Green Arrow In Comics

[lemotomato]

I think Percy is a shit writer (werewolf!AIDS Oliver? "Pretty Bird snuggles"?) so I'm glad he doesn't like Felicity because I don't want him anywhere near her. 

[BkWurm1]

41 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

I think Percy is a shit writer (werewolf!AIDS Oliver? "Pretty Bird snuggles"?) so I'm glad he doesn't like Felicity because I don't want him anywhere near her. 

Yeah, I was willing to see what he'd do with the reboot rebirth but he actually lost me, not when he got to the "Pretty Bird Snuggles", but when he basically had Oliver listen when someone (I think BC) told him that in order to fight crime effectively, he had to give up all his money because otherwise  he was part of the problem when he was fighting against "the Man".  Confirmed everything I'd taken from Percy's "Oliver is now a werewolf" story line.  Just a huge logic fail.  

[bijoux]

2 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Isn't Tommy Merlyn the traditional Dark Archer in the comics?  

From what I've ead around these parts, yes.

[Morrigan2575]

7 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Isn't Tommy Merlyn the traditional Dark Archer in the comics?  

The traditional Dark Archer (pre Flashpoint) is Arthur King AKA Merlyn The Magician. In Nu52 they introduced Tommy Merlyn as the Dark Archer. 

In the Barrowman comics, he linked Malcolm Merlyn to Arthur King (identity) to legitimize Malcolm as THE Dark Archer.

Edited January 7, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[BkWurm1]

15 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

The traditional Dark Archer (pre Flashpoint) is Arthur King AKA Merlyn The Magician. In Nu52 they introduced Tommy Merlyn as the Dark Archer. 

In the Barrowman comics, he linked Malcolm Merlyn to Arthur King (identity) to legitimize Malcolm as THE Dark Archer.

I'd forgotten that.  

[tv echo]

On 1/3/2017 at 10:52 AM, tv echo said:

Estimated comics sold to North American comics shops as reported by Diamond Comic Distributors...

August 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-08.html

September 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-09.html

October 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-10.html

November 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-11.html

(December 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures - not yet posted.)

Sales right before and after Rebirth (Green Arrow: Rebirth #1 and Green Arrow #1 were released on June 1 and 15...

May 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-05.html

Quote

94    Green Arrow    52    $2.99    DC    20,559

June 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-06.html

Quote

19    Green Arrow Rebirth    1*    $2.99    DC    81,760
.  .  .
33    Green Arrow        1*    $2.99    DC    69,833

July 2016 Comic Book Sales Figures
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-07.html

Quote

34    Green Arrow    3*    $2.99    DC    72,864
35    Green Arrow    2*    $2.99    DC    72,849

Edited January 13, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Somehow this doesn't surprise me...

Benjamin Percy On Tackling James Bond
Posted by Dan Wickline January 12, 2017
https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/01/12/benjamin-percy-tackling-james-bond/

Quote

Benjamin Percy is an experience writer having made his name on novels, short stories, essays, comic books and screenplays. While in the midst of his critically acclaimed run on Green Arrow, the Oregon native has taken on a new project… James Bond. I spoke to Percy about his familiarity with the iconic spy and the direction he’s going in James Bond: Black Box for Dynamite Entertainment. Cover by John Cassaday, interiors by Rapha Lobosco.

[thegirlsleuth]

December comic sales are in:

Green Arrow 12:  38,515

Green Arrow 13: 37,365

So it will be back to its pre-Rebirth numbers in 4 - 5 months? Schadenfreude is fun!

[lemotomato]

13 minutes ago, thegirlsleuth said:

December comic sales are in:

Green Arrow 12:  38,515

Green Arrow 13: 37,365

So it will be back to its pre-Rebirth numbers in 4 - 5 months? Schadenfreude is fun!

