S02.E06: Are We Fired?

[Girl in a Cardigan]

I like that the one piece of advice that was aired was about getting a floor mat.  That was some real insider knowledge right there!

 

Oh that, and renting it out for the events they are already renting it out for....

 

I'm just amused that Julie managed to use the show to advertise a better looking, more popular estate than Mapperton.  I can tell you, if I had to choose between the two, I would probably visit Raif's estate before I visited Mapperton.  It just looks like more of a professional operation.

 

I wonder if they could actually have a sandwich shop at Mapperton, or if it would somehow interfere with whoever licenses the "Earl of Sandwich" name?  Meh, I guess they wouldn't care either way.  But the more I think about it, the more a super fancy sandwich shop would be a good idea.  When we did a tour of London, one of the highlights was having tea/lunch in a beautiful garden so it might help them out on the tour circuit.

Looking at the website, they do have sandwiches in their cafe, but it's not really playing up the Seat of the Earl of Sandwich angle. Looks like the menu at any of the English houses I've visited. I'm still not entirely sure why Julie has to SAVE MAPPERTON. Since her husband is not yet the Earl (right?), his parents are still in control of the estate and her husband helps out because it's apparently a lot to run. I would get it if she wanted to contribute some ideas or something, but she acts like if she doesn't come up with a plan, the whole place will crumble beneath them.

 

I was surprised that Caroline F was SO OFFENDED by Marissa's terrible jokes. "Actually, that's disgusting." Um yeah, that's why EVERYONE hates pedophiles. This isn't news. But perhaps it's just a weird cultural thing. (Twenty second personal story: I was friends with a girl who had an Irish guy she met on study abroad come to visit her and they started dating. I would joke with her about her "boy toy," even though I knew they were in a relationship and the same age, etc. One time I used the term in front of him and he got totally bent out of shape, even though it was clear that I was joking. Otherwise he was a chill dude, so it seemed weird that this phrase was rub him so wrong.)

 

I'm a Caroline Stanbury stan, but it was hard to watch her just walk out of her office, knowing what the investors were going to say and not really doing anything. I can only assume that all of the staff there have been looking for work since before Christmas (there's no way they didn't know the business was failing), but it was still hard to hear her be so hard on the phone with Rania that everyone is "fired." Also, I was a bit amused that Caroline S described her make up artist as her best friend and other half, as that's what people usually say about their husbands. But since I'm sure her husband will never watch this show, it's not a big deal.

 

Listening to Sophie describe Will Ferrell in "Old School" and realizing that she and I now have at least one thing in common just made me laugh. What are her feelings about Craig Kilborn? I need to know!

[RCharter]

Looking at the website, they do have sandwiches in their cafe, but it's not really playing up the Seat of the Earl of Sandwich angle. Looks like the menu at any of the English houses I've visited. I'm still not entirely sure why Julie has to SAVE MAPPERTON. Since her husband is not yet the Earl (right?), his parents are still in control of the estate and her husband helps out because it's apparently a lot to run. I would get it if she wanted to contribute some ideas or something, but she acts like if she doesn't come up with a plan, the whole place will crumble beneath them.

 

I was surprised that Caroline F was SO OFFENDED by Marissa's terrible jokes. "Actually, that's disgusting." Um yeah, that's why EVERYONE hates pedophiles. This isn't news. But perhaps it's just a weird cultural thing. (Twenty second personal story: I was friends with a girl who had an Irish guy she met on study abroad come to visit her and they started dating. I would joke with her about her "boy toy," even though I knew they were in a relationship and the same age, etc. One time I used the term in front of him and he got totally bent out of shape, even though it was clear that I was joking. Otherwise he was a chill dude, so it seemed weird that this phrase was rub him so wrong.)

 

 

Yeah-- color me confused on why Julie feels she has to sell JUB Balls, teach yoga, raise 4 kids in the city, and save Mapperton, when three other people are supposed to be working there.  But I'll read her article and maybe it will clear it all up.

 

I've dated younger men, and I'm always the first one to make the jokes.  When I was dating a guy 10 years younger I would always say that I was convinced Chris Hansen was going to pop out of a corner somewhere with a camera crew and a chat log in his hand.  And I'm not nearly as thick skinned as all these women claim to be.  

[izabella]

Why do these women feel the need to dress up in costumes all the time?  Where did this idea come from that everything requires a costume?   I will say the wigs were an improvement on some of them.

