Green Arrow In Comics

[BkWurm1]

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He doesn't have a sister that's been mentioned, but he does have a son, Conner Hawke.  

Actually Emiko is his sister, daughter of Shado and Robert.  

Edited July 6, 2017 by BkWurm1

[statsgirl]

2 hours ago, johntfs said:

Presumably Thea is also a bit broke since wasn't Merlyn living in a shitty apartment prior to the finale due to having no actual money?

Malcolm secreted away some money, I assume, but since he "died" during the Undertaking, as his only living child Thea inherited the Merlyn estate which was how she could afford the loft and to buy Verdant in s3.

[bijoux]

Was Malcolm's shitty apartment featured on LoT? Because I don't remember it from Arrow.

[statsgirl]

I think he's referring to the end of this season of LoT when they returned Malcolm to the true timeline.  I never saw it on Arrow.

[tv echo]

EXCLUSIVE: Ragman Returns to Gotham City in New DC Comics Miniseries
07.11.2017  by Albert Ching
http://www.cbr.com/ragman-gotham-city-new-dc-comics-miniseries/

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Given Ragman’s unique powers — which are commonly depicted as derived from the souls that his patchwork suit has absorbed — he wasn’t necessarily a natural choice to show up on The CW’s relatively grounded DC Comics-based Arrow, but nonetheless he was a recurring character in the show’s recently wrapped fifth season, as played by Joe Dinicol.

DC Comics looks to continue the character’s momentum with a new miniseries scheduled for release in October, and CBR has the first details. The six-issue Ragman series will be written by Ray Fawkes (a writer/artist known for his creator-owned work including The People Inside, along with multiple Batman family credits including the Batman Eternal team) and illustrated by Inaki Miranda (most recently seen on Harley Quinn) and colored by Eva de la Cruz (Catwoman, Survivors’ Club), with covers by Guillem March (Gotham City Sirens, Catwoman).

The upcoming Ragman miniseries looks to plant the character firmly in Gotham City, which feels like a natural setting given Fawkes’ experience on the Bat-books. Here’s DC’s official description of the series, the first comic to feature Ragman in a starring role since 2010’s Ragman: Suit of Souls one-shot:

War vet Rory Regan is plagued by the death of his time after a failed mission to find a hidden treasure in the Israeli desert. While battling survivor’s guilt back home in Gotham City, Regan discovers that he actually bought the treasure back home with him, in the form of the Suit of Souls. The Suit of Souls has the ability to trap and collect the souls of others, including those of his dead partners.

With the aid of his dead teammates, Rory begins to learn more about the abilities of the suit, when something evil begins to brew in Gotham. An evil demon from hell wants the Suit of Souls, and is sending his minions to retrieve it for him. Now Rory must learn how to use the suit and its powers to stop these evil forces from invading Gotham City before it’s too late.

Edited July 12, 2017 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

That artwork looks pretty cool.  

[BkWurm1]

This just proves to me that it was the actor I liked, not the conceit behind his power, lol.  

[tv echo]

June 2017 GA comic book sales numbers have been posted...

June 2017 Comic Book Sales to Comics Shops
Estimated Comics Shipped to North American Comics Shops
Based on Reports from Diamond Comic Distributors
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2017/2017-06.html

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Units    Dollars    Comic-book Title    Issue    Price    Pub.    Est. units
*  *  *
85          126    Green Arrow                     24       $2.99    DC       27,737
*  *  *
87            87    Green Arrow                     25       $3.99    DC       27,388

To compare, here were the May 2017 GA comic book sales numbers:
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2017/2017-05.html

Quote

85          114    Green Arrow                      22       $2.99    DC      28,931
*  *  *
88          116    Green Arrow                      23       $2.99    DC      28,291

Edited July 17, 2017 by tv echo

[statsgirl]

Lol at the fact that they have to keep rebooting to get people to buy them again.

My hat's off to those 20,000 - 25,000 fans who just don't give up.

