Daisy Johnson: That IS her name!

[Raja]

5 hours ago, Jack Kerouac said:

 

Thank you. Daisy is a moron. Going off like an idiot to try and save Jenna even though Deke told her the Kree would straight up murder people in retaliation. What exactly was her plan? Quake a bunch of people and go run and hide? What an idiot.

If my friends and family were in that station, I would have turned her in too.

At least Fitz had an escape plan, a spaceship, a stash of weapons for the team and a Sentient Chronicon from Signus. Daisy even seemed to realize her plan was stupid when Deke pointed it out to her last episode.

I think that in her time alone after the Hive arc she just had come to depend upon her ability to quake her way out of anything. And thus were gone all the reasons Coulson recruited her in the first place.

[Lobsel Vith]

4 hours ago, Raja said:

I think that in her time alone after the Hive arc she just had come to depend upon her ability to quake her way out of anything. And thus were gone all the reasons Coulson recruited her in the first place.

Considering that Fitz's initial suggestion and plan was for them to shoot their way out of there, until Enoch had to explain that such an idea wouldn't work (and Fitz is meant to be some genius on the level of Stark, if not greater given what he built last season), I'm not seeing why Daisy is viewed as a 'moron'. She attempted a stealth approach because Jemma's life was at risk (which, as we saw from Kasius' threat during the Abby fight, it certainly was).

Fitz also kept veering from the plan despite Enoch's warnings - like when he refused the protocol suggestion and when he tried to speak with Jemma despite everyone around them. Enoch also had to tell Fitz they simply couldn't shoot their way out of there, which is what Fitz - the Stark-level genius of the show - suggested as an escape plan. So I question why Daisy is the only one who is criticized when Fitz, the genius of the show, kept going off-book. And I'm very apprehensive about anyone defending Deke selling a person into slavery when we've seen how little he actually cares for the denizens of the Lighthouse since it was Flint who make a big deal about their lives - Flint, the young Inhuman, not Deke, who admitted to working for Kasius outside of selling Daisy to him.

[Wishing Well]

I rewatched the entire show last two weeks (leave me alone I'm having withdrawals) and I just can't say enough about how this show casts its female leads.  I'm a 24 year old Asian girl who has never related to superheroes before and only got into them when Melissa Benoist was cast as Supergirl. I love Kara, and I adore Sara Lance, but it wasn't until seeing Daisy and May that I truly felt immersed and welcomed into the world of superheroes.  It's like the reaction when Wonder Woman came out for a lot of women, but even more so because here are two Asians kicking ass and embracing their heritage.  Honestly, I was worried in s2 that they would somehow whitewash Skye, since Chloe is fairly white passing, but then Afterlife and Jiaying and Hunan showed up.  May's elderly Chinese parents showed up, she speaks Chinese...its all amazing.  A lot of showwriters wouldn't make this effort because it CAN be much more difficult but I will always support this show because of what they did.

 

Plus, the writing and acting is tight AF.

[scrb]

Well, these are actresses and a lot of their fight scenes are done by stunt doubles.  The magic of movies and all that.

If you've watched the show from the beginning, they converted the Daisy/Skye character into a badass fighting heroine over the course of the show.

And of course, Chloe Bennet changed her stage name away from her Asian surname.

 

Anyways, is it really empowering to have exaggerated representations of female characters with superhuman fighting prowess?  To have 120 pound women thrown men who are 200 pounds or greater like rag dolls?

Cynthia Rothrock, who could defeat men in real life, did a lot of movies and nobody held her up as some feminist hero.

[jhlipton]

11 hours ago, scrb said:

is it really empowering to have exaggerated representations of female characters with superhuman fighting prowess?  To have 120 pound women thrown men who are 200 pounds or greater like rag dolls?

Cynthia Rothrock, who could defeat men in real life, did a lot of movies and nobody held her up as some feminist hero.

Yes and yes.

ORLY?  She was one of the guests of honor at the Action Stuntwomen Conference last year (along with Ming Na Wen!)... 

[SnoGirl]

On 2/11/2018 at 3:17 PM, scrb said:

Well, these are actresses and a lot of their fight scenes are done by stunt doubles.  The magic of movies and all that.

