Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

tofutan · January 9, 2018

See, I think the show actually liked the whole Guardian stuff, it's more that the fans rejected it. I think it's very telling that as soon as the James/Lena stuff starts, suddenly we seem to get the return of action!James. Rather than let's say them telling Lena/James as Lena falling in love with the soulful sensitive photographer. Because I think they dig action James and don't know how to find just nice guy James interesting, but fandom hates action!James and is still attached to nonaction-niceguy!James.

Primal Slayer · January 9, 2018

It probably doesn't help that the other shows treat some characters like glorified extras who are just around to fill the room or get people excited for a hot minute. Supporting characters are just basically just as important as the lead in shows like these.

Oreo2234 · January 9, 2018

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There isn't anything wrong with having one main hero like the other shows, and maybe it is unfair to compare them, but I also feel like the other shows have frequently struggled with their larger casts, and giving them subplots that dont feel like padding to keep the actors around. Like how much Supergirl has had trouble figuring out what to do with Jimmy after Kara found a new love interest,

At times Supergirl seems to have trouble knowing what to do with all the supporting characters left from season One. Season's 2 and 3 have added characters that take up a lot of screentime and the balance just isn't as good as it was in the first season, though so far this season is doing better than last year.

Edited January 9, 2018 by Oreo2234

tv echo · January 9, 2018

HOW THE ARROWVERSE SEXUAL HARASSMENT SCANDAL WILL CHANGE DC TV
POSTED BY SYDNEY BUCKSBAUM ON JANUARY 8, 2018
https://nerdist.com/mark-pedowitz-andrew-kreisberg-cw-harrassment-arrowverse-tca/

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One case that made waves in the comic book community? Arrow-verse executive producer Andrew Kreisberg, who was first suspended and then fired by Warner Bros. Television after an investigation looked into multiple complaints of sexual harassment on The Flash and Supergirl. Kreisberg executive produced all four Arrowverse series (Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl and Legends of Tomorrow) as well as CW Seed animated series Vixen.

So what does this mean for fans of all the Arrow-verse series, most specifically Supergirl and The Flash?
* * *
Not much, conferred CW President Mark Pedowitz. The network boss sat down to speak with Nerdist at the 2018 Winter Television Critics Association press tour on Sunday, and revealed that even though behind-the-scenes restructuring has been going on in light of Kreisberg’s termination, creatively, fans won’t notice a difference.

“On Supergirl, there’s Robert Rovner and Jessica Queller who stepped up,” Pedowitz says of who has been taking control of Kreisberg’s responsibilities as showrunner. “Greg [Berlanti] is very actively involved. To make a long story short, the studio [WBTV] is managing that process, so [CW is] a little bit further in the background.”

Pedowitz was quick to add that no matter who someone is or what power they hold on a series, it takes a village of many people to bring a television show to life, so the success of the Arrow-verse won’t hinge on one producer’s presence. Adding to that confidence? Production never halted on any of the Vancouver-based sets, minimizing the likelihood of any potential schedule delays.
* * *
“I have seen no decline in anything,” Pedowitz says. “I think there is a team in place that’s terrific and we’ll see to it that it goes forward. I just saw a Flash episode the other day that was actually pretty damn good. It’s fun. You’ll be amazed at what really goes on. One person’s important, but there are so many talented people involved in the show that I think they’ll overcome whatever is missed.”
* * *
“I think people need to feel that they can express themselves if there’s an issue,” Pedowitz says. “People have to say that sexual misconduct and sexual harassment will not be tolerated and you have to feel safe, that you’ll be listened to if you have a complaint and that complaint needs to be investigated. I think people are more sensitized to that [now]; hopefully people who work at The CW, who work with us, realize that and we are open to listen to if there’s an issue.”

Edited January 9, 2018 by tv echo

tofutan · January 9, 2018

1 hour ago, Oreo2234 said:

At times Supergirl seems to have trouble knowing what to do with all the supporting characters left from season One. Season's 2 and 3 have added characters that take up a lot of screentime and the balance just isn't as good as it was in the first season, though so far this season is doing better than last year.

Really? I think s3 is pretty awful in that regard. Winn had NOTHING to do all season. Nothing. We don't even know if he's together with his girlfriend anymore or not and the show even retconned his friendship to Kara to so they could hype up Sam and Lena some more. Characters and storylines constantly disappear without explanation. J'onn's father arrives to town, then is not mentioned for episodes, suddenly it's "oh, he was in the DEO the entire time, unable to find the bathroom". The Lena/James relationship went from 10% (we are slowly getting to know each other) to 100% (we are making out because other characters say that supposedly we've been pining for each other). The Sam/Kara "friendship" is a total joke, they have had like 1 conversation and suddenly Kara claims that Sam is her best friend and she never had a best friends before (really? what about Winn and James?).

As far as supporting characters getting things to do season 2 was FAR FAR FAR superior than season 3. in Season 2 supporting characters (J'onn, Alex and James/Winn) actually had storylines that moved on their own pace. Season 3 it feels like everybody is always in a waiting pattern off screen till Kara has time for them, whether it makes sense for that character or not. Yay, so Lena has had this really big drama episode in episode 5 where she almost killed a guy and then reaffirmed her friendship with Sam and Kara. How about we don't show or mention her again till episode 9!

The writing for supporting characters has been atrocious this season for anybody except maybe Sam and Alex. IMO it's never been more obvious that the supporting characters are treated as super disposable tools rather than real characters with lives of their own.

Edited January 9, 2018 by tofutan

tv echo · January 9, 2018

Black Lightning star won't rule out a crossover with the Arrowverse
BY MORGAN JEFFERY 9 JANUARY 2018
http://www.digitalspy.com/tv/arrow/news/a847054/black-lightining-arrowverse-crossover/

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"I would totally love to see that," said McClain, who plays Jennifer Pierce, the youngest daughter of Jefferson Pierce / Black Lightning.
* * *
"We are not a part of the Arrowverse right now but that could very well change. I love all of the other DC shows. I feel like Arrow is very dark and that's very similar to our show, so I would love to see them cross over, and also I just love The Flash, I love Grant [Gustin], so that would be cool too."

McClain, who's also performed in the girl group McClain and sung on the soundtrack of Disney's Descendants 2, added: "We could do another musical episode! Fingers crossed on that. I would love to do that."

