BlackMamba August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) She revealed this to John? I hope John talks to people other than Vanessa, his game play is so weird/bad, like if Van came to you you would dismiss her, so he is gonna have to hustle to get at least James/Meg on the train to keep him, and assure the Austwins IF he stays he's totes 100% on their side going forward.No. She told the Scampers alliance early this. Again shes covering for Becky in case she comes back Thursday! Becky was the person who told her that Liz and Steve were the hinky votes to keep Jeff during week 5's hoh. Vanessa believed it then because When Jason was scrambling for votes she told Liz and Steve don't throw any hinky votes and Liz's eyes got real big as if she'd been caught. Early this morning, Liz sat in dummy silence but Austin defended her and said she didn't do it. Austin doesn't want to believe Liz liked Jeff but also she voted for him to keep the twin thing quiet. Does it make sense? As for Meg/James, James will go with the house this week to vote out John. Hes sliently pissed John told that he was going to throw hoh so John could gun for Vanessa. But make no mistake James said if he wins hoh next he will gun for Liztin. The twins will evict John. Both Steve and the Austwins need each other. Steve using them as buffers. Austin/Twins are using him as buffer. Edited August 25, 2015 by BlackMamba 2 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Did anyone watch this? I might have to go back and see how legit he sounded: Mon 9:03 PM BBT James/Meg discussing who to put up if they win HOH outside while playing pool. Mon 9:15 PM BBT Van: "How do I know anyone will keep the deals they make with me now."Austin: "I think James/Meg have been pretty consistent."(Meanwhile, outside James has been telling Meg he wants to put up Austin/Liz.) 2 Link to comment
Deputy Deputy CoS August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 It didn't register when Becky told Vanessa Liz and Steve were Jeff's hinky votes. She was too busy looking for reasons. I find it hard to believe that she is thinking back on that conversation and protecting Becky should she come back. I was surprised that she told John she hoped Shelli or Becky came back Thursday. Maybe like Becky, she'd have qualms working with a former nemesis. Did anyone watch this? I might have to go back and see how legit he sounded: But concluded it was too early. 1 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Too early to talk about or too early to put them up? If it's the latter, wtf? LOL too early to break up a threesome in a house of 8? Sigh. 2 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) Johnny Mac is proposing a deal with Vanessa. I really wish someone would follow through with a deal with him - he's been betrayed left and right every step of the way. If he's a secret mastermind or a guy bumbling his way through the game - he keeps trying to put something together (and then strangely sabotaging his own efforts). I wish John would acknowledge that he's a mess and a total flop game wise. It would go a long way in making me like him again. Maybe he is but Production would rather show him screaming and acting a fool in DR because it's 'cute' or whatever. Tue 12:18 AM BBT Van: "As a Big Brother fan, I feel like maybe you'll actually listen. It was douchy. You did my so dirty." Steve: "I agree." Tue 12:25 AM BBT Vanessa prods Steve about whether he feels like a douchebag about certain things. Steve people-pleasingly agrees he's a douche. Tue 12:30 AM BBT Vanessa says the "really funny part about this is that you f*cked yourself completely" by "scheming heavily." Steve: "Sounds like I earned it." Wow. I applaud these people for not punching Vanessa in the face tbh. She does this kinda shit all the time. I would go off. She's lucky there's so many weak/timid people around for her to treat this way. She'd be in a world of trouble if she tried this shit with stronger people/players. Too early to talk about or too early to put them up? If it's the latter, wtf? LOL too early to break up a threesome in a house of 8? Sigh. It's like everyone watched BB15 and thought Helen had a great strategy. Edited August 25, 2015 by peachmangosteen 8 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I was surprised that she told John she hoped Shelli or Becky came back Thursday. It was in a conversation with John, though, under a hypothetical situation where John stays and teams up with Vanessa. In that situation, Shelli and Becky would be preferable to Jackie or Steve, because Shelli and Becky have and probably would continue to work with either Vanessa or John. Whereas Jackie never has, and Steve would be feeling betrayed after being voted out, so probably wouldn't team up with them either. It's like everyone watched BB15 and thought Helen had a great strategy. This will be the season of everyone tiptoeing around Big Moves and no one actually doing anything because blood is hard to wash off of hands 4 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 This will be the season of everyone tiptoeing around Big Moves and no one actually doing anything because blood is hard to wash off of hands LOL. Except Vanessa, of course, who has been bathing in blood, jumping into pools of blood, etc. I was just thinking this week has actually been quite a good one. Some drama, some uncertainty, some great Vanessa quotes. And it's going to end in either John or Steve getting evicted, which is pleasing to me no matter which way it goes. Who'd have thought an Austin HOH would be so interesting?! 1 Link to comment
