S06: Amazon

[Whimsy]

Here is your Survivor S6 topic.

[Lamb18]

Now I'm starting this season. Isn't Jenna the Jenna of Ethan and Jenna? I think I recognize her. Besides being handsome, Alex also looks familiar. Was he on The Amazing Race?  The first episode was pretty funny. The guys were all full of themselves thinking they would win every immunity challenge, then the women win the first one.  There was a balance beam, two puzzles, a bunch of keys, plus other stuff in that challenge. The guys kept falling off the beam - they were almost as good as Debbie. I've read about the treatment of Christy, the deaf contestant, so I'm not looking forward to seeing that.

[LadyChatts]

I'll be curious what you think!  This season still ranks as one of my top 5 all time favorites.  I don't believe Alex was ever on any other reality show besides this one. 

One of my favorite moments during that first IC was Probst ragging on Dave and Rob and saying 'we've got a rocket scientist and a computer programmer that can't figure out the puzzle.'  One of the few times I didn't mind him throwing his two cents in.

[Nalan]

1 hour ago, Lamb18 said:

Isn't Jenna the Jenna of Ethan and Jenna? I think I recognize her.

Yes, that's the one.  She was on this season, on All-Stars, and then was on TAR19 with Ethan, Africa's winner.

[Lamb18]

On ‎4‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 3:55 PM, LadyChatts said:

One of my favorite moments during that first IC was Probst ragging on Dave and Rob and saying 'we've got a rocket scientist and a computer programmer that can't figure out the puzzle.'  One of the few times I didn't mind him throwing his two cents in.

Well, I'm going to watch episode 2 tonight while I eat supper. That line by Probst was so funny! And he kept encouraging the women, too, telling them they could catch up. One thing I noticed - the first five seasons the challenges seemed to tie to the culture and history of the host country. Now this first immunity challenge didn't really have anything to do with the Amazon. You know, I forgot what country they are actually in. I think Brazil, but it could be Peru, too. I'll have to try and listen for a country reference.

[Lamb18]

I finished the series. I thought Matt would get more votes than he did. Jenna was OK, I kind of liked her and to remember that she was only 21, only 21. I think sometimes the young competitors (early 20s) feel intimidated by older ones (30s and older) and hide it by trash talking the older ones, lying around, being defiant. Because to these younger ones, the older ones represent parents, teacher, bosses, etc., who they've had to obey their entire lives and now they're competing against them on a level playing field! Woo hoo!!

The fire at the camp - I wonder if TPTB put out the fire that burned down the camp. I know crew is not supposed to interfere, but it's one thing to help with food or shout out a warning and another thing to let a forest fire go unchecked. Maybe it rained. Bummer to come back from a reward challenge to see your camp burned up and all your possessions gone. At least Rob's magic 8 ball survived!

I kind of liked Rob. He was a good player and he did have a lot of insight about the game, how to play it and how his teammates were playing the game. His problem was insincerity which the others eventually copped to. If you want people on your side, they need to trust you for at least one tribal council.

Matt grew handsomer in a Jeremy Irons way as he lost weight. He could have posed as the chiseled-featured hero on the cover of a romance novel. Rob also improved in looks. I thought Heidi looked better in camp without all the makeup.

And Christy - her treatment wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be. Joanna was the worst with that yelling in her face. But once the tribes switched up she had some friends. I think Butch was like having a father out there.

One thing about this season I noticed was the introduction of rope tunnels - rats, I can't remember the others - type of generic challenges that aren't related to the culture of the host country. Season 6, to me, shows the first weakening of the connection between the game and the country/environment in which it's played. The two weren't as closely related as they were in the first five seasons. Now this current season we're all watching, I feel no connection between the game and the country/culture it's in, except for some vaguely sentimental theme of pirates and shipwrecks. It seems more tied to the Pirates of the Caribbean commercials I see on All Access repeatedly when watching episodes than to the country the show is in.

[enlightenedbum]

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I kind of liked Rob. He was a good player and he did have a lot of insight about the game, how to play it and how his teammates were playing the game. His problem was insincerity which the others eventually copped to. If you want people on your side, they need to trust you for at least one tribal council.

On the other hand, he got as far as he could by scheming and probably would have won if he had taken the last challenge.  This more screwed him in his return appearance.

[LadyChatts]

I remember there was controversy over Christy's vote to Jenna, and whether she understood she was voting for her as the winner, and not against her as winner.  Jenna's vote was surprising at the time, but I was more stunned Matt only received one vote.  However, looking back, Jenna's win was a no brainer with that jury.