Edited January 9, 2018 by tv echo

tv echo · January 9, 2018

"Crisis on Earth-X": The Ten Best Lines
By RUSS BURLINGAME - January 8, 2018
http://comicbook.com/dc/2018/01/09/crisis-on-earth-x-the-ten-best-lines/

SLIDE 1/10 – BASICALLY THE WHOLE INTRODUCTION
SLIDE 2/10 – BASICALLY ANYTHING HEAT WAVE SAYS
SLIDE 3/10 – "NAZIS? I HATE NAZIS."
SLIDE 4/10 – "SUPER-SPEED: I DON'T HAVE IT."
SLIDE 5/10 – "BECAUSE I LIKE MEN. AND I LIKE WOMEN."
SLIDE 6/10 – "WHY DO YOU HAVE A KRYPTONITE ARROW?"
SLIDE 7/10 – "THEY WANTED TO WAIT..."
SLIDE 8/10 – "GET THE HELL OFF OUR EARTH"
SLIDE 9/10 – UP, UP, AND AWAY -- MAN OF STEEL
SLIDE 10/10 – JAX'S SPEECH

tv echo · January 9, 2018

BGN Exclusive interview with Mark Pedowitz, President of the CW
By Kay-B - January 7, 2018
https://blackgirlnerds.com/bgn-exclusive-interview-with-mark-pedowitz-president-of-the-cw/

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Kay-B: Thanks for chatting with Black Girl Nerds. So let’s jump right in, tell me about how important it is for the CW to tell the story of Black Lightning and the Pierce family now?

MP: Oh, that’s an easy one, it actually starts with Mara and Salim (Akil, co-creators and Executive producers). I’ve wanted to be in business with them for many, many, many years. It stems back to my days at ABC Studios. With Black Lightning, Fox had the pilot and they passed on it. So Salim and Mara came in and said this is what we have. It was different from all of our other superhero shows and it was never designed to be apart of the Arrowverse. It told the story of an educator, an upwardly mobile family, and a community. We thought that was a great point of view. It gave a different cultural perspective and God bless them, they stayed with that hook. They pushed it out and we have supported them the whole way.
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Kay-B: What sets Black Lightning apart? I am a huge Flash fan, so what sets it apart from The Flash and Arrow? DC’s Legends of Tomorrow is already kooky and hilarious on its own. How do you keep all four shows fresh and unique?

MP: You’re blessed with great showrunners with creative vision and who are collaborative to work with. None of it is easy though. Last season of The Flash was a little too earnest and this season the fun is back. Arrow recaptured what it was, and its good. Legends is just kooky and is just the most comic booky, comic book show (laughs). Caity (Lotz) who plays White Canary has come into her own as the leader and Dominic (Purcell) just makes me laugh.

Kay-B: Dominic’s character has great one liners and is so insane (laughs).

MP: As we’ve lost some characters this season, you will see new ones pop up.

Kay-B: That’s good to hear. I will say the departure of Firestorm as a unit was hard. The way Franz (Drameh) handled the material on his way out, he did a great job.

MP: He’s an incredible actor, but you might see Wally West (Keiynan Lonsdale) show up on Legends.
* * *
MP: I just saw a Legends episode with Tala Ashe (Zari Adrianna Tomaz).

Kay-B: Yes, the first Muslim superhero on TV!

MP: She literally has an episode that she just basically carries by herself, which was fantastic and funny.

Kay-B: So will Wally West be a permanent fixture on Legends?

MP: I can’t answer that, you’ll have to watch (laughs)!

Kay-B: You know I will, I just confessed my obsession with The Flash to you! With respect to Wally West, for a lot of people in this generation, comic book Wally West is the only Flash that they know, not Barry Allen, so I have been wanting them to utilize him more, since he is a great character and actor.

MP: You’ll see it.

Kay-B: When will we hear about the renewals?

MP: Just a couple more weeks, we weren’t ready yet. People now take us for granted doing it earlier and earlier, but we just weren’t ready. The holidays ended and we had a four day work week. It’ll all get resolved though and I think everyone will be happy when its done.
* * *
Kay-B: Final question, a lot of these networks have developed unique writing programs where they find and bring in fresh new writers. Is the CW interested in doing that at all?

MP: I actually was that started that program at ABC many many years ago. Because we have two really strong studios in Warner Brothers and CBS, who hav those programs, we rely on them. We are very conscious when we staff our shows to seek out new voices, diverse voices because we think its good for shows to have that representation.

Kay-B: So what would you recommend, how do people get into those programs?

MP: Just apply. Go to the CBS, NBC or ABC websites and find a way to apply.

Edited January 9, 2018 by tv echo

Starfish35 · January 9, 2018

Lineup for PaleyFest 2018.

Looks like none of the superhero shows are going this year. The only two CW shows on the schedule are Supernatural and Riverdale.

I wonder why no Black Lightning?

Oreo2234 · January 9, 2018

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Really? I think s3 is pretty awful in that regard. Winn had NOTHING to do all season. Nothing. We don't even know if he's together with his girlfriend anymore or not and the show even retconned his friendship to Kara to so they could hype up Sam and Lena some more. Characters and storylines constantly disappear without explanation. J'onn's father arrives to town, then is not mentioned for episodes, suddenly it's "oh, he was in the DEO the entire time, unable to find the bathroom". The Lena/James relationship went from 10% (we are slowly getting to know each other) to 100% (we are making out because other characters say that supposedly we've been pining for each other). The Sam/Kara "friendship" is a total joke, they have had like 1 conversation and suddenly Kara claims that Sam is her best friend and she never had a best friends before (really? what about Winn and James?).

As far as supporting characters getting things to do season 2 was FAR FAR FAR superior than season 3. in Season 2 supporting characters (J'onn, Alex and James/Winn) actually had storylines that moved on their own pace. Season 3 it feels like everybody is always in a waiting pattern off screen till Kara has time for them, whether it makes sense for that character or not. Yay, so Lena has had this really big drama episode in episode 5 where she almost killed a guy and then reaffirmed her friendship with Sam and Kara. How about we don't show or mention her again till episode 9!

The writing for supporting characters has been atrocious this season for anybody except maybe Sam and Alex. IMO it's never been more obvious that the supporting characters are treated as super disposable tools rather than real characters with lives of their own

Now that I think about it, your right. I was thinking that it was better balanced in the sense that no new character is dominating screentime as much as Mon-el did and in the early episodes they did seem to try to make the cast a little more integrated and less sectioned off but its true that the returning supporting characters don't have anything more to do than they did last year. Alex has an arc but its a story that could easily end up diminishing her character.

Sakura12 · January 9, 2018

They really are not hyping or promoting Black Lightening. You think they would. I'll be checking it out but any regular tv viewer would barely know it's exists. My friend only watches the Flash and doesn't follow anything online didn't know about that show. She said she vaguely remembers a quick promo that may have been for it, but didn't really pay attention to it.

Edited January 9, 2018 by Sakura12

tv echo · January 9, 2018

25 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Lineup for PaleyFest 2018.

Looks like none of the superhero shows are going this year. The only two CW shows on the schedule are Supernatural and Riverdale.

I wonder why no Black Lightning?

Probably used up their budget on the DC in D.C. event.

Oreo2234 · January 9, 2018

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They really are not hyping or promoting Black Lightening. You think they would. I'll be checking it out but any regular tv viewer would barely know it's exists. My friend only watches the Flash and doesn't follow anything online didn't know about that show. She said she vaguely remembers a quick promo that may have been for it, but didn't really pay attention to it.

I agree. The promotion has been really lackluster, even the promotion on the CW hasn't been that good, maybe I'm not watching at the right time but all I recall is blink and you miss it promos.

