Spoilers and Spoiler Speculation: Benchmarking

[funnygirl]

I think Sara is a goner.

[windsprints]

If its Sara's exit I am so disappointed. Callie has been here since S2 and deserves a way better exit than this. I loathe that Callie's exit will be driven by Penny's success and not Callie's. 

 

Its too bad they had to make them all owners of the hospital because that essentially removed the option of just moving away for a better job for more than one of them (already done with Cristina). If Callie wasn't an owner they could have had her do a few surgeries elsewhere and get a great offer. Now she's just following Penny because she can't manage long distance for a year. So dumb.

[BaseOps]

I hope they're just playing with us and they're going to use Sara's contract negotiation as a cliffhanger for the next few episodes / over the summer. But sadly I, too, have a feeling that not only is Sara's exit being written, but she's getting one of the worst send-offs of all time. It's nice that she's thinking of Arizona too, but I don't see how she could even consider it. I'm looking forward to Thursday night to see how they get the ball rolling with this story... 

[beautifulGA]

I have been saying this that callie mulling to move is enough of a sign for arizona to consider joint custody. i just hope callie doesn't challenges it. her following penny is enough of a character assassination, i don't want more reasons to shake my head over her character. this is such an insult to sara.

[statsgirl]

The thing is if you take into consideration who has the more stable life right now, it's Callie.

 

People are angry at Callie because she is dating Penny.  Penny may not be who they want her with but she's doing nothing wrong dating her.

 

Arizona is dating random women.  She lives with an intern who also brings women home.

 

Arizona is the one who apparently starts the ball rolling so if there is any anger to be had, it should be directed towards the one who initiates this whole situation.

Sofia has stayed with Arizona so she knows April and De Luca and presumably gets on with them. She just met Penny.

 

If Callie takes Sofia with her to New York, Sofia has to leave her school, her daycare provider, her friends and her activities as well as her other parent.  And then when Sofia is settled, Callie will either bring her back to Seattle, uprooting her again, or they will stay in New York forever, the other side of the country from Arizona.

 

Who has the more stable life is debatable (I'd argue it's not Callie who wants to move to New York for a year with her brand new girlfriend) but who would provide the greater stability for Sofia is Arizona.

 

Arizona may start legal action but the problem really is that Callie wants to move away and take Sofia with her.  It's another stupid Grey's angst for the sake of angst plot.  Like April/Jackson/Catherine, if for two minutes these adults thought about what was best for the children rather than themselves, the situations would be easily resolved.

[CED9]

It all just seems like one giant misunderstanding based on Callie and Arizona once again talking to each other, but not actually listening.

Arizona makes a decision, Callie makes a decision based on Arizona's decision, which causes Callie to make a decision based on that next Arizona decision, and around and around it goes.

And then they'll go to court where *gasp* they have to listen to each other.

Edited April 13, 2016 by CED9

[DrKarevFan]

http://us.blastingnews.com/showbiz-tv/2016/04/grey-s-anatomy-season-12-episodes-18-19-details-released-00869227.html

 

 

"Rumors are flying about characters that may potentially be leaving the show. There have been rumors actress Jerrika Hinton (Dr. Stephanie Edwards) may be leaving the show as well as actress Jessica Capshaw (Dr. Arizona Robbins)."

 

 

This is the first I've heard of Capshaw leaving. Maybe this will play into the whole Arizona/Callie/Sofia court thing.

[beautifulGA]

http://us.blastingnews.com/showbiz-tv/2016/04/grey-s-anatomy-season-12-episodes-18-19-details-released-00869227.html

"Rumors are flying about characters that may potentially be leaving the show. There have been rumors actress Jerrika Hinton (Dr. Stephanie Edwards) may be leaving the show as well as actress Jessica Capshaw (Dr. Arizona Robbins)."

This is the first I've heard of Capshaw leaving. Maybe this will play into the whole Arizona/Callie/Sofia court thing.

Jessica is signed through season 14. she also said it in her podcast that baby number #4 will come over hiatus. i don't think she's leaving. actually im pretty sure that after the pdemps fiasco, none of the season veteran greys cast will leave.

[RealityCowgirl]

If its Sara's exit I am so disappointed. Callie has been here since S2 and deserves a way better exit than this. I loathe that Callie's exit will be driven by Penny's success and not Callie's. 

 

Its too bad they had to make them all owners of the hospital because that essentially removed the option of just moving away for a better job for more than one of them (already done with Cristina). If Callie wasn't an owner they could have had her do a few surgeries elsewhere and get a great offer. Now she's just following Penny because she can't manage long distance for a year. So dumb.

This. All of this. Another reason this potential storyline is so absurd: the fact they've mostly *told* us about this grand Callie/Penny love but not actually *shown* us. Not the first time for this show, unfortunately. If Sara ends up leaving, she deserves a far better exit story than this.