If you've watched the show from the beginning, they converted the Daisy/Skye character into a badass fighting heroine over the course of the show.

And of course, Chloe Bennet changed her stage name away from her Asian surname.

 

Anyways, is it really empowering to have exaggerated representations of female characters with superhuman fighting prowess?  To have 120 pound women thrown men who are 200 pounds or greater like rag dolls?

Cynthia Rothrock, who could defeat men in real life, did a lot of movies and nobody held her up as some feminist hero.

Representation matters. I think its super empowering to see Chloe, Ming Na, Adrianne, and Natalia kicking ass and taking names. Do I think someone who weighs 120 pounds and is trained to fight could take down a grown man? Hell YAS I do. Let’s break this stereotype that women are helpless, or can’t take a man. Maybe not throw them like rag dolls, but do some damage? Yes. If you know how to fight, you can hold your own.

I think of Ming Na, who is 55 and has been doing a lot of her own stunts, whenever I run at the gym. If she can fight, I sure can run another half mile. And I have a lot of respect for stunt people, female or male. I love action movies/tv shows. I know it wouldnt be possible without them. Plus, the 12 and 13 year olds I work with talk about Daisy, May, Gemma and Elena all the time. They are blown away by them. These are the same girls who talk about Leia, Rey, Uhura, Hermione, Luna and Wonder Woman with the same regard. I’ll say it again. Representation matters.

Plus, if you’re questioning the ladies(and making kinda a sexist remark), don’t leave out Coulson, Hunter, and  Fitz. Because they’re tiny and I can hardly believe they could take anyone alone in a fight without help. Even Ward and Tripp weren’t huge guys. In fact, the only male I could literally see doing any damage is Mack.

That’s why this is a super hero show. Watching people do the impossible. This show has always been about the underdogs, the unrepresented. If you can’t get behind that, maybe this show isnt for you.

By the way, those links are the ladies talking about doing their own stunts. They might not do everything, but they definitely do a lot.

Edited February 12, 2018 by SnoGirl

[scrb]

No but men aren't looking up to those male figures as sources of inspiration or empowerment because the characters they play appear to fight well on a TV show.

I can definitely say I never idolized Bruce Lee, Jackie Chan, Steven Segal, Jean Claude Van Damme or any other movie action star for their fighting prowess.

 

I think Jackie Chan is great more for the physical movements he shows on film to express inventiveness of his character, almost in the same way great dancers like Fred Astaire expressed himself through dancing in films.  Or even Steve Martin in All of Me.

 

Or if action is the preferred genre, how about John Woo movies, which filmed action sequences with style?

 

Supergirl and Batgirl haven't been feminist heroes either, as far as I can tell.  But it seems the rejuvenated Wonder Woman is being held up by some in that way.  I just hope there are other ways to inspire girls and young women than to show female characters beating up men.

[SnoGirl]

Im really confused what your point is. First you talk about how its not empowering for a woman to be a fighter.  Then you switch to how men don’t look up to men who fight on tv shows but literally refer to every male action movie figure who are known for their fight movies. Then to how you hope young women have someone else to look up to than women who fight? I’m trying not to be offended by your points, but I think this is the last time I’m responding to them. I know woman’s value, and in a genre where men have been fight men for years, I’m excited for a show where women are not only valued for their intellect, but their ability to be the big damn heroes.

I’m bringing this thread back on topic. I actually want to see Director Johnson. At this point, I think its been earned. I dont think May wants it, and Gemma would be a great second in command. And Elena would be top notch at leading the inhumans, she practically did it in space. I actually hope they have all the ladies in charge. Man, that would just rock.

[Wishing Well]

I would absolutely love Director Johnson, assuming that they are able to get her headspace and maturity there by the end of the season.  It would be a phenomenal end to her hero’s journey/new beginning for the next.  A friend of mine is watching AOS for the first time, and he’s having trouble connecting the Skye he is seeing to the Daisy that I holler about, but as he makes it through he show (currently on 1.19), his view is slowly changing.  It’s even more sentimental for me, being able to sort of relive watching AOS for the first time.

