Spoiler Discussion Thread

[AyChihuahua]

In the promo, it looks like Oliver is flying the cargo plane and Nyssa's riding shotgun with the back loading area open and they're coming in to land/crash. Sorry, but Oliver's a pilot now? He's never done that before, right? 

He flew the small plane back from Lian Yu in the finale of S2.  Felicity asked him how he learned to do that from five years on the island.

[MostlyC]

This thread is now the definition of a cat chasing its own tail. We're going in circles.

 

This is also known as the "Beating a Horse" corollary.

 

Why it is kind of masochistically fun to keep going in circles and beating our chests and tearing at our hair, we should all dial it down a notch.  And stay on topic.

 

I would hate for my evil alter-ego (think if Ras and Malcom were truly evil and bloodthirsty and scary + Hulk Smash!) to emerge.  She might have to mention the dreaded word" argumentative."   And will start breaking out Thor's Hammer (who graciously loaned it to her).  You don't want to meet EvilAntiReverseMostlyC.  You wouldn't like her when she's angry.

[nksarmi]

Malcolm's arc reminds me a lot of Spike's on Buffy.  He was the BB, then he turns on Angel and Drusilla, redeeming himself and by the end of the series he became Buffy's most trusted ally, even though everyone else distrusted him right to the very end.  

I think we will always be suspicious of Mal, but we must trust Oliver just as we trusted Buffy, Mal is redeemed and therefore JB can continue to chew scenery and be a "character".  Love him. 

The one minute promo was interesting as were the pics.  But as any good magician will tell you, what I show you isn't the trick, it's what I don't show you.  All those pics and clip combined are maybe 5 minutes of the episode, that gives Team Arrow 40 minutes of the real story. My guess is getting them out of NB, and the showdown with Raj is over pretty quick, and the season 4 set up, share your feelings stuff is the meat.  Remember how quickly we got to Thea's resurrection. 

Bummed if DD turns out to be Felicity's dad.  

When does Merlyn get his can't kill chip or his soul?

[SmallScreenDiva]

In the promo, it looks like Oliver is flying the cargo plane and Nyssa's riding shotgun with the back loading area open and they're coming in to land/crash. Sorry, but Oliver's a pilot now? He's never done that before, right? 

 

Not that we've actually seen on screen but in last year's finale he supposedly piloted the plane he, Felicity and Diggle took to Lian Yu (or was it when they were heading back to Starling?).

Edited May 8, 2015 by SmallScreenDiva

[catahoulamama]

^ Thanks, I guess I either missed that or forgot it altogether.

[quarks]

 

Btw, Nyssa couldn't get a green card out of it either, not only because of all the many reasons the marriage would not be recognized, and also because she's a citizen of nowhere except a terrorist organization.  That is one background check she will not be passing.  

 

Well, I've always assumed that she holds citizenship in an actual country - she did flash a passport when she showed up at the Starling City airport, after all. Also, I guess if her mother is from Odessa (assuming Ra's wasn't lying) she can claim Ukrainian citizenship. That said, I am increasingly convinced that this country, home to Nanda Parbat, is actually named "Oregon."  Or "Wyoming," making her an American citizen, and I feel the evidence for this keeps mounting up.

[AyChihuahua]

Well, I've always assumed that she holds citizenship in an actual country - she did flash a passport when she showed up at the Starling City airport, after all. Also, I guess if her mother is from Odessa (assuming Ra's wasn't lying) she can claim Ukrainian citizenship. That said, I am increasingly convinced that this country, home to Nanda Parbat, is actually named "Oregon."  Or "Wyoming," making her an American citizen, and I feel the evidence for this keeps mounting up.

Oh yes, back before the transwarp conduit was up and running.

 

She still ain't passing that green card background check.  And for her, that'd be about the only benefit of being married to Oliver Queen.

