Heartaches, Bromances, True Love and Team Arrow: the Relationships Thread

[Password]

Calling Felicity a fling is completely....not watching the story in the screen. The only fling Oliver has had is the dalliance with Isabel. Helena broke it off with him, Makenna and Sara too. Laurel was a blatant mistake. Shado...well I don't really know what Shado was about. If they mean they were short, I can agree but I would say Oliver was invested in those relationships. He's not the same Ollie (choke, gag) as pre island, although the sister swapping is vile. It's just my opinion but there is nothing to deduce from Oliver's exchanges with Laurel to suggest they belong together other than his romantic, angst face around her.

[Sakura12]

I wonder if Cassidy ever planned on training to play the Black Canary or if she was just going to to with the writing says I'm so I am. If you look at most action films (not all) the women are usually model thin and we're just supposed to pretend they can kick ass. 

 

Then Caity Lotz got hired, and she was like oh shit, I guess I have to actually work at this playing a super hero thing. I better start working out. Because she could've actually been getting herself some training this entire time to prepare for the role she was hired to play. It's not like we see Laurel in skimpy clothing, no one would've noticed she had muscles. She could've been taking martial arts classes, weapons training, archery or whatever else was needed. Caity apparently took archery lessons for that one scene she held a bow at Roy. She was also probably using it to add more skills to her resume. 

[Anthea]

I agree KirkB with your theory on how the EP acted with Laurel/BC.

 

But I think that instead of sticking with the plan, they are giving it a last try. If they can't fix it by season 3, they should give up (Well ok it's my wishful thinking)

I'm also afraid that they'll go the Lauriver route once more, hopefully just to end it.

[statsgirl]

I don't think Barry and Felicity will ever be a thing, despite the EP's selling it as that in the beginning to draw interest to the Flash. (which still makes no sense to me because comic wise, Flash is much more popular and well known than Green Arrow).

I think it makes sense in terms of TV show vs comic books.  It's been a long time since I read the comics, but I love the Arrow TV show so to have Barry start out on Arrow is a way to draw people like me in.  Also it was a way of testing the character out before the expense of a pilot or backdoor episode.  Maybe it was also to push Oliver into worrying that he was going to lose Felicity, on the team if nothing else. SA talked about the scenes in Unthinkable being the culmination of their (Oliver & Felicity) arc.

 

Barry was cute but too much like Felicity for good TV romance. They were like the Bobbsey Twins.  If Iris does turn out to be Laurel V2, his Felicity will be Caitlin, given their chemistry on the 5 minutes trailer.

 

 

But I think that instead of sticking with the plan, they are giving it a last try. If they can't fix it by season 3, they should give up (Well ok it's my wishful thinking)

Yes , to both.  They have to give it another try, if only to end the Lauriver ship for all but the most die-hard fans.  And then they should give it up because if it hasn't worked in 3 seasons, it's not going to.

 

I'm on the slow-burn wagon for Oliver and Felicity for two reasons:

1.  Right now Oliver is not at a place where he can sustain a serious longterm relationship. When he gets there, I want it to be Felicity but I don't want them to get together now, and then break up, and then get together again, and then break up.... that being Marc Guggenheim's idea of a well-written romance.

 

2. This is a TV show and it's too soon to put the endgame couple together yet because they would just break up again by the end of next season.  One of the reasons I want it to be Felicity is that I think she would bring the least drama into the relationship and the show could just concentrate on crime fighting but I know the CW will milk it for all its worth.

 

Only the audience really liked Sara and became even more dismissive of Laurel, which I think the EP's and Cassidy are unaware of. The plan was to make Laurel the Canary and they're going to stick to it, even if it takes longer than they expected.

I wouldn't be surprised if the casting of KC as Laurel came from CW rather than the EPs.  Why would you not chemistry test your lead male with your lead female otherwise?

 

I don't know about KC but I think the EPs are well aware that many in the audience don't think Laurel is BC stuff, especially after Caity Lotz in the role, and they are scrambling to find a way to keep CL and put Laurel in the role that is expected of her, or at least a role that she can play.

Edited May 22, 2014 by statsgirl

[KirkB]

At this point I don't care if they make Laurel into a vigilante sidekick for Oliver, so long as it isn't the Canary. The Canary is Sara, period. Give Laurel mad skills and a costume out of the blue, fine, just with some other name.

