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Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

ArctisTor

By ArctisTor
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apinknightmare
apinknightmare

I mean, I don't want her in a suit so it's not the "never" in this instance that bothers me, but Marc saying that Felicity specifically would make the notion of superheroics "silly." Why? In this show

Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

And then someone tells him that what he did was okay because of reasons, or that he can't keep feeling guilty, he just has to move forward. Like, no, just...go ahead and feel really guilty for awhile?

SleepDeprived
SleepDeprived

Hey, now... Listen. The practice of proper etiquette during an impromptu wedding officiated by your best friend in a park, right after the funeral of a beloved colleague, is of the utmost importance,

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Starfish35

Starfish35

4 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Out of all the shows they've put behind Flash, LoT has the best shot at a healthy retention. Curious to see how it does.

Same.  It might help it, it might not.  It's certainly the most compatible of any of the shows Flash has been paired with, but that doesn't always mean anything.  I remember when they put The Originals after The Vampire Diaries.  IIRC (and I may not), it didn't move TO's ratings much at all. 

Nonetheless, it's still currently the CW's fourth highest rated show, edging slightly ahead of SPN in the season averages.  So I think it's safe for now.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

8 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Same.  It might help it, it might not.  It's certainly the most compatible of any of the shows Flash has been paired with, but that doesn't always mean anything.  I remember when they put The Originals after The Vampire Diaries.  IIRC (and I may not), it didn't move TO's ratings much at all. 

Nonetheless, it's still currently the CW's fourth highest rated show, edging slightly ahead of SPN in the season averages.  So I think it's safe for now.

I wouldn't worry about it tbh - it's safe for now and will be even safer when it gets a ratings boost for when it moves to Tuesdays after Flash. 

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wonderwall

wonderwall

6 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

According to TVLine, Flash and LoT return January 24, and Arrow returns January 25.  No official return date has been announced for Supergirl, although January 15 is rumored.

http://tvline.com/2016/12/09/tv-calendar-2017-january-return-dates/

Wasnt' it supposed to be February? I guess it's a good thing Arrow returns in January. I don't think the network would want a Laurel episode being a sweeps episode. Especially with how episode 9 fared... I think Arrow is the only one that didn't rise in its ratings after the crossover.

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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

3 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Same.  It might help it, it might not.  It's certainly the most compatible of any of the shows Flash has been paired with, but that doesn't always mean anything.  I remember when they put The Originals after The Vampire Diaries.  IIRC (and I may not), it didn't move TO's ratings much at all. 

Nonetheless, it's still currently the CW's fourth highest rated show, edging slightly ahead of SPN in the season averages.  So I think it's safe for now.

They waited to long to pair TO/TVD. TVD was already dying. I'm still surprised that TheCW didn't force them to do any real crossovers.

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Sunshine

Sunshine

6 hours ago, wonderwall said:

Wasnt' it supposed to be February? I guess it's a good thing Arrow returns in January. I don't think the network would want a Laurel episode being a sweeps episode. Especially with how episode 9 fared... I think Arrow is the only one that didn't rise in its ratings after the crossover.

February Sweeps begins Thursday Feb 2 and end Wednesday Mar 1 so sweeps episodes are 5.12 Bratva to 5.15.  Even if they returned Feb 1 5.10 was never going to be a sweeps episode.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

I'm struggling to figure out why they had Arrow starting a week later anyway. I can't remember the original schedule that was released but was Arrow the only one (DC) starting in February?  Was/is LoT starting on 1/24 or the following week?.

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Sunshine

Sunshine

Flash and LOT are both coming back on the 24th I believe.  I think a reporter said something about Arrow and February but their was no official announcement that I recall.  My local station didn't show it.  I saw the 25th when I watched the 5.10 preview on the CW app.

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Sunshine

Sunshine

Thanks.  I don't know if I ever actually looked at them or not.  I just remember the discussion about sweeps dates and saw a couple of tweets asking for confirmation of the return date but never seeing a response.  

