Here And Now - General Discussion

[OnceSane]

Your Media topic!

[OnceSane]

Anticipate here!

[OtterMommy]

Here and Now set to premiere on February 11

[formerlyfreedom]

And now the first Official Trailer!

 

And more from TVLine.com;

Quote

Where can you see the first official trailer for Alan Ball’s new HBO twisty, dysfunctional family drama? Here and Now.

The premium cabler released the promo Friday, formally introducing viewers to the Bayer-Boatwrights (played by Top of the Lake‘s Holly Hunter and The Brink‘s Tim Robbins) and their four children, three of whom are adopted and have Colombian, Somalian and Vietnamese backgrounds. As the video shows, the dysfunctional family’s life gets even weirder when one of the kids starts to see things that other people can’t.

[scrb]

Just saw the trailer, right before season 2 premier of Divorce.

Had no idea it was coming.

Maybe Ball will approach the brilliance of 6FU.

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

A darkly comic meditation on the disparate forces polarizing American culture, as experienced by a progressive, multi-ethnic family consisting of a philosophy professor, his wife and their four children, three of whom are adopted from Vietnam, Liberia and Colombia, and a Muslim family headed by a psychiatrist who is treating one of their kids.

[scrb]

Very lukewarm review from Tim Goodman.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/review/review-1080645

He holds out hope that the direction of the show could change after the 4 episodes he previewed.

Says the liberal, multi-cultural family isn't likeable.

Show may have supernatural elements or maybe it's all in the head of one of the characters?

Or it could be some Lost-y or Leftovers type of plot gimmicks.

[scrb]

Interview with Ball, explaining how he came up with the idea.

‘Here and Now,’ a New Supernatural Drama From the Creator of ‘True Blood’
https://nyti.ms/2FGgdnp

Interesting that he pitched a couple of pilots that HBO rejected.  He knew they wanted a family drama so he came up with one.

[bilgistic]

I'm intrigued enough to stick around at least another week. Ramon (the gay son) and his new man are super hot together so that was a nice bonus. On the flip side, I was incredibly grossed out by the 17-year-old daughter having sex (for the first time!) with the other daughter's not-hookup (the model). She wore that ridiculous horse mask the whole time, so I take it the model never even saw the daughter's face. I can't fully convey why I feel as gross as I do about it.

I don't care about Tim Robbins's existential life crisis. How cliched that he has a regular appointment with a prostitute. Holly Hunter's character isn't impressing me yet either.

So I guess I'm intrigued by the kids. It's pretty easy to see this is an Alan Ball project. There are shades of the Six Feet Under characters in these characters. I loved 6FU, and I doubt anything can match its beauty.

[formerlyfreedom]

Ramon and Shokrani explore the possible psychic connection between “11:11” and a photograph in the doctor’s office. Kristen and Ashley run into trouble. Duc gets good news about his self-help manuscript, but his mood is dampened by the publisher’s request. Audrey is enlisted to help break up a politically incorrect new society at school. Disturbed in part by a medical diagnosis, Greg loses his cool in the classroom. Ramon crashes a family meeting.

[numbnut]

Hmm. I'm on the fence. All the family/relationship drama was meh so I guess I'll watch for the supernatural premise to see where it goes. Holly Hunter is great but the mom was really bugging me (especially in the therapist's office) because I know someone just like that. The actress playing the only biological kid cannot be 17. I thought she looked around 25.

ETA: Okay, she is 25, and I had no idea that was Sosie Bacon.

Edited February 12, 2018 by numbnut

[veronicalodge44]

sosie bacon reminds me so much of ally sheedy, around brat pack time period, especially her voice and inflections.  (in an enjoyable way)

 

i actually liked this show, perhaps because the critics' reviews had led me to believe it was so awful that i found myself pleasantly surprised.  i like the relationships and most of the characters enough to want to see where they're going with things.

 

and holly hunter is a fav and has spoken highly of alan ball and his writing and of this experience, which gives me hope for the longer trajectory of this season.

 

also, ramon is eminently watchable (both the actor and his character), so that's a bonus.

[Trillian]

8 hours ago, bilgistic said:

So I guess I'm intrigued by the kids. It's pretty easy to see this is an Alan Ball project. There are shades of the Six Feet Under characters in these characters. I loved 6FU, and I doubt anything can match its beauty.

Agree on the shades of SFU characters.  When my husband joined the viewing late and needed a quick catch-up, I said, “That’s the Claire Fisher character with the horse’s head; this time, Nate is the younger one and the gay one, and the Vietnamese guy seems to be David”.  The other daughter seems to be, so far, a reasonable stand-in for Brenda. (I will not go into details because of spoilers for both shows, but there’s even a shot in the promo for next week that seems to reinvent a Claire-Brenda plot line).  Since I haven’t learned any of their names yet, I’m at serious risk of continuing to call them by “their” SFU names, at least for a while. 

