Season 17 Live Feed Discussion: Watch People Sleep All Day!

[poopchute]

I understand not wanting to be drunk but I think is really strange to not take one sip of celebratory champagne. Steve is just a terrible asshole and must be even worse in real life.

[Vicky]

I don't drink alcohol either. If someone wanted to pour me champagne so I could celebrate, I'd surely clink our glasses and say congratulations, but I'd no way take a sip of champagne.  I'm not a problem drinker, I have no religious or health reasons for not drinking alcohol.  I don't like it.  There's nothing wrong with not drinking alcohol.  I wouldn't eat a spicy hot pepper either.  Live and let live.  

[le bordel chaud]

Of the many things I find odd about Steve, the fact that he didn't want to drink champagne is not one of them.

OTOH him saying, "They're talking in there" and then fleeing like he was being chased by an axe-wielding murderer? That was weird.

[mayziemay]

I would take Steve to final 2 if I was Vanessa, he was not well liked and was not a comp beast. But then again, i don't think the people in jury like either Liz or Steve except Julia and douche judas.

[robertorv]

I remember Cody last year around this time being on HOH room lockdown as the second part of the final HOH was being played. He was so restless up there he was losing his mind. Lots of talking to himself...the thing you could clearly make out was that he was counting jury votes and he knew there was no way that he was going to beat Derrick. A few days later Cody wins the HOH and takes Derrick anyways.

I bring this up because I was reading on Jokers about a conversation from earlier tonight between Steve and Liz where they were acknowledging to each other that they cant beat Van in the jury vote. They didnt come out and actually say it in those words but it was obvious what they meant. I just hope we dont get a repeat from last year. I Know that Steve privately fantasizes about telling Van to get to stepping...but in the moment of truth will he have the guts to do it? And what about Liz (the one I am rooting for)...now that I know that she knows that she cant be Van, Im going to be so disapointed if she wins HOH and picks Van anyways.

Im not sure how much I trust them to do the right thing. I almost hope that Van wins HOH and then that way she picks one (hopefully Liz) to take to their inevitable second place finish. I would rather see that over seeing one of them become this years Cody.

Edited September 19, 2015 by robertorv

[Guest]

John is GONE now.  Finally.  Why discuss his winning chances?  There are none, so that's irrelevant.

 

And yet still more interesting than the prospect of any of the actual final three winning.  

[call me ishmael]

I remember Cody last year around this time being on HOH room lockdown as the second part of the final HOH was being played. He was so restless up there he was losing his mind. Lots of talking to himself...the thing you could clearly make out was that he was counting jury votes and he knew there was no way that he was going to beat Derrick. A few days later Cody wins the HOH and takes Derrick anyways.

I bring this up because I was reading on Jokers about a conversation from earlier tonight between Steve and Liz where they were acknowledging to each other that they cant beat Van in the jury vote. They didnt come out and actually say it in those words but it was obvious what they meant. I just hope we dont get a repeat from last year. I Know that Steve privately fantasizes about telling Van to get to stepping...but in the moment of truth will he have the guts to do it? And what about Liz (the one I am rooting for)...now that I know that she knows that she cant be Van, Im going to be so disapointed if she wins HOH and picks Van anyways.

Im not sure how much I trust them to do the right thing. I almost hope that Van wins HOH and then that way she picks one (hopefully Liz) to take to their inevitable second place finish. I would rather see that over seeing one of them become this years Cody.

I wonder if liz actually believes that. She knows she has two votes and may be counting on Austin to sway some votes or a bitter jury. She may be trying to get Steve to take her is he wins HOH.

[robertorv]

The convo between them was mostly about how Liz doesnt believe in such a thing as a bitter jury. She and Steve were saying that all changed since Dr Will started talking to the jury and setting them straight about voting strickly based on game and not on emotion. Steve said that Dan would have won BB14 if Dr Will had paid a visit to that jury

[Katesus7]

Of the many things I find odd about Steve, the fact that he didn't want to drink champagne is not one of them.

