S06.E20: Hush... Hush, Sweet Liars

[WhosThatGirl]

I personally don't like Emison and not really sure they are endgame, I think out of all the couples, that one is the one that never seems to be endgame. I just think Marlene keeps throwing the couple a bone every now and then, and then the fans on tumblr lose their damn minds over every little moment. I'm pretty sure Haleb, Spoby, and Ezaria are endgame., I'm pretty sure also Hanna will be alive. I doubt Ashley wants off when there's only one season left to go. 

[SadieT]

Take this with a grain of salt because the characterizations are completely insane this season, but the last thing I remember about Liam was Aria and him being good and she sorta "picking" him (in the wedding episode if I'm not mistaken). I remember that scene you mentioned but I didn't think she was making any reference to Aria and Liam being exes. If anything, Aria seemed to react like someone who cared about how her boyfriend might feel about be take off an assignment. So, I'm pretty sure they're still together.

 

Doesn't Aria mention Liam in this episode? She tells Emily that he's hurt whenever he reads her pages about Ezra because he can tell she loves him, so yeah, Aria can go sit in the cheating circle with Hanna and Caleb. 

 

Come to think of it, why would Rollins pretend to be the ghost of Wilden? It's not like Alison is particularly fond or particularly scared of him. Also, it would have been hilarious if upon seeing these "ghosts" Alison had tried the modern solution of using her phone to take a picture of them.

 

I think Alison might actually have been afraid of Wilden. If he was in fact Beach Hottie like many people suspect, then he would have been the guy Alison goes crying to CeCe about when she thinks she might be pregnant. I think Ali even says he'll kill her if he finds out. Also when Charlotte's telling her story she says she killed Wilden to protect Alison, that he would have never let Ali come home so maybe Wilden had threatened her before?   

 

I personally don't like Emison and not really sure they are endgame, I think out of all the couples, that one is the one that never seems to be endgame. I just think Marlene keeps throwing the couple a bone every now and then, and then the fans on tumblr lose their damn minds over every little moment. I'm pretty sure Haleb, Spoby, and Ezaria are endgame., 

 

It would be kind of ridiculous to pair all the heterosexual liars back up with their high school boyfriends at the end of the series. Sure first loves last for some but certainly not the majority of people. And if they did that and didn't make Emison happen it would look like bias. The thing is, I think of all 4 ships, Emison coming back together after all this time makes the most sense to me because they never really had a shot at being together and I could understand them wanting to see what could have been if the timing is right (i.e. when Alison is no longer married to a creep). They weren't ready to be together in the past because they were never on the same track: Alison hadn't accepted who she was before her disappearance and Emily couldn't trust her feelings for Ali after her return, so they went their separate ways, but now that they've both grown into themselves and accepted their feelings, it would make sense for them to try because they might be ready to have a real relationship.    

 

But if the writers have no intention of giving Emison a real shot, they need to be upfront about it. Stop stringing along the shippers because it just riles them up even more and it's not fair.  

 

The other ships all had their shots and blew them multiple times. Why show them breaking up for completely valid and realistic reasons just to throw them back together to appease fans? Those relationships may have worked in past but the character grew apart from each other and that should be okay but of course it's not. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Why does anyone want to harass these four girl if some shadowy Carissimi group has been behind this scheme to get Ali's money the whole time

The Carissimi Group isn't after Ali's money. Charlotte set up the Carissimi Group as a front for her holdings (she had piles of money thanks to her financial wizardry and she needed a legit way to use it without revealing she was the one spending the money). She had the Carissimi Group buy the Radley Sanitarium after the PLLs escaped the dollhouse, which is something she couldn't have done in her own name without arousing suspicion.

 

Jason has been working at the Carissimi Group. Ali mentioned this in 6x16, but she didn't say how long he had been working there so I'm not sure if he only started after Charlotte died or if he started working there at some point during the five year jump.

 

Ali owns 51% of the Carissimi Group. Again, not sure if Charlotte left this to Ali in her will or if she gave her majority ownership in the company during the five years she was locked up and getting therapy, but either way it's because Charlotte GAVE it to her.

 

Elliot and Mary's scheme was for Elliot to marry Alison and then have her committed so that they would have control of Ali's 51% of the Carissimi Group. The stupid thing is their logic in taking over the Carissimi Group is "this is what Charlotte would have wanted," but Charlotte is the one who gave Ali control of the company in the first place so what Charlotte actually wanted was for Alison to own the company.

 

I'm curious as to whether Jason owns the other 49% or if there are other shareholders. Heh, can you imagine Charlotte telling her sibling/cousins/ex-boyfriend who she never had sex with "I want you two to have my company. But I'm going to give Ali enough to always overrule you, Jason"? I mean, honestly, I can see Jason saying that he doesn't want to own the company but that he would be happy to work there to keep an eye on things for Charlotte.

 

Since the writers are so stuck on redeeming Charlotte, I think this is going to boil down to some good twin/bad twin rivalry thing between Jessica and Mary with Mary being Uber A and Charlotte's A being a pawn.

ITA - the writers want to redeem Charlotte and they have clearly been panting to do a twin reveal since the beginning (remember that creepy twin story in one of the Halloween episodes?) so I totally expect them to do some kind of good twin/bad twin thing with Jessica/Mary that will somehow turn Charlotte into the innocent manipulated victim who just happened to stalk and torture her sister/cousin and her friends.