Of course, I loved SFU, and love Alan Ball, so I’ll keep watching and see where this goes.  I think it had potential. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I will give the show points for realistically depicting family dynamics. My mom does that annoying thing where she calls me and then proceeds to have a conversation with someone who is with her while I sit on the phone going, "MOM? MOM?"

I also don't understand why Kristen insisted on her mom putting her phone call with Ramon on speakerphone. I LOATHE being on speakerphone and having to listen to conversations on speakerphone. ETA: Okay, it was because of the hands-free law so there was a valid reason (not just nosiness).

Why didn't Audrey just tell Kristen to text/call Ramon about the dry cleaning so that she wasn't driving while on the phone? It never ceases to amaze me that people think they MUST call the very second that a thought pops into their brains. Like she couldn't have waited until she got wherever she was going to park the car and then call Ramon?

And if Kristen was so concerned with her mom getting a ticket for driving while on the phone, why didn't she just take the phone and hold it for her? There's a huge button on the screen labeled SPEAKERPHONE. You don't need to use bluetooth to go hands free. Heh, obviously I have a lot of issues with people and their cell phone usage.

The show also gets credit for immediately establishing that the show is in Portland. Guy with a man bun riding his fixie to the laundry/coffee shop to flirt with the bearded hipster in a vest about his dreams. And man bun's parents pay his rent!

I was totally with Ramon when he said it would be weird for Henry to come to his dad's birthday party as their first date. I would not want to be in that position (as Henry or Ramon).

Ha, I think everyone needs a therapist like Duc. Oh, sorry, motivational architect. Despite his hilarious job title, I loved what he said to Lydia and Brandon.

I had mixed feelings about Kristen losing her virginity to the model. On the one hand, it was clearly her decision. She sought him out. She was not coerced. This was something that she wanted to do. Randy told her that they could slow down or stop if she wanted to. Honestly, this scenario was not the worst I've seen for first time sex.  If I were Randy, I would have been a little bit freaked out that she wanted to keep the horse head on, but I think it made her feel safe.

All that said, she is 17 and the age of consent in Oregon is 18 so that was statutory rape.

Worst birthday speech ever?

After fourteen seasons of watching Grey's Anatomy, I was happy to hear Ramon's therapist talk about patient confidentiality. Audrey's aggressiveness and pushiness with Ramon's therapist was so uncomfortable to watch. I was glad that he reminded her that Ramon is an adult so he gets to choose whether to treat whatever he has as well as whether his parents get to stay in the room. I get that she's freaked out about him potentially having schizophrenia like her brother, but (1) it's not your decision to decide whether to medicate him and (2) calm the hell down!

Tim Robbins is arguably the most well known actor in the cast but I have the least amount of interest in his character. I don't care about his depression, his philosophy, his weekly hooker appointments, etc.

Holly Hunter is about as well known as Tim Robbins but I have slightly more interest in her character because aside from her hippie dippie stuff (which may seem like a stereotype but I live in hippie central and there are a million people like her in real life), she seems like a more complex character. I think she still truly loves her husband but is perplexed by his depression (and staying true to being a therapist, she is waiting for him to tell her about it voluntarily rather than digging for it).

Similarly, I think she does love her kids and, like many parents, had the best of intentions without realizing how she was making her kids feel. Parents who adopt from other countries are encouraged to keep the kids aware of the culture and traditions from their birth countries, but making Ashley and Duc wear traditional clothing for picture day at school? Just no. School picture day is not the time or place for that. Same with the way she was fawning all over Henry because he's the first guy that Ramon has ever brought home. Her heart was in the right place, but she was still making Ramon feel uncomfortable. She needs to stop thinking so much about what she SHOULD be doing and be more aware of how she's making her kids feel.

Edited February 12, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[luna1122]

I was intrigued enough to set up a series record, anyway. A lot of these folks are kind of unbearable, but the actors involved are going to get me back watching next week. I was telling my honey about it later, cuz he missed it, and yeah, I was saying, well, Kevin Bacon's daughter is Claire, basically, and there's a hot gay Nate hooking up with the almost-stranger, etc. I loved 6FU, but the characters were often just as unbearable, but still interesting, so I have hope.

It's disconcerting for Holly Hunter to have no Southern accent.

Hot model guy knowingly having sex with a virgin but not bothering to see her face or ascertain her age was pretty creepy. We all have our little kinks, but having sex with someone in a horse head seems odd for anyone.

Daniel Zovatto/Ramon is ridiculously pretty, like a baby Timothy Olyphant, Costa Rican style. Dang.

Sosie Bacon bugged me a little. She was very 'actory' and on, tho that COULD just be an acting choice in playing a melodramatic teenager. I didn't care abut Tim Robbins and his angst and his weekly hooker appointment either.

I have absolutely no idea where the whole 11/11 thing or the hallucinations or the dream about his shrink's mom are going, which is kind of nice.

Edited February 12, 2018 by luna1122

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Henry: You're way deeper than I am. I just dream I'm at work with no pants on.
Ramon: Do you have a boner?
Henry: In the dream or right now?
Ramon: Either.
Henry: No.

