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Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

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LeighAn

LeighAn

First off @tv echo to answer your question NO It's sounds nothing like Olicity. 

Read the interview again, she's asked twice in some form what her purpose is on the show and she offers nothing in return except to say she's a "bad ass". She's asked what Dinah has coming up- "she becomes more of a bad ass" She's asked what her role is in catching Prometheus- "she's up for the challenge cause she's a bad ass" (paraphrasing) 

Translation she probably has nothing note worthy coming up in terms of an actual  storyline. And even though she talks like she's a lead character- thirsty- she doesn't mention having an actual storyline.

So no I don't think this means GA/BC comic canon foreva.

Re Sneak Peek:

I watched it after seeing every one else's opinions and it didn't come off that bad to me.

I think we are suppose to see it as Oliver thinks what Thea did was wrong, Oliver wants Thea to make amends to not have a blight on her soul yada yada and not look to closely at the fact that Susan is the bigger threat and a snake and Olivers a moron to trust her ha.

I get it and at this point Im just going to go with it because the whole storyline is stupid and time wasting but I have to get through it to get past it.

Susan is Ray to me, he was a stalker creep who was making moves on Felicity while he knew she was mourning someone, he used (stole) her facial recognition software with out telling her, came off as threatened by her intelligence and never gave her much credit for her work, he kept her isolated from the rest of the plot, was written as incredibly try hard in terms of being "funny" and he ate up too much screen time. 

And yet even after he tried to capture (kill) Oliver and Roy after finding out their identities in a jealous fit, Felicity still thought he was a good guy and apologised to him.

Hes great now on LOT but he wasn't so loved in season 3. This is just Olivers turn to be with a stupid, badly written pointless relationship that hopefully we will forget about eventually to. *shrug* 

Only difference being Ray wasn't as big a threat to the rest of Team Arrow outside that one episode while Susan is- I just can't figure out if the writers are going to launch the Susan is a threat grenade or not, or if they are going to go the Susan is a good person just doing her job route. 

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

^^^ I'm not sure what question you're answering. I was comparing JH's description of Tinah/Curtis to the early O/F dynamic. And I said nothing about the GA/BC comic canon in my post.

The following is in response to a post in the Social Media thread...

JH has not used the term "soul mates" in any interviews that I've read to date. However, her comments in those interviews do imply a closer relationship between Oliver and Tinah (even if just platonic) than what we've seen on screen so far, where they've barely interacted...

http://culturess.com/2017/02/19/exclusive-interview-arrows-newest-black-canary-juliana-harkavy/

Quote

As a fighter, she’s super strong and very well-trained, and while she is going to be training with the team, what she gets from Oliver is more of an emotional thing. She’s going to learn how to be a normal person again and have friends again, and I think that a lot of lessons that Oliver teaches Dinah are lessons from the heart.

http://collider.com/arrow-juliana-harkavy-interview/

Quote

At this point, who do you think she feels closest to?
HARKAVY: I think she feels close to different team members for different reasons. In general, probably Oliver because he was the one who she opened up to first, and they share such a similar background with so much pain....

https://www.yahoo.com/tv/arrow-new-black-canary-juliana-harkavy-interview-151735643.html

Quote

Even though Oliver convinced her to come to Star City with the promise of helping her cope with that remorse, she says it’s a two-way street. “They do help each other. It’s an ongoing battle to fight that — the darkness and the light inside of you — and they help each other out with that.”

Edited by tv echo
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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

2 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

if they are going to go the Susan is a good person just doing her job route. 

But they could have made her a good person just doing her job and actually had her get to the same point that she has without all the shady behavior.

Don't have her date Oliver. Just have her be digging into him as a reporter. If they really needed her to see his Bratva tattoo, have her throw coffee on him or something to get him to remove his shirt. Have her walk into his office while he's changing shirts or something. Have a photo pop up somewhere that shows the tattoo. Etc. The writers could have come up with something. 

And really, any reporter should probably be able to put together who's GA, who's on the team, etc. without needing to hire a PI to do the work. GA just so happened to show up in Star City at the beginning of S4 when Oliver Queen returned to town, just like the Hood showed up in S1 when Oliver returned. Then there was Oliver revealing LL was BC and this group of people hung out with no one else but each other, so someone should have put the pieces together. Oliver disappeared at an event earlier in the season and then GA appeared moments later. No one questioned that. The list goes on.

Maybe then Susan wouldn't be so hated. Instead, we have to deal with this "relationship" that makes Oliver look ridiculously stupid and that they're trying to make seem so important that the other relationships in his life are suffering/nonexistent right now. 