Edited July 17, 2017 by statsgirl

[LeighAn]

And correct me if I'm wrong but are these numbers of comics purchased by fans at comic stores or are these numbers of comic stores purchasing comics to resell?

 

Because if it's just what the stores have brought then there's no garunteeing that all 25,000 ish comics actually were sold to 25,000 ish fans.

[EmilyBettFan]

I hadn't ever bought comics before but when they had Diggle and Felicity in the new 52 I was there in a heartbeat! I even bought doubles as giveaways! Now they lost a customer after they took away Felicity. I even bought the bombshells with little Felicity in it.

[statsgirl]

Same here, to both the Diggle & Felicity comics and the Bombshells.

[EmilyBettFan]

9 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Same here, to both the Diggle & Felicity comics and the Bombshells.

I also forgot I bought Flash when Felicity was in them. 

[Morrigan2575]

4 hours ago, LeighAn said:

And correct me if I'm wrong but are these numbers of comics purchased by fans at comic stores or are these numbers of comic stores purchasing comics to resell?

I think it's the number purchased by stores. Of course most stores probably have a good feel for how much of each title they will sell.

[BkWurm1]

I'll be curious to see if there is any kind of bump when GA meets [fill in the blank].  Those crossovers seemed like a numbers grab, but will they work?

[tv echo]

BARRY & OLLIE On the Case In GREEN ARROW #27
By Newsarama Staff  July 14, 2017 
https://www.newsarama.com/35357-barry-ollie-on-the-case-in-green-arrow-27.html?sf98589235=1 

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The Flash in for a team-up, with Wonder Woman waiting in the wings with this preview of next week's Green Arrow #27.

GREEN ARROW #27
Written by BENJAMIN PERCY
Art by JAMAL CAMPBELL
Cover by OTTO SCHMIDT
Variant cover by ESAD RIBIC
“HARD TRAVELING HERO” part two! Oliver Queen is a pillar of morality. A champion of ethics. The essence of truth. Or at least he thought so. The self-described people’s hero Green Arrow crosses paths with the Justice League’s real paragon of virtue, Wonder Woman, when his cross-country fight against the Ninth Circle puts both heroes’ muscle and mettle to the ultimate test.
On sale JULY 19 • 32 pg, FC, $2.99 US • RATED T+

Edited July 18, 2017 by tv echo

[leopardprint]

1 hour ago, tv echo said:

Quote

Oliver Queen is a pillar of morality. A champion of ethics. The essence of truth. Or at least he thought so. 

Edited 1 hour ago by tv echo.

?

[BkWurm1]

4 hours ago, tv echo said:

Oliver Queen is a pillar of morality. A champion of ethics. The essence of truth.

Sounds like a prig. ;)

[quarks]

[/prohat]  Diamond publishes store orders, not hard unit sales. 

However, for comics, those numbers aren't all inclusive - they don't include sales through Walmart, for instance, or for certain distribution channels like Scholastic.

[BkWurm1]

4 hours ago, quarks said:

[/prohat]  Diamond publishes store orders, not hard unit sales. 

However, for comics, those numbers aren't all inclusive - they don't include sales through Walmart, for instance, or for certain distribution channels like Scholastic.

Or the digital sales, right?  But the number still remains an interesting bellwether to watch.  

[quarks]

12 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Or the digital sales, right?  But the number still remains an interesting bellwether to watch.  

Right.  

[tv echo]

[Primal Slayer]

3 hours ago, wonderwall said:

Just out of curiosity... Did that version of the comics where Superman was dating WW have Lois Lane in it? I'm just trying to figure why you think that they wouldn't. Was it in the writing? IDK saying that they wouldn't have isn't really a great argument because that's a claim that's hard to support unless the writers told the audience what direction they were going in or it was blatant in the writing.

Again it's just out of curiosity.