Kristen: Mom, put [Ramon] on speaker.
Audrey: I don't - it's this new phone. I have to -
Kristen: You don't know how to connect to bluetooth. This is why millennials are so angry.
Audrey: You're not a millennial. They haven't even named your generation  yet, although I have a few suggestions.
Kristen: What? The stupid cunts?

Audrey: On your way over tonight, I need you to stop by the dry cleaners and pick up your dad's grey suit blazer.
Ramon: Mom, seriously?
Audrey: Please don't make me bring up who pays your rent.

Brandon: I'm on time this week!
Duc: I appreciate that. When it becomes the norm, that's when it will be an accomplishment.

Stylist: If [the models] aren't supposed to wear hats, why are there so many of them in the accessories vault?

Coworker: You just destroyed that poor girl
Ashley: If that's all it takes, I'm sorry, she needs to be destroyed.
Randy: She'll probably end up giving blow job for meth money to erase the pain of this day.

Michael: The way you marry epicureanism with presentism and then reboot them both into something so deeply, deeply moral-
Greg: As if morality matters.
Michael: Fuck those idiots who called it an ethical defense of hedonism.

Kristen: Patchouli and frankincense organic soy candles? Ugh, flashback to that awful red moon party you threw for me when I first got my period.
Audrey: I can't believe you still haven't forgiven me for that.
Kristen: I will never forgive you for that. That party wasn't even for me. It was just so you and your old hippie friends could get drunk in the hot tub and grab each other's tits.

Ashley: Where would I go? LA? I shot there. I hated it. New York, Chicago - I can't do the winters. Where else is there?
Duc: Paris, London-
Ashley: Oh, fuck you.
Duc: Don't be an angry black woman, Sabido.
Ashley: Don't be a ching chong Vietcong, Duc.
Duc: You're sassy.
Ashley: You're inscrutable.
Duc: I bet you're good at sports.
Ashley: I bet you're you're so motherfucking good at math.

Duc: Why are you here?
Randy: I have blow.

Ashley: They named me Sabido, this African name that nobody even knows what it means.
Randy: Sounds like Speedo.
Ashley: Exactly: They called me scrote tote in middle school so on my eighteenth birthday, I had it legally changed to the whitest name I could think of. One picture day, she dressed me in kente cloth and put this Erykah Badu thing on my head. It was so fucking humiliating.
Duc: No, I got the áo dài which is basically a dress. So let's take one of the only Asian kids in school and send him to picture day in a dress that makes him look like he's the host at an Asian fusion restaurant.

Henry: Where's the bathroom?
Malcolm: End of the hall. Follow the smell of patchouli.

Malcolm: [Henry]'s cute!
Ramon: I barely know him.
Malcolm: You're going to want to enjoy that while it lasts.

Ramon: You're unusually forthcoming tonight.
Kristen: I'm high. I'm always high.
Ramon: Is that a plea for help?
Kristen: Dear God, no. I love it.

Randy: You're married? Actually that makes total sense.
Ashley: What the fuck does that mean?
Randy: You're beautiful and smart and fucking hot. Of course you're married.
Ashley: Awww, you're very sweet, Randy. Or you're a complete douchebag.

Randy: [Malcolm]'s like a golden retriever turned into a dude.
Duc: Right? I think she married him to piss our mom off. He was a Republican - you know, before Trump.

Randy: Dude, I don't think she's going to fuck me tonight.
Duc: Dude, that's my sister. Shut your fucking mouth.
Randy: Why'd she even bring me? She just likes to play with fire.
Duc: Ashley likes to play near fire without ever going close enough to actually get burned.
Randy: I get it. Her husband's very fuckable.

Randy: Everyone here is pretty old.
Duc: It's a 60th birthday party.

Kristen: So tell me about this psycho you hooked up with.
Ramon: It was so fucking creepy. He made this face during sex that was literally like the face of madness.
Kristen: That's it? He just made a weird face?
Ramon: You seem disappointed that he didn't murder or dismember me.

Audrey: Sweetie, I want you to know you have my full unconditional blessing.
Ramon: Well, of course I do, mom. Not that I need it.
Audrey: This one's a keeper. There's something very special about this one.
Ramon: Yeah, we put our dicks in each other.
Audrey: Was that really necessary?
Ramon: Mom, we're gay. We're not special. That's a little bit condescending and weird.
Audrey: Would you prefer a mother who disowned you or sat shiva for you?
Ramon: Sometimes.

Duc: Great party, mom.
Audrey: Is it?
[Duc looks at her but doesn't say anything]
Aren't you even remotely interested why I might say that?
Duc: Remotely. Mom, if you want to tell me how you're feeling, you can tell me. I'd love to hear. But it's not my job to dig it out of you.
Audrey: Is that how you motivate people's architecture? Passive aggressively?
Duc: Yes, and that was neither passive nor aggressive.

Ashley: What's with the all black? Is [dad] Johnny Cash?
Audrey: He's struggling for autonomy.
Ashley: But the grey silk - he looks so good in that.
Audrey: He doesn't want to look good. He wants to have his way.