Edited May 22, 2014 by KirkB

[ostentatious]

I suspect that the original plan was to have Dinah be the first BC. Which explains why they bothered to hire Alex Kingston. But then KC didn't work out very well, so instead of bringing Sara in as Ravager as they'd planned, they brought her in to audition for BC, or at least introduce the possibility that, despite comics canon, Laurel Lance might not be the BC after all.

 

Absolutely Oliver was a trophy for Laurel, but her a trophy for him? She's middle class, she's attractive enough but not *prize* level attractive, she's intelligent, she's probably a school overachiever. I'd see her more as Oliver liking overachieving girls because he's an underachiever. So, if he considered her a trophy, I have to back up and admire that because those are actually valuable, positive qualities to be looking for.

[bravelittletoaster]

Comic canon is this wrinkle I always forget is a factor because Idgaf about the comics or what happens in them.  So it seems like all this pressure to put Laurel with Oliver is mostly derived from what [to me] are extra-textual issues, ie, forces outside the tv show itself.  I guess if you feel the show is beholden to follow the trajectory of the comics you can't get behind Oliver being paired with a character [Felicity] who I understand is not even in them.

 

As a fan of Caity as the Sparrow I've gleaned I'm running into the same tension, since it's not that way in the comics.  Fuck the comics, is my opinion.  I'm here for a tv show.

[SmallScreenDiva]

But she just seems like a more natural fit for Barry to me.  And the show was clearly courting that, so I'll be curious to see what if anything they do with that when they launch the Flash show and how often if ever they cross over.

 

I really don't see The Flash and Arrow doing anything with the Barry/Felicity flirtation. I think we might get a mention of it either in The Flash pilot or one of the early eisodes of Arrow but I really doubt they'd continue with it. I think they kinda shut the door on that in "Seeing Red," when Cisco tells Felicity that Iris had been visiting Barry a lot. Besides, if I read the cast/character descriptions for The Flash, they already are setting up their own love triangle (*groan) with Barry, Iris and the golden boy cop whose name escapes me at the moment. I think "Barricity" was merely used to entice viewers, although it did help move Felicity and Oliver's relationship forward (he admitted he really needed her by his side, even though he tied it to their vigilante work and actually apologized for being a jerk, something I don't think Oliver's ever done before).

 

It's funny that this is the sentiment I've heard (from a few of my male friends who watch and my 74-year-old Dad who texted me yesterday to ask if they end up together in the comics--he was really sad when I told him that they're not even in the same comic title)

 

My mom was telling me the same thing, LOL! She and my dad were watching and it was my dad who got really upset that it was a ruse and thought they should have kissed at the beach.

[icandigit]

 

think the EPs never expected backlash against the sister-swapping because of the popularity and longevity of The Vampire Diaries (with brother-swapping at its core romance).

This explains so much. thanks for the info.

[ostentatious]

I think that Barry and Felicity are Oliver and Sara. They're meant to be the same character at different points on the same sort of journey. Which explains why for the first times in Arrow history, chemistry reads were part of casting! GG and EBR had one, SA and CL had one. So I don't see those pairings as pairings, per se, but as opportunities for the characters to see themselves in a mirror, and for the audience to compare and contrast.

 

I think the important difference they missed between TVD and Arrow is that TVD has an almost all female audience, and one that is likely to be way friendlier to MFM than FMF. Same with Twilight. One guy two girls is a very different thing. I'm sure there are guys who could totally be down with MFM but the more likely fantasy is FMF.

 

WRT comics canon, I think that canon has been served wrt the GA/BC relationship. The Arrow and the Canary have banged. Canon served.

Edited May 22, 2014 by thecatbastet

[Danny Franks]

Kind of tough to sell Barry as unlucky in love or whatever, when he's got at least three gorgeous women hanging around him all the time, isn't it? Especially when it's already been made clear that at least one of them is interested in him.

 

No Flash/Arrow crossovers, please. I imagine it will already be a tough enough sell for Grant Gustin to pass himself off as a superhero, without being compared to Stephen Amell every step of the way.

[Password]

When the episode where Felicity found out about Iris aired I just felt so bad for her. Every dude she likes has issues surrounding love. All I could think was when is Felicity going to win.

I thought that episode was also meant to put to bed anything to do with a Barry-Felicity love.

[bluebonnet]

I don't mind Felicity having a thing with Barry or any other fellow.  I think she should and I look forward to seeing her live her life outside of Team Arrow.  They've created her into a person too good to just sit around and pine for someone that isn't ready.  She's extremely confident, apart from that one time when she wasn't sure if she was even necessary to the team, and it would be out of character to make her into someone who didn't realize there are other people out there.  In other words, she's not Ollie and she's not Laurel.  

