Serial

[Indy]

2 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

I really want to know more about Faye, the town clerk. Something was very weird there with her and that list of people John knew.

Me too. It was just so damned shady with that list. And of all people why did John pick her to call during? 

Spoiler

Maybe she took the money from the freezer and not Tyler....

[ABay]

Her not calling the men at all was just wrong, but calling the cousins first--while also wrong--made more sense when it was revealed that Rita had lived there and she & her husband own property there.

[TattleTeeny]

Yeah, I was left with mixed opinions on both Rita and Tyler by the end, when earlier I had felt one was "good" and the other "bad."

And what is with the town hall having lists of people's friends?!

[Ciarrai]

I cannot stand John.

Spoiler

He definitely had a mental illness and likely had mercury poisoning

but he's such a narcissistic ass that I feel no sympathy for him.

[stillshimpy]

On 4/15/2017 at 9:32 AM, ABay said:

 

Her not calling the men at all was just wrong, but calling the cousins first--while also wrong--made more sense when it was revealed that Rita had lived there and she & her husband own property there.

 

 

I think the part that Brian never focused on but that made the most sense, is that Faye called the cousins first because they were family.   I can't even imagine how traumatic it must have been for her and I'm assuming she really was in shock afterward.   By the way, episode 7 was one of the most difficult things I've ever listened to.  

I'm going to spoiler tag the rest just in case anyone is still listening: 

 I liked that in the end S-Town wasn't about small town corruption, a murder mystery, or even simply about despair in a modern world, although there were elements of that throughout.  

It was equal parts the incredibly sad fate of people experiencing social isolation at John's level and a micro representation of so many of the social ills that plague us.   Despite literally having to cover my ears, as was my husband, during much of the "Church" self-harm material, I think it was included mostly to show that John's deteriorating mental state could be charted very easily as coming to a fevered pitch at the end of his life.  

I appreciated knowing that there was a likely cause -- mercury poisoning -- and that he had been a different sort of man earlier in his life.  I found him very interesting but constantly off-putting.  It's clear that the last year of his life was just a long march of emotional agony, and he simply lost the will to keep going on.  I thought it was truly heartbreaking that Mary Grace actually got better in the care of the cousins because John's increasing tendency to isolate himself isolated her also.   

I was in floods of tears at the end though.  John was a man who was as cursed as he was blessed.  It was Tyler who raised the most questions for me.  He was playing by the rules of life as he understood them but by the end of John's life, his relationship with Tyler was detrimental to both of them.  

It was as if every problem that we can see on the macro level -- systemic corruption, rampant greed, increasingly overt racism, the price of loneliness and the weight of what we have done to the world in terms of our environment -- was in this story.  But I did think Brian Green, who was wonderful throughout and clearly cared about John, gave a hint as to what may have happened to his money.  Two separate times people asked him to turn off the tape and go off the record.  He did so.  Both times the subject was whether there might be some money there, or in Tyler's case, whether or not he found it.  

This was one of the best podcasts I'd listened to in a while, all the way through episode 5.  Episode 6 was probably a little too much time devoted to it but it did ultimately emphasize how lonely John really was in the world.  Episode 7 is something I never want to sit through again.  Not because it was bad, simply because it was incredibly difficult and uncomfortable.  

[xaxat]

Bowe Bergdahl Expected to Plead Guilty to Desertion

[xaxat]

Adnan Syed of ‘Serial’ will get a new trial

I'll be interested in this case. I was never convinced of his guilt or innocence after listening to the pod.

On the other hand, I always thought Bergdahl was guilty.

[Garden Wafers]

I keep trying to get into S-Town, but listening to John is terribly exhausting. I mean, the guy compared his old school to Auschwitz for goodness sake; you'd expect that sort of attitude from a 16-year-old, certainly not a 40+ year old man. He might be more well-read than his neighbors, but he's certainly not any more impressive. 

[jenrising]

The trailer for season three of Serial is up. First episode drops on 9/20. 

[Fukui San]

The topic seems to be "the whole criminal justice system".

[hendersonrocks]

Quote

The trailer for season three of Serial is up. First episode drops on 9/20.

Well, the trailer just brought my rage level up about forty three notches. Our criminal justice system is so broken.

[starri]

Two episodes in, and I'm already way more engaged than I was with S2.