Audrey: I wasn't high. I was tripping.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On 1/12/2018 at 6:20 PM, saoirse said:

Where can you see the first official trailer for Alan Ball’s new HBO twisty, dysfunctional family drama? Here and Now.

The premium cabler released the promo Friday, formally introducing viewers to the Bayer-Boatwrights (played by Top of the Lake‘s Holly Hunter and The Brink‘s Tim Robbins) and their four children, three of whom are adopted and have Colombian, Somalian and Vietnamese backgrounds. As the video shows, the dysfunctional family’s life gets even weirder when one of the kids starts to see things that other people can’t.

Either they changed the script or the press just got it wrong - Ashley's character is from Liberia.

[formerlyfreedom]

I had been looking forward to this show since it was announced early in 2017, and was really bummed with the early reviews. But I found myself pleasantly surprised while watching -- I really enjoyed this episode! I agree with you, @veronicalodge44, the actor playing Ramon is VERY watchable. And a lot of the story really seemed true to me - the conversation over drinks between Ashley and Duc with the model, talking about what life had been like growing up seemed like something I've seen at times in my own life, but they do still all kind of love each other in that truly dysfunctional way only family can.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Some promos from HBO:

Meet Greg:

Meet Audrey:

 

Meet Kristen:

A look inside with executive producers Alan Ball & Peter Macdissi:

[Kenz]

2 hours ago, luna1122 said:

It's disconcerting for Holly Hunter to have no Southern accent.

 

 

I think this is the first time I've seen Holly Hunter not have a southern twang. I love her, twang or no twang, so I will continue watching the show for her. Poor Tim Robbins. I really like him as an actor, but he was given a pathetic role in this show. Maybe he can recover from his depression and become a more interesting character.

The sex scene with a seventeen year old girl wearing a horse head was creepy and really unbelievable. I doubt a grown man would do that to a girl he doesn't know and could be underage, which she was.

I live in Portland and enjoyed the Portland scenes, even though they got their geography mixed up as they traveled west toward Laurelhurst instead of east, but that's a minor criticism. 

Edited February 12, 2018 by Kenz

[formerlyfreedom]

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Either they changed the script or the press just got it wrong - Ashley's character is from Liberia.

I'm guessing they changed this at some point in production; IMDB still lists Columbia, Somalia, and Vietnam, as does much of the early press. It must have been changed late, and now I'm very curious as to why they changed it.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

12 minutes ago, saoirse said:

I'm guessing they changed this at some point in production; IMDB still lists Columbia, Somalia, and Vietnam, as does much of the early press. It must have been changed late, and now I'm very curious as to why they changed it.

Now my curiosity is piqued about why it was changed. When they’re talking about where the kids are from, Randy says, “Libya?” and Ashley correcrs him with “Liberia.” I don’t remember it sounding like they had looped in different lines in post-production (and I can’t imagine what country they would have had Randy guess that sounds similar to Somalia) so now I REALLY want to know what caused this change!

[slasherboy]

But is it true to life that siblings/siblings and parents/children talk so much about sex, saying fuck and asking intimate questions?  My siblings and I don't even say the word "pregnant" around each other.  The whole thing just seemed kind of incestuous.

I'll be back.

15 hours ago, luna1122 said:

the dream about his shrink's mom are going

Maybe the woman in the picture is Ramon's grandmother and the therapist is his father.  Maybe ........???

[ElectricBoogaloo]

3 hours ago, slasherboy said:

But is it true to life that siblings/siblings and parents/children talk so much about sex, saying fuck and asking intimate questions?  My siblings and I don't even say the word "pregnant" around each other.  The whole thing just seemed kind of incestuous.

It depends on the family. My sisters and I certainly use the word FUCK around each other all the time. Some people are more comfortable sharing details about their sex lives with each other but that doesn't make them incestuous. It just means they're comfortable talking about sex.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Season 1 sneak peek:

Meet Ramon:

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Behind the scenes:

[Anela]

I'm still watching the episode, and I'll probably watch again, but I wish the dad wasn't seeing a prostitute. 

I only watched a few episodes of Six Feet Under, when it was on, and I keep meaning to look it up on Amazon, since I saw it there a couple of years ago. I remember the characters that someone mentioned above.

I am interested in the supernatural story line, and I liked Ramon choosing to see the therapist, without his parents there. The dad's speech at his party, seemed a little forced, though - even though I could relate (being depressed, too). It felt like they were trying to do something similar to The Newsroom, some years back. 

[slasherboy]

9 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It depends on the family. My sisters and I certainly use the word FUCK around each other all the time. Some people are more comfortable sharing details about their sex lives with each other but that doesn't make them incestuous. It just means they're comfortable talking about sex.

Oh, I realize every family has their comfort level when discussing sex.  I grew up in a very modest family so it amazes me when I see a family so open and revealing.  I'm not being judgmental in any way ... just saying it's so different from my own experience.