SiobhanJW August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) I think if Vanessa comes at the right Angle to James about keeping John it might happen. She needs to approach it as, I'm not mad at you guys for wanting me out. We've never worked together. But I've come to realize that we have a problem with the 3 headed monster upstairs. I've spoke to both John & Steve. Steve would put you guys up, while John will gun for them. John can get Becky to be on our side to help, you can get Jackie and I can try and get Shelli. Can we call a truce for a week. She needs to not present any "deals" and just give him the facts. Bring John into the conversation. James is a rational person he will listen. She just has to approach it right. She also needs to do it late Wednesday night, early Thursday morning. Edited August 25, 2015 by SiobhanJW 6 Link to comment
Deputy Deputy CoS August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Too early to talk about or too early to put them up? If it's the latter, wtf? LOL too early to break up a threesome in a house of 8? Sigh. Too early to put them up 1 Link to comment
Nashville August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I think if Vanessa comes at the right Angle to James about keeping John it might happen. ... She needs to not present any "deals" and just give him the facts. We been watching the same Vanessa? :D 9 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) We been watching the same Vanessa? :D LMAO I was just about to post the same thing. You're right about what she needs to do, SiobhanJW, but she just isn't capable of it. Edited August 25, 2015 by peachmangosteen 5 Link to comment
SiobhanJW August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 We been watching the same Vanessa? :D I know.. I know.. This is crazy talk. But we've seen moments of rational thinking in between all the crazy. We know it's there.. Kinda. Haha. 4 Link to comment
Nashville August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 LMAO I was just about to post the same thing. You're right about what she needs to do, SiobhanJW, but she just isn't capable of it. Echo echo. V's usual breakfast is two eggs over easy, buttered toast and three deals on the side. 8 Link to comment
njbarmaid August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I'll be happy for Thursday if anyone but the newly evicted comes back. Just to change things up. At least we know the HOH room will actually be used for sleeping. 1 Link to comment
Nashville August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I'll be happy for Thursday if anyone but the newly evicted comes back. Just to change things up. At least we know the HOH room will actually be used for sleeping. Assuming, of course, Liz doesn't win HoH. If that happens, the beefcakes will need to start stocking the HoH bathroom with the economy-size drum of hand sanitizer. Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I'll be happy for Thursday if anyone but the newly evicted comes back. Just to change things up. If John leaves, I kind of want him to come back, just because the Austwins don't want that to happen. I am for whatever scenario gets Austin and Liz on the block the quickest. 6 Link to comment
SiobhanJW August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) If Liz or Julia win HOH this week I'm self evicting from Big Brother for the rest of the season. Edited August 25, 2015 by SiobhanJW 5 Link to comment
Stinamaia August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) If Liz or Julia win HOH this week I'm self evicting from Big Brother for the rest of the season.I want Vanessa to win HOH (I don't think she wants it) and to put up Liz and Austin, and then (shock!) Julia wins veto and takes Liz down, Vanessa while moaning and crying over blood and aloneness has to choose someone. She puts up the returned HP and Austin goes home. In fury and loathing the twins win the next HOH and put Vanessa on the block. My fantasy sort of ends here. Either Vanessa wins veto and she attacks the twins with her poison green beanie or Vanessa loses veto and constantly berates the other HPs with crazy theories and deals sworn on lives of the living and the dead.But, Vanessa on the block makes for the most action packed weeks for sure. Edited August 25, 2015 by Stinamaia 5 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) But, Vanessa on the block makes for the most action packed weeks for sure. Really, Vanessa on the block, as HOH, or as Veto holder ensures the highest amount of drama on the feeds. Anything where she's either scrambling or where she has some sort of power. I'm watching a few of the conversations from last night, and Liz just asked Austin and Vanessa what "expendable" means. Edited August 25, 2015 by Ceeg Link to comment