I'm going to guess the judge profiled in the second episode is going to have a harder time winning reelection in November, had this not aired.

[Neurochick]

On 9/20/2018 at 6:51 PM, starri said:

Two episodes in, and I'm already way more engaged than I was with S2.

I'm going to guess the judge profiled in the second episode is going to have a harder time winning reelection in November, had this not aired.

I'm three episodes in and man, this sucks.  It makes one think, "The system is broken and only something drastic can fix it."

[xaxat]

The story is finally finished.

U.S. Supreme Court Won't Hear Adnan Syed's Appeal, Keeping 'Serial' Subject In Prison

[merylinkid]

On 11/25/2019 at 12:56 PM, xaxat said:

The story is finally finished.

U.S. Supreme Court Won't Hear Adnan Syed's Appeal, Keeping 'Serial' Subject In Prison

Wait, not yet.   

It was announced today that Baltimore Prosecutors will file to VACATE the murder conviction.  

https://www.wsj.com/articles/adnan-syed-serial-podcast-vacate-murder-conviction-11663163015

They want a new trial, but they want him released in the meantime.   I am presuming if they vacate the conviction, he gets to start back at square one with a presumption of innocence.   Apparently the DNA turned up TWO alternative suspects.

[jenrising]

5 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Wait, not yet.   

It was announced today that Baltimore Prosecutors will file to VACATE the murder conviction.  

https://www.wsj.com/articles/adnan-syed-serial-podcast-vacate-murder-conviction-11663163015

They want a new trial, but they want him released in the meantime.   I am presuming if they vacate the conviction, he gets to start back at square one with a presumption of innocence.   Apparently the DNA turned up TWO alternative suspects.

This is wild, and huge. I really didn't expect anything substantial to come from the new DNA testing. 

[merylinkid]

Oh there is apparently  more than the new DNA.   Apparently the prosecutor at the time failed to hand over a WHOLE lot of exculpatory evidence.   Like there were 2 suspects that were never cleared -- one of whom had THREATENED TO KILL Ms. Lee.   They also failed to mention that where her car was found was RIGHT BEHIND where a family member of one of the suspect's lived.   In less surprising news, the cop who worked the case turned out to be "unreliable."   Or you know, your average Baltimore City cop.     So yeah, this is gonna be a hot mess.   And the City of Baltimore is going to be paying the Syed family a WHOLE TON of money.   

I do feel for the Lee family.   They still don't know who killed her because the cops were too busy framing the nearest Muslim guy.

[jenrising]

53 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

Oh there is apparently  more than the new DNA.   Apparently the prosecutor at the time failed to hand over a WHOLE lot of exculpatory evidence.   Like there were 2 suspects that were never cleared -- one of whom had THREATENED TO KILL Ms. Lee.   They also failed to mention that where her car was found was RIGHT BEHIND where a family member of one of the suspect's lived.   In less surprising news, the cop who worked the case turned out to be "unreliable."   Or you know, your average Baltimore City cop.     So yeah, this is gonna be a hot mess.   And the City of Baltimore is going to be paying the Syed family a WHOLE TON of money.   

I do feel for the Lee family.   They still don't know who killed her because the cops were too busy framing the nearest Muslim guy.

Yeah I just finished reading the article and there's a lot. The only good news for the Lee family is they would have been informed about this before it went public so they had some time to prepare, however possible that is.

[PurpleTentacle]

On 3/29/2018 at 10:57 PM, xaxat said:

Adnan Syed of ‘Serial’ will get a new trial

I'll be interested in this case. I was never convinced of his guilt or innocence after listening to the pod.

There seem to be a lot of people being 100% sure he is guilty and also a lot who are 100% sure he's innocent. I, like you, was never sure.

What I am sure about is that the evidence brought against him was severely lacking, the motiv was weak, the only witness was crappy and could have just as well been the real murderer, Adnan didn't have adequat representation and the standards set for appeals in the US are ridiculous. So I hope he gets a new trial.

So I'm glad he seems to be getting a new trial now, even though he didn't get one 4 years ago, because again, the standards for appeals in US a completely unreasonable. Justice reform has to start there.