 

As I stated above, I want Olicity to be end game so I don't want to see them anywhere near a bed, or even see their lips within a foot of one another, for a while because I don't want the added drama of break ups that seems necessary for tv.  The thing about Ollie and Felicity is they make each other better people.  They lift each other up.  It's in a way that's different with how Oliver and Diggle interact.  Diggle helped Oliver see that he could do some real good instead of the single-minded focus on The List vendetta, but it was about making The Arrow better at his job.  There isn't quite the same reciprocation with Oliver and Diggle.  Diggle works in more of a mentor role.  With Felicity, there's much more focus on making Oliver want to be a better Arrow and man.  She gives him advice about his personal life and counsels him in his vigilante job.  She makes him question his decisions.  But, it's not all one-sided.  Oliver's tactics are different but he still challenges Felicity.  He pushes her to face her physical fears, he shows her how strong she is without her needing to play on Sally by giving her the super important task of taking down Slade, he supports her creativity when he uses ideas she has.  They have both grown due to the influence of one another.  There's also this really significant peace they bring out in one another.  Can't remember the episode, but Ollie was yelling, I think at Sara.  Getting real worked up and Felicity just said a few words and the anger just drained out of him.  The best thing about it all is that she's not afraid to stand up for herself.  She doesn't have the skills to punch Ollie when he's being a jerk but that doesn't make her afraid to look him in the eye and say that she doesn't deserve the way he's acting towards her.  It's honestly one of the most organic and fulfilling relationships I've seen on TV.  Ever.  

 

I think the EPs never expected backlash against the sister-swapping because of the popularity and longevity of The Vampire Diaries (with brother-swapping at its core romance).

 

I can kinda get this.  TVD was quite popular and a lot of it was due to the pretty brother drama.  However, I think the EPs overlooked the big difference between vampires and superheroes.  We expect our vampires to be pretty shady.  We don't really want this with our heroes.  Sister-swapping with pre-island Oliver worked because he was meant to be a real douchebag.  It might have even worked when he returned from the island because while he was a vigilante, he was still a sort of shady person, what with all that murder.  Season 2 Ollie should not have been sister-swapping as he was firmly on the road to hero.  Heroes can be jerks with anger issues but they shouldn't be sleeping with sisters.  It felt more natural coming from Sara since they portrayed her as the albeit wild partying sister, but the one who was truly broken up over doing this to her sister.  It felt worse with Ollie because he stared at a pic of Laurel for months and gave her pining eyes for an entire season only to turn around and hook up with the sister again.  Of course, it also made Laurel look really dumb for continuing to give creepy hugs to Ollie and smiling like a loon when Sara said Ollie needed her because um, girl needs to get some self-esteem.  

[SmallScreenDiva]

Can't remember the episode, but Ollie was yelling, I think at Sara.  Getting real worked up and Felicity just said a few words and the anger just drained out of him.  The best thing about it all is that she's not afraid to stand up for herself.

 

I think that may be the "Deathstroke" episode when Oliver was getting angry because Sara and Diggle were trying to stop him from going after Slade alone. This is the "Go get Thea" speech, if I remember correctly. I loved that scene because IMO it illustrated just how much Felicity understands Oliver and how much Oliver looks to Felicity for guidance. He was feeling so helpless at that moment, so worried for his sister. He was going to do what he needed to do anyway so why not back him up? And that's what Felicity did. There was an implicit permission in her words: "Do whatever it takes."

 

There was another scene earlier in the season, in "Tremors." I rewatched that recently after stumbling across a Tumblr post pointing out the scene in the lair with the trio. Oliver was getting worked up over Roy, Diggle was indicating his disapproval of putting Roy in the field. Felicity stops Oliver's angry tirade by finishing his sentence in a matter of fact tone, very different from Oliver's agitated tone. Then she softens her voice and you can see Oliver respond to that because his next words are a lot calmer. The video can be found here, if anyone is interested.

 

However, I think the EPs overlooked the big difference between vampires and superheroes.  We expect our vampires to be pretty shady.  We don't really want this with our heroes.

 

I haven't watched TVD in years but has Elena actually gone back and forth between Damon and Stefan? She was with Stefan first, but now with Damon, right? Has she gone back to Stefan since being with Damon? I agree with the difference between vampires and superheroes. Vampire morals are tiny bit different ;) Arrow is supposedly much more grounded in reality, and so must its relationships, I think.

