All Episodes Talk: "I'm Just a Fake Psychic Zombie Trying to Do Her Part"

[Watcher0363]

I am starting this thread as a catchall for ones general thoughts of, or on the show.

 

For me the first thing I want to say is what a find that Rose McIver was. The nuance that she brings to each of the personalities she experiences is wonderful. This young lady is a very good actress and I am really enjoying her performance.

 

Second thing. It has been a long time since I have seen a show that seems like it is very well mapped out. These early episodes are reminding me of the early episodes of Babylon 5. Where minor characters, institutions and events are mentioned. And it is not until the full story starts to unfold that minor characters become major players, pass events mentioned in passing become pivotal plot points. And most important, institutions and major characters never turn out to be who you think they are.

 

I am hoping this show has a good run. That we are introduced to the layered universe soon, so we can began to peel back the layers, to reveal the true essence of this universe.

[FurryFury]

I think the thread should be subtitled as "All Episodes Talk", so as its purpose would be clear.

 

For me the first thing I want to say is what a find that Rose McIver was. The nuance that she brings to each of the personalities she experiences is wonderful. This young lady is a very good actress and I am really enjoying her performance.

 

Yeah, I don't yet know if McIver is as great a find as Kristen Bell was in VM, but so far, she rocks. Both dramatic and comedic scenes are great. The only problem I can see is the comparative lack of chemistry with Major (which really isn't much of the actress' fault), and considering the type of character he is, lack of chemistry can prove damning for him.

 

Second thing. It has been a long time since I have seen a show that seems like it is very well mapped out.

 

I can't say much about worldbuilding of the show yet. While Rob Thomas did emphasize in his interviews that he considers mythology to be the key to a genre show (correct), I haven't seen enough of it yet to draw a conclusion. I wouldn't expect any major contradictions as soon as 6 episodes anyway. However when it comes to maneuvering the characters, it seems to work fine, although yet again, it's too early to judge. 

[Cranberry]

Changed the title to the standard All Episodes Talk, but feel free to suggest a subtitle! I wasn't sure which part of the original title to use (it was long).

[riley702]

I do have one wee request. Not everyone here has seen (or wants to see) Veronica Mars. *ducks* I know they have the same show runner, but can we not have a reference to VM in what seems like every other post? Hashing whether this character is more like Logan, Duncan, Troy, etc. doesn't mean a damned thing to me and makes me feel like I shouldn't be here - that these threads are just for VM folks.

I DO understand there will inevitably be some mentions and comparisons. Maybe just not quite so much? Please?

[FurryFury]

Just imagine the showrunner of one of your favorite shows ever has a new show. One that does have quite a few similarities to the previous one, too. Would you really go out of your way to avoid referencing it, especially when you see something that really, really reminds you of his previous project? Especially when a lot of people on the boards would probably understand you.

 

I mean, I get that it can be annoying... But just a bit, I guess. Pretty soon, if things will continue to develop as well as they do, we'll all start to talk only about iZombie, without bringing up Veronica Mars in every other post.

 

(And also, even if you're probably already sick of it - go watch VM, it's genuinely fantastic, at least seasons 1&2).

Edited April 22, 2015 by FurryFury

[Julia]

Can I humbly suggest that if that's the case, it might serve everyone to create a VM flashback thread? Because it seems as if the resonances some folks see from the earlier show are still very emotional for some people who watched it, and I feel as if it's a matter of time before I step on a landmine if I comment on this show and accidentally push someone else's (possibly thoroughly valid) VM buttons.

 

Actually, I'm pretty sure that's already happened. And you could make the case that it's unfair to ask people who just want to watch and talk about this show to take on the responsibility of watching another show before they can safely comment.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Julia

[Sakura12]

I guess we can ask if we can make a "Similar Shows" thread like we have on the Arrow and Flash forums.

[Watcher0363]

To be honest I did not start the thread with an all episode overview in mind. I wanted it to be an everything iZombie discussion thread. If you wanted to talk about overall themes find. If you wanted to talk about characters in general as they relate to iZombie or other shows like Veronica Mars or Buffy, go for it. If you wanted to talk about the actresses or actors in general go for it. I wanted it for people to bring in outside influences, which they believe may or may not be influencing the show.