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LeighAn

LeighAn

3 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

But they could have made her a good person just doing her job and actually had her get to the same point that she has without all the shady behavior.

Don't have her date Oliver. Just have her be digging into him as a reporter. If they really needed her to see his Bratva tattoo, have her throw coffee on him or something to get him to remove his shirt. Have her walk into his office while he's changing shirts or something. Have a photo pop up somewhere that shows the tattoo. Etc. The writers could have come up with something. 

And really, any reporter should probably be able to put together who's GA, who's on the team, etc. without needing to hire a PI to do the work. GA just so happened to show up in Star City at the beginning of S4 when Oliver Queen returned to town, just like the Hood showed up in S1 when Oliver returned. Then there was Oliver revealing LL was BC and this group of people hung out with no one else but each other, so someone should have put the pieces together. Oliver disappeared at an event earlier in the season and then GA appeared moments later. No one questioned that. The list goes on.

Maybe then Susan wouldn't be so hated. Instead, we have to deal with this "relationship" that makes Oliver look ridiculously stupid and that they're trying to make seem so important that the other relationships in his life are suffering/nonexistent right now. 

Again its the same thing with Ray- they could have made him just another up and coming vigilante without throwing a romance with Felicity into the mix, and maybe he would have been more succesful and instead of LOT we got The Atom like was the original plan. But they just had to use him as an Olicity cock block which not only instantly prejudiced the audience against him but muddied the waters in terms of his storyline.

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Belinea

Belinea

Is JH talking about that conversation in the car in 5x12 because at this point there is nothing that indicates that Oliver will teach her how to have a normal life. And even if he does, she should run very fast because after five years he is still asking himself 'Can I be Oliver Queen and the GA?', so I don't know what he will teach her in that regard.

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LeighAn

LeighAn

10 minutes ago, tv echo said:

^^^ I'm not sure what question you're answering. I was comparing JH's description of Tinah/Curtis to the early O/F dynamic.

You mean Tina/Curtis sound like Oliver/Felicity? I thought you meant that Tina taking the Felicity role in relation to Curtis and Oliver, so Im really sorry if I misintepreted :)

I guess my point was that mainly it sound like Juliana has nothing of importance to say about her character even though she tries to sell her like shes an important character. 

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statsgirl

statsgirl

I don't see Ray being in any way like Susan other than as a stall to an Olicity relationship.  Most striking is that what Ray did, he did to help people who are hurt by bad guys. Susan is doing this entirely for her peraonl benefit.  A second reason is that I really do think that the EPs wanted to give Felicity a desirable relationship to contrast with Oliver, even if they blew it when writing Ray especially in 3x`17. 

Ray also believed that the Arrow was dangerous and a threat to the city. If Susan hasn't figured out yet that Oliver is not a danger when there a serial killer out there targetting the ACU among others she's even more stupid than Oliver is.

37 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Re Sneak Peek:

I watched it after seeing every one else's opinions and it didn't come off that bad to me.

I think we are suppose to see it as Oliver thinks what Thea did was wrong, Oliver wants Thea to make amends to not have a blight on her soul yada yada and not look to closely at the fact that Susan is the bigger threat and a snake and Olivers a moron to trust her ha.

 

Oliver should be dealing with the clear and immediate danger. not trying to make things up to Susan.  His reaction seems almost like he's in need of a psych evaluation because he's obsessing so much about Thea's soul when he was out killing people for the same reason a few months ago.

I get the feeling that Oliver wants it to be Prometheus who leaked the report because then it wouldn't be Susan. Or else he's just too stupid to see that she could be a problem.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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36 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

So...is Talia the real big bad of the season and Prometheus is just doing her bidding? Are we going full Dark Knight Rises here? I can't figure it out but it wouldn't surprise me.

Oh really? I didn't read the interview but, I did call TDKR ripoff awhile ago. Seriously, when in doubt look to the Nolan Trilogy; they just can't help themselves. ?

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)
Quote

 I think even Emily [Bett Rickards] has done it (salmon ladder) — she is so incredibly strong. She is fitness goals. 

Yup.  I unashamedly love this.  Even more so that she's never crowed about it.

Did JH's repeated use of "Badass" get on anyone else's nerves?  I have a feeling that Tinah is going to get more and more two dimensional kickass female.  

Edited by BkWurm1
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Guest

Guest

(edited)
6 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Oh really? I didn't read the interview but, I did call TDKR ripoff awhile ago. Seriously, when in doubt look to the Nolan Trilogy; they just can't help themselves. ?