[quarks]

I'm fascinated by how many people want to see Felicity dating someone else. I'm not against it, and I can definitely see that evening out the playing field would be a good thing, since so far Oliver has been with six women on the show and is presumably adding number seven (Amanda in the past timeline) next season, and Felicity - really not so much.  And I'm really not against it if this someone else turns out to be Nyssa. :)

 

At the same time, my fear is that on the show this will be played more as "how to get Oliver jealous" and make us wonder when and if Oliver will say anything, which, especially since there's a good chance that the show will be playing up some Laurel/Oliver stuff in the Arrow cave, is not really something I'm looking forward to it.

 

So what I'd actually like to see is occasional comments and hints that Felicity has a social life of some sort outside Oliver, or occasionally hanging out with her new coworkers - whether for a new company or in a new division for Queen's Consolidated. Or even just exchanging texts with Caitlin Snow about things.

 

Speaking of Laurel/Oliver jealousy - she witnessed the whole Oliver/Slade/Felicity showdown, and yet we never got her response to that, even after Sara's whole "Oliver needs you," thing. I'm wondering how she's going to deal with that - just assume that it was a ruse? And that she can totally tell it was a ruse because she knows Oliver well enough to tell, even though Slade, who also knows Oliver well, couldn't and didn't?

[Password]

Well seeing as Laurel is now the queen of cool and knows Oliver in his bones they may play it off as she knew it wasn't true. Or they could make me really happy and have her irrational about it. Bitchy Laurel makes me laugh. It would be in line with the way she dismisses Felicity most of the time anyway.

About Felicity getting a love interest, I'm utterly unconcerned about how Oliver responds to it, I just want her to have someone she can turn to. Whether it's a new friend or someone special, I can't stand to see her so alone and Oliver oriented when we know she had to have a life before Arrow.

I loved seeing her, Caitlin and Cisco interact. I immediately thought hah! I would totally watch them together because they clicked well. It would be fun to see Oliver first see that Felicity's life doesn't revolve around him but that's where I would end it. He can go ahead and have his fun, Felicity can have hers too.

Edited May 22, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[Danny Franks]

So what I'd actually like to see is occasional comments and hints that Felicity has a social life of some sort outside Oliver, or occasionally hanging out with her new coworkers - whether for a new company or in a new division for Queen's Consolidated. Or even just exchanging texts with Caitlin Snow about things.

 

 

That's pretty much how I'd rather see it play out too. The idea that Felicity needs some sort of outside life has some legs, but I wouldn't discount that she actually seems to have a genuine friendship with Diggle. Just because he's part of Team Arrow, doesn't mean he can't be important to her outside of that setting. I'd like to see her have more friends, but not to the extent that it sows discord between her and Oliver when she's late or too busy to help him with something. It would be needless angst, now they've already established that this trio have a very effective working relationship.

 

And I think any boyfriend they gave her would exist solely to cause strife for her and Oliver. Whether through overt jealousy or just through her being unavailable at times. I don't think the show needs it. I don't think I need to see Felicity torn between some guy and Team Arrow to understand that it's tough to build a life around clandestine activities.

 

Speaking of Laurel/Oliver jealousy - she witnessed the whole Oliver/Slade/Felicity showdown, and yet we never got her response to that, even after Sara's whole "Oliver needs you," thing. I'm wondering how she's going to deal with that - just assume that it was a ruse? And that she can totally tell it was a ruse because she knows Oliver well enough to tell, even though Slade, who also knows Oliver well, couldn't and didn't?

 

 

I would hope they explore it in some fashion, because it would at least give Laurel's presence in that scene some sort of relevance that it currently doesn't have. Would it shock her to imagine that Oliver could love Felicity? Probably. She doesn't seem to care for Felicity, but I don't think she's been given much reason to. Looking at the scenes they've had together, I can understand that Laurel isn't keen. But would Laurel make an effort, now she knows how important Felicity is to Oliver? Yeah, I'm doubtful about that, to be honest.

 

Perhaps they could finally kill Oliver/Laurel by having her offer herself as a purely platonic, honestly no jealousy, source of advice if Oliver ever plans to ask Felicity out on a date. It could actually be a sweet aspect to a relationship that has been purely toxic and revolting, to this point. But I doubt the writers will take it in that direction.

[bluebonnet]

I'm fascinated by how many people want to see Felicity dating someone else.