OTOH him saying, "They're talking in there" and then fleeing like he was being chased by an axe-wielding murderer? That was weird.

I think that comes from the beginning of the season, where people kept saying that Steve would creep into conversations between two people, and he got some flack for that. He finally promised (I believe in one of his monologues to the cameras) that he would make it a point NOT to join any conversation unless there were at least three people. He was pretty vigilant about it for awhile. I think that ship has sailed, though, so he should probably get a grip.

I want to see Steve and Vanessa face off in the final HOH. My Steve/Vanessa final two ship seems to have sailed, so I'll take Steve getting some courage and booting Vanessa. Or Vanessa smoking Liz in the final two. Either/Or.

[alegria]

Steve won! 

Edited September 19, 2015 by alegria

[Katesus7]

Fantastic! Vanessa isn't safe, and the final comp will be the mother of all crapshoots. Honestly, even though the answers are so stupid, I still expect Vanessa to smoke Steve. He just has zero clue about what anyone is really thinking at any time.

[Petunia13]

The final HOH comp wins happened exactly how I predicted days ago.

The only way Steven has a chance of winning is if he wins the final one and then discovers his balls and evicts Vanessa. Then he will have a compelling argument for jury backed up by his comp wins. Bug I don't think he has the gumption to evict her and its possible cray cray will win the last round.

[loki567]

Fantastic! Vanessa isn't safe, and the final comp will be the mother of all crapshoots. Honestly, even though the answers are so stupid, I still expect Vanessa to smoke Steve. He just has zero clue about what anyone is really thinking at any time.

 

I have to point out that Ian, arguably the only houseguest who could rival Steve in the social awkwardness category, answered every single one of the part 3 questions right. It's complete luck. Anybody could 50/50 their way into a win. 

[Petunia13]

Ian was actually more sociable than Steve. He got along with Britney, Boogie, Dan, the airhead Ashley. The first 3 are more cunning in social game and they coached/mentored that scamp and guided him. I actually think Ian knows more BB trivia than Steve and is a teacher in RL so he might be better at memorization or studying people.

I'm not an Ian fan btw.

Also Vanessa has interrogated the shit outta every HG daily for hours so she SHOULD have an edge over Steven. Maybe.

[Xazeal]

The fact that Vanessa has an insane memory and would be able to recall precise details of her conversations with the jurors could help as well. Also, as someone pointed out somewhere else, some of the fake answers don't really line up with the juror's speech patterns, which I'm sure she'd notice.

 

But in reality, it's a coin flip. It's going to be intense.

[Ceeg]

Steve won the Bleep HOH, which is basically guessing/knowing what HGs have said. So, I wouldn't assume he'd be bad at R3.

[Eolivet]

I remember Cody last year around this time being on HOH room lockdown as the second part of the final HOH was being played. He was so restless up there he was losing his mind. Lots of talking to himself...the thing you could clearly make out was that he was counting jury votes and he knew there was no way that he was going to beat Derrick. A few days later Cody wins the HOH and takes Derrick anyways.

 

It was last year, and I'm trying to block as much of that season from my mind, so forgive me if my memory is faulty, but didn't it seem like this was the first time Cody had ever considered voting out Derrick? Whereas Steve has been saying he wants to do this for weeks -- practicing for it, even. There's a difference between having a fleeting (in Cody's case, very fleeting) thought and having an active plan.

 

If Vanessa doesn't win this, she's screwed. I hope she knows this, because I at least want to deprive Steve the "pleasure" of a blindside.

[ByaNose]

Well, the Final 2 is what I hoped for. I just want to see Vanessa sweat just a littttllle bit. The "what did I say?" Is so stupid & 50/50 that either could win. In the end, Vanessa deserves to win but if Steve wins he knows he has to evict her, right?

[peachmangosteen]

Also, as someone pointed out somewhere else, some of the fake answers don't really line up with the juror's speech patterns, which I'm sure she'd notice.

 

They don't hear them say the answer until they've already guessed it, so this wouldn't matter.