urusai August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 When Steve said he didn't mean to attack Austin and would stop, I laughed when I heard James say "Control, alt, delete". 8 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) Now I'm watching the Vanessa/Steve conversation. Steve is so so so bad at this game. I can't with Vanessa's crying, but STEVE-UH is terrible. He's trying to play dumb, and it's so futile because 4 of the 5 ~alliance have already come clean with Vanessa about it. Dude, she already knows you tried to get her out the past two weeks. Admit it, come clean, ask for forgiveness, fluff up that he was threatened by how smart she is, and then promise her Final 2 again because that's what she wants to hear. But nothing he says is sincere at all, when he can't even admit he's wrong about something without her prompting him to remember it. "What do you want me to say?" "That you're a douche" "Okay, then I'm a douche". "I don't believe that you didn't know what week this happened, because you're Steve Moses" "Okay, I accept that." It's also interesting to watch Vanessa's eyes reading someone when she knows they're lying to her. Edited August 25, 2015 by Ceeg 3 Link to comment
Kris117 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Yikes. https://twitter.com/megan_palacios/status/635682716067823616 This is from a couple of days back, but there are two things that really struck me about that letter: Love how his being on BB and trying to win the money is "all about you, Babe." Yeah, right. Notice the way Austin signs it. "I love you sooo muchhh." Remind you of anyone? The almighty REASON. That's been the theme of this season. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCwJ8Rzt3aw Vanessa is somehow exhausting and infuriating while at the same time absolutely amazing and iconic. OK, so I finally got HBO two weeks ago because Hard Knocks is featuring the Texans this season, and as a devoted Texans fan, I had to watch it (it's about an NFL team training camp for those people who don't follow silly football stuff). I realized that now that I have HBO, I can watch all of Game of Thrones. So for the past 8 days, I have watched the first two seasons. Why does this matter? Because it has bled into my subconscious, and now all I can think of when watching the feeds is how lame and passive these people are, and then rooting for certain heads to be on stakes. And whoever shows up with any dragons - and I'm including Vanessa in this - has my undying loyalty until the end. My mind is fucked up right now, is what I'm saying, and I can't even deal with these people. I wish John would acknowledge that he's a mess and a total flop game wise. It would go a long way in making me like him again. Maybe he is but Production would rather show him screaming and acting a fool in DR because it's 'cute' or whatever. Wow. I applaud these people for not punching Vanessa in the face tbh. She does this kinda shit all the time. I would go off. She's lucky there's so many weak/timid people around for her to treat this way. She'd be in a world of trouble if she tried this shit with stronger people/players. It's like everyone watched BB15 and thought Helen had a great strategy. I know.. I know.. This is crazy talk. But we've seen moments of rational thinking in between all the crazy. We know it's there.. Kinda. Haha. When Steve said he didn't mean to attack Austin and would stop, I laughed when I heard James say "Control, alt, delete". Link to comment
Kris117 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) Yikes. https://twitter.com/megan_palacios/status/635682716067823616 This is from a couple of days back, but there are two things that really struck me about that letter: Love how his being on BB and trying to win the money is "all about you, Babe." Yeah, right. Notice the way Austin signs it. "I love you sooo muchhh." Remind you of anyone? The almighty REASON. That's been the theme of this season. Alternate thread title for Vanessa: Because reasons. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCwJ8Rzt3aw Vanessa is somehow exhausting and infuriating while at the same time absolutely amazing and iconic. So true. Austin is on that show for fame and glory, but I think there are several houseguest so far more memorable than he. As to the video, she is using Steve's social insecurity and their friendship against him hard. It's legit in game terms, but ugly as hell to watch. It would be a deal-breaker in a relationship for me, because it's abusive. The only way for Steve to have shut that down would have been for him to keep saying, "Asked and answered, Vanessa," over and over again. Or to answer her questions with a question. Of course, Steve is no more capable of doing either of those things than is a newt. I realized that now that I have HBO, I can watch all of Game of Thrones. So for the past 8 days, I have watched the first two seasons. I prescribe two hours of LOLcat videos for that. It's like everyone watched BB15 and thought Helen had a great strategy. Ha! I said that BB17 is a houseful of BB15 Helens in the episode thread about an hour ago! Great minds, yada, yada. I know.. I know.. This is crazy talk. But we've seen moments of rational thinking in between all [of Vanessa's] crazy. We know it's there.. Kinda. Haha. As was remarked upon upthread, she's at her most rational when she's in desperate straits, and has no time to indulge in the paranoid fantasies she comes up with when she's anticipating threats to come. When Steve said he didn't mean to attack Austin and would stop, I laughed when I heard James say "Control, alt, delete." Oh, I missed that! Thanks for catching that, because it's so funny. Edited August 25, 2015 by Kris117 1 Link to comment
