Spoilers With Speculation

[auntvi]

Is the guy in the background Aaron Douglas (Chief from Battlestar Galactica)?

[SueB]

@catrox14

Quote

WHY THE FUCK IS MR. KETCH IN THE GD BUNKER??

Seems pretty straightforward to me:
- IMO, we're definitely going to see more of the 'discussion' as Mary tries to sway them with burgers, beer, and bullshit.
- Since the BMoL already knew the location, I'm not too fussed about him knowing about the location.
-  I presume Mary convinces them to at least LISTEN to them and asks Ketch to come to the Bunker.  
- I expect the Dean/Ketch moment is a square off between them where Dean decides the guy is complete and utter bullshit.  Thus Dean does NOT go a-hunting with Sam, & Mary on a BMoL job.  
- The previews show Ketch & Mary in tactical gear in a high tech kind of location and also in some foggy location.  This is either Mary going out with Ketch alone after the 'discussion' OR a flashback to her hunting with him in the past few months. I vote flashback.  There seems to be more than one "vamp kill 2017" tour stop in the promo.
- They previews also show a guy in tactical gear who is black being attacked by a vamp.  Looking at the body shape I've changed my opinion, that's NOT Ketch knocked out (or worse) on the ground.  That stunt-dude #2.  
- Mary and Sam hunting without Dean but with stunt-dude #2 has both Mary and Sam in Hunter combo 101 gear (flannel). 
- Mary and Sam are back in the high tech area but this time their blades are bloody clean and they are walking with a random (who apparently may be  Aaron Douglas (Chief from Battlestar Galactica) per auntvi).
- Finally, I am going to steadfastly hold onto my hope that Sam and Dean conspire to have Sam go in with Mary for a hunt and Dean watches their back (without Mary knowing.  It won't look like that during the episode, but it'll turn out that way.

MY big fear: that Sam goes, Dean does not, it goes pear-shaped and Sam looks too trusting.  I want him to retain healthy skepticism.  If Sam and Dean come up with a plan independent of Mary/BMoL from a safety perspective, then I'm okay.  

Edited February 25, 2017 by SueB
error correction

[catrox14]

2 minutes ago, SueB said:

Since the BMoL already knew the location, I'm not too fussed about him knowing about the location.
-  I presume Mary convinces them to at least LISTEN to them and asks Ketch to come to the Bunker.  
- I expect the Dean/Ketch moment is a square off between them where Dean decides the guy is complete and utter bullshit.  Thus Dean does NOT go a-hunting with Sam, & Mary on a BMoL job.  

I don't care if they know the location. Why are they allowing them in the bunker at all.  It's just like fucking Lucifer and Metatron being in the bunker.  Yes I"m sure it's a real world cheap production thing but the bunker is the BOYS HOME. I'm sick of their enemies just lolling about in their home. 

[SueB]

Just now, catrox14 said:

I don't care if they know the location. Why are they allowing them in the bunker at all.  It's just like fucking Lucifer and Metatron being in the bunker.  Yes I"m sure it's a real world cheap production thing but the bunker is the BOYS HOME. I'm sick of their enemies just lolling about in their home. 

I have a vision of you running around the bunker with Lysol spray to eliminate their cooties.  I would support such a life choice.

[catrox14]

46 minutes ago, SueB said:

I have a vision of you running around the bunker with Lysol spray to eliminate their cooties.  I would support such a life choice.

Lysol, lysol wipes, followed by some pine sol and more lysol. LOL

[Mick Lady]

18 hours ago, Wayward Son said:

This isn't really spoilers, but I wasn't sure where else to put it. 

There will be a two or three week break after episode 15 has aired.

I wish there was a way I could "unlike" your post! No offence intended.

[mertensia]

3 hours ago, Mick Lady said:

I wish there was a way I could "unlike" your post! No offence intended.

It's just March Madness time. 

[Geordiegirl1967]

6 hours ago, SueB said:

Mary and Sam hunting without Dean but with stunt-dude #2 has both Mary and Sam in Hunter combo 101 gear (flannel). 

 

6 hours ago, SueB said:

MY big fear: that Sam goes, Dean does not, it goes pear-shaped and Sam looks too trusting.  I want him to retain healthy skepticism.  If Sam and Dean come up with a plan independent of Mary/BMoL from a safety perspective, then I'm okay.