Yes Lois was featured in the Superman comics. The thing is, these characters have been around for over 70 years and Superman always ends up getting with Lois Lane somehow or someway which is what made me think that SM/WW wouldn't be together past the dating phase. DC is not about making big changes, the one big change they did they've gone back and reversed it with Barry Allen since they are more interested in the most iconic versions of the characters. Superman and Lois have dated other people throughout the decades (Lois dated Bruce Wayne briefly in STAS). Superman/WW have had romances throughout the decades as well but it is something that never goes far. Even in the major Elsewhere stores, they get together after Lois has died but she still remains the love of his life.  These aren't new characters where it is hard to see what DC will do with them.

3 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Or what I'd call just another version of canon.  The New 52 changed things to the way they wanted them to be, the implication being that it would have still been going on if the numbers had stayed high enough.  It's not like they wrote the Sm/WW pairing as a way for Clark to fall for Lois.  It wasn't a Ray vs Oliver set up. They took Lois out of Supe's romantic arc altogether.  And I get it, pairing two characters already in the thick of the action would simplify writing.  Personally, I always felt it removed a crucial level of humanity from Superman's character if he's with another super powered character but I get the urge to pair like with like and skip the world building that would include Lois enough for her to be an option as a love interest.   The same urge to have a simple pairing is probably what put GA and BC together originally.  Hey, look, two characters happen to be there in each other's orbit and both are crime fighters, why not?   

But even if rebirth reset things, the New 52 run existed and was canon so chances are the question of Wonder Woman or Lois Lane isn't going to vanish.  It's a viable option from here out.  

They wanted to explore something different for SM/WW but all things lead back "home" for DC, its been that way for decades. There has to be a reason why DC went back to "basics" for Rebirth, Geoff said that fans felt disconnected from The New 52 and that Rebirth was a love letter to the fans.

I came back to them and I said, ‘What if I did a special that was [about the] DC Universe?'” he explained. “I could essentially take a look at the line as a whole, because I felt that there are things that made DC that were lost.”

What exactly was lost, according to Johns? “Legacy, open optimism, sense of history, most importantly relationships between characters,” he told me without missing a beat. “I felt that a lot of the heart for me had kind of gone missing. I wanted to try and restore it, and essentially make DC Universe Rebirth a love letter to the DC Universe and the fans and to everyone that loves these characters. ”

“I spent a lot of time thinking about what I missed in the DC Universe, and what I think the DNA of DC is, and how to bring some hope, optimism, and positivity, and point the compass in the right direction as far as heart goes,” Johns said. “That was the main goal for Rebirth.”

In other words, Rebirth is not a reboot. That is something that Johns has taken great pains to make clear. Rather, it is a course correction, a righting of the ship before it crashes into the rocky shoals ahead.

“I’ve never been a fan of reboots,” Johns declared. “I’ve never been a fan of erasing all history. I like using everything, and this was an opportunity to put all the pieces back on the board, with no limitations. I didn’t want to see rules like ‘No old characters,’ or ‘No one can be married.’ It just feels ridiculous to put rules on the DC Universe, because the DC Universe is way beyond rules.

http://nerdist.com/geoff-johns-is-on-a-mission-to-save-dc-comics/

 

Batman is not meant to be a happy go lucky guy just as Supes isn't meant to be a dark and broody guy, they've tried to change things up for characters and for some reason always go back to what made the characters work. 

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

 These aren't new characters where it is hard to see what DC will do with them.

I don't question what has happened in the past or even what they did this time, but they didn't just toss into the story line that Supes was going to date Wonder Woman on his way before turning to Lois.  They LAUNCHED a totally new reboot where Supes and WW were going to date and be in love.  They cleaned the slate and made press announcements and wrote that continuity into current animated features that had nothing to do with the New 52.  We can guess that it wasn't going to last, but there was nothing I read that suggested they were writing Supes with WW as a mere stepping stone to Lois.  They wrote Supes and WW as an epic couple, not just a place holder.  For all we really know, a slightly better sales result and we wouldn't see Lois dating Clark until the next reboot hit the comics.  As it is, that's pretty much what happened.  For all we know, the next reboot will go back to Supes and WW.  Can't rule it out since it's part of the many storylines that falls under the heading of canon.  