[Artymouse]

I really hope Sara isn't leaving, but I can't really say I blame her if she is. Of all the actors she has or has had chemistry with, they pair her with the one person she has negative chemistry with.

But it wouldn't surprise me if this was her exit story. I agree that it really would be lame, but considering what a tepid buildup there was to Dempsey's exit, it wouldn't be unprecedented.

[kurtz]

I've hinted this before over the last few months, but since the original cast of Broadway's hottest ticket will have their contracts end in July, it would not surprise me if SaRa is cast in it as either the supporting role of the three females in the cast (a fantastic role), or the minor female role (which is dual, but has a huge number that I can hear SaRa making epic). She could have the female lead, but vocally I do not hear her there.

I find it painful to consider that Mark was killed off because he would never leave Sofia, but Callie would consider uprooting or leaving Sofia for a relationship. This S12 Callie is not the Callie I have come to know and love.

[PrincessTT]

True, just like Arizona going for sole custody would be a character assassination.

But as explained Arizona makes the first move whatever it is and yet Callie is getting heat.

We don't know what's happening yet so I don't get the anger towards Callie.

Also, if Callie wants to move, I get the sense people feel she should just willingly relinquish custody to Arizona.

They are both her mothers and both have every right to want her with them without being looked at like a monster.

 

 

I defintely don't think that Callie should relinquish custody to Arizona if she wants to move, but I also don't think it would be wrong for Arizona to want visitation and access arranged legally if Callie were to move. 

[CED9]

True, just like Arizona going for sole custody would be a character assassination.

But as explained Arizona makes the first move whatever it is and yet Callie is getting heat.

We don't know what's happening yet so I don't get the anger towards Callie.

Also, if Callie wants to move, I get the sense people feel she should just willingly relinquish custody to Arizona.

They are both her mothers and both have every right to want her with them without being looked at like a monster.

If Arizona is looking into her legal visitation options, I could see Callie being quite offended since co parenting is the one thing (we assume) they have down pat.

From those episode 21 (I think) promo pics, it looks like Penny is on Arizona's service. She could unknowingly exacerbate the problem that leads to this seeming court "battle" in 22.

[North]

I defintely don't think that Callie should relinquish custody to Arizona if she wants to move, but I also don't think it would be wrong for Arizona to want visitation and access arranged legally if Callie were to move.

Absolutely and I think if it were as simple as that Callie would agree.

I'm not saying this is you, but a lot of what I've seen is how awful it is for Callie to even consider moving away with Sofia.

Apparently, Callie's happiness is far outweighed by Arizona's for some.

[Joana]

I defintely don't think that Callie should relinquish custody to Arizona if she wants to move, but I also don't think it would be wrong for Arizona to want visitation and access arranged legally if Callie were to move. 

 

I agree. And I don't think Callie would be opposed to it if they discussed it normally. They've shown to be completely reasonable in their parenting arragenements even in more difficult situations (cheating, divorce), so I struggle to think what they could be doing that results in a bitter custody battle.

Knowing the show, it will again be a total lack of communication. Like, Arizona overhears Penny saying Callie might be moving to follow her, so she just sues for custody without talking to Callie about it, and then Callie gets offended and decides she's definitely going away and taking Sofia with her etc. 

Edited April 13, 2016 by Joana

[North]

Sofia has stayed with Arizona so she knows April and De Luca and presumably gets on with them. She just met Penny.

If Callie takes Sofia with her to New York, Sofia has to leave her school, her daycare provider, her friends and her activities as well as her other parent. And then when Sofia is settled, Callie will either bring her back to Seattle, uprooting her again, or they will stay in New York forever, the other side of the country from Arizona.

Who has the more stable life is debatable (I'd argue it's not Callie who wants to move to New York for a year with her brand new girlfriend) but who would provide the greater stability for Sofia is Arizona.

Arizona may start legal action but the problem really is that Callie wants to move away and take Sofia with her. It's another stupid Grey's angst for the sake of angst plot. Like April/Jackson/Catherine, if for two minutes these adults thought about what was best for the children rather than themselves, the situations would be easily resolved.

Stability is more than just about staying in a familiar place.

Children move all the time and they are none the worse. Children of divorced parents move too and are fine. They go back to visit the other parent and are fine.

Callie is in a relationship, with another doctor, that for better or worse is stable.

Arizona randomly hooks up with women and lives with an intern who also brings women home.

That is not going to work in Arizona's favor no matter how you cut it.

Edited April 13, 2016 by North

[PrincessTT]

Absolutely and I think if it were as simple as that Callie would agree.

I'm not saying this is you, but a lot of what I've seen is how awful it is for Callie to even consider moving away with Sofia.

Apparently, Callie's happiness is far outweighed by Arizona's for some.