And I don't for one minute believe the family is incestuous.  It just didn't seem like it would be out of the question.

Edited February 13, 2018 by slasherboy

[OtterMommy]

After 2 days of fighting with my HBO Now app, I finally got to see this and, well, it interested me enough.  I mean, it is all sorts of messed up, but i still engaged me and I'll keep watching.

There were a number of things that I liked.  The characters are all very layered, which doesn't happen often enough in television.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not sure I liked any of them (well, maybe Ramon), but there is a big difference between disliking characters because they unlikable people (which was the case here) and disliking them because they are badly written or badly performed.

They also got Portland right.  It seems that most of the characters I see in shows set in Portland fall into 2 categories: complete caricatures (hello, Portlandia!) or totally generic.  Here, however, they are much closer to the sort of people one would actually find in Portland.  Yes, they are a bit over the top at times, but not so much that they are unbelievable.  To be fair, I think this is an issue with pretty much any show set in a specific place outside of Southern California, or maybe New York City, but being in the Portland area, it was something that I appreciated.

Hearing Holly Hunter without her Southern accent was a little disconcerting at first, but there were a couple points where she slipped or I could tell she was trying really, really hard to keep it up and, for some reason, that made it all work for me.

I'm a little worried about how this show is going to balance itself between all the characters.  I get that the set up is that the siblings, or at least 3 of them, are front and center, but I'm not seeing much here for anyone but Ramon.  But, it's the first episode and maybe that will work itself out as the show goes along.

[planet17]

I was also highly excited to watch this and I was sad when I saw the reviews. However I was pleasently surprised. There were a few things that bothered me. Somethings I felt unnecessary and that could be more subtle, but overall I really liked it. The chemistry between the cast was one of the best parts for me, especially between the siblings.

Too soon to tell if the show will get better or worse but judging by the critical reception and rating numbers, things do not look good in terms of renewal. I hope HBO gives the show another chance like they did to The Leftovers.

[DearEvette]

I agree with everyone that the reviews of the show seem overly harsh.  I had been anticipating this and then read some reviews and was like, 'oh bummer' but decided to watch anyway and was pleasantly surprised.  What were they expecting?  It felt like the pilot  -- and hence suffers from typical pilot-itis where there seems to be a lot of self aware exposition.  But overall i liked how... messy the family is.

I loved the sense of place the show has.  As @ElectricBoogaloo points out, kudos for the very Portlandness of the place.  I only visited Portland once and just watching i felt like I knew it.  The overcast look of the sky, the bikes galore, hot gay barista dude rocking a beard and artfully slouched knit hat.

I like how snarky the kids are about their upbringing and the performative aspect of their parents' parenting.  I totally get them just wanting to be normal American kids but having to suffer their parents' well meaning (or not) attempts at keeping them connected to their culture.

Mostly I am intrigued by he family dynamics.  The two older sibs seems closer to each other while the two younger sibs seem closer.  Why does Audrey seem to dismissive of her son-in-law -- he seems nice and harmless.  Is he too whitebread for her?  Did she want Ashley to marry an African guy?   Their relationship with Dad looks interesting -- a little more disconnected than with mom.  I love that Holley Hunter seems to have that her character's number down cold.  I could totally see this mother and why her kids are the way they are.

All in all I think the actors are adding layers to what, in this first episode, feels like clunky dialogue and this need to push all these elements out in front.  I am hoping as it goes on it settled into itself.  But so far I am intrigued enough to keep watching.

[OtterMommy]

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

Mostly I am intrigued by he family dynamics.  The two older sibs seems closer to each other while the two younger sibs seem closer.  Why does Audrey seem to dismissive of her son-in-law -- he seems nice and harmless.  Is he too whitebread for her?  Did she want Ashley to marry an African guy?   Their relationship with Dad looks interesting -- a little more disconnected than with mom.  I love that Holley Hunter seems to have that her character's number down cold.  I could totally see this mother and why her kids are the way they are.

There was a comment about this in the episode--the older brother (forgot his name) told Blow-guy that he thought Ashley had married her husband to piss off her Audrey because he (the husband) had been a Republican.

[scrb]

One of the fan criticisms of 6FU was that it devolved into a soap opera in the later seasons.

Maybe that's why Ball put in this supernatural thing because a standard family drama would focus on the likability of the characters, some of whom might be too hard to take sometimes.

 

I got to watch 6FU again one of these days, because my memories of it have become hazy.  There was one season where Nate marries someone that the fans hated, IIRC.

[DrivingSideways]

I didn't even know this show was coming so I missed the reviews.  It was entertaining enough, but the 11:11 candle scene was a bit over the top.  Is this going to be a supernatural show?

And I also cannot stand Sosia Bacon.  I'm not sure if its the actress, or the character, but she's extremely grating and annoying.  And also seems too old to be acting the way she is.

[woodscommaelle]

Six Feet Under is my all-time favorite show. Ever. 

I am all in for this show. Loved this episode. 

[woodscommaelle]

Is Audrey a teacher?