Another 10% drop, 3 months in a row. They'll be down to 23k in May, which would 2.5k more than they sold last May, pre-reboot (looking at @tv echo's post)

[kismet]

So basically they reboot, that brings in new or returning eyes - the product is meh and people walk away. A few months later that try a new reboot/rebirth. Good business strategy, at least I know where the rinse/repeat philosophy comes from. You would think they would look at the pattern and try to fix it on a creative/quality control level. But its probably just the fan's fault that they are not buying the product (or that is how to they logic their losses).

[tv echo]

15 hours ago, thegirlsleuth said:

December comic sales are in:

Green Arrow 12:  38,515

Green Arrow 13: 37,365

So it will be back to its pre-Rebirth numbers in 4 - 5 months? Schadenfreude is fun!

Source link: http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2016/2016-12.html

[Primal Slayer]

3 hours ago, kismet said:

So basically they reboot, that brings in new or returning eyes - the product is meh and people walk away. A few months later that try a new reboot/rebirth. Good business strategy, at least I know where the rinse/repeat philosophy comes from. You would think they would look at the pattern and try to fix it on a creative/quality control level. But its probably just the fan's fault that they are not buying the product (or that is how to they logic their losses).

That's just how comics work nowadays. It's why Marvel is obessed with #1s like no other. Especially with the internet now, it is basically the way of the neilson system.

[apinknightmare]

DC just tweeted this out:

The Arrow and the Canary: The Not-So-Secret History of Oliver Queen and Dinah Lance

Quote

The fact is this: Despite their wild ups, downs, reunions and departures, both Ollie and Dinah have grown over the years into forces that balance one another out. With nearly 50 years of shared history, they’ve sunk into one another’s bones.

What is it with these people and bones? OMG.

[lemotomato]

Apparently boning each other is all they've done in this reboot, so...

[Chaser]

Arrow Haters: Romance Sucks! Soap Opera Drama Destoyed Everything!

DC Comics: Guys, I think we need to add some Romance. Throw back in GA and BC. 

DC Comices: Totes Rebirth as a success.

Arrow: Throws Olicity on the back burner. Avoids romance at all costs.

Arrow: Rating go down. Social Media is quiet.

[lemotomato]

Since the loudest complainers were the Because Comics sites and fans, it's clear that it wasn't romance on the show they had a problem with, but who Oliver was romancing. The vitriol against the show/Olicity/Felicity only ramped up when it became clear that she wasn't going to be just a notch in the post/speed bump on the road to a GA/BC endgame. 

Edited January 15, 2017 by lemotomato

[Chaser]

I agree. I'm just mocking the sentiment. 

If DC Comics took anything from Arrow, it's that Romance is a good thing.

[Velocity23]

Makes me wonder if that "iconic" couple needs so much push. And DC is not happy with the sales. 

[Primal Slayer]

GA is fine with the sales. They knew how sales would go. An online article isnt going to push anything.

[statsgirl]

Do we know that DC is not happy with the sales, or is that an assumption?  And if DC is happy with those results, then

Spoiler

why the big push to create a new Black Canary who isn't even Dinah Laurel Lance?

Personally I'd prefer it if they weren't happy because I have the feeling that Felicity as we know her will be gone when the show is and I think she's the best female comic character because anybody could be her, you don't have to be a martial arts expert and wear a mask.

Edited January 15, 2017 by statsgirl

[Chaser]

I dont understand comic sales. I don't see how a comic losing 10% of sales a month is considered a good thing. It's an on going, connected story. A drop should be expected but you would think the sales would even out to be a consistent number.

[Primal Slayer]

Of course they would want the sales to continue to be higher but overall Rebirth has already been a big win for them, but history repeats itself with every reboot. The same titles drop in sales while the big 3 (Bats/Supes/JL) are usually top sellers with some of the surprise hits (Harley)

[statsgirl]

How is it a big win for DC when they've lost more than half of their buyers in 6 months, and it's still trending downwards?