 

I can't speak for everyone, but my only issue with Callie moving away would be that it's supposedly only for a year. 

 

Callie's happiness and Arizona's happiness isn't my concern, but taking Sofia out of school and away from her friends to then let her get settled in a new place only to bring her uproot her and move back again is not in her best interests IMO; and that is regardless of whether it's Callie or Arizona wanting to move with her. 

 

I don't think that either Callie or Arizona should have to stay at GSMH (or in Seattle) forever just to keep the other one happy, and I would fully support either or them making a permanent move away and wanting to take Sofia away but still giving the other parent access & visitation. 

 

In the case of going away for a year I think it would be best for Sofia to stay in Seattle and the moving parent have access & visitation during their year away. 

[BaseOps]

I can't speak for everyone, but my only issue with Callie moving away would be that it's supposedly only for a year. 

 

Callie's happiness and Arizona's happiness isn't my concern, but taking Sofia out of school and away from her friends to then let her get settled in a new place only to bring her uproot her and move back again is not in her best interests IMO; and that is regardless of whether it's Callie or Arizona wanting to move with her. 

 

I don't think that either Callie or Arizona should have to stay at GSMH (or in Seattle) forever just to keep the other one happy, and I would fully support either or them making a permanent move away and wanting to take Sofia away but still giving the other parent access & visitation. 

 

In the case of going away for a year I think it would be best for Sofia to stay in Seattle and the moving parent have access & visitation during their year away. 

 

This. The thing is that Callie simply doesn't need to uproot Sofia to follow Penny when she's only leaving for a year. Callie could easily stay in Seattle, keep things the same for their daughter, and take frequent trips out to see Penny. It's not fair to ask Arizona to have to make that commute to see her daughter for a year all because Penny got a grant. It's not fair to Sofia, either. 

 

I'm still going to wait to see how it all plays out, but it's not looking good for me. 

[North]

This. The thing is that Callie simply doesn't need to uproot Sofia to follow Penny when she's only leaving for a year. Callie could easily stay in Seattle, keep things the same for their daughter, and take frequent trips out to see Penny. It's not fair to ask Arizona to have to make that commute to see her daughter for a year all because Penny got a grant. It's not fair to Sofia, either.

I'm still going to wait to see how it all plays out, but it's not looking good for me.

To me it's still basically telling one parent to give up their child.

The situation may not be ideal, but at it's core both have every right to want her with them, even if it's for a year.

Sofia may be better served staying in Seattle or she may be better served going to New York.

My friend's mom had to go away for school for about a year. Should she have left her daughter with the grandparents so as not to uproot her? It didn't damage my friend. In fact that new experience was beneficial.

I don't for a second think Callie is leaving. I think this is all for drama.

[windsprints]

Apparently, Callie's happiness is far outweighed by Arizona's for some.

 

For me its about Sofia's happiness, not Callie or Arizona's.  Yes, some divorced parents will move away with their child. But, there's also many that remain in the same state as the other parent until the child is 18 to allow shared custody.  My perception (which could be wrong given how little information we get about the kids in general) is that Sofia splits her time pretty equally between her parents. Moving her away essentially removes Arizona from her life for a year other than some visits throughout. YMMV, but I think its a sucky thing for Sofia when its for a year. Put your child first and have a long distance relationship. At the very least give it a try and see how it goes. Callie is an owner of the hospital so I'm sure she could arrange to take a few weeks off here and there throughout the year to go visit.

Edited April 13, 2016 by windsprints

[North]

For me its about Sofia's happiness, not Callie or Arizona's. Yes, some divorced parents will move away with their child. But, there's also many that remain in the same state as the other parent until the child is 18 to allow shared custody. My perception (which could be wrong given how little information we get about the kids in general) is that Sofia splits her time pretty equally between her parents. Moving her away essentially removes Arizona from her life for a year other than some visits throughout. YMMV, but I think its a sucky thing for Sofia when its for a year. Put your child first and have a long distance relationship. At the very least give it a try and see how it goes. Callie is an owner of the hospital so I'm sure she could arrange to take a few weeks off here and there throughout the year to go visit.

If this was real life sure, but this is Grey's.

I'm not about to say Callie is an awful person for wanting to pursue a life with Penny and wanting to include Sofia in that life.

[windsprints]

If this was real life sure, but this is Grey's.

I'm not about to say Callie is an awful person for wanting to pursue a life with Penny and wanting to include Sofia in that life.

 

"This is Grey's" pretty much applies to every single storyline & scene on the show, lol.

I never said Callie would be an awful person.

[North]

"This is Grey's" pretty much applies to every single storyline & scene on the show, lol.

I never said Callie would be an awful person.

I never said you did.

It's the implication from others that my response and earlier ones were about.

The fact is both have a right to want Sofia with them. Neither one is wrong in this scenario.