For me, it has a lot more to do with wanting them to maintain consistency with her character.  I'm not at all interested in seeing her have a social life in order to show Oliver as jealous.  He didn't express any overt jealousy towards his so-called great love Laurel, so he shouldn't be expressing it towards Felicity now that (I assume) he realizes he loves her.  But to be consistent with Felicity, they can't really show her sitting around waiting for Ollie to get his shit together.  I don't need to see a lover or group of friends in my face every single episode, but mentions of it would be great, like they mentioned Barry off and on.  

 

I'd just really really hate if they turn Felicity into a Laurel by making her character inconsistent and practically irrelevant.  

[statsgirl]

 

Speaking of Laurel/Oliver jealousy - she witnessed the whole Oliver/Slade/Felicity showdown, and yet we never got her response to that, even after Sara's whole "Oliver needs you," thing. I'm wondering how she's going to deal with that - just assume that it was a ruse?

If Laurel is anything like Katie Cassidy's fans, she's going to assume that Oliver deliberately risked Felicity's life in order to save Laurel because Laurel is the one he really cares about.  I've read it even in some reviews.

 

I don't know if we can avoid seeing Felicity date someone else.  One of the big complaints about her character has been that she's only about Oliver and that she has no life outside of Oliver.  I would have liked something this season, maybe just a remark about going to lunch with an old friend from the IT department and how the gossip hurts her.  But we got nothing because the show is All About Oliver and everything ties into him, whether it's Thea turning to Malcolm or Diggle's baby,which I'm sure will end up being about Oliver's child in the end.

 

I'm not optimistic that Felicity will have a life outside of Oliver, and that means that any social life she gets will be fodder for Oliver's reactions.

[Password]

I think I saw somewhere they wanted to delve into Felicity's parents a bit more in s2 but they ran out of time and it wouldn't have fit in. I'm curious to see whom her mother is, cocktail waitress from Vegas. And her dad whom apparently ran out on them. I don't know how they'll integrate him because it would be too good to be true if he somehow had something to do with Oliver. Would make me think Oliver is keeping secrets from his team (which he is) but that would be overkill.

I'm just very curious about Felicity Smoak and her origins. Any details are cherished haha

[slayer2]

I'm okay with it being fodder, she's not the star of the show Oliver is and he's the one I'm really invested in. I'm far more interested in what he thinks and does than anyone else. I'm all about the superhero so for me watching Felicity on a date unless it wakes Ollie up is of no interest to me. However I'm not opposed to a throwaway line or two about her dating or being social.

Edited May 22, 2014 by slayer2

[Password]

I agree the show isn't about Felicity. But even Diggle got the Suicide Squad episode. She's really the only character who's entire life is team Arrow and that should be remedied. Cut one or two of Laurel's scenes. She wasn't entirely necessary in the finale anyway.

[statsgirl]

I think they actually have to show Felicity having an outside life because otherwise people who think that her only interest is Oliver are going to continue thinking that way.  It doesn't have to be much, maybe the guy who used to stand outside her window at MIT comes to town for a bit, or have her try on-line dating and be screening guys at the new Cave, or Oliver can't find her because she's having drinks with friends, but it's got to be something, if only to establish her as a rounded person so that her life doesn't revolve aroubnd Oliver. Even Laurel got to have a friend at CNRI.

[slayer2]

I think a throwaway line or two would work. She could be relaying a story to Diggle or something and absently mention a date she went on. It can't be anything serious or it would undercut their progress in Unthinkable.

[Password]

I think a throwaway line or two would work. She could be relaying a story to Diggle or something and absently mention a date she went on. It can't be anything serious or it would undercut their progress in Unthinkable.

I don't necessarily think her dating someone else or having a life outside of Oliver undercuts their progress. Just being a sort of mix of Tony Starc's secretary and Chloe from Smallville isn't enough because we're only allowed to see the beautiful side of Felicity. Giving her something outside of Arrow makes her character more crunchy and easier to take seriously. Even Miss Potts ended up running Starc Industries. Oliver isn't the only one growing on the show, Felicity should have storylines that make her grow too. She's not just the character waiting around until a guy she likes is ready to be a real boy. In that way they can both be shaped into being perfect together whilst standing on even ground. We saw how strong she became. What else can Felicity Smoak do?

Edited May 23, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[icandigit]

They wouldn't be able to sell a jealous Oliver to me after Felicity already silenced that noise the first time. No way he would try her again with that.