I'm assuming the crew would have put the fire out before it did too much damage.  They pretty much foreshadowed that with Butch and his obsessive need to collect firewood.  Rob had some of the best TH and TC voting confessionals ever.  I know at the time Probst considered him one of the best contestants that never won, and I still believe he's one of the best to ever play.  Too bad AS came so close to Amazon, because I don't know if he would have fizzled out so early otherwise.  

[SVNBob]

19 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Season 6, to me, shows the first weakening of the connection between the game and the country/environment in which it's played.

The part of "cultural link" in this season was the initial gender divide.  They were playing by the Amazon, so they decided to have the first all-female, or Amazon, tribe.

[Nalan]

1 hour ago, SVNBob said:

The part of "cultural link" in this season was the initial gender divide.  They were playing by the Amazon, so they decided to have the first all-female, or Amazon, tribe.

That kind of made it all the more fitting to me that a woman ended up winning the season.

[Lamb18]

Matt had two votes - Jeff read them first and Jenna had the rest.

I liked the gender-based tribes. You could tell the challenges were designed so that strength wasn't the only determining factor in which team won. I'll never forget Daniel and the other guy (Ryan?) trying to get across the balance beam tied together. Daniel kept falling off, then he scooted himself along which Jeff immediately disqualified. The women passed the men up and won!

[ljenkins782]

2 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Matt had two votes - Jeff read them first and Jenna had the rest.

I liked the gender-based tribes. You could tell the challenges were designed so that strength wasn't the only determining factor in which team won. I'll never forget Daniel and the other guy (Ryan?) trying to get across the balance beam tied together. Daniel kept falling off, then he scooted himself along which Jeff immediately disqualified. The women passed the men up and won!

It was 6-1 for Jenna, only Butch voted for Matt. 

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I finished the series. I thought Matt would get more votes than he did. Jenna was OK, I kind of liked her and to remember that she was only 21, only 21. I think sometimes the young competitors (early 20s) feel intimidated by older ones (30s and older) and hide it by trash talking the older ones, lying around, being defiant. Because to these younger ones, the older ones represent parents, teacher, bosses, etc., who they've had to obey their entire lives and now they're competing against them on a level playing field! Woo hoo!!

I couldn't stand Jenna the first time around, but when I rewatched, a lot of her nasty behavior did seem more reactionary and defensive. And most of all, driven by the truly obnoxious Heidi, who came across just as badly the second time around. 

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I remember there was controversy over Christy's vote to Jenna, and whether she understood she was voting for her as the winner, and not against her as winner.  Jenna's vote was surprising at the time, but I was more stunned Matt only received one vote.  However, looking back, Jenna's win was a no brainer with that jury.

I guess it's fairly unimportant in the eventual outcome since Matt would have lost either way, but I believe Christy knew what she was doing when she voted Jenna. Yes, she had said earlier that she'd never vote for her, but when it came down to her and Matt, that might have been the deciding factor. Had it been anyone else (except Heidi) in that seat, perhaps she would have kept her word to not vote for Jenna. 

[KimberStormer]

But what was so wrong with Matt?  A bit of a weirdo, but he seemed like a sincere, kind fellow.  I get that Jenna had a better social game than him, and people voted for her because they liked her, that's Survivor!  I would probably have voted for Jenna too, because I like her.  But it's weird to me that someone would hate her, say they'd never vote for her, but decide Matt of all people is too terrible a person to vote for.  He's not Russell or something.

Edited May 10, 2017 by KimberStormer

[ljenkins782]

4 minutes ago, KimberStormer said:

But what was so wrong with Matt?  A bit of a weirdo, but he seemed like a sincere, kind fellow.  I get that Jenna had a better social game than him, and people voted for her because they liked her, that's Survivor!  I would probably have voted for Jenna too, because I like her.  But it's weird to me that someone would hate her, say they'd never vote for her, but decide Matt of all people is too terrible a person to vote for.  He's not Russell or something.

This could be one of those cases where careful editing created a offbeat, but mostly likable character who didn't exist to the people who were actually out there with him. Christy said she found him creepy, so I don't think she was a fan. Given that he made F2 with another person who didn't come across all that great on many occasions, they might have gone overboard to try to make him more appealing.

[LadyChatts]

I always thought creepy Matt was the edit, and that he played it up (especially when it came to sharpening the machete, which Rob said was probably going to be used to murder them).  There was a challenge, can't remember if it was reward or immunity, where they had to fill out a questionnaire, and then base their answers on how the group overall voted.  One of the questions was who was the craziest, and I believe Matt won that in a landslide.