 

It's a literal crapshoot. It's a guessing game. Steve will probably be flustered though, which could affect him, but he's actually won two comps when he was super flustered, so maybe that actually helps him.

 

The only person I actually want to see win is Liz and there is zero chance of that happening, so I want one of two things to happen just because they'd be funny to me: Steve wins final HOH and evicts Vanessa or the F2 is Vanessa/Steve and Steve wins. Basically I want Vanessa to lose because it'll be funny to me. Normally when we get down to F3 I hate everyone so I'm usually just rooting for the most hilarious outcome.

[TheGapper]

I don't have a problem with Steve not drinking either.  I know he gives away his HOH alcohol, but I thought he was just being generous, or it was possible game play.  I just found it interesting that he refused a sip of champagne.  I wondered if he had moral or religious reasons.

  

Well, I drink a lot of wine and beer and some cocktails with vodka or bourbon. I can't stand champagne though. It just tastes like crap to me. Even the $200 bottle ones. I only drink it with OJ.

Even though they're the final 3 and competing for the half-mil, the atmosphere in that house must be so much more pleasant with Austin the delusional, needy, grandiose, whiny bully-baby gone.

  

That is something so refreshing about this season. I enjoyed that. Watching the season with toxic Donato was cringing and unpleasant.

I watch the The Talk often and Julie is very careful about what she says on air. I think perhaps it's partly because people might wrongly assume she's speaking for her husband when she might not be. Even if she didn't see all of Austin's misbehavior herself, BB production staff would have and probably told her either via her earpiece or after the taping. I think she likely wouldn't have tweeted anything if it wasn't true; there's no reason for someone in her position to make herself look clueless for no reason.

 

I don't watch The View, but I read this past week that they made fun of one of The Miss America contestants who wore a stethoscope since she was a nurse. They claimed she took the doctor's stethoscope or something to that effect. Basically insinuating that a nurse could not and should not wear one, which infuriated all the nurses in our town. That makes me think that those women on The View must be clueless and obviously not care about what they say.

 

I think houseguests look at the returning houseguest as just another twist you have to roll with, just like twins, siblings of famous people, coup d'etats, Team America, etc. 

That makes me wish for this final fuck you to Austin. I hope that Liz and Julia gets asked to do Americas Race, i think that's the name of that partners race show.

[Joimiaroxeu]

That makes me think that those women on The View must be clueless and obviously not care about what they say.

There's at least one of those types on The Talk too but she's mainly used for comic relief. However, that show appears to be very tightly run and I don't think the women say much on air that hasn't been vetted beforehand. I don't watch The View ever but found it amusing that Julie Chen has publicly talked trash about the show. I'm guessing some of that is based on inside industry knowledge about what a clusterfcuk The View appears to be both in front of and behind the camera.

 

Good news about Steve I guess. I'd rather see him in the F2 versus Liz mainly because of the dismissive way many of the houseguests treated him. Some of them acted like they were repulsed by him (and I do understand that some of that may be with good reason). However, I don't want to see him win the $500k because I think he spent at least half the season coasting along. Vanessa, for better or worse, IMO has worked hard the entire season and has earned the win.

[ByaNose]

I'm sure no one is more suprised about Steve than Jason. Didn't Jason say there was no chance Steve would even make jury? That said, either did I. I thought he was too annoying & the HG would tire of him really. Somehow, winning a few HOH's, help from Vanessa & Steve & a little luck he's in the Final 3. I didn't think he had a chance just for the fact that he was supposed to be the Ian clone and the HG would have cut him really just for that alone.

[peachmangosteen]

I just read that Vanessa compared BB to concentration camps. I mean honestly how does one even respond to that kind of bullshit?

[Ceeg]

Steve benefitted greatly from Vanessa's help. But also because Vanessa pulled him into a power alliance where he was the least threatening of the entire alliance. A showmance, a mastermind, twins, and then there's Steve. He also won HOHs at absolutely crucial moments.