On 9/15/2022 at 2:47 AM, merylinkid said:

 Apparently the prosecutor at the time failed to hand over a WHOLE lot of exculpatory evidence.   Like there were 2 suspects that were never cleared -- one of whom had THREATENED TO KILL Ms. Lee.

I'm shocked that a prosecutor would supress exculpatory evidence, shocked! /s

You know the murder solve rate is now below 50% when in the 60s it was above 90%. In the media there is wild speculation about how that could be when new forensic techniques should make it easier than ever to convict murderers. I think the answer is pretty easy: New forensic techniques and preassure on police and prosecuters have made it much harder for them to just point at the nearest brown person and convict them with pseudo-science, like bite mark analyses or (in this case) cell tower records.

That doesn't mean that quite 40% of conviected murderers were innocent, since police also liked to pin murders on people who were already dead (sometimes to have an excuse why they made them dead), but it ceartainly was a lot of innocent people the state murdered or put behind bars for life.

On 9/15/2022 at 2:47 AM, merylinkid said:

They also failed to mention that where her car was found was RIGHT BEHIND where a family member of one of the suspect's lived. 

So that would mean Jay is one of the suspects (the car was behind his grandmas house, if I remember correctly). I'm not surprised. It only ever made sense that Adnan might be innocent if Jay was (one of) the murderer(s). That police just took his story as fact and never investigated him always really ground my gears. If I was a murderer the first thing I'd do would be to try and pin it on the ex-boyfriend.

On 3/30/2018 at 3:50 PM, Garden Wafers said:

I keep trying to get into S-Town, but listening to John is terribly exhausting. I mean, the guy compared his old school to Auschwitz for goodness sake; you'd expect that sort of attitude from a 16-year-old, certainly not a 40+ year old man.

He was a gay boy in a High School in rural Alabama in the early 1980s. If he had been outed, he would have been just as dead as any gay man in Auschwitz. I can't muster any outrage for the comparison.

[merylinkid]

6 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

o that would mean Jay is one of the suspects (the car was behind his grandmas house, if I remember correctly).

Thanks for the name.   I was wondering who it was.   Jay is that the druggie guy?   Yeah I always suspected him.   

[jenrising]

20 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

So I'm glad he seems to be getting a new trial now, even though he didn't get one 4 years ago, because again, the standards for appeals in US a completely unreasonable. Justice reform has to start there.

Assuming there's more evidence than what was included in the new filing, I think there's a strong chance they don't even go for a new trial for Adnan Syed. He's been locked up for 23 years already. 

I do wonder if we'll get anything from Sarah Koenig on this, depending on what the judge decides. 

[jenrising]

It's official. Conviction overturned. Sayed will be given home detention. Sarah Koenig was apparently present for the hearing. 

[PurpleTentacle]

9 minutes ago, jenrising said:

It's official. Conviction overturned. Sayed will be given home detention.

Right decision on overturning the conviction, considering the corrupt cops and prosecution. (still not sure if he did it or not)

But how can he be given home detention if the conviction is overturned? Anybody versed in american law as to how something like this is possible?

On 9/17/2022 at 2:39 PM, jenrising said:

I do wonder if we'll get anything from Sarah Koenig on this, depending on what the judge decides. 

I could see her doing something in a few years, once the new investigation is concluded. I wouldn't bank on anything soon, to get the scoop or something like that. Not her style.

[jenrising]

2 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

But how can he be given home detention if the conviction is overturned? Anybody versed in american law as to how something like this is possible?

The charges have not been dropped, just the conviction. So as of right now, he's still charged with the murder. The state will decide if they want to retry the case or not.

[PurpleTentacle]

Yeah but can you just order somebody who is only charged with something to home detention? That seems like imprisonment without a conviction.

There is of course detention while awaiting trial but that is to prevent high risk suspects from fleeing. I don't see how home detention would accomplish that.

[merylinkid]

1 minute ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yeah but can you just order somebody who is only charged with something to home detention? That seems like imprisonment without a conviction.

There is of course detention while awaiting trial but that is to prevent high risk suspects from fleeing. I don't see how home detention would accomplish that.

He's out on bail essential with home confinement instead of behing held without bail.   Happens a lot.   

My friend who does minor criminal (no murders) says they will probably retry him just so they can the family they tried.    That's if the continuing investigation doesn't conclusively point to anyone else.    But with all that is out there, reasonable doubt is pretty much guaranteed.

