S02.E08: Girl Meets Hurricane

[Skyfall]

No one even liked Angela! And the whole Shangela thing was rushed and had no backstory or driving force to it. So Shaty/Kawn is already much better than that.

[allonsyalice]

Yea it wasn't the best, but at least it wasn't like s1. Those episodes aren't good at all.

You are very right. I haven't seen much of Season one, just Girl meet home for the holidays and Mayas birthday episode. (guess the common factor there.) But it was a show I enjoyed, so I kept watching.

 

 

PS - Trina's twitter feed is next level. Methinks she only took the role for $$ and did not support any of the plot decisions. Also, she seems to be asking for a spin-off? IDK but I got a good laugh.

I don't think Trina entirely did it for the money, I think she also did so because she really loves these fans. 

[Skyfall]

The knock knock and Kermit/Torpanga/Angela name gags had me dying!

Also the premise to how Shawn could buy all those clothes was believably too.

All in all I liked this episode and laughed throughout.

[spanana]

No one even liked Angela! And the whole Shangela thing was rushed and had no backstory or driving force to it. So Shaty/Kawn is already much better than that.

 

I don't think that's remotely true.  You may not have personally been a fan of Angela or Shawn/Angela, but that relationship had a whole lot of vocal support from BMW fans.  They weren't Cory/Topanga important, but if Shawn/Angela didn't have fans there wouldn't have been belly aching before this episode aired about how Angela would be portrayed.   Besides, I'm not sure what sort of backstory Shawn/Angela needed.  Most couples don't have crazy backstories.  People meet and start dating.  Not everything needs to be a meet cute we played on the playground together when we were 4 years old.  Or there is this girl that desperately wants me to be her dad therefore I should date her mother.   I'm not begrudging anyone being a fan of the Shawn/Katy angle or even liking it better than Shawn/Angela, but pretending like no fans were invested in Shawn's previous relationship is just not true.

Edited June 20, 2015 by spanana

[Skyfall]

I think it really depends how you view season 5 of BMW.

Also informant to mention, if this episode only featured Chet it would've been perfect. The Angela scene sorta killed the momentum until she brought up Maya's spying.

[KerleyQ]

I didn't get the part where Riley said Lucas volunteered after Katrina and he asks if he told her and she says no. What? Explain it to me like I'm an adult who watches the Disney channel. 

 

The only thing I could remotely guess there was that they were going for "Riley knows Lucas so well and how much of a good guy he is that she just 'knew' he would have gone to volunteer."  

 

And I call bullshit on the whole "no-one's ever cared enough to say something like that to me" thing. I'm guessing she actually meant no man (which is problematic in itself, because it means she's discounting anything she's heard from Katy, Riley, and probably Topanga) but I'm sure Cory has shown he cares about her a lot, even though most of what see between those two is snarky teasing.

 

I was offended on Cory's behalf at that line.  All through season 1, we saw him do his best to be as much of a father as he could be for her. Two instances that stick out are when he bought her a smartphone and found a way to give it to her without it feeling overtly like "charity," and the father/daughter dance.Of course there were countless other examples, too, pretty much every episode. I get that Shawn is going to move into even more of a "father" role in her life, but Cory has filled it admirably in the past, and it's insulting that the show now wants to erase all of that. 

 

PS - Trina's twitter feed is next level. Methinks she only took the role for $$ and did not support any of the plot decisions. Also, she seems to be asking for a spin-off? IDK but I got a good laugh.

 

 

People keep mentioning Trina's tweets so I want to check them out. I do love how she engages with fans and she seems really sweet, but wow, some If her tweets have a strange, desperate quality to them. "With the killings in the south, Angela needs to live independently of GMW" "If Caitlyn Jenner is good enough for our kids, so is Angela."

What does that even mean?

 

She comes across as so desperate.  She's acting like her not being in this series as a regular is some sort of racial statement.  The reality is, there's really no place for her on an ongoing basis, and it has zip to do with the color of her skin.  The show is about the girls, for the most part, and the adults that are in there are there for the ties they have to the girls.  Obviously, they wanted to find some way to keep Shawn around as much as possible for the Cory/Shawn nostalgia factor, but they've done so in a way that ties him in to the girls.  Eric showed up to help resolve a problem between the girls.  There's no ongoing story in Angela and the girls.  

 

And her not getting to play a role as long as she wants to is in no way, shape or form, similar to Caitlyn Jenner feeling able to be herself.  I mean, seriously, what the hell, Trina?  

[Gbb]

I know people were banding together and the French Quarter did amazing things to help others in a truly horrible time, but given the true target audience for this show was barely even born, I hate to think Hurricane BBQs are what their take away might be from a horrific disaster.