[stcroix]

Seems like this show was made for advertisements more than anything.  Julie pitching her JUB things and with a neverending advertisement for Mapperton ( They act like it's about to be taken away for non payment of back taxes and the family will all be in Julie's small house sleeping like the folks in Willie Wonka!  It's already a going concern apparently and I just read that in 2013 there were over 10,000 people touring the house and gardens,along with a number of summer weddings and concerts, as well as Mapperton being chosen as the setting for Bathsheba Everdene’s beautiful Dorset manor house in the new film adaptation of Thomas Hardy’s classic novel, Far from the Madding Crowd.  That doesn't sound like it's going to crumble to the ground if Julie doesn't get to cookin' and sellin' JUB!  I think they're pulling one over on us with the 'poor Mapperton' bit (as expensive as it is to keep up, I realize)  And also there was free advertisement for cousin's Beaulieu! 

 

The other ladies conveniently have items to push,too.  Baroness Caroline seemed to want to showcase her almond butter and cookbook.  Annabelle and her childrens books.... sigh....  (I had to fast forward through that long segment, thank goodness for dvr).  Marissa's always pushing that hot dog restaurant-- now with hats to match.  Who am I forgetting... ?  I guess Juliet would want us to know she's available for dressing people, but after seeing her unkept look I don't think even the producers want to pursue that venture...

 

And the gay ex football star who's suddenly old family friends with Caroline S... Putting her children to bed.... I'm out!  Oh who am I kidding, see you all next week  ;)

 

Oh, and I like the music!  It makes me feel like I'm in London about to go shopping in one of those fabulous stores.  Wish they'd take us in one of those and fake try on clothes, or shoes or makeup or anything. 

[pasdetrois]

The opening theme song is one of the most tuneless, insipid things I've ever heard. I hate it.

 

Marissa is very competitive against other women. Under Marissa's polished, smiley exterior there beats the heart of a catty competitor. Perhaps there's a mutual dislike between her and Caroline F., kind of an undercurrent.  Maybe Caroline F.'s ditzy hippie-sunshine act requires absolute adoration from everyone around her or she gets grumpy, and Marissa knows how to push her buttons. Caroline has had great wealth, beauty, social success, security...sometimes people like that are incredibly spoiled and don't react well to being treated like regular folks.

 

I've bumped into a fair number of aristocratic Brits over the years, such as at embassy gigs. The wives are not raving beauties. I'm not sure where the idea came from - that British aristocracy marries only beautiful women. Julie certainly looks harried all the time, but she looks like a typical working mother to me.

Edited October 15, 2015 by pasdetrois

[hoodooznoodooz]

I enjoyed Caroline S's twins teasing one another about Lucy and Corrine, and their adorable pajamas, and their spontaneous rolling around on the bed.

Ha, ha! stcroix, I just watched Willy Wonka with my 6-year-old, so I love the reference to everyone from Luke Montagu's family having to share a bed, foot to foot.

Edited October 15, 2015 by hoodooznoodooz

[TheFinalRose]

Pushing Mapperton to an American television audience is Julie' storyline, maybe that was the agreement she made with the family before/in order to go on the show.  However, I don't know how effective this publicity is because honestly, when I go to England my time is limited and I am going to go to Chatsworth or Castle Howard (Brideshead Revisited) for my stately homes fix, and not wee little Mapperton.  Now if this show airs in Britain, then maybe the Sandwiches might be raising their profile some. It seems like more of a destination place for locals, not a national draw. That said, if Julie wants to keep knocking on the door of the stately home set and bringing in the cameras I'm all for it. That's what this show is for!

 

 

I wonder what the real story is behind Caroline S.'s business failure. Her CFO was very distraught; maybe she had invested. And when Caroline left the investor meeting she was very subdued and grim. Maybe there was difficulty in accounting for the investors' funds. Even if Caroline was just the face of the business and did very little actual work, others could have tried to manage the business successfully. Caroline actually seemed ashamed.

 

 

I actually liked seeing this side of Caroline S. She seems excessively rational in her approach to life but is not one-dimensional as she has plenty of close friends and it seems a good relationship with Cem. Her stoic reaction to the demise of her business might be her 'don't overanalyze situations, just accept reality and move on' advice that she gave to Juliet, in action. Wonder if she bit off more than she could chew acquiring that wedding business that was mentioned in the beginning of the season but ne'er heard from again, as well as taking her eye off the ball by filming this show, which took place over the holidays which is where TGL needed to make its year. It's an interesting real storyline on a reality show.  