[Password]

Exactly. That would just be noise.

[quarks]

And I think any boyfriend they gave her would exist solely to cause strife for her and Oliver. Whether through overt jealousy or just through her being unavailable at times. I don't think the show needs it.

 

 

I think the real issue is that we've already seen them deal with this: Felicity incredulous over Isabel, but dealing with and becoming friends with Sara and worried only that she won't be good enough for the team; Oliver getting a clenched jaw over Barry, which was pretty funny, and later getting ticked that Felicity wasn't constantly at his beck and call, which made him admit that he could be dependent on someone. So it's not something that I think the show needs to play with again. 

 

What else can Felicity Smoak do?

 

 

Lots of things. The obvious answer is "found a tech firm," which actually is not that far off - since I'm assuming that she's out of a job right now herself, she can start by doing consulting work and work to build that up. If Felicity is starting up a company while Oliver is trying to get his back, that can provide some fun tension. Or go to work for a firm -- say Kord Industries - start making friends there and getting really into her job before finding out Mysterious Happenings. Get a visit from some MIT friends where she has to hide her nighttime activities from them - and her embarrassing MIT stories (there's more than the lacrosse player) from Team Arrow.  Continue to do physical training - I promise Tumblr and other sites will have a meltdown if she and Oliver have a sparring training session and one of them lands on top of the other one.  Have her invent tech things and patent them - and use any income to help support Team Arrow.  Find out who her father (or fathers if this show decides to pull an adoption plotline on us) is, and if my completely off the wall fanwanking with absolutely no basis in the show at all is right, have Carter Hall teach her how to fly.  (I know, I know, but I still like it :) ). 

 

Also the inevitable Vegas trip, which is either next season or season four, depending upon how much they want to tease the Vegas wedding thing.

[statsgirl]

 

It can't be anything serious or it would undercut their progress in Unthinkable.

It was Oliver's progress though, not Felicity's.

 

I think they did a good job this season of writing her her own hero arc, going from scared to being willing to take Slade on.  But in terms of her relationship with Oliver, she still thinks that either he was faking at Queen Manor, or while he's fond of her, it's not in a romantic way.  I hope she's not the kind of person to sit around waiting for the guy to finally notice her instead of going out to seek her own destiny.  She wasn't like that when she went to MIT. 

 

I think dating someone else would undercut Oliver's progress, especially since his story is that he can't be with someone he cares about.  Felicity, on the other hand, deserves someone who cares about her when he's awake (although it was cute when Oliver said Barry was probably dreaming about her).

 

ETA: 

 

Also the inevitable Vegas trip, which is either next season or season four, depending upon how much they want to tease the Vegas wedding thing.

In these EPs hands..... I'm already having nightmares about that episode.  Season 3 is my guess if they start getting together at the end of it, because these things are better done when the couple isn't together  yet.

 

I really the idea of her inventing things and patenting them to help out money-wise. 

Edited May 23, 2014 by statsgirl

[Password]

The Merlyn job in Vegas...the VEGAS JOB. What an awesome name...if the show's name were Leverage. But all of those sings mentioned were awesome, especially her patenting things to fund team Arrow.

[SonofaBiscuit]

I'm really curious to see interviews and Arrow cast panels from events like Comic-Con as the third season gears up.  Last summer, Stephen Amell really seemed to be promoting Olicity.  I think we might get some clues to where Oliver's relationships are headed in season 3 based on what Amell says in interviews/at panels.  As it stands now, he doesn't seem too keen on the idea that Laurel and Oliver might end up together. 

 

I find it amusing that Katie Cassidy is giving interviews proclaiming that Oliver and Laurel are soulmates and she should be with him because Canary and Arrow were together in the comics (she does realize she's not Canary YET, right?) while Amell seems far less committed and is basically saying that it's possible that the only relationship in their future may be friendship.  I think it would make things far less confusing if the EPs would clue their actors in on what they should be promoting.  Of course, to do that, the EPs would have to have a clear idea of where their show is headed and as far as I can tell, they are just making it all up as they go along.

[statsgirl]

I'll be interested to hear what they have to say at Comic Con, but I'll be surprised if we get a definite direction on Oliver's love life.  They'll want to tease everything, and it's too soon for Oliver's endgame relationship to happen.