Totally agree. But "celebrate what you have in the midst of uncertainty" is not a bad takeaway.

On another note, I've been thinking about Chet. If we accept that he's really Shawn's inner voice, then I find what he said to be an interesting glimpse into where Shawn's head is at right now regarding Katy.

The reasons he gave himself (via Chet) for accepting her date request had very little to do with what he himself wanted. They were all about not disappointing Maya or Katy. The only Shawn-centric reason was that he needed to take a chance and let people in.

So from that I get that he doesn't know if he sees anything with Katy but he's willing to give it a shot because Maya wants it so badly, Katy needs someone, and because he needs to put himself out there and risk his heart again. (And maybe he kind of likes that she's a "screwball").

Those aren't bad reasons for a first date as long as he doesn't let the first two reasons push him into a relationship he doesn't want. The fact that the writers laid Shawn's reasoning out there for us to see gives me *some* hope that they're not going to just shove Insta-family down our throats without letting them all earn it. Note to writers: Please make them earn it.

Edited June 20, 2015 by Gbb

[Kromm]

PS - Trina's twitter feed is next level. Methinks she only took the role for $$ and did not support any of the plot decisions. Also, she seems to be asking for a spin-off? IDK but I got a good laugh.

Her being AGAINST a plot decision would almost makes me support them. I mean someone who was clearly phoning it in as much as she was counts about the same as us in the peanut gallery.

The knock knock and Kermit/Torpanga/Angela name gags had me dying!

Also the premise to how Shawn could buy all those clothes was believably too.

All in all I liked this episode and laughed throughout.

The window gag was really the only piece of comedy in the entire episode that worked. The "Kermit" bit came close, but was a little more forced.

The clothes stuff was just beyond belief. There is probably no way that was EVER going to work, but they didn't even make a very good stab at it.

I just give up. This episode was terrible. I almost dread whatever the next episode is because I feel like it will be ANOTHER Maya episode. I mean, we're up to four now. We all love Sabrina Carpenter and Maya is a great character, but I think it would be nice if they started showcasing others. For example, give Farkle a plot or revisit the Lucas stuff. This would be like Shawn having a major plot every single week and stealing the spotlight from Cory.

I don't know about giving up yet, since this season overall has been really good. It's just this episode that took this nosedive into utter garbage. What remains to be seen is how much of the stench of this one persists into upcoming episodes. Not just qualitywise, I mean, but how seriously they try and force the dynamics badly engineered by this episode into future ones. So we shall see...

What the hell was wrong with Maya's clothes that made Shawn think she had to dress differently? She looked fine. She's usually the best dressed character on the show.

Yeah, other than it being slightly weird that a 14 year old was wearing a tribute to a band of 70 year olds, that initial outfit was great (as were most of what they've had her wear in the past). They gave Maya a kind of rebel-chic look which worked. The clothes the episode replaced them with are horrible in comparison. A few of them even had ruffles. Good lord.

[FozzyBear]

I tuned in to see the Shawn/Angela bit and to see if Angela's hair was as bad as rumored. Yikes. That was bad. And creepy. Creepy and bad. And not just the hair. Why didn't Shawn like Mya's clothes? I really didn't get that. Were they supposed to look slutty by some crazy Disney standard? I do not understand what the problem was to begin with. But that's a side issue to the OH MY GOD INAPPROPRIATE MAKE IT STOP! Shawn is in his 30s and not her father and should have no opinion on how she dresses! None at all! That was so weird. And the stuff with Katie felt so forced. Maybe if the two actors had more chemistry, but it just felt like some sort of bad dare when they decide to go on a date. The Angela stuff was fine, if badly paced and written. Yeah it's beyond stupid that she would hunt down her ex that she hasn't seen in 15 years to ask family planning advise, but after trying to hold my puke during the Cory/Riley/Shawn/Mya Pretty Woman reenactment sceen I'll happily let that go as a narrative devise. I'd forgotten how creepy tween TV can be when viewed through an adult mind. It's such a bizarre world view on display. I'm a really big Rider Strong fan, but I am too old for this show. Waaaaaay too old.

[Kromm]

Mr. Google shows that someone on the show's staff either has a huge Rolling Stones fetish, or is being paid off by someone in Stones merchandise.

 

Not only has Maya worn SEVERAL of them, but Rowan wore one to an event (and that last shirt is a Beatles shirt).  The cropped shirt looks like it COULD be inappropriate, if it was worn like the model is wearing it, but OVER another shirt?  Come on!

 

And this isn't even including the one worn in yesterday's episode (which frankly was the best accesorized with the rest of her outfit.   No photo of that one.