I'm worried that Dabb will have Dean and Sam disagreeing about BMoL and Sam going off with Mary while Dean stays behind in protest. I will be beyond pissed if this happens. Dabb has thankfully avoided the ooc, created for dramatic effect, SOOO not fun to watch bro conflict that Carver was so obsessed with. If he goes down this route I will not be happy. Dean and Sam were a united front when challenged by John and need to be same with Mary. She needs to see how much of a team they are. I'm really worried about this ep based on these pics and the promo.

[Morrigan2575]

8 hours ago, auntvi said:

Is the guy in the background Aaron Douglas (Chief from Battlestar Galactica)?

It certainly looks like him. So I think yes.

[Wayward Son]

2 hours ago, Geordiegirl1967 said:

 

I'm worried that Dabb will have Dean and Sam disagreeing about BMoL and Sam going off with Mary while Dean stays behind in protest. I will be beyond pissed if this happens. Dabb has thankfully avoided the ooc, created for dramatic effect, SOOO not fun to watch bro conflict that Carver was so obsessed with. If he goes down this route I will not be happy. Dean and Sam were a united front when challenged by John and need to be same with Mary. She needs to see how much of a team they are. I'm really worried about this ep based on these pics and the promo.

I'm hoping, as others mentioned, that if they go the route of splitting the brothers for this episode (due to Jensen needing time off) it will be a mutual agreement. For instance they both agree that despite being angry with her they want to look out for Mary and help out with the mission of the episode. But then something else comes up and Dean goes to deal with that. 

Still not ideal as I don't like the idea of either brother working with the BMoL to be honest, but at least beats them fighting.

Edited February 25, 2017 by Wayward Son

[Aeryn13]

From the promo pics it looks as if Dean`s scene(s) (aside from the scene with Mary which appears to directly pick up where the last ep ended) will be in the bunker with Ketch.

Now that could be because Ketch wants to give Dean the sales pitch next but how is it decided that Dean doesn`t come on the hunt Sam and Mary go on? Does Dean say no? But that Sam should go? Do they argue over it? Do the BMOL/Ketch say no to Dean? If so, why? If it`s the BMOL nixing his involvement, why would Dean abide by it and why would Sam then go? Mary isn`t big on loyalty so it wouldn`t matter to her probably.

Or does Dean say no and then Ketch shows up later and they have their talk? 

It`s better than him going on the hunt and then inexplicably not being a presence during it but I`m not confident they will write him out of it in a satisfying manner either. And if it becomes a bonding exercise for Sam and Mary (which is fine in itself) with the purpose of just leaving Dean at odds for further angst and drama later, count me out.  

[ILoveReading]

2 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

From the promo pics it looks as if Dean`s scene(s) (aside from the scene with Mary which appears to directly pick up where the last ep ended) will be in the bunker with Ketch.

Now that could be because Ketch wants to give Dean the sales pitch next but how is it decided that Dean doesn`t come on the hunt Sam and Mary go on? Does Dean say no? But that Sam should go? Do they argue over it? Do the BMOL/Ketch say no to Dean? If so, why? If it`s the BMOL nixing his involvement, why would Dean abide by it and why would Sam then go? Mary isn`t big on loyalty so it wouldn`t matter to her probably.

Or does Dean say no and then Ketch shows up later and they have their talk? 

It`s better than him going on the hunt and then inexplicably not being a presence during it but I`m not confident they will write him out of it in a satisfying manner either. And if it becomes a bonding exercise for Sam and Mary (which is fine in itself) with the purpose of just leaving Dean at odds for further angst and drama later, count me out.  

I can see it going a couple of ways,

It seems to pick up right where they left off.   I can see them going with  Sam buying what Mary is saying.  Given Sam's nature and his character I can easily see him wanting to believe in a world without monsters or even just because he wants a connection to Mary so he's willing to give her the benefit of the doubt.   Dean's walls are up, he's not going to back down.  Mary asks him to at least listen to what Mr. Ketch has to say.  Dean doesn't buy into it and doesn't go on the hunt.   Or he agrees and worse than not going, he's taken down early. 

Or, after the hunt, Mr. Ketch tries to pitch Dean, and he grudgingly agrees because Sam and Mary are on board and he wants to keep an eye on them and doesn't trust Mr. Ketch.   We do know that Jensen filmed a scene with Mick (for episode 16 I think).

Sam and Mary seem to be hunting with knifes rather than magic ray guns.  I wonder if it was like @catrox14 speculated and the alpha has figured out an immunity to their toys.   That's when things go sideways.   If that happens its possible Mr. Ketch tries to appeal to Dean about mixing their hunting styles.