Xander · January 9, 2018

21 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

They really are not hyping or promoting Black Lightening. You think they would. I'll be checking it out but any regular tv viewer would barely know it's exists. My friend only watches the Flash and doesn't follow anything online didn't know about that show. She said she vaguely remembers a quick promo that may have been for it, but didn't really pay attention to it.

Someone saw an ad for it on ESPN so they are advertising it.

thegirlsleuth · January 9, 2018

Even though it's Marvel, I would have thought CW PR would try to latch onto the hype around Black Panther. Black Panther is going to be huge, and critically, the advanced buzz on it is excellent. I don't want to pigeonhole the movie or the tv show, but Black Panther is generating a lot of conversation, and it seems like Black Lightning should be capitalizing on that. Between the TCAs, the release of the new Black Panther trailer, and its debut coming up, this should be the week where we're seeing press, and I'm not seeing it, although I will admit that most of the press I read about the Berlanti shows comes because @tv echo is so amazing at finding all the press mentions.

Edited January 9, 2018 by thegirlsleuth

tofutan · January 9, 2018

I read there are some billboards and stuff around the city where they are shooting it.

statsgirl · January 9, 2018

I'm wondering if they are waiting to see how Black Panther does and if it does well, then they'll tag on to that. I f it doesn't, then they'll rely more on social media. Sadly even in 2018 POC programs are still a niche area unless they're comedies like Blackish or Fresh Off The Boat.

1 hour ago, Oreo2234 said:

Now that I think about it, your right. I was thinking that it was better balanced in the sense that no new character is dominating screentime as much as Mon-el did and in the early episodes they did seem to try to make the cast a little more integrated and less sectioned off but its true that the returning supporting characters don't have anything more to do than they did last year. Alex has an arc but its a story that could easily end up diminishing her character.

It is better balanced in terms of All of the supporting cast more or less having a life of their own (Lena took over Catco plus a new for in the evil industrialist, J'onn has his father, James finally had a storyline running the paper as opposed to the 'S by is he still on the show?' Guardian of last season and Alex has engagement/ break-up/possible adoption as well as finally reconnecting with Kara. Winn is the only one without one unique to him but he's still got lots to do at the DEO.

They still haven't learned to balance the show the way LoT can but few shows can, even ones that are promoted as ensembles which Supergirl isn't. I'm 300% enjoying this season more than the last one so no complaints from me right now.

tofutan · January 9, 2018

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It is better balanced in terms of All of the supporting cast more or less having a life of their own (Lena took over Catco plus a new for in the evil industrialist, J'onn has his father, James finally had a storyline running the paper as opposed to the 'S by is he still on the show?' Guardian of last season and Alex has engagement/ break-up/possible adoption as well as finally reconnecting with Kara. Winn is the only one without one unique to him but he's still got lots to do at the DEO.

In season 2 Winn and James were working on getting Guardian off the ground. Winn fell in love with an alien and dealt with the ensuing relationship troubles. J'onn met M'gann, learned her secret and forgave her. Alex had her coming out story and experienced various relationship troubles and angsted over her father's return. Lena wasn't even a regular and she dealt with mommy issues, had her ex-boyfriend return and had a storyline with Rhea the main villain.

Season 2 was all about giving all of the supporting cast a life.

And unlike in season 3, those storylines actually flowed in a somewhat sensible manner, rather than being constantly stop-go, stop-go, stop-go.

James has done nothing meaningful jobwise at CatCo, Lena just walks all over him and then he doesn't get a rebuttal. Now that they are dating it looks like he will finally get to accompany on their regular "threaten the evil industrialist" runs, but the show jumped to kissing almost instantly, with basically no setup for their feeling in that episode, after not showing them for together for 3 episodes (like either of them confiding in their friends that they have a crush) And J'onn's storyline is perfect for showing off this terrible "stop and go" writing. Rather than: this is the episode where J'onn meets his father, okay this is the next episode where he angsts about it or tells about about it (you know, the way normal people would behave), the father is suddenly gone without an explanation and if you saw J'onn in those episodes, you'd never guess he had a father.

I don't begrudge people if they happen to find s3 more their style, but the idea that the writing for the supporting cast is better or that the characters have more of a life is just ridiculous. (for record, I don't consider Alex supporting cast, she's the secondary lead) IMO nothing showcases this more than the extremely shitty writing during Kara's Christmas party where Kara praises Lena (?) and Sam (????) for helping her through the hard times and says she never had best friends before. When what we actually SAW was James and WInn and J'onn all do way more to help Kara emotionally in the earlier episodes. And then they talk about how James and Lena have been into each other for weeks when again, nothing that was clearly identified as already romantic was shown and at that point Lena and James hadn't shared screentime in 3 episodes. Another top contender is the episode where Mon-El returns and James shows up for a single scene at the DEO just to exposition how awesome Mon-El and Kara were and then is gone from the episode again. And of course the scene where M'yrrn wanders around the halls of the DEO and Winn informs us we are supposed to believe that he has been there the entire time. For supporting characters? The writing has been downright awful in s3.

People might enjoy the "what" of certain things (yay! Lena at CatCo! yay! the female characters sitting around and sipping wine because that is how strong female relationships work !?! yay James gets to be Lena's busboy but at least he is no longer guardian except when he still is!) but the execution, the actual scene to scene writing is just cringeworthy bad.

Edited January 9, 2018 by tofutan

statsgirl · January 9, 2018

The storylines for the supporting cast feel more integrated with the show overall this season. Last year everyone was on their own little island, even Alex who only interacted with Kara when it was time for Kara to give her a pep talk about her love life. James may have had a handful of episodes becoming the Guardian but he never fought with the DEO even when they needed him. It was like the show only cared about Kara/ Mon El and Alex/ Maggie and the other characters got crumbs of C and D stories because they were being paid so the show might as well use them. Winn/Lyra was pure filler and the biggest reaction to James' Guardian arc was "Why hasn't he been dropped from the show yet?" Even Lena's story I couldn't connect to, it was so scattered. The best done was J'onn and M'gann but that didn't come together till the end of the season.

I think that to write for an ensemble cast, which every multi season show needs to do unless it's Quantum Leap, they not only need to write stories for the characters, those stories need to be part of the main show.

BkWurm1 · January 9, 2018

11 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

That is certainly true, and its a big plus that LoT has when it comes to writing for an ensemble. There isn't anything wrong with having one main hero like the other shows, and maybe it is unfair to compare them, but I also feel like the other shows have frequently struggled with their larger casts, and giving them subplots that dont feel like padding to keep the actors around. Like how much Supergirl has had trouble figuring out what to do with Jimmy after Kara found a new love interest, or the issues that Arrow has had incorporating their newbies into the show, I dont think the writers are awful at writing for multiple characters (which all of the shows have now) but they do have problems with it in ways that the LoT writers dont.