Father Jack! Yes. That voice you'll never forget.

Edited February 19, 2018 by woodscommaelle

[The Solution]

This is growing on me. I enjoyed the fight in the parking lot.

Was Duc fantasizing or was he tapping mad ass?

[The Solution]

Every time I watch this show, I get the Luther Vandross song stuck in my head.

[topanga]

1 hour ago, The Solution said:

This is growing on me. I enjoyed the fight in the parking lot.

Was Duc fantasizing or was he tapping mad ass?

I think he was being not so celibate in Vancouver. But deliberately rejected the Asian woman. Because of the memories of his mother?

The sene at the police station was interesting. No blatant racism Ashley could report, but a definite difference in how the policewoman treated the black woman vs. the white kid—who is the reason they got arrested in the first place. I’m glad Ashley lost that wig—it was bugging me, too. 

The mom clearly doesn’t want to let Baby Jesus grow up.

The psychiatrist’s family was interior. I’d like to see them more. 

And is it wrong that I don’t care about Tim Robbins’ character? Love the actor, but the character is a man-child whose mid-life crisis leads him to hurt other people. 

[OtterMommy]

56 minutes ago, topanga said:

The sene at the police station was interesting. No blatant racism Ashley could report, but a definite difference in how the policewoman treated the black woman vs. the white kid—who is the reason they got arrested in the first place. I’m glad Ashley lost that wig—it was bugging me, too. 

 

I thought the scene was interesting too.  On one hand, I think Ashley's experience was very true-to-life (unfortunately).  On the other, I really can't see any cop putting up with Kristen's behavior, much less sort of participating in it.

I'm curious about the timing of the taping of this show.  At one point, the psychiatrist makes reference to something that happened on the MAX during Ramadan.  Last year, I believe during Ramadan (although I could be wrong on that), there was a truly horrific event that happened on the MAX where a man was harassing two women who were hearing hijabs.  Two or three other men stepped up to the women's defense and the man in question stabbed and killed two of them.  However, the way I remember this event and what I remember of the filming of this show (again...questionable), this happened after the filming.  So either there was a really horrible coincidence or there was some additional filming to acknowledge this (or I'm messing up the chronology of things..)(

[formerlyfreedom]

Greg gets detoured in the wilderness on the way to an ethics convention. Audrey finds herself in the media crosshairs after a hate crime at school. Following a mountain-bike race with best friend Malcolm and their pals, Duc reveals the secret to staying in control, a credo that’s tested by Carmen, a fellow life coach. Haunted by a painful memory, Shokrani looks for unconventional help to get him through a wedding. With help from Ashley, Kristen’s crush on a predator comes to an end. Audrey ends an otherwise bad day with a rare good night with Greg.

[bilgistic]

I really don't care about Tim Robbins's character, either. I reached maximum capacity for entitled wealthy white men's problems many years ago.

I'm bothered by how the white biological daughter is written. This show seems to be built at least somewhat on the premise that this family is multicultural by the design of "hippie" parents who would be very aware of the how people of different races are treated, and in theory, would teach their kids. Hell, a whole segment of tonight's episode was devoted to it with Holly Hunter's character mediating the student meeting among different races and ethnicities. But her sole biological child among three other adopted children of different ethnicities is written as oblivious to the fact that in law enforcement (among other situations), black people are treated far worse than white people? That was a huge misstep.

Other than that, I liked it well enough. I am still intrigued with Ramon's story. The mental health issue is personal to me because my mother is basically the opposite of the mom here. (I had to look up her name--Audrey.) My mother more or less won't deal with my lifelong struggles with depression and anxiety, and never got me any help when I was a kid. Audrey is too hands-on...but, if his parents are paying his insurance and doctor bills (I assume they are since they pay his rent), where's the line for how much input is too much? He's in a very fortunate position. So, I have lots of feelings about it.

I like seeing the psychiatrist's story and family (I recognize the actress playing his wife from Girlfriends' Guide to Divorce), and am glad that wasn't thrown in last week, too. I like seeing that the doctor is actually listening to Ramon, and am eager to see how that develops. I'm glad Ramon's beach dream wasn't just written off as a hallucination or something else "scientific". If the show is going to have a supernatural aspect, it needs to be all in.

I didn't remember Duc's story from last week because of how much was going on. I wish this storyline would have either been given the time the dad's story was given (in place of the dad's story), or pushed until next week and given more time then. It felt shoehorned.

The fallout of Audrey's school meeting is not going to go well, and I'm really afraid of what's coming.

[scrb]

That high school was unreal.  Those kids are insufferable.  But interesting that Audrey was encouraging empathy while Greg is telling his students to forget empathy.

That ophthalmologist -- "no you'll never see the same again but you're not seeing the same as when you were a teenager" -- must have pissed him off.

Also, the trans or gender-fluid son of the psychiatrist had all the family in his social media feed or something.  Talk about all these coincidences, when these people have never had any contact with each other previously.