[SosaLola]

Yikes, what's up with Angela's Shakira hair? 

 

I thought everything in the episode was forced. Shawn and Maya's father/daughter relationship moved way too fast for my taste - not to mention heavily handled. I'd have liked if Shawn wasn't into Katy and that her fascination with him was nothing but a desire to give her daughter the father she desperately needed. That would have been so uncomfortable for Shawn, but it's interesting drama, especially if Maya believed that her mother was really into Shawn. The end result would be of Katy confessing to her daughter that she was only trying to get close to Shawn for her and that she really didn't have any romantic feelings for him. 

[venusnv80]

Umm...I don't like Maya. I have never liked Maya since the show started and I also don't like the Shawn aspect in Maya's life. I think part of the reason is because Maya appears to be out of place on this show. She's almost a 16 year old in a 12, 13 or so year old body and it shows. 

 

As for Angela's appearance, well..I guess it just happened to give the Shawn and Angela fans a crumb (and literally that's what it was). I also noticed in that scene with Katy, Angela and Shawn...Katy looked older than them both and I am sure Trina may be in her mid 40's now. 

 

I don't know about this episode and I usually LOVE Shawn episodes (when its not about Maya). 

Edited June 20, 2015 by venusnv80

[Mabinogia]

The end result would be of Katy confessing to her daughter that she was only trying to get close to Shawn for her and that she really didn't have any romantic feelings for him.

 

 

Oh how I wish that would happen. I get two young girls thinking "I like this guy, he's like a dad, he needs to hook up with my mom so we can be a family" because kids logic can be pretty simple like that. I hate that pretty much everyone else on the show is also pushing the Shawn/Katy agenda and I would love, if this weren't a Disney show for idealistic little kids, to see it all blow up. Shawn and Katy go on their forced date like everyone on earth is basically forcing them to do, and they hate it. Maybe Maya learns that she can have a relationship with Shawn (paternal though their chemistry is disturbing at times) without shoving her mother down his throat too and vice versa.

 

I have always fought against every pre-destined, forced relationship writers think everyone should support so I am never going to like Shawn and Katy on principle, but also because I just don't see it. AT ALL Maya and Shawn have more chemistry than Shawn and Katy. Hell, Lucas and Riley have more chemistry than Shawn and Katy and it's not easy to have chemistry with a cute cardboard boyfriend. lol

 

 Funniest moment of the ep to me was noticing that they replaced Zay (black male with a speaking role) with a random black female because all I oculd think was "OMG Zay had a sex change!" Since we all know there is only one black kind in that whole school. hehe

[Fostersmom]

 

As for Angela's appearance, well..I guess it just happened to give the Shawn and Angela fans a crumb (and literally that's what it was). I also noticed in that scene with Katy, Angela and Shawn...Katy looked older than them both and I am sure Trina may be in her mid 40's now.

 

 

According to Wiki she's almost 46 (Trina)

 

 

Funniest moment of the ep to me was noticing that they replaced Zay (black male with a speaking role) with a random black female because all I oculd think was "OMG Zay had a sex change!" Since we all know there is only one black kind in that whole school. hehe

 

YES! I completely noticed the random new black student in Zay's seat! Although last week, Zay was in Lucas's seat and a generic kid was in Zay's seat. 

Edited June 20, 2015 by Fostersmom

[MostlyC]

I agree too that they shouldn't be taking the edge off of the Maya character.  The last thing she needs is to be another Disneyfied character.

 

Turning Maya into Riley is, for me, a mistake by the producers.  The difference between the two girls is an important part of the show.  I like the character of Shawn, but if he also turns in "Corey," then what is the point of the show?  Without conflict,or balance between the happy and sad, then I think there is  no good story.

 

I was happy to be surprised at the arrival of Ghost Shawn's Dad (Chet)?  It's kind of odd to me, because he wasn't a good father while he was alive, but he's somehow a great dad now that he's dead?  Anyway,  I like it because it gave Shawn some hope- and it seems that hope was the main storyline.

[bettername2come]

I was happy to be surprised at the arrival of Ghost Shawn's Dad (Chet)?  It's kind of odd to me, because he wasn't a good father while he was alive, but he's somehow a great dad now that he's dead?  Anyway,  I like it because it gave Shawn some hope- and it seems that hope was the main storyline.

 

Although, if Ghost!Chet is just a fantasy of Shawn's, it makes total sense that Chet is a better father now.

 

I could have done without Angela. Or with some Angela/Topanga interaction. As much as I loved Shawn/Angela, I think that goodbye they had in Boy Meets World sounded like Shawn accepting it was over. I don't mind Shawn and Katy, but they haven't convinced me that he likes her for her yet, I'd have to see their date.

