Books vs Show: Has It Gone All Pear-Shaped Yet?

[MissLucas]

Urgh, that little twat! I just hope he never returns to the books - but I know better than to bet any money on that.

That said I could see Marcus Scribner for the part. I think he could pull off a sullen Belter teen.

[Macbeth]

I have to say.  I love the books.  But I think the show is better than the books.  Given the cost - They have to get to the point sooner rather than later.  They brought in Marcus now in S4.  I hate him.  But he is a compelling character.  

[Haleth]

Regarding the PM bugs, were these in the book?  It's been a long time since I read it and I only remember pink worms that consume everything.  I'm only up to episode 3 so I don't know if the worms will show up later, but I was wondering if the bugs were replacing the worms.

[raven]

11 hours ago, Haleth said:

Regarding the PM bugs, were these in the book? 

Do you mean the death slugs (those were in the book) or in the show, the ones that were flying?   IIRC, in the book there were lots of new life forms, some that flew and some not.  There were nano-bots created by the PM, which may be the flying "bugs" in this show.

[MissLucas]

I'm glad they ditched all the weird life-forms. Sometimes I felt like I was reading 'Alice in Space'.

I must say that I thought this season a vast improvement from the book. I think a lot of things that bugged me about this book and the next were already dealt with and I'm more than happy about that. Thanks to the Mars subplot and the Belter plot we did not spend endless time on Ilus/New Terra and everything going down in Nemesis Game does not happen out of the blue like in the book which then necessitated long-winded hindsight explanations about the New Navy and the Martian defectors. Everything has been set in place. And I'm glad we get to see that not everybody was drinking Inaros' Kool-Aid. I thought the books handled that aspect not particularly well.

Edited December 17, 2019 by MissLucas

[wanderingstar]

On 12/16/2019 at 7:48 PM, MissLucas said:

I must say that I thought this season a vast improvement from the book. I think a lot of things that bugged me about this book and the next were already dealt with and I'm more than happy about that.

Thank you! No Havelock and no Elvi crushing on Holden made me SO happy. Those were my least favorite parts of Cibola Burn.

And I like the Inaros/Free Navy storyline getting started this season.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Gillian Rosh

[HotRats2112]

I haven't read book 4 in a while but does Amos lose it like that in the books?  I don't remember that.  They made up for it in the show when he capped the girlfriend but seeing scared Amos just didn't sit right with me.  He (Wes Chatham) was great, but I thought Amos was always the steady hand.  Even with the eyesight eating virus.  Has anyone read the books more recently?  Or remember if that's how it happened in the book?  

And while I can't say it's better than the books, the show's pacing for this season was well done.  A little rushed, maybe. But overall good.  I thought bringing Marco in this early would bug me but it didn't.  I wouldn't have revealed the rock dropping plan as a cliff hanger though.  Maybe just a tease.  But book 4's slow pace did get to me after a while.  That book took the longest for me to finish. 

Edited December 17, 2019 by HotRats2112

[wanderingstar]

I read book 4 this past summer, and I don't recall Amos losing it. There was one scene where Holden was joking that since Amos was temporarily blind, maybe he (Holden) could finally take him in a fight. But I remember Amos just being *shrug* about the loss of his eyesight.

I actually like how they handled it in the show. Amos losing his sight would cause him to lose control over his environment (which he very much needs), so I get him breaking a bit.

[MissLucas]

Yes, they changed quite a bit especially with regards to Belter physiology and how it can handle a gravity well. In the book the colonists had prepared on their way to Ilus by taking muscle growth hormones and working out. Something Namoi explicitly refused to do even after Holden had pointed out to her that she could then visit Earth with him. Which I considered a bit of a dick move (especially since the procedure in the book is described as strenuous but not painful) . So no gravity adaptation drugs and no fatal heart problems. I think they changed that because quite a lot of people pointed out inconsistencies with Belter physiology in later books. 