I never believed the conspiracy about Christy, either, but I continue to see it referenced.  Between Jenna and Matt, she had the worst edit of the two, so it was interesting to see her win in a landslide.  But not so much anymore when you look at the jury.  Jenna after the show really owned her behavior, and admitted she was young and still had growing up to do.  I admired that, because Heidi took the defensive role.  Amazon is one of those seasons I feel has been grossly underrepresented on returning player seasons, and I wish we had seen more of the cast return besides Jenna and Rob.  It was overall one of the best seasons, and shows you can still have blindsides, no Pagonging, and risky moves without idols being in play.  It was rare back in those days, but possible.  

[Lamb18]

I don't think Matt had much of a relationship with Christy or a lot of the other tribe members except for Butch and Rob. Rob set up a situation in which Matt would receive voting information from him only and Matt went along with it. With the machete stuff, I got the impression that he's a guy that likes to be doing something as opposed to sitting around, and sharpening the machete was something to do. But he also said that he enjoyed creeping people out w/the sharpening.

[ljenkins782]

52 minutes ago, Lamb18 said:

I don't think Matt had much of a relationship with Christy or a lot of the other tribe members except for Butch and Rob. Rob set up a situation in which Matt would receive voting information from him only and Matt went along with it. With the machete stuff, I got the impression that he's a guy that likes to be doing something as opposed to sitting around, and sharpening the machete was something to do. But he also said that he enjoyed creeping people out w/the sharpening.

Yeah, I think Rob correctly identified Matt as a person unlikely to have allies and positioned himself nicely to act as his one true friend, even if he was trashing him behind his back. And Butch was an older guy who didn't seem to relate to the Jenna/Heidi/Alex crowd, so he was on the fringes along with Matt. 

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I never believed the conspiracy about Christy, either, but I continue to see it referenced.  Between Jenna and Matt, she had the worst edit of the two, so it was interesting to see her win in a landslide.  But not so much anymore when you look at the jury.  Jenna after the show really owned her behavior, and admitted she was young and still had growing up to do.  I admired that, because Heidi took the defensive role.  

Yeah, considering the specific people who were on that jury, her majority win made sense. Had people Joanna or Jeanne (or Gene, according to rocket scientist Heidi, lol) been on the jury, Jenna's vote percentage would have gone way down. 

As for Christy, I just don't believe that a show that was in its 6th season of massive success wouldn't have known to make provisions for a contestant with a hearing impairment and making sure they were looped in. Also, I'm sure she'd seen the show before and she was clearly fine with lip reading as long as there was enough light to see, so the idea that she was completely in the dark about the show's rules doesn't fly with me. 

[Lamb18]

I was thinking maybe there was an interpreter for Christy at the challenges and tribal council. Obviously, not at camp. It seems too important that Christy understand everything that's going on at challenges and tribals for them to be careless about it. It would definitely be negligent to not care if she understands all the rules or Jeff's questions/the conversations at tribal council.

[LadyChatts]

I can't remember if there was an interpreter or not.  It could be the whole men vs women theme led to her voting for Jenna, or she found something out at Ponderosa that made her look at Jenna differently.  I know there's always discussions, too, about how some jurors can be very persuasive or persistent in getting a majority to vote for who they want to win, so maybe it was something like that.

I wonder whatever happened to Matt.  He was one of the castaways from this season I would have loved to have seen get a second chance, but he went off the Survivor radar.

[NutMeg]

Amazon is the only season I watched way after it aired (I think I may have watched it about two years ago). It was a different experience in that I knew who had won (I take this opportunity to thank those of you who answered my question about why you read spoilers. I get where you're all coming from, but I still would never know what happens next while the season is still unfolding :D), and I knew that she was not an universally loved winner, to say the least, and that "Rob was robbed" and that there was a "crazy", "scary" guy. And boy, did I see the season differently.

First of all, I loved the season. Then, I thought Jenna earned her win. I also thought Rob, while entertaining, earned his eviction from the game. But the biggest surprise must have been Matt. I found him super interesting, and even googled him after watching the season. He is indeed even more interesting than I thought, for pursuing his passions (if memory serves, he worked in a renowned french restaurant for a while because he wanted to learn fine cooking, he's run some of the most hardcore races in the world, etc.) and for having a fantastic job, consulting or designing hotels the world over. Plus he spoke how many languages? Mandarin, French, Italian, ... I'm not surprised he's never been back on Survivor though, he's probably ticked it off his bucket list and has moved on to other challenges, and I suspect he was in it more for the surviving aspect than for the winning. He still remains one of my favorite people to ever play this game, even if he's not my favorite player. Hope that makes sense :)  

[Corporal Agarn]

Rewatching now. Matt is one of my favorite contestants ever. There’s just something about him, he’s an enigma.

i have no time for Jenna or Heidi. Ugh

[NutMeg]

On 4/28/2018 at 4:58 AM, Corporal Agarn said:

Rewatching now. Matt is one of my favorite contestants ever. There’s just something about him, he’s an enigma.

i have no time for Jenna or Heidi. Ugh

Haha, yes, agree on Matt, I watched this season a couple of years ago and was fascinated by him. However, I disagree with you on Jenna, who I thought actually played a good game (that was edited as why other people- like Rob- lost, unfortunaly). 

