S03.E01: Light In Darkness

[PepperMonkey]

I'm not even going to lie: I was so excited for this season premiere.

I figured Rhonda would be the dead one, but I'm still sad about it.

Having said all that, these people are so morally bankrupt (I'm looking at you, Lucious, Cookie and Anika) that I'm seriously only watching for the Lyon brothers now. Even with everything going to shit around them, those three really act like they care about each other, and it's the only thing keeping my interest.

Cookie's ridiculous loyalty to Lucious is unbelievable AND highly unlikely, and if she's only doing it to hold on to the family fortune, that makes it even more abhorrent. And now to circle the wagons around Anika, of course, once again, just so Lucious is safe... well, I'm kinda hating on Cookie right now. And no one but Jamal has been to check on 'Dre? No funeral or talk of funeral or even visible mourning for Rhonda?

I will keep watching but there better be some justice on here somewhere.

[thuganomics85]

Yay, Empire is back!  Maybe it isn't the "best" show out there, but I still can't think of any show that is just so balls to the wall crazy like this one is, and I couldn't love it any more!

So, we did get an actual death and I suspected, it was Rhonda.  As much as I grew to love her, I just really doubted it would be Anika, because there is so much craziness with that character, and I can't see the show wanting to lose it.  Plus, I figured Rhonda would take Andre to an even bigger level of meltdowns and insanity, which I figured the show would go far, since Trai Byers seems to have perfected making Andre always at the edge of going off the deep end for good.  At least it seems like Rhonda might stick around in ghost form for an episode or two!  Hopefully Kaitlin Doubleday will find another gig.  Maybe she can get on Mr. Robot with her sister (really can't believe I never knew that she and Portia were related.  I see the family resemblance now!)

I swear, I really can't think of a character I love to hate more then Lucious.  Sure, there are plenty of character I flat-out hate, but I just can't help but get a kick out of him.  I mean, here is freaking threatening a woman while she's giving birth, mocking his son who is obviously suffering some kind of PTSD after freaking getting shot (and freaking Lucious was the target!), basically taking his other's son baby from him and then acting like the son is the one at fault, and, of course!  Of course, Lucious acts all shocked whenever people get mad at him!  There is just something wrong with him.  He really can't seem to fathom why his actions are wrong and why he is hated so much.  It is nuts.  And, again, whatever issues I have with Terrence Howard in real life, he is just a perfect choice for this character.

As much as I love Cookie and how Tariji P. Henson and Terrence Howard play off one another, I really do hope Cookie actually makes a full attempt at putting a wall between her and Lucious.  This has gone way beyond unhealthy now.

Tariq is proving to be a fun antagonist.  The dinner scene was tame by Lyons standards, but I loved all the sons getting ready to throw down after he went after Cookie.  Sure, shit-talking Lucious is fine, but no way were they going to stand for him insulting their mom.

Noticed Tiana's face when the new singer was performing, so maybe they'll actually give her a storyline this time.

Xzbit is going to be a huge problem for Lucious going forward.  OK, yes, I know his character's name is actually Shyne, but I'm still choosing to believe it's just a very dangerous version of Xzbit.  

Can't wait to see where this crazy train goes next!

[Landlord]

Unrelated note, when Hakeem (in the conference room, day after Rhonda died) told Cookie that she didn't have a broom to beat him with, I was genuinely waiting/maybe hoping that cookie would hurl her glass in his direction. Out of character for Cookie, maybe, but it would have shown this drunk little shit that she doesn't need a broom lol!

[darkestboy]

It was an okay opening episode. I don't care enough for either Tariq or Shyne so having them as regulars is not a good thing. Interesting to see that Freda is now a regular, even though she wasn't in this one.

Rhonda dying sucks but I expected it. Though if we can keep her in ghost form and have her haunt Anika, I'd be cool with that. I'd also be cool with Andre getting revenge on Anika too.

Bella is a nice name for a baby though Lucious should not be around that kid even if he is trying to maintain a ruse. Hakeem really does need to step up there.

Jamal's Freedom song was nice, the only musical highlight of the episode to be honest.