 

Is Aria actually still with Liam? When her boss visited her in the previous episode she made some comment about Liam being an ex and that's why Aria should bypass him and send pages directly to the boss. I don't remember it happening onscreen, but I thought maybe I missed something and they had split up.

They didn't split up. Her editor said she was taking Liam off the Ezra/Aria book project because it wouldn't be appropriate, which is when Aria realized that her boss had known all along that she and Liam were dating. If I recall correctly, her boss was just telling her that even though they never told her they were dating, she was aware of it and that's why she was taking Liam out of the loop on this book. She didn't want Liam's personal feelings for Aria interfering with the book in any way.

[Jack Shaftoe]

Come to think of it, the writers could have easily given Mary and Elliot an actual motive to harm the Liars. All they had to do was have the Liars file a civil suit against Charlotte and get millions in damages.

 

 

I think Alison might actually have been afraid of Wilden.

 

It's possible but adding "Wilden's ghost" to the plan to gaslight Alison seems so needlessly complicated and risky, even with the miraculously realistic masks that seem to be all the rage in Rosewood. Her mother looking like a literal zombie should have been scary enough, IMO.

 

 

She didn't want Liam's personal feelings for Aria interfering with the book in any way.

 

I bet Marlene thought that was exquisitely ironic and subtle. When Aria talked to Emily about her writing process all I could think of was "Have you and Ezra heard of the concept of fiction? Of putting yourselves into the characters shoes? This is not an autobiography, it's (supposedly) a fiction novel. You don't have to actually be Nicole to write from her point of view, you idiot."

 

Something else I have realised - they haven't introduced a really compelling new character since season 3A. If you think Charlotte fits the bill, that is, if not, you can say since season 2 or even season 1. The vast majority of new characters are obvious red herrings and/or obviously temporary love interests with no depth whatsoever. Five years time-jump and yet the protagonists seem to have no new friends whatsoever.

 

In other news, the ratings for 6.20 are horrible - 1.19 million, 0.6 adults 18-49, by far worse than of any other mid-season or season finale. Seems like more and more people have had enough of this trainwreck.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Jack Shaftoe

[insubordination]

 

Shower Harvey's driver must be A.D

Actually, my initials are AD. Perhaps I will turn out to be A? I bet they never told the actress who played CeCe that she was going to be. Kinda undermines her earlier acting choices. They are lucky the actress tried to take it seriously in the reveal.

 

I'm glad this finale has tanked in the ratings. They really f***ed up big time - twice. 

[Mabinogia]

The show can have flashbacks of Charlotte rescuing puppies from a burning building and I'm still not going to buy that she wasn't an evil, manipulative, homicidal stalker who ruined the lives of four innocent girls out of some deluded jealousy and fun. Sorry show. Too late. I am going to believe that Charlotte gave Ali 51% of the company with the plan of her ex marrying Ali, getting her committed and taking over with the help of her bio-mom. Bitch was insane. You can't cure the level of crazy she was in five years.

I am glad Jason didn't get the lions share so he is, hopefully, out of this mess now. Run Jason, run!

[mac123x]

It's possible but adding "Wilden's ghost" to the plan to gaslight Alison seems so needlessly complicated and risky, even with the miraculously realistic masks that seem to be all the rage in Rosewood. Her mother looking like a literal zombie should have been scary enough, IMO.

 

Another good choice would have been Ian.  You know, the guy she actually pushed off the bell tower. The same bell tower that Charlotte was flung from.  Nice thematic connection there.  I'm guessing they picked Wilden due to actor availability.  We're lucky it wasn't Garrett or Shana or someone even less connected to Ali like Maya.

 

I guess what really bugs me is how abruptly this plot was introduced.  "Ali is seeing things" just started last episode, and already they've driven her to the sanitarium.  I would have expected a slower build, starting with Ali catching glimpses of Mary/Jessica in a crowd, etc.  First she'd be dismissive, then maybe have the conversation with Emily about seeing her mother and Em's "I dreamt of my dad after he died".  Spread this crap out over the course of 6-8 episodes instead of cram it in at the end. 

Edited March 17, 2016 by mac123x

[abbottrabbit]

And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Elliot is Wren. They probably couldn't get the Wren actor for this season so either he is wearing an Elliot Mask right now becuase it makes as much sense as a Wilden mask really, OR, Elliot was wearing a Wren mask back when he was busy seducing the Hastings sisters and Hanna, and probably Ally but not Emily because she likes girls and not Aria because she has no taste in men at all...I mean, she has been lulled into a hypnotic stupor by Ezra's total lack of personality. I wouldn't blame Elliot for wearing a Wren mask. Or hey, lets make all the guys in Rosewood really the same guy in lifelike masks, or an army of Droids that the Cassimi group plan on selling to the government to go to enemy countries, seduce all the teenage girls thereby preventing the enemy men from procreating and making more enemies. Yeah, makes about as much sense as what I just watched. I think this show broke my brain.

 

I would watch the shit out of this show -- an army of bland white boy robots has magnificent potential for social commentary. 

 

 I'm pretty sure also Hanna will be alive. I doubt Ashley wants off when there's only one season left to go. 

 

I wouldn't be surprised, though, if everyone else thinks Hanna's dead for awhile to allow AB the opportunity to film other projects. She seems to have more on the boil than the rest of them (which irritates but doesn't surprise me). 

 

Another good choice would have been Ian.  You know, the guy she actually pushed off the bell tower. The same bell tower that Charlotte was flung from.  Nice thematic connection there.  I'm guessing they picked Wilden due to actor availability.  We're lucky it wasn't Garrett or Shana or someone even less connected to Ali like Maya.

