie had left Franny at her sister's. He certainly would have found another reason to look for Carrie's room than to find Franny's favorite toy.    

On ‎26‎.‎3‎.‎2018 at 7:07 PM, WaltersHair said:

Have been mulling over the idea that Dante is a good guy, not  a bad guy. If he is a good guy, then the ex-wife must be the bad guy because someone is lying in that old coupling.

Dante had ample reasons to lie, unlike her ex, except of course natural bitterness after separation but her calling to Dante (if he told the truth about it) showed that she wished him only well.

Dante told she was bipolar but is she really such?

[Refresh]

The motel Carrie took Franny to looked familiar. I think that’s where Dana Brody worked for a while. Isn’t it?

I know Locations are likely reused but I  thought it was going to be a plot point . She drops off Franny with Dana-“here’s your half sister, later”

[Kel Varnsen]

On 4/3/2018 at 8:32 AM, John Potts said:

Frannie is going to be one f'ed up kid - having Carrie as a mum must be bad enough, even without running to hug her (naked) when armed men burst in. 

Not just with Carrie as her mom, but surely she will eventually find out that Brody was her dad. And I think the general public within the show still believes that Brody blew up CIA HQ. Also speaking of Carrie as a shitty parent, what was up with her driving around with Frannie in the front seat?

Although I did laugh at Saul threatening Max saying he will tell a judge that spying on Wellington is the biggest national security threat since 9/11. Fuck off with that shit Saul. There have been many bigger threats since then and you have been involved with all of them (even if you spin what Max did in the worst way possible). Or did you forget about Brody being a congressman and a terrorist. Or about Abu Nazir. Or about you sleeping with a Russian agent or about Dar Adal trying to take out the elected president (where you kind of helped him).