The only wrong thing might be how each goes about this situation but I'm going to reserve judgement until I see how it plays out.

[BaseOps]

To me it's still basically telling one parent to give up their child.

The situation may not be ideal, but at it's core both have every right to want her with them, even if it's for a year.

Sofia may be better served staying in Seattle or she may be better served going to New York.

My friend's mom had to go away for school for about a year. Should she have left her daughter with the grandparents so as not to uproot her? It didn't damage my friend. In fact that new experience was beneficial.

I don't for a second think Callie is leaving. I think this is all for drama.

 

No one is saying that Callie should give up Sofia - I think the consensus is just that it's a very contrived situation, because Callie doesn't have to leave. She's been with Penny for only a few months. She didn't get an offer, Penny did. If Callie got a grant it'd be a different story. My thoughts are that Callie should let Penny go, not that she should go with Penny and leave Sofia with Arizona. Your friends situation is a totally different scenario than this one. It's not just about uprooting Sofia, it's about taking Sofia away from her mother, Arizona, for a year so that Callie can follow her girlfriend of just a few months. 

[North]

No one is saying that Callie should give up Sofia - I think the consensus is just that it's a very contrived situation, because Callie doesn't have to leave. She's been with Penny for only a few months. She didn't get an offer, Penny did. If Callie got a grant it'd be a different story. My thoughts are that Callie should let Penny go, not that she should go with Penny and leave Sofia with Arizona. Your friends situation is a totally different scenario than this one. It's not just about uprooting Sofia, it's about taking Sofia away from her mother, Arizona, for a year so that Callie can follow her girlfriend of just a few months.

Again, my feeling is, if Callie feels that strongly about pursuing a life with Penny, there is nothing wrong with wanting to include Sofia in that life.

It doesn't mean cutting Arizona out.

Having said that, I'm not going to give either a hard time and decide what either one should do until I see how it plays out.

This fandom gets torn apart by snap judgements and what one or the other is doing wrong. The story hasn't even begun to play out and people have already decided Callie's in the wrong.

Edited April 13, 2016 by North

[CED9]

The LGBT community has been so gut punched by TV shows lately that it's easy to assume the lesbian non-biological parent will get screwed over no matter what.

[North]

The LGBT community has been so gut punched by TV shows lately that it's easy to assume the lesbian non-biological parent will get screwed over no matter what.

As opposed to the bisexual biological parent?

The custody battle sucks but either way it's not about LGBT and about Grey's upping the drama quotient.

Edited April 13, 2016 by North

[CED9]

As opposed to the bisexual biological parent?

The custody battle sucks but either way but it's not about LGBT and about Grey's upping the drama quotient.

Take out the LGBT factor, and just by biology, Callie already has the upper hand in court. It does suck. A lot.

Especially for a show that has for so long prioritized family you choose over biological family.

And I have no trust in these writers to handle it well. No matter what it is. Call me cynical.

Edited April 13, 2016 by CED9

[BaseOps]

Again, my feeling is, if Callie feels that strongly about pursuing a life with Penny, there is nothing wrong with wanting to include Sofia in that life.

It doesn't mean cutting Arizona out.

Having said that, I'm not going to give either a hard time and decide what either one should do until I see how it plays out.

This fandom gets torn apart by snap judgements and what one or the other is doing wrong. The story hasn't even begun to play out and people have already decided Callie's in the wrong.

 

I'm right there with you on waiting until I actually see it unfold, but this thread is for speculation based off of spoilers, so I think we're all just having fun with trying to figure this out. I certainly haven't condemned Callie yet, but if the story plays out the way it looks it will, it won't be a good look for Callie, who has long been one of my favourite characters. As much as I dislike Penny, even if I loved Callie's romantic interest I'd still think it's selfish to uproot her daughter and move her 6+ hours away from Arizona for a year just to follow a new girlfriend. 

[funnygirl]

I find it painful to consider that Mark was killed off because he would never leave Sofia, but Callie would consider uprooting or leaving Sofia for a relationship. This S12 Callie is not the Callie I have come to know and love.

 

This. It's very OOC. And all for the sake of Penny. When did Penny become the sun?

Edited April 13, 2016 by funnygirl

[North]

I'm right there with you on waiting until I actually see it unfold, but this thread is for speculation based off of spoilers, so I think we're all just having fun with trying to figure this out. I certainly haven't condemned Callie yet, but if the story plays out the way it looks it will, it won't be a good look for Callie, who has long been one of my favourite characters. As much as I dislike Penny, even if I loved Callie's romantic interest I'd still think it's selfish to uproot her daughter and move her 6+ hours away from Arizona for a year just to follow a new girlfriend.

One thing we've seen though is Callie is not that person. She's not selfish.

She has a huge heart so I'm thinking that a person she's been seeing for months that she sees a future with is not just some whim.