 

 

I really like this show. I believe it. I, too, like Carolyn F a lot. Her life has zero in common with mine, and yet she is a human being. Of course she's eccentric and snobbish, could there be another option for her? She's also warm and cute and makes strides to be normal. I think she's a wonderful addition to the show.

 

 

Oh I love her being the Danish Martha Stewart. At least she's throwing her heart and soul into cooking for her kids. And yes, I'm looking at you Juliet (Does Kraft Mac N Cheese count as cooking?)  Loved Caroline's response to that: And nothing else? And her home is so interesting to me, really shows off her style and personality.  But haha to her sit down with Julie and Annabelle, thinking she could fix Juliet's personality. That's a hopeless cause.

 

I am slightly fascinated by the fact that Juliet has not that much going on in her life. Surprised that she hasn't come up with a business to hawk in-between seasons. It's just her and her lonely life and little kids (and her daughter already seems over her at six years old).

 

 

I think if I was in Caroline F's shoes, I would've gotten pissed at Marissa too.

"Cougar" shirt, ok, ha ha. "Lock away your children"--ok, you got me, lol. "She only likes little boys"--ok, we all get it. Shut the fuck up now, Marissa.

 

 

Yeah, and Marissa knew she was pissing off Caroline but her face stayed really mean and she showed zero remorse. I actually think Marissa is the most insecure of all the Americans because of her constant yapping about her husband's nightclub/restaurant connections. At least Annabelle had a long, real friendship with McQueen, she wasn't a coat-tails grabber. But Marissa's just as much a nobody there as Juliet and Julie, and she's dependent on her husband's connections too.  At least Julie seems to have her own interests that she's devoted to.  Marissa was in PR, but now she's opening a restaurant, that's two different disciplines. You know her husband is doing most of the heavy lifting on that endeavor, even though she says it's hers. We've seen her doing a lot of the pr stuff, but hubby is probably providing the contractors and negotiating with the vendors because why wouldn't he? It's his money and his area of expertise.  

 

 

 

I'm not gonna lie.  I love this show.

 

 

Me too.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I'm not crazy about the illustrations for the "Me Me Me" books. They remind me of the Roger Hargreaves (Little Miss Greedy, etc.) characters, but on acid, or a Tim Burton-ish interpretation of those characters.

They could rename the Real Housewives series Me Me Me.

Edited October 15, 2015 by hoodooznoodooz

[Girl in a Cardigan]

I'm not crazy about the illustrations for the "Me Me Me" books. They remind me of the Roger Hargreaves (Little Miss Greedy, etc.) characters, but on acid, or a Tim Burton-ish interpretation of those characters.

All I could think of was Pixar's "Inside Out." I guess these scenes happened before that movie came out this summer, and maybe it wasn't as popular in the UK. But it seems like it's been done already.

[stcroix]

I totally agree with the above posters saying Marissa seems nice but is actually sneaky mean.  I get that vibe from her.  That huge smile or over the top laugh about nothing while her eyes are seriously calculating the effect of what she said creeps me out.  I would not want her as a friend, I don't think she is to be trusted.  A Climber if ever I saw one!

[innocuouspuff]

While I can understand people saying that Marissa's comments were maybe too many, again, aren't all these Brits and Europeans supposed to have this thick skin? Nothing Marissa said was offensive or meant to be anything other than a joke. Caroline F. seems proud to be dating younger men, so why should she have a problem when people joke about it?

One obvious difference to me is that jokes are funny? Not just someone basically shouting "haha pedo" over and over.

[RCharter]

One obvious difference to me is that jokes are funny? Not just someone basically shouting "haha pedo" over and over.

"you can't do a hand stand fast enough" wasn't funny either.  In fact none of their jokes are funny.  Caroline S. has funny snark but thats about the long and short of it.  But not a one of them is going to be the next Tina Fey.  The pedo jokes are just as dumb as any other joke on this show.

[innocuouspuff]

Well, and I dislike all of that sniping, personally. :) But my underlying point was that if you take away the "comedy" part of an insulting joke then you've pretty much just got an insult. And if we're ranking insults, the ones Marissa was throwing out are pretty bad. I don't blame Caroline for not wanting to grin and bear it.

Edited October 16, 2015 by innocuouspuff

[RCharter]

Well, and I dislike all of that sniping, personally. :) But my underlying point was that if you take away the "comedy" part of an insulting joke then you've pretty much just got an insult. And if we're ranking insults, the ones Marissa was throwing out are pretty bad. I don't blame Caroline for not wanting to grin and bear it.