[LanceM]

Amazon is probably my favorite season. I love everything about it especially the cast.  I will agree with others above that Matt is one of my favorite players ever, just such an odd personality.  Heidi is another one of my all time favorites just for the unintentional comedy she provided.  I love the Roger boot for the simple fact that the editors didn't even try to fool the audience that anyone else was in danger of going home that night.  They coulld have done something similar with Bradley or Chris this season.

[NutMeg]

As I said above, I watched the season long after it aired and absolutely loved Matt, who is one of the most interesting person I've ever seen on Survivor. It's only after watching that I remembered the canon that says Jenna won because she took a crazy guy to FTC. To anyone who watched it live, was that how it felt at the time? It seems so far from the truth that I'm wondering if it's a "back them, the villains were rather tame" kind of thing, or some other effect. 

[fishcakes]

12 hours ago, NutMeg said:

To anyone who watched it live, was that how it felt at the time?

Matt did seem a little disturbing at the time. He spent a lot of time sharpening the machete while staring at his tribemates. Also, as he lost more weight his face became a little more Crazy Eyed Killer, which is not his fault, but still. Rob said that there were times they were all genuinely afraid Matt would kill them in their sleep, but he was laughing when he said it, and Rob is not always a reliable narrator, so it's hard to say how they really felt.

Matt was part of one of my favorite Survivor scenes, when he was in the jungle alone with Daniel talking strategy and they started speaking Mandarin to each other. It was a cool spy movie kind of moment and it was just fun to be surprised by something.

[peachmangosteen]

I watched live and all I know is I loved Matt, but I don't really remember the details. I remember being so pissed Jenna won though, but now I don't mind her as the winner.

[ljenkins782]

15 hours ago, NutMeg said:

As I said above, I watched the season long after it aired and absolutely loved Matt, who is one of the most interesting person I've ever seen on Survivor. It's only after watching that I remembered the canon that says Jenna won because she took a crazy guy to FTC. To anyone who watched it live, was that how it felt at the time? It seems so far from the truth that I'm wondering if it's a "back them, the villains were rather tame" kind of thing, or some other effect. 

As fishcakes said, he did have his creepy moments, but he was one of those people that I imagine came across a little better over the TV than in person. He was very awkward and it just seems like an unedited view of him would have shown that more. The editors threw some of that in with the machete sharpening and Rob's commentary, but they also shaped his character into a quirky underdog. 

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I remember being so pissed Jenna won though, but now I don't mind her as the winner.

I was too, although I also hated Rob and was thrilled when he went out third. I halfheartedly rooted for Matt just because he wasn't one of those two. I honestly did not appreciate Rob's play at the time because his horny 8th grade boy routine irked me to no end. At the time, it seemed like he was entirely driven by hormones, but looking back on it, he probably did identify Heidi and Jenna as potential goats. Ultimately incorrectly in Jenna's case, but as noted above, with a slightly different jury (namely, the older women that Heidi and Jenna so thoroughly alienated), Jenna loses. 

Heidi was probably a prime goat, she couldn't help but be obnoxious and never knew when to shut up. A FTC performance from her probably would have been comedy gold. 

[peachmangosteen]

3 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

... I also hated Rob and was thrilled when he went out third.

Same.

[Corporal Agarn]

I was reading a transcript of one of Rob’s podcast episodes with Amazon alumni. He said on there a lot of the ‘crazy Matt’ thing was edited to make it look more over the top than it was. 

He’s just so fascinating to me...the fact that he speaks Mandarin, the complete lack of understanding of the game, his unique looks...I just love him.

[NutMeg]

I'm right there with you with being fascinated by Matt, as a person rather than as a contestant. After watching this season years after it happened I googled him, and found that he both had a great career, but was also taking time for extreme adventures. That is truly impressive, because he's neither a "real work" type that decided to have a fling/life dream type survivor experience, nor is he the mactor or contestant with an unstable work situation. I was particularly impressed that he actually had various careers, having for instance decided to learn French cooking in France :) And of course his mastery of Mandarin, in addition with French and whatever other languages left me in awe of him. I've not googled him now, so as not to be biased if there are some new stuff, this is all how I remember it from when I watched the season. I think he's the most intriguing contestant I've even seen and definitely amongst the top 5 I'd most like to meet, and the only one that interests me more as a person than for his experience of the game. 