[HotRats2112]

19 hours ago, Gillian Rosh said:

I read book 4 this past summer, and I don't recall Amos losing it. There was one scene where Holden was joking that since Amos was temporarily blind, maybe he (Holden) could finally take him in a fight. But I remember Amos just being *shrug* about the loss of his eyesight.

I actually like how they handled it in the show. Amos losing his sight would cause him to lose control over his environment (which he very much needs), so I get him breaking a bit.

That's how I remembered it.  I was getting worried that they are trying to humanize Amos too much in the show.  But that's one thing I love about him, nothing makes him budge.  Even when we get into the 5th book and the rocks start dropping and visits Baltimore and all hell breaks loose.  Amos is the constant.  

But, as an edit, I will say that my worries quickly evaporated when Amos capped his girlfriend.  I just didn't like seeing him freak out and punch the air.  It felt out of character, even for the show. 

Edited December 18, 2019 by HotRats2112
added 2nd paragraph

[MissLucas]

Over in the Media Thread is the link to an interview with Chatham that explains a bit more why Amos was losing it.

[Tachi Rocinante]

I would love Jay Hernandez to show up as Havelock in a deleted scene wearing a Hawaiian shirt and Tigers ballcap.

[MissLucas]

I'm getting the impression that those of us who read the book are much happier with this season than the non-readers. I certainly am and Cibola Burn was not even my least favorite book. That's still to come (Babylon's Ashes) but I'm mildly optimistic now.

[Danny Franks]

They've definitely done a better job with the Ilus stuff than Franck and Abraham did, with the book. I think it helps that we've got other storylines to focus on as well, to break up the planet-side stuff.

But it's a lot quicker, there's a lot less of Elvi alternating between wondering at weird, alien lie and crushing on Holden. And I barely remember Lucia from the book (I do remember the daughter who wanted to go to university on Mars), so she's been a revelation for me.

[mac123x]

On 12/16/2019 at 6:48 PM, MissLucas said:

I must say that I thought this season a vast improvement from the book. I think a lot of things that bugged me about this book and the next were already dealt with and I'm more than happy about that. Thanks to the Mars subplot and the Belter plot we did not spend endless time on Ilus/New Terra and everything going down in Nemesis Game does not happen out of the blue like in the book which then necessitated long-winded hindsight explanations about the New Navy and the Martian defectors. Everything has been set in place. And I'm glad we get to see that not everybody was drinking Inaros' Kool-Aid. I thought the books handled that aspect not particularly well.

I was coming here to ask if the Bobbie, Avasarala, and Ashford plots were from the 5th book.  I read 1-4 but stopped after Cibola Burn because I absolutely hated the book.  Book 3 was pretty bad with the disaster porn, and Book 4 took it up to eleven, plus Murtry was SO implausible his every action kept taking me out of the narrative.  The show made him much more plausible, mainly because he adjusted his behavior based on the current situation.

 

I wonder if I should read book 5, but based on your comments I think I'll skip it.

[wanderingstar]

23 hours ago, mac123x said:

I wonder if I should read book 5, but based on your comments I think I'll skip it.

I'm biased because it's my favorite, but I definitely think you should read book 5 (Nemesis Games). The story is exponentially better than book 4. While I didn't dislike Cibola Burn, I did feel like it got away from character-driven storytelling to focus on and-then-this-bad-thing-happened, which got old fast. Book 5 is the exact opposite of all that: it goes deeper into the past of each (non-Holden) character, while still giving you a pretty propulsive plot. I definitely recommend reading it.

[whiporee]

Am I remembering wrong, or was there a whole "Naomi is a hostage" plot in CB they've just abandoned here? if so, i don't disagree with it especially since it plays such a big role in the next one.

I like this season a lot more than the book. I do wonder if they intend to wrap the series after NG, or if they're going to age everyone 30 years to set up the Laconians. If they do want the Laconians, then I hope they age everyone, because making them happen quicker than 30 or so years stretches plausibility to an extreme. And I think Laconia is a necessary way of dealing with Mars and the abandonment of terraforming it -- you had an entire culture with society-first goals, and then it's not important anymore. However, i don't like that someone other than Avasaralla is pointing it out, because to me it was her big-picture nature is what made her so great. 