I just hope they don't kill the Alpha vamp yet.  I like Rick Worthy.

I'm also going to be very disappointed if Dean doesn't call Mr. Ketch Inspector Gadget. 

[DittyDotDot]

2 hours ago, Geordiegirl1967 said:

I'm worried that Dabb will have Dean and Sam disagreeing about BMoL and Sam going off with Mary while Dean stays behind in protest. I will be beyond pissed if this happens. Dabb has thankfully avoided the ooc, created for dramatic effect, SOOO not fun to watch bro conflict that Carver was so obsessed with. If he goes down this route I will not be happy. Dean and Sam were a united front when challenged by John and need to be same with Mary. She needs to see how much of a team they are. I'm really worried about this ep based on these pics and the promo.

I'd like to think that Sam and Dean would agree about the BMoL--they're bad news--but might disagree on how to handle Mary working with them. However, I wonder if they'll be totally on the same page this time? They could have Sam go along to look out for Mary while Dean gets called away for something else instead of it being that Dean refuses to go at all? I also wonder, since they're using machetes instead of the vampire ray gun, if Sam insists they do it old school to prove to Mary they don't need the toys?

I also wonder if the scene of Dean and Mr. Ketch is at the end of the episode?

[MysteryGuest]

Sam certainly didn't seem interested in joining up with the BMOL at the end of the last episode, so I hate to think that he was swayed by Mary's lying sales pitch.  Unless she comes clean about the last job with the Prince of Hell, she's still just using them and covering her own ass.  I'm guessing she won't be confessing anytime soon, because I think finding out about the Colt is going to be a big reveal later on down the road.  Unless, of course, the writers decide that the Colt is no longer a big deal to the boys, which will also piss me off.

My guess is that Sam goes along with her, even though he doesn't want to, just to keep the peace.  Dean stays behind and does whatever...more ironing, maybe.  I just do not want them falling for that smarmy Mr. Ketch's bullshit.  They're too smart for that, and their radar should be pinging all over the place that he is not to be trusted.

[rue721]

I don't have a problem with Sam going with Mary to see the BMOL. If my mother were going to meet up with some terrifying assholes who had tortured me, I would insist on going with her and giving her some backup, too. I mean, these are not nice people and Sam knows that. IMV it makes sense that he wouldn't want Mary to just traipse into the lion's den all alone. YMMV.

I wonder if Ketch is at the bunker as a diversion to keep Dean from joining Sam and Mary.

ETA:  I mean a within-show diversion, like the BMOL want to split up the group somehow and they thought this would be an easier way to do it.

Edited February 25, 2017 by rue721

[MysteryGuest]

9 minutes ago, rue721 said:

I mean, these are not nice people and Sam knows that. IMV it makes sense that he wouldn't want Mary to just traipse into the lion's den all alone.

The difference is that Mary's been hanging out in the lions den for quite a quite a while now, and she's not your "normal" mother.  I'm prepared for them to show that Sam is cajoled into joining her to at least hear their side of it, while Dean is just far too stubborn to go along.  

[catrox14]

I just had a terrible thought about Mary's role in all this.

I'm speccing that Mary will end up with Lucifer's spawn. She might be the person who is faced with killing it or not and she just can't because MOM reasons. She' might have been losing her mind all along because she's still grieving that she was forcibly separated from her baby Sammy by Amara and she might just decide to abscond with LuciSpawn and protect it herself. 

I'm putting that high on my list of spec now.

[ILoveReading]

Looking at the stills and the promo, it seems to take place at some kind of facility.  Mr. Ketch in the promo says something about rounding up and killing every last vampire.  It seems far more like an extermination or a canned hunt.  Like shooting ducks in a barrel. 

I wonder if this is where the Alpha comes in.  He won't take kindly to his "children" being executed.  I'm guessing he might show up and open all the cells and the guns probably stop working at some point. 

Not going to lie.  I'll be rooting for the Alpha and the vamps. 

[rue721]

2 hours ago, MysteryGuest said:

The difference is that Mary's been hanging out in the lions den for quite a quite a while now, and she's not your "normal" mother.  I'm prepared for them to show that Sam is cajoled into joining her to at least hear their side of it, while Dean is just far too stubborn to go along.  

Mary has also already proven herself an idiot by even deigning to talk to the BMOL, so that would make me MORE anxious to get involved in her business, not less.