[Primal Slayer]

1 minute ago, Chaser said:

I dont understand comic sales. I don't see how a comic losing 10% of sales a month is considered a good thing. It's an on going, connected story. A drop should be expected but you would think the sales would even out to be a consistent number.

This is also DCs first big foray into pushing a lot titles to bi-weeklys. Sales at the beginning are always highest because people still think that #1s will be valuable one day. But with people being able to buy comics online, trades becoming more and more popular, and illegal downloads being a huge thing, that is the norm for majoirty of comics now. As long as they balance out at the 30k-40k mark, will they considered as being fine. 

[Primal Slayer]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

How is it a big win for DC when they've lost more than half of their buyers in 6 months, and it's still trending downwards?

It generated a lot of positive buzz, their comics are getting good reviews and the sales were huge at the beginning. They spent 3 months in a row beating Marvel which Marvel has been #1 for a hot minute. 

[wonderwall]

5 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

This is also DCs first big foray into pushing a lot titles to bi-weeklys. Sales at the beginning are always highest because people still think that #1s will be valuable one day. But with people being able to buy comics online, trades becoming more and more popular, and illegal downloads being a huge thing, that is the norm for majoirty of comics now. As long as they balance out at the 30k-40k mark, will they considered as being fine. 

Trend wise they don't seem like they'll balance out at 30k-40k? They're still losing 10% of its audience every month and the loss doesn't seem to be slowing down. So it's tough to say whether they're fine. We'll have to wait and see. But as of right now, if the trend continues it doesn't look good at all... 

I also doubt the people who purchased the comics legally in the first place would drop it and suddenly download/purchase it illegally. That just makes no sense. 

Edited January 15, 2017 by wonderwall

[Morrigan2575]

11 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

I also doubt the people who purchased the comics legally in the first place would drop it and suddenly download/purchase it illegally. That just makes no sense. 

Speaking as a comic reader, they wouldn't, they may drop the title from their lineup but, they wouldn't go the illegal download route. 

Edited January 15, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[Primal Slayer]

Looking back at previous sales, GA seems to balance out in the 20k mark which this one will probably do eventually. But its Rebirth numbers are still better then its New52 numbers back when it was monthly. It is pulling in more now shipping twice a month back when it was shipping once a month, thats a win. DC is asking people to spend more money and its a tough market, the public will drop you fast and move on to the next thing and come back for crossovers or when a new #1 drops.

[Primal Slayer]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Speaking as a comic reader, they wouldn't, they may drop the title from their lineup but, they wouldn't go the illegal download route. 

I am a comic reader and I have seen plenty of comic readers who can't afford all the comics they would like to due to money issues and turning to an alternate form of getting the comics they want. If you are someone who likes to have each and every issue the same then yeah you probably wont jump from one to the other but the ones that are more flexible will go between the two depending on the comic, what is going on in an upcoming issue, etc.

[Velocity23]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

GA is fine with the sales. They knew how sales would go. An online article isnt going to push anything.

Was just funny seeing DC comics tweeting about the new GA rebirth 3 times in a row. No such dedication for other issues. 

[lemotomato]

3 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

It generated a lot of positive buzz, their comics are getting good reviews and the sales were huge at the beginning. They spent 3 months in a row beating Marvel which Marvel has been #1 for a hot minute. 

If by "a hot minute" you mean October, November, and probably December if the trend continues, then sure. And Marvel didn't have to reboot to get back on top. In fact, Marvel was first in market share all of 2016 except for those 3 months.

Edited January 15, 2017 by lemotomato

[dtissagirl]

2 hours ago, wonderwall said:

I also doubt the people who purchased the comics legally in the first place would drop it and suddenly download/purchase it illegally. That just makes no sense. 

I've done that a whole bunch of times. LOL.

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

I've done that a whole bunch of times. LOL.

Shame, shame. I know your name.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[dtissagirl]

Sometimes I buy it and then get a copy off the ~alternate places on top of it so I can fanart it.