Cookie will never be done with Lucious though I like her trying to put a wall between the two of them. Flashbacks to the two of them when they first met were good though, 7/10

[KLovestoShop]

The only things Lucious loves are power and money.  Everything and everyone else are just gnats to brush away or a way to get more power and money.

Can't wait to see Cookie and Taye Diggs get it on.  He's so gorgeous and to see him going up against Lucious with regards to Cookie will be fantastic.  

Edited September 23, 2016 by KLovestoShop

[damnman]

I felt for Andre when they showed him grieving, poor baby I just wanted to give him a hug.

Please have Andre go full-out evil. He's been Lucious' right hand since a child, you can't tell me he didn't learn a thing or two from his dad and I think that he could/would be worse than Lucious.

Terrance is doing an amazing job with the character, as is Taraji, I can honest to god feel that chemistry between the two actors.

[Neurochick]

23 minutes ago, damnman said:

Please have Andre go full-out evil. He's been Lucious' right hand since a child, you can't tell me he didn't learn a thing or two from his dad and I think that he could/would be worse than Lucious.

That's what I'd love to see. 

I loved the two young actors playing young Cookie and Lucious.  The young man playing Lucious looks better than Terrance Howard ever did. 

[withanaich]

  20 hours ago, withanaich said:

Also, Anika lied to him and told him it was a boy (because she knows he's awful) to try to win him over to the idea of this new "heir,"

He's already got 3 boys. Did he think he could mold #4 into his idea of perfection? Selfish prick. 

That's what's so bizarre/awful/hilarious about Lucious's excitement every time he finds out one of his sons is expecting a kid, and his persistent obsession with molding one of his grandkids into an "heir." You ... already have heirs, though? And they kinda hate you? Because you suck at parenting, Lucious. Stop looking for innocent kids to mess up.

[jhlipton]

I feel sorry for Tariq -- there is no way his story is going to end well for him

On 9/22/2016 at 2:44 PM, withanaich said:

Mousy Laura was about the first love interest of his that was believable.

You mean the Laura who refused to be one of Hakeem's "thots" until he said one nice thing to her?  That believable love story?

6 hours ago, withanaich said:

Stop looking for innocent kids to mess up.

Or even semi-innocent ones like Freda!

[Landlord]

It just occurred to me. No Thirsty in this episode. I really hope it stays that way. He's crass and I strongly dislike him. Never made sense to me how Lucious was so freaking quick to have this stranger so privvy to his business (his mother, among other things). 

Other than that, I hope Grandma Lyons stabs the heck out of Anika, by "accident". NO ONE does this to my Rhonda. And it is very unfair that the b***h no one liked (Camilla) got such a send off, and the one that was actually family isn't getting anything. If next week's episode doesn't start with a funeral or at least a proper send off, I might hurl the remote at the TV.

Who am I kidding. I'll sit there in silence and keep watching.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

One Death, One Birth, And Two Empires

As Cookie and Lucious agree to split up their kingdom, Andre's doing some psychic splitting of his own.

[Dee]

I loved Lucious pointing out that everyone in his circle eats because of his dirty work & then bitches about it.

He's a reprehensible human being, but he isn't wrong.

[eXiled]

On 9/22/2016 at 2:44 PM, withanaich said:

And please stop trying to convince us that all these adult women who have their shit together are panting after Hakeem. Mousy Laura was about the first love interest of his that was believable. Please don't let them make Shine's niece "come around" and fall for Hakeem's "charm" after all.

Quoted for truth. The actor is a young cutie and all, but every time I see an attractive grown woman go out of her way to be his next Hit & Quit, I laugh out loud at the ridiculousness of it all. I didn't even mess with boys Hakeem's age when I was Hakeem's age. The show really wants us to know the kid has them real back-blowing-out skills. Meanwhile, he's not enough man to hold his child properly or even change her diaper, I'll bet. He still might as well be in diapers his damn self.