 

"Kermit?!" was the best part of the episode for me because he and I had the same reaction.

Edited June 21, 2015 by bettername2come

[bagert]

So, kind of off-topic - was the clothing store supposed to be Demolition (the one first used in the episode with Debby Ryan) - maybe with new owners?

Edited June 21, 2015 by bagert

[allonsyalice]

Yup, that was Demolition!

[AntiBeeSpray]

Don't forget, it was one big hurricane BBQ down there. Seriously, Disney? 

 

^ This. Hands down. There were people going through terrible circumstances at the time, Disney. A lot of them were forced to leave their homes. Way to misrepresent what was going on to a point.

According to Wiki she's almost 46 (Trina)

 

 

YES! I completely noticed the random new black student in Zay's seat! Although last week, Zay was in Lucas's seat and a generic kid was in Zay's seat. 

 

Damn.

 

Boy do I feel old :O.

[BigPaul25]

Ya know, I initially watched this show out if BMW nostalgia but do care about the core characters. I'm fine with the show's Angela closure and with giving Maya hope. I can see where at times this show can become the Maya and Shawn learn stuff show, but I'm fine with that. It seems if Rider Strong is not in an ep this season, he's probably directing one.

BTW, wasn't the dress that Riley came out in at Demolition the same one she wore on her first date with Lucas?

[dd21dd21]

I signed up just to voice my displeasure with this episode

 

Everything about Angela's scene was awkward...I rather they not have had her on at all than the scene we got

 

and what are they doing to Shawn! bad enough they rewrote Shawn/Angela breakup so kids can like Shawn more but him and Maya's mother? NO..

 

Also Maya is on quite the winning streak huh? they like to remind us that she is the girl Shawn but outside of the first episode(no one helps me with my homework!) how is she not Riley?

 

 

[Canadian213]

If anyone's interested, I wrote a blog post about my thoughts on Hurricane and Shawngela on gmwpodcast.com:

 

http://gmwpodcast.com/2015/06/25/he-still-loves-you-donna-karan/

[madfortv]

I like the idea of Shawn and Katy together. I never cared for Angela but could not figure out the reason. Now I understand. She came across as distant or uncomfortable in the role.

[AmandaPanda]

I finally got to watch this episode last night. I'm still not sold on the idea of Shawn and Katy as a couple, but I'm open to them working toward it. I thought the shopping scene was so awkward. I loved some of the clothes that Maya got, but I hated that Peter Pan collar dress. I think it would have worked if she weren't wearing knee-high boots with it. That just made it look weird. The Angela scenes were so stilted and awkward. I liked Shawn and Angela as a couple, but I never thought they would be together years later. They needed each other to grow at that time, but their life paths were just too different. I can understand why Angela would have reached out to Shawn, but at the same time, it would have made more sense to write a letter or find him on Facebook. I think my overall issue with this episode is that it was just awkward. If they were going to have Angela come back, I would have rather them had her just naturally bump into Shawn somewhere. Maybe she and her husband came to the bakery because she liked the name or because she knew Topanga ran it. It would have made more sense for it to be a natural meeting rather than her seeking out Shawn to ask his permission to procreate. That was just weird.

[Skyfall]

Just realized William Russ directed this episode. That explains why everything (outside of the Angela scene) worked so well, the lesson was factual, and it felt like a BMW lesson.

[CurbUrEnthusiasm]

If anyone's interested, I wrote a blog post about my thoughts on Hurricane and Shawngela on gmwpodcast.com:

 

http://gmwpodcast.com/2015/06/25/he-still-loves-you-donna-karan/

Great post! Very well-written. Really enjoyed your assessment of the episode and I agree with many of your points.

 

Just realized William Russ directed this episode. That explains why everything (outside of the Angela scene) worked so well, the lesson was factual, and it felt like a BMW lesson.

Actually I find that incredibly disappointing since I thought the episode was a huge mess for the most part and nothing about it worked well. The lessons on BMW  were typically much more organic and "real"...but this is a Disney show, so I should know to lower my expectations (I will aways be bitter this show ended up on Disney and not ABC family). I just wish this show would rely a teensy bit less on all these parallels and BMW nostalgia to create its "lessons". But it's sweet to know the likes of Ben, Rider (and his brother), and the "old vanguard" are so intimately involved with the show.