If she wants to go is it selfish? Sure, but it's because she wants to be with this person. If she wants to take Sofia? That's no more selfish than Arizona wanting to keep her. They both love their daughter.

Like you said it's a year. Why is it all on Callie to make it work? Because she's the one who wants to leave? So what? She wants to leave because this person she cares about is moving.

It's also on Arizona to make it work and not just by forcing a custody battle to keep Sofia there.

There is a happy medium that exists where it could work, but both have to want to make some compromises. Not one or the other.

Again, just my opinion.

I'm still not going to come down on either one until I see what happens.

I understand it's a speculation thread, but speculation about a storyline is one thing. Deciding a character is already in the wrong is another thing especially when it hasn't played out.

On a side note, I'm not saying you've made a decision, but it's clear some have.

This. It's very OOC.

Who said Callie was leaving Sofia?

To be honest, I think this is Grey's amping up drama. Nothing more.

Edited April 13, 2016 by North

[statsgirl]

Callie is in a relationship, with another doctor, that for better or worse is stable.

Arizona randomly hooks up with women and lives with an intern who also brings women home.

Callie's relationship with Penny is fairly new and they're obviously not living together since Sofia just met Penny.  It's a stable dating relationship but it's not a stable live-in relationship.

 

If Arizona's dating is a problem, she can do what other divorced parents do and either not bring the date home with her or go to her place while Sofia is with a babysitter.  I doubt Sofia is going to be traumatized by De Luca's dating habits. 

 

But maximum stability for Sofia:  Arizona takes over Callie's apartment for the year she's away so that Sofia can stay in the same place.

 

My friend's mom had to go away for school for about a year. Should she have left her daughter with the grandparents so as not to uproot her? It didn't damage my friend. In fact that new experience was beneficial.

I don't know your friend's situation.  I know mothers who have left their children with grandparents when the mother had to move away so the child wouldn't have their lives disrupted.

 

But this isn't a question of leaving a child with grandparents, it's leaving a child with one parent or the other.  One parent is staying in Seattle where the child's life is and who has a prestigious job as the head of a department, the other is moving away across country for one year to be with a very recent girlfriend and will presumably be looking for a job when she gets there.  If Arizona had equal rights to Callie, I think most judges would leave Sofia in Seattle.

 

I've seen kids who are in therapy because they have trouble dealing with going back and forth between divorced parents, and I've read about divorced couples who they keep the house and the adult moves back and forth between the family home and an apartment so the kids get to stay in one place.

 

It all depends on whose feelings you prioritize. For me, it should be Sofia.

 

Callie is going to look so bad if she insists on taking Sofia to New York.

Edited April 13, 2016 by statsgirl

[CED9]

I feel like Ellen's tweet about Jessica almost confirms that Arizona loses in court. Why else would she "rip our hearts out."

The title of the episode seems to point in that direction, too.

[TheresaW1934]

Stability is more than just about staying in a familiar place.

Children move all the time and they are none the worse. Children of divorced parents move too and are fine. They go back to visit the other parent and are fine.

Callie is in a relationship, with another doctor, that for better or worse is stable.

Arizona randomly hooks up with women and lives with an intern who also brings women home.

That is not going to work in Arizona's favor no matter how you cut it.

Is being in a relationship with a girlfriend or a boyfriend considered 'stable' from a legal  perspective?  Does time involved and living together for x time count?  Have they been living together?  I'm thinking no if Penny just met Sofia.  Is there a time-jump during any of this miss-mash? 

 

My guess is Callie and Penny's relationship status will be upped via online scenes or info dumps in the last handful of programs left in season 12.  If feels like it has to be to give the story sea legs and enable the viewers to relate to the 'tell' of the tepid thus far.

 

For me personally to invest more in the Callie / Penny relationship, I'd like more than dialog.  I'd like to hear ILY from Callie, the discussion or result of the discussion about both wanting a family together and expanding family and agreeing to more kids. 

 

Logical direction would be for Penny to say enough, and tell Callie she should stay, it's only a year etc.  Callie responds to the 'give' and says, no I 'want' to go and be with you.  The 'give' back.  Else, it's Callie thinking she gives and gives and gives again yes? 

 

Clearly, custody can be worked out with either Mom or Sofia traveling and should not be a deal or even relationship breaker.  It seems like that's just one half of the story being told - Arizona's half.  Arizona fights. Perhaps even makes the grand gesture of letting go and agreeing to visitations.  Growth.  Giving. 

 

Callie's story is about her relationship with Penny and establishing it's transition.  Permanent or letting go; attempting a long distance relationship and success TBD.  Go to New York sans Sofia is commitment and desire for long and true relationship.  Stay in Seattle is not letting go of Penny, but possible commitment to trying and making long distance work because it's worth the effort.  Letting go means sacrifice with intent to the 'best' thing in Callie's opinion for her daughter. 