[phoenics]

I knew it would be Rhonda who bit the big one... and I'm glad.  I did grow to like Rhonda (she had great clothes, and I liked her weird relationship with Andre), but she was a paper thin character who we never really got to know on her own.  There was no story with her - other than her acting as a foil for Andre's illness or Anika's envy.  That's it.  She simply didn't exist beyond that.  That's why she works so well as a ghost tbh.

Even though Anika is horrible for pushing her down the stairs (I also thought that was way too much, but I digress), she exists as her own entity and there is far greater storyline potential with her alive vs Rhonda.  Anika's fights with Cookie were gold in S1 and S2 was harmed (I thought) by not mining their catfights more often and removing the conflict between them.  Sidelining Anika all season long and not having her and Cookie and Lucious interact really hurt the show and robbed it.  I LOVED the Cookie/Anika interactions - half of Cookie's one liners from S1 were about Boo Boo Kitty.  We lost that in S2.

My hope now is that finally we can get back to the formulas that work - and those are around characters.  Lucious - evil.  Cookie - awesome. Anika - scrappy amoral survivor.  Jamal.  Hakeem.  Andre.

Watching Trai have to strangle his wife was actually hard.

I enjoyed the premiere - mostly because it was focused on the characters and less on plot.  The only thing was - I think the show skipped past some heavy emotional beats (Rhonda's death; Anika v Andre; Hakeem getting left at the altar) - but maybe that's because there were SO many heavy emotional beats set off by the finale that the show couldn't get to them all.  The show doesn't even have to manufacture drama now - because it has so much from the S2 finale to work through.  Do that show.

Overall - much better feelings about this premiere than the one in S2.

[photo fox]

50 minutes ago, phoenics said:

Watching Trai have to strangle his wife was actually hard.

Agreed. And I thought it couldn't get weirder for the actors than last year, when TB conducted the on-screen wedding of his RL wife to his TV dad. Lol

[Syndicate]

57 minutes ago, phoenics said:

I knew it would be Rhonda who bit the big one... and I'm glad.  I did grow to like Rhonda (she had great clothes, and I liked her weird relationship with Andre), but she was a paper thin character who we never really got to know on her own.  There was no story with her - other than her acting as a foil for Andre's illness or Anika's envy.  That's it.  She simply didn't exist beyond that.  That's why she works so well as a ghost tbh.

Even though Anika is horrible for pushing her down the stairs (I also thought that was way too much, but I digress), she exists as her own entity and there is far greater storyline potential with her alive vs Rhonda.  Anika's fights with Cookie were gold in S1 and S2 was harmed (I thought) by not mining their catfights more often and removing the conflict between them.  Sidelining Anika all season long and not having her and Cookie and Lucious interact really hurt the show and robbed it.  I LOVED the Cookie/Anika interactions - half of Cookie's one liners from S1 were about Boo Boo Kitty.  We lost that in S2.

My hope now is that finally we can get back to the formulas that work - and those are around characters.  Lucious - evil.  Cookie - awesome. Anika - scrappy amoral survivor.  Jamal.  Hakeem.  Andre.

Watching Trai have to strangle his wife was actually hard.

I enjoyed the premiere - mostly because it was focused on the characters and less on plot.  The only thing was - I think the show skipped past some heavy emotional beats (Rhonda's death; Anika v Andre; Hakeem getting left at the altar) - but maybe that's because there were SO many heavy emotional beats set off by the finale that the show couldn't get to them all.  The show doesn't even have to manufacture drama now - because it has so much from the S2 finale to work through.  Do that show.

Overall - much better feelings about this premiere than the one in S2.

I'm not glad about Rhonda's fate at all. She may have been a paper thin character, but that was the fault of the writers. They've never really actually WRITTEN for this show to be honest. Just cameos, excessive music, and standalone plots. Rhonda's character could've easily been delved into more. Who are her parents and are they still alive? What type of people are they and how did they feel about their daughter's marriage to a black man? Does Rhonda have any siblings? Does she have an ex-boyfriend or ex-husband? They just didn't bother with Rhonda, plain and simple.