 

I have not seen VM and probably never will. There is so much material which many people may have not read or seen. I wanted them to able to bring it up in this thread without worrying about spoiler tags or whether everyone reading their statements can relate to them. For me we are 55 years into the modern television era. Given British, Canadian, Japanese sci fi and American television, I am not up on every single show that has been produced in that 55 years. Nor am I even thinking about trying to catch up on them. So if someone mentions something I have never heard of or something I have heard of but will never watch, I say, so what. If someone else understands it and they have a conversation, then maybe I will learn something. Or it may turn me on to something new that I will explore.

 

I know I am in the minority here. But I do not want people to have to censor their thoughts and comments on a TV show just because not everyone knows what they know, concerning other shows parallels. Spoilers about what is coming up can be placed elsewhere. But as for as characters and plots resembling other shows, just go for it. So far to me, iZombie is Tru Calling, done much better.

 

P.S. the title was a take on a Faith Hill song lyric.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Watcher0363

[FurryFury]

To be honest I did not start the thread with an all episode overview in mind. I wanted it to be an everything iZombie discussion thread. If you wanted to talk about overall themes find.

 

All episode threads are usually pretty vaguely defined and can be used for a lot of stuff. Including overall themes. I feel like it's wise to follow other forums' example rather than create lots of original threads.

 

So, as for me, I think it's wise to create threads such as iZombie and similar shows, Relationships, All episodes, Mythology, etc.

Edited April 22, 2015 by FurryFury

[Julia]

 But I do not want people to have to censor their thoughts and comments on a TV show

 

WADR, it seems to me that you're being a bit selective about who you want to have to censor their thoughts and comments on a TV show here. 

[riley702]

And you could make the case that it's unfair to ask people who just want to watch and talk about this show to take on the responsibility of watching another show before they can safely comment.

This. I wasn't talking about this topic specifically. I put this comment here, as it seemed to be a catch-all topic, but there's a helluva lot of it in episode threads, character threads, etc. It's a bit much, personally. I want to talk about this show, in this show's forum. It doesn't seem a lot to ask.

[CinnamonCat]

I agree with the idea of a Veronica Mars flashback topic -- sure, sometimes mentioning the parallels and similarities will be unavoidable, but I believe we can reduce them to a minimum on other topics. Not only would this make the people who haven't seen VM (a lifestyle choice I do not understand, but hey, to each their own) feel more included, but it would also help in not spoiling those who plan on seeing it. After all, nothing spoiled me for Buffy more than discussions about the similarities between it and VM.

Actually, maybe a flashback topic for more similar shows would be a good idea -- let's debate whether Major's an Angel or a Riley! 

...Wait, no. In this analogy, Lowell is Parker. Forget I said anything. 

 

Agreed regarding Rose McIver. She's not as brilliant as Kristen Bell was (yet), but she's pretty good and I think she'll improve. Also, I find her persona much more appealing than Bell's, but YMMV.

[Cranberry]

Single-episode threads are for discussion of a particular episode; all-episode talk is for discussion of the show as a whole (arcs, themes, stuff like that).

 

I considered a separate thread for comparing iZombie to other shows, but I haven't done it yet because the references to Veronica Mars seem to mostly be offhand comments sprinkled throughout episode threads ("this dialogue is just like something Veronica said," or "this scene gives me hope that Major won't be as boring as Duncan was"), and I'm not sure a dedicated topic would get rid of those. But if you guys want a comparison topic, we can start that and see if it helps. I will say that I'm not going to outlaw VMars mentions in other threads; that's a level of nit-picky moderation we do not get into around here.

 

EDIT: Started a thread!

[Cranberry]

A place to discuss particular episodes, arcs and moments from the show's run. Please remember this isn't a complete catch-all topic -- check out the forum for character topics and other places for show-related talk.

[riley702]

I wasn't asking for a ban - I just asked (nicely, I thought), for people to voluntarily cut it back a bit since everyone isn't conversant with VM. But, thank you.

[fluffysheap]

Am I the only one that has thought that they really should try to bring in Jim Gaffigan for an episode? Whether as a zombie, or just a guy who gets mistaken for one, either would do.

[Derrell2015]

What kind of smartphone does Liv use? I sort of looks like a Huawei from the back but is it?

[editorgrrl]

I get the feeling they're treating Major like an Arrow character—he gets the Bad Things Happen for No Reason recurring plot.  I hope he gets a happy ending (or an explanation for the bad karma...but preferably the former; the Evil All Along trope can get annoying if they do it too much, and they already have [Lieutenant Suzuki].

 

Enh, I kind of like that the Damsel in Distress is a guy.