[raven]

29 minutes ago, whiporee said:

Am I remembering wrong, or was there a whole "Naomi is a hostage" plot in CB they've just abandoned here?

You're not mis-remembering, it was left out.  I don't think Naomi ever sets foot on Ilus in the book.  She and Alex bring Basia to the Roci per Holden's request because Murtry would have killed him.  At some point they realize that Murtry has made a bomb of out the shuttle (this was done in the show) and when Naomi goes to disable it, she is captured and imprisoned by Miller's old partner Havelock.

That was all left out except the shuttle is a bomb point, which was dealt with by Alex.

 

[wanderingstar]

I have a question about books 7 and 8: where exactly are the Void Cities? Are they supposed to be places just inside the Ring space?

ETA: According to The Expanse Wiki,
 

Quote

 

Void cities are enormous settlements for residents of the system who would normally be considered within "Belters' dominion" and these cities are controlled by the Transport Union, each housing roughly two hundred thousand people. These cities were equipped to also serve as battleships, medical facilities, ports, and resupply posts.

These cities include Independence, Guard of Passage, and People's Home, as well as Assurance of Peace which was under construction at the Pallas-Tycho Shipyards.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by Gillian Rosh

[whiporee]

I thought the season did a good job with a pretty weak, place-filler book. The election and Mars stuff filled in gaps that needed to be filled for the next season. 

I hope Bezos ponies up a lot of money for next season, because there’s a lot of destruction and effects to show once the rocks start to fall. 

[Danny Franks]

So we know what they're setting up for season 5, although I'm a little iffy on how the timing is going to work - getting Amos to Earth before the asteroids hit. It doesn't look like they're going to deviate massively from the Nemesis Games narrative, but here's one thing I'd really like to see:

Drummer, instead of joining up with Inaros like Michio Pa did, ends up helping Holden with his investigation into missing ships, and missing Naomi. It makes sense to put them in the same storyline, as they both have a connection to Naomi, they both have an interest in stuff going on around the Ring, and Drummer has a lot of knowledge about Marco that Holden doesn't.

This would give Holden's storyline some much needed life, because he really gets the rough end of the stick when it comes to character interactions in book five. Also, they chance to see Drummer and Avasarala in scenes together would be fantastic.

I also wonder if they might try to get Elizabeth Mitchell back, and include her in Amos' storyline.

 

[Tyro49]

I just read books 7 and 8 back to back - wow! (Persepolis Rising and Tiamat's Wrath). I can't wait for book 9 to come out! I know it's sometime in 2020, but it is 2020 now, so when??? How many more months? I wonder what the title will be. And I'm sad because it will be the last book. 

Edited January 22, 2020 by Tyro49

[wanderingstar]

On 12/31/2019 at 11:58 AM, Danny Franks said:

So we know what they're setting up for season 5, although I'm a little iffy on how the timing is going to work - getting Amos to Earth before the asteroids hit. It doesn't look like they're going to deviate massively from the Nemesis Games narrative, but here's one thing I'd really like to see:

Drummer, instead of joining up with Inaros like Michio Pa did, ends up helping Holden with his investigation into missing ships, and missing Naomi. It makes sense to put them in the same storyline, as they both have a connection to Naomi, they both have an interest in stuff going on around the Ring, and Drummer has a lot of knowledge about Marco that Holden doesn't.

This would give Holden's storyline some much needed life, because he really gets the rough end of the stick when it comes to character interactions in book five. Also, they chance to see Drummer and Avasarala in scenes together would be fantastic.

I also wonder if they might try to get Elizabeth Mitchell back, and include her in Amos' storyline.

 

I would love to see Drummer and Holden in a storyline together, but I figured they would keep Monica in the investigating-missing-ships storyline since Anna Hopkins is returning in that role. 

Would be interesting if they brought Anna back for the Amos/Clarissa story since she has a connection to both characters. 