 

I don't know if the EPs have told Stephen Amell where the show is headed but in all his interviews, he says pretty much the same two things: told that the Olicity fans were upset that the ILU was a fake, he says "I don't know. Was it?"; and  repeats the line from Keep Your Enemies Close that he told Felicity, that because of when I/we (sometimes it's 'I', sometimes it's 'we') do, I can't be with someone I really care about.  Meanwhile, Marc Guggenheim is tweeting confirming that the 'unthinkable' is Oliver risking the woman he loves to defeat Slade.

 

If Katie Cassidy weren't saying in all her interviews that Laurel and Oliver are Made For Each Other, would we even be wondering?

[writersblock51]

 

If Katie Cassidy weren't saying in all her interviews that Laurel and Oliver are Made For Each Other, would we even be wondering?

 

Probably not.

 

I find her to be exceedlingly annoying.

[slayer2]

Well I've just watched 1.08 and now I ship Oliver and The Huntress, their chemistry s fantastic, I love their parallels, how damaged they both are. It reminds me so much of Batman and Catwoman whom I love and the actress is amazing. My favourite pairing thus far.

[quarks]

Slayer2, that episode cemented my belief that the Oliver/Laurel ship was in severe trouble. You have Oliver, trying to connect to Laurel for seven episodes and apart from the one moment with the ice cream, failing - and even post that moment, disappointing her by pretending to be his old, drunk jerk of a self at the QC Applied Sciences opening (for good reason, mind you, but still, and she doesn't see the reason) -

 

And after one initially reluctant dinner and one fight, Helena a) immediately recognizes him (which Laurel has failed to do), b) bonds with him and gets him immediately. Highlighting the total issue.

 

She's only been in four episodes so far, granted, but I still see her as a more viable long term choice for Oliver than Laurel, which is saying something. Every once in awhile the producers will slip in a comment about how Oliver has various women in his life, and list Helena there, so I think there's a chance that might get explored again.

[KirkB]

With the events of her last episode, once she spends some time in jail she could actually return as a viable romantic partner for Oliver.

Edited May 24, 2014 by KirkB

[catrox14]

As much as I love the dynamic between Ollie/Amell and Felicity/EBR, I was quite blown away by Amell and deGouw when she showed up in s2.  She was 100% better this time. If they put them together again, I think it would be compelling and enjoyable. 

[slayer2]

Yay!! Thanks quarks that gives me hope! I just saw so much emotional honesty in their scenes in 1.07/1.08 and I got to see a childlike hopeful, innocent side of Oliver that I hadn't seen before which was entirely precious. The way he looks at her is something else, and the actress is phenomenal as well, she has an incredible strength yet a vulnerability that she seems to be able to access in seconds. Fascinating match that one.

Edited May 24, 2014 by slayer2

[statsgirl]

With Dracula cancelled, I can just see the EPs planning how to write the Huntress back for an arc next season.

 

I like their dynamic and I think it could be a strong arc/relationship. She's a lot like Sara damaged but survived it less well,  more darkness, fewer morals.  The show (mostly voiced by Diggle) has set up that she's crazy and that for me rules out a healthy long-term relationship with Oliver but it would be interesting to have Helena back again and see where they go with it, especially if they use her to set up a Birds of Prey spin-off. 

[calliope1975]

I don't know that I see Helena as a healthy, viable partner for Oliver long-term, but I wouldn't be adverse to seeing a reformed Helena. I wasn't a fan of JDG's acting in her S1 appearances or her stint on Dracula, but I really enjoyed that final scene with Oliver in S2 where she was more lost and vulnerable. And I would love to see more of a BoP team-up. Helena, Sara, and Nyssa kicking ass? Yes, please. The Huntress is one of my favorite DC characters, and her relationship with The Question in Justice League Unlimited was one of my favorite. 

[quarks]

To be fair,  I did list Helena as a better long term choice for Oliver than Laurel, which at this stage seems a pretty low bar :)

 

I doubt she's going to be endgame, but I do think the writers could have a lot of fun bringing her back, especially since Felicity really, genuinely, hates her, and although Laurel stopped Sara from killing her, Laurel didn't seem overly excited either.  And Helena, Sara and Nyssa as the Birds of Prey? That would be awesome. 

[Password]

Oliver has a real soft spot for Helena. He always handles her with kid gloves, hence the baby arrows. He always acts very responsible for her, when really she was just crazy. Oliver the mentor doesn't always work out all that well.

