S01.E06: The Watergate Tape

[bros402]

4 hours ago, snarktini said:

My history education from the 50s-70s on came from my parents at the dinner table. Stories about Vietnam, Goldwater, Tricky Dick, Eisenhower. I never learned Deep Throat's name, though, at any point.

W. Mark Felt was only revealed to be Deep Throat in 2005.

[Cthulhudrew]

Just how many goons does Flynn have working for him, anyway? And where and how does he recruit them? Maybe someone in the present should try tracking down the money trail that leads through his henchmen supply chain.

[Netfoot]

11 hours ago, snarktini said:

To me it was obviously the same guy

I thought so too, but with so many making queries, I went back and double checked my eyes.

[Haleth]

I too cannot believe Rufus didn't know what Deep Throat was.  And if Flynn's only purpose in jumping around time is to thwart Rittenhouse, why didn't he give the tape to Woodward and Bernstein?  Expose Rittenhouse and send them off to obscurity in the helicopter with Nixon.

I didn't think Rufus's guy and dad were the same person so I checked imdb and they only have one actor listed as "Rittenhouse agent."  No separate listing for dad, so I guess they are one and the same.

As someone who watched just about every moment of the Watergate hearings (HS at the time) this brought a lot of nostalgia.  I still remember the jaw dropping moment Alex Butterfield casually told the committee about the tapes.  Talk about a history changing event!  One small comment brought down a presidency.

Edited November 20, 2016 by Haleth

[Raja]

31 minutes ago, Haleth said:

I too cannot believe Rufus didn't know what Deep Throat was.  And if Flynn's only purpose in jumping around time is to thwart Rittenhouse, why didn't he give the tape to Woodward and Bernstein?  Expose Rittenhouse and send them off to obscurity in the helicopter with Nixon.

I didn't think Rufus's guy and dad were the same person so I checked imdb and they only have one actor listed as "Rittenhouse agent."  No separate listing for dad, so I guess they are one and the same.

As someone who watched just about every moment of the Watergate hearings (HS at the time) this brought a lot of nostalgia.  I still remember the jaw dropping moment Alex Butterfield casually told the committee about the tapes.  Talk about a history changing event!  One small comment brought down a presidency.

I will head canon that Rittenhouse, along with Flynn have had no problem with dropping as many bodies as needed with no thought of collateral damage. Just don't get caught as Rittenhouse instead of the Blackflag Anarchist. The Nixon Administration was not going to carry out a hit if necessary on Woodward and Bernstein, look at how we reacted to a burglary, but Flynn and/or Rittenhouse would

[Ceindreadh]

Regarding Doc, I have a theory (behind spoiler space, just in case)

We know that she had a 1 year old son in 1972, correct?  He'd be about 45 now?  Maybe it's Mason, and that's how he's got tangled up with Rittenhouse

[withanaich]

Ceindreadh, my husband had the same idea. That would explain how

Spoiler

Mason became part of Rittenhouse

 and the timeline does fit.

Quote

I was never interested in history in school because it was nothing but rote memorization of this battle on this date, that battle on that date, this battle on this date, that battle on that date, etc. That was literally it. We had to memorize every little battle that took place during the civil war or the revolutionary war. There weren't interesting tidbits about people or scandals, it was just battle, date, battle, date, battle, date. 

That's certainly how we learned it, at least up until junior high. So. damn. boring, and I don't remember any of those dates or battles. I do recall being annoyed that we were basically starting from the beginning every year and barely finishing WWII every year. I would've been a lot more interested in learning about more recent events. And they wonder why most people just aren't that interested in their own history! I couldn't tell you how they taught history in high school, because I'm pretty sure I skipped it and took whatever electives they were offering instead.

[CooperTV]

I've no idea why Rufus didn't know who is Deep Throat was. Because he would at least know The X-Files' Deep Throat, and there was the "What is Watergate" moment in that introduction. Either The X-Files doesn't exist in their universe, or the writers are that stupid, because they failed him as a smart, educated character twice, as far as I'm concerned. But then again, noone knew who Verner von Braun was last episode, and that was even more dumb.