I am extra excited for him to watch my favorite AOS scene of all time - Ward playing the old trope of bad guy will do anything for good girl and hide abuse as love...and then Skye just nailed him four times in the back.  So many times I’ve seen the girl just be blind to his true nature because he loves her and is good to her...and then bang bang bang bang.  Amazing ?

[Wishing Well]

6 hours ago, scrb said:

No but men aren't looking up to those male figures as sources of inspiration or empowerment because the characters they play appear to fight well on a TV show.

I can definitely say I never idolized Bruce Lee, Jackie Chan, Steven Segal, Jean Claude Van Damme or any other movie action star for their fighting prowess.

 

I think Jackie Chan is great more for the physical movements he shows on film to express inventiveness of his character, almost in the same way great dancers like Fred Astaire expressed himself through dancing in films.  Or even Steve Martin in All of Me.

 

Or if action is the preferred genre, how about John Woo movies, which filmed action sequences with style?

 

Supergirl and Batgirl haven't been feminist heroes either, as far as I can tell.  But it seems the rejuvenated Wonder Woman is being held up by some in that way.  I just hope there are other ways to inspire girls and young women than to show female characters beating up men.

 

So you, a man I can only presume, want to dictate who women and WOC idolize and are empowered by, in order to fit YOUR definition of an ideal girl and woman.

Captain America is one of the biggest male icons in recent times thanks to the MCU.  Captain America also beats up men and women.  I don’t see arguments saying that young men (AND women) shouldn’t look up to the ideals that Steve Rogers and Chris Evans embodies. 

[jhlipton]

On 2/12/2018 at 3:49 PM, SnoGirl said:

Plus, the 12 and 13 year olds I work with talk about Daisy, May, Gemma and Elena all the time. They are blown away by them. These are the same girls who talk about Leia, Rey, Uhura, Hermione, Luna and Wonder Woman with the same regard. I’ll say it again. Representation matters.

By the way, those links are the ladies talking about doing their own stunts. They might not do everything, but they definitely do a lot.

My niece loves the women Ninja Warriors, Jessie Graf (stuntwoman on Supergirl -- and this slip of a "girl" could toss a guy across the room) in particular.

Caity Lotz -- Sarah Lance on Legends of Tomorow -- does a lot of her own stunts, too.

On 2/12/2018 at 4:11 PM, scrb said:

I just hope there are other ways to inspire girls and young women than to show female characters beating up men.

All the above women fight (not "beat up") other women as well as men.  I guess you missed the Daisy-Sinara fights in two episodes.

[Froippi]

On 2/13/2018 at 1:51 AM, Wishing Well said:

 

So you, a man I can only presume, want to dictate who women and WOC idolize and are empowered by, in order to fit YOUR definition of an ideal girl and woman.

Captain America is one of the biggest male icons in recent times thanks to the MCU.  Captain America also beats up men and women.  I don’t see arguments saying that young men (AND women) shouldn’t look up to the ideals that Steve Rogers and Chris Evans embodies. 

 

Honestly people shouldn’t need to idolize anyone I grew up not Idolize anyone still don’t Idolize anyone 

[Wishing Well]

5 hours ago, Froippi said:

 

Honestly people shouldn’t need to idolize anyone I grew up not Idolize anyone still don’t Idolize anyone 

 

Good for you. 

 

I personally enjoy having inspirations I can look up to. 

[scrb]

On 2/12/2018 at 10:51 PM, Wishing Well said:

 

So you, a man I can only presume, want to dictate who women and WOC idolize and are empowered by, in order to fit YOUR definition of an ideal girl and woman.

Captain America is one of the biggest male icons in recent times thanks to the MCU.  Captain America also beats up men and women.  I don’t see arguments saying that young men (AND women) shouldn’t look up to the ideals that Steve Rogers and Chris Evans embodies. 

Where did I dictate anything?

I merely asked if the criterium for idolizing some female characters was that they could beat up other people in make-believe works.

Back in the day, some young women thought Lara Croft, a video game character, was also an empowering symbol as well.

Not Cleopatra, Simone de Beauvoir, Queen Elizabeth, etc.  But a video game character who shoots up things.

[Wishing Well]

39 minutes ago, scrb said:

Where did I dictate anything?

I merely asked if the criterium for idolizing some female characters was that they could beat up other people in make-believe works.