But they were jokes....even bad jokes are just jokes.  Her intent wasn't to seriously say that Caroline was a pedophile, the same way Caroline S's intent wasn't to call Julie a terrible yoga teacher.   For people who are supposed to have these thick skins, the Europeans seem very thin skinned.  People called Julie thin skinned for getting upset over the yoga joke, but in that instance she had Caroline S. basically calling her an idiot during the meeting about her business beforehand so that might at least explain her sensitivity.  But if Caroline F. is upset over some annoying jokes about her dating younger men than she is even more thin skinned, because it was a joke -- and there was no history of Marissa ever saying anything disrespectful to her in the past.  Caroline F. talks about dating younger men, but now no one can make an annoying but genuine joke about it?  

 

In the future maybe Caroline F. should keep these things to herself if she needs to control who talks about it and how they discuss it and is going to be so sensitive about it to the point where no one can joke about it unless they clear it with her and make sure she won't be offended.

Edited October 16, 2015 by RCharter

[innocuouspuff]

I guess I don't think intent cures everything? I think there's a huge grey area between a genuinely funny joke about a subject the target may be sensitive about, and calling someone a name in 100% seriousness. Marissa was reveling in it while smirking and constantly repeating herself. While she may not have literally been accusing Caroline F. of child molestation, she seemed to think the mere existence of the young boyfriend was hilarious. That's unkind imo, and there's plenty of room in the grey area for someone to say, hey, that's not cool.

Haha, she likes little boys. Haha, she's ugly. Haha, she's stupid. If you later have to explain that you were totally joking! because hypothetical 'she' had just mentioned a bad haircut or bad test scores, some offense is probably still to be expected. Because the majority of your comment was a straight up insult.

[balshureen]

Caroline F. has always appeared to be very down to earth, but while she is no longer technically a baroness, she was raised European royalty, and I'm sure that she still gets a lot of deference for that in London and all over Europe.  Princess Mary is godmother to her daughters... she's high class (although she does do headstands in formal dress and exposes herself).  No one likes being called a cougar or that they like young boys, and especially not someone used to being given the royal treatment.  Marissa overstepped her bounds with someone she doesn't know very well.  I kind of got the sense that Caroline F. was thinking that Marissa was being a little overly familiar with her.  Seems a pretty stupid move for Marissa, who's a social climber and trying to push a new business.  

 

However, if you're going to objectify the person you're dating and basically condense him down to a thirty year old with a very big, er, um, heart, then you better be prepared to take the heat.  

[RCharter]

I guess I don't think intent cures everything? I think there's a huge grey area between a genuinely funny joke about a subject the target may be sensitive about, and calling someone a name in 100% seriousness. Marissa was reveling in it while smirking and constantly repeating herself. While she may not have literally been accusing Caroline F. of child molestation, she seemed to think the mere existence of the young boyfriend was hilarious. That's unkind imo, and there's plenty of room in the grey area for someone to say, hey, that's not cool.

Haha, she likes little boys. Haha, she's ugly. Haha, she's stupid. If you later have to explain that you were totally joking! because hypothetical 'she' had just mentioned a bad haircut or bad test scores, some offense is probably still to be expected. Because the majority of your comment was a straight up insult.

There was nothing genuinely funny about Caroline S's joke to Julie either. And there was nothing serious in Marissa's jokes, other than the fact that they were based on Caroline F. dating a younger man.  I feel like there were jokes like this made to Samantha on Sex In the City.

 

And how was Marissa supposed to know that Caroline F. was sensitive about the subject matter.  Caroline F. herself revels in the fact that she is dating a younger man with a "big heart."  And to me, if you're that sensitive about who you are dating, maybe you shouldn't be dating them. 

 

No one should ever have to explain to Caroline F. that what Marissa said was a joke, because it was so clearly a joke.  If she doesn't see them as jokes (albeit annoying ones) and she is truly offended by something that is clearly a joke she has an even thinner skin than Julie, and they both have HSP syndrome or whatever.  

 

There were three jokes that I heard.  Yeah, that may be annoying, but its hardly unkind or even constant.  So now if Marissa even finds the mere fact that Caroline F has a younger boyfriend as funny thats unkind?  That sounds super thin skinned to me. So, if Caroline F doesn't want people joking about her dating younger men, or they need to clear these jokes with her I think she should just keep her relationships to herself if people around her need to censor themselves so much so that they can't even joke about it.