 

 

Did we ever find out who killed Maya, by the way? I'd forgotten about her until I saw her in a listicle about dead lesbian TV characters recently. 

[Jenniferbug]

That was so predictable, and yet still managed to insult my intelligence.

I think everyone called Mrs D having a twin a long time ago. There was even a lot of speculation about Cece being their cousin back when she first appeared (before we knew her as Charles/Charlotte). I don't think anyone believed that Elliott was in love with Ali and not a creeper. It would have been more surprising if he had turned out to be genuine. And what is with the sudden British accent? For a second I was like "did they recast Wren?"

I don't understand why Ali is suddenly committing herself to an institution. Didn't she think her pain meds were causing her to see things? Did she stop taking them and continue hallucinating? Why not try therapy first? That was so ridiculous.

I feel like all this season has done is cause me to actively dislike characters. I used to love Hanna and Caleb (both together and separately) and that was ruined a long time before this episode. Inserting Spencer into a love triangle with them made what little liking I had left for her evaporate (she started bugging me before this season). Aria has always sucked, and I'm pretty indifferent to Emily (who seemed sidelined most of this season).

I mean, what exactly is supposed to bring me back for next season? I think I'm out.

[SadieT]

I guess what really bugs me is how abruptly this plot was introduced.  "Ali is seeing things" just started last episode, and already they've driven her to the sanitarium.  I would have expected a slower build, starting with Ali catching glimpses of Mary/Jessica in a crowd, etc.  First she'd be dismissive, then maybe have the conversation with Emily about seeing her mother and Em's "I dreamt of my dad after he died".  Spread this crap out over the course of 6-8 episodes instead of cram it in at the end. 

 

I agree. Her decent into induced madness was much too quick. I'm guessing they didn't want to play their Mrs. D card too early not to spoil the surprise so they couldn't have Ali seeing her any earlier without people calling her as the twin, but if Rollins and Mary's plan had been a long con to have him marry her and then trick her into insanity, we should have saw hints of that earlier. 

 

Anyone else think the WIlden mask reveal opens a can of worms for the show? If people in Rosewood have access to such realistic masks then who's to say any of the characters are actually who they appear to be? Literally anyone can now peel off their face and reveal they're actually someone else if the writers want to go for shock value. First they went back on flashbacks being absolute truths and said they could just be from a person's perspective, and if that person is lying then the entire flashback could turn out to have never happened, and now characters can wear other people's faces, so no reveal or truth we see on screen is sacred. Everything can be changed to fit the story or to shock the audience.  

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Did we ever find out who killed Maya, by the way? I'd forgotten about her until I saw her in a listicle about dead lesbian TV characters recently.

Fake cousin Nate killed Maya!

I couldn't remember who killed her either so I had to check online. That's the problem with so much Spencering and red herrings on this show!

[Peanut6711]

Yvonne annoyed me in this episode with her contrived jump to the conclusion that Toby must be helping Spencer. Also, it isn't like she is the daughter of a presidential candidate. Nobody would care if her boyfriend failed to show up for the stupid election party, she can live without Toby for an hour or two, I'm sure.

Yvonne did act like a spoiled brat in that scene. I can understand her being disappointed that he wasn't going to be there and frankly Toby would have been better off to simply tell her he had police work to do, which wouldn't be a total lie.  While most of the couples behaved badly this episode I actually didn't think Toby did anything wrong. He knows the 'A' story and the danger involved, and he seemed to be helping out for old times sake rather than Hanna who clearly had other motive with this plan. 

[Peanut6711]

I bet Marlene thought that was exquisitely ironic and subtle. When Aria talked to Emily about her writing process all I could think of was "Have you and Ezra heard of the concept of fiction? Of putting yourselves into the characters shoes? This is not an autobiography, it's (supposedly) a fiction novel. You don't have to actually be Nicole to write from her point of view, you idiot."

Their whole book is such a joke. I used to work in publishing marketing, and the fiction market is flooded with new releases at any given time. Their book would be a dime a dozen. Aria and Ezra are acting like they will be big stars. Not likely.  

[abbottrabbit]

 And what is with the sudden British accent? For a second I was like "did they recast Wren?"

 

 

Well, the (terrible) actor playing creepy Elliot is actually British, apparently (and apparently married to Jeanne Shaheen's daughter?  The things you learn when you think "this guy is AWFUL. Where did they find him?" and hit google). So however they explain making him British in the show, at least it'll allow him to use his natural voice and MAYBE he'll be less stilted and weird as a result. 

 

Fake cousin Nate killed Maya!

I couldn't remember who killed her either so I had to check online. That's the problem with so much Spencering and red herrings on this show!

 

THANK YOU -- I couldn't remember how it was tied into the whole Ali / A situation, but apparently that's because it wasn't. (

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Didn't A give Emily clues about Maya's website? I think that was when Mona was still A? And I think A also helped Emily find Maya when she was hiding at Noel Kahn's place? But the only real Ali/Maya link was that Maya moved into Ali's house. As far as I remember, Maya never met Ali or Charlotte so she just happened to get murdered but it was unrelated to all the A stuff that was going on.

But yeah, it's hard to keep all the liars' theories vs who actually did what straight.