My point is just that I think Sam (and/or Dean) could go with her because they think what she's doing is fucked up and crazy (and they want to do damage control or at least get a handle on what's going on), rather than because they actually found the BMOL pitch persuasive themselves. JS that that's what I would do myself, so I don't have a problem with Sam doing it, if that's what he's doing. YMMV :)

I have no doubt that shit is going to hit the fan, because they obviously want Mary for SOMETHING, and JMV but I doubt it's because she's such a great hunter. They were testing her when they made her get the Colt with no help from them (and with the unwitting help of her friends/family), and I bet they're testing her again now by throwing her (and whoever is with her) in another snake pit.

This set up kind of reminds me of when the Council wanted to test Buffy, so they drugged her to take away her Slayer powers and then put her in a booby trapped house with a psycho vampire.

[IWantDean]

18 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Promo photos from 12.14.

WHY THE FUCK IS MR. KETCH IN THE GD BUNKER??

 

http://www.thetvaddict.com/2017/02/24/supernatural-photos-s12e14-the-raid/

Probably to convince Dean to work with him and Mary. And thats why Mary and Sam went on a hunt together so she can convince him also.

I would've removed the last few pics but I'm not really sure how.

Edited February 25, 2017 by IWantDean

[Wayward Son]

@Mick Lady 

The reason I think we are going to lose Cas this season is that in my opinion all signs on and off show are pointing to it. Since I'm lazy I'm just going to quote something I wrote while discussing Stuck in the Middle (With You) over on Livejournal.  

Quote

This episode and the heartfelt death-bed speech have cemented my view that Castiel / Misha Collins will be gone by the end of the season. I know most consider him to be a safe character (and will celebrate or bemoan the fact depending on how they feel about Cas), but I have always disagreed. As much as I am a fan of Cas the only truly safe cast members are Jensen and Jared and everyone else is expandable. All the signs are pointing towards his exit this season.

Firstly, there's the credit change. It seemed like a minor change to me, to be honest I didn't even notice it until a friend mentioned it, but apparently having an "and Misha Collins" type credit is a massive boost to the resume of an actor. Misha's role on the show hasn't changed this year so why the sudden change? I wouldn't be surprised if it was organised as a favour to Misha to help him when seeking new roles for next season.

Secondly, Dabb has chosen to give him three centric episodes this year 12x10, this weeks episode and 12x19. Personally I wouldn't consider either episode to be especially Castiel centric. Lily Sunders Has Some Regrets focused on the story of Lily, which happened to feature a cameo from Castiel. This weeks episode was an ensemble piece where everyone had a part to play. However, Dabb has described them as Castiel centric so he clearly thinks of them as such. This change too is rather unexpected. The last Castiel centric episode we had was season six's The Man Who Would Be King. Why are we getting three of them all of a sudden? This, for me, is too good to be true. I think the most likely explanation is they want to give Misha plenty to do before he goes.

Thirdly, the narrative itself is pointing towards his exit. During First Blood there was a clear emphasis on the fact that Castiel believes the Winchesters are more essential to the fate of the world than he is. In my opinion this is a clear foreshadow of him later sacrificing himself so that they might live. 

Fourthly, they're taking alot of time to show us how much he has changed since Lazarus Rising. When we first meet him Castiel was a detached warrior of God. He had no particular investment in events and was solely focused on what he perceived as his duty to the greater good. We also know because of his soldier mission that Castiel was not one for owning up to his own actions as he was a follower. However, they are now showing us just how different Castiel has become. Castiel has become someone who is deeply invested in protecting the world and keeping those he views as family safe. This is shown through his speeches in First Blood and Stuck in the Middle (With You). Castiel is someone who is willing to be held accountable for his past actions, as shown when he holds his hands up and admits the wrong he did to Lily. He was even willing to die if it helped ease her pain. Castiel is now someone who is interested in protecting the individual and no longer believes that a minor loss is as acceptable in the face of the greater good hence his desire to find a different way when they track down Kelly Klein. Again why the sudden need to empathise his changes to date unless its a reminder of his journey throughout the show before his death?

Fifthly, the fact that this weeks speech changed. Personally this is what has convinced me that Castiel will be dead by the end of the season. Bearing in mind the above, it reads to me as a form of closure for those like myself who are fans of his. I think when they do kill him off it will happen in an abrupt manner. There won't be time for goodbyes and heartfelt declarations, so Castiel's fans were given this instead.