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)
13 hours ago, tv echo said:

I had only watched the premiere episode and the crossover episode of The Flash this season, but I have been reading comments here about how female characters have been badly treated on that show. So I watched the Flash's midseason finale. You guys weren't kidding...

  • Team Flash tech support - Cisco seemed to be the one to do everything and figure out everything and have his own storyline, while Caitlin was there to say a few lines and support Cisco.  
  • Two West children - Wally got his own hero journey and storyline, while Iris was there to support both him and Barry, and also be Barry's DID.

And this is the season where the show runners are working harder to write for Iris.  Yeah, let that sink in.  

12 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Out of all the shows they've put behind Flash, LoT has the best shot at a healthy retention. Curious to see how it does.

I think this season especially might be a good fit since LoT is pretty good at delivering just plain fun episodes and coming off of the Flash and its more angsty habits this year, I think it would make a great pick me up to weary viewers.  

Plus, LoT is pretty new viewer friendly.  Even the on going plot points aren't really confusing AND we have the Reverse Flash this year as our big bad villain.  (With DD and Merlyn as his back up dancers)  It's a great natural fit and answers the question of some of those extra consequences that Barry caused with Flashpoint and RF not being dead for reasons I can't explain since Eddie still is.  

Speaking of LoT, Rip got about 10 times less sexy when he opened his mouth and an American accent fell out. Lol.    

Edited by BkWurm1
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manbearpig

manbearpig

I think Lillian Luthor on Supergirl has the potential to be one of the better villains on these DC shows in some time, particularly if they start developing her relationship with her daughter. Maybe I just want to see the Supergirl writers try to create a dysfunctional dynamic like Lionel and Lex had on Smallville, but with a bit of a mother/daughter twist. I haven't seen the midseason finale, but Lillian definitely seems commanding and intelligent to me, and Brenda Strong is certainly a capable actress.  

Prometheus doesn't interest me yet, The Flash has another speedster and Legends is using villains that we've already seen on the other shows (and, like...villains that were mostly ruined on those shows, for me anyway). 

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

6 hours ago, manbearpig said:

I think Lillian Luthor on Supergirl has the potential to be one of the better villains on these DC shows in some time, particularly if they start developing her relationship with her daughter. Maybe I just want to see the Supergirl writers try to create a dysfunctional dynamic like Lionel and Lex had on Smallville, but with a bit of a mother/daughter twist. I haven't seen the midseason finale, but Lillian definitely seems commanding and intelligent to me, and Brenda Strong is certainly a capable actress.  

Prometheus doesn't interest me yet, The Flash has another speedster and Legends is using villains that we've already seen on the other shows (and, like...villains that were mostly ruined on those shows, for me anyway). 

LoT has done a great job with redeeming the former Big Bads.  Even last year with Ra's.  I was never really interested in the actual Eobard Thane  but he makes a compelling and smart adversary.  And Damian and Malcolm are entertaining wingmen.  

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

What was cut from the Arrowverse crossover?
BY NATALIE ABRAMS  December 1, 2016
http://www.ew.com/article/2016/12/01/arrow-flash-supergirl-legends-tomorrow-crossover-deleted-scenes

Quote

Below, Kreisberg and fellow EP Marc Guggenheim reveal what else could’ve happened in the epic team-up:

An Alex/Sara romance that never was: “There was a little exchange between Sara [Caity Lotz] and Kara [Melissa Benoist] that I really liked — I don’t think we even filmed it — where Sara says, ‘Hey, do you want to get a drink when this is all over?’” Kreisberg reveals, “and Kara says, ‘I think you wanna meet my sister.’ Just the idea of starting the Sara/Alex [Chyler Leigh] shippers going…”

Familiar faces: “There were moments with Colton [Haynes] and Colin [Donnell] in Arrow that were scripted that we obviously just couldn’t do because of Colin and Colton’s availabilities,” Guggenheim says. “For example, Roy was going to be Thea’s [Willa Holland] boyfriend, that hadn’t changed, and they met when he stole her purse, and that also hadn’t changed. I just thought that would have been fun and nice to see.”