Stinamaia August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Abusive bullying/crying is Vanessa's go to game. It's amusing that she doesn't even realize it, but then again most of us are unaware of our patterns. It's her lack of awareness about this trait that makes me think she carries it into real life although perhaps not so intensely. She seemed to be completely stymied when John called her on it. Even though she said you won't see that from me again, she' was back at it quickly. It's why I can't back Vanessa to win although I think she is a good strategist and excellent at persuading. 7 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Abusive bullying/crying is Vanessa's go to game. Abusive bullying? Really? I would call her manipulative and intense, I would call her a dog with a bone when she interrogates people, I would call her a hot emotional mess on occasion. But an abusive bully? Where is that coming from? 6 Link to comment
Stinamaia August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 What you describe plus the personal insults. That's my assessment of what she is doing and why I don't like her. Of course, people have different perceptions about what they see. This is mine. 9 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) I just think it's problematic to throw out divisive and potentially harmful terms like abusive to describe a reality show contestant on game about lying who, as far as I know, has never actually abused anyone. Nor has anyone complained about her being abusive. Personally, I don't think Vanessa has actually been a bully, but I can still see where people are coming from if someone calls her that after being questioned by her. I just sort of take offense to her being called abusive. Particularly since I know how actual legitimate abuse can harm those who are abused. Also, I'll admit I don't watch the feeds 24/7, but when has she ever hurled personal insults at anyone? I'm racking my brain and can't think of anything. Edited August 25, 2015 by Ceeg Link to comment
Katesus7 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 She called Steve a douchebag last night. 5 Link to comment
Former Nun August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Often during trials prosecutors and/or defense attorneys are accused of bullying. This is the type of bullying Vanessa does--with the assistance of Big Brother producers. In my book (never to be published), she IS a bully. 11 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) Oh that's not something I view as a personal insult. To me, a personal insult would be calling him an ugly virgin or attacking his lack of social skills in a derogatory way. Liz and Julia called John a "skeleton with back hair" yesterday. Not to his face, but that's something I view as a personal insult. James and Clay almost came to physical blows, but neither of them are viewed as abusive as far as I know. Even if I don't agree, calling Vanessa a bully isn't what I have issue with. It's calling her abusive that bothers me. Edited August 25, 2015 by Ceeg 1 Link to comment
Stinamaia August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I see why you disagree, but to me bullying is abusive, and it becomes distasteful to me when it includes the added personal insults (which you don't agree are personal) and the claimed moral and intellectual high ground which puts the target on a lower level. There is a spectrum of abuse, of course. Vanessa's is on the lower end, but would be very difficult to contend with on a daily basis. Her doing this to Steve (over a move she would make in a heartbeat) when he is in a position of great weakness, reinforces my opinion. It doesn't need to be anyone else's. I might be wrong. However, it is my current perception. 11 Link to comment
mooses August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) As far as the Steve confrontation - he chose Shelli over her, she found out, it's blowing up in his face. I could see where bullying comes from, but I can also understand how frustrating it must be to try to level with Steve. He agrees with everything to please her, but she knows he's lying. I'm guessing she wants a conversation like she had with Austin, but it's like talking to a mirror with Steve. Plus, his game is to appear weak and get people to feel sorry for him. It's worked! As for name calling - they all do it. Every HG had multiple trash Vanessa sessions, James has thrown out the c-word, Vanessa called Steve a douchebag and John a psychopath, the Twins are Queens of trash talk... No one is innocent of it. ETA: I don't think it is smart the way Vanessa handled Steve, but I also don't think it's some moral issue either. Edited August 25, 2015 by mooses 3 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 As for name calling - they all do it. Every HG had multiple trash Vanessa sessions, James has thrown out the c-word, Vanessa called Steve a douchebag and John a psychopath, the Twins are Queens of trash talk... No one is innocent of it. For me that's all a lot different than the way Vanessa uses guilt trips and her sense of superiority to browbeat people into doing/saying what she wants. 11 Link to comment