I skimmed the interview tbh but she said something about Talia being a chess master, which made me think she might be the one setting up all these happenings with Prometheus. 

Oh, and there was also a bit about how she saw potential in Oliver. I could see her being disappointed that he maybe didn't fulfil that potential the way she wanted in s1? IDK. But nothing would surprise me if they wanted a "twist."

Edited by Guest
LeighAn

LeighAn

2 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

 

Did JH repeated use of "Badass" get on anyone else's nerves?  I have a feeling that Tinah is going to get more and more two dimensional kickass female.  

Yep that felt to me like Dinah has nothing coming up on the show except being muscle in Team Arrow fight scenes. Pretty much she's become exactly like Laurel- just there. 

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tangerine95

tangerine95

5 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Yep that felt to me like Dinah has nothing coming up on the show except being muscle in Team Arrow fight scenes. Pretty much she's become exactly like Laurel- just there. 

Yeah and that really sucks because the best thing imo about being done with LL was that they'll get rid of a character they didn't know what to do with or seemed to have any desire to write for and who was just there. Now we have another one with slightly better acting and a kinda less dumb looking canary cry lol

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Mellowyellow

Mellowyellow

2 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Yep that felt to me like Dinah has nothing coming up on the show except being muscle in Team Arrow fight scenes. Pretty much she's become exactly like Laurel- just there. 

That is good! We need muscle when the Olicity babies come along! Early days of parenthood are hard you don't want to be on patrol as well!

Dinah can go on patrol and Curtis on comms while Olicity bounce their babies. 

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)
13 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Who's Catwoman then? I loved Seline in TDKR.

Considering I actually think Arrow will end with Oliver faking his death ala TDKR.

I think in that ending Oliver=Bruce, Felicity=Seline and sadly Diggle=Alfred. I don't really like that arrangement in particular but, I can see it.

In regards to Catwoman saving Oliver from Bane, I could see it being Felicity. They had her stab Slade and Rescue Oliver in the ATOM suit, plus stop a ton of nukes including one heading directly for SC.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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LeighAn

LeighAn

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Considering I actually think Arrow will end with Oliver faking his death ala TDKR.

I think in that ending Oliver=Bruce, Felicity=Seline and sadly Diggle=Alfred. I don't really like that arrangement in particular but, I can see it.

In regards to Catwoman saving Oliver from Bane, I could see it being Felicity. They had her stab Slade and Rescue Oliver in the ATOM suit, plus stop a ton of nukes including one heading directly for SC.

And he's left a whole bunch of vigilantes he's inspired to carry on the legacy aka like Robin in TDKR.

I can see it.

At the same time I could also see them going the Smallville route of him being a fully realised and happy superhero and showing a flash to the future that he's married and has a family of his own. 

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LeighAn

LeighAn

1 minute ago, lemotomato said:

In season 1 she indirectly saves him (and the Glades) when she talks Lance through disarming the bombs. It's practically a season finale staple now.

Didn't she save him in the season 4 finale as well? When she hit the ghost who was coming at him with Nlack Canarys baton? 

And then you have season 2 with Slade. So yeah I could see it being a quota and one I'm not complaining about ha.

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thegirlsleuth

thegirlsleuth

Within the show's universe, it might be better to look at which unmarried, unrelated, straight woman who are not villains--not that being a villain stopped Oliver-- that he didn't hook up.  I am excluding the time he in a committed relationship with Felicity.  There's Poppy.  There's Cupid.   Was there anyone else?  Just going on his count, he's no longer a ladykiller, but if you look at the percentages of available women on the show he's hooked up with, it's pretty high.

I no longer think that there is going to be a BC/GA romance, perhaps because the supercomics stretch of episodes 5.8-5.13 didn't generate any lift in interest or ratings.  I never thought they would happen this season, but now I don't think they will happen at all, but based on the percentages, it would not be outrageous to think its possible.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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IF chase is Vigilante what would get him to go after OQ? Could it be a setup? Like he really doesn't want to kill OQ but, take the impeachment  heat off? Does something get revealed in the episode that has Chase turn on OQ (again assuming Chase is Vigilante).

And can I say that it's so weird they haven't even revealed that yet because I've just accepted it as fact at this point.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

23 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

IF chase is Vigilante what would get him to go after OQ? Could it be a setup? Like he really doesn't want to kill OQ but, take the impeachment  heat off? Does something get revealed in the episode that has Chase turn on OQ (again assuming Chase is Vigilante).

And can I say that it's so weird they haven't even revealed that yet because I've just accepted it as fact at this point.