[kismet]

Now that they persisted to go through with the ridiculous marriage, I hope it is more than an Olicity stall. I do not mind if they get some annulment/divorce/soul unbinding and its used as snarky/funny moments between O, F, N, S & whoever. I also would not mind if the allegiance plays into future situations, so long as Nyssa remains on their side and this kick ass without becoming annoying, but the official unbinding of the souls metaphorically needs to end ASAP (or never had happened on the 1st place). It also needs to legally ended/annulled/nullified ASAP. Considering how much O/N & the fans are against it as an actual marriage, I hope the writers don't stretch it out for reasons or try to make it become an actual relationship with feelings. I just couldn't accept that & I feel I am not alone. I cannot change the past & make it never happen (which is my 1st choice) I'm can barely get on board with this w/m for plot purposes & Ras is evil. Please writers, do not insult my intelligence by making this sham of a marriage continue. While I'm begging, plz no consummation or baby as a result of this union. Leave all the baby mama drama to the preexisting love child out there.

Edited May 8, 2015 by kismet

[tv echo]

I think my comments are new (sorry if I missed something and they're not)...

 

Even if the marriage is only legal in NP, neither Oliver nor Nyssa will want to stay married in any jurisdiction.  Oliver, for obvious reasons.  Nyssa, because she won't want any kind of ties (technical or not) to any man, and because marriage could have LOA ramifications that could hamper her if she's going to take over the LOA.  Also, if CL returns as Sara, then also obvious reasons.

 

I rewatched the 3x23 promo again and noticed for the first time how SA changes his voice while he's saying "My name is Oliver Queen", so that he starts off in his gruff Al Sah-Him voice but ends with his regular Oliver voice by the time he says "Oliver Queen".  Real nice.

[FurryFury]

Now that they persisted to go through with the ridiculous marriage, I hope it is more than an Olicity stall.

 

I can't see how it can be an Olicity stall in any shape or form. It's not like anyone of them should consider it something more than a sham it is. I guess it's just a plot point and maybe another illustration of Ra's villainy.

[tv echo]

Looking at the finale spoiler pics again... Is this the first time that Nyssa has been in the same room with Malcolm?  If so, how can she resist not attacking him?

[tv echo]

Someone requested this earlier in the thread, I believe...

 

(source)

Edited May 8, 2015 by tv echo

[apinknightmare]

I hope that punch leads to some heated shoving. For reasons. 

[FurryFury]

This moments all look so fake when viewed up close. Reminds me of Black Widow knocking a bad guy out with her hair at the beginning of Avengers.

(As somebody who dislikes Oliver, I applaud this scene anyway).

[ostentatious]

Looking at the finale spoiler pics again... Is this the first time that Nyssa has been in the same room with Malcolm?  If so, how can she resist not attacking him?

 

Because this is season three of Arrow, and if any character responded to Malcolm the way they should based upon their knowledge of and experience with him, nothing after 308 could exist. 

[AyChihuahua]

Hit him again!  Hit him again!

[Chaser]

I find that GIF very attractive. I bame DR.

 

Ra's said that there were four instruments of death. Did he say they were carrying them? We know that KC and KL were shoting together, we can see DR and WH are together, SA and KL are on the plane with Ra's and EBR and BR may be tech central. I'm wondering if its a redux of Flarrow. Four Teams for Four Instruments.

Edited May 8, 2015 by 10Eleven12

[apinknightmare]

I find that GIF very attractive. I bame DR.

 

Ra's said that there were four instruments of death. Did he say they were carrying them? We know that KC and KL were shoting together, we can see DR and WH are together, SA and KL are on the plane with Ra's and EBR and BR may be tech central. I'm wondering if its a redux of Flarrow. Four Teams for Four Instruments.

 

 

I'm wondering what exactly they are? Malcolm switched out the vials of the A/O virus - I wonder if Ra's had more than one. And did Malcolm just keep the other? I need to stop asking questions. 

[tarotx]

I love Oliver but he deserves the punch because you do not leave a child alone. Especially a toddler! And you don't force a mom to leave her child alone. I'm hopping Layla gets a punch in too...