Of course I could prove to be entirely wrong, but I just thought I'd share some speculations on why the speech occurred in this weeks episode :).

[RulerofallIsurvey]

19 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Promo photos from 12.14.

WHY THE FUCK IS MR. KETCH IN THE GD BUNKER??

And why is he drinking whiskey with his pinky out?  I thought that was only for tea? ;)  Sheesh.

[Mick Lady]

7 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

@Mick Lady 

The reason I think we are going to lose Cas this season is that in my opinion all signs on and off show are pointing to it. Since I'm lazy I'm just going to quote something I wrote while discussing Stuck in the Middle (With You) over on Livejournal.  

I haven't been on Livejournal in decades!

I see your point, especially the credit change, that's huge! I just hope you're wrong! *sigh*

5 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

And why is he drinking whiskey with his pinky out?  I thought that was only for tea? ;)  Sheesh.

Nope, my Mom was British. I drink everything, including beer with my pinky out!

[Wayward Son]

3 minutes ago, Mick Lady said:

I haven't been on Livejournal in decades!

I see your point, especially the credit change, that's huge! I just hope you're wrong! *sigh*

Nope, my Mom was British. I drink everything, including beer with my pinky out!

Hehe I like it! The community over there's smaller, but much less fanatic than the tumblr and Twitter account in my experience :) Plus it's a nice place to store my reviews of past episodes and occasional meta / thinky thoughts. 

I hope I'm wrong too, but at this point I'm pretty convinced I'm not. 

[catrox14]

34 minutes ago, Mick Lady said:

I see your point, especially the credit change, that's huge! I just hope you're wrong! *sigh*

I"ve been beating that drum since the premiere so I guess I'm both happy and sad that someone else shares my opinion on that.

[catrox14]

Yeah I think that is Aaron Douglas  and I swear that looks like a spaceship. LOL Did the old girl get a makeover? (Sorry BSG nerd here. My favorite show in the history of ever.)

[auntvi]

Maybe they're on a Cylon ship?

[catrox14]

Just now, auntvi said:

Maybe they're on a Cylon ship?

Ohh. Man, I would love that so much.  We just need Tricia Helfer to come back and a visit from James Callis and I would just go ahead and die because my two favorite (well okay it's 1A. 1B and 2(Angel) would have their crossover..

[Mick Lady]

50 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

Hehe I like it! The community over there's smaller, but much less fanatic than the tumblr and Twitter account in my experience :) Plus it's a nice place to store my reviews of past episodes and occasional meta / thinky thoughts. 

I hope I'm wrong too, but at this point I'm pretty convinced I'm not. 

May I view your journal? If you okay it, can I get a link?

[Macbeth]

On 2/22/2017 at 10:52 PM, Lemuria said:

"Andover, Massachusetts?"  Isn't that where Meg Masters was from?  Is that the only town in MA that the writers know, or are we supposed to be suspicious about this?  (Knowing these writers I lean more towards the former than than the latter.)

I remember during at least  S1?? There were a lot of places they went to that had  a correlating town in Massachusetts.  I am from Massachusetts so I noticed.  Even Lawrence, Kansas - there is a Lawrence, MA.  I don't know the reason why - I just noticed.

[MysteryGuest]

I believe Misha/Cas will be fine.  I think the change in cast status is just a promotion for an actor who has been with the show longer than everyone but the two leads.  I still say that Misha is far too popular in the fandom for the show to kill him off.  The only exception would be if Misha himself has asked to be written out.  But I don't see why he would do that.  He works enough to earn a pretty decent living, I'm sure, and he still has ample time to act in other projects and dedicate his time to his Random Acts charity.  I would be stunned if they kill him off.

[companionenvy]

While I guess it is possible Misha just renegotiated the credit, I think you're right that the change seems ominous. What I'm hoping is that Cas leaves the show without being killed, which has long struck me as a plausible option for the character. Going back to heaven is the obvious way of writing him (mostly) off the show, but I don't see it given the way this season is going. That would have made sense back in the days where heavenly politics played a role in the show, but that isn't the case right now.