[Macbeth]

On 12/21/2019 at 10:40 PM, Gillian Rosh said:

I'm biased because it's my favorite, but I definitely think you should read book 5 (Nemesis Games). The story is exponentially better than book 4. While I didn't dislike Cibola Burn, I did feel like it got away from character-driven storytelling to focus on and-then-this-bad-thing-happened, which got old fast. Book 5 is the exact opposite of all that: it goes deeper into the past of each (non-Holden) character, while still giving you a pretty propulsive plot. I definitely recommend reading it.

 

I agree with you completely.  Nemesis Games is my favorite book.  You really get into the backgrounds and viewpoints of Amos, Alex and Naomi.

And you have to read it if only for the Amos and Chrisjen interactions.  The odd couple I didn't know was missing from my life. Hilarious.  

The show had already set up those two when Amos was helping Chrisjen with her gravity boots by telling her to think of them as high-heeled shoes.  Indicating that Amos had worn pumps in his life.

[wanderingstar]

I just re-read Nemesis Games, and I'd forgotten that Alex actually meets Winston Duarte in that book. Wonder if we'll see him in season 5.

[Emily Thrace]

On 12/29/2019 at 11:02 AM, whiporee said:

Am I remembering wrong, or was there a whole "Naomi is a hostage" plot in CB they've just abandoned here? if so, i don't disagree with it especially since it plays such a big role in the next one.

I like this season a lot more than the book. I do wonder if they intend to wrap the series after NG, or if they're going to age everyone 30 years to set up the Laconians. If they do want the Laconians, then I hope they age everyone, because making them happen quicker than 30 or so years stretches plausibility to an extreme. And I think Laconia is a necessary way of dealing with Mars and the abandonment of terraforming it -- you had an entire culture with society-first goals, and then it's not important anymore. However, i don't like that someone other than Avasaralla is pointing it out, because to me it was her big-picture nature is what made her so great. 

They could write around the time issues with Laconia pretty easily. Considering the way the ring gates are manipulating space it wouldn't be shocking for them to be shifting time as a side affect. Say going through the gate throws you back 20 years.  It might even explain why Duarte chose that planet in particular. So he would have more time compared to the rest of the universe.

[Katsullivan]

Rewatching the show after re-reading the books this quarantine, and examining the way characters like Ashford and Drummer were centered over Fred Johnson, and the way Naomi's character and her dynamic with the others was changed, the anti-blackness behind these these decisions is starkly obvious.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Katsullivan

[Tachi Rocinante]

Was hoping the the rocks would hit earlier than the end of Episode 3, because the rest of the story(ies) may be rushed.  We'll see.

Loving Season 5 so far.

[whiporee]

I had though they weren't going to do Laconia, but in the opening sequence, when you're looking at all the gates, one of them says "Laconia." Is that Martian professor supposed to be Duarte? And then getting into the proto-scientist whatever his name is, I think they're headed that way.

Not a lot of time. 24 episodes left.   

[wanderingstar]

Quote

I had though they weren't going to do Laconia, but in the opening sequence, when you're looking at all the gates, one of them says "Laconia."

They are certainly planting the seeds of the Laconia story. Which makes me wonder how far they're going to take that. Ty Franck and Daniel Abraham have indicated that they view book 6 (which would presumably serve as the basis for season 6), as a natural ending for the show. But the Laconia hints have me wondering.

I'd be fine with ending the current iteration of the show at the end of book 6, and then following that up with a limited series (maybe in like 5 years) that covers books 7-9.

[whiporee]

52 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Ty Franck and Daniel Abraham have indicated that they view book 6 (which would presumably serve as the basis for season 6), as a natural ending for the show. But the Laconia hints have me wondering.

Me, too. 

I liked Laconia in the books, but like I said above, I think the time jump would be too hard to pull off, and I don't think Laconia makes a lot of sense without the time jump. I think it only works if everyone is older -- Holden and Namoi are wanting to settle down somewhere, Bobby seeing Alex as her endgame -- and make it reasonable that Laconia could develop the tech to the level they do. 

I like your idea of doing a limited series later. Let everyone age a bit. i just hope they don't try to cram those three books into the ending, because the ending of 6 is pretty hopefull. That would be a good way to end things. 