[jjjmoss]

 

It would be kind of ridiculous to pair all the heterosexual liars back up with their high school boyfriends at the end of the series. Sure first loves last for some but certainly not the majority of people. The other ships all had their shots and blew them multiple times. Why show them breaking up for completely valid and realistic reasons just to throw them back together to appease fans? Those relationships may have worked in past but the character grew apart from each other and that should be okay but of course it's not.

See Gossip Girl. Still fuming about Blair+Dan ending for contrived BS reasons. 

I mean, Dawson's Creek was able to change the S1-dictated ending because of organic storytelling.

[WhosThatGirl]

See Gossip Girl. Still fuming about Blair+Dan ending for contrived BS reasons. 

I mean, Dawson's Creek was able to change the S1-dictated ending because of organic storytelling.

This. Gossip Girl really made me mad with that one. I look back and am just angry they even went there if at the end of the day they were just going to put all the original couples back together.  But at this point with TV, i sort of expect this trope. The one thing I can see while Buffy did sort of give Angel a "maybe, down the line, cookie dough, blah, blah" speech implying that there is still a future for them-probably only because hardcore BTVS people needed a Angel/Buffy scene shout out- at least she got to end up on her own. I would have been mad if she ended up with any of her love interest. 

 

I think Mona was still A when she gave the clues for Maya's website page but Cece was BIG A at that time, because Mona was in Radley. Honestly, no god damn idea on the timeline. All I know is that first half of the season was pretty awful as who killed Maya was our big storyline for the first half and then it was a random. 

Edited March 17, 2016 by WhosThatGirl

[Peanut6711]

Didn't A give Emily clues about Maya's website? I think that was when Mona was still A? And I think A also helped Emily find Maya when she was hiding at Noel Kahn's place? But the only real Ali/Maya link was that Maya moved into Ali's house. As far as I remember, Maya never met Ali or Charlotte so she just happened to get murdered but it was unrelated to all the A stuff that was going on.

But yeah, it's hard to keep all the liars' theories vs who actually did what straight.

I miss the creepy fun and puzzles of crAzy Mona that did actually turn out to mean something. "Where were we? Where were we?" www.....

[Jack Shaftoe]

 

Another good choice would have been Ian.  You know, the guy she actually pushed off the bell tower. The same bell tower that Charlotte was flung from.  Nice thematic connection there.

 

That would have been much better, of course, but it would have been such a waste of Ryan Merriman's talents.

 

 

I'm guessing they didn't want to play their Mrs. D card too early not to spoil the surprise so they couldn't have Ali seeing her any earlier without people calling her as the twin, but if Rollins and Mary's plan had been a long con to have him marry her and then trick her into insanity, we should have saw hints of that earlier.

 

Rollins also didn't want to make his relationship with Alison public knowledge... only to change his tune in the very next episode for no apparent reason. What kind of moronic evil mastermind comes up with a plan hinging on the willingness of a 23-year old woman to marry the blandest guy this side of Ezra Fitz? This isn't a Victorian novel, people don't usually marry without going on a single date. Plus, even in rosewood it should be not that easy to commit somebody to an institution, especially with all of her friends and family members having many reason not to trust these institutions one bid and with so much money at stake.

 

 

While most of the couples behaved badly this episode I actually didn't think Toby did anything wrong. He knows the 'A' story and the danger involved, and he seemed to be helping out for old times sake rather than Hanna who clearly had other motive with this plan.

 

Yes, Toby usually annoys me post-season 3A but he was fine in this episode, especially compared to Ezra and Caleb.

[itainttippithebird]

 

Didn't A give Emily clues about Maya's website? I think that was when Mona was still A?

 

Yeah, it was Mona, but it was after her reveal as 1st A and when she was in Radley. I think we don't really know if Mona was A team when she was in Radley, but she was conveying the whole sitch to Charlotte. I would guess that this was just Mona being Mona, not Mona being an instrument of Charlotte, if I had to. God only knows why Mona (or Charlotte) would want to help solve Maya's murder - maybe they did it for the reveal that Maya had been staying in Noel's murder cabin, either for throwing suspicion off Mona/Charlotte or for the pure fun of being an argent of chaos!

 

Like Peanut6711, I so dearly miss the days of "Miss Aria, You're A Killer, Not Ezra's Wife"! Thinking about it in the context of the past season makes me even sadder about the show's rapid demise.

Edited March 17, 2016 by itainttippithebird

[WhosThatGirl]

Yeah, it was Mona, but it was after her reveal as 1st A and when she was in Radley. I think we don't really know if Mona was A team when she was in Radley, but she was conveying the whole sitch to Charlotte. I would guess that this was just Mona being Mona, not Mona being an instrument of Charlotte, if I had to. God only knows why Mona (or Charlotte) would want to help solve Maya's murder - maybe they did it for the reveal that Maya had been staying in Noel's murder cabin, either for throwing suspicion off Mona/Charlotte or for the pure fun of being an argent of chaos!

 

Like Peanut6711, I so dearly miss the days of "Miss Aria, You're A Killer, Not Ezra's Wife"! Thinking about it in the context of the past season makes me even sadder about the show's rapid demise.

The plan got all messed up. Cece by proxy Mona wanted Paige to be framed for the murder of Maya..for reasons. Mona was going to have Paige get caught with Maya's phone, but then Nate attacking Paige and the lakehouse situation screwed that up. I don't know why they wanted Paige to take the fall. But that was at the end with the Toby is an A team member reveal hoodie scene. 

[itainttippithebird]

Wow, I practically have a PhD in Liars Studies, how does this not ring a bell at all?! All I remember is A (or someone) calling Emily to say "Thanks, I owe you one" (for...killing Nate? Freeing Garrett?)