Instead, while I, like Catrox, had considered that Mary might wind up taking charge of Lucifer's kid (I suspect Kelly isn't long for this world), I'm not thinking that it might be Cas. Mary has no connection to the Lucifer Baby Mama Drama so far, whereas Cas has taken responsibility for the Kelly situation. We also had a plot that involved Cas regretting OKing the killing of the presumed Nephil (Nephilim is plural in Hebrew, so while the show goes there, I won't!), so I think it would work, in a narrative sense, if Cas wound up protecting this one. I could see him deciding he was going to raise the kid on Earth, but far, far away from anything that would bring heavenly or demonic attention to them. That would still leave an opening for Cas to come back for a guest arc, but would justify him no longer being a presence on the show, and be, I think, a more satisfying resolution for the character than a return to heaven.

If Cas is gone, though, I have to believe Samantha Smith becomes a regular, since I doubt J2 are going to be willing to take an extra load. And since the Mary death anvils have been falling as well, who knows. 

[SueB]

I understand your logic for the potential for Cas' death but unless Misha has decided to run for public office, I'm going to put the probability at <5% that Cas dies because J2 have probably insisted on having other regulars in their contract.  And while Mary might technically be capable of replacing Cas as a 'regular', Dabb and Singer aren't that stupid.  But, "will Cas die?" is a FAR more plausible threat than either Sam or Dean.  Which means it provides for more drama potential to threaten either him or Crowley.

And Cas can still be on the show but suffer some permanent state change that ALSO makes a major dramatic impact. I just anticipate Misha Collins will be on the show in S13.  

[rue721]

Also, this is silly, but -- wasn't Misha Collins building a house and/or starting a home business? I don't think he would dip out on the show right when after committing to such a big outlay of money. I mean, he's rich and all, but that's just not sensible ;)

[Mick Lady]

2 hours ago, SueB said:

I understand your logic for the potential for Cas' death but unless Misha has decided to run for public office, I'm going to put the probability at <5% that Cas dies because J2 have probably insisted on having other regulars in their contract.  And while Mary might technically be capable of replacing Cas as a 'regular', Dabb and Singer aren't that stupid.  But, "will Cas die?" is a FAR more plausible threat than either Sam or Dean.  Which means it provides for more drama potential to threaten either him or Crowley.

And Cas can still be on the show but suffer some permanent state change that ALSO makes a major dramatic impact. I just anticipate Misha Collins will be on the show in S13.  

Thanks SueB! I needed that hope!

I can see them using "Is Cas dead?" as this season's cliff hanger, but other than that, killing him off would destroy a lot of the arc, including, (and perhaps most importantly) his relationship with Dean.

[Wayward Son]

7 hours ago, companionenvy said:

While I guess it is possible Misha just renegotiated the credit, I think you're right that the change seems ominous. What I'm hoping is that Cas leaves the show without being killed, which has long struck me as a plausible option for the character. Going back to heaven is the obvious way of writing him (mostly) off the show, but I don't see it given the way this season is going. That would have made sense back in the days where heavenly politics played a role in the show, but that isn't the case right now.

Instead, while I, like Catrox, had considered that Mary might wind up taking charge of Lucifer's kid (I suspect Kelly isn't long for this world), I'm not thinking that it might be Cas. Mary has no connection to the Lucifer Baby Mama Drama so far, whereas Cas has taken responsibility for the Kelly situation. We also had a plot that involved Cas regretting OKing the killing of the presumed Nephil (Nephilim is plural in Hebrew, so while the show goes there, I won't!), so I think it would work, in a narrative sense, if Cas wound up protecting this one. I could see him deciding he was going to raise the kid on Earth, but far, far away from anything that would bring heavenly or demonic attention to them. That would still leave an opening for Cas to come back for a guest arc, but would justify him no longer being a presence on the show, and be, I think, a more satisfying resolution for the character than a return to heaven.

If Cas is gone, though, I have to believe Samantha Smith becomes a regular, since I doubt J2 are going to be willing to take an extra load. And since the Mary death anvils have been falling as well, who knows. 

I like the idea of Cas being written out in such an open way! It would be a much more satisfying ending than him dying that's for sure.

I wouldn't be surprised if the plan was to replace him with Samantha Smith. She has already been acting as a series regular in everything but name. So far it is known she will be in nine episodes this season (12x01-03, 12x06, 12x09, 12x12-12x14 and 12x17), which matches the number Misha has had as a regular in the past. Also that is only as far as episode 17. There is a good chance she will be in several more before the end of the season, which would make her match the 11-13 episodes Mark and Misha have been in the last few seasons. Plus the inclusion of a woman as a series regular would also help to combat the complaints about a lack of diversity the show has received in the past.