Or maybe Chase set it up this way to see if Oliver would cover it up. And because he did and then whatever happens if Oliver isn't impeached (say, whatever Felicity and Thea do), he turns on Oliver as Vigilante? 

LadyChaos

LadyChaos

28 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

IF chase is Vigilante what would get him to go after OQ? Could it be a setup? Like he really doesn't want to kill OQ but, take the impeachment  heat off? Does something get revealed in the episode that has Chase turn on OQ (again assuming Chase is Vigilante).

And can I say that it's so weird they haven't even revealed that yet because I've just accepted it as fact at this point.

I've been speculating for a bit that its a mislead, and we will find out that he is really there to protect him.

BkWurm1

BkWurm1

5 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

That would be weird, because Chase is the one who decided to cover up Billy's murder, and Oliver was the one who told him to stop. It would maybe make sense if Chase isn't Vigilante. If he is, not so much.

If Vigilante actually is coming after him for corruption, then I'm going with Pike being Vigilante and Chase as Prometheus.  

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Sunshine

Sunshine

(edited)

Will Vigilante even be important going forward?  He's been a ghost most of the season. Mention in 5.02. Had an episode dedicated to him in 5.07.  They could go after him but now that Chase has been revealed as Prometheus I think Vigilante was just a red herring.  

So Felicity is definitely leaving the team to go work for Helix?  Also, if Oliver is going to be all about Snoozan in 5.16 I guess the adult conversation might not take place until 5.18 when I presume the team disbands?

Edited by Sunshine
Trisha

Trisha

So Oliver and Susan are back together (with Felicity's help!), she promised to keep his secret, she'll be saved by him next episode after Chase kidnaps her, and CP is still filming. Is it possible we all underestimated Susan's role? Everyone dismissed her as a relationship stall and/or a threat to Oliver, but neither of those things seem as sure now. Even though we haven't seen it develop onscreen, we're clearly supposed to believe he has real feelings for her.  So how does her storyline wrap up? Or maybe it doesn't?  Is it possible CP comes back for season six? 

Whatever the case, this is not a rebuild.  Even if Olicity somehow reunites this season, they've done such damage to that relationship I can't see how it would be written in any way that makes sense. (Not that making sense seems to be a big priority right now.)  I really hope Felicity officially joining Helix gets her out of this mess and lasts for longer than 520. Maybe she realizes they're shady and somehow takes control of them and next year she's leading that team. 

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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15 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

 So Felicity is definitely leaving the team to go work for Helix?  Also, if Oliver is going to be all about Snoozan in 5.16 I guess the adult conversation might not take place until 5.18 when I presume the team disbands?

I don't think she's leaving the team. There actually doesn't seem to be a reason why she can't do both.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I don't think she's leaving the team. There actually doesn't seem to be a reason why she can't do both.

Yeah, I don't think she is just given the episode description - if she wasn't still with the team, there wouldn't be any reason for her to need Helix's help, so they wouldn't have anything to hold over her head.

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LeighAn

LeighAn

2 minutes ago, Trisha said:

So Oliver and Susan are back together (with Felicity's help!), she promised to keep his secret, she'll be saved by him next episode after Chase kidnaps her, and CP is still filming. Is it possible we all underestimated Susan's role? Everyone dismissed her as a relationship stall and/or a threat to Oliver, but neither of those things seem as sure now. Even though we haven't seen it develop onscreen, we're clearly supposed to believe he has real feelings for her.  So how does her storyline wrap up? Or maybe it doesn't?  Is it possible CP comes back for season six? 

Whatever the case, this is not a rebuild.  Even if Olicity somehow reunites this season, they've done such damage to that relationship I can't see how it would be written in any way that makes sense. (Not that making sense seems to be a big priority right now.)  I really hope Felicity officially joining Helix gets her out of this mess and lasts for longer than 520. Maybe she realizes they're shady and somehow takes control of them and next year she's leading that team. 

Your forgetting that they directed Emily to play Felicity visibly upset and conflicted by what Oliver was asking her to do. And then followed it up by her making a comment on what a great guy he was and how they are lucky to have him as Mayor- cue flattered Oliver.

 

If- as bad as it is written- this wasn't part of the seeds for the rebuild they would have had Felicity not act conflicted not play it as upset or acknowledge the underlying relationship and feelings they have for one another. They would have had her be super chill about the request and talk about what a great girl Susan is and how great their relationship is, like they did with Laurel and Oliver when they weren't rebuilding them.

Its not great but it's online with the awkwardness and ragey ness of 3x16-3x17.