 

AND if thinking of co-parents, it sets season 13 up for a lot of things to work out with co-parent Arizona, especially as it pertains to overcoming the hurt and anger that got them both there in the first place.

 

Long way of saying there is nothing to date suggesting that Arizona had any of her 'hook-ups' in her home or when she had Sofia.  Nor is there anything to suggest Deluca and Maggie were together when Sofia was there.  Clearly Sofia and Penny weren't in the same place during Callie's allocated time.  It would also be very easy to say this is how things are and/ or would change when my daugher is with me.

 

Regardless, it's not a story line I admire for the characters involved.  Extraordinary disappointed if Grey's takes us down that road.  As IMO, all three characters deserve better.  Plus depending on how it's presented, it could do irrevocable damage, as Greys doesn't always do fair and balanced story telling well.

 

Of course, this is the speculation part of the spoiler and speculating thread for me.  I've no idea where they're going or if any of the speculation will play out.

 

How things play out will determine how I perceive the characters moving forward.  That final perception won't occur until seasons end as things won't start to set until then.  Nothing for it but to wait and see.  It is what it is.

 

PS

Forgive errors as posts appear as dictated.  Going back and listening and re-editing takes a great deal of the fun out of things, so I just fire them off and let them lie.

Edited April 13, 2016 by TheresaW1934

[Joana]

I feel like Ellen's tweet about Jessica almost confirms that Arizona loses in court. Why else would she "rip our hearts out."

The title of the episode seems to point in that direction, too.

 

I'm guessing it will be an Arizona-centric episode covering her relationship with Sofia ever since she first found out that Callie is pregnant, overcoming the initial shock and discovering herself in a somewhat unexpected role as a parent. It would have the potential for some emotional stuff.

 

But she's almost certainly fighting a losing battle, even if it's just about not letting Callie take Sofia with her. I don't even want to consider her asking for full custody, it would be pure nonsense. 

[North]

Callie's relationship with Penny is fairly new and they're obviously not living together since Sofia just met Penny. It's a stable dating relationship but it's not a stable live-in relationship.

If Arizona's dating is a problem, she can do what other divorced parents do and either not bring the date home with her or go to her place while Sofia is with a babysitter. I doubt Sofia is going to be traumatized by De Luca's dating habits.

But maximum stability for Sofia: Arizona takes over Callie's apartment for the year she's away so that Sofia can stay in the same place.

I don't know your friend's situation. I know mothers who have left their children with grandparents when the mother had to move away so the child wouldn't have their lives disrupted.

But this isn't a question of leaving a child with grandparents, it's leaving a child with one parent or the other. One parent is staying in Seattle where the child's life is and who has a prestigious job as the head of a department, the other is moving away across country for one year to be with a very recent girlfriend and will presumably be looking for a job when she gets there. If Arizona had equal rights to Callie, I think most judges would leave Sofia in Seattle.

I've seen kids who are in therapy because they have trouble dealing with going back and forth between divorced parents, and I've read about divorced couples who they keep the house and the adult moves back and forth between the family home and an apartment so the kids get to stay in one place.

It all depends on whose feelings you prioritize. For me, it should be Sofia.

Callie is going to look so bad if she insists on taking Sofia to New York.

Certainly in real life you would prioritize Sofia.

Callie wanting Sofia shows just how much she prioritized her. One year in New York is not going to break her.

The fact remains a mother in a relationship of many months is going to be looked at more favorably than a mother who randomly hooks up.

I'm not begrudging Arizona either. She's single and free to date however she wants, but it's not stable and save for Callie that in general has been her dating history. She can make all the promises she wants but the fact remains that it doesn't look good and would surely be used as a mark against her character by any good lawyer.

What if Arizona is the one who doesn't want to work with Callie in order to figure out something for that year?

Doesn't that make her look bad?

Right now, we'll see what Arizona decides to do tomorrow and go from there.

The story hasn't been told so it's hard to say who's going to look bad.

Edited April 13, 2016 by North

[TheresaW1934]

Moving her away essentially removes Arizona from her life for a year other than some visits throughout.

Quick question - I know when Penny was reading she said the grant was for a year.  Yet, when Ben was speaking to Miranda he said something akin to being away from his family for a year or maybe more.  Did I hear that right?  Is the time away a question mark or was it a continuity error?

Edited April 13, 2016 by TheresaW1934

[North]

Scenario: what if Callie decides to take the year off while in New York? That way when Sofia's not in school she's with Callie.

[photo fox]

My feeling is: the onus to "make it work" is on the person who wants to change the status quo.

 

A lot of people I know have it written into their divorce decree that the custodial parent can't move from a certain geographical area without getting approval from the non-custodial parent, unless they are willing to give up primary physical custody.  I can absolutely see Arizona seeking some kind of legal document to that effect.