For the diehards: “There were a lot more nods to the comic book,” Kreisberg says of the Dominators. “There was discussion about the size of their circles and how that was indicative of where they stood in the caste system, so I’m sorry some of that stuff went away just because it was great flavor, and I think people who are fans of the original comic book would have seen a lot more of our joy at adapting Invasion in there, but unfortunately, to get these down to the proper time, that’s the kind of stuff that tends to fall by the wayside.”

A change of clothes: “Originally we had designed the Dominators with the green robes that were very iconic of the comic,” Guggenheim says. “When we decided to do all the Dominators full CG, as we ended up doing, the robes had to go away because the presence of the robes made animating them prohibitively impossible.”

A super moment saved for later: “There was a Supergirl moment on the Waverider that I really wanted to get in there,” Guggenheim says. “I’m not going to tell you what it is, because we may do it next year, but Supergirl never ended up on the Waverider, so we couldn’t do the moment.”

Speedy says what we’re all thinking: “There was a funny scene between Speedy and H.R. [Tom Cavanagh] where she says, ‘So what are you doing here? What value do you bring?’” Kreisberg says. “He’s like, ‘Well I’m writing a book,’ and she’s like, ‘Oh, that’ll be a big help,’ and walks away.”

Edited by tv echo
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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

34 minutes ago, legaleagle53 said:

I just want to know one thing:  If Laurel really is back, who's going to break the news to Sara, and how will she react?

Be it Laurel or Siren, I doubt Sara would hear about it anytime soon since they will magically forget how to contact Sara.

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bettername2come

bettername2come

28 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Especially considering that no one has told the Arrow team that Darhk is a current problem for the Legends. And that now Malcolm is with him. They just exchange information when the writers want them to/it's relevant to the crossover story. 

If only they would ask Barry for advice on their mysterious, murderous, unidentified time-traveling speedster.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

3 minutes ago, bettername2come said:

If only they would ask Barry for advice on their mysterious, murderous, unidentified time-traveling speedster.

Especially since Barry knows he's out there but hasn't done anything about it. If only he'd look for him. Maybe tell the others. Maybe they could find references in history and call their time traveling friends and exchange information...

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

My memory might be faulty, but wasn't Prof. Stein involved at the end of Flash S01, when Barry was fighting Reverse Flash? He must have been because Ronnie Raymond died in the black hole that opened up over Central City. He should know who RF is.

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

5 minutes ago, Lokiberry said:

My memory might be faulty, but wasn't Prof. Stein involved at the end of Flash S01, when Barry was fighting Reverse Flash? He must have been because Ronnie Raymond died in the black hole that opened up over Central City. He should know who RF is.

I suppose he wouldn't know the face though?  

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kismet

kismet

3 hours ago, bettername2come said:

If only they would ask Barry for advice on their mysterious, murderous, unidentified time-traveling speedster.

I think it's best if we leave Barry out of everything possible. Barry messes things up enough on his own. No need to seek out his help or advice.

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bettername2come

bettername2come

1 hour ago, Lokiberry said:

My memory might be faulty, but wasn't Prof. Stein involved at the end of Flash S01, when Barry was fighting Reverse Flash? He must have been because Ronnie Raymond died in the black hole that opened up over Central City. He should know who RF is.

Martin was in the Cortex while Cisco, Joe and Barry were in the Pipeline. So he could've seen Eobard turn back into his real self over the cameras, but nothing was ever definite. 

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Includes interview with Arrow-verse composer, Blake Neely, where he talks about creating the music score for the big crossover (starting at around 2:30)...

-- Blake played snippets of Arrow's theme, Flash's theme, Legends' theme and Supergirl's theme, and then explained how he combined them all together to use in the scene where Barry introduces Supergirl to all the different teams.