[jenrising]

3 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yeah but can you just order somebody who is only charged with something to home detention? That seems like imprisonment without a conviction.

There is of course detention while awaiting trial but that is to prevent high risk suspects from fleeing. I don't see how home detention would accomplish that.

It's just pre-trial detention, happens all the time. He'll get an ankle monitor. 

Also, new Serial coverage coming tomorrow!

[Lovecat]

3 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yeah but can you just order somebody who is only charged with something to home detention? That seems like imprisonment without a conviction.

There is of course detention while awaiting trial but that is to prevent high risk suspects from fleeing. I don't see how home detention would accomplish that.

People who are on home detention usually wear an ankle monitor, sort of like a GPS for people, which alerts authorities if the detainee goes more than, say, 100 yards from their home.  Some home detainees are given permission to work or go to school, and their monitors are set to allow them to go to those places during set hours.

The New York Times (which I believe owns the Serial podcast now) says there will be a new episode tomorrow.

[PurpleTentacle]

1 minute ago, merylinkid said:

He's out on bail essential with home confinement instead of behing held without bail.   Happens a lot.   

Ah okay. I'm not that familiar with the american justice system, not being american.

I could see being confined to a certain area, as to make it harder to drive to a border and just disappear, but being confined to ones home seems overly restrictive and more punitive than practical.

But as the old saying goes "Andere Länder, andere Sitten." (other countries, other mores)

5 minutes ago, jenrising said:

Also, new Serial coverage coming tomorrow!

Guess I was, really, really wrong.

A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one.

[Lovecat]

2 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I could see being confined to a certain area, as to make it harder to drive to a border and just disappear, but being confined to ones home seems overly restrictive and more punitive than practical.

We've all somehow made it work these past couple of years... ;)

[merylinkid]

Here is walking out the courthouse:

Ms. lee's brother addressed the court today.   He left it up to the judge to make the right call but he said it was hard on his family.    I can see where he is coming from.   The family has been told for years by the prosecutors and the cops they had the right guy.   Now even the prosecutors are like "well maybe not."   I hope the family finally gets justice.  

[PurpleTentacle]

7 minutes ago, Lovecat said:

We've all somehow made it work these past couple of years... ;)

I mean barely and I still could go out shopping or walking in the woods and fields, swimming in the summer, etc.

Also kinda not the point. Seems like an overreach to restrict a person who is still presumed innocent in such an overly agressive manner. If you have a GPS monitor, what does it matter if you are at your house or at the gym 5km away? But I guess I'll defer to you americans as to what your justice system should look like.

[Lovecat]

17 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I mean barely and I still could go out shopping or walking in the woods and fields, swimming in the summer, etc.

Also kinda not the point. Seems like an overreach to restrict a person who is still presumed innocent in such an overly agressive manner. If you have a GPS monitor, what does it matter if you are at your house or at the gym 5km away? But I guess I'll defer to you americans as to what your justice system should look like.

I was just being ironic with my flip little comment...and I don't think any of us Americans (especially this crowd) are saying that our justice system is anywhere close to what it *should* look like!  We were just answering your question as to why, under the system as it exists, someone would be put on home detention and the logistics of how that works (or doesn't work, as there are many cases of people cutting the ankle monitors off and making going on the lam).

[merylinkid]

Prosecutor drops all charges against Adnan Syed:

https://wtop.com/baltimore/2022/10/report-prosecutors-drop-charges-in-serial-podcast-case/

TECHNICALLY the incoming State's Attorney could reintroduce the charges.   But I don't think he will.    He doesn't strike me as that kind of SA.   Also with all the reasonable doubt in that motion for his release there is no way you get a conviction.

I do feel for her family.   They STILL don't know who killed their loved one.   All because the Baltimore Cops were lazy.   The information was RIGHT there in 1999 that someone else did it.   But they soooooo wanted it to be the Muslim guy they just went with it (and remember this happened pre 9-11 so there isn't even that excuse for their laziness)

[jenrising]

6 hours ago, merylinkid said:

I do feel for her family.   They STILL don't know who killed their loved one. 

I hope the DNA evidence mentioned offers some direction for the investigation but it seems unlikely there will be a resolution now, at least legally. 