 

I realize some people may say that impinges on Callie's rights, but I feel like having a child with someone is a tacit agreement that you will make considerations for that person until the child reaches adulthood.  (Always assuming that the other person is not abusive, or a deadbeat, etc.)

 

eta: Compromise is all well and good, but considering the distance they seemed to be implying, the reality is that Sophia would live with one parent and visit the other very occasionally.  If she were older and could travel alone, it might be different, but...

[windsprints]

 

Quick question - I know when Penny was reading she said the grant was for a year.  Yet, when Ben was speaking to Miranda he said something akin to being away from his family for a year or maybe more.  Did I hear that right?  Is the time away a question mark or was it a continuity error?

 

I don't remember what Ben said. I was going by Penny saying it was a grant for a full research year. Maybe its something that can be extended if the research goes well?  I have no idea how that kind of thing works, sorry.

[TheresaW1934]

The fact remains a mother in a relationship of many months is going to be looked at more favorably than a mother who randomly hooks up.

Help me understand where this is coming from?

 

Going to make some assumptions here which the show can change on a dime.  :)

1. Arizona adopted Sofia, thus making Callie and Sofia legally recognized parents.

2. Callie and Arizona are single parents raising a child.

3. Both can provide basics and homes that support Sofia's safety and well-being.

4. Both have the right petition the court to allow the child to leave the state  OR keep the child in state since it changes custodial rights or agreements.

5. Both have the right to petition for full custody or change in custody if agreement cant be reached.

 

Third Parties:

Penny is a non-issue because (at this writing anyway) she does not live in the home and has no direct influence on Sofia's safety or well-being.

 

Deluca can be looked at  vetted because he does live in the same home. His presence and influence would need to be established and the court ensured it does not negatively affect Sofia.

 

The court can decided to dismiss the hearing and refer it to Child services for follow up and recommendation.  The court can decide to approve the motion to allow the child to stay in state or leave the state.  The court can establish full custody for one or the other. The court can state specific custody agreements.  Or again, refer it back to Child Services or whatever the appropriate agency is in Washington state to recommend custody / visitation rights etc.

 

Whom Callie or Arizona date, whether it's one person or a million is a non-issue.  The court's concern is Sofia's welfare and well-being.  Until Grey's changes it - and that could happen in the next few programs, Penny is a non-factor.  My guess is, Deluca will be a non-factor as well.  In this, I think Grey's will keep it balanced and level headed.  Could be wrong.

 

Sorry, got side-tracked: Where in the law does a parent's dating life influence a court's decision IF that life does not and has not affected the child's well-being?  How could / would a court use the relationship for or against one or the other?  Isn't it a moot point?

 

Or are you thinking it's Grey's they'll take it places that have no bearing to make drama for drama's sake?

 

ETA; forgot an important bit.  If Callie and Penny do move in together and it's been only a few months, that could become a deficit.  Why? Callie wants to take Sofia out of state to follow a girlfriend.  There is not an established long term relationship.  Swing it around, if Callie was going for a job opportunity or grant or something else -- then she has a better starting point.  Again, I think for this to work, Callie and Penny need to make a change.  Plus an infamous time jump could help s well.

Edited April 14, 2016 by TheresaW1934

[North]

Help me understand where this is coming from?

Going to make some assumptions here which the show can change on a dime. :)

1. Arizona adopted Sofia, thus making Callie and Sofia legally recognized parents.

2. Callie and Arizona are single parents raising a child.

3. Both can provide basics and homes that support Sofia's safety and well-being.

4. Both have the right petition the court to allow the child to leave the state OR keep the child in state since it changes custodial rights or agreements.

5. Both have the right to petition for full custody or change in custody if agreement cant be reached.

Third Parties:

Penny is a non-issue because (at this writing anyway) she does not live in the home and has no direct influence on Sofia's safety or well-being.

Deluca can be looked at vetted because he does live in the same home. His presence and influence would need to be established and the court ensured it does not negatively affect Sofia.

The court can decided to dismiss the hearing and refer it to Child services for follow up and recommendation. The court can decide to approve the motion to allow the child to stay in state or leave the state. The court can establish full custody for one or the other. The court can state specific custody agreements. Or again, refer it back to Child Services or whatever the appropriate agency is in Washington state to recommend custody / visitation rights etc.

Whom Callie or Arizona date, whether it's one person or a million is a non-issue. The court's concern is Sofia's welfare and well-being. Until Grey's changes it - and that could happen in the next few programs, Penny is a non-factor. My guess is, Deluca will be a non-factor as well. In this, I think Grey's will keep it balanced and level headed. Could be wrong.

Sorry, got side-tracked: Where in the law does a parent's dating life influence a court's decision IF that life does not and has not affected the child's well-being? How could / would a court use the relationship for or against one or the other? Isn't it a moot point?