Edited February 26, 2017 by Wayward Son

[DittyDotDot]

Unless Misha doesn't want to do it anymore, which I haven't gotten that sense, I don't think they'll kill Cass off. Make him into something else? Sure, it wouldn't be the first time they tried that. But completely get rid of Cass? I dunno.

But, I've been wrong before, so... .

[Aeryn13]

I`m also not convinced Cas would be written out. Not unless Misha decided to not re-sign. As for switching him out with Mary, I can`t see that either. Cas` role was initially expanded because he had been a real hit with viewers back then and the character has since amassed his own significant fanbase. Unless I`m missing a lot of places, I don`t think the Mary-character has had a similar strike of popularity, in fact it looks more like favourable reactions to her have decreased from the start of the Season to now. I`m not saying everyone hates her but to me it would be a bad switch.

[ILoveReading]

Take with a grain of salt because its not  a reliable source but there was a post on Tumblr claiming that Misha all but confirmed at a con that he's signed for s13. 

[Macbeth]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

Take with a grain of salt because its not  a reliable source but there was a post on Tumblr claiming that Misha all but confirmed at a con that he's signed for s13. 

Thank you Jesus - I hope that is true.

[SueB]

6 hours ago, Macbeth said:

Thank you Jesus - I hope that is true.

I believe BOTH Misha and Mark are signed.  

[goldy]

Samantha Smith - SPN Nashville convention

 

[ILoveReading]

Just because someone doesn't have a plan doesn't mean its a good one.  What happened to the grey area and that not all monsters are bad?

I really hope that Sam and Dean don't buy into their spiel. 

[rue721]

Dude what is up with her pants. SAMANTHA SMITH get in the car right now you need a trip to Marshall's for fuck's sake

[SueB]

3 minutes ago, rue721 said:

Dude what is up with her pants. SAMANTHA SMITH get in the car right now you need a trip to Marshall's for fuck's sake

Hi, I'm truly fashion challenged.  Is it because it's cropped pants jeans?  Cause the jeans look a little high in the waist?  Seriously, fashion challenged person needs to know.

PS.  Remember that show "What Not To Wear?"  I am the PERFECT candidate.  In fact, if it was still on, I'm fairly certain I'd find my family applying for it. 

[rue721]

Just now, SueB said:

Hi, I'm truly fashion challenged.  Is it because it's cropped pants jeans?  Cause the jeans look a little high in the waist?  Seriously, fashion challenged person needs to know.

PS.  Remember that show "What Not To Wear?"  I am the PERFECT candidate.  In fact, if it was still on, I'm fairly certain I'd find my family applying for it. 

They're just so short and tight and weird. It's like she borrowed her 13 y/o daughter's pants. And her 13 y/o hasn't had her growth spurt yet. Idk they just look so uncomfortable!

And the artful fading and whiskering....are they from when SHE was 13 y/o?!

OMFG now I want to take YOU to Marshall's @SueB :P

[SueB]

Ah, whiskering.  I don't like that.  And yes, I had to google that term before I responded.  I told you, fashion challenged.

Sorry for the off-topic.  Carry on....

[rue721]

16 minutes ago, SueB said:

Ah, whiskering.  I don't like that.  And yes, I had to google that term before I responded.  I told you, fashion challenged.

Sorry for the off-topic.  Carry on....

Well I'm not exactly fashion forward...I just see weirdly tiny pants like that and all I can think is

Spoiler

damn that's how you get a yeast infection

*DO NOT CLICK THAT SPOILER unless you are not that easily grossed out because it's kind of gross.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

32 minutes ago, rue721 said:

They're just so short and tight and weird. It's like she borrowed her 13 y/o daughter's pants. And her 13 y/o hasn't had her growth spurt yet. Idk they just look so uncomfortable!

I think the camera angle did not help.  :)

I thought she was wearing boots in the first pic because of the shadows, and thought - wow, that's a bad combo.  Lol.  It wasn't boots.  But those are some SERIOUS platforms.  Do people really still wear those?  

[Macbeth]

1 hour ago, SueB said:

I believe BOTH Misha and Mark are signed.  

That's fantastic news Sue B.  And I will thank Jesus for Mark's signing as well.

And I hope Samantha gets signed as well.  She has been a valued supporting player over the years.  And they need another woman on the show.

I know that her story line makes it appears that she isn't solidly  on Team Sons, but making bad decisions for the right reasons is a main Winchester characteristic. 

Edited February 26, 2017 by Macbeth