Though I don't want the anger to consume Diggle. Forgive but don't forget...

Oliver isn't going to fully understand that until he has a child-well at least gets to know his son.

[Chaser]

I love Oliver but he deserves the punch because you do not leave a child alone. Especially a toddler! And you don't force a mom to leave her child alone. I'm hopping Layla gets a punch in too...

Though I don't want the anger to consume Diggle. Forgive but don't forget...

Oliver isn't going to fully understand that until he has a child-well at least gets to know his son.

You cracked the resolution to the Oliver and Diggle conflict in S4.

[TVHappy9463]

When does Merlyn get his can't kill chip or his soul?

Give it time, it took BTVS 4 seasons to chip Spike and 6 seasons to give him a soul. 

[TVHappy9463]

In MG's latest tumblr posts he says "someone" will die in the finale, I bet a lot of someones will die. But will it be anyone important? Is Raj getting killed? That would be good, then Oliver could appoint Nyssa head of LOA.  

[nksarmi]

Give it time, it took BTVS 4 seasons to chip Spike and 6 seasons to give him a soul. 

LOL to me it just always made sense why Buffy was willing to work with Spike....shag him? No, not so much.  But work with him? Sure.

 

He might have built his whole image on being a badass slayer killer, but when he said he didn't want to see the world destroyed, I believed him and his motivation made perfect sense.  They didn't try to make him a hero there.

 

Later when he's chipped - Buffy working with him again makes sense.  By the time he gets his soul, he's actually a little more volatile of a character, but he had kind of proven himself worthy of some leeway by then.

 

Merlyn just drugged Thea and had her kill Sara about 20 weeks ago - what is that 5 months?  Characters keep mentioning that Merlyn is the character who killed Sara, but so far his only comeuppance has been a little torture and Oliver seems to trust him implicitly.  I'd much prefer Malcolm as the villain and I'm still crossing my fingers for the double cross I feel should be coming. 

 

Otherwise, if they are going to keep him on this loving dad, anti-hero path, I kind of need there to be some crazy retcon involving Sara.....like he tossed her in the LP or he knew Rip was going to snag her from time (per speculation regarding the spin-off), or heck, the Sara that died was an evil character in disguise and Malcolm knew it and he did nothing wrong by killing her ala Marian was really Zelena all along over on Once.

In MG's latest tumblr posts he says "someone" will die in the finale, I bet a lot of someones will die. But will it be anyone important? Is Raj getting killed? That would be good, then Oliver could appoint Nyssa head of LOA.  

I was thinking about which characters were real options for dying in the finale and this is what I think we get....

 

Oliver, Felicity, Diggle, and Thea are definitely safe with Laurel being about 99% because of spoilers about season four, contracts, etc...

 

Ray is safe because of the spin-off.

 

Ra's and Quentin are both good possibilities along with random LoA members. Maybe the general in the Flashbacks?

 

Merlyn is a maybe because they do seem to like the actor and I think we got a spoiler that he will be in season four so this seems less likely. 

 

Tatsu/Katana and Nyssa are also possibilities because I don't think either is a lock for season four, but I want to downgrade their likelihood because of the negative backlash either death on this show would bring.

Edited May 8, 2015 by nksarmi

[AyChihuahua]

I'm quite sure Ra's will die. 

 

I WANT TO KNOW HOW OLIVER ENDS UP IN CC!  Does Ra's send him to help Reverse Flash, in evil solidarity?  Does Ra's send him to hurt RF, because of replacing-evil-with-death bullshit?  (Although seriously, Oliver would have no shot v. RF.)  Does Barry grab Oliver while Oliver's on a bathroom break and then bring him right back?  I WANT TO KNOW.

[SmallScreenDiva]

I think Laurel is safe, killing her at this point will not exactly add too much to Oliver's manpain. Also, even if the character is polarizing, I'm sure there's going to be a huge backlash if another female "superhero" is killed off. Also, iron-clad contract. And as much as I want the character off the show, I really do not want another female to die. Ship her off to another comic city, bring her back for the big crossovers along with the other masked personas if you really want to see BC fight alongside Arrow.