5

I think at times shows with a main lead fall into the trap of thinking that because they are not an ensemble show with a bunch of co leads, that they don't have to write for an ensemble but once a cast has more than 2 or 3 main regular cast members, writers are just fooling themselves. They are writing for an ensemble just one that has to tie back to the main character, and the artificial limits they place on themselves like only letting Dinah interact in any significant manner with Diggle but not Felicity (or having letting Diggle interact mostly with Dinah and very little Felicity), the show feels smaller, less real. The story should dictate interaction, not forced restrictions. There have been so many times where it makes no sense for certain characters not to be interacting. It pulls one out of the show and all it would take is a little of the ensemble mentality to mix things up and make it better. It's an ongoing frustration of mine.

23 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

The storylines for the supporting cast feel more integrated with the show overall this season. Last year everyone was on their own little island, even Alex who only interacted with Kara when it was time for Kara to give her a pep talk about her love life. James may have had a handful of episodes becoming the Guardian but he never fought with the DEO even when they needed him. It was like the show only cared about Kara/ Mon El and Alex/ Maggie and the other characters got crumbs of C and D stories because they were being paid so the show might as well use them. Winn/Lyra was pure filler and the biggest reaction to James' Guardian arc was "Why hasn't he been dropped from the show yet?" Even Lena's story I couldn't connect to, it was so scattered. The best done was J'onn and M'gann but that didn't come together till the end of the season.

I think that to write for an ensemble cast, which every multi season show needs to do unless it's Quantum Leap, they not only need to write stories for the characters, those stories need to be part of the main show.

6

I very much agree. Last year the side characters got to do stuff but it often felt like busy work to get them out of the way since it was stuff that just didn't matter when it came to telling the main story. Their reason for being on the show is their relationship with Kara and it feels like they have that this year again. I do like when side characters get their own development but it has to matter in relation to the rest of the show and I don't think anyone can explain to me what makes Guardian relevant when they have Supergirl. At least the show certainly hasn't managed to do that. But this year as Kara'a friend and boss who's been allowed back into her sphere which also includes Lena, I feel like James matters again even if he's not doing as much.

SmallScreenDiva · January 9, 2018

I need some help identifying the guy Felicity hugs in this GIF. It's been bugging me not knowing since the crossover:

BkWurm1 · January 9, 2018

Could that be Barry's boss from the police station? The one that Mick ends up sitting next to in the church?

Scratch that. That's Wally, isn't it. He had the fancy suit and the slicked back hair.

Edited January 9, 2018 by BkWurm1

tofutan · January 9, 2018

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Last year everyone was on their own little island,

Which is not the same as not having a life of her their own. They very much had a life of their own it just happened to be away from Kara. Hence, characters having a "life of their own" in season 3 is not novel, they had way more "life of their own" in season 2.

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The storylines for the supporting cast feel more integrated

That doesn't mean that they are well written. And in what way is J'onn's storyline well integrated with everybody? Even James/Lena haven't really been properly integrated so far (though they might be in the future).

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, even Alex who only interacted with Kara when it was time for Kara to give her a pep talk about her love life

This is factually untrue. Top of my head had scenes about Superman/Clark, they had scenes about Jeremiah, not to mention they had scenes about Alex love life. (aside from the fact that in season 3 ALSO plenty of scenes the sisters had were either about Alex or Kara's love life)

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. Winn/Lyra was pure filler

And yet it is more than Winn has gotten this season.

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the biggest reaction to James' Guardian arc was "

That doesn't change that he got point of view and actual agency in this story and for a while at least actual follow through. While this season he frequently was used just to give pep talks to people. Read precisely what people mean when they talk about shitty lead versus supporting cast distribution.

Again, just because you enjoy the result (pretty people of your preference standing around in a scene together) doesn't mean that it's well written, such as them never being allowed to actually do or say anything meaningful or the way they got into this scene being highly questionable and crowbarred in (such as shitting all over Kara's friendship with Winn and James so they can pretend that Kara and Sam have a meaningful friendship) And continuity and "show don't tell" and characters having their own agency was extremely poor in s3 so far. The "what" is not the same as the "how". And the "how" of season 3 is terrible, it's just that people don't give a shit about good writing as long as they get what they want. So hey, who cares if the show passes Sam off as a friend of Kara's even though they've only exchanged two sentences of personal information and Sam sees no reason to inform her "best friends" and "sisters" about the fact that she's been having strange blackouts. But let's keep on pretending that they are good friends just because the actresses look pretty together in scenes sipping wine and not talking about anything of substance. Because hey, sitting around and drinking wine is totally what Supergirl is about!

Now, I'm glad that James is getting a love interest because love interest usually means more story and screentime. But even I think that this was not properly built up. Even Winn and Lyra had a more natural getting together. But yeah, if the show was actually treating these characters and relationships like realistic people then maybe Lena could have told her "best friend" and "sister" Kara or Sam about developing feelings for James.

tofutan · January 9, 2018

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I do like when side characters get their own development but it has to matter in relation to the rest of the show and I don't think anyone can explain to me what makes Guardian relevant when they have Supergirl. At least the show certainly hasn't managed to do that. But this year as Kara'a friend and boss who's been allowed back into her sphere which also includes Lena, I feel like James matters again even if he's not doing as much.

Guardian matters because it was about James exploring something he wanted. (and on a meta level: he matters to the show because that way they can do additional action scenes that cost less special effects money than the Supergirl scenes). He might not matter to the world, but he matters to James. Why shouldn't James get to explore his heroism or J'onn gets to explore his heritage, especially since the point of these stories is usually to create overarching themes or serve as parallels to other stories.

To me a more multicast approach is when characters get their own life rather than just serving the lead. It's a matter of taste when they say, no, actually they prefer a setup that his hierarchical around the lead where supporting characters serve the lead and don't have meaningful storylines with each other. That's fine. But then be aware that that's what you are saying: I prefer the hierarchical lead structure, just like it was in season 1.

But as far as supporting cast getting screentime in actual storylines, season 2 was definitely more there than season 3.

And the "choppyness" of the stories is a perfect example. Like the constantly disappearing M'yrnn. Or take Morgan Edge. So in 5 Morgan Edge is dealt a major blow by having his plans foiled, but he still manages to walk off scott free by none of the evidence sticking to him. Then suddenly 4 episodes later Lena is on the kill list of a gang.

The *logical* way to write this story would have been "Morgan Edge is dealt a major blow, that's why he starts plotting his revenge immediately" or "Morgan Edge has been dealt a major blow, because of this he is involved in some sort of legal battle, but as soon as he's back he puts his next plan into motion".

Instead things on SG S3 just happen randomly. Characters don't behave like real people because they are "on a break" while Kara cares about other things. It's like nobody is moving while Kara is not looking rather than people having a life of their own.

And I genuinely don't understand how you can just ignore the show just leaving out huge chunks of the story by just telling us they happened (ie Sam helping Kara with her problems, James and Lena flirting). In what universe is that good writing? Just because you think that the show scores higher in one category (being integrated/having more screentime with Kara) doesn't mean that those flaws in other categories don't exist (even if those are not categories you care about).