 

[ETA: I just went back and watched and yeah, how did I forget that?! I must have been so excited about the Toby reveal that I lost that thread.]

Edited March 17, 2016 by itainttippithebird

[WhosThatGirl]

I remember that too. But when walking back to Radley Mona tells Toby something like, "even the best plans go wrong.. " and then telling Toby to get that phone back and then explaining what would have happened if the liars had found Paige with Maya's phone. The only thing I can think is that Cece wanted Paige punished for hurting Ali? Because Ali was her sister! That was her reason for hurting the liars for years. It also explains how the earrings got into Paige's bag. 

[cuddlingcrowley]

I feel like all this season has done is cause me to actively dislike characters.

 

 

Same. I think this might be the first hiatus I won't miss the show thanks to MK doing such good job of wanning us off it.

 

I guess what really bugs me is how abruptly this plot was introduced.  "Ali is seeing things" just started last episode, and already they've driven her to the sanitarium.  I would have expected a slower build, starting with Ali catching glimpses of Mary/Jessica in a crowd, etc.  First she'd be dismissive, then maybe have the conversation with Emily about seeing her mother and Em's "I dreamt of my dad after he died".  Spread this crap out over the course of 6-8 episodes instead of cram it in at the end.

 

 

 

 

Everything feels incredibly abrupt and somehow dragged out at the same time. There's no build up to anything. The characters make no sense, the plot makes no sense, imo. Did they change the entire writing team? MK clearly hasn't set foot in the writers' room since the hiatus. It just feels like an entirely different show.

 

 

And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Elliot is Wren. They probably couldn't get the Wren actor for this season so either he is wearing an Elliot Mask right now becuase it makes as much sense as a Wilden mask really, OR, Elliot was wearing a Wren mask back

 

 

When Elliot (that's his name!) started talking with an english accent that's what I honest to God thought -- that it was Wren wearing an Elliot mask. That's what this show has done to me. And I'm pretty sure you just called where the storyline is going.

Edited March 17, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[mac123x]

What should have been:  Elliot (disguised with his super elaborate mask as Wilden) drapes his arm over the sleeping Alison.  Ali grabs the stun-gun from under her pillow and zaps him. 

 

You know old-school before season 5 Ali would have done that.

 

When she checked in to the new mental hospital, wouldn't the first thing they do is get a medical history?  "Oh, you fell down the stairs and had a concussion less than 72 hours ago... we'd better get you an MRI / CAT scan to look for brain trauma.  You might have a blood clot and this isn't psychological at all."  I guess they just rolled the incompetent staff from Radley over to this new joint.

[RachelKM]

 

Another good choice would have been Ian.  You know, the guy she actually pushed off the bell tower. The same bell tower that Charlotte was flung from.  Nice thematic connection there.

This reminds me, did anyone else think it was bizarre that  both Ali in choosing a "safe place" and Emily deducing "where she'd feel safe"  settled on Our Lady of Perpetual Murder as a reasonable hide out location?  The Fuck?  I wouldn't set foot in Iglesia de la Muerte alone. 

 

Everyone has pretty much said what I was thinking about the Quadrangle of Shipper Bullshit and the cheat-a-thon. All I can add is that I cracked up when I suddenly realized that Ezzria were screwing and I was literally clipping my toenails... Also, I need to get my ass in a chair for a pedicure.  

[itainttippithebird]

 

The only thing I can think is that Cece wanted Paige punished for hurting Ali? Because Ali was her sister!

 

Well that and/or she wanted Garrett out for some reason, but I can't remember why she might want that, so picking on Pigskin does make more sense as motivation...

 

Our Lady of Perpetual Murder!!!!! Amazing.

[Mabinogia]

Our Lady of Perpetual Murder

 

That has got to be the name of the church. Seriously brilliant.

[superman1204]

Everything feels incredibly abrupt and somehow dragged out at the same time. There's no build up to anything. The characters make no sense, the plot makes no sense, imo. Did they change the entire writing team? MK clearly hasn't set foot in the writers' room since the hiatus. It just feels like an entirely different show.

This.  If I had to guess the show feels that way because the writers are so heavy handed with everything.  The first time some plot thread or idea is presented, its immediately obvious where the writers are going with it.  So the first time we see something, it came out of nowhere, every time after that the plot thread or idea feels old and dragged out.  Basically the writes do not trust us to follow something that is remotely subtle, so they beat us over the head with the same idea over and over again.  Which is weird when you think about all of the fan theories and fanfiction out there; the fans clearly think about this show way to much.

[cuddlingcrowley]

Which is weird when you think about all of the fan theories and fanfiction out there; the fans clearly think about this show way to much.

 

 

I think that's exactly what they're trying to avoid: the fans putting more thought on the storylines than they do, like it happened last time. Well, congratulations to them, then, because they've succeeded with me. I personally don't have a clue what's going on and I couldn't care less about trying to figure it out. My brain is permanently on "off" during this show.

Edited March 18, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[Black Knight]

I think one of the many problems is that PLL wants to have its twists, but most of its twists are generally obvious, and the writers realize this to enough degree that they try to get around it somewhat by rushing the twist. Rollins is a perfect example - it wasn't hard to guess that he would turn out to be evil. So we hardly saw him all of S6b, until Ali suddenly married him at the end of an episode. The next episode with them was the start of his gaslighting her, and again, it wasn't hard to guess that he was messing with her mind, so in the very next episode (this one) we have more gaslighting and the reveal that he was the one gaslighting her (along with her aunt). Basically, they rushed the story in order to stay ahead of the audience's guesses. But first, it didn't work, and more importantly, since we hardly saw him, we had no investment in him or in his relationship with Ali, so the reveal would've had zero impact even if the rush to keep us from guessing the truth had worked.