[Macbeth]

Wow I really didn't expect to see Fred dying so soon.  That was a shocker.  In the books he survived the assassination attempt and died later when his heart gave out from the high speed space chase.

I love Chad Coleman.  This sucks.

 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Macbeth

[Macbeth]

I did absolutely love this episode.  Even though I had read the books and knew Earth would be hit by more than one meteor - it was very suspenseful.  And I had forgotten that the attack on Tycho happended at exactly the same time.  Everything just came crumbling down everywhere.

But watching the Marcos scenes will be very hard for me.  I so despise that character.  

Edited December 23, 2020 by Macbeth

[MissLucas]

35 minutes ago, Macbeth said:

But watching the Marcos scenes will be very hard for me.  I so despise that character.  

Ditto, I can't wait for Naomi to get off that damn ship.

[ursula]

16 hours ago, Macbeth said:

Wow I really didn't expect to see Fred dying so soon.  That was a shocker.  In the books he survived the assassination attempt and died later when his heart gave out from the high speed space chase.

I love Chad Coleman.  This sucks.

 

And I felt it had more pathos in the books. It was a ---opposite of Hope Spot trope --- where you're celebrating that they'd won and escaped capture from the Navy only for his old age to have the last say. And it hits harder in the books because Fred and Holden had a much warmer relationship - Holden gives Fred the protomolecule, the whole Naomi Incident never happened. He's the closest thing the books have to a Big Good. In the show, Fred is a sometimes antagonist and never completely trusted. Now we're supposed to suddenly care that he's dead??

 

On 6/16/2020 at 2:31 PM, Katsullivan said:

Rewatching the show after re-reading the books this quarantine, and examining the way characters like Ashford and Drummer were centered over Fred Johnson, and the way Naomi's character and her dynamic with the others was changed, the anti-blackness behind these these decisions is starkly obvious.

This is actually... quite accurate.

[wanderingstar]

23 hours ago, Macbeth said:

Wow I really didn't expect to see Fred dying so soon.  That was a shocker.  In the books he survived the assassination attempt and died later when his heart gave out from the high speed space chase.

I love Chad Coleman.  This sucks.

 

I'm re-reading Babylon's Ashes now and I just read the part where Fred is killed, so seeing him die so soon in the show was disappointing. I feel like they should have kept Fred around at least until the end of this season, if for no other reason than Chad Coleman is awesome and makes everything better! Plus, Fred's fairly important in this part of the Inaros story.

Edited December 24, 2020 by Gillian Rosh

[raven]

I read somewhere and it was a while ago so I could be completely mis-remembering that the authors changed up Naomi a bit based on what they saw from Dominique Tipper as an actress.  I don't mean that as an insult to her - I think she does well with the material, I just greatly prefer book Naomi in the Marco/Filip scenario.  I don't like Naomi weeping at Filip that she wants to be his mom; I get her desperation but she really can't expect that he would just jump ship with her and leave.  I know that in the books Naomi also offers him a ship but the circumstances are somewhat different.    I do hope we get badass Naomi who engineers her own escape.

I was disappointed in two things - Fred being killed by the assassin and Marco claiming that Filip did not kidnap Naomi at his behest.  Both scenarios are different in the books and Naomi uses them as proof that Marco doesn't win completely  - since Fred escapes assassination and dies of natural causes and she escapes from Marco, thus proving to him again that she doesn't want to be with him.

 

[Haleth]

I haven't read the books beyond this one (I hated this book because of Marco and Filip) so I don't know if it would be possible, but I was wondering if the series next season would replace Alex with either Bobbie or Drummer aboard the Roci.  Of course neither is the pilot that Alex is but it would be better to replace his character with someone we already know and like, rather than creating a new replacement.

Ugh, or another thought... replace Alex with Clarissa.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Haleth

[MissLucas]

One of the best scenes in book 8 includes Alex so I'd rather not have them change that. I can separate the actor from the part but I would not mind a ruthless recasting. Not the first time the show's done that s. Avasarala's husband.