[wonderwall]

16 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

I've done that a whole bunch of times. LOL.

How.dare.you.

[dtissagirl]

...How do you guys figure I watch the foreign tv show that is the subject of this forum. LOL.

[wonderwall]

3 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

...How do you guys figure I watch the foreign tv show that is the subject of this forum. LOL.

Arrow is fineee it's just a TV show but this is the COMICS we're talking about! The holy grail D: 

[Primal Slayer]

1 hour ago, lemotomato said:

If by "a hot minute" you mean October, November, and probably December if the trend continues, then sure. And Marvel didn't have to reboot to get back on top.

By a hot minute, i sarcastically mean they have been on top for a good while which is why DC beating them for even 3 months is good.  Marvel doesn't really reboot as they restart everything a thousand times and do events out the ass. DC doesn't try to do the "All New All Different Superman" like Marvel loves to do. 

53 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

Arrow is fineee it's just a TV show but this is the COMICS we're talking about! The holy grail D: 

Well if it weren't for the comics, we wouldn't be here talking any of this. 

[wonderwall]

4 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Well if it weren't for the comics, we wouldn't be here talking any of this. 

I know. Comic stans never let me forget it :P

Anyways it was just a joke so....

Edited January 15, 2017 by wonderwall

[Primal Slayer]

Ok.

[lemotomato]

If we're going with how much we owe the comics, let's be more specific. If it weren't for Christopher Nolan and his version of Batman, we wouldn't be here. If Berlanti had tried to sell the comics version of GA as a TV show, he'd have been laughed out of the room.

"It's gonna be great! See, he's got the classic Robin Hood thing going for him, the iconic pointy hat and green tights. And his facial hair-- really distinctive! Oh, and his love interest totally rocks the short shorts and fishnets look. Her super power is screaming at people! Hey, where are you going? Guys?"

Edited January 16, 2017 by lemotomato

[LeighAn]

13 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

If we're going with how much we owe the comics, let's be more specific. If it weren't for Christopher Nolan and his version of Batman, we wouldn't be here. If Berlanti had tried to sell the comics version of GA as a TV show, he'd have been laughed out of the room.

Haha Yep Arrow owes way way way more to Christopher Nolan then they ever owe to the comics. 

[Primal Slayer]

1 hour ago, lemotomato said:

If we're going with how much we owe the comics, let's be more specific. If it weren't for Christopher Nolan and his version of Batman, we wouldn't be here. If Berlanti had tried to sell the comics version of GA as a TV show, he'd have been laughed out of the room.

"It's gonna be great! See, he's got the classic Robin Hood thing going for him, the iconic pointy hat and green tights. And his facial hair-- really distinctive! Oh, and his love interest totally rocks a short shirts and fishnets look. Her super power is screaming at people! Hey, where are you going? Guys?"

As if they would ever try to sell that. Arrows costume would still be the same, just as Batman didnt go into the 90s wearing his undies and costume made up of spandex. Especially considering Green Arrow had already been adapted to Smallville wearing not a robin hood outfit. Of course Nolan helped get the show off the ground and inspire the Arrow that came out, hell they practically plagiarized the movies but lets not act as if the character would've even been adapted if he werent somewhat popular. The concept didn't appear out of thin air.

55 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Haha Yep Arrow owes way way way more to Christopher Nolan then they ever owe to the comics. 

Without the comics, Arrow wouldnt exist period. Berlanti and crew wouldn't have come up with "hey lets do a rip off of Batman who dresses in a hood, was deserted on an island and shoots arrows, sounds like a winning combo!"

[wonderwall]

10 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Without the comics, Arrow wouldnt exist period. Berlanti and crew wouldn't have come up with "hey lets do a rip off of Batman who dresses in a hood, was deserted on an island and shoots arrows, sounds like a winning combo!"

... I think we all know this? It's simple logic lol

Edited January 16, 2017 by wonderwall

[Delphi]

4 hours ago, dtissagirl said:

I've done that a whole bunch of times. LOL.