[merylinkid]

So there is a LOT more information.   One of the suspects (still unnamed), but it is apparent is NOT the one who threatened to kill Hae, had a LOT more connections to the area where she was found, and to where her car was found than first thought.   

the one who threatened to kill Hae was Bilal.   Rabia O'Chaudry doesn't think it was him.   She thinks the connections the othe rguy are more compelling.

Urick the prosecutor is claiming the "note" that freed Adnan (it wasn't just the note but the DNA EXCLUDING him but okay) doesn't mean what it says.   He is know claiming that it was ADNAN who said he would kill Hae.   A fact that was NEVER mentioned at his trial.   You are trying to convict a guy and you don't mention this one allegedly damning fact?   Asia McClain is DRAGGING the prosecutor for all his lies.   Apparently he told her that the DNA convicted him so why bother giving him an alibi.   He also apparently told her that EIGHTY people withdrew their promises to speak on Adnan's behalf.   All in an effort to discourage her from testifying on the appeal.   

Finally, the family of Hae are continuing their appeal of the judge releasing Adnan claiming they were not given due notice of the hearing.   I feel for them.   I do.   This has to be all confusing for them.   The prosecutors for DECADES told them "Yes Adnan did it, we got the right guy."   The prosecutor involved is STILL telling them that.   Yet a court released him.   They don't understand how this is all going on.  

[EtheltoTillie]

Is anyone listening to the new series, "The Coldest Case in Laramie"?  I think it's pretty interesting. 

[merylinkid]

Dang gummit.   The Maryland Court of Appeals REINSTATED his conviction.   The family did not have enough notice to meaningfully participate in the hearing.   Even though there is no absolute right to be heard.    So the Court ordered a NEW hearing that the family can personally attend (not zoom) to go over everything again.   And have the same outcome.

Fortunately, Adnan will not be going back to prison while this plays out.   

[SoMuchTV]

On 3/9/2023 at 10:29 AM, EtheltoTillie said:

Is anyone listening to the new series, "The Coldest Case in Laramie"?  I think it's pretty interesting. 

I did listen to that one.  I had forgotten it was from the "Serial" people.  It was several weeks ago and now I'm fuzzy on the details, but I did think it was interesting.

[BetterButter]

Serial is coming back in March to tackle Guantanamo Bay

[PurpleTentacle]

S04.E02:

"He wasn't treated much worse than a supermax prisoner in the US."

Yes, and every other country in the world considers, how these prisoners are treated, torture! Because it is!

This bullshit is so frustrating.

 

S04.E03:

It's really disgusting to see how quick the military turned on their own, largely unimpeded, because of racism. And then of course the guy responsible for wasting valuable resources and ruining people's lives gets promoted and commended for his actions...

Also catholics really shouldn't throw with stones when it comes to weird rituals. I mean eating human flesh and drinking human blood much?

Edited April 10, 2024 by PurpleTentacle

[merylinkid]

On 3/28/2023 at 3:25 PM, merylinkid said:

Dang gummit.   The Maryland Court of Appeals REINSTATED his conviction.   The family did not have enough notice to meaningfully participate in the hearing.   Even though there is no absolute right to be heard.    So the Court ordered a NEW hearing that the family can personally attend (not zoom) to go over everything again.   And have the same outcome.

Fortunately, Adnan will not be going back to prison while this plays out.   

And the Supreme Court of Maryland affirmed.   The victim's family has a right to appear IN PERSON at a vacatur hearing.   Zoom isn't good enough.   Because the nolle pros couldn't happen without a proper vacatur, the conviction is reinstated.   HOWEVER, buried in a footnote, the Court stated they are issuing no order changing Syed's conditions of release.   So he can stay free although considered convicted at this moment.   Which means they know how its going to go, but the the process must be followed.    As the Court said, in order to fix the injustice to Mr. Syed, they trampled on Mr. Lee's rights.   

Which okay.   Victim's rights are important and we have seen what happens when they are ignored to many times in favor of the perpetrator (the Stanford swimmer among others).   So this was an important case to rule on to make it clear that victim's rights are just on paper, they are part of the process.   

Let's hope everything can be scheduled soon, or the family says "we made our point, its been months, we don't really have anything to add other than we want to know who really did this, let's drop it."