 

I finally got to watch this episode last night. I'm still not sold on the idea of Shawn and Katy as a couple, but I'm open to them working toward it. I thought the shopping scene was so awkward. I loved some of the clothes that Maya got, but I hated that Peter Pan collar dress. I think it would have worked if she weren't wearing knee-high boots with it. That just made it look weird. The Angela scenes were so stilted and awkward. I liked Shawn and Angela as a couple, but I never thought they would be together years later. They needed each other to grow at that time, but their life paths were just too different. I can understand why Angela would have reached out to Shawn, but at the same time, it would have made more sense to write a letter or find him on Facebook. I think my overall issue with this episode is that it was just awkward. If they were going to have Angela come back, I would have rather them had her just naturally bump into Shawn somewhere. Maybe she and her husband came to the bakery because she liked the name or because she knew Topanga ran it. It would have made more sense for it to be a natural meeting rather than her seeking out Shawn to ask his permission to procreate. That was just weird.

It was so bizarre and poorly executed - her appearance was pointless and disappointing. Whether or not you like Angela or her pairing with Shawn, that was just weakly developed story-telling and questionable writing. In many ways, Michael Jacobs was in a tough position - not bringing Angela back at all would have been disappointing for many. However, TPTB could have found infinitely better ways to write this storyline and integrate the character into the episode (and without rewriting BMW history - I'm still in awe they seriously had Shawn ask Angela why she "left" him and how Cory barely acknowledged his old friend/acquaintance).

 

I won't get into the absurdity of giving Shawn this forced, saccharine insta-family but his bond with Maya is so very sweet. For the umpteenth time, I just wish the writers would realize he can be part of Maya's life and a "father figure" without actually dating her mom. Actually that could potentially be a great storyline for Maya.

 

Lastly, great post, spanana! Actually, I aways thought him falling in love with her via the items in her purse was a charming, sweet part of their relationship and more than adequate "backstory".

[KerleyQ]

I kind of bought Shawn viewing it as her leaving him.  That's Shawn's long running issue - he feels like he's somehow not worthy because people keep leaving him.  No matter how Angela presented her trip to him, he was going to see it as her leaving him.  That's not saying that she did leave him (or, at least, that she intended it as her leaving him at that time), but that's how he felt.  

[Canadian213]

I kind of bought Shawn viewing it as her leaving him.  That's Shawn's long running issue - he feels like he's somehow not worthy because people keep leaving him.  No matter how Angela presented her trip to him, he was going to see it as her leaving him.  That's not saying that she did leave him (or, at least, that she intended it as her leaving him at that time), but that's how he felt.  

 

But Cory and Topanga know that's not what went down. By having them not convey in any way the reality surrounding Angela's leaving, it's like they agree that she callously left him when she didn't. Retcon.

[SmithW6079]

Cory summed this episode up best: "Awkward, meet Awkward. Awkward."

 

I never liked Angela -- I don't think she fit in with the rest of the crowd (I also didn't like the tall red-head roommate Jack and Eric were always fighting over) -- so I never felt that we needed "closure." She and Shawn were college sweethearts who broke up. Happens all the time. And it was a ridiculous that she'd seek him out after 10 years or so of apparently never seeing him to ask his opinion on her having children.

 

I do agree that they're trying to shoehorn Shawn into ready-made fatherhood, and they really should just leave it be. Angsty Shawn is my least favorite Shawn. Just get back to the love story of Topanga, Cory, and Shawn.

 

A classroom scene where there was actual learning going on! (Or at least, no Riley & Maya antics, until Cory made it all about Maya and hope.)

[TwistedandBored]

I agree with the people online who said, "this episode should have a two-parter episodes". It should have started with Maya's hope and ending with a closer found between Angela/Shawn and Maya getting what she wanted. This could also have given them a chance for Angela to interact with her old friends. 

[SmithW6079]

I said this over on the Spoilers thread, but I'll repeat it here:

 

To me, despite what the fans say or might want, this show isn't "Boy Meets World: The Adult Years." It's Girl Meets World, which is about Riley and Maya and their friends and relationships. Shawn Hunter's ex-girlfriend from 15 years ago is not part of that world. And if we're going to be subjected to continual Shawn angst, I'd rather he not be on the show.

[Canadian213]

Angela absolutely could have been a part of this "World" had she been introduced as married to Shawn. She relates to Maya the exact same way Shawn does because she was also abandoned by a parent. Shawn and Angela could've both been adult mentorish figures for Maya and showed her that in spite of being left, you can overcome it and maintain a healthy marriage/relationship (cause I'm SURE those issues will come up for Maya in the future). Angela could even do that if her and her husband were introduced.

If the show also wanted to continue the Cory/Topanga Shawn/Angela juxtaposition (something I'm not a fan of personally) they could've had Shawn and Angela display a conversely more difficult/realistic marriage than Cory and Topanga.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Canadian213

[CurbUrEnthusiasm]

Angela's just not part of the GMW universe. She was a bit more than just "Shawn's ex-girlfriend" but it is what it is. That is not the crux of the problem at all (for me).