Edited October 16, 2015 by RCharter

[beesknees]

I enjoyed Caroline S's twins teasing one another about Lucy and Corrine, and their adorable pajamas, and their spontaneous rolling around on the bed.

Ha, ha! stcroix, I just watched Willy Wonka with my 6-year-old, so I love the reference to everyone from Luke Montagu's family having to share a bed, foot to foot.

Loved Stcroix's Willy Wonka reference!  Made me laugh out loud and smile seeing I just had a rummage sale last week and pulled out a box of childhood books from the 1970's.  There was my dog-eared copy of "Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory" complete with a home made golden foil ticket :)

Edited October 16, 2015 by beesknees

[Jezebel97]

I guess I don't think intent cures everything? I think there's a huge grey area between a genuinely funny joke about a subject the target may be sensitive about, and calling someone a name in 100% seriousness. Marissa was reveling in it while smirking and constantly repeating herself. While she may not have literally been accusing Caroline F. of child molestation, she seemed to think the mere existence of the young boyfriend was hilarious. That's unkind imo, and there's plenty of room in the grey area for someone to say, hey, that's not cool.

I agree with this.

I tend to have a bawdy sense of humor that sometimes borders on Beavis & Butthead territory so I would have taken Marissa's idiotic ribbing in stride.

I love to tease my friends too as long as it's all in good fun. 

 

But Caroline F's reaction would have cued me to cool it.  She did not laugh along & became quiet.  So as a friend or acquaintance I would have stopped, moved on & tried to make my friend or acquaintance comfortable again.  That's called social etiquette.

[kassa]

In my book, if you make a joke at somebody's expense once... okay, a joke, no harm done.  Sometimes you can't resist an obvious joke and it's lame.

 

When you make it the second time in the same social gathering, it's a dig.  Maybe you still mean it to be funny, but unless the entire company was joining in and one upping you and you came up with something to top them all... a dig.  Side eye time.

 

The third time?  You're being hostile for some reason.  And I'm going to ask why.

[RCharter]

I agree with this.

I tend to have a bawdy sense of humor that sometimes borders on Beavis & Butthead territory so I would have taken Marissa's idiotic ribbing in stride.

I love to tease my friends too as long as it's all in good fun. 

 

But Caroline F's reaction would have cued me to cool it.  She did not laugh along & became quiet.  So as a friend or acquaintance I would have stopped, moved on & tried to make my friend or acquaintance comfortable again.  That's called social etiquette.

When Caroline S was at Caroline F's house for dinner she said she doesn't eat fruit, or something to that effect.  But the dessert was fruit.  In spite of Caroline S's repeatedly saying that she didn't eat fruit, that she didn't want the fruit, don't give her the fruit, she isn't into the fruit, she wouldn't like to try the fruit, please not the fruit Caroline F. pretty much shoved it in her mouth and wouldn't take no for an answer.

 

She knew her friend didn't want to do something, for whatever stupid reason, and she made her do it, in spite of the fact that she was uncomfortable with it.  I get bothered when people hold themselves to a different standard.  And thats what I see with Caroline F. and probably all of the Europeans.  If you're going to hold yourself to almost no social etiquette standard, than you shouldn't hold others to one either.  When Julie gets upset about a dumb joke that came from someone who has a history of putting her down she is thin skinned.  When Caroline F. gets upset about some dumb jokes, about a subject that she seems to have no problem with suddenly she is rightfully upset.

 

I'm not saying Marissa's jokes were the height of humor.  She made the joke three times over the course of an evening in which I hope they were talking about other things.  No doubt Marissa said it, but was she sitting there doing a 10 minute monologue about Caroline F. being a child molester?  I doubt it.  And did she just blurt these jokes out of the blue?  Maybe, or maybe she made the jokes at separate times in the course of a conversation.  I actually think that Caroline F. was talking about it at Caroline S's cocktail party, so it doesn't seem like a taboo subject.  And Juliet made a joke of it on the shirt.  If Caroline F. doesn't want jokes about her being a cougar than she should stop talking about dating younger men in such a jovial tone.

Edited October 16, 2015 by RCharter

[innocuouspuff]

So now if Marissa even finds the mere fact that Caroline F has a younger boyfriend as funny thats unkind? That sounds super thin skinned to me.

Laughing at someone's life choices or circumstances is skirting the kindness line pretty hard to me, yeah. As balshureen pointed out, Marissa doesn't really know Caroline F like that. If she did, Caroline might receive it differently.

Or to put it another way: what's so intrinsically hilarious about having a younger boyfriend? Other than that it's apparently not something Marissa would do. I can't think of anything funny about it, causing all that giggling from M, that would actually be a compliment.