[wanderingstar]

Quote

 

I haven't read the books beyond this one (I hated this book because of Marco and Filip) so I don't know if it would be possible, but I was wondering if the series next season would replace Alex with either Bobbie or Drummer aboard the Roci.  Of course neither is the pilot that Alex is but it would be better to replace his character with someone we already know and like, rather than creating a new replacement.

Ugh, or another thought... replace Alex with Clarissa.

 

In the books, both Bobbie and Clarissa eventually become part of the Roci crew. Don't know if the show will follow that. I guess if they could replace Alex with either character, but I'd rather them recast Alex, or bring in a new pilot character.

[Danny Franks]

6 hours ago, Haleth said:

I haven't read the books beyond this one (I hated this book because of Marco and Filip) so I don't know if it would be possible, but I was wondering if the series next season would replace Alex with either Bobbie or Drummer aboard the Roci.  Of course neither is the pilot that Alex is but it would be better to replace his character with someone we already know and like, rather than creating a new replacement.

Ugh, or another thought... replace Alex with Clarissa.

It's certainly possible to replace Alex with either of them. Fans wouldn't question it, and the show has easily set those characters up as potential replacements - we've seen both Bobbie and Drummer piloting ships, and Bobbie has the MCRN military experience.

Clarissa isn't a pilot, as far as I know. She shipped as an engineer under the Melba identity. In the books she does become a member of the crew, but initially works almost exclusively with Amos because the others don't trust her.

[raven]

I wouldn't be happy to have Bobbie replace Alex, though I love the character.  I would not watch if they replaced him with Clarissa (which I don't think would happen).    My preference is a re-cast.   They've done well with the casting so I trust the show to get it right.

[whiporee]

If they are following the books, they can't not have Alex. They can recast him, because the show isn't popular enough for there to be many people who actually care. But Alex is part of the Roci family, and unless they intend to abandon the books, they simply can't get rid of the character. He can't just get subbed in by another character.

Spoiler

Bobby and Clarissa each have arcs that extend out into Book 7 (I think Clarissa makes it until book 8), and Bobby's long-term ideas with Alex are sort of a crucial part of her character one we hit the time jump. And Drummer is HUGE in book 7 and in 8, and I imagine in 9, too. 

If they are keeping with the books, they recast. Ain't the end of the world -- used to happen all the time. 

[MissLucas]

After episode 6 it seems clear that the show is going to push for a harder redemption arc for TLS than the books did so far. I wonder if he will be crucial for Naomi's escape, it sure looks like it.

[Ziggy]

On 12/28/2020 at 8:18 PM, raven said:

I was disappointed in two things - Fred being killed by the assassin and Marco claiming that Filip did not kidnap Naomi at his behest.  Both scenarios are different in the books and Naomi uses them as proof that Marco doesn't win completely  - since Fred escapes assassination and dies of natural causes and she escapes from Marco, thus proving to him again that she doesn't want to be with him.

I wouldn't worry too much about Marco's "intentions" (ie, whether or not he ordered Filip to kidnap Naomi).  Marco is very much a narcissist.  No matter what happens, it's what he intended to happen.  So if he ordered Naomi's kidnapping and it turned out to be a good thing, Marco wins.  If he ordered Naomi's kidnapping and it turned out to be a bad thing, someone else screwed up and Marco is not at fault.  No matter what happens, he will twist it to his favor.  So really, most of his decisions don't matter.  He's still always right and always awesome ... at least according to him.

[Katsullivan]

On 12/29/2020 at 8:49 PM, whiporee said:

If they are following the books, they can't not have Alex. They can recast him, because the show isn't popular enough for there to be many people who actually care. But Alex is part of the Roci family, and unless they intend to abandon the books, they simply can't get rid of the character. He can't just get subbed in by another character.

 

I'm honestly trying to remember if Alex did anything significant (besides very cool piloting on the Roci, maybe?) and I'm drawing a blank? Perhaps they can give Clarissa a pilot arc to fill the gap for Alex

Spoiler

and give him her own hero's exit. Although it made more sense for Clarissa since she was dying from her implants already.