If Steve wins the last HOH and evicts Vanessa, he probably deserves to win. I'll still be disappointed though that yet another white dude is crowned the BB winner.

I just read that Vanessa compared BB to concentration camps. I mean honestly how does one even respond to that kind of bullshit?

...I watched this conversation and I didn't hear her say that. I thought she was saying that even if none of them win, there's nothing to be stressed about bc there are bigger life things out there.

Her grandmother and great grandmother survived the Holocaust and the rest of her family died in it.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Ceeg

[ByaNose]

And, Vanessa has enough money already to survive what's out there. LOL!!! I wonder if anyone will bring that up?!

[jeansophie]

And, Vanessa has enough money already to survive what's out there. LOL!!! I wonder if anyone will bring that up?!

We know that Vanessa has won lots of money playing poker, but that doesn't necessarily mean she still has that money. Her answer to what she would do with the money if she won was that she could stop working to support herself and Mel and become a full time DJ and grow that business.

[peachmangosteen]

I do look forward to the jury finding out that Vanessa is such a successful and famous poker player. OK really just Austin lol! That is gonna be fun. 

[Eolivet]

If Steve wins, it will not only be another white dude winning, it will be a dude benefiting from a majority woman alliance, similar to Austin. Scamper Squad was four women, two men. I can be OK with Vanessa getting evicted as long as Liz wins and makes history. As others have said, Liz's twin status made her a big target, but she won competitions and seemed to have a decent social game.

 

Plus, the Sixth Sense and the Scamper Squad were the two biggest alliances of the season. They were what I have been screaming at women players to do forever -- the strong ones bond together, just like the dudes, and form a majority alliance. And win comps! And strategize! And the women this season were such good competitors because the majority of the jury are women (and will be even more lopsided if Vanessa is evicted).

 

So, it's a principle thing now. If Steve wins against a woman, in a jury with a majority of women, it says to all women superfans and future Big Brother players "You cannot make an alliance with dudes unless you kick them all out first, because if you have even one at the end, you will lose to him."

 

Vanessa or Liz has to win this thing. Since Shelly was evicted, they've been the two strongest women there. I wouldn't be saying this if it was Julia and Meg (though I'd be rooting for them to make history, as well). But Steve winning over Liz or Vanessa seems like a bigger travesty, given their respective roles in the season.

 

This isn't sexism, it's reality. Because if a woman can't win in this season, featuring a majority woman alliance, women twins, a woman mastermind and even a woman winning the freaking "fill up a bucket" comp, then to me, that's a pretty big statement.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Eolivet

[Sara2009]

I just can't root for Liz, woman or not. She's just too vile. I also think Vanessa and Steve have played better games. I'll be disappointed if Vanessa doesn't win, but I can swallow a Steve win easier than a Liz win.

[peachmangosteen]

I just can't root for Vanessa, woman or not. I don't like how she played the game and I don't like her personality. 

 

I'm torn on whether or not I want her in F2 though. If she is, she'll win, which sucks for me, but we'll get to see her jury speech/answers, which will be hilarious.

[MrsMommy]

I rooting for Steve to win, he overcame the most in the house and he deserves iy. Imho

[Cutty]

Scamper Squad was three women (Vanessa, Liz, Julia) and two men (Austin, Steve). 

 

And yeah, I can't root for Liz either. I don't think she is the greatest representation for women and I definitely don't think she's a strong woman. She basically relied on a man carrying her to where she is now, and has shit talked basically every other attractive female in the house. (She is so jealous of Jackie it's not even funny.) And lets not talk about what she did on the feeds with Austin. She's not the type of female winner I would want to see.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Cutty

[MKL122788]

I'm not 100% sure what Steve overcame in the scheme of the game. His awkwardness worked out in his favor because he was seen as a non-threat from the beginning.

 

He has never once seriously been the #1 target for eviction. The HoH reigns he had where he had any influence resulted in the eviction of Jackie and Julia. Dem big moves. He wanted Austin gone and then Liz and got Julia because literally everyone else in the house had more influence on the outcome than he did.