I don't disagree that they're all hypocrites, lol. Though Juliet asked if the shirt was okay or a bridge too far, so she was actually tuned into the social niceties for once. Being happy to talk about something isn't the same as wanting people to laugh at you.

Edited October 16, 2015 by innocuouspuff

[RCharter]

Laughing at someone's life choices or circumstances is skirting the kindness line pretty hard to me, yeah. As balshureen pointed out, Marissa doesn't really know Caroline F like that. If she did, Caroline might receive it differently.

Or to put it another way: what's so intrinsically hilarious about having a younger boyfriend? Other than that it's apparently not something Marissa would do. I can't think of anything funny about it, causing all that giggling from M, that would actually be a compliment.

I don't disagree that they're all hypocrites, lol. Though Juliet asked if the shirt was okay or a bridge too far, so she was actually tuned into the social niceties for once. Being happy to talk about something isn't the same as wanting people to laugh at you.

I think we always laugh at people's life choices.  Especially if its a choice.  Trump is choosing to run for POTUS, it is funny...I will laugh.  Mary Carey chose to run for governor of California, it was funny....I laughed.  People choose to wear mom jeans ,it is funny.....I will laugh.  

 

There is something funny about people dating significantly younger or older than them.  Probably because its somewhat taboo and its not something most of the population does. I didn't find the Anna Nicole golddigger jokes offensive, nor did I find the cougar jokes about Demi Moore offensive.  It's become a joke in our culture and one of the least harmful ones because those jokes aren't really based on anyone hurting anyone else.  I think the term cougar is actually a compliment.  It means you are a woman that has taken care of herself and has the ability to attract a young, hot guy on her own terms.  From my POV you're not going to offend me with jokes about how I'm in a situation where I'm able to attract young, hot men because I look so great.

[innocuouspuff]

The question was not whether we laugh, but whether it's kind to do so in their faces. Anyway, I'm happy to agree to disagree.

[hoodooznoodooz]

You guys are making really valid arguments for both points of view.

I do wonder why Marissa seemed to enjoy pushing CF's buttons. What did M say? She had met CF's boyfriend once; he was a bit of a douche to her? Does she hold a grudge over this?

[hoodooznoodooz]

Loved Stcroix's Willy Wonka reference!  Made me laugh out loud and smile seeing I just had a rummage sale last week and pulled out a box of childhood books from the 1970's.  There was my dog-eared copy of "Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory" complete with a home made golden foil ticket :)

I wish I lived near you: I would've bought that entire box!

Home made golden foil ticket! That's something my mom would've helped me make, too.

[hoodooznoodooz]

So I rewatched. I'm more inclined now to believe that it's the editing that leads you to believe that Marissa is cackling over how pissed CF is. She could be laughing about anything. She also seems to laugh simply because she is pretty drunk.

Also CF is really taking the "jokes" at face value. Most people would realize that friends will embellish and exaggerate in order to get the laugh. But CF seems to think that Marissa's jokes are really implying that CF is a pedophile. Having said that, Marissa should have stopped once she noticed how aloof CF had become.

I think it's pretty cool that no matter how chic, wealthy, connected or aristocratic these women, no matter how many Birkins they own, many wear these very basic woolen hats.

What? Beaulieu is pronounced Byoo Lee? Isn't it of French origin?

[RCharter]

The question was not whether we laugh, but whether it's kind to do so in their faces. Anyway, I'm happy to agree to disagree.

Of course, agree to disagree...and I get your point.  But at least for me, its better if someone addresses a joke to my face.  And I would say a joke in someone's face if I meant it to be a joke, and if I had any ill intent I would say it behind their back.  I realize that may just be me.  And maybe its because joking with someone is how I show I like them.  I've always said that if I like someone I'll talk shit to their face...if I can't stand someone I just have nothing to say to them or I'll be over the top polite.  For me, its generally when I like someone that I'm inclined to joke with them.

 

Certainly agree though that the same joke three times would certainly be annoying, and in the right context I could see it sending a message.

[RCharter]

Eh, I think it's a bit different since the Carolines have known each other for a long time. Besides, Caroline S. doesn't seem like the type of person who will do something she really doesn't want to do. She probably saw it as camera time and a chance to be the center of attention.

 

Personally, going from "cougar" to what seemed like pedophilia jokes was a pretty big jump. Caroline F's reaction was pretty clear, but I think that she didn't make a big deal about it in the moment. Can you imagine if it were Juliet or Julie? Or one of the RHs?