-- Blake talked about composing new music for the new villains, the Dominators, and played a snippet of their theme.

-- Blake then talked about assigning different scenes to different members of his composing team and to himself.

-- Blake mentioned that Chris Bluth played the duduk, which he said was used a lot in films to represent Middle Eastern. He said that they brought in the duduk in Arrow Season 3 when they went to Nanda Parbat. He then said that "it just became attached to Sara's character since she died and became an assassin." So in the crossover, he thought it was a good opportunity to bring the duduk music back for Sara (scene where bridesmaid dress-wearing Sara fights Deathstroke).

-- Blake explained that once everything is written, recorded and mixed, it's all put into one big session and sent to the music editor, who takes it to the mix stage, and then they "lay it in with all the sound, dialogue, music."

CW Crossover Behind-the-Music + The Flash Midseason Finale
Published on Dec 6, 2016, by DC Entertainment

Edited by tv echo
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kismet

kismet

That was pretty impressive wording... although the performance was a little weak. Still congrats to that person for putting it together & releasing it.

I must admit I absolutely LOVE Hamilton & I used to love Arrow - but I seriously see no connection between the two stories beyond the BTS stuff of cast singing Hamilton. The two stories just aren't connected for me and share no overlap.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

(edited)
Quote

It was said to be on the fast track. The Flash movie lost its director the last time i heard. So i dont know what WB plans next. 

Also WB will start developing their merchandise soon. 

I was just thinking they would probably give this movie the Flash weekend. Of course their record with fast tracking isn't very good but, Harley is popular so it'll do well.

(Brought over from  the speculation thread)

Edited by Morrigan2575
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way2interested

way2interested

(edited)

So, I read the Haunting of Barry Allen book, the part 1 of the crossover novels based on Arrow/Flash that was posted here a while ago IIRC. I thought it was actually an entertaining read and am looking forward to part 2. They've got some good interactions that haven't really been in the show (Joe and Diggle, Caitlin and Iris, and some development for Peekaboo) along with some nice scenes with Barry and Oliver, which were always some of my favorite parts of the crossovers in general. It also takes place in the 2a/4a timeline (with a bunch of inconsistencies tbh, like taking place in October but Diggle has his Spartan code name, but still overall before the major Jay Garrick/Zoom stuff or the BMD), so that's fun to imagine. The book had a bunch of fun stuff from OTA and I don't want to quote them all, but I wanted to give some highlights:

Spoiler
Quote

"Maybe this guy just collects sound-related items," John offered. "Don't super-villains do that sort of thing?"

Barry looked doubtful. "Not that I know of. That seems sort of weird."

"That seems weird?" John raised his eyebrows higher than a human should be able.

Quote

"That's what Oliver does," Felicity said proudly. "He figures out the best way to hurt people. Bad people, I mean. People who need to be hurt. Not just people in general. That would be wrong." Oliver put his arm around her waist and she went silent.

Quote

Barry straightened, pulling back his hunched shoulders. For a moment the weight lifted. Oliver's praise was better than any drug Caitlin could pump into him.

Quote

"Yeah?" Barry said, a hint of a smile playing across his face. "When was the last time you took a vacation?"

The deep furrows of Oliver's brow relaxed, and the tightness of the jaw lessened. His entire face went from hard-edged crime fighter to ordinary friend.

"Well, I once spent a lot of time lounging on a Pacific Island. Now that I'm back, I prefer to stay at work." He paused, then added, "I do go away, though. I've taken time to recharge. It helps when you have someone like Felicity pushing you to go, and the fact that I have her with me makes me want to do so."

"I'll swap with you. I'll go with Felicity, and you go fishing with Joe. Probably in the snow or something."

Quote

A wistful expression overcame [John]. "When [my daughter's] awake, I feel the work calling. But when she's napping, I find myself counting the minutes until she wakes up."

"Welcome to fatherhood," Joe said with a broad grin. "There's something about baby girls that just melts us."