 

Steve had virtually no power the entire game and has been on the outskirts on a single alliance as opposed to central to 2 like the ladies. Vanessa's game has been much better strategically. Liz's game has been much better socially(shit talking goodbyes and DRs aside).

 

He simply has been a non-entity for too long. Can a last second eviction of Vanessa use short term memory sway over the jury? Possibly. But he doesn't deserve it based on his body of work.

Edited September 19, 2015 by MKL122788

[Sara2009]

I just can't root for Vanessa, woman or not. I don't like how she played the game and I don't like her personality.

I'm torn on whether or not I want her in F2 though. If she is, she'll win, which sucks for me, but we'll get to see her jury speech/answers,

which will be hilarious.

I can respect that.

To root for someone, I have to either find them likable or a good strategist. For me Liz is neither. Obviously this is all very subjective,though.

[Skycatcher]

 

The View,  made fun of one of The Miss America contestants who wore a stethoscope since she was a nurse.

OT, but FYI, several major advertisers are pulling out of The View in protest.  Funny how we never heard of advertisers pulling out during Aaryn's disgusting season.

[Ceeg]

He simply has been a non-entity for too long. Can a last second eviction of Vanessa use short term memory sway over the jury? Possibly. But he doesn't deserve it based on his body of work.

I just saw this post on tumblr, and I think I agree with it:

 

 

All of Steve’s “big moves” were only made because he really didn’t have another choice and if he wins final HoH and evicted Vanessa, it’ll be the same case. When Steve had the choice to make big moves, like flipping the vote against Vanessa a few weeks ago, or using the DE to evict a big player, he choked every time.

Steve doesn’t make big moves when he has a choice, Steve makes big moves when they’re his only option. And that’s not great gameplay, it’s just common sense.

I think a Steve/Liz F2 should be a toss-up as to who wins because there are pluses and minuses for both, but based on the jury's internal bias I'd guess that Steve wins. I'd be shocked if Liz is the one who becomes the first girl to beat a man on BB.

[ByaNose]

I 90% like how Vanessa played the game. If it weren't for all the crying & hysteria it would be a solid 100%. I don't want any woman or man crying as part of their strategy or attempt to guilt other HG. It just turns me off. It was made worse when she would cry and then start telling the other HG that it hurt her feelings that other HG were being doubting her and thought she was lying about something/anything. That said, everyone was afraid to go against her so she was doing something right.

Edited September 19, 2015 by ByaNose

[Sandiscot]

I don't like Vanessa, don't like how she played, but there is no doubt that she did play and she played her game her way.

 

If Liz were to win, Austin would take all the credit because he "kept her safe" so she could make the finals. She certainly hasn't done anyting to help herself since he left.

 

Steve is annoying and may keep some shrink busy for years. I think he is at the end thanks to Vanessa.

 

So, reluctantly, Vanessa ftw.

[peachmangosteen]

Liz's game has been much better socially(shit talking goodbyes and DRs aside).

 

I think Liz played a good social game, but overall I, sadly, think Steve is better liked anyway. There's really only 3 people on the jury (including Vanessa) that like Liz better than Steve: Austin, Julia, and Meg. Everyone else likes Steve more. Also, I don't think many of them would give Liz any credit for getting to the end (Becky would, I believe, and maybe Shelli.), while I think they absolutely would give Steve credit for it.

 

I don't like Vanessa, don't like how she played, but there is no doubt that she did play and she played her game her way.

 

I feel the same can be said for Liz and Steve as well though. I don't see how there can be any argument that Liz and Steve didn't play the game. Sure, they weren't going to everyone and demanding deals while crying about their integrity, but they played the game they could play and they played it well imo. There's no one left that was dragged to the end or didn't make any moves.

 

All of Steve’s “big moves” were only made because he really didn’t have another choice and if he wins final HoH and evicted Vanessa, it’ll be the same case. When Steve had the choice to make big moves, like flipping the vote against Vanessa a few weeks ago, or using the DE to evict a big player, he choked every time. Steve doesn’t make big moves when he has a choice, Steve makes big moves when they’re his only option. And that’s not great gameplay, it’s just common sense.