Back in the day, some young women thought Lara Croft, a video game character, was also an empowering symbol as well.

Not Cleopatra, Simone de Beauvoir, Queen Elizabeth, etc.  But a video game character who shoots up things.

Why are young men idolizing Iron Man, Luke Skywalker, James Bond, Superman instead of Thomas Edison, Edgar Allen Poe, and Louis the Sun King? 

Is the criterium for idolizing some male characters was that they could beat up other people in make-believe works?

[Cranberry]

Let's keep this thread to the topic of Daisy Johnson, guys. Thanks!

[Lobsel Vith]

On ‎2‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 1:37 AM, Wishing Well said:

I would absolutely love Director Johnson, assuming that they are able to get her headspace and maturity there by the end of the season.  It would be a phenomenal end to her hero’s journey/new beginning for the next.  A friend of mine is watching AOS for the first time, and he’s having trouble connecting the Skye he is seeing to the Daisy that I holler about, but as he makes it through he show (currently on 1.19), his view is slowly changing.  It’s even more sentimental for me, being able to sort of relive watching AOS for the first time.

Daisy certainly grew as a person, but I've liked how Chloe Bennet would show the pain that 'Skye' was going through, even in the first season. The moments where she opened up about how she was always rejected from the foster families, or how awful it was to be homeless in that one moment she opens up to Coulson when they're near the pool at the hotel. She was pretty much the antithesis of Ward - she had a dark childhood as well, but she never used it as an excuse to be a villainous person.

I'd like to see Daisy Johnson become a part of the greater MCU. Tessa Thompson liked my tweet to her about Daisy Johnson being part of the Lady Liberators pitch she made (she is the first Asian-American superhero introduced into the MCU).

On ‎2‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 1:37 AM, Wishing Well said:

I am extra excited for him to watch my favorite AOS scene of all time - Ward playing the old trope of bad guy will do anything for good girl and hide abuse as love...and then Skye just nailed him four times in the back.  So many times I’ve seen the girl just be blind to his true nature because he loves her and is good to her...and then bang bang bang bang.  Amazing ?

Ward really should have died then and there. He pretty much served his purpose from a narrative perspective for Daisy's journey, and afterwards he pretty much just meandered in roles that anyone else could have played (especially the alliance with Malik, who tries to kill Ward, and then they become allies for no reason). While I like how the show never had Daisy 'fall' for Ward after finding out he was Hydra, I've disliked their inability to let him go (and trying to elicit sympathy for him in the Framework storyline, at the expense of screentime and story for a marginalized character like Trip, was really unfortunate).

It's part of the reason I dislike the show's handling of Deke selling Daisy into slavery, and then handwaving it because he's an attractive white guy who makes quips.

Edited February 26, 2018 by Lobsel Vith

[ProudMary]

I hope this is OK to post in this thread.  I don't see a cast thread.  If it's better elsewhere Mods,please feel free to move.

Congratulations to Chloe Bennet on being named one of the A-100.  
https://goldhouse.org/a100/index.html

Quote

The A100 honors the most impactful Asians in culture every May for Asian American & Pacific Islander Heritage Month. Honorees pioneer new enterprises as founders; herald new industries in the C-suite; transform culture through historic creative endeavors; and set unmatched global sports records. This year is especially momentous as we celebrate the 50th Anniversary of “Asian America.”

Quote

Chloe Bennet is the star of ABC’s hit series, Marvel’s Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. She is a consistent and admired advocate for Asian representation by incisively publicizing Hollywood’s bias against her legal last name (Wang), whitewashed castings, as well as equal rights and pay for women. Her layered perspectives stem partly from her third culture heritage (she moved to Beijing, China when she was 15 to pursue a singing career as she studied Mandarin) as well as her multi-faceted, multi-ethnic household (she has six brothers: three biological, two foster, and one adopted; two are African American and another is Mexican-Filipino).

[scrb]

Since she changed her surname from Wong to Bennett, isn't she downplaying her Asian heritage?

[Cranberry]

It was the only way she could get work. 

Here's a more in-depth interview.

[Kel Varnsen]

5 hours ago, Cranberry said:

It was the only way she could get work. 

Here's a more in-depth interview.