 

It really would've been much more effective if they had just accepted that viewers were going to guess almost immediately that Rollins is evil, and instead of trying to surprise us, instead let us watch what he was doing to Ali from his POV. Then we could've had a reasonably-paced gaslighting story carried out over the half-season. It probably would've been quite gripping, because Sasha can act, and by the time Ali had herself committed, it would've been understandable both how she had gotten to that desperate point and why Emily let her go through with it (having become convinced herself that there is really something seriously wrong with Ali).

[cuddlingcrowley]

It really would've been much more effective if they had just accepted that viewers were going to guess almost immediately that Rollins is evil, and instead of trying to surprise us, instead let us watch what he was doing to Ali from his POV. Then we could've had a reasonably-paced gaslighting story carried out over the half-season.

 

 

Exactly! MK used to be so good at hitting the right notes, not matter how ridiculous the storyline. But now it seems the response to the 6-A finale has really done a number on her. For one, she seems to have a really hard time wrapping her mind around the concept that a storyline can be engaging without shocking. But also, if she/they clearly doubt their ability to shock us, given the rushing thing you mentioned, then what's the point of telling this shitty story in a half-assed sort of way? Besides, milking this show dry for as long as they can, that is.

 

I just can't shake the impression PLL has become a side-project for MK, and at the same time she's still trying to prove something to us. Like, "I don't care anymore. You hated my work in the past, well watch how well you like it when I don't even try to deliver a good show anymore (but at the same time I still want you to love me and worship me)".

Edited March 18, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[fitzcarraldo]

I honestly think they think pll viewers are the whiney 'shippers on twitter and Facebook who thought Andrew really was A that brief herring fishing trip.

[Mabinogia]

It really would've been much more effective if they had just accepted that viewers were going to guess almost immediately that Rollins is evil, and instead of trying to surprise us, instead let us watch what he was doing to Ali from his POV. Then we could've had a reasonably-paced gaslighting story carried out over the half-season. It probably would've been quite gripping, because Sasha can act, and by the time Ali had herself committed, it would've been understandable both how she had gotten to that desperate point and why Emily let her go through with it (having become convinced herself that there is really something seriously wrong with Ali).

 

That would have been fascinating and Sasha would have acted the hell out of it. That girl is good when they let her be. And it might have undone a lot of the damage they did to Ali. We might have actually started caring about her again or at least being interested in her storyline and feeling sorry for her, despite her often being quite terrible, because she is so desperate for love and a family that she is willing to marry this guy who is basically mindfucking her senseless.

 

Done well it could have been compelling television and just the shot in the arm this show desperately needs right now. Of course this show would manage to fuck it all up so I guess it's better they rushed through it before we could become invested at all. Can you imagine how intense that scene at the top of the stairs could have been if we were all on the same page, knowing this guy was going to push her down, waiting for it to happen? That is suspense. Yes, we, the audience, are in on it, but we still wait with baited breath to see it happen. It doesn't all need to be WTF shocking moments that come out of nowhere. Alfred Hitchcock isn't a legend for nothing. He knew how to properly build suspense without relying on shock value all the time.

 

I always wanted this show to be more like that, suspenseful and less...what it is, whatever that is.

[SadieT]

I think one of the many problems is that PLL wants to have its twists, but most of its twists are generally obvious, and the writers realize this to enough degree that they try to get around it somewhat by rushing the twist. Rollins is a perfect example - it wasn't hard to guess that he would turn out to be evil. So we hardly saw him all of S6b, until Ali suddenly married him at the end of an episode. The next episode with them was the start of his gaslighting her, and again, it wasn't hard to guess that he was messing with her mind, so in the very next episode (this one) we have more gaslighting and the reveal that he was the one gaslighting her (along with her aunt). Basically, they rushed the story in order to stay ahead of the audience's guesses. But first, it didn't work, and more importantly, since we hardly saw him, we had no investment in him or in his relationship with Ali, so the reveal would've had zero impact even if the rush to keep us from guessing the truth had worked.

 

It really would've been much more effective if they had just accepted that viewers were going to guess almost immediately that Rollins is evil, and instead of trying to surprise us, instead let us watch what he was doing to Ali from his POV. Then we could've had a reasonably-paced gaslighting story carried out over the half-season. It probably would've been quite gripping, because Sasha can act, and by the time Ali had herself committed, it would've been understandable both how she had gotten to that desperate point and why Emily let her go through with it (having become convinced herself that there is really something seriously wrong with Ali).

 

That would have been so much better. Rollins turning out to be evil wasn't shocking at all, just about everyone called it from the second he appeared on screen and a lot of people were even actively wishing for it, so there was no reason to play it close to the vest. Like you said, it could have been revealed early on and then we'd get to see him playing with Alison's head while she and the other liars had no idea. Instead of wasting time pretending Alison and Elliott were really in love and fooling absolutely no one, they could have touched on all the emotional issues Alison has that made her so eager to jump into marriage with a stranger. Then we could have seen her losing it gradually instead of all of a sudden. And for their big shocking finale moment, they would still have the Mary Drake reveal and we would see he was working with her all along. 