 

On 12/29/2020 at 8:49 PM, whiporee said:

Spoiler

Bobby and Clarissa each have arcs that extend out into Book 7 (I think Clarissa makes it until book 8), and Bobby's long-term ideas with Alex are sort of a crucial part of her character one we hit the time jump. And Drummer is HUGE in book 7 and in 8, and I imagine in 9, too. 

 

Spoiler

Clarissa bites it in book 7.

I don't know what to put in spoilers!

[Holmbo]

I've only read up to book three so I'm not going through the discussion. Just wanted to jump in to say I'm happy the show finally got some more body horror this episode. That's the main thing I enjoyed in the books which has been almost entirely missing from the show.

[MissLucas]

It's been a while since I've read Nemesis Games and Babylon's Ashes but I wonder what the ending of season 5 means.

If there's only one season left, then it should be dedicated to dealing with the Free Navy (and boy do I wish they skip Holden producing all those Youtube kumbaya clips) - but they also need to deal with the plot around the Laconia gate. It looks to me as if Sauveterre's ship was ripped apart by the same mechanism - and energy wake? - that destroyed parts of the Laconian fleet in Babylon's Ashes and was later used to deal with Marco and the Free Navy. So maybe they are going to short-cut the whole Laconia plot by never having Laconia taking off the way it did in the later books? Instead it goes out with a whimper - I actually wouldn't mind.

[raven]

6 hours ago, MissLucas said:

So maybe they are going to short-cut the whole Laconia plot by never having Laconia taking off the way it did in the later books? Instead it goes out with a whimper - I actually wouldn't mind.

I wouldn't either.  They can cut out a LOT of Laconia and skip the huge time jump.   I wonder if Marco will go out the same way and if Filip will have the same ending, which I rather liked. 

The ending of S5 shows the start of production of a Laconian ship - the Roci crew & Avasarala were too busy dealing with the Free Navy in the books to know about that but the show already has them making the Marco/Martian connection, which I am optimistically going to say points to things being more streamlined.

I did have an overall rant mentally prepared because I wanted Alex re-cast and not killed but I didn't hate it as much as I thought I would.   I did a re-watch of S1-4 and they flow together pretty well.  Still, though there are things in the books that needed an editor, I prefer the books to the show, even though the show is very good. 

There has been too much odd softening of character traits in the show (Naomi is not a weepy mess in the books, though she is not the only example); Fred Johnson's early death was inexplicable at first but now I think that was supposed to have more of an emotional arc for the main characters but the Anvar thing took the the show runners by surprise and unfortunately the Alex death overshadowed Fred's. 

[MissLucas]

Carried over from the episode thread:

Quote

So next season is to be the last. They still have book 8 to go through, and a lot happened there (wow! was my reaction), but I can see how that can be condensed in some way. Book 9, which was supposed to come out last year seems to have been delayed to this, will, as I understand it, cover the final question, i.e., what happened to whoever or whatever built the protomolecule and the ring gates. I can only hope that the authors and the showrunners have gotten together so that the show can conclude with approximately the same ending as the book series. Here's hoping. Anyone have any info on this??

There have been some more or less vague hints that the show will end with book 6  which is mostly concerned with defeating Marco and the Free Navy. For example here. The question is how they want to address the Laconia plot.

It's a natural end point since book 7 starts with the 30years time-jump which would create a lot of problems even if Amazon wanted to go on. Do you digitally alter the actors or pull a Crown and just recast? There is of course still the option to cover the last three books - the whole Laconia plot - later. Which would make recasting easier I guess. But that would require leaving a lot of questions open and plot threads dangling.

On the other hand if they manage simultaneous releases of book 9 and season 6 they could close the show with all questions answered without pissing off readers like GoT did. Well provided they can pull this off elegantly which is no easy feat since they need to deal with Laconia simultaneously and this would be a version of Laconia that has not yet gotten as scary as the book version.

 

Edited February 20, 2021 by MissLucas