Supergirl s3 is badly written on a bare bones nuts and bolts level because events happen randomly rather than linking into each other, characters often act like scene dispenser when he show has some time left over to feel like showing us M'yrnn again rather than acting in a timely fashion and the show several times presents us relationships taking huge leaps in intensity despite not showing us any of the linking scenes.

(by comparison, Alex/Ruby is not badly written when it comes to build up, people just understandably hate it because they don't like the idea of where it is going, but on a writing level the show has put in actual effort to them slowly getting to know each other rather than rushing things and giving us insight why Alex feels certain things and then invested considerable time to have Alex deal with these things and reflect on them. This is the show actually putting in the work to build this story, it just happens to be wasted on a story that everybody hates because they hate the concept of the outcome)

Edited January 9, 2018 by tofutan

tv echo · January 9, 2018

Today's NY Times article on Black Lightning (warning: rest of article contains spoiler for opening minutes of pilot)...

On ‘Black Lightning,’ a Superhero Takes On Race, Justice and the Real World
By DAVE ITZKOFF JAN. 9, 2018
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/09/arts/television/black-lightning-dc-superhero-cw.html

Quote

“Black Lightning,” which debuts on Jan. 16, shares its roots in the comic-book adventures that have yielded other CW shows like “Arrow,” “The Flash” and “Supergirl.” But where those other programs often coat their real-world commentary in layers of allegory, “Black Lightning” takes on issues of race and social justice directly and unambiguously.
* * *
In that situation, Mr. Akil could not call on any superhuman abilities. But he sees “Black Lightning” and the platform it provides as a power in its own right.
* * *
In 2015, when the Akils struck an overall TV deal with Warner Bros., the parent company of DC, they inquired about the Milestone characters. Those properties were unavailable, but Warner Bros. instead offered them Black Lightning.
* * *
As Mr. Akil recalled that conversation, “Mara’s the very expressive one and I tried to be cool, like Miles Davis cool. I just sat there, like, ‘That sounds interesting.’ But inside, I was like, oh, yeah.”

Mr. Akil added, “To me, Jefferson Pierce represented every side of me. I knew that I would be able to flesh him out.”
* * *
Of particular interest to the Akils was the idea that Black Lightning had set aside his superhero status and returned to it in middle age.

“It echoes the idea that we can all get into this fight, at whatever place in our lives, at whatever age,” Ms. Akil said. “There’s a lot to fix, a lot to make right, and it’s not going to solve itself.”
* * *
A veteran of TV shows like “Nash Bridges,” “Prison Break,” “Friday Night Lights” and “Hart of Dixie,” Mr. [Cress] Williams had auditioned for the lead on “Luke Cage,” the Netflix series based on that Marvel character.

When it instead went to Mike Colter, Mr. Williams said, “That was rough. I can be honest at this point. Everybody who knew me knew that I desperately wanted to do that. But when you don’t get a role, you lick your wounds and move on.”
* * *
Greg Berlanti, an executive producer of CW’s many comic-book adaptations, including “Arrow,” “The Flash” and “Riverdale,” as well as “Black Lightning,” said it was more important that Mr. Akil feel a sense of investment in his show than have it conform to other DC superhero shows.

“I think it’s compatible,” Mr. Berlanti said of “Black Lightning,” “but I also think it’s an evolution. These shows, whether we’re a part of them or not, are only going to stay interesting, exciting and relevant for the audience if there are fresh voices behind them. New people with new stories to tell have to lead the charge. What’s so exciting is that Salim is one of those people.”
* * *
If “Black Lightning” has worked the way he is hoping, Mr. Akil said he’ll know at the end of October.

“If I’m walking down the street or taking my kids trick-or-treating,” he said, “and I see some young girls or boys who are dressed up like Black Lightning, that, to me would be success.”

Edited January 9, 2018 by tv echo

Starfish35 · January 9, 2018

I really do hope the show does well and get amazing ratings.

tv echo · January 9, 2018

Two positive media reviews of Black Lightning (allegedly spoiler-free, but there are minor spoilers) - I've tried not to quote any spoilery parts...

BLACK LIGHTNING: "THE RESURRECTION" REVIEW
DAVID GRIFFIN 8 JAN 2018
http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/01/08/black-lightning-the-resurrection-review

Quote

Lightning has struck for a fifth time with the newest addition to The CW’s stacked live-action superhero lineup -- joining Supergirl, The Flash, Arrow and DC’s Legends of Tomorrow. While Black Lightning won’t be involved with the rest of the crew in a 5-way crossover anytime soon, there is plenty to get excited about when the series premieres on January 16th.
* * *
The world of Black Lightning feels alive with real-world issues at the forefront of its story. Creators Salim and Mara Brock Akil have left out the league of assassins, interdimensional speedsters, and alien invaders in order to focus on gang violence, police brutality, and racism within the black community. If you take away the superhero angle, Black Lightning would still be a great drama series on its own.

Williams is excellent as Jefferson. He skillfully inhabits the roles of father, principal, and superhero seamlessly. Since most of The CW heroes are so young, it’s a nice change of pace to see a hero who’s already lived that lifestyle and tried to do something different. Instead of smashing heads in, Jefferson is trying to make sure young people are getting a good education and staying off the streets.
* * *
Black Lightning also does a wonderful job of fleshing out its villains. Like The Wire, moral ambiguity thrives due to strong character development. The men and women of The One Hundred are complex and have their own stories to tell. They’re not just simple fodder for Jefferson to hurl electricity at.
* * *
Black Lightning doesn't redefine the superhero genre, but it does do an excellent job of grounding its characters in a realistic world where the weight of their decisions feels more important than those of the other live-action DC shows. There is room for growth in what is already a strong beginning to the series.

Black Lightning Review: The CW's New Super-Drama Tells A Powerful And Electrifying Story
BY NICK VENABLE January 8, 2018
https://www.cinemablend.com/television/1768390/black-lightning-review-the-cws-new-super-drama-tells-a-powerful-and-electrifying-story

Quote

The CW has cornered part of the market when it comes to TV superheroes, with the Arrow-verse shows thriving among dedicated (if not enormous) fanbases. The network will soon introduce audiences to a new hero with Black Lightning, and as shocked as I am to say it -- no pun intended -- Black Lightning is as stunningly well-realized and relevant as any other comic book series out there, and it immediately stands out from the Arrow-verse, casting those shows in a ghostly pale light. With its pitch-perfect cast, action-packed drama and emotional sincerity, Black Lightning is the new king of Superhero TV.
* * *
We've seen gang violence depicted on TV many times before, but rarely within these specific contexts, since Black Lightning is a story as much about hope and heroism than it is about violence and social decay. One factor that helps keep this show separate from the other currently unconnected Arrow-verse shows -- as well as from the de facto comparison series, Netflix's Luke Cage -- is its non-metropolitan setting. Though the Black Lightning comics were initially set in an outskirts neighborhood of Metropolis, the live-action series altered its comic book location, which allows the ironically titled Freeland to develop its own troubled identity, which can't be done with series set in giant and well-established locations like New York City, Central City and others.