[DigitalCount]

Unfortunately I don't think there was any way to make Mary Drake work. If the culprit is introduced in the same episode as the reveal, then that's a huge problem. There's no way to make "Is it A, B or C? The answer is...D!" compelling television. It's never satisfying to learn that not only is your guess wrong, but that there was no real opportunity to guess right. I say this having believed that Jessica had a twin, but there was no sign that Charlotte was really Mary's daughter.

Edited March 18, 2016 by DigitalCount

[cuddlingcrowley]

DigitalCount, I agree. So, at this point I would settle for the writers to attempt to produce something remotely enjoyable to watch. I don't need it to be quality writing because I find the very core concept of the current storyline flawed, so that would be impossible at this point. I just need not watch something that's no so obviously terribly writen.

 

The worst thing is what others have mentioned: there's such obvious potential being wasted. The show could be so great with some simple tweaks: trash the couples' drama or at least reduce its screen time; focus on the girls' friendship, how they've dealt/are still dealing with their PTSD and the various shady characters of their past. KILL A-moji/Shower/Secret Twins/Scooby doo masks and respect this show is now supposedly adult-size so you have every excuse to actually take the plunge from teen show to proper drama/horror/suspense show. Hell, season 2 looks more adult than whatever it is we're getting. Some of us are old, Marlene!! Some of us started this thing not belonging to your target demographic as it was and 6 years later your trolling just isn't funny anymore! Stop writing for the twitter fandom!

Edited March 18, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[Black Knight]

For one, she seems to have a really hard time wrapping her mind around the concept that a storyline can be engaging without shocking.

Your sentence, right there, perfectly encapsulates it.

 

She's just chasing after Twitter OMG!s instead of telling a story. And like others who have done the same thing, she's forgotten that ultimately it's the stories that give the shocks any power they have. Like I said, even if we had not immediately guessed that Rollins was evil, it wouldn't have mattered because we barely knew him and it's not interesting to have the reveal be someone we hardly know. I know the show ended up backpedaling on Toby and EzrA, but the original reveals worked better because we knew those guys, we'd seen a lot of them over several years first. We knew how devastating it was going to be for Spencer and Aria to learn the truth. If MK was hoping to get the same reaction to Rollins, well, that was never going to work because she passported his entire relationship with Ali and then crammed their marriage and gaslighting into two episodes. As for Ali, since they told rather than showed me her relationship with him, even though intellectually I know she'll be devastated like Spencer and Aria were, I don't really feel it or care - and that's coming from someone who likes Ali and doesn't want to see her hurt. My main reaction was a vague wondering if they plan to finally do Emison in S7 - and that's only a vague wondering because they've barely had Emily and Ali interact all season, and so my interest in Emison has cooled off. Which once again underlines the problem, I can't be interested in characters or relationships they haven't devoted some screentime to establishing. (I could probably be wooed back to Emison, but the show would need to do a slow burn and actually work on the relationship, not just throw them together.)

 

Can you imagine how intense that scene at the top of the stairs could have been if we were all on the same page, knowing this guy was going to push her down, waiting for it to happen? That is suspense. Yes, we, the audience, are in on it, but we still wait with baited breath to see it happen. It doesn't all need to be WTF shocking moments that come out of nowhere. Alfred Hitchcock isn't a legend for nothing. He knew how to properly build suspense without relying on shock value all the time.

 

I always wanted this show to be more like that, suspenseful and less...what it is, whatever that is.

 

Well, it's probably too late now, but MK could stand to watch Bates Motel and take some notes. That's a show where viewers are fully aware going in that this boy is going to become the Norman Bates of Psycho. The show is one big Greek tragedy and it knows how to wring plenty of suspense from that. It is not surprising when Norman kills but it is suspenseful as hell.

[dohe]

I personally don't like Emison and not really sure they are endgame, I think out of all the couples, that one is the one that never seems to be endgame. I just think Marlene keeps throwing the couple a bone every now and then, and then the fans on tumblr lose their damn minds over every little moment. I'm pretty sure Haleb, Spoby, and Ezaria are endgame., I'm pretty sure also Hanna will be alive. I doubt Ashley wants off when there's only one season left to go. 

At this point, I don't think it should matter if people like or don't like Emison.  Even those who dislike Emison should be mocking what has occurred with Emily.  The double standard is jarring.  We have seen 3 liars with love interests through out this half of the season who are now possibly heading back to former love interests.  We have seen Allison with a guy through out the season.  Then there is the lesbian character who has no love interest through out this half of the season after already having her storylines presented with a double standard through out the program's duration.  When the lesbian is not in a romance while the other women are torn between multiple male love interests, it takes an astonishing level of straight privilege not to see anything wrong.  

 

Edited March 18, 2016 by dohe

[kissedbyarose]

I read all of these great and thoughtful posts and once again came to the conclusion that any one of us put way more thought into this "story/plot" than the actual writers did.

If I watch season 7 (and I probably will), I'll have no one to blame but myself. The writers have shown us time and time again that they clearly don't follow their own show so I'm fully prepared to hate the series finale and ignore the last couple of seasons once this is all over...just like I did with Gossip Girl.

What? You're telling me Gossip Girl had more than 2 (maybe three) seasons? Sorry! Can't hear you!

ETA: Season 7 is the last, right?!

Edited March 18, 2016 by kissedbyarose

[ElectricBoogaloo]

If we find out in the series finale that Lucas is Gossip Girl, I will stab a bitch.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I just realized that Nicole is Aurora on The Originals!

