S02.E08: White Hat/Black Hat

[ElectricBoogaloo]

When Richard takes pity on a competitor, he accidentally sparks a feud that finds him paranoid about security. Jared exaggerates Pied Piper’s size to get results. Facing pressure from board members, Gavin looks to place responsibility elsewhere.

 

Promo:

[Shriekingeel]

Found the tequila deletion a little hard to believe, but the Monica smoking subplot was amusing. The Raviga woman always makes me laugh.

[escatefromny]

Erlich's filthy bong water grossed me out.

[JTMacc99]

This episode was stupid.

Edited June 1, 2015 by JTMacc99

[Traveller519]

The jokes are making me laugh. But the overall plot of this season (one step forward one week, 9/10ths of a step back the next) are grinding me. Not so much the tediousness, but the predictability.

[chocolatine]

No no no no no! I thought our heroes were finally going to catch a break. If I were Richard I'd have taken the tequila bottle outside and smashed it against the hideous orange McLaren, then kicked Russ in the balls.

[Cthulhudrew]

This is definitely getting kind of dumb now. This whole Endframe thing was funny when it appeared to be a one-off ("whoops! What appeared to be a VC meeting was actually industrial espionage!") but it becoming a plot point? We've already got the Hooli attempting to reverse-engineer Pied Piper thing going on, and having another company in the mix is just... more of the same. It makes the whole Hooli plot superfluous and gives Gavin less to do with the rest of the show (he's basically in his own little side show now), and we just keep rehashing the "Pied Piper falls on its face" thing. This is the post-middle out season; we should be beyond that.

 

It seems pretty clear to me that the end result of all of the mishaps on both sides is going to be Gavin approaching Richard and agreeing to give him full credit and financial backing in order to be the third party that powers Nucleus, and there being wins on both ends. But they're taking a really hackneyed approach to it at this point. There is a lot of funny this season, but the overall story arc is lacking.

 

The Endframe plot is to Silicon Valley what Midichlorians were to Star Wars; an unnecessary middleman to a plot that doesn't explain anything, doesn't move things forward, doesn't serve the plot, and makes parts of it extraneous. 

 

EDIT: Traveller59 said it much more succinctly than I did while I was in midpost. :D

Edited June 1, 2015 by Cthulhudrew

[hincandenza]

Before I begin my rant, I have to say they're really struggling to find a way to keep Erlich relevant to the show, which is a shame because he's still hilarious when he's given the space.

I... where to even begin? In season 1, they had a UCSB professor devise a plausible sounding compression algorithm, just for the veneer of realism (well, and setting up the greatest dick joke in TV history). Based on this season's plotlines, their season 2 technical advisors appear to be my 93-year-old grandma, and that one creepy guy at the library who watches porn on the public terminals.

The first rule of a startup is, you always make payroll. Always. This isn't 1998; people expect to get paid, at market rates, and on time. I've known several people who have launched successful (and previously, unsuccessful) startups, who are well versed in what goes right and wrong. They've told me that the day you miss a paycheck, your employees will walk and your investors will ready you for slaughter. You're all but dead when that happens.

We talked about it last week and good on whoever called it with the $986M + $15M math, but even if they'd won the bake-off it's not like Russ gets that $15M; he owns at best a minority stake in PP, and that only if he exercises his buyout. He makes far more money ensuring PP gets valued highly- which we know he understands, because valuation increases was his whole plan several episodes ago. There's no reason to believe even he wouldn't understand and ensure they cover their operating costs to get that first contract.

Also, when you send 100TB to someone across the city, you don't FTP it, you copy it onto a box of drives and then courier it over.

Also, you have backups, that's so standard a process it should be assumed. Hell, we should assume EndFrame has a copy too since they were downloading the same data. Or the multiple CDNs that cache that data since their the ones streaming it.

Also, you would never give someone read-write access just to copy data, or if you do it's in a sandbox environment on one of those racks in Intersite's datacenter. Or, you know, the fucking Cloud.

Also, why would holding down a delete key lock out users and processes on other terminals? A decent sysadmin would just trace the process and node that was doing the deleting, and kick it off the network.

Also, Richard would know that compression algorithms have literally nothing to do with delete speed of a directory of files, so why even mention that?

Ugh. And the night started so well with that great Game of Thrones.

At this point (I've not seen the preview yet), this only makes sense if they end up being acquired by Hooli after all. The twin tales of inconceivable incompetence from both Hooli and PP can only resolve with some begrudging kind of mutual benefit. The hilarious part is that Baghead is primed to actually look like the rockstar if he ends up brokering the acquisition, saving the PP gang and keeping Nucleus from cratering Gavin and Hooli. Ha, the little dude would probably be festooned with riches!