Black Lightning creators Mara Brock Akil and Salim Akil also made this series stand apart by putting a spin on the stereotypical origin story. Similar to how Netflix's The Punisher was more about re-embracing a vengeful persona than crafting one outright, Black Lightning also shows us why someone would NOT want to become a city-saving superhero, balancing the glorification and the downfalls accordingly. And one assumes that the show will dig into all the characters' pasts to show fans what went wrong during Black Lightning's initial reign, ....

Despite providing a realistically gritty tone, Black Lightning is far from a total downer-fest, even if there isn't a Cisco or Mick around to drop silly one-liners. We've somehow made it this far without talking about the magnificence of the Black Lightning character himself, who doles out punishment largely through devastating punches and kicks that are bolstered by Jefferson's lightning powers, which are enhanced by his flashy-yet-dapper costume. (Though if a complaint is to be made, it's that other characters fail to recognize Jefferson beneath Black Lightning's goggles or mask.) It's both visual and mental splendor to watch him do the damned thing, and the fight scenes here are thankfully closer to Arrow than The Flash, with choreographed brawls and more blood spatter that I'd have expected. The 100 do not fight clean.

Edited January 9, 2018 by tv echo

Trini · January 9, 2018

2 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

I need some help identifying the guy Felicity hugs in this GIF. It's been bugging me not knowing since the crossover:

It's Wally.

statsgirl · January 10, 2018

6 hours ago, tv echo said:

the fight scenes here are thankfully closer to Arrow than The Flash

LOL.

I'm glad to see it's getting positive reviews.

6 hours ago, tofutan said:

Again, just because you enjoy the result (pretty people of your preference standing around in a scene together) doesn't mean that it's well written,

I don't think it's well written yet. Just better written than s2.

Last season Supergirl kept dropping all the emotional beats that would have connected me to the show. Setting aside Kara/Mon El, which was pretty much Kara's entire storyline for the season, Alex/Maggie zipped through Alex's arc I thought and was even worse with Maggie. In the Valentine's Day episode, Alex is disappointed because Maggie doesn't want to celebrate. Kara goes to Maggie to persuade her to change her mind and hears the heart-breaking reason why. The emotional beat would be to explore it through Maggie's eyes and contrast her journey about her sexuality with Alex's. Instead we got Kara callously telling Maggie to give in because Alex has always loved Valentine's Day since she was a little girl and so she did.

James' Guardian arc looks better on paper than it did on screen. James decided that he wanted to be a fighter in a blink-and-you'll-miss-it moment that wasn't properly explored (we got more of his thinking in s1 when he told Kara about his father's camera) and from then on, it was completely tangential to the rest of the show. They could have tied it in to the idea of what really makes a hero? that they were dancing around with Mon El and J'onn's feelings about White Martians but it looks like no one on the show thought of that. Or really any reason to tie James or the Guardian to what else was happening on the show.

But that's just my opinion and we'll have to agree to disagree.

ETA: one thing I have to give props to the Arrow writers for is that they connect the theme of the season to multiple characters and situations on the show, not just the lead.

Edited January 10, 2018 by statsgirl

BkWurm1 · January 10, 2018

4 hours ago, tofutan said:

(by comparison, Alex/Ruby is not badly written when it comes to build up, people just understandably hate it because they don't like the idea of where it is going, but on a writing level the show has put in actual effort to them slowly getting to know each other rather than rushing things and giving us insight why Alex feels certain things and then invested considerable time to have Alex deal with these things and reflect on them. This is the show actually putting in the work to build this story, it just happens to be wasted on a story that everybody hates because they hate the concept of the outcome)

1

I actually don't have a big problem with Ruby or the potential storyline with Alex. They write her a bit young but I've come to expect that in these shows and I've seen the actress in another role and she did just fine so I don't think there will be a problem in the long run.

TwistedandBored · January 10, 2018

2 hours ago, Trini said:

It's Wally.

He looked good during the crossover. It is shame they didn't use him that much since he had the best moves.

Oreo2234 · January 10, 2018

Quote

I actually don't have a big problem with Ruby or the potential storyline with Alex. They write her a bit young but I've come to expect that in these shows and I've seen the actress in another role and she did just fine so I don't think there will be a problem in the long run.

I find Ruby very irritating (no offence to the actress) so I don't have any desire to see her character continue on the show and I can't imagine any stories Alex has relating to her being interesting. I also think having a kid could and probably will limit what stories they can or we will be willing to do with Alex.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Oreo2234

tennisgurl · January 10, 2018

My next "this hiatus is super long and I get bored WAY too easily at work" thought experiment? What if the Arrowverse did a week of Elseworld stories?

In DC comics, Elseworld stories are out of continuity stories putting characters into new situations or settings, and just having a fun little thought experiment about it. Usually it involved changing the time period (what if Batman lived in the Victorian Era?) or some kind of Alternate Universe based on a change in the story (what if Superman landed in the USSR instead of Kansas?) or just a What If story (what if everyone just randomly lost their powers?), and they just play with interesting ideas that they normally cant do due to continuity issues, or because it would be such a huge change to the story, characters, or setting. It would be a bit like when they explore the various Alternate Earths (you see characters you know in totally different ways) but without having to worry about continuity. I mean, I guess they could easily work it into continuity if they wanted (The Music Miester is up to his old tricks again!) but I think it would be fun to just have all four shows just do something totally different as an opportunity to let the actors play with something different, or a try a new setting.

Like "What if Arrow took place in ancient Rome" or "What would happen if Iris got super powers instead of Barry?" or "What if LoT took place on a steampunk Earth" or even "What if Rip Hunter gathered a different bunch of weirdos for his mission?" or "What if Supergirl made it to Earth when she was supposed to, and she was Clark's mentor? " or "What if everyone with superpowers lost them, and everyone without them got superpowers?" or stuff like that? Does that sound interesting, or is it just me?

tofutan · January 10, 2018

Quote

But that's just my opinion and we'll have to agree to disagree.

It just seems weird to me that you'd call that "the characters finally getting a life of their own" when to me s3 is bascically exactly the opposite. To me s2 fulfills "life of their own" way more because the storylines were actually progressing without Kara. It just seems like a huge contrast when what sparked the discussion originally was praise for Legends for Tomorrow because Legends actually lets non-main characters have storylines together and then people turn around and say James (despite not doing much) feels like he "matters" again just because he is doing nothing next to Kara than last season when he got a storyline about slowly bonding with Winn which imo culimnated/climaxed when James told Winn he considers him a brother now. On Legends, nobody would ever consider that character and relationship development somehow does not count just because Sara is not around when Mick has a deep storyline about his messed up father supported by Nate or just because Sara so far has paid little attention to the Amaya/Zari/Totem storyline.