"Amen to that."

 

 But yeah, that stuff and a bunch more. It's Flash-centric obviously, but more like the Flash episode of a crossover, to which I'm guessing the sequel might be more Arrow focused. But yeah, overall, I recommend. It's harmless fun.

Edited by way2interested
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Trini

Trini

I wonder how they're going to handle the 4-show crossover with the DVDs. Last time (when it was only Flash/Arrow) they put the crossover episode from each show on the other show's set. I just wonder if they'll bother with putting 3 extra episodes on each show's set. It's likely if it doesn't end costing much more.

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Trini

Trini

13 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Two extra episodes, really. There seems no need to include Supergirl since the scene was repeated on The Flash.

True; but they (CW, WB, DC) made such a big about having Supergirl in the universe, and including all 4 shows!! Technically, the crossover had nothing to do with Supergirl's world, so it could be excluded there, but I'm not sure if they would want to do that.

A separate bonus DVD with the extra episodes with each set sounds like a good idea. Don't know if the 4 episodes by themselves would be worth the effort.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

13 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Bonus DVD with all 3 (4?) episodes on each set? Or perhaps a cash grab and release a separate set with the 3 or 4 crossover episodes?

I think this is possible.  On the CW app, and maybe on the website too, they've set up a special section ("Heroes vs Aliens") in the Shows section that includes all four episodes.  

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)
15 hours ago, way2interested said:

So, I read the Haunting of Barry Allen book, the part 1 of the crossover novels based on Arrow/Flash that was posted here a while ago IIRC. I thought it was actually an entertaining read and am looking forward to part 2. They've got some good interactions that haven't really been in the show (Joe and Diggle, Caitlin and Iris, and some development for Peekaboo) along with some nice scenes with Barry and Oliver, which were always some of my favorite parts of the crossovers in general. It also takes place in the 2a/4a timeline (with a bunch of inconsistencies tbh, like taking place in October but Diggle has his Spartan code name, but still overall before the major Jay Garrick/Zoom stuff or the BMD), so that's fun to imagine. The book had a bunch of fun stuff from OTA and I don't want to quote them all, but I wanted to give some highlights:

  Hide contents

 

 But yeah, that stuff and a bunch more. It's Flash-centric obviously, but more like the Flash episode of a crossover, to which I'm guessing the sequel might be more Arrow focused. But yeah, overall, I recommend. It's harmless fun.

Thanks for the excerpts. It just makes me miss Oliver & Felicity as a happy couple in Arrow 4A and Baby Sara Diggle.

Edited by tv echo
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

45 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Thanks for the excerpts. It just makes me miss Oliver & Felicity as a happy couple in Arrow 4A and Baby Sara Diggle.

I won't lie, reading the conversation about Baby Sara made me a bit misty.  That's never going to stop bugging me.   

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tv echo

tv echo

Patrick Wilson is no Tom Hiddleston...

Patrick Wilson To Play ‘Aquaman’s Evil Half-Brother ORM
Mike Fleming   Dec. 12, 2016
http://deadline.com/2016/12/patrick-wilson-aquaman-orm-ocean-master-dc-villain-jason-momoa-1201869055/

Quote

EXCLUSIVE: Patrick Wilson has been set by Warner Bros and director James Wan to co-star in Aquaman. Jason Momoa plays the title character, and Wilson will play the fish whisperer’s supervillain half brother ORM, also known as Ocean Master, in the DC film that Warner Bros will release October 5, 2018.
*  *  *
The character has some of the sibling-rivalry elements found in Loki. That is Thor’s half brother, who has figured as the heavy in numerous Marvel films, in the form of Tom Hiddleston. ORM is at least as disagreeable and more powerful: In the comics, Aquaman’s human half brother is a rival for the throne of Atlantis and wreaks havoc on the high seas and beneath them when he doesn’t get his way. Amber Heard is playing Mera, Queen of Atlantis.

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