 

When the season began, I would never have thought Ra's would die at the end. Now, I'm kind of 50-50, just because Arrow failed in their version of the character, IMO. Like Deathstroke, Ra's should be one of those villains that will forever be a thorn in Oliver's side. But the show has undermined them both.

 

I think Tatsu and Nyssa are safe; I think EPs will now be wary of killing more female characters. Malcolm, I'm almost 80% sure is safe.

[Starfish35]

Yeah, the only person I think is dying is Ra's. I would have thought Quentin, but there was that bit from the E!Online article about his trust issues with Laurel continuing past the finale.

I would love for It to be Malcolm, but I think we're stuck with him for awhile. :(. Still hoping for last minute double cross though.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Starfish35

[Chaser]

Yeah, the only person I think is dying is Ra's. I would have thought Quentin, but there was that bit from the E!Online article about his trust issues with Laurel continuing past the finale.

I would love for It to be Malcolm, but I think we're stuck with him for awhile. :(

Some of us were wondering what Laurel would be doing in S4 now that she is Black Canary. Lance Family Drama. It's an old staple.

[Angel12d]

Yeah, I think Ra's is going to die. I hope Nyssa is the one who skewers him. Get him good, girl. He deserves it.

 

I can see the twist being that Nyssa thinks she's finally taking her rightful place as Heir to the demon and then Malcolm takes over instead. I remember Barrowman said the finale will blow our minds or something. There's got to be a twist somewhere.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Angel12d

[AyChihuahua]

I think the rules (although LOA rules seem pretty bendy) would provide that that although Oliver is the Heir, if someone else kills Ra's in combat, that person would inherit.  So I can see Malcolm sneaking up behind Ra's when Nyssa/Oliver have him on the ropes and getting in the final stab.  I would overall be fine with that, except that I think Malcolm has been a big show-killer this year, and if he's back as a regular next year while also getting settled as the new Ra's in NP and being all evil, I won't be able to handle that.  (I wonder what Malcolm's hometown is.)

[apinknightmare]

I still hope Malcolm's working with Damien Darhk and that he's working with the team this year because his interests (and Darhk's) are aligned in order to take out Ra's. I'd like it a lot if we get these scenes with Malcolm where we're almost lulled into thinking he's a decent guy (since he didn't double-cross the team in NP) but then the show reminds us that he's a piece of shit by showing him contacting Darhk or something. That could be the semi-cliffhanger or whatever MG was talking about. 

 

If he's not working some con, I could also see him doing something shady to take over as Ra's, especially since now that Nyssa's seen what life is like outside of that organization, I want her to be able to live it a little. 

Edited May 8, 2015 by apinknightmare

[FurryFury]

The whole Malcolm thing is starting to REALLY remind me of Peter Hale on Teen Wolf. He was the season 1 big bad who was pretty soundly defeated and then got resurrected via his back-up plan in season 2. After then, he continued to hang around the heroes giving them advice from time to time. Everyone knew he was a murderous bastard but didn't do anything and in fact continued to deal with him (rather warily, but still). And yeah, he was related to one of the main characters and even got a daughter he never knew about later (who became one of the main characters). To no one's surprise, he eventually got back to his evil ways and started actively plotting against the heroes. I expect the same thing of Malcolm.

Edited May 8, 2015 by FurryFury

[catrox14]

Did anyone else think Oliver saying "MY NAME IS OLIVER QUEEN!" was super hot?! Daaaamn son.

 

This is what I've become. Haha.

 

I frakkin' cheered, victory armed, air-punched,shouted "FUCK YEAH, THAT'S MY OLIVER!" and then desperately needed a cigarette even though I don't smoke, because that was swoonworthy badassery. 