I'm so hate-watching this shit show at this point, I'm having "Lost" season 3 level flashbacks of increasing disgust and ultimately throwing in the towel and never looking back.

[JTMacc99]

Also, you have backups, that's so standard a process it should be assumed. Hell, we should assume EndFrame has a copy too since they were downloading the same data. Or the multiple CDNs that cache that data since their the ones streaming it.

I agree with everything you said, although I think this is the one that prompted my first post in this thread.  There is no such thing as a permanent delete, especially for the kind of delete you accomplish by hitting the "delete" key on a laptop.  That company would obviously have all their data (it being their entire business and all) stored not only in the physical location where we saw their employee, but another place entirely just in case of, you know, actual disasters like fire or 1,000 year flood.

 

Therefore, that was stupid.

 

But the smoking story was stupid in the good way, so at least there was that.

[Cramps]

Yes this did feel like a jump the shark episode. And I know nothing about technology. This was the first episode I really disliked. The ending felt really forced and fake.

I do know about plotting, and it screamed that they will finally do a deal with Hooli, because both sides desperately need to.

Edited June 1, 2015 by Cramps

[Should Be Working]

They must have brought in the script-writing team from Nucleus this week.

[Should Be Working]

This lousy episode accomplished little more than make a compelling case for removing Richard as CEO of PP and retaining him only as chief architect/programmer. Why the silly need to keep contacting Seth Lee, the network guy terminated from End Frame, only to succeed in pissing him off more and more? Why the lame and counterproductive interaction with the head of Intersite just before the bakeoff?

 

When it comes to CEO decision-making, Richard ought to adopt the "do the complete opposite of every impulse I have" strategy that George Constanza used so effectively on Seinfeld. Even Monica, with her weakness for sneaking an occasional cigarette, would do a far better job.

 

And of course, Gilfoyle could serve as chief technical strategy advisor to the new CEO. His left-hand path approach is laudible in Silicon Valley.

Edited June 1, 2015 by Should Be Working

[Traveller519]

I did enjoy seeing an exposed and frantic Guilfoyle in this episode. Throughout the series he's been the one who's steady on the course, and always with his sarcastic retorts. He's one of the best characters on the show, for playing against Richard's hectic-ness and neurosis, and Dinesh's own uncertainties.

 

When he spurng into action he didn't have an answer, didn't have a level-head, he was just as exposed as everyone. It was great to see that even he can be rattled.

[EyesGlazed]

I still love this show.  As a non-tech viewer, I don't care whether the tech speak is accurate, just that it sounds plausible enough to drive the plot lines.

 

I hate Russ though.  From his douchebag boots to his overstyled head to his horrible tequila.  He can't get off my screen fast enough.

 

Poor Monica.  But speaking from prior long-ago experience, I can attest that the one time you try to sneak a cigarette in an area where you can be seen by passers-by, you will be seen by the wrong person.

[Pallida]

The comment about being back in the 1990s with the switch confused me.  Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought wifi tech still isn't comparable to the transfer speed of cat 5 cable.  I realize the writers have to balance "insider jokes" with a non-tech audience, but stuff like that seems geared towards those in the know. 

[Hootis]

It's already off the rails.

Usually it takes several seasons for characters to become parodies of themselves; I feel like I'm watching a show in it's 6th season. Like the writers have skipped all the good stuff in seasons 1-5 and went right to waxing the waterskis.

These characters are so dumb, redeeming them now would seem like a cheat.

[kieyra]

The comment about being back in the 1990s with the switch confused me.  Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought wifi tech still isn't comparable to the transfer speed of cat 5 cable.  I realize the writers have to balance "insider jokes" with a non-tech audience, but stuff like that seems geared towards those in the know. 

 

WiFi speeds are acceptable for most things you're going to be doing with a laptop/desktop or mobile device. (e.g., if you run a speedtest on a machine with a good wifi connection on your home ISP, versus running it on a wired connection, it's going to look about the same, aside from maybe some extra latency). And they were only talking about their laptops/workstations, not the servers. So that one didn't bug me so much. 

 

I don't know, in general I suspect that expecting this show to be 100% technically accurate is like expecting House or Grey's Anatomy to be 100% medically accurate, and I'm not sure there's much value in that since it's not intended to be a documentary. (I just said much the same thing over at the Halt and Catch Fire forums.)  JMO, though. 

[tennisgurl]

Show...look at your life. Look at your choices. Go back to your room, think about what you did, then come back here, and try again. 

[lucindabelle]

I'm REALLY tired of their not getting a break.