[iMonrey]

This episode was really remiss in not addressing how they changed history - or more specifically, how Flynn changed history by stealing that tape before it could be erased. Assuming he did not erase it himself and then put it back, it means Lucy, Wyatt and Rufus came back to a present where Nixon may never have been impeached! At the very least, there would be no knowledge of this tape with the missing 14 minutes, which Lucy specifically reference before they took the trip. Meaning Agent Christopher and Mason should have been like "Wait . . . why did you go back to 1972 again? Tape? What's this about a tape?"

[dubbel zout]

Nixon resigned before he could be impeached.

[Clanstarling]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

Nixon resigned before he could be impeached.

True, but tape with the missing 18 minutes (discovered in December 1973) was a significant piece of evidence leading to his resignation. Of course, the smoking gun tape (on which he discussed the break-in  and planned part of the coverup just days after it happened) was found only days before he resigned in August 1974 and was probably more critical to his decision to resign.

Still, the point remains that they haven't shown any impact to history - the missing 18 minutes was bad enough and created a lot of speculation at the time - what impact would a completely missing tape have had? Would Nixon have resigned sooner? Would the call for impeachment and subsequent proceedings have moved faster and started before the smoking gun tape was found?

It would be interesting as well if it made no impact to history - given that it was such a significant tape at the time, and also significant to Rittenhouse.

Edited November 21, 2016 by Clanstarling

[KaveDweller]

Maybe Flynn just made a copy of the tape?

They still should have addressed though.

[legaleagle53]

Interestingly enough, the missing 18 minutes was featured today on a trivia blog I frequent:  http://triviatoday.com/blog/article.asp

Edited November 22, 2016 by legaleagle53

[callie lee 29]

Catching up on past episodes. I can understand how the average 20-30 year old man (or woman) regardless of color may not know Deep Throat in 2016. I don't but that Rufus didn't know about it. Or Mark Fell. That's what seems wonky to me. 

 

Personally, I like Wyatt. I like all the characters. I also like that they went the IMO much more realistic route that betrayal and keeping secrets would naturally create division and some side-eye amongst the gang of three. Betrayal = bonding my ass. 

[Eneya]

Being smart, educated and nerdy in some areas, doesn't mean it is so in EVERY area.
Trust me, I'd know...

Sometimes I have this giant gapes in popular culture or somesuch, because at no point it mattered to me.
I knew about DeepThroat (but I first saw it on X-files, then I learned of the porn and THEN I learned of the politic-related person under the same alias)... I didn't know his name and I never cared much about Nixon. So... there. :)

[Raja]

As an old guy here whose political memories start with the 1972 election cycle and when the premier porn theatre in town on Hollywood Blvd played Deep Throat the entire decade (the Hollywood Christmas Parade always tried to get them to hide the marquee for that one night a year) with the other locations putting on other movies until the VCR killed that business I do wonder how much folks 20 years younger than me know about those two wings of recent history that collided with the cover name.

[CoyoteBlue]

My big question with this was :

WHY didn't anyone get the list of names Doc had memorized!?! Write them down, record them on tape, whatever would be fastest! 

It's also a shame they couldn't get the BLA to help fake her death so Rufus could claim his mission was complete and Rittenhouse would stop looking for Doc.

[CTrent29]

Quote

Personally, I like Wyatt. I like all the characters. I also like that they went the IMO much more realistic route that betrayal and keeping secrets would naturally create division and some side-eye amongst the gang of three. Betrayal = bonding my ass. 

 

Betrayal?  I don't have an excuse for Lucy not telling Wyatt and Rufus about her conversations with Flynn.  I don't think she really has one.  But Rufus had a damn good explanation.  Rittenhouse was not only threatening his life, but also his family's lives.  And yet, neither Lucy or Wyatt could understand that.  Instead, they had reacted with outraged anger . . . especially Wyatt.  And I found his attitude even more ridiculous, considering that it confirmed Flynn's own comments about Rittenhouse.  Instead of realizing how dangerous Rittenhouse could be, Lucy and especially Wyatt, reacted with anger and expressed no concern or sympathy about Rufus' family.  I was disgusted.