Well, I think Caroline S has her own insecurities, and if everyone is focused on her and telling her what to do.  Especially if they are people she sees as being on her social level she may not feel as bold as she does with the Americans.  You notice she didn't have a word to say about Caroline F. when they were doing handstands NYE.  Caroline F. is a baronness, and I feel that trumps a lady (a lady earl is a lady right?)

 

 

Also CF is really taking the "jokes" at face value. Most people would realize that friends will embellish and exaggerate in order to get the laugh. But CF seems to think that Marissa's jokes are really implying that CF is a pedophile. Having said that, Marissa should have stopped once she noticed how aloof CF had become.

 

 

Exactly, the joke is in the exaggeration.  When I would joke about Chris Hansen popping out of a corner when I was on a date with a guy 10 years my junior I knew I wasn't dating some 12 year old kid, but I knew I was dating a guy who was a lot younger. 

[HunterHunted]

McQueen mention tonight! And thank goodness. I was beginning to forget that Annabelle was so close to him.

I don't think I would mind her mentioning McQueen of she didn't continually remind us he was her best friend. I always want someone to ask her if Alexander knew that. I think he was friends with her, but he certainly wouldn't name Annabelle as his best friend. The deaths of Isabella Blow and especially his mother sent him down a very dark path. This is a very mean thought but if Annabelle had died rather than his mother, I'm pretty sure McQueen would be alive today.

I have no sympathy for Caroline S. She was sitting in her office agonizing over the finances of her business with a Swarofski encrusted phone. I just wanted to scream at her. This is why her business is failing. She has a posh office in London that she just did a glamorous remodel a couple of years ago rather than actually investing it into the business by improving processes, increasing efficiency, or eliminating waste. If the investors want to figure out where the money went, they should look at the bowl of jelly tots next to the bedazzled phone which is reflecting the glow from the neon sign on the wall.

Julie should take a page from Lisa Vanderpump. Lisa is probably worried about how successful her restaurants are. However, we only ever see Lisa working on things that proactively improve the restaurants, like remodeling and new menu tastings. If we saw Julie meeting with event planners on expanding the types of events they have at Mapperton to include more conferences, art exhibits, food and wine or film festivals, Julie wouldn't seem so harried and desperate. Or if we saw her meeting with the local government to try get a rudimentary tourism program together. Or a food festival with all of the best restaurants in the region and maybe a famous chef from London. I can't say enough about Julie's horrible hair color. It was the same color as her bowling shirt.

[balshureen]

This website has pictures of the younger boyfriend.  

 

http://www.seoghoer.dk/nyheder/caroline-fleming-atter-single

 

It looks like the Danish equivalent of the Daily Mail, so take that for what it's worth.

 

I know he probably isn't used to being followed by paparazzi, but he doesn't look that into her in either of those pictures.  I don't like to judge just from pictures,  however, he does look a little "douchey" as Marissa put it.

Edited October 19, 2015 by balshureen

[RCharter]

Not only does he not look that into her, he really isn't that attractive.....his heart must be huge, and he must know how to use it well.

 

I mean I give a pass for people not doing PDA's and smiling 100% of the time, but he looks like he found out she spit in his bowl of cornflakes.

[izabella]

He's sporting the emo Jon Mayer look. 

[RCharter]

He looks like a moody art student who is in desperate need of a bloody steak and a sun bed.

 

He's sporting the emo Jon Mayer look. 

He looks like he has a closet full of skinny jeans and a drawer full of eyeliner somewhere.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Me thinks she was hyper sensitive bout the child molester jokes cuz she has quite the history of liking young dudes & they seem to get younger & younger & younger.  Maybe Marissa wasn't so far off.  Is that baby crying somewhere her next bf?

[biakbiak]

This dude is 7 to8 years older than the last dude who have had a kid with.

[NewDigs]

Maybe I just didn't notice before but I wish Julie would stop talking with her big huge man-hands! Too harsh? Maybe, but they are not her best feature to display front and center.

CarolineS is ridiculous. I don't believe for a minute she is feeling nearly the remorse that she is expressing. And that ridiculous phone! Swarovski? (Thanks HunterHunted) Way to watch the finances, genius.

Surprised to see a Duck boat. For some reason I thought those things had been mothballed because of so many accidents.

CarolineF seems just too-too. As in too too fake.

Tub scene? Another take on ridiculous.

This show is turning into oddly pieced together contrivances, imho.