I wouldn't be surprised if Ball is gently mocking the Portland hipster mindset.  He said in one interview though that Oregon excluded black people when it was originally founded so despite its current reputation, it has problems with race in its origins.

They have to dial the Kristen character down a little.  Why can't she rebel against the hippie parents by being a Trump supporter or something?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

9 hours ago, The Solution said:

Every time I watch this show, I get the Luther Vandross song stuck in my head.

It gets stuck in my head every time I see the show title on the front page!

[luna1122]

6 hours ago, scrb said:

 

They have to dial the Kristen character down a little.  Why can't she rebel against the hippie parents by being a Trump supporter or something?

Oh please no.

I liked Kristen/Bacon-daughter a little better this week...she's just really young, and impulsive, and thoughtless (re: not realizing that the whole cop experience was different for her sister than her).

I just hate Tim Robbins' character. And he looks so...unattractive. Bad 'do.

I was also confused by Duc's supposed celibacy when he was banging everyone he could (except the Asian woman, which: man, Duc, you got issues) in Vancouver. Do we know WHY he's insistent on being--or anyway, SAYING he's celibate?

I liked seeing the shrink's family too...also recognized Necar Zedagen (it always shocks me that she's only 35) from Girlfriend's Guide,  and am interested in that family as well.

Also intrigued by Ramon's story and the link to the doctor's family. Also, damn, that boy is pretty.

Edited February 19, 2018 by luna1122

[topanga]

6 hours ago, scrb said:

Also, the trans or gender-fluid son of the psychiatrist had all the family in his social media feed or something.  Talk about all these coincidences, when these people have never had any contact with each other previously.

Yes. A few too many coincidences. Other than that, I like how the story is developing. It’s one I’ve  rarely seen on screen. I like the father’s very real reaction of being frustrated/confused by his son (without lashing out), and in the next breath, he showed his son how to wear the hijab properly. 

 

8 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

I thought the scene was interesting too.  On one hand, I think Ashley's experience was very true-to-life (unfortunately).  On the other, I really can't see any cop putting up with Kristen's behavior, much less sort of participating in it.

 

6 hours ago, scrb said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Ball is gently mocking the Portland hipster mindset.  He said in one interview though that Oregon excluded black people when it was originally founded so despite its current reputation, it has problems with race in its origins.

I grew up in Portland, so shout out to my home town. But, yes, the relationship between the police and the black community has always been strained. People often wouldn’t believe young black people’s complaints because they often came from 1) unemployed black men who were drug dealers or 2) black women who happened to be crack addicts. Thus, no one thought they were credible. Also, “Hey, this is Portland. We’re chill, we love everybody. Our mayor wears shorts to work. We can’t be racist.”

I don’t know if the show will ever tackle gentrification in Portland, which is a huge issue. And it’s more than white business owners opening coffee shops and artisanal breweries in black and brown neighborhoods. It’s trying to bully people of color into selling homes they’ve owned for generations or pricing working class renters out of the city entirely. But the show is addressing a lot already. I don’t know if it will have time. 

But is the show saying that everyone in Portland does drugs? Jeez. People are so casual about marijuana, cocaine, mushrooms, Ecstasy, LSD, etc. I’m not Nancy Regan or anything (yeah, I’m dating myself), but I hate it when tv and movies show how fun, edgy, and bad-ass drug use can be and never show how devastating drugs can be for individuals, families, and communities. I’m actually on Audrey’s side with this one.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ramon: I can't call you "Doctor" cause sometimes people call my dad "Doctor" and it always makes me wanna laugh.
Dr. Shokrani: You can call me Fred.
Ramon: You don't seem like a Fred.
Dr. Shokrani: My name is Farid, so Fred. 
Ramon: Why did you anglicize your name? 
Dr. Shokrani: It's just easier for some patients.
Ramon: What, racist patients?

Ashley: Do you really think he's mentally ill?
Duc: Ramon or Dad?

Ashley Look, what can we do? Anything?
Duc: Just be there for him if he needs us. I really don't think we should be intrusive. You know Mom's gonna be taking care of that.

Greg: My lunatic grandmother had cataracts behind these fucking Coke-bottle glasses. It magnified her eyes, made her look like a demented owl. That woman terrified me.

Farid: I'm merely acknowledging a series of interesting connections. Carl Jung would call that synchronicity.
Minou: Carl Jung was a racist, chauvinistic homophobe and he can suck my dick.

Kristen: Great. First time I have sex, I get fucking chlamydia!
Ashley: Well, did you use a condom?
Kristen: Oh, you're assuming it was with a guy?
Ashley: It wasn't?
Kristen: Of course it was.
Ashley: Did you use a condom? Kristen! You're a fucking idiot. You know that?
Kristen: Yes, I know.

Student: Are you suggesting we not strive to choose empathy over fear? Because that's kind of the cornerstone of your own philosophy.

Audrey: Why were you in jail? It's okay, sweetie. Your father and I have both been arrested.