 

I feel as if this year's Richard has almost nothing to do with last year's. Last year he was the voice of reason and the calm guy. this year he goes off on weird limbs. His setting up meetings with the security guy not once but twice wasn't funny because it felt so forced.

 

I had a crush on him last year. this year, he's kind of a doofus.

 

I really hope they change this soon. I LOVED last year's season so much I watched it twice and I would put on the last episode any time I needed a laugh. Maybe I've seen it six times now.

 

There isn't one episode this year I would rewatch.

 

I'm still watching but...

 

also, one of the things I LOVED about the series was that it so jibed with my experience of working at Oracle in 1989 (the corporate hubris, etc.). It feels very fakey now.

[hincandenza]

This lousy episode accomplished little more than make a compelling case for removing Richard as CEO of PP and retaining him only as chief architect/programmer. Why the silly need to keep contacting Seth Lee, the network guy terminated from End Frame, only to succeed in pissing him off more and more? Why the lame and counterproductive interaction with the head of Intersite just before the bakeoff?

 

When it comes to CEO decision-making, Richard ought to adopt the "do the complete opposite of every impulse I have" strategy that George Constanza used so effectively on Seinfeld. Even Monica, with her weakness for sneaking an occasional cigarette, would do a far better job.

 

No doubt!  If their whole point has been to convince us that PP deserves to fail, then they have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams.  It's "Three Stooges" levels of incompetence and easily avoided screw-ups, and Richard is almost entirely to blame.  Over and over he makes impossibly wrong decisions; they've mutated him from amusingly socially awkward to almost alien in his inability to interact with human beings without figuratively shitting the bed. 

 

 

I'm REALLY tired of their not getting a break.

I feel as if this year's Richard has almost nothing to do with last year's. Last year he was the voice of reason and the calm guy. this year he goes off on weird limbs. His setting up meetings with the security guy not once but twice wasn't funny because it felt so forced.

I had a crush on him last year. this year, he's kind of a doofus.

I really hope they change this soon. I LOVED last year's season so much I watched it twice and I would put on the last episode any time I needed a laugh. Maybe I've seen it six times now.

There isn't one episode this year I would rewatch.

I'm still watching but...

also, one of the things I LOVED about the series was that it so jibed with my experience of working at Oracle in 1989 (the corporate hubris, etc.). It feels very fakey now.

Again, I totally agree.  I don't know who these people are anymore, or why they behave the way they do. Even non-techies loved Season 1; I have a stoner buddy in his mid-40's who is a fan of, but very mystified by, most tech, yet he adored the first season and called it his favorite new show. The defense of this show out there that "real tech" would be boring isn't true, when done well- and Mike Judge has clearly shown he can consistently deliver in both Season 1 and in previous works. 

 

The humor and draw is skewering corporate, technological, and Silicon Valley trends, through plausible but just slightly broad characters and scenarios; in a way it's kind of like "Portlandia" in that regard.  Richard's magical MacGuffin algorithm is supposed to be a vehicle to let us peak into that world, and we saw the first part- the living room startup- in season 1.  Each season should be an opportunity for PP to travel the peaks and valleys of that world, giving us a glimpse into different facets of an at times insane industry and culture that has come to exert massive influence over our society as a whole... along with some good old-fashioned sitcom gags. As I've blathered at length before, we could have spent this season as a burgeoning success story in nicer offices but with new challenges, then maybe another season on the obscene riches and incredible stresses- both work and personal- excess hinted at in season 1 with Gavin and Peter having once been the best of friends, all sprinkled with difficult but not existential challenges for our loveable gang to overcome in comic but ultimately satisfying fashion.

 

Instead, they've gone the classic sitcom route, apparently determined to throw up every Diabolus ex Machina roadblock the writers can imagine to keep our cast stuck in the same place, and same now-stale sitcom scenarios, time and again.  It's a real shame, because like the utterly brilliant "Office Space" showed two decades ago, tech-based comedy can be highly accessible to the layperson without losing verisimilitude.

 

I still love this show.  As a non-tech viewer, I don't care whether the tech speak is accurate, just that it sounds plausible enough to drive the plot lines.

 

I can totally respect that, and thanks for sharing- a part of me wishes I could feel that way, and I hope my constant carping isn't too much of a bummer!  And truthfully, for all my gripes there still have been quite a few great one-liners or comedy set pieces this year, so it's not like I never laugh.  I think I just overall feel after most episodes that it felt off, forced, and as lucindabelle said above, "fakey".