[dcalley]

I thought "Vaughn Du Clarke" was just begging to be put into the anagram generator. There are some real gems, such as Cadaver Lug Hunk, Larvae Duck Hung, Guava Drunk Lech.... Unfortunately, the internet tells me it's spelled without the e, so that really cuts down on the number of results. But we still have Vulgar Hunk Cad, Lava Chunk Drug, and some more.

[fantique]

Hey, new to watching this show and just finished season 1. I really miss Lowell (I was so bummed he died I had to take a day off binging the show on Netflix).

Please tell me I am not  the only one really over Major. Why couldn't he have died instead?

 

PS: I know it's unfair to Major, the out of reach because reasons love interest is hard to like for me but gosh he is so bland.

I do love the show though and can't wait to see how Blaine and Major deal with being cured. Rose McIver is the best. I love Ravi and Peyton (I hope she comes back) too. And I appreciated that they made it realistic that only a Rookie trying to catch a break would actually depend this much on a psychic and I feel like he actually got better at his job as the season went on. I do hope they bring him in on the secret but I am not tired of his "uh oh, she being weird-er" looks when Liv eats a more out there brain just yet.

Edited October 23, 2015 by fantique

[Julia]

Hey, new to watching this show and just finished season 1. I really miss Lowell (I was so bummed he died I had to take a day off binging the show on Netflix).

Please tell me I am not  the only one really over Major. Why couldn't he have died instead?

 

PS: I know it's unfair to, the out of reach because reasons love interest is hard to like for me but gosh he is so bland.

I do love the show though and can't wait to see how Blaine and Major deal with being cured. Rose McIver is the best. I love Ravi and Peyton (I hope she comes back) too. And I appreciated that they made it realistic that only a Rookie trying to catch a break would actually depend this much on a psychic and I feel like he actually got better at his job as the season went on. I do hope they bring him in on the secret but I am not tired of his "uh oh, she being weird-er" looks when Liv eats a more out there brain just yet.

 

Ravi/Peyton (Rayton? Pavi?) is a really popular ship, or at least it seems to be in this group. And I'd love to see Clive get more play, particularly if it took time away from the Major angst arc. I'm not a Blaine fan, and I'm still enjoying his screen time this season more than I am Major's arc.

[FurryFury]

You're not the one who dislikes Major. I think the actor's a big reason for that, but mostly, I tend to hate pairings that are already established by the start of the story. I prefer it when character meet at the start and things work slowly.

 

Plus, Major is never funny, which is a serious problem for a dramedy.

[Chicago Redshirt]

And I appreciated that they made it realistic that only a Rookie trying to catch a break would actually depend this much on a psychic and I feel like he actually got better at his job as the season went on. I do hope they bring him in on the secret but I am not tired of his "uh oh, she being weird-er" looks when Liv eats a more out there brain just yet.

I would say that while Clive's original willingness to depend on a psychic was dependent on his being a rookie outsider, now that Liv has proved her "psychic" abilities in at least 15+ cases, at some point it would seem that there would be wider interest both from the department and from the outside world. I mean, I know that they have basically gotten a confession in each murder, which would presumably make it so that there was no need for Liv to testify as a fake psychic as to the leads. But still, I think it would garner some interest that a psychic managed to help the police clear like 15+ cases.

[CletusMusashi]

I was always pretty good about catching the new episode every week, and I don't plan to stop doing that next season, but now that I'm marathoning the whole thing from the beginning I've got to admit that it's even better this way. For one thing: if you're trying to watch for clues to the mystery, it detracts from paying attention to the characters.  But once you know how the procedural aspect ends, you can scan around more and enjoy more of what else is going on. And, honestly, the procedural-only stuff doesn't take up nearly as much of the ep as it feels like the first time.

Also, I originally felt there were pacing issues with a lot of the side-characters. But there's a big difference between not seeing a main character for a few weeks or not seeing them for a couple hours. Also, a lot of the early episodes take place literally a day after the last one. Watching them end to end is an easier way to stay in the moment.

And when you already know where the story is going, you can see a lot more early seeds being planted. I loved Season 1 when it was airing, sure, but until I started the rewatch I underestimated how quickly the overall story actually progresses.

[marketdoctor]

Quote

I would say that while Clive's original willingness to depend on a psychic was dependent on his being a rookie outsider, now that Liv has proved her "psychic" abilities in at least 15+ cases, at some point it would seem that there would be wider interest both from the department and from the outside world.

I have a few thoughts here:

1.  Some psychics in our universe do a lot of self-promoting, so if Liv were keeping a lower profile, which is in character most of the time (depending on the brain), she'd be getting less PR.