Malcolm: So, uh, okay, so let's see. Your 17-year-old sister was legally raped and now has a venereal disease because you like to flirt while you were drunk and doing blow with a model.
Ashley: Well, when you put it like that, it sounds terrible.

Malcolm: Look, if you wanna do crazy shit do it with me, okay? You know I'll be into it. Who brought mushrooms to our honeymoon? 
Ashley: Mushrooms that didn't work. 
Malcolm: Yeah, well, the effort there.

Kristen: Mom, why do you act like this delicate goody-two-shoes when you're so not?
Audrey: Cause that's who my mother was. And no matter how much you try not to turn into your mother, you can never completely avoid it.

Audrey: There are lots of other ways, as Ram's family, that we can help [Ramon].
Kristen: Like having meetings behind his back.

Edited February 19, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

The most interesting thing Greg did in this entire episode was see that 11/11 sign. I don't care about his midlife crisis or hearing him try to schedule another appointment with the prostitute or telling his class to go out and live. Ugh. Did you ever think that these people are living life in their free time? I also cringed when Greg spoke Spanish to the car wash employees and said he wasn't the jefe because they're amigos. Dude, just stop.

Now who is going to find his prostitute's birthday gift in the glove compartment? I really hope it's Audrey mostly because if it ends up being one of the kids, he will try to bluff his way out of it and they will be so grossed out that they won't want to talk about. Audrey, on the other hand, will not let him off the hook so easily. Pro tip: if you don't want your wife to find out that you've been seeing a hooker, maybe don't keep presents from said hooker in your car.

Man, Duc has some issues. Maybe he needs to see a motivational architect to deal with that. I think he is celibate in Portland but that when he goes out of town, all bets are off. It's also possible that this is not a routine thing for him (meaning he just got triggered by the music and was acting out). I feel bad for anyone who feels dirty after sex for any reason. And poor Duc - those feelings were caused by what he witnessed, not anything he actually did.

And it must suck to get a book offer only to learn it's because what the publisher really wants is your dad. I'm guessing Duc is not going to tell him about their request for a foreword and just hope that his book will still get published without it.

Ahhh, the good old anti-choice protesters harassing and slut shaming women at Planned Parenthood. When they showed other people in the parking lot with their phones out recording Kristen kicking him, I thought that the videos would go viral but so far all we got was Kristen having fun in jail. Meanwhile Ashley gets groped and humiliated even though she didn't do a dam thing. Sadly, not surprising at all.

I'm glad that Malcolm found out the truth about Ashley lying about working late, bringing the model to the party, etc. He seems like a perfectly nice guy and it sucks that she's hiding all of this from him. If she truly thought it was all harmless flirting, she wouldn't keep it a secret. If you're truly unhappy in your marriage, you should discuss it with your spouse, try to fix it, or get out. I'm pretty sure that doing cocaine with randos isn't going to accomplish any of that.

Kristen can be annoying but I'm glad she told Ramon that their mom called a family meeting about him.

9 hours ago, bilgistic said:

if his parents are paying his insurance and doctor bills (I assume they are since they pay his rent), where's the line for how much input is too much? He's in a very fortunate position.

My opinion on this is that just because he's on his parents' insurance doesn't mean that they get to decide what kind of treatment he gets. He is a 22 year old adult. Unless they have him declared incompetent, there is no reason for them (and by them, I mean Audrey) to force medication upon him. I think the Affordable Care Act now allows you to keep your kids on your insurance until they're 26.

7 hours ago, scrb said:

Also, the trans or gender-fluid son of the psychiatrist had all the family in his social media feed or something.  Talk about all these coincidences, when these people have never had any contact with each other previously.

I just assumed that he found her on FB because they're the same age and they both live in Portland. You can search for people in your area so Navid may have just been looking for people his own age on FB. Sometimes FB suggests people based on having friends in common, geography, etc. Either way, I didn't find it unbelievable.

Edited February 19, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[luna1122]

20 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

I just assumed that he found her on FB because they're the same age and they both live in Portland. You can search for people in your area so Navid may have just been looking for people his own age on FB. Sometimes FB suggests people based on having friends in common, geography, etc. Either way, I didn't find it unbelievable.

Wait, I thought he went to school with Kristen? Or am I mistaking another kid in her class for him? I did laugh a little that the parents were not quite clear on whether it's gender fluid or gender queer, or what. They're trying to be supportive, but sometimes the labels get confusing.

I'm also curious about just what Audrey's occupation/career/business is, exactly.

I do think there's going to an ugly fall out from the "White Kids' movement group. That boy who Audrey clearly believed she had gotten thru to....I'm pretty sure she did not.

[The Solution]

9 hours ago, scrb said:

Also, the trans or gender-fluid son of the psychiatrist had all the family in his social media feed or something.  Talk about all these coincidences, when these people have never had any contact with each other previously.

He was in Audrey's meeting at Kristen's school. They know each other.

BTW, if someone were ever to tell me that my statements must start with the two words "I feel", I would say "I'm done" and walk out. I feel that I deal in facts, not emotions.