Remember Felicity telling Oliver she should have told him about Ray because he's her good friend. Cue Oliver looking like he wanted to die. 

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LadyChaos

LadyChaos

7 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Yeah, I don't think she is just given the episode description - if she wasn't still with the team, there wouldn't be any reason for her to need Helix's help, so they wouldn't have anything to hold over her head.

Remember that in 516 they ask her to do a favor before they will continue to give her access again.  Something that makes her either go to Oliver or ends up with Oliver bailing her out.  So I would venture to say that her partnership with Helix is short lived.

Sunshine

Sunshine

2 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

Remember that in 516 they ask her to do a favor before they will continue to give her access again.  Something that makes her either go to Oliver or ends up with Oliver bailing her out.  So I would venture to say that her partnership with Helix is short lived.

Doesn't she have to do something, possibly more than one thing, before she can profoundly understand Oliver?  I would think this would last at least through 5.20 since 5.19 is titled Dangerous Liaisons.  She hasn't really done any morally grey things yet, at least no more than usual.  Even if she wants out immediately she might find it's not that easy to get out.  

LeighAn

LeighAn

Just now, Sunshine said:

Doesn't she have to do something, possibly more than one thing, before she can profoundly understand Oliver?  I would think this would last at least through 5.20 since 5.19 is titled Dangerous Liaisons.  She hasn't really done any morally grey things yet, at least no more than usual.  Even if she wants out immediately she might find it's not that easy to get out.  

I think what ever they asked her to do in 5x16 she does, but her empathy powers make her guilty and conflicted. And she will carry that for an episode or two before we get to the Oliver to the rescue part

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leopardprint

leopardprint

I had a similar thought to Trisha. They seem to be pushing that relationship along so quickly and with the same beats from last season. I'm wondering if they want to diminish the importance of Felicity for next season.  Or maybe they just want to make Oliver so terrible no one wants him to get back together with her. That's a novel way to deal with an unwanted ship. 

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Trisha

Trisha

6 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Your forgetting that they directed Emily to play Felicity visibly upset and conflicted by what Oliver was asking her to do. And then followed it up by her making a comment on what a great guy he was and how they are lucky to have him as Mayor- cue flattered Oliver.

I'm not forgetting - I saw it. I also saw her try to tell him that he should fix this himself and him look completely oblivious to her obvious discomfort and treat her like a buddy. I couldn't even appreciate their moment (which I'm sure was supposed to be cute and hopeful) on the heels of that.

I recently rewatched 316 and even though that was at their lowest, there were so many cute moments between them and it was so obvious they wanted to be together (on both sides) that a reunion was inevitable. I just don't see that here. I'm not saying they won't end up together by the end of the season, but the writers are not following their previous playbook. They are burning this relationship to the ground (momentarily at least). Is it because they are working towards a big surprise and need both of them to hit rock bottom before they can realize what they want or something? Possibly. But I don't see them writing with any consistency so it's nearly impossible to predict. 

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sara1121

sara1121

7 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

We'll probably see Oliver visiting Susan in the hospital. 

Or will keep vigil at the hospital for every second she's there. Paralyzed fiances can be left alone for days on end but I assume Oliver will be fully present and devoted to the girlfriend that basically no one cares about.

4 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

 And she will carry that for an episode or two before we get to the Oliver to the rescue part

Is the Oliver to the rescue part just speculation or based on a spoiler? Just wondering if I'd missed a spoiler somewhere.

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JJ928

JJ928

I've always thought that Olicity would be broken up all season with a reunion or hints of one in the finale. I still think this is what will happen. I don't want to say I'm off the ship, I'm not... but Oliver needs to put in the work before I can support them again.I rather they just hint to reuniting and wait until next season, and hopefully Oliver won't be such a dumb moron. lol

I don't know if Snoozie is gonna die next episode, but I saw an interview w/the actor playing Chase, and it sounds like Snoozie may betray Oliver after all. At least it felt like that actor was hinting it. If this has already been discussed,I'm sorry for repeating. It's ben tough keeping up since this forum is on fire tonight. lol

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

  • Author
2 minutes ago, JJ928 said:

I don't know if Snoozie is gonna die next episode, but I saw an interview w/the actor playing Chase, and it sounds like Snoozie may betray Oliver after all. At least it felt like that actor was hinting it. If this has already been discussed,I'm sorry for repeating. It's ben tough keeping up since this forum is on fire tonight. lol

She's filming 516, 518 and 519. So she's not dead yet.

Do you have a link for that interview? 

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