For the record, I don't think that s2 had flawless or great writing either, but imo the "nuts and bolt" writing is just so much worse in s3 and particularly for supporting characters, it's been a huge drowngrade, particularly due to

1.) this tendency for storylines to just stop/the associated characters to disappear without in show explanation or reason and then resume again at a later point even though that's not how normal people would react to situations. Ie if your dad who you thought was dead and who was abused and tortured for years was back in your life that would be a big deal to you. The show could have solved this by throwaway lines (if I didn't want to show it on screen) like "I'm taking some time off to spend with my father" or "my father right now is doing X, he is fine, thanks for asking".

2.) character relationships take completely unrealistic leaps without the show providing the scenes to justify them. The show constantly uses scenes that never actually happened/they never bothered to show us tp justify moves it makes. The James/Lena move in episode 9 could easily have been improved by like one scene where Kara calls him out on liking Lena in a previous episode and them talking about it and maybe the occasional throwaway line by Kara about how Lena is (like when he came to the DEO to sing the praises of Karamel). That would have shown his point of view, better built up James and Lena by letting us actually know more about what he feels for her (is it a crush? sexual attraction? feeling protective of her? is he weirded out by being romantically fond a Luthor? hesistant to pursue it because she is his boss? insecure about her wanting him or him fitting into her life?) and built up the James/Kara friendship a bit more and let it feel more natural. Or do the opposite, have Lena confide in Kara about digging James before 9 or have Kara or Sam call her out on it or at least exchange knowing looks any time before 2 seconds beforer Lena and James jump each other. The show didn't even bother to tell us what happened after the kiss? We see them walking the streets together, so what happened? Did they sleep together? Did they feel the kiss was a mistake and agreed to go back being professionals? Did they agree to try and date? I feel like I have no idea what the current state of James and Lena's relationship is because the show didn't bother to show us their feelings after the kiss just like they didn't bother showing us the scenes of what Kara referenced had been going on between them. Things just "happen" rather than events and scenes leading into each other.

I don't fault anybody for LIKING s3 better, but to me statements like "characters getting a life of their own" (indicating that that wasn't the case before) or that this season has been good for supporting characters are just not justified by what I see on screen. There has been a lot of clumsy writing this season and supporting characters are particularly hit hard by it.

==> That doesn't mean that s3 can't be better by most people's metrics. Kara and Alex ARE the main characters so if those two have more consistent writing now that is worth it a lot to make the show feel more consistent overall. But imo on the fringes, the writing has been cutting a lot of corners and imo the supporting storylines and relationships are hit particularly hard by it. And to me that comes across as the show not really respecting those supporting characters if they don't bother writing them consistently and have them react to the events in their lives in any kind of realistic fashion.

I do think the show dropped the ball on James Guardian storyline in s2 for example by tying it back in thematically with Mon-El's heroism story. But to me it still felt like a logical progression. James wants to be a hero, James intiates steps to make it happen, James encounters obstacles (like when Guardian is framed for murder), which is what one would expect to happen and overcomes them, James is found out by Kara and it leads to conflict, James deals with "leadership problems" when Winn's girlfriend wants on the team, James encounters limits to what he can achieve as Guardian when he realizes that people don't look up to him the way they look up to Supergirl. They picked a topic for him and explored various angles of it.

James and Lena dealing with running CatCo together is a concept that looks neat on paper but so far nothing has been done with it. In ep2 James was upset that Lena didn't invite him for meetings, Lena indicated that she would bring him along to meetings now. This is the extent of "stories about running CatCo". Oh right, there was this throwaway conversation where Lena wants to run ads that are disguised as articles (one of things that are commonly considered one of the shittiest popular journalism practises), James doesn't like it, but with one throwaway line it is decided that it should be done anyway. Them clashing over this could easily have been an entire episode B plot. None of this has lead to meaningful actual storylines to explore this concept, something that was the case with Guardian (James deals with being framed, James deals with Winn getting injured on the job, James clashes with Kara over whether as a human he is strong enough to put himself into danger, James deals with leadership decisions, James deals with whether he is not inspiring enough).

BTW, speaking of things that were not followed up on, remember how the reason started with it looking like Kara and Reign were sharing a dream? Which was all weird because it looked like Alura was in Sam's dream too? The creature from Reign's dream showed up again when she had a vision of the hologramm lady and there was something that could be a veiled reference when Kara and Sam both mentioned that they've been having trouble sleeping. But other than that? There's been no progress on that whatsoever, I'm not even sure whether they just forgot about that.

Edited January 10, 2018 by tofutan

Trini · January 10, 2018

5 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

My next "this hiatus is super long and I get bored WAY too easily at work" thought experiment? What if the Arrowverse did a week of Elseworld stories?

I always like 'alternate reality' stories! It's nice for a change of pace or perspective, and to see the actors do something new. The Flash and Legends have done them several times, but I'm not sure how'd they get Supergirl and Arrow especially to do them. But it doesn't necessarily need an explanation if it's truly an Elseworlds story. I don't mind some occasional filler - IF it's actually fun and entertaining; but the TPTB might think it's risky to do something outside of continuity on these mostly serialized shows.

tv echo · January 10, 2018

Misc. filming spoilers...

Edited January 10, 2018 by tv echo

tv echo · January 10, 2018

17 NEW TV SHOWS PREMIERING IN 2018 (THAT WE ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT)
Sci-Fi, Fantasy, and more for the nerdy crowd.
By Peter McPherson Jan 9, 2018
https://www.nerdmuch.com/tv/152751/new-tv-shows-premiering-in-2018-sci-fi-fantasy/

Quote

Black Lightning, The CW — January 16
...
The latest DC series comes from executive producer Greg Berlanti (Arrow, The Flash) — Black Lightning is in good hands.

Based off of the classic comic (and drawing a lot from the source material), Black Lightning follows high school principal Jefferson Pierce (Cress Williams), who retired from his days fighting crime as a superhero ten years ago to spend more time with his family and serve the community in a new way. But the day has come for the lightning-wielding hero to return; a gang known as “The One Hundred” threatens to take over the city, and Jefferson Pierce must once again don the mantle of Black Lightning. But can he manage to hold his family and his community together at the same time?

Pierce may not be the only one in the family with the powers—his daughters Anissa (Nafessa Williams) and Jennifer (China Anne McClain) just might join him in his quest to fight crime.
* * *
The Oath, Crackle — March 8
...
From executive producer 50 Cent and G-Unit Film and Television Inc. comes a gritty drama about gangs within the police force.

The show follows Sean Bean (Game of Thrones, The Lord of the Rings) and his son Ryan Kwanten (True Blood) and their involvement with the cop gang known as The Ravens. They are joined by Arlen Escarpeta (The Magicians), Cory Hardrict (American Sniper), Katrina Law (Arrow), and J. J. Soria (Animal Kingdom). We don’t know much more about the story just yet, but this look at the alliances and corruption within the police should be intense.
* * *
Krypton, Syfy — March 21
...
In another DC prequel series, Superman fans will get a look at the hero’s homeplanet before its destruction.

Cameron Cuffe stars as Superman’s grandfather, Seyg-El, in his fight to repair his family name and save the world. Returning to the world of Superman is executive producer David S. Goyer (The Dark Knight, Man of Steel).