[cleo]

I'm watching or rewatching this now. I can't recall if I ever saw it. I started watching Survivor in real time from season 1, but I periodically got disgusted by the awful people and skipped seasons randomly.

Spoiled about Jenna winning, which surprised me bc she seems like a bitch in the first ep. Got a vibe from Heidi too. 

Rob is entertaining. I have not listened to a single one of his podcasts. Just don't like podcasts.

Most of all- this one ep was better than the entire last season. It's great watching them struggle with the environment. The ep was just a complete story in itself, not just- welp, one hour closer to deciding if Dom or Wendell wins. The show's scope has just narrowed so much.

[cleo]

I'm continuing with my Amazon watch. Heidi is obnoxious, much more so than Jenna a few eps in. She also keeps commenting about how others see her body, and how much it bugs them. Reality is she seems to be the one obsessed with it.

Dave to Heidi- vote with us

Heidi- what would you do if you were me?

Dave- vote with us. 

Heidi- well that is clearly a neutral and unbiased opinion, plus it came from a man so okey dokey!

Okay, the last one I paraphrased. 

Rob's ongoing comments about the women are making him seem like a gross guy that has never had a date and watches a lot of porn wishing it was his life.

 Edited 3 minutes ago by cleo.

[BK1978]

On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 1:55 PM, ljenkins782 said:

I was too, although I also hated Rob and was thrilled when he went out third. I halfheartedly rooted for Matt just because he wasn't one of those two. I honestly did not appreciate Rob's play at the time because his horny 8th grade boy routine irked me to no end. At the time, it seemed like he was entirely driven by hormones, but looking back on it, he probably did identify Heidi and Jenna as potential goats. Ultimately incorrectly in Jenna's case, but as noted above, with a slightly different jury (namely, the older women that Heidi and Jenna so thoroughly alienated), Jenna loses. 

Heidi was probably a prime goat, she couldn't help but be obnoxious and never knew when to shut up. A FTC performance from her probably would have been comedy gold. 

This was the first season I saw all the way through (I saw the last episode of Season 5 when Brian beat Clay) and I hardly remember it.  I know I was a fan of Rob and thought he was funny at the start but after sometime he just started annoying me.  Though I will say I loved when he flipped.

I was angry when Jenna won and I honestly thought that Butch might end up winning.  Which...yeah that was never going to happen.  Though Butch was/is one of my favorite Survivor players.  Especially after he accidently burned down the camp.

[watchingtvaddict]

On 5/24/2018 at 2:55 AM, ljenkins782 said:

I was too, although I also hated Rob and was thrilled when he went out third. I halfheartedly rooted for Matt just because he wasn't one of those two. I honestly did not appreciate Rob's play at the time because his horny 8th grade boy routine irked me to no end. At the time, it seemed like he was entirely driven by hormones, but looking back on it, he probably did identify Heidi and Jenna as potential goats. Ultimately incorrectly in Jenna's case, but as noted above, with a slightly different jury (namely, the older women that Heidi and Jenna so thoroughly alienated), Jenna loses. 

Heidi was probably a prime goat, she couldn't help but be obnoxious and never knew when to shut up. A FTC performance from her probably would have been comedy gold. 

Watched this for the first time a few weeks ago. I was really annoyed by the 8th grade behaviour of the men and especially Rob. But, I'm thinking the sex- focused confessionals were producer driven. Both men and women spoke about how they needed to be in a tribe with the opposite sex. Heidi and Jenna kept on talking about how the other women in the tribe were jealous of their youth/beauty etc (and it didn't really make sense in the context of an all women tribe- they were annoyed because Heidi/Jenna and Shawna weren't pulling their weight!).

I'm also wondering if one of the reasons behind Jenna's win was her sick mother (Adam got a lot of sympathy votes during his season IMO). They didn't really mention it during the season, but most of the tribe were aware her mom was sick.  

[seacliffsal]

I really liked Matt during this season.  At the time, I wrote weekly articles for "Survivor Fire" (anyone remember that site?).  Anyway, Matt contacted me after an article I wrote in which I identified key strategic moves he made throughout the season.  We conducted a phone interview and he really was intelligent, nice, and funny.  I was so disappointed that he lost and that so many viewers had a negative perception of him.