[Angel12d]

I still hope Malcolm's working with Damien Darhk and that he's working with the team this year because his interests (and Darhk's) are aligned in order to take out Ra's. I'd like it a lot if we get these scenes with Malcolm where we're almost lulled into thinking he's a decent guy (since he didn't double-cross the team in NP) but then the show reminds us that he's a piece of shit by showing him contacting Darhk or something. That could be the semi-cliffhanger or whatever MG was talking about. 

 

If he's not working some con, I could also see him doing something shady to take over as Ra's, especially since now that Nyssa's seen what life is like outside of that organization, I want her to be able to live it a little. 

 

Me too, me too! Didn't they say we'd be introduced to the s4 big bad in the s3 finale? I know DD has been mentioned already but I just assumed we'd see more on him than passing information and hints about a 'hive' of people. Subtle, show. And yeah, I really need Malcolm to be a bad guy still. I don't want him to be redeemed. He works better as a villain. Some characters should just stay bad.

 

I was reading about Nyssa Raatko on Wikipedia and they have set up some similar elements in Nyssa al Ghul, so I wouldn't be surprised if we see her introduce herself next season using her mother's maiden name, especially after all the shit her father put her through. Maybe she'll still be linked to the LOA, maybe she'll continue to train Laurel. Whatever happens I'm definitely interested in seeing her again. 

[Velocity23]

2 and a half minutes have been added to the Arrow season finale.

[calliope1975]

I hope they cast someone good for Damien Darhk. Half of my problems with Ra's is MN. He's not a bad actor, per say, but he's not bringing whatever I thought I needed to Ra's al Ghul. (My expectations were probably too high.)

 

I think Nyssa used Raatko in her first appearance at the airport with the worst security force in the US. 

 

If they handle the secret kid as well as they've handled this season, sigh, it's going to be a rough year. 

 

If there are more than one vial of the A/O virus, and even one gets out, I hope all the residents of SC move to Gotham. It's safer. But seriously, no, why would anyone want to live in this horrible city??

[Angel12d]

If there are more than one vial of the A/O virus, and even one gets out, I hope all the residents of SC move to Gotham. It's safer. But seriously, no, why would anyone want to live in this horrible city??

 

I thought they said that SC wouldn't be in danger this year because it was getting ridiculous. I guess they must have changed their minds?

 

LOL. Citizens of SC should probably just go away every year. Oh, it's May already - vacation time! 

[tarotx]

I'm probably going way off but with so many people hoping that Ra's isn't the real Ra's I've been trying to find out who he could be then. Perhaps "he" is Doctor Dark the president of the LOA?

"Dr. Daark himself did not depend on physical prowess, and as an assassin he instead relied upon careful planning and manipulation, ambushes and death traps, as well as a variety of cleverly concealed weapons and poisons"

That kind of fits our Ra's.

Perhaps our HIVE is really a part of Ra's empire? And Perhaps Melcolm has never left the LOA? Perhaps Hive was trying to buy Malcolm's earthquake machine because it was theirs to begin with? Perhaps Starling has some bed memories for the Real Ra's and he keeps sending people in to destroy that city? LOL :P

Nyssa would still be the daughter of the real Ra's al Ghul but raised by Doctor Dark because Ra's is to busy being a true evil mastermind? Plus in the comics Nyssa wasn't raised by Ra's al Ghul.

OK farfetched I know...

[FurryFury]

Am I the only one who feels like the name "Damien Darhk" (ugh, the silent "H" infuriates me, it's so pretentious!) feels way too cheesy for Arrow? I mean, in the seasons I've watched, it's generally been pretty good in this regard. Superhero names were used very sparingly (unlike The Flash where I can't help but cringe every time Cisco names a villain, and I actually love Cisco) and the show felt pretty grounded overall.

[BkWurm1]

While I'm begging, plz no consummation or baby as a result of this union. Leave all the baby mama drama to the preexisting love child out there.