 

I'm pretty sure most people with a lick of sense realize this show is about the new generation of kids and they are the central focus - as it should be. Otherwise, I can't imagine putting up with this show for too long.

 

However, it's also extremely silly to think that absolutely no one in the audience is watching for the slight nostalgia factor, particularly if the show makes a concerted effort to bring back old BMW characters time and time again. So when they are brought back, I don't think it's at all unreasonable to ask for some half-way decent writing, respect for the characters' previous history (along with some semblance of accuracy), and adequate, sensible integration of them into the main storyline. I don't care how much you personally like or dislike the character - the same principle should apply. That's partly why Eric's appearance was so much more enjoyable.

Edited July 2, 2015 by CurbUrEnthusiasm

[TwistedandBored]

No one is saying Angela should be part of GMW. All everyone is saying is the character and her history on the show should have been treated with a little more respectful than what we were given. 

[skeskali]

Did the Katrina metaphor about "things getting better" rub anyone else the wrong way?

 

 

If anyone's interested, I wrote a blog post about my thoughts on Hurricane and Shawngela on gmwpodcast.com:

 

http://gmwpodcast.com/2015/06/25/he-still-loves-you-donna-karan/

 

OMG, I thought I was the only one who was ticked off at the misogyny, the "ownership" male characters (Shawn mostly, but Cory too) displayed in this episode. THANK YOU.

 

I won't get into the absurdity of giving Shawn this forced, saccharine insta-family but his bond with Maya is so very sweet. For the umpteenth time, I just wish the writers would realize he can be part of Maya's life and a "father figure" without actually dating her mom. Actually that could potentially be a great storyline for Maya.

 

Sadly, this would probably only happen if the show aired on ABC Family.

 

 

No one even liked Angela! And the whole Shangela thing was rushed and had no backstory or driving force to it. So Shaty/Kawn is already much better than that.

 

Every single one of my black female friends who watched BMW back in the day watched it because of Shawn and Angela. As a matter of fact, I think I was the only one in my circle of friends who'd watched the show from the beginning; most of my black female friends only tuned in when Angela was added to the cast.

 

Well IMO Maya's Rolling Stones outfit was great, even if they used it to demonstrate something Shawn didn't like. Not that I even remotely get why a 14 year old is supposed to be wearing something representing a bunch of 70+ year old men.

 

I wore Beatles t-shirts and other memorabilia pretty much non-stop from the age of 12-17, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[SmithW6079]

OMG, I thought I was the only one who was ticked off at the misogyny, the "ownership" male characters (Shawn mostly, but Cory too) displayed in this episode. THANK YOU.

 

Only in feministaland does a male character doing something nice for a female character equal "misognyny."

 

Also, I did not think that means what you think it means. Here's the definition of misogyny: hatred of women. Show me where Shawn or Cory showed a "hatred" of women. Maybe condescension, but not hatred.

[AmandaPanda]

Alright, everyone. It's starting to get a bit heated in here. Let's remember that we are here to snark the show, not your fellow posters. 

[Canadian213]

Only in feministaland does a male character doing something nice for a female character equal "misognyny."

 

Also, I did not think that means what you think it means. Here's the definition of misogyny: hatred of women. Show me where Shawn or Cory showed a "hatred" of women. Maybe condescension, but not hatred.

 

The way the characters were written demonstrated how a man (Shawn) was superior to a woman (Katy). Portraying females as inferior to males is also misogynistic. This episode was written by a man not surprisingly.

 

Katy is being written inconsistently and I think that’s where the air of misogyny comes from. In one breath she expresses discontent with Shawn’s actions, but then Shawn responds with charm (“can’t we just have a good day?”, “I dress the kid up a little bit!”) & she almost immediately submits even though she had very very valid concerns. Maybe it’s cause she’s crushing on Shawn but if something more organic changed Katy’s mind I’d feel better about it. They’re writing Shawn as superior to Katy both financially and intellectually to me whilst writing Katy as downtrodden. I wish they made a point of saying whether or not Katy paid Shawn back for the locket money

Edited July 2, 2015 by Canadian213

[Kromm]

That's more sloppy amateurish writing than anything else. The writers decided from Day 1, even before Shawn was inserted into the picture, that they wanted the character of Maya to be kind of messed up because she had no Dad in the picture and a frazzled mother who was never around. They adjusted that picture a bit by bringing Katy into Topanga's business, but the root of the situation they're working from was always that Katy was a mess even before Shawn was written into the situation.