Or are you thinking it's Grey's they'll take it places that have no bearing to make drama for drama's sake?

ETA; forgot an important bit. If Callie and Penny do move in together and it's been only a few months, that could become a deficit. Why? Callie wants to take Sofia out of state to follow a girlfriend. There is not an established long term relationship. Swing it around, if Callie was going for a job opportunity or grant or something else -- then she has a better starting point. Again, I think for this to work, Callie and Penny need to make a change. Plus an infamous time jump could help s well.

Okay, see I'm not talking about this from a real life legal standpoint. I couldn't.

This is Grey's spec and because they do drama for the sake of drama. They always say the show is not about the kids, yet here we are.

I also believe they highlighted Arizona's dating habits for this specific reason, otherwise why not just have her meet somebody?

I get the desire to relate real life instances, I've done it, but ultimately this show is not often based in reality.

[TheresaW1934]

Okay, see I'm not talking about this from a real life legal standpoint. I couldn't.

This is Grey's spec and because they do drama for the sake of drama. They always say the show is not about the kids, yet here we are.

I also believe they highlighted Arizona's dating habits for this specific reason, otherwise why not just have her meet somebody?

I get the desire to relate real life instances, I've done it, but ultimately this show is not often based in reality.

Oh, okay.

 

Guess I was seeing Arizona accept and move on.  Regaining her confidence and a sense of who she was - the let me fly.

 

Nothing for it but to wait and see I guess.

 

Thanks for explaining.

[North]

Oh, okay.

Guess I was seeing Arizona accept and move on. Regaining her confidence and a sense of who she was - the let me fly.

Nothing for it but to wait and see I guess.

Thanks for explaining.

At first that's how I saw it but now seeing how it's playing out, I think there is a specific reason the highlighted it so much.

You're welcome. I looked back and realized it sounded like I was talking from a real life perspective. I can't with this show though. Lol.

[Greysaddict]

not that there is any doubt about Callie and Arizona being involved in some kind of custody case but I just got around to watching the sneak peak and realized the missing kid was the subject of a custody case THAT morning, so it seems like that could be what starts off the whole thing.  

 

Also, I don't see the point over arguing who is more stable between Callie and Arizona.  They are both highly successful, established surgeons.   I'm pretty sure both would be deemed "stable" by the court system. 

[North]

not that there is any doubt about Callie and Arizona being involved in some kind of custody case but I just got around to watching the sneak peak and realized the missing kid was the subject of a custody case THAT morning, so it seems like that could be what starts off the whole thing.

Also, I don't see the point over arguing who is more stable between Callie and Arizona. They are both highly successful, established surgeons. I'm pretty sure both would be deemed "stable" by the court system.

In real life. In drama and thrillville? Who knows what shit they are going to pull. Edited April 14, 2016 by North

[beautifulGA]

from life experience, from personal experience. i know for sure that arizona will be fighting a loosing battle. single parent's dating life are not scrutinized by court, the only thing they want to make sure is who is connected to child more 'ethically' and who can provide more stability. this subject is a sore matter, i have been here.

beside being a non biological single parent, one major thing that is going against arizona is her being an amputee. while they don't always point it aloud but the court always wants to know, under a situation of 'crisis' which parent is emotionally, mentally and physically more fit to protect that child. and this could be all low blows to arizona.

im glad that jessica and sara finally have material where they can show their amazing chemistry and intense acting abilities but for once I wished it was not always arizona on the loosing end and callie being all mighty powerful calling the shots. ugh this show is no better than all other shows that are being dragged for tropes. greys is ruthless to it's lgbtq characters no less.

[pennben]

....so I think we're all just having fun with trying to figure this out....

 

Okay, this made me giggle a bit.  I hope you can forgive me.  it just feels like a lot more angst than fun at the moment!   We're all just getting mad before we see what makes us mad! What will be will be, and I'll be back next year, regardless, so I'm going to try to skip back out of here again and just watch.

 

Be well all! I hope to not see you in this thread until the summer (but it's likely I'll be chatting here next week....grrrr)....:)!  Catch you all in the episodes threads!

Edited April 14, 2016 by pennben

[Greysaddict]

I've hinted this before over the last few months, but since the original cast of Broadway's hottest ticket will have their contracts end in July, it would not surprise me if SaRa is cast in it as either the supporting role of the three females in the cast (a fantastic role), or the minor female role (which is dual, but has a huge number that I can hear SaRa making epic). She could have the female lead, but vocally I do not hear her there.

I know this is off topic, but which Broadway show are you talking about?  

[CED9]

I don't know if this is really a spoiler, but I wanted to be safe than sorry.

I thought it was interesting that on the Shondaland Revealed podcast Betsy and Chandra brought back up the whole "Callie is in love with love" thought.

I wonder how/if that will play into things the next few episodes.