blixie August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 James has thrown out the c-word, Right, thow that out multiple times and you are still the most rootable guy in the house per the internets, Vanessa uses douchebag once and is an abusive bully, using her evil manipulative tears. However can anyone in that house defend themselves against overbearing emotions?! 3 Link to comment
mooses August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) For me that's all a lot different than the way Vanessa uses guilt trips and her sense of superiority to browbeat people into doing/saying what she wants. Understandable. And I don't doubt she's at least partly, if not mostly, like this in real life. But, luckily, I don't have to know her in real life, and, thus far, her guilt tripping tactics have really worked in the game. But, yeah, I don't think anyone has to like it. But it's worked! Edited August 25, 2015 by mooses 2 Link to comment
Stinamaia August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I don't put it on a moral level either. I find it distasteful, and it's why I don't care for Vanessa. People have done far worse on big brother for sure, and I've disliked them more than I dislike Vanessa. She knows how Steve is. She knows he will curl up into a ball and yes it's maddening and it's his way of not taking responsibility, but that is no reason to keep at it. I know how tempting it is. There are many times I've dug into a witness because of evasion and I'm not proud of it and in retrospect realized how useless and unnecessary it was. You can't expect someone to throw up their hands and admit they were lying dogs. All of us have a side that isn't very nice. The BB house intensifies things, I'm sure. 15 Link to comment
mooses August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I don't put it on a moral level either. I find it distasteful, and it's why I don't care for Vanessa. People have done far worse on big brother for sure, and I've disliked them more than I dislike Vanessa. All of us have a side that isn't very nice. The BB house intensifies things, I'm sure. Totally. And I've disliked Big Brother HGs for far less. I get it! 2 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I just read that Derrick hates Vanessa, which tbh makes me want to root for her. 15 Link to comment
Cutty August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Vanessa also lied and claimed Audrey manipulated her because she was a lesbian. She's tried to play that card multiple times, which I find more distasteful than name calling. 10 Link to comment
mooses August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I just read that Derrick hates Vanessa, which tbh makes me want to root for her. I think I heard he likes John. And he watches the feeds. Which is odd. 3 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Right, thow that out multiple times and you are still the most rootable guy in the house per the internets, Vanessa uses douchebag once and is an abusive bully, using her evil manipulative tears. However can anyone in that house defend themselves against overbearing emotions?! I've also seen people (not here, that I can remember) hate Vanessa for being a liar, and in the same breath applaud James for breaking his word to Clay and Shelli. I think a lot of people (not here, that I can remember) have a lot of internalized or even externalized misogyny when it comes to BB players, so that bothers me a lot. This was talked about in the Strategy thread not long ago, I think. That men on this show can get away with a lot more than women. I also think crying, and using crying as a weapon, for whatever reason bothers people a lot more than using any other manipulation technique, and I have to wonder if it's because emotions and tears are a stereotypical female reaction to things, and therefore unacceptable. I'm not accusing anyone here of misogyny at all, just some things I've been wondering about recently about the BB community en masse, wrt Vanessa and past male BB ~masterminds like Will or Dan. Who did as much lying and manipulating, but in a different way than Vanessa has done, and simultaneously they have a lot of love and admiration in the community, while Vanessa gets a lot of criticism and anger. 13 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I will say this, though. Despite Austin grossing me out, physically and in re: some weird possesive things he's said about Liz, I do like that he's never tried to go after women in the game, and that he has no problem being part of an alliance with all women. A lot of guys would be tempted to bro it up (which might have happened, had Jace stayed), but Austin isn't threatened by women, and in fact, seems to think he should protect them, and he has no apparent issue with any strong woman beating him in an HOH. He actually depends on the strong women surrounding him to win comps. So for that, I do respect him, even though it seems insane that that's what this game has come to, for me. Respecting a man for respecting women. 19 Link to comment