Krypton should give fans a Superman story that’s closer to the comics than Smallworld was. Hopefully the show’s setting is able to draw in new fans as well. The special effects certainly look dazzling enough so far, but strong characters are what will carry this prequel mini-series forward.
* * *
Titans, Unnamed DC Comics service — TBA 2018
...
According to Deadline, Titans will air on a new streaming service specifically for DC shows—time will tell how this works out for Warner Bros.

We know that the cast will include Brenton Thwaites as Dick Grayson (or Robin), Anna Diop as Starfire, and Teagan Croft as Raven.

Whether or not people will be willing to pay for a DC streaming service is yet to be seen, but hopefully Titans will make a strong addition to the lineup of DC shows.
* * *
Cloak & Dagger, Freeform — TBA 2018
...
Based on the comic book superhero duo, Cloak & Dagger is the newest Marvel TV series, is expected to premier in 2018.

It follows two teenagers, Tyrone Johnson (Aubrey Joseph) and Tandy Bowen (Olivia Holt), who both have dark and troubled pasts but come together when they develop strange powers. Cloak and Dagger has a chance to be a great coming-of-age story, but it could also develop into something much bigger.

Cloak and Dagger will be Freeform’s first Marvel series, and Joe Pokaski (Heroes) will serve as showrunner.

Philip K. Dick’s Electric Dreams, Amazon Prime — January 12
Black Lightning, The CW — January 16
Corporate, Comedy Central — January 17
Counterpart, Starz — January 21
The Alienist, TNT — January 22
Altered Carbon, Netflix — February 2
Our Cartoon President, Showtime — February 11
Stargate Origins, Stargate Streaming Service — February 15
Hard Sun, Hulu — March 7
The Oath, Crackle — March 8
Krypton, Syfy — March 21
The Terror, AMC — March 26
Siren, Freeform — March 29
Castle Rock, Hulu — TBA 2018
Titans, Unnamed DC Comics service — TBA 2018
Cloak & Dagger, Freeform — TBA 2018
Disenchantment, Netflix — TBA 2018

Edited January 10, 2018 by tv echo

tv echo · January 10, 2018

tofutan · January 10, 2018

Yet another Supergirl trailer, showing off a lot of Reign with her priestess mentor (does she have a name yet?)

bijoux · January 10, 2018

Stan Lee Accused of Sexual Misconduct, Denies Allegations

Morrigan2575 · January 10, 2018

Dude's 95 freaking years old, grieving a dead wife and got bilked out of 300K in a check scam. I'm inclined to believe he's suffering a deterioating mental state than wilful abuser.

Upon further reading I'm calling Bullshit until/unless something more credible (NOT the Daily Mail) puts something out.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Morrigan2575

LeighAn · January 10, 2018

These are nurses, they aren't startlets who some could argue are looking for attention or a pay day. They are women and men who do a pretty thankless job and as I have family members who are aged care nurses I've learnt you don't do that job unless you are in it to help people.

None of us know Stan Lee and his private behaviour to say whether it is categorically true or categorically false but I think the women should have a safe space to at least come forward without being called liars and then since it's been implied there is a court case it's up to judge to examine the validity (even though the court system has an increadibly poor track record of siding with the accusers aka Bill Cosby). It's possible his behavior is a side effect of his deteriorating mental health but that doesn't negate the nurses rights to a safe working environment.

The whole movement is about allowing women to speak about abuses or sexual harrassment in a welcoming environment rather then the decades and decades of women who tried to speak out who were then further harassed vilified and ultimately shamed into silence or lost their employment while the accused carried on relatively unharmed. For it to really work there has to be the same respect given to the nameless faces in professions beyond just Hollywood actresses.

quarks · January 11, 2018

LeighAn, in general I agree with you - particularly about the part where nurses deserve a safe working environment. Absolutely - and unfortunately, my suspicion is that sexual harassment of nurses by patients and coworkers is, if anything, under-reported. If this story had originally appeared in virtually any other British or American newspaper - including tabloids like US Weekly or even The National Enquirer - I would have believed it, and hoped that it would be the start of a dialogue about the need for safe working environments for nurses.

That said, in specifics, when it comes to the Daily Mail, no. The Daily Mail has been known to flat out make up witnesses and quotes and outright lie about their subjects, when not just engaging in notoriously sloppy reporting. There have been at least eight successful lawsuits against the Daily Mail from people of various political persuasions, and hundreds more that The Daily Mail settled - and that's just from people who bothered to take action. Most people are just like, eh, it's The Daily Mail, why bother. There's a reason Wikipedia has said that The Daily Mail is not a reliable source.

Nor, in this case, is The Daily Mail providing a safe space for women to speak about abuses or sexual harassment in a welcoming environment. These articles aren't quoting the allegedly harassed nurses. Instead, they are quoting Lee's attorney, a source who claims to have talked to the nursing company, one nurse who says she wasn't harassed (which is meaningless), and someone who claims to be a friend of Lee (ditto). Which means that while we don't know if these nurses were harassed, we do know that they didn't feel safe talking to The Daily Mail.

Add in that Lee has - how to put this - a very long history of getting involved with some distinctly shady/semi-shady folks, especially but not just limited to Peter Paul, and, yeah, in this very particular case I think a touch of skepticism may be warranted.

WindofChange · January 11, 2018

I watched 206 a couple of days ago so details may be hazy... I'll be watching 208 later today!

Nate/Ray: I was actually quite annoyed with Nate in this episode because of his constant complaining. I get that he wants to prove himself to be a hero but jfc you can do that without complaining and dragging your feet, Nate. But I think teaming him up with Ray was a smart move because they are both essentially going through the same thing and I really enjoyed their heart to heart towards the end of the episode so that redeemed Nate a bit in this episode. Also Yay! Ray can build his new suit now! Granted it doesn't make sense that he'd be able to do it himself because he couldn't the first time without Felicity's help, but ok -_- I still wish Ray would give credit that he wasn't alone in making the suit. Bastard.

Stein: Oh boy he's keeping secrets :/ But I bet the woman he was seeing in his daughter which is intriguing and really really sad. He'll probably die not knowing his daughter as well as he should :(

Sara: Despite the poor acting, she was good in this episode and a proper leader. Keep Caity far away from any emotion and nuanced acting and keep the writing up and maybe then I can probably deal with her better.

Mick/Amaya: Amaya is still awesome and I love that they're teaming her up with everyone on the team. She did a good job reassuring Mick this episode... However I'm not sure what caused Mick's existential crisis in this episode because we didn't see anything trigger him. What made him think he was more of an 'animal' than anything else? That part was confusing. But I do like that we're seeing more of Mick and his insecurities play up.

WindofChange · January 11, 2018

OK I'm like 1 minute into 208 and I can't believe I just squealed at a Damien/Malcolm/Eobard team up. THIS IS THE BEST! THIS IS HOW YOU DO AN ALL VILLAIN TEAM UP.

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Carrie Ann

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Posted Images

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