Also cbr files is a fantastic way of reading certain stories without having to go through an entire closet  (yes I have a dedicated closet) to find the right issues and read them in the right order. 

[tv echo]

20 hours ago, apinknightmare said:

DC just tweeted this out:

The Arrow and the Canary: The Not-So-Secret History of Oliver Queen and Dinah Lance

What is it with these people and bones? OMG.

Also note the following quote from the above-cited article, which admits to the comics being a "soap opera" but is totally fine with it...

Quote

Theirs is a romance shaped over decades and across the Multiverse, but like most matters of the heart, it hasn’t always been easy or simple. The ravages of time, reinvention and crises (both cosmic and moral) have made Ollie and Dinah’s love story read more like a super heroic soap opera than a Romeo and Juliet tale—which, if you ask me, is pretty befitting of a modern day Robin Hood and a rock star.

Edited January 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

This is not going to help comics sales...

UPDATED: Confirmed -- New York Times drops graphic novel, manga bestseller lists; others pared back, eliminated
by John Jackson Miller   Jan. 25, 2017
http://blog.comichron.com/2017/01/whither-new-york-times-graphic-novel.html

Quote

Since the New York Times added graphic novels to its bestseller lists several years ago, comics creators and publishers have had an additional chance for exposure; I was pleased to have made the softcover graphic novel list myself at one point. This Wednesday, however, publishing professionals who get peeks in advance began reporting that a number of cutbacks to several categories have taken place as of the Feb. 5 report — including elimination of the hardcover and softcover graphic novel lists and the manga list.

Bombshell Confirmed: Comics will no longer have NY Times Bestseller Lists
01/26/2017 9:58 AM BY ALEXANDER LU 
http://www.comicsbeat.com/bombshell-graphic-novels-no-longer-worthy-of-a-ny-times-bestseller-list-rumor/

Quote

According to an email subscription version of February 5th’s NY Times Best Sellers List, “Beginning with the advance BSL edition that will be delivered today for February 5, 2017 there will be revisions to multiple categories in the publication. These changes will span weekly and monthly lists.” One of these changes appears to be the deletion of the hardcover graphic novels, softcover graphic novels, and manga Best Seller lists, as none of these sections are included in the document that we have reviewed.

The stunning reason why the NY Times eliminated comics-related bestseller lists
01/26/2017 3:20 PM BY ALEXANDER LU 
http://www.comicsbeat.com/the-stunning-reason-why-the-ny-times-eliminated-comics-related-bestseller-lists/

Quote

When asked for comment on why specific lists, including those related to comics and manga, were removed, the Times said that “the discontinued lists did not reach or resonate with many readers. This change allows us to expand our coverage of these books in ways that we think will better serve readers and attract new audiences to the genres.”

Edited February 4, 2017 by tv echo

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, tv echo said:

When asked for comment on why specific lists, including those related to comics and manga, were removed, the Times said that “the discontinued lists did not reach or resonate with many readers. This change allows us to expand our coverage of these books in ways that we think will better serve readers and attract new audiences to the genres.”

So they are saying that even the top sellers didn't have that many readers?  Or at least that their readers didn't give a hoot?

[LeighAn]

Haha classic.

[EmilyBettFan]

On 1/15/2017 at 1:59 PM, Primal Slayer said:

Looking back at previous sales, GA seems to balance out in the 20k mark which this one will probably do eventually. But its Rebirth numbers are still better then its New52 numbers back when it was monthly. It is pulling in more now shipping twice a month back when it was shipping once a month, thats a win. DC is asking people to spend more money and its a tough market, the public will drop you fast and move on to the next thing and come back for crossovers or when a new #1 drops.

Going by what you said before though wouldn't people then illegally download New52 so those numbers they had could've been higher? Because you're giving that logic to rebirth only.

Edited February 4, 2017 by EmilyBettFan