Edited September 24, 2016 by Syndicate

[phoenics]

1 minute ago, Syndicate said:

I'm not glad about Rhonda's fate at all. She may have been a paper thin character, but that was the fault of the writers. They've never really actually WRITTEN for this shoe the be honest. Just cameos, excessive music, and standalone plots. Rhonda's character could've easily been delved into more. Who are her parents and are they still alive? What type of people are they and how did they feel about their daughter's marriage to a black man? Does Rhonda have any siblings? Does she have an ex-boyfriend or ex-husband? They just didn't bother with Rhonda, plain and simple.

I agree it was the choice of the writers not to delve deeply into Rhonda - but I don't see this as a fault - I see it as a deliberate choice.  Cookie's comment about Rhonda in S1 was literally how the writers saw her too.  I didn't mind her character so much, but I didn't wait expectantly each week waiting for her to appear on my screen.  She was much better than Laura - but I don't miss her.  I'm happy we still have her as a ghost - she'll be just as effective that way as she was alive as she had literally zero impact on the show and its characters except Andre (kinda).

I find that none of what you mentioned about Rhonda - her life, her family, any exes, or siblings remotely interests me at all.  If I had my pick of characters to flesh out further, Rhonda wasn't even near the middle of the list.

[healthnut]

No funeral, really? Will there be one next week? No one seemed to even care. 

Ridiculous that Anika has had the baby now, 35 weeks have passed since she got pregnant yeah okay, whatever. She showed for like two episodes. And the baby went home too quick to be six weeks premature. 

Can we get a love interest for Cookie, please? Can Derek Luke move back?

[phoenics]

14 minutes ago, healthnut said:

No funeral, really? Will there be one next week? No one seemed to even care. 

Ridiculous that Anika has had the baby now, 35 weeks have passed since she got pregnant yeah okay, whatever. She showed for like two episodes. And the baby went home too quick to be six weeks premature. 

Can we get a love interest for Cookie, please? Can Derek Luke move back?

I thought about this when this happened - what if Anika's baby is actually Lucious' baby?  I was gonna count backwards six weeks from when she thought she was pregnant - would that be around the time she was still with Lucious?

ETA:  And (unfortunately) Taye Diggs is coming onboard to play Cookie's love interest.  Not that I don't want her to have one (I do), but I can't stand Taye Diggs.  One black woman hating actor on this show is more than enough.  Don't need two.

Edited September 24, 2016 by phoenics

[Syndicate]

2 hours ago, phoenics said:

I thought about this when this happened - what if Anika's baby is actually Lucious' baby?  I was gonna count backwards six weeks from when she thought she was pregnant - would that be around the time she was still with Lucious?

ETA:  And (unfortunately) Taye Diggs is coming onboard to play Cookie's love interest.  Not that I don't want her to have one (I do), but I can't stand Taye Diggs.  One black woman hating actor on this show is more than enough.  Don't need two.

[Syndicate]

2 hours ago, healthnut said:

No funeral, really? Will there be one next week? No one seemed to even care. 

Ridiculous that Anika has had the baby now, 35 weeks have passed since she got pregnant yeah okay, whatever. She showed for like two episodes. And the baby went home too quick to be six weeks premature. 

Can we get a love interest for Cookie, please? Can Derek Luke move back?

There's probably no funeral for Rhonda either. It's like I said, the writers just couldn't be bothered with Rhonda other than to now show her in ghostly form. As for the details of Anika's pregnancy, I tend to believe it's nothing more than the usual awful pacing that this show has learned to be famous for. Every single plot moves faster than it should.

[Dee]

Taraji personally requested Taye.

As she did previously with Derek (and Adam). 

Largely as a way to address viewer complaints about the show's perceived colorism issues.

[withanaich]

Quote

 

It just occurred to me. No Thirsty in this episode. I really hope it stays that way. He's crass and I strongly dislike him. Never made sense to me how Lucious was so freaking quick to have this stranger so privvy to his business (his mother, among other things). 