 

I don't really agree with this. I think that in terms of the game big moves are kinda overrated tbh. Now, as a viewer who watches more for entertainment than gameplay, I love them, but as a player sometimes they aren't necessary/don't make sense. And I believe that is the case for Steve. 

Edited September 19, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[AndreaK1041]

I think Steve played scared for a huge majority of the game, which I don't like. That's why I liked James (though his shrinking to the background when he was not in power I didn't like) and why I liked Janelle back it the day. I sort of love that wrecking ball, blood on your face type of player. It's not a good way to win of course, but I'm here to watch a TV show.

[Guest]

I just saw this post on tumblr, and I think I agree with it:

 

All of Steve’s “big moves” were only made because he really didn’t have another choice and if he wins final HoH and evicted Vanessa, it’ll be the same case.

 

I don't understand this.  They all have choices.  Evicting Vanessa now would be a choice.  Not evicting Vanessa earlier is a choice.  Who's to say he'd be where he is now if he evicted Vanessa weeks ago?

 

By this logic, no one has earned the win because the viewer just has to label all the choices they made as 'their only choice'.  

[peachmangosteen]

I think Steve played scared for a huge majority of the game, which I don't like. That's why I liked James (though his shrinking to the background when he was not in power I didn't like) and why I liked Janelle back it the day. I sort of love that wrecking ball, blood on your face type of player. It's not a good way to win of course, but I'm here to watch a TV show.

 

This. I mean for me as a viewer I like people who entertain me and I don't particularly care about whether or not they make the best strategic moves and not doing anything ever isn't entertaining to me, but it can be a valid strategy and is often the only choice some types of players have.

 

Who's to say he'd be where he is now if he evicted Vanessa weeks ago?

 

Exactly.

 

And who's to say Vanessa would still be here if it weren't for her alliance winning every HOH since week 7? I mean the fact that the people who's better interest it was to keep her kept winning really helped her get to the end. Same for Liz. I mean no one gets to the end alone and without any luck, I don't think.

 

I think all 3 have played well tbh. I just don't like how Vanessa played and I don't think Steve/Liz played a bad enough game where I would feel I have to vote for Vanessa anyway.

Edited September 19, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[Cramps]

Casting has given us such lame women over the years. Occasionally we'd get someone who was a powerhouse at competitions, but so rarely have we had good strategists. It's always been more about the bikini factor for them.

There were exceptions. I loved Danielle from season three. Maggie was like a cult leader, but wasn't enjoyable to watch. And Nakomis changed the game.

Whether you like Vanessa or not (and I do), she had been one of the most brilliant players ever to play this game and has kept it really interesting. She is the reason there are no floaters left at the end.

She is a force of nature and I hope she wins. That said, I don't know if I'd want to be stuck in a house with her for a whole summer.

PS-at least one of the twins and Steve would probably have been booted early if Vanessa hadn't decided she wanted them in her alliance. She has completely controlled this game.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Cramps

[Guest]

I respect Dan's or Derrick's game more than Vanessa's.  They at least were subtle in their manipulation, and aggressive in strategic moments (Dan, moreso).  Vanessa was like a constant jackhammer of aggressive manipulation.  There is just an air of desperation to her game that turns me off.  

[peachmangosteen]

PS-at least one of the twins and Steve would probably have been booted early if Vanessa hadn't decided she wanted them in her alliance. She has completely controlled this game.

 

If Vanessa's alliance hadn't have won 80% of the HOHs Vanessa would've probably been booted early, too, because she did a terrible job at playing the social game. But at the same time maybe she would've been able to guilt trip anyone who won into keeping her. And Steve might've been able to float through for awhile and then won key HOHs, which is basically what he did anyway. Liz might've won enough HOHs to keep her/Julia safe. Anything could've been possible if anything that happened went differently.