[Jack Shaftoe]

At this point, I don't think it should matter if people like or don't like Emison.  Even those who dislike Emison should be mocking what has occurred with Emily.  The double standard is jarring.  We have seen 3 liars with love interests through out this half of the season who are now possibly heading back to former love interests.  We have seen Allison with a guy through out the season.  Then there is the lesbian character who has no love interest through out this half of the season after already having her storylines presented with a double standard through out the program's duration.  When the lesbian is not in a romance while the other women are torn between multiple male love interests, it takes an astonishing level of straight privilege not to see anything wrong.  

 

Of course there is a double standard. The question is whether this is not actually for the better in this particular case, considering the utter ineptitude shown in the portrayal of all romantic relationships for at least two seasons now. Personally, I'd rather watch no romance than crappy romance, regardless if it's a heterosexual relationship or not. If the writers want to make Aria, Spencer and Hanna stay single for a while too, I would be all for it. If they decide to pull their heads out of their asses and portray an interesting relationship involving Emily, I am sure I will ship it as I did Emily/Paige but as it is Emily being single is preferable. To summarise, I really don't like the fact they writers are applying a double standard but ironically the results of that are not that bad because the way the pander to shippers makes me say "no, thanks, I'd rather you not pander to me". If Paige hadn't left, they would have made me dislike her too, the way they have managed to turn me against Hanna and Caleb.

[Lii]

This show has gotten so incoherent that I can't even parody it any more. Seriously, this shit is way more arbitrary, random and SF-esque than any Mona Is Skynet bullshit I can come up with.

 

The only thing that can save this show is making Tanner a space pirate and Mona her occasionally trusty AI sidekick. God I would watch the SHIT out of that. Emily can come too. It would be like Lexx, only with an even smaller budget.

[insubordination]

 

Anyone else think the WIlden mask reveal opens a can of worms for the show? If people in Rosewood have access to such realistic masks then who's to say any of the characters are actually who they appear to be?

 

They can swap genders too, and bring back characters from the dead. All to stimulate viewers trying to unravel the mystery!  In the good ol' 80s, they never had masks.  An old character would make a comeback with the aid of plastic surgery (which could also change height and weight).  But PLLs is going even more retro with their nod to Scooby Doo, Where are you? Wasn't Spencer eating scooby snacks a while back too?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

And then when Ezra is finally revealed as the Ultimate A, he will say, "I would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for you darn kids!"

[superman1204]

She's just chasing after Twitter OMG!s instead of telling a story. And like others who have done the same thing, she's forgotten that ultimately it's the stories that give the shocks any power they have. Like I said, even if we had not immediately guessed that Rollins was evil, it wouldn't have mattered because we barely knew him and it's not interesting to have the reveal be someone we hardly know. I know the show ended up backpedaling on Toby and EzrA, but the original reveals worked better because we knew those guys, we'd seen a lot of them over several years first. We knew how devastating it was going to be for Spencer and Aria to learn the truth. If MK was hoping to get the same reaction to Rollins, well, that was never going to work because she passported his entire relationship with Ali and then crammed their marriage and gaslighting into two episodes. As for Ali, since they told rather than showed me her relationship with him, even though intellectually I know she'll be devastated like Spencer and Aria were, I don't really feel it or care - and that's coming from someone who likes Ali and doesn't want to see her hurt. 

This perfectly sums up what is wrong with the mystery with this show.  I just wanted to add, that the writers are in this situation because they have not introduced any well developed character since season 3 (Cece was probably the last somewhat well developed character) and they have used up all of the original characters for "shocking" reveals.  I guess it kinda a chicken or the egg situation.  The writers don't have any well developed characters because they keep throwing in new characters for reveals (Shower and Rollins) but the since they keep adding new characters for each season, no one new is around long enough to become a well developed character.  Repeat every twelve episodes.

Edited March 18, 2016 by superman1204

[mac123x]

I wouldn't set foot in Iglesia de la Muerte alone.

 

I blurt laughed at that.  It's the Spanish that really makes it.  Now I'm wondering what it'd be in French.  Notre Dame de Muetre Perpétuel?

 

I'm listening to the BrosWatchPLLToo podcast... it's 3 hours long.  So far they have liked everything I detested, and vice versa.  Sigh.

[WhosThatGirl]

Oh I agree, there is a double standard when it comes to Emily. She almost had a thing with that coffee girl this season and it did seem like they were even going to go there, Emily felt really bad about flirting with her and I really thought they were going to circle back to that but they never did. 

[Mabinogia]

When did CeCe/Charles/Charlotte become the main character of this story?  I mean, first CeCe is some girl Ali befriended, no wait, she was Jason's ex, no wait, she's their sister, no wait, she's their brother, no wait, she's their cousin, so what will she be next, is she really their father, the mayor, god (I'd say the devil but man is this show trying to push the Charlotte is really good deep down agenda so they would likely go with god.)

 

It has gone far beyond farce at this point. And AD? WTF? Why do we need an AD? They keep calling this one Uber A. Wasn't the last one Uber A when they switched from the first one who was Uber A before there was a next A? It has all gotten so convoluted that it has to be that the entire series has been some asylum patient's dream, or better yet, we've been watching Ezra's "great American novel". Okay, that would crack me up, if this mess was his masterpiece. And the final scene of the show is his editor putting the manuscript down, pointing to the door and saying "take this crap and get the hell out of my office!"