Edited July 27, 2017 by BkWurm1

[LeighAn]

When they announced the change to Superman/Wonder Woman didn't they even refer to it as the new status quo? Which suggests they intended it to be more permanent (and probably more popular) then it ended up being (on both counts)

 

Although this is one area where I tend to side with the "canon" argument just because I think Superman needs that touch with humanity and his romance with Lois I always felt was a good way of someone remarkable an out of this world recognising and loving the remarkable in someone human and ordinary who fights for justice in their own non powered ways. Superman/Wonder Woman just felt from the little I saw of making Superman remote and isolated from humanity because Wonder Woman is the only other person who can supposedly understand him. Plus I found the whole Wonder Woman is the only woman strong enough to take Superman seed made by comic frat boys on the internet as personally gross. 

 

But Superman/Wonder Woman IS canon and bringing it back to Green Arrow it seems like people treat comic canon as pick or choose based on what point they are trying to make. For instance comic fans spout GA/BC as canon and therefore Olicity exsisting means Arrow is a bastardisation of Green Arrow because he's not with Black Canary. But then there seems to be selective amnesia about the fact that Ollie cheated on Dinah, lied to Dinah and did various other shitty things to her in the course of their relationship. It's also canon that GA/BC are divorced, with other people or didn't know each other in different comic canons and they weren't in a romantic relationship in every canon therefore the idea that the only way to respect GA is by having him with BC romantically isn't accurate. 

 

I mean I always laugh that this is the actual comic "canon" reaction from the Justice League to Dinah and Ollie getting married:

 

I mean Ive seen comic fans post pics of Ollie proposing or Ollie and Dinah in their wedding attire on twitter to Olicity/Arrow tweets but not to many post this one haha. (By the way Bruce's reaction wins!)

[Primal Slayer]

New52 is the only canon where they didn't know each other after being together for over 25 years. Other then that they had dated/broken up/rinse repeat. And why would fans post that page when it comes to the characters getting married? I for one loved it and laughed over it but it wouldn't make sense to post it. And GA did cheat on BC but he was never as bad as what they did in the show with him being a serial cheater from what I can remember. But that is something the characters worked on and eventually moved on from after rebuilding their relationship, there was more good then there was bad which is why the two have fans.

I don't think anyone would deny that heroes can date other people since it happens all the time, will it stand the test of time? Probably not. SM/WW was selling fine along with JL so it certainly wasn't numbers that decided to change things with Rebirth. 

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, LeighAn said:

When they announced the change to Superman/Wonder Woman didn't they even refer to it as the new status quo? Which suggests they intended it to be more permanent (and probably more popular) then it ended up being (on both counts)

 

Although this is one area where I tend to side with the "canon" argument just because I think Superman needs that touch with humanity and his romance with Lois I always felt was a good way of someone remarkable an out of this world recognising and loving the remarkable in someone human and ordinary who fights for justice in their own non powered ways. Superman/Wonder Woman just felt from the little I saw of making Superman remote and isolated from humanity because Wonder Woman is the only other person who can supposedly understand him. Plus I found the whole Wonder Woman is the only woman strong enough to take Superman seed made by comic frat boys on the internet as personally gross. 

 

But Superman/Wonder Woman IS canon and bringing it back to Green Arrow it seems like people treat comic canon as pick or choose based on what point they are trying to make. For instance comic fans spout GA/BC as canon and therefore Olicity exsisting means Arrow is a bastardisation of Green Arrow because he's not with Black Canary. But then there seems to be selective amnesia about the fact that Ollie cheated on Dinah, lied to Dinah and did various other shitty things to her in the course of their relationship. It's also canon that GA/BC are divorced, with other people or didn't know each other in different comic canons and they weren't in a romantic relationship in every canon therefore the idea that the only way to respect GA is by having him with BC romantically isn't accurate. 