It is not like she is the first person working in Hollywood to change their name. I mean we never had the Daily Show with John Leibowitz or Toy Story starring Tim Dick as Buzz Lightyear.

[Kel Varnsen]

Of coure it is also kind of funny how Chloe Bennett changed her last name professionally from Wang because it sounded Asian, but then ended up working on a show based on comics created by a guy who changed his last name to Lee.

[scrb]

She's apparently made accusations of racism against casting agents and others in Hollywood.

If she doesn't get more traction towards stardom in Hollywood, maybe she can do Chinese films.  Got to be a big market over there.

[blueray]

On 5/14/2018 at 6:49 AM, Kel Varnsen said:

Of coure it is also kind of funny how Chloe Bennett changed her last name professionally from Wang because it sounded Asian, but then ended up working on a show based on comics created by a guy who changed his last name to Lee.

Stan Lee changed his name from Stanley Martin Lieber because he thought it sounded to Jewish.  Basically the same reason she changed her name. Which is really sad, that something like someone's background is still effecting the job opportunities for them to the point where they change their names.

Edited May 16, 2018 by blueray

[Lobsel Vith]

22 hours ago, blueray said:

Stan Lee changed his name from Stanley Martin Lieber because he thought it sounded to Jewish.  Basically the same reason she changed her name. Which is really sad, that something like someone's background is still effecting the job opportunities for them to the point where they change their names.

Jack Kirby, who was also Jewish (and helped co-create a number of Marvel characters, both with Stan and independent of him), was born Jacob Kurtzberg and he used different pen names when writing (like Jack Curtiss). A number of different actors have modified their names as well due to how Hollywood is - like Oscar Isaac.

[TVSpectator]

Since we are on the topic of why some actors have changed their names here is a website that has a list of actors who have changed their names and also their birth names as well:

http://www.famousnamechanges.net/html/actor/actorc.htm

[VCRTracking]

Seeing Daisy use her old computer skills in the recent episodes was nice. I remember back in the TWoP forums one of the big  reasons fans didn't like Daisy(then Skye) during the early season 1 was she was a hacker and that's why she was brought on the team. Viewers scoffed and asked why a SHIELD team wouldn't already have an expert trained hacker from their ranks. Valid point but this was a show with a flying car in the first episode. Personally I  think they didn't buy a pretty girl could be such an expert in computers. Guess they should have put her in ponytail and glasses.

Edited August 8, 2020 by VCRTracking

[scrb]

Maybe the writers didn't buy her as hacker either since they eventually gave her powers, renamed her.

Twice, Daisy and Quake, as if to kill the original name.

When they initially wrote the scripts, they probably didn't plan to give her an action role?  She'd be one of the brainiacs along with Fitz and Simmons, who has never fought.

But they wanted to feature the actress more so she became a fighter, with special powers and tighter outfits?

[Jack Shaftoe]

I think the problem with Daisy early on was not so much her own personality and actions but the way other characters, Coulson in particular, acted like she was the most important person in the universe for no apparent reason. Few things can annoy viewers more than a perceived writers' pet. I still cringe a little when I think of Coulson's many speeches on the subject of Skye.

51 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

Personally I  think they didn't buy a pretty girl could be such an expert in computers.

I very much doubt that. Characters like Willow from Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Claudia from Warehouse tend to be pretty popular with the fans. Plus, it's not like Elizabeth Henstridge is any less pretty but few fans hated her character.

[VCRTracking]

11 minutes ago, scrb said:

Maybe the writers didn't buy her as hacker either since they eventually gave her powers, renamed her.

Twice, Daisy and Quake, as if to kill the original name.

When they initially wrote the scripts, they probably didn't plan to give her an action role?  She'd be one of the brainiacs along with Fitz and Simmons, who has never fought.

But they wanted to feature the actress more so she became a fighter, with special powers and tighter outfits?

They definitely were intending her to be trained to eventually be a field agent with tight outfit and not just a hacker. Third episode they already have her going undercover. Her audition scene with Brett Dalton was the scene where Ward preps her.  I think if the original plan of it just being a "case of the week" SHIELD show she would have been the MCU Sydney Bristow with Ward as her handler/partner. Winter Soldier changed that. Daisy Johnson/Quake was already a  minor character in the comics and the writers already made Skye an orphan so it was easy for them to then make her the MCU Quake.