 

There's a line in the film "Thank You for Smoking" (starts at 0:54) where they're discussing how to insert cigarettes as product placement in a sci-fi movie set on a space station, and suggest some hand-wavy line of dialogue like "Thank god we invented the blah-blah-whatever device".  When telling story you can get the audience/readers to buy into one big suspension of disbelief- mutant powers, time travel, aliens, whatever- and they won't sweat the little quirks or inaccuracies.  But after that, if your characters behave in ways that don't make sense, or your SoD keeps changing whenever it's inconvenient to the plot or because it would take away the drama, it can really turn the audience off.

 

It's not that we need the tech to be perfect or even front-and-center (I'm not watching this show because of my interest in compression algorithms), it's that if the writers are going to intentionally trip up their own characters just to keep them from succeeding, they better do it in a way that doesn't have us nitpicking the obvious flaws.  They made the tech itself a key element in progressing the plot, beyond the initial SoD.  The writers chose to make a $15M contract- and pretty much the life and death of PP itself- hinge on the particulars of how the delete key works and what method a company would use to transfer files.

 

I'm sure by season's end, they'll have some form of success and actual progress; my own bet is a very lucrative cooperation deal with Hooli that bails out both parties while leaving PP to still be its own company with new challenges (just hopefully not financial).  But the success won't feel earned.  Season 1 had them making many mistakes, because they didn't know better- but they learned from them, and overcame the challenges little by little.  This season, they've made so many bad choices for indefensible reasons, an eleventh hour deal in the finale to once again save their bacon would seem too pat.

 

I do hope they can figure this show out to make another couple of good seasons, because they clearly have a great cast and solid premise, and when the show is funny it's really funny. 

 

[lucindabelle]

I couldn't agree more hincandenza.

 

I loved Richard, the slightly socially awkward but genuinely sweet guy, who wanted to name a program for a kids' fairy tale, who was too sweet to tell Jared he was weird, and who I totally bought Monica would want to date. That guy might have had the thought of contacting the security guy-- but not done it. Just as last year's Richard only let Erlich on the board when he was drunk and his very first impulse was to get him off it.

 

There was a lot they could have done this year-- and we expected to see them rich, given the end of last season. I'm disappointed.

 

But I'll keep watching. In hopes that it's just sophomore slump.

[mywinston]

Richard is getting on my nerves. And these episodes are starting to get repetitive. I like the show but PP needs a win or it's going to feel deriviative. How many contrived problems can these people run into/make for themselves?

 

Russell does make me laugh, though.

Richard is getting on my nerves. And these episodes are starting to get repetitive. I like the show but PP needs a win or it's going to feel deriviative. How many contrived problems can these people run into/make for themselves?

 

Russell does make me laugh, though.

[hincandenza]

For what it's worth, my non-techie stoner friend and I met up for brunch yesterday, and when I mentioned this most recent episode he said "Done.  I'm so done.  It's not even funny anymore!".

 

Well, it's all shot and in the can at this point anyway, so maybe Judge & Co. will take some hints from the online reactions and retool for season 3.

[Miles]

I'm binging this show at the moment so I'm a year late, but I got to vent.

This show has strained my suspension of disbelieve a lot at some points, but this would break the suspenseions of the golden gate bridge.

Why would not-pornhub even give these guys write access? That makes no sense. Why would something on the delete key actually delete those files? Who coded that function? And we are seriously to believe that such a massive company has no backups? Not to mention the fact that they wouldn't have sent this over the internet anyway. Buh humbug!

On 2.6.2015 at 4:21 PM, kieyra said:

I don't know, in general I suspect that expecting this show to be 100% technically accurate is like expecting House or Grey's Anatomy to be 100% medically accurate, and I'm not sure there's much value in that since it's not intended to be a documentary. (I just said much the same thing over at the Halt and Catch Fire forums.)  JMO, though. 

There is not being 100% accurate and then there is duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuumb. This was duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuumb. Also house was pretty accurate. It's increadibly unlikely that all these cases would happen in one small hospital, but they can and do happen that way. The show had a pretty big medical research staff to make sure things were as accurate as possible. Silicon Valley seems to have monkeys on typewriters.

Edited June 15, 2016 by Miles

[Camera One]

I started binge-watching this show last week, and the last few episodes have been frustrating so I was curious what other viewers thought at this point.

I liked the characters in Season 1 who were smart and seeing them have a bit of success, but this has changed in the last few episodes.  Richard was very frustrating to watch, going out of his way to talk to Seth Lee twice and tell him exactly how they got into their system.  It was ridiculous enough last episode when Richard almost fell into the same trap of revealing his ideas when he barged into the End Frame boardroom.  The endless obstacles and Russ are annoying.

I guess I'll keep watching and hope it gets better.  I'm not usually too into comedies but I've found this show pretty funny.