 

I have sudden visions of Nyssa deciding at some point she wants a child and drugging Oliver with the mind control herbs that erase memory.   Her not being a fan of the whole penis thing, perhaps she'll just do some harvesting and go the turkey baster route.  

 

And yes, I'm sorry I put that out in the universe. 

 

 

 

I thought they said that SC wouldn't be in danger this year because it was getting ridiculous. I guess they must have changed their minds?

 

LOL. Citizens of SC should probably just go away every year. Oh, it's May already - vacation time! 

I'm thinking the difference this year could be that the citizens of Starling don't in general KNOW they are in imminent danger as opposed to the prior years when they had news coverage of the events.   Maybe this time they will have a few stories about some new vigilante types but not widespread panic. 

Am I the only one who feels like the name "Damien Darhk" (ugh, the silent "H" infuriates me, it's so pretentious!) feels way too cheesy for Arrow? I mean, in the seasons I've watched, it's generally been pretty good in this regard. Superhero names were used very sparingly (unlike The Flash where I can't help but cringe every time Cisco names a villain, and I actually love Cisco) and the show felt pretty grounded overall.

I was wondering if Damien Darhk is a title like Ra's rather than the dude's actual name.  

[FurryFury]

I have sudden visions of Nyssa deciding at some point she wants a child and drugging Oliver with the mind control herbs that erase memory.   Her not being a fan of the whole penis thing, perhaps she'll just do some harvesting and go the turkey baster route. 

And yes, I'm sorry I put that out in the universe.

 

You should be! Anyone remembers the Lost clone "Flash Forward" a few years ago? There was a lesbian character who was assured via a prophetic vision (everyone in the world got one, long story) that in a year or so, she'll be pregnant. By the time she was supposed to conceive she was so desperate to have a baby she slept with her best friend (IIRC, it's been a while. Maybe she didn't exactly sleep with him but got pregnant via him anyway in a very desperate way).

[jay741982]

I frakkin' cheered, victory armed, air-punched,shouted "FUCK YEAH, THAT'S MY OLIVER!" and then desperately needed a cigarette even though I don't smoke, because that was swoonworthy badassery.

I think if Felicity saw it she would be right there with ya lol

[Starfish35]

I was reading about Nyssa Raatko on Wikipedia and they have set up some similar elements in Nyssa al Ghul, so I wouldn't be surprised if we see her introduce herself next season using her mother's maiden name, especially after all the shit her father put her through.

IIRC, she was using Nyssa Raatko at the airport when we first met her in Heir to the Demon. So she's apparently already been using it to some extent. But yeah, I too would not be surprised to see her start using it more often if she starts trying to disassociate herself with Ra's and the League next year. I really don't have any idea where they're going with her through.

I thought they said that SC wouldn't be in danger this year because it was getting ridiculous. I guess they must have changed their minds?

Yeah, I thought I remembered them saying that too.

LOL. Citizens of SC should probably just go away every year. Oh, it's May already - vacation time!

Haha! Like Sunnydale. :)

Edited May 8, 2015 by Starfish35

[TwistedandBored]

Someone requested this earlier in the thread, I believe...

 

(source)

 

I have wanted to do that to Oliver all season long! GO DIGGLE!

 

 

Actually, I have wanted to punch almost all of them this season. 

[FurryFury]

Can you imagine how much better Laurel could be if THIS was her introduction scene back in the pilot?

[Velocity23]

Emily posted yesterday that she finished ADR yesterday. Isnt it a bit late for that?

[Morrigan2575]

Emily posted yesterday that she finished ADR yesterday. Isnt it a bit late for that?

What's ADR?

Oh voice over/dubbing

Edited May 8, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[dtissagirl]

Maybe the 2 extra minutes are from the riding into the sunset in a Porsche scene, which MOST DEFINITELY needs ADR, haha sorry for the Pollyanna moment, I'll shut up now.

[Velocity23]

 

Ummm .....

[apinknightmare]

Ummm .....

 

Crazy talk, but I think they're eloping.

[Angel12d]

Whaaaaat?