I remember though even at the end of first season half of season 2 and Skye went through terragenesis and broke out of that cocoon using her new power there were some people on the boards like "Ugh she has super powers now?" Some were reasonably mad Tripp just got killed but Skye now being a superhero just made them hate her more. At the time Skye and Chloe both were both seen as just white. So there wasn't a big celebration of having a female POC superhero in the Marvel Cinematic Universe.

[VCRTracking]

30 minutes ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

I think the problem with Daisy early on was not so much her own personality and actions but the way other characters, Coulson in particular, acted like she was the most important person in the universe for no apparent reason. Few things can annoy viewers more than a perceived writers' pet. I still cringe a little when I think of Coulson's many speeches on the subject of Skye.

Yeah but it's very clear now, probably not then Coulson was already thinking of Skye as a surrogate daughter. Being a career man at his age who had a near death(really actual death) experience will bring up those feelings. By "The Magical Place" it's also clear she saw him as a father figure. Thankfully the writers got to eventually show how and why Skye is great, not just have Coulson tell us she is.

I understand the resentment at the perceived "writers pet". The dreaded "Mary Sue" but I think Skye earned the affection and loyalty of the other characters by mid season. When Skye got shot and near death and the team took her to T.A.H.I.T.I. and Coulson had killed two guards shooting at them, you'd think he committed a war crime on the TWoP boards! It was "totally unjustified!" "He's a murderer who killed two innocent..blah blah"  I'm glad it was later revealed Garrett did it all deliberately to be find the secret.

30 minutes ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

I very much doubt that. Characters like Willow from Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Claudia from Warehouse tend to be pretty popular with the fans. Plus, it's not like Elizabeth Henstridge is any less pretty but few fans hated her character.

Many of those examples is the instance of the "Hollywood Nerd" trope. They're dressed down and not glammed up. Also personality wise they're not as bold and self confident, therefore they're more accessable. 

Edited August 8, 2020 by VCRTracking

[Jack Shaftoe]

8 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

I understand the resentment at the perceived "writers pet". The dreaded "Mary Sue" but I think Skye earned the affection and loyalty of the other characters by mid season. When Skye got shot and near death and the team took her to T.A.H.I.T.I. and Coulson had killed two guards shooting at them, you'd think he committed a war crime on the TWoP boards! It was "totally unjustified!" "He's a murderer who killed two innocent..blah blah"  I'm glad it was later revealed Garrett did it all deliberately to be find the secret.

But Coulson did kill two guards who were just doing their job as far as he knew at that time. I read those old TWoP threads when I was binging the show and while people complained a little too much (understatement alert), the show did sweep what Coulson did under the carpet in a way that must have reinforced for many people the idea of Skye as the writers' pet because clearly the show was okay with the protagonists doing anything, murder included, to save her.

15 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

Many of those examples is the instance of the "Hollywood Nerd" trope. They're dressed down and not glammed up. Also personality wise they're not as bold and self confident, therefore they're more accessable. 

Yes but that's still Hollywood and the actresses are almost always pretty enough for this to be obvious regardless of whether they are glammed up or not. People didn't like Skye because the show was sold as an ensemble and yet she was obviously more important than everyone else, except for Coulson, and even he often played second fiddle to her and wouldn't stop singing her praises. When this stopped, the fandom warmed up to her.

[VCRTracking]

2 minutes ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

But Coulson did kill two guards who were just doing their job as far as he knew at that time. I read those old TWoP threads when I was binging the show and while people complained a little too much (understatement alert), the show did sweep what Coulson did under the carpet in a way that must have reinforced for many people the idea of Skye as the writers' pet because clearly the show was okay with the protagonists doing anything, murder included, to save her.

If Skye was more well liked by the fans it wouldn't have been such a big deal IMO. They would have been considered mooks and redshirts. When I look back on those early episodes all of the characters had time to shine. It felt Skye had more because she was the outsider. She didn't join this elite organization she was asked to, which made her seem like she was getting unwarrented special treatment. Ditto her being there on missions when she's not official. 