2.  Clive is extremely quiet, and knows Liv is helpful, but weird.  Not every cop, nor every media outlet, deals well with weird.

3.  Counterpoint is why Dale Bozio isn't noticing more of that, and thus bringing her to the attention of the FBI.  (I could even see her realizing zombies are real, but really useful in crime prevention.)

(Happy Thanksgiving everyone!)

[Thriftykins]

I keep having these dreams where I am screaming at Ravi for letting the world go to shit in a zombie apocalypse, because he knew about zombies and was working on a cure while the problem was still small enough to contain.  Yet he didn't engage the CDC, and in fact actively impeded them.

 

I guess the hypothetical fiasco isn't all on him, but I still think he's being very irresponsible.

[Affogato]

20 hours ago, Thriftykins said:

I keep having these dreams where I am screaming at Ravi for letting the world go to shit in a zombie apocalypse, because he knew about zombies and was working on a cure while the problem was still small enough to contain.  Yet he didn't engage the CDC, and in fact actively impeded them.

 

I guess the hypothetical fiasco isn't all on him, but I still think he's being very irresponsible.

Oh, real world logic. 

I wonder if the return of Chase (Savage, is it?) will mean we will learn the problem is not small and contained. Max Rager, like Coke, may well be an international brand!

[ParadoxLost]

I'm no longer finding much of anything enjoyable with this show.

At the end of last season I was worried.  it seemed like they set up a scenario that was overly ambitious for a part serialized, part procedural TV show and pretty much untenable in trying to maintain the series in the form that it had taken in the prior three seasons.  I think it actually has gone off the rails in a way I hadn't anticipated because they set up a massive change and then didn't fully follow through with it.

Liv is way too over the top when she eats a brain this season. I think this is a reaction to zombies being known to the public and especially Clive.  They can no longer get any humor out of Liv being subtly off kilter because everyone shrugs it off as zombie brain.  So they go to the extreme every time she eats a brain so Clive and gang has something to react to.  The only reason this is even necessary is because they are trying to maintain the murder of the week procedural nature of the show when the set up a scenario at the end of last season that made the procedural part seem inconsequential.

Next, this underground railroad or resistance thing Liv joined up with is stupid.  They are in a city walled off from the rest of the US filled with thousands of zombies forcibly turned by the corporation that has seized control of the city in a coup that is now systematically stripping all rights from the people, beheading the zombies they turned in public and that they now can't feed.  The cause this handful of numb-nuts running the underground railroad has decided to take up is helping people with terminal illnesses become zombies?  Are you kidding me? 

Then we have the morons running FG all shocked and sad that their plans aren't turning out as expected.  Its shocking that people haven't filled donation cards to have their brains eaten upon death said no one ever.  Except chase Graves seems to think its weird that people didn't volunteer to be food upon death.

That brings me to a bunch of starving zombies who were turned against their will being entirely too reasonable and rational about not having enough to eat considering this was intentionally done too them.  They'll turn tricks,  Starve themselves to feed their family.  They'll follow Blaine's whackjob Dad.  But picketing FG, that's a step too far.

Not to mention that Clive can't be the only person now in a relationship with a zombie.  Why are people just trying to figure out how to deal with families and relationships broken up by the zombie vaccine and not lashing out at FG.

And the remaining humans in the city are taking no longer being at the top of the food chain way too well.

They seem to be playing up the idea people are too afraid or have too much self interest to do anything about this situation.  I don't buy it.  There would at least be insurgents causing havoc.  There would be people killing zombies out of fear. 

And if their approach is that FG has a tight enough hold on the city to suppress factions from lashing out,, Liv, Clive, Ravi, and Peyton should be having private discussions that give the audience some insight to that.  It almost feels like they don't really want Chase to be a villain so they are ignoring that he did something pretty much irredeemable by not really hammering home how shitty it was in how many ways.  He's getting the woobie treatment and it annoys me.   He feels really bad that he has to do bad things to control the situation he created.  Boo hoo.

I do actually feel like Major is infiltrating FG for some as yet unrevealed purpose, like an actual resistance, that is a surprise for the season finale or something and that they are not playing obvious beats of this storyline to keep it a surprise to the detriment of the show.

[Ray Adverb]

That post pretty much nails it.  Except for the hypothesis about Major being an infiltrator.  I still think he's a completely genuine FG piece of shit.