That's just storytelling, albeit sloppy and bad storytelling. There was no agenda there, I think, beyond them trying to prop up the reasons why Maya is supposedly messed up. Could they have done it better or in a more gender neutral/fair way? Of course. But the blame in my opinion is due to more to them coming up with this cockamamie notion that Maya and Shawn needed some instafamily situation, Katy already having been established as struggling and pretty flaky, and a bad cobbling together of the two situations.

I think the accusations of misogyny might ring more true if the show hadn't gone out of its way (to an extent unrealistically, if we're being honest) to show Topanga as this totally functional super-lawyer who not only is the main breadwinner for the family, and not only magically has plenty of time for her kids on top of that, but also is right in almost every debate she and Corey have on the show. I mean any signs of struggle on her part to make that all work--which would be the realistic situation--is kind of glossed over. And Katy is supposed to be Topanga's antithesis, I guess. That's seemingly the show's motivation, for good or ill, more than misogynistic writing. Shitty over-simplistic writing isn't the same thing.

[AmandaPanda]

I definitely agree with the idea that the writing of Katy isn't misogynist. It's just pure laziness. The writers wanted to capitalize on the popularity of Shawn and find a way to make him relevant to Riley's life. If he is her best friend's stepfather, then he'll be around more and the BMW fans will be happy, or at least that's the thought process. They haven't taken any time to flesh out Katy's character. She is a tool for a story. If the genders were reversed and Shawn was a female character, then I fully believe there would be some man ready to fill the Katy role. 

[KerleyQ]

I actually think the show has done a decent job of showing that what the kids might initially view as Katy being "flaky" or whatever is her actually working her butt off to provide a roof over her daughter's head.  She isn't always around for things because she has to work.  She was missing out on Maya's birthday party because she was trying to work extra shifts to buy her a locket.  And Topanga (and then Shawn) pointed out that while Shawn buying the clothes for Maya is the more "fun" thing, Katy works her butt off to provide all those every day things that kids take for granted - food, shelter, electricity, etc.  

[Kromm]

I actually think the show has done a decent job of showing that what the kids might initially view as Katy being "flaky" or whatever is her actually working her butt off to provide a roof over her daughter's head.  She isn't always around for things because she has to work.  She was missing out on Maya's birthday party because she was trying to work extra shifts to buy her a locket.  And Topanga (and then Shawn) pointed out that while Shawn buying the clothes for Maya is the more "fun" thing, Katy works her butt off to provide all those every day things that kids take for granted - food, shelter, electricity, etc.

I think the poster upthread might dislike that it took Shawn to point that out. That it comes off like a "male rescue" scenario.

Of course you've helped us clarify that it was actually Topnaga who insisted Shawn do so. She was the main actor of the situation, while he was simply the tag-along.

Edited July 2, 2015 by Kromm

[grandemocha]

Is child support too mature of a topic for the Disney crowd? Why the hell isn't Maya's absentee dad paying up?

[KerleyQ]

Is child support too mature of a topic for the Disney crowd? Why the hell isn't Maya's absentee dad paying up?

 

I've always had the impression that her mother doesn't even know where he is.  I'm not sure why I have that impression, though. 

[MostlyC]

I think Maya said in the last season that her Dad had another family now. 

As much as I like Shawn and Maya's bond, I don't want Maya to have her insta family.  But then, this is disney, so who knows.  Wonder if the show will get more than 4 seasons.

[Spencer Hastings]

This episode bothered me for so many reasons. I'm going to preface this by saying that I realize I'm not the target audience. This show isn't written for people my age. I'm in that weird age gap where I was too young for the first few seasons of BMW but just old enough to catch the last two seasons. So I have a lot of feelings.

1. Shawn Hunter is no one's father. They can give him as many scenes as they want with Cory talking about those "father" moments but I can't see Shawn Hunter jumping into that role so quickly. It feels rushed. Can I see him being like Mr. Turner eventually? Yes. But the writers need to show a gradual progression, not a "Oh, you're Riley's best friend. Your dad abandoned you too. Your mom is pretty. Here are some clothes. You look beautiful." smack in the face. This relationship went from 0 to 100. Maybe it's because they have a story to tell but can only use Rider for 1/4 of the episodes so they pack as much as they can in. But they need to slow down because this kind of deal isn't something that Shawn Hunter would jump into.

2. They need to work on whatever they're doing with Shawn and Maya. They have chemistry but it's the wrong kind. She seems more like a jealous girlfriend than some little orphan child hoping for a daddy. It makes all of their interactions seem more skeevy than they should. They have more chemistry than Katy and Shawn do.