What quarks mentioned about Felicity really disliking Helena is a really good point. That would be super fun to see happening. I actually really like The Huntress and I'm surprised so many people dislike her. I always like crazy women on TV shows, they're very entertaining. I don't particularly want Oliver and Helena to become a thing again because their relationship was...hmm very convenient. Ooh Oliver finds someone just like him who understands him. Wah wah waaah. But yes, they probably will visit that again.

BoP minus Laurel Lance and added Felicity would be amazing.

Edited May 24, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[statsgirl]

No, not Laurel. I've like to see Helena have a friendship with Sara because they've both been through the darkness but Sara is healthier. If anyone could help Helena put things in perspective, it would be Sara.  I'd like to see a BoP with Sara, Nyssa and Helena, long as none of them have to be in a wheelchair.

 

I actually really like The Huntress and I'm surprised so many people dislike her.

Viewers or characters on the show?  I like Malcolm Merlyn and his craziness is fun to watch but I wouldn't want anyone I care about to be in a relationship with him. (Same with Laurel, but for other reasons.)  It's no surprise Diggle and Felicity don't like Helena.

 

Felicity having to deal with Helena and come to some sort of accommodation with her could be interesting -- unlike Isabel Rochev she's not out to get Oliver but unlike Sara she's not good for him either -- but I don't want to see Jealous Felicity again.  It does her no favours nor the show either.

Edited May 24, 2014 by statsgirl

[Password]

Viewers of the show. I've seen several comments about the show making her a cop killer and dislikeable but I really enjoy her and her episodes. Hmm was Sara actually good for Oliver though? She was an excellent partner in the field and they really complimented each other there but their relationship?

I don't mean jealous Felicity. Helena forced Felicity to hack into the FBI database then tied her up in s1. Felicity probably doesn't have warm and fuzzy feelings about her. Not to mention Diggle doesn't like Helena at all. It would be fun to see Felicity and Diggle snark over her.

[Zalyn]

Helena and Oliver are emotionally and psychologically interesting, so I wouldn't mind seeing that relationship explored and developed more in the future. As a "good idea" relationship?  Terrible.  If I had two friends like that, I would tell them to get the hell away from each other.  But as a story and opportunity for character development, they are great to see. 

[slayer2]

Although given the fact that Oliver isn't long for healthy relationships (on the show or in canon) him and Huntress do make a certain kinda sense. AW hell I just love those crazy kids.

[SleepDeprived]

I enjoy Helena. I found her interesting, even at the peak of her batshit insanity. She reminds me of Faith, on Buffy, so I'd be down for an Oliver/Helena relationship that might be similar to Faith and Angel's. The quiet moment between them at the end of "Birds of Prey" showed a vulnerability in Helena that I would be keen to see the show explore. And I imagine it would be very entertaining to see how Felicity and Diggle would interact with her if Oliver ever brings her in to their new Arrow lair. Lots of sassing and snarking at each other, I bet.

 

How would she return, though? Wasn't she set to go to trial for all the crime she committed? Could Waller read her in to the Suicide Squad, maybe?

[statsgirl]

Maybe in exchange for information on her father's crime organization, they could let Helena out early. Wasn't she the one who got it all on the laptop anyway?

 

Hmm was Sara actually good for Oliver though?

I think she was.  When Oliver came back from the island, he was very closed off emotionally and physically.  Laurel shut him out, he opened up to Helena and that went bad, then he tired again with  McKenna and she left.  (Really, for her knowing Oliver put her in danger because Helena was the one who took out her knee.)  

 

Oliver cared very much about Sara, enough to put a tracker on her when she disappeared from Starling City.  Their sexual relationship this season didn't last long for various reasons (plot contrivance being the biggest) but I think it was good for him to be with someone he could trust and who cared for him, someone with whom he could let his guard down completely, and who he knew could take care of herself in the field and fight by his side.  She may not have been his great love story but it was as good a relationship as they both could make it given how screwed up they both were.

[Sakura12]

Yeah, I think at that time Sara was good for Oliver, they both were looking for something to hold on too, someone to understand them. They had been through so much together and Oliver was separated from her horrifically, twice. Ultimately I think they both knew it wasn't going to work, but they needed that closure.

 

So for me even though we didn't get much their relationship I think it helped them both grow a little more and realize what they truly want.  

[KirkB]

So for me even though we didn't get much their relationship I think it helped them both grow a little more and realize what they truly want.

 

 

   Which, hopefully, is Nyssa for Sara and anyone but Laurel for Oliver. Seriously, I'd rather see him with Helena, Felicity, Waller, even Diggle. Malcolm might be pushing it but at least they have archery in common.