Edited April 25, 2018 by RayAdverb
Said "Chase" instead of "Major"

[Mr. Sparkle]

After loving Season 1, and being pleasantly surprised that Season 2 was just as good, if not better, I am also disappointed with where the show has gone for Seasons 3 & 4. The Filmore-Graves stuff just hasn't worked, IMO. The walled-in city plot is just so preposterous that it makes a show about a zombie coroner who eats brains unrealistic. I kind of hope this is the last season. 

That said, I could totally see a Chase redemption plot, followed by his death. 

[ParadoxLost]

On ‎4‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 8:34 AM, RayAdverb said:

That post pretty much nails it.  Except for the hypothesis about Chase being an infiltrator.  I still think he's a completely genuine FG piece of shit.

Its tough to tell with Major ( I think you meant Major).

I think he got thrown in to the FG storyline because someone had to and his character has nothing else to do.

Whether he is a genuine POS kind of depends on what type of bad writing this show is employing.

I'm going with ulterior motive because he shot up the newsroom.  Usually when they take him that far, they pull out some surprise that tries to mitigate the shitiness of his actions.

Like Major is the Chaos killer, oh wait he just tossed zombies into the deep freeze temporarily.

[Ray Adverb]

12 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

Its tough to tell with Major ( I think you meant Major).

Woops.  Went back and edited that...

[Ray Adverb]

I actually had a dream influenced by this show.  Actually by the latest episode.  I dreamed I was trying to blackmail Peyton to get some of that stolen money.  That didn't work because she sent Liv after me who threatened to turn me into a zombie.  Then I just settled on trying to turn Liv in to FG for her smuggling work and get her sentenced to the squishotine.

[Affogato]

On ‎4‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 10:06 PM, ParadoxLost said:

 

They seem to be playing up the idea people are too afraid or have too much self interest to do anything about this situation.  I don't buy it.  There would at least be insurgents causing havoc.  There would be people killing zombies out of fear. 

And if their approach is that FG has a tight enough hold on the city to suppress factions from lashing out,, Liv, Clive, Ravi, and Peyton should be having private discussions that give the audience some insight to that.  It almost feels like they don't really want Chase to be a villain so they are ignoring that he did something pretty much irredeemable by not really hammering home how shitty it was in how many ways.  He's getting the woobie treatment and it annoys me.   He feels really bad that he has to do bad things to control the situation he created.  Boo hoo.

I do actually feel like Major is infiltrating FG for some as yet unrevealed purpose, like an actual resistance, that is a surprise for the season finale or something and that they are not playing obvious beats of this storyline to keep it a surprise to the detriment of the show.

I think the religious zombies and Major with his teenagers at the restaurant or convenience store (where one scratches a human), and of course the spray painting doors are all evidence of some of the things you mention. The bus driver crashing the truck can't have been the only incident like that and they mayor's office is dealing with a string of these things.  I think we are supposed to extrapolate that these things are happening all over and I imagine we are also to assume that a lot more people are coming in, not just a couple a month. 

In fairness Carey created the situation and he was called in cold to run the organization, also he pretty clearly isn't trained for that sort of job, as opposed to a military job, and it shows.  this isn't really explored in detail. Right now kidnapping and smashing Renegade are the really horrible things he's done and he is pretty clearly flailing. I can't imagine it ends well for him legally but I can see him going out doing something noble and redeeming. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

Interesting piece:

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/renewcancel/cancel-bear-vs-the-cw-week-31-izombie-can-thank-expansion-for-its-likely-renewal/

[Mr. Sparkle]

It's been renewed. I really hope the 5th season is better than the 4th. 

[ruby24]

1 hour ago, Superclam said:

It's been renewed. I really hope the 5th season is better than the 4th. 

Agreed. I loved the show once, but this season has definitely been its worst. Maybe if they consider next year the last, they can turn things around and plot an end point.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Kind of telling how little chatter there is on here about the renewal, isn't it? 

[jewel21]

I'm happy it's been renewed. After the cancellation of Lucifer, The Exorcist, and Superior Donuts, I needed some good news. 

[kieyra]

10 hours ago, Superclam said:

Kind of telling how little chatter there is on here about the renewal, isn't it? 

I tagged out a few episodes ago. No longer understand or care what’s going on. :/

It’s almost like RT loses interest in his lead characters after a few seasons.

[Free]

15 hours ago, Superclam said:

Kind of telling how little chatter there is on here about the renewal, isn't it? 

Izombie hasn't been much of a buzzy show in a long while but it's nice that it gets closure for its most likely final season.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Well, I'm in it until the bitter end. I really hope next season is better than the last 2.