[Valentine]

 

Maybe I am so beaten down by the just awful Housewives. (so my bar for a new reality show is low?) Christ, no tacky, ignorant, and narrowminded Vicki woo hooing or telling workers no scratchy the woody. No Ramona and Tamra stupidly mispronouncing things. No Joisey accents with loser adult kids living at home. No Kim Z horrific plastic doll surgery. No Brandi graphic bodily function talk. No flaunting religion and excessive praying and thanking Jeebus. No stripper classes with pole dancing. No hitting or throwing things at people...yet. No crimes being committed...yet. 

 

I do want more house, lifestyle, and London & surroundings porn, though. And I was turned off by the bowling with silly wigs event. It was veering too close to tacky Housewife territory with formulaic contrived gathering in order to behave like ridiculous mean girl teenagers.

 

Even though I don't intend it, I always seem to find myself on someone's side in those wretched Housewives feuds. Maybe because the sides change so often here, I just do not care. It's a nice break. I also appreciate the lack of tacky.

 

There are some really beautiful shots of London on this show. Like you, I want to see more of that. 

[FozzyBear]

I thought Marissa's joke was dumb and uncalled for and she should have cooled it. But I wasn't 100% sure she realized she was upsetting CarolineF until the end of the night. Marissa wasn't there yet when Caroline tried to avoid the Cougar shirt (for the record I would have been more pissed at Juliet over strong arming me into that shirt than anything else) and Caroline's back was to Marissa when Marissa made the first joke so I'm not sure she was clued into how upset she was until the joke during the group picture. On the other hand, Marissa stated that she met the boyfriend and didn't like him (I guessing the "he's an old soul" thing is bullshit and he's actually an annoying party boy who's good in bed) so I do think there was some underlying tension to her jokes from the get-go. On the third hand, I was surprised at how upset Caroline got. It makes me wonder if her above it all barefoot baroness thing is actually just an act.

[RCharter]

I thought Marissa's joke was dumb and uncalled for and she should have cooled it. But I wasn't 100% sure she realized she was upsetting CarolineF until the end of the night. Marissa wasn't there yet when Caroline tried to avoid the Cougar shirt (for the record I would have been more pissed at Juliet over strong arming me into that shirt than anything else) and Caroline's back was to Marissa when Marissa made the first joke so I'm not sure she was clued into how upset she was until the joke during the group picture. On the other hand, Marissa stated that she met the boyfriend and didn't like him (I guessing the "he's an old soul" thing is bullshit and he's actually an annoying party boy who's good in bed) so I do think there was some underlying tension to her jokes from the get-go. On the third hand, I was surprised at how upset Caroline got. It makes me wonder if her above it all barefoot baroness thing is actually just an act.

I think its an act, the same way "we're European and we're not as sensitive as you Americans" is also an act.  Both of the Caroline's have shown that they don't necessarily get over anything quicker than anyone else.

[izabella]

I think its an act, the same way "we're European and we're not as sensitive as you Americans" is also an act.  Both of the Caroline's have shown that they don't necessarily get over anything quicker than anyone else.

 

Annabelle, too.

[NewDigs]

Bolding mine

I thought Marissa's joke was dumb and uncalled for and she should have cooled it. But I wasn't 100% sure she realized she was upsetting CarolineF until the end of the night. Marissa wasn't there yet when Caroline tried to avoid the Cougar shirt (for the record I would have been more pissed at Juliet over strong arming me into that shirt than anything else) and Caroline's back was to Marissa when Marissa made the first joke so I'm not sure she was clued into how upset she was until the joke during the group picture. On the other hand, Marissa stated that she met the boyfriend and didn't like him (I guessing the "he's an old soul" thing is bullshit and he's actually an annoying party boy who's good in bed) so I do think there was some underlying tension to her jokes from the get-go. On the third hand, I was surprised at how upset Caroline got. It makes me wonder if her above it all barefoot baroness thing is actually just an act.

Maybe I saw this episode out of order but I thought the Cougar shirt came after Marissa's first, to me, ill advised cougar "jokes" that weren't much more than shots at CarolineF. Were all of the cougar-shots at the lanes? I was thinking Marissa started her jabs elsewhere.

I was surprised that CF didn't go ballistic when she was handed that shirt!

Like you, I considered the shirt to be the more egregious of the actions.

[biakbiak]

"All" of Marissa cougar jokes (which were three comments) we were shown were at the bowling alley. She is shown telling her husband the jokes and talking about in reaction to the fight.