3. The hurricane. Angela. I didn't like Angela growing up. I won't talk about how inaccurate the backstory is because continuity is not Jacobs' strongpoint but this episode felt like a very calculated move to get rid of the Angela problem and force Katy on us. Growing up, I appreciated that this show didn't underestimate their viewers by spelling things out for them (to a certain extent) but I feel like they're telling viewers that they have to like Katy and Angela=bad. I'd like to have seen more of a fair playing field here. I know that Angela can't be a part of the show and that they have a big happy family ending in kind but at least let me decide who to root for instead of just running Angela over with a bulldozer. Again, I didn't even like Angela on BMW but that was my choice. They even made Lauren likable back in the day when we knew darn well Cory and Topanga were the only option.

4. Cory is a dirty traitor and he's basically dead to me after his interaction with Shawn and Angela. They were all best friends but again, Katy good, Angela bad.

This episode was just a mess. I think that better pacing and more accurate characterization would have helped. It was nice to see Chet again.

Edited July 3, 2015 by Spencer Hastings

[Canadian213]

This episode bothered me for so many reasons. I'm going to preface this by saying that I realize I'm not the target audience. This show isn't written for people my age. I'm in that weird age gap where I was too young for the first few seasons of BMW but just old enough to catch the last two seasons. So I have a lot of feelings.

1. Shawn Hunter is no one's father. They can give him as many scenes as they want with Cory talking about those "father" moments but I can't see Shawn Hunter jumping into that role so quickly. It feels rushed. Can I see him being like Mr. Turner eventually? Yes. But the writers need to show a gradual progression, not a "Oh, you're Riley's best friend. Your dad abandoned you too. Your mom is pretty. Here are some clothes. You look beautiful." smack in the face. This relationship went from 0 to 100. Maybe it's because they have a story to tell but can only use Rider for 1/4 of the episodes so they pack as much as they can in. But they need to slow down because this kind of deal isn't something that Shawn Hunter would jump into.

2. They need to work on whatever they're doing with Shawn and Maya. They have chemistry but it's the wrong kind. She seems more like a jealous girlfriend than some little orphan child hoping for a daddy. It makes all of their interactions seem more skeevy than they should. They have more chemistry than Katy and Shawn do.

3. The hurricane. Angela. I didn't like Angela growing up. I won't talk about how inaccurate the backstory is because continuity is not Jacobs' strongpoint but this episode felt like a very calculated move to get rid of the Angela problem and force Katy on us. Growing up, I appreciated that this show didn't underestimate their viewers by spelling things out for them (to a certain extent) but I feel like they're telling viewers that they have to like Katy and Angela=bad. I'd like to have seen more of a fair playing field here. I know that Angela can't be a part of the show and that they have a big happy family ending in kind but at least let me decide who to root for instead of just running Angela over with a bulldozer. Again, I didn't even like Angela on BMW but that was my choice. They even made Lauren likable back in the day when we knew darn well Cory and Topanga were the only option.

4. Cory is a dirty traitor and he's basically dead to me after his interaction with Shawn and Angela. They were all best friends but again, Katy good, Angela bad.

This episode was just a mess. I think that better pacing and more accurate characterization would have helped. It was nice to see Chet again.

 

Can you exalt people on this board? Because holy balls. LOVE.  ALL.  OF.  THIS.

[grandemocha]

 

I think Maya said in the last season that her Dad had another family now.

Then he should be paying child support for his other child that he apparently abandoned. I mean, any little bit would help IMO. I heard her dad is supposed to show up later this season.

[skeskali]

I think the poster upthread might dislike that it took Shawn to point that out. That it comes off like a "male rescue" scenario.

 

 

You would be right.

[dd21dd21]

in what way did the show display SHAWN HUNTER of all people superior to Katy financially and intellectually( we are talking about Shawn right?)... ?  

Shawn I assume is always on the road and Katy has a kid, apartment, bills   so he can waste his money moreso than she can I think he even mentions this

 

and on a show where a female(Topanga) is a lawyer while Cory is a teacher and since the start Boy Meets World was always seen as smarter than Cory I just don't see it

 

 

 

 

The way the characters were written demonstrated how a man (Shawn) was superior to a woman (Katy). Portraying females as inferior to males is also misogynistic. This episode was written by a man not surprisingly.

 

Katy is being written inconsistently and I think that’s where the air of misogyny comes from. In one breath she expresses discontent with Shawn’s actions, but then Shawn responds with charm (“can’t we just have a good day?”, “I dress the kid up a little bit!”) & she almost immediately submits even though she had very very valid concerns. Maybe it’s cause she’s crushing on Shawn but if something more organic changed Katy’s mind I’d feel better about it. They’re writing Shawn as superior to Katy both financially and intellectually to me whilst writing Katy as downtrodden. I wish they made a point of saying whether or not Katy paid Shawn back for the locket money