 

I wonder how the game would've went, particularly for Vanessa, if she had went through with her plan to BD Austin in week 5? I think she probably would've ended up pretty fucked if that would have happened. And I give Liz and Shelli a shit ton of credit (blame?) for Vanessa not doing it. But she also might've still got to the end anyway, who knows.

Vanessa was like a constant jackhammer of aggressive manipulation.  There is just an air of desperation to her game that turns me off.  

 

I agree. I feel like Vanessa's game is like 80% aggressive, gross manipulation tactics and I just don't like that style of play, particularly if it's such a large part of someone's gameplay and if I hate their personality lol.

Edited September 19, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[call me ishmael]

I wonder how the game would've went, particularly for Vanessa, if she had went through with her plan to BD Austin in week 5? I think she probably would've ended up pretty fucked if that would have happened. And I give Liz and Shelli a shit ton of credit (blame?) for Vanessa not doing it. But she also might've still got to the end anyway, who knows.

 

I think that she would have done fine.  I actually still wonder why she didn't at that point.  Austin had just outed the twins and if she used that as her excuse Julia would have been fine with it and even Liz probably wouldn't care (wasn't she at that point still in her "I'm just putting up with him phase"?)  In fact, that is the one thing I hold against her since then we wouldn't have had to put up with Austin all summer.  I think that she played the best game in the house otherwise and deserves to win.  But I think that she may not.

[peachmangosteen]

I actually still wonder why she didn't at that point.

Liz and, particularity, Shelli really talked her out of it. Plus Austin gave her what she wanted by begging her and profusely apologizing for ever daring to not play the game for her.

 

I think that she played the best game in the house otherwise and deserves to win.  But I think that she may not.

The only way Vanessa won't win is if she loses part 3 and Steve actually evicts her. She will beat them both at F2.

Edited September 19, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[call me ishmael]

Liz and, particularity, Shelli really talked her out of it. Plus Austin gave her what she wanted by begging her and profusely apologizing for ever daring to not play the game for her. The only way Vanessa won't win is if she loses part 3 and Steve actually evicts her. She will beat them both at F2.

If what people say about her neck being injured she might. I also think there is a chance Steve might at this point. He wouldn't have to deal with her at this point. The only other time that might have been true was when he nominated jackie andthere was no time to recover.

So is part 2 going on now? I don't actually have the feeds. Just everyone's great play by play.

[peachmangosteen]

If what people say about her neck being injured she might.

There's nothing physical about part 3. It's just guessing how the jury answered questions.

Steve already won part 2. Steve and Vanessa will face off in part 3 live on Wednesday.

[Katesus7]

If Steve wins part 3 HOH, boots Vanessa and wins agains Liz, he absolutely "deserves" it, whatever that even means. But I'm of the opinion that anyone who wins the game, regardless of how they got there, "deserves" it. I loathe him, but Dr. will deserved it even though he purposely never won a comp. Ian deserved it, even though I thought Dan played one hell of a game, while I thought Ian was just kind of there for half the season. Rachel deserved it, even though she had a HUGE helping hand by the "duo" twist being inexplicably brought back into the game at final six, and her being able to save both her AND Jordan from eviction. Dick deserved it....no, nope, that's where I draw the line. Dick won because he had his own soundtrack, and great edit, and "America" fell in love with him and basically kept him in the game. Still pisses me off after all these years.

I will always think of this season as the season of the strong, badass women players. But if Steve beats Liz (and I would vote for him to win over her, based on what I saw all season on the feeds), I personally don't see it as some statement where a woman can never beat a man. I would see it as this particular woman did not beat this particular man. Although I think Liz very well could pull it off.

Honestly, I keep trying to come up with a big rooting interest, but I think my reaction to any of these three winning would be "Eh, that's cool. When does Survivor start?" My big rooting interest went out the door with Johnny Mac. I know, I know, he was a complete spaz as a player, but I like who I like, I have no control over it!

Edited September 19, 2015 by Katesus7