[Jack Shaftoe]

The whole thing was just dumb and people would have complained anyway - a super important, super secret facility has a grand total of two guards? Coulson and company don't even entertain the idea of using their non-lethal guns? But yeah, the protagonists going beyond the pale for Skye of all characters sure helped fuel fan anger.

[scrb]

Were they angry at the character or the actress?

 

 

[VCRTracking]

7 minutes ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

The whole thing was just dumb and people would have complained anyway - a super important, super secret facility has a grand total of two guards? Coulson and company don't even entertain the idea of using their non-lethal guns? But yeah, the protagonists going beyond the pale for Skye of all characters sure helped fuel fan anger.

I just remember my frustration that after all this time we finally learn the secret of "Tahiti" and how Coulson survived getting impaled in the heart by Loki. We see this shocking image of the fluid used to cure him and Skye is actually blood in tubes coming from the half corpse of a blue alien and and ALL anyone could talk about for pages it seems was Coulson murdering these two guards and Skye not being worth it. I thought "JFC I know you guys hate her but come on!"

[Raja]

46 minutes ago, scrb said:

Were they angry at the character or the actress?

 

 

What was there about the then all but unknown outside of China actress to dislike? Later the was a controversy about Bennett's choice as a boyfriend.

[Guest]

21 hours ago, Raja said:

What was there about the then all but unknown outside of China actress to dislike? Later the was a controversy about Bennett's choice as a boyfriend.

Early on there was a lot of criticism that she wasn’t a good actress. 

 

23 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

Yeah but it's very clear now, probably not then Coulson was already thinking of Skye as a surrogate daughter. Being a career man at his age who had a near death(really actual death) experience will bring up those feelings. By "The Magical Place" it's also clear she saw him as a father figure. Thankfully the writers got to eventually show how and why Skye is great, not just have Coulson tell us she is.

I understand the resentment at the perceived "writers pet". The dreaded "Mary Sue" but I think Skye earned the affection and loyalty of the other characters by mid season. When Skye got shot and near death and the team took her to T.A.H.I.T.I. and Coulson had killed two guards shooting at them, you'd think he committed a war crime on the TWoP boards! It was "totally unjustified!" "He's a murderer who killed two innocent..blah blah"  I'm glad it was later revealed Garrett did it all deliberately to be find the secret.

It’s really interesting to watch the first two seasons now. At the time it seemed like Skye was in danger of taking over the whole show. So much of the plot revolved around her. It makes sense considering the Inhumans were Perlmutter’s big plan to replace the X-Men and transitioning Skye into Quake was the their intro into the MCU. Now I can appreciate the way that story evolved. To me it’s a story that improves significantly after the fact. 

Edited August 9, 2020 by Guest

[swanpride]

Chloe Bennet was genuinely the weakest of the actors when the show started, though that was less about her being particularly bad and more about all the others being particularly good actors. She needed some time to grow.

Otherwise the main problem was really that the writers kind of held her character up like an unwanted kitty screaming "like her! Like her please!" Ironically once the show treated the ensemble more like an ensemble and not everything seemed to be about Skye anymore, the fans started to like her way more.

Also, Coulson's explanation why he wanted to keep her wasn't pretty clear. When he said "do you know how rare it is that Shield knows nothing about someone" I was misunderstanding it as Skye being such a great hacker that she could even hide from Shield. I only realised later on that those Shield agents were the ones who "hid" her and that Coulson mostly wanted to keep an eye on her to figure out what the mystery surrounding her was.

[VCRTracking]

Chloe's best acting moment in season 1 was episode 19 when Skye found Eric Koenig's body and realized Ward was Hydra. Her shock and terror were so raw and real. The next episode "Nothing Personal" where she confronted him is when her character really shined.

[swanpride]

Yep, and that was also the moment the audience started to turn around on her.

[StarBrand]

I can get why people might not have liked Daisy's character in Season one, but her character started to become more interesting around the time we found out she was identified once as an 084.  Looking back, the writers left several clues about who/what she was, starting with that reveal, then a little more when Coulsen started reacting weirdly to the alien blood, but Daisy did not.  Her character was already better at the start of season two-she was actually acting like a shield agent, fighting and being a sniper. Making her an inhuman made things even more interesting.