 

I mean I always laugh that this is the actual comic "canon" reaction from the Justice League to Dinah and Ollie getting married:

 

I mean Ive seen comic fans post pics of Ollie proposing or Ollie and Dinah in their wedding attire on twitter to Olicity/Arrow tweets but not to many post this one haha. (By the way Bruce's reaction wins!)

11

Ha!I love the "mostly" in the previous box as well.

[LeighAn]

10 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Ha!I love the "mostly" in the previous box as well.

Omg I didn't even notice that till you pointed that out haha ?

[tv echo]

From A.V. Club article linked in above tweet:

Quote

Oliver worked with The Flash to investigate speedster animals, faced domestic terrorism in Washington, D.C., with Wonder Woman, and in this week’s issue, he heads to Metropolis to confront Lex Luthor about his relationship with The Ninth Circle. This exclusive preview of Green Arrow #28 spotlights Lex Luthor’s powers of deduction, and he’s immediately able to piece together the hero’s recent changes by analyzing his appearance and weaponry. While Lex reads Oliver, Clark Kent is on the streets of Metropolis, inconspicuously stopping crime before grabbing a croissant. The pages are split between these two tracks, which is something Percy has done a few times in the past to play around with pacing.

[BkWurm1]

His road show sounds like a joke.  Speedster animals?

[bijoux]

Unless it's a cheetah, what's the point?

[BkWurm1]

9 hours ago, tv echo said:

From A.V. Club article linked in above tweet:

Just noticed in that last panel with GA, he looks a lot like SA now.  I'm used to seeing Justin Hartley, lol.  

[tv echo]

[tv echo]

Remember when Michael Rowe said at a comic con that both he and Manu Bennett wanted Deadshot to return to Arrow and have a fight with Deathstroke? Apparently it's happening in the comics...

Tomorrow’s Batman #28 Has The Deadshot Vs Deathstroke Fight You’ve Always Wanted
Posted by Rich Johnston August 1, 2017
https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/08/01/batman-28-deadshot-vs-deathstroke-fight/

Quote

That’s why it may be worth knowing for some folk that in Batman #28 by Tom King, Mikel Janin and June Chung, published tomorrow by DC Comics, fans will get what they have wanted for ages. With Deadshot and Deathstroke divided by allegiances to the Joker and the Riddler as the War Of Jokes And Riddles — and Batman’s post-coital-and-proposal conversation with Catwoman — continues after the previous Peanuts-inspired interlude.

And a full-blown, knock-down battle between the two across the streets of Gotham with a longevity more like a cricket game than a baseball match. And a little on the Miracleman #15 side, too…

Edited August 3, 2017 by tv echo

[statsgirl]

Are Deathstroke and Deadshot redeemed characters in the comics or just on the show?

[Primal Slayer]

They are kind of anti-heroes but recently Deathstroke took a turn for the good. They mostly go where the money is.

Speaking of Deathstroke, his daughter Ravagers current costume is really something I'd like to see on Sara

[tv echo]

[BkWurm1]

27 minutes ago, tv echo said:

My unfiltered reaction: "God, that looks dumb."

 

So Batman is now short and green and I'm sure the drama they've manufactured will be top notch.    So much cringing.

[tv echo]

Edited August 12, 2017 by tv echo

[bijoux]

Do these comics usually have so much inner monologue? Because that's a lot up there. I like the perspective on the fire escape.

[leopardprint]

Why is Batman about to give Green Arrow a piggy back ride? 

[tv echo]

For comparison, the June 2017 report listed GA #24 with 27, 737 est. units sold and GA #25 with 27, 388 est. units sold...