Katesus7 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Right, thow that out multiple times and you are still the most rootable guy in the house per the internets, Vanessa uses douchebag once and is an abusive bully, using her evil manipulative tears. However can anyone in that house defend themselves against overbearing emotions?! That's a bit much. I do think Vanessa is a bit of a bully, but I've really only had an issue with it twice - once with her talk with Johnny Mac where he told her he didn't like it when she yelled and cried, and yesterday with Steve. Both of those guys are very anti-confrontational (which, I believe, IS on them), to the point where I think they get anxious at the thought of it. Neither confrontation served any purpose other than to make her feel better about how much more awesome she was at the game. I didn't see any "game" value in either conversation, Vanessa just wanted them to really get how wonderful she was, and how much they betrayed her, and how horrible it was for them to even think about going against her. Eh, it felt like bullying to me, quite frankly. Mostly I find her exhausting to the point I can't even watch her on the feeds. 10 Link to comment
blixie August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 and in the same breath applaud James for breaking his word to Clay and Shelli.I think a lot of people (not here, that I can remember) have a lot of internalized or even externalized misogyny when it comes to BB players, so that bothers me a lot. Yeah I don't really have a problem with hypocrisy in BB, and I think "owning it" is dangerous proposition for a woman in this game. I think they automatically get disparaged while people like Dr. Will are glorified and beloved. Jun and Allison are as close as we've come to women who played without apologies for how, and still in the end the one who wasn't capable of even faking the charm for five minutes lost to the one who could make it taste a little sweeter, very few hold them up as the admirable badasses they were in the history of the game. 3 Link to comment
MV007 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Austin did have a conversation with James a while back that was basically about how those two had to protect their women and how their women would be nowhere without them. 2 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 (edited) I don't know if I'd go as far as to call Vanessa a bully, but I think she 100% uses bullying tactics. Her bullying tactics might be game play (although her DRs lead me to believe they actually aren't), but I just don't like that kind of game play. It's not fun to watch and I just don't respect it. Edited August 25, 2015 by peachmangosteen 7 Link to comment
Katesus7 August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I loathed Dr. Will. I also loathed Allison. I think "faking charm" is just good gameplay regardless of sex. There have been plenty of guys over the years who have been booted for not faking the charm. The only winner I can think of who didn't is Dick, which I won't even get into that travesty. 4 Link to comment
Ceeg August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 Austin did have a conversation with James a while back that was basically about how those two had to protect their women and how their women would be nowhere without them.I don't think he actually believes that, especially after Liz's comp wins. And I definitely don't think he believes that about Vanessa. I think Austin has his bro moments, but he does exactly what his alliance of girls tells him to do. James probably does believe that though, because well, he's partnered with Meg. 3 Link to comment
TheRealT August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I think misogyny has a lot to do with how some people view/criticize Vanessa, but I also think a lot of the Vanessa hate/criticism is rooted in the fact that she has a grating personality. More charming people can get away with more (and men can get away with more "not nice" behavior than women). Personally, I would like to root for Vanessa as a smart, strong female player, but both her gameplay and her personality annoy the shit out of me. 10 Link to comment
peachmangosteen August 25, 2015 Share August 25, 2015 I loathed Dr. Will. Heart eyes emoji! As for not minding that James broke his deal while being annoyed by Vanessa's lies, for me it's a matter of Vanessa crying over lies told to her while being perfectly fine with lying herself. I think if someone went back on a deal with James, he wouldn't whine about them betraying him and how they're literally the worst people in the world for going against him. Vanessa would/has done that though. Personally, I would like to root for Vanessa as a smart, strong female player, but both her gameplay and her personality annoy the shit out of me. LOL! I completely agree 6 Link to comment
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