Other than that, I hope Grandma Lyons stabs the heck out of Anika, by "accident". NO ONE does this to my Rhonda. And it is very unfair that the b***h no one liked (Camilla) got such a send off, and the one that was actually family isn't getting anything. If next week's episode doesn't start with a funeral or at least a proper send off, I might hurl the remote at the TV.

Who am I kidding. I'll sit there in silence and keep watching.

 

Agree with all of this, except for the bit about Thirsty. He's absolutely crass, which is why I love him. (Plus, you know, Andre Royo.) He just DGAF, or treat the Lyon clan's insane goings-on with any kind of reverence. And Lucious has to trust someone with his dirty laundry, so it makes sense for it to be someone utterly amoral that he's paying to do so (rather than the "family" he treats like shit whenever he's in the mood, who have every reason to turn on him). Still, it might be funny -- and fitting -- to see Thirsty eventually betray Lucious for more money. 

[Neurochick]

On 9/24/2016 at 0:33 PM, phoenics said:

I agree it was the choice of the writers not to delve deeply into Rhonda - but I don't see this as a fault - I see it as a deliberate choice.  Cookie's comment about Rhonda in S1 was literally how the writers saw her too.  I didn't mind her character so much, but I didn't wait expectantly each week waiting for her to appear on my screen.  She was much better than Laura - but I don't miss her.  I'm happy we still have her as a ghost - she'll be just as effective that way as she was alive as she had literally zero impact on the show and its characters except Andre (kinda).

Yes, I kind of feel that way too.  I think Rhonda was interesting in the first season, but not so much the second season.  What I will miss will be her relationship with Andre, but after that...I don't think I'm going to miss her. 

[DollEyes]

Not surprisingly, the Empire Season premiere hit the ground running at 100 MPH in terms of crazy. Lucius had his Machiavellian way at his family's expense, whether it was his threatening Anika to keep quiet while she was in labor with his granddaughter Bella, his basically stealing Bella from Hakeem, her actual father-who, in fairness may not be in the best shape now to raise a child, but that doesn't mean he'll stay that way-his taunting Jamal over his PTSD post-shooting, inviting his half-brother Tariq to have dinner in an attempt to make him compromise his investigation, which he shouldn't be conducting in the first place, not because Lucius is innocent-two words that haven't belonged in the same sentence in years-but because of the while "conflict of interest" thing.

Speaking of the dinner, while the boys' defending Cookie was sweet, I think that the reason why they also defended Lucius was to protect themselves and the secrets that Tariq doesn't know more than to protect Lucius, some of which aren't legal, hence them circling the wagons, not that it'll help much, what with the bugged teddy bear. Speaking of bugs, that's apparently what Shyne, Lucius' frenemy has in his brain, given the way he attacked Hakeem's former producer in front of witnesses, not that he'll snitch because, to paraphrase the old saying, "Snitches get stitches-or worse."  Shyne's a loose cannon, to put it mildly. Shyne & Anika would be perfect together because they're both batshit crazy. Regardign Cookie, if the flashback scene with a teenaged her, Carol & Candace is any indication, Lucius has been arguably the biggest thorn in their sides. Lucius is Cookie's Achilles' heel, they both know it & despite them having kids together, reuniting with Lucius would be toxic for Cookie. 

Re Rhonda, while she wasn't my favorite character, seeing what her death has done to Andre is heartbreaking. Andre lost both the woman he loved and their child in the same year because of the same woman-who, thanks to Lucius, is his new stepmom.  As if Lucius' telling Andre that he's ashamed of him for being bipolar and his disapproval of Andre's marriage to Rhonda wasn't reason enough for Andre to hate him, Lucius' marrying and protecting Anika, who killed both Rhonda and their unborn child should be the last nail in the coffin. I hope Andre does turn bad and goes after Lucius with everything he's got.

I loved Lucius' pointing out that everyone eats because of his dirty work and then bitches about it.

He's a reprehensible human being, but he isn't wrong

 I totally disagree. Cookie and the boys have earned every bit of their success the hard way. In their own ways, Cookie, Hakeem, Jamal and Andre have sacrificed just as much or more than Lucius. As far as I'm concerned, they've succeeded despite Lucius, not because of him.