July 2017 Comic Book Sales to Comics Shops
Estimated Comics Shipped to North American Comics Shops
Based on Reports from Diamond Comic Distributors
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2017/2017-07.html

Quote

Units    Dollars    Comic-book   Title     Issue    Price    Publisher        Est. units
*  *  *
80         107           Green Arrow                26         $2.99      DC                 27,285
*  *  *
83         110           Green Arrow                27         $2.99      DC                 26,715

Edited August 15, 2017 by tv echo

[BkWurm1]

Huh.  Doesn't look like the special crossover issues are doing much to stop the pain.  

[statsgirl]

We're just not sophisticated enough to truly appreciate them.

[Morrigan2575]

3 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Huh.  Doesn't look like the special crossover issues are doing much to stop the pain.  

Huh, didn't even think about that. 

[BkWurm1]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

We're just not sophisticated enough to truly appreciate them.

Nor apparently are their comic readers, lol.  

[Trini]

'Looking back on 70 years of Black Canary'

[statsgirl]

Quote

This three issue series would see Black Canary venturing off on her own in Seattle, attempting to stop a dangerous drug dealer, when her plan goes awry. Dinah is captured, strung up, tortured and sexually assaulted before being found and rescued by Oliver. As a result of the series, Dinah loses her ability to bear children and her trademark Canary Cry. Green Arrow, meanwhile, got his own ongoing series.

Misogyny at its finest.

[Starfish35]

45 minutes ago, Trini said:

'Looking back on 70 years of Black Canary'

That's really interesting - thanks!  There were several things in there that caught my attention.  One was where they were talking about Longbow Hunters and how it came out about the same time as The Killing Joke.

Quote

Just as her mother was relegated to the panels of other heroes' adventures, so too was Dinah Lance trapped in the world of the Green Arrow. She came very close to breaking out on her own in the early 80s, but plans for a solo mini-series were derailed when DC decided to allow Mike Grell to use the character in a brand new prestige format comic called Green Arrow: The Longbow Hunters. This three issue series would see Black Canary venturing off on her own in Seattle, attempting to stop a dangerous drug dealer, when her plan goes awry. Dinah is captured, strung up, tortured and sexually assaulted before being found and rescued by Oliver. As a result of the series, Dinah loses her ability to bear children and her trademark Canary Cry. Green Arrow, meanwhile, got his own ongoing series.

“Dinah was one of the victims of the female superhero trope in American superhero comics which is, well if we want to do something interesting with a woman, we have to have her physically maimed, right?” recalls Joseph Illidge, former editor of Birds of Prey. “So in the case of Dinah, being strung up and being sliced in Green Arrow: The Longbow Hunters by a sadist, and then additionally having a failed relationship with Oliver Queen at the time and even having a failed relationship with The Ray at the time. Dinah was there when I think the transition began away from that trope.”

But it would be years before that transition would really start to come into effect. In the same year that saw the publication of Green Arrow: The Longbow Hunters, Barbara Gordon was shot and paralyzed by the Joker in the pages of The Killing Joke. Eventually, she would be brought back by Suicide Squad writers John Ostrander and Kim Yale as the hero Oracle, a character who would have a great effect on the trajectory of one Dinah Lance.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Starfish35

[Starfish35]

This was also interesting:

Quote

“.....I made a choice to stay on that title, and I'm glad I did, but that really spoke to the affection that I have for those characters and the responsibility I felt about Birds of Prey because at the time it was the top selling female led superhero comic after Wonder Woman. And because of that, I felt that there was a responsibility to have that book properly represent those characters and represent women.”

Birds of Prey finally brought Black Canary into the spotlight, making her a main character in her own series, and unlike her failed series from the early 90s, it was one that captured an audience. Over the course of the first two years, the character would start the slow progress from a down on her luck, beaten and broken former hero to once again becoming a whole person. The series allowed Dinah to become more defined, and to find physical as well as emotional healing. In one issue, Dixon even went so far as to undo the physical damage that had been done to the character during Green Arrow: The Longbow Hunters, returning her Canary Cry following a dip in Ra’s al Ghul’s Lazarus Pit. But even though she was made whole in that issue, Dinah has never been defined by her Canary Cry.