Afterbuzz Show: DWTS

[Uke]

I was amused by how much Corky and Shirley acted like still-married bickerers. I was also surprised by how much they still seem to be working together - I'd had the impression they kept their distance, but this was clearly not the case.

 

The thing about Karina and Corky is something I'd read, but when I tried to track it down a year or two ago online, it appeared that it came from a misread of something someone said. (I don't remember the details now, not going to search.)

...

 

A "dogsbody" is a British term that essentially means a go-fer - the person who does whatever boring thing someone else assigns them.

 

Shirley + Corky seem to spend quite a bit of time together. She and her boyfriend even go down to Houston to spend Christmas holidays with Corky and their huge family. I think it's nice they were able to put their problems behind them and just carry on amicably.

 

As far as Karina rumors, there's so much trash online and then it gets repeated and repeated to where it's believed as true.  Unless the parties involve say it themselves, to me it's all just gossip.

 

Dogsbody - thanks for the definition. I'd never heard that expression before.

[Andiethewestie]

For me, Teaching, Learning, Affairs and what not is not family. Even the Ballas home to the little Houghs is not really family,. But  Julianne is family to two competitors this season, and therefore should recuse herself from judging and find something else to do on the show.  

[truthaboutluv]

Okay, but considering the season is practically over, not to mention I'm sure she'll be back next season, as will Derek, clearly her recusing herself is not happening. So one can either keep demanding something that is clearly not going to happen or simply stop watching the show in protest as long as she's on.

[Andiethewestie]

Watching the show and actually giving credence to the criticism of yet an additional screaming banshee who inserts her foot in her mouth more often than not, are two entirely different things. If the voters mention it enough eventually the pink haired one will be Brooke Burked. A fourth judge is not better, it is just another drag on the payroll.   

[Budgita]

I feel like it's a reality tv show and there are always going to be factors that aren't exactly the way we as viewers see as ethical, fair, or appropriate. I personally don't feel that children of stars should count as stars to consider for the show but it is what it is. Her dance training and musical

theatre performance experience makes her a top contender and an enjoyable person to watch. Same for Riker with the ballroom past. He's been my favorite of the season. Those qualities enchance the show for me because I wouldn't want to watch a motley crew lead by the likes of Robert and Chris.

[Andiethewestie]

The term Stars has been used very loosely since season one when Trista Sutter  was cast. None of the Bachelor franchise are stars, nor is the Kardashians or the Osbournes, or the daughter of a failed politician, and the Duck girl but they all have been cast. At least the entertainers who have been on the show have a resume of movies or theatrical performances. 

 

But who they cast to compete, vs who the judges are is not the same thing. I can chose not to vote for a so called star, but If a show asks me to vote, and my vote gets combined with a judges score, I want that score to be credible. Family members being judged is not credible. imho 

Edited May 1, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[skittl3862]

 

Re Henry, I didn't think Shirley was throwing shade.  She just said that Henry didn't want to be "anyone's 2nd dog's body" (?) which I think means 2nd fiddle (?) or he didn't want to be the unheard, unseen guy doing only as he's told behind the scenes. Perhaps Henry was feeling disrespected.  I haven't re-watched the show to get Sasha's exact wording but I recall him referring to himself as the stunt-double in the team.

 

I do think Shirley's tone came across as a little, if not biased, at least judgy. I see no issue with Henry being annoyed with the situation. Unlike Sasha, he spent weeks rehearsing with Nastia and had no acknowledgment on the show. Not just not being shown in the package; they didn't even mention it in passing. I don't believe I ever heard anyone give him a shout-out.

 

I love when Suri bitches about Maks and when people who actually know him outside the show shut her down, she still digs her heels in. She did it this week, she did it another time Shirley was on the show, and during season 18, she got into an argument with Maks's former competitive partner (she was a pro in the early seasons, I forget her name. Elena?) about how controlling she thought he was. She fell for the reality show character and refuses to admit it. I don't like Maks based on what I saw on the show, but I will totally defer to the opinions people who have known him in real life, instead of arguing based on what the show's producers edited for me to see.

 

I have no issue with judging nepotism. I think the producers are the real problem. They call the shots and the judges just frame it for the cameras. They could have Maks, Papa, Mama, and Grandma Chmerkovskiy as the 4 judges and Derek would still make it to the finals.

Edited May 1, 2015 by skittl3862

[kitcloudkicker]

Henry was, in fact, shown in a package, and they spent a lot of time on him. He was interviewed in a talking head. They showed the back and forth with Derek over video. I don't know how much more shown he could have been. 

 

The thing about the Henry situation that I took away was that it was Henry's decision to leave Nastia duty - so the only thing that confirmed was that he wasn't fired in a Derek diva fit, like I'd seen speculated. I don't necessarily think that it speaks terribly of Henry that he asked to be replaced - it just kills the argument that poor Henry got passed over. Listen, they've all got egos. And I like Henry, but the fact that his instagram is plastered with selfies of his 12-pack makes me think he's not exempt. And we know Derek is very type-A and controlling about his dances. That they'd butt heads isn't surprising to me. Sasha seems much more willing to just go along with it. They worked it out. Maybe Henry regrets bowing out now that Sasha's getting a bigger role, or maybe he doesn't, since Derek's still controlling everything. He might feel fine about bowing out of it all, as it might be driving him up a wall more than it does Sasha. 

 

I liked that Shirley speaks highly of all the dancers. There seem to be fan contingents that are convinced there's a BallasHough/Chmerkovskiy, Montague/Capulet, Hatfield/McCoy situation going on, and that seems to be clearly untrue. 

 

Re: jidges - they do have their own thread?

[Saylii]

It's better that Julianne is a judge and not an executive producer. There's a lot more that she could do behind the scenes to skew things for her brother.

As it is, there are three other people to keep Julianne's scores accountable. I can't remember an instance where her scores wildly deviated from the others in support of only Derek. It's not like she only holds up the 10 paddle for him. As far as rounding up scores (ie she feels it's about a 7.5, she gives 8) you can tell that all the judges have their favorites that are going to benefit from rounding up.

The only objection I would have is if Julianne became head judge while her brother competed. Head judge's scores breaks ties and Len has made some final decisions in one-off dance competitions.

[OakGoblinFly]

It is all fine that the show is finding a spot for Julianne after her movies tanked but she is a better dancer than a judge and should have come back as a dancer, maybe in the troupe until she gets back into form. Having her as a judge is just the wrong message to send to people who they are asking to vote.  

 

 

How?  I don't Julianne begging the audience to vote for Derek or NOT vote for a contestant ; Erin (and to a lesser extent) Tom are the ones who ask the audience to votes, not the judges.

 

I cannot fault the show for bringing in Julianne; a generally well-liked, usually well-spoken, attractive young woman with a wealth of experience.  She is providing feedback that once used to come from the panel; frankly once she found her footing as a judge, she's been a breath of fresh air (over exuberance and all) and a welcome addition.

 

As far as having to recuse herself from the judging panel because she is related to one dance and grew up with another, ballroom in general (and the Utah connection specifically) is rather incestuous - you can't swing a sequenced fringe without hitting someone you're related to, were taught by, taught, or trained with.

 

This show's judging panel isn't any more or less biased than any other "reality competition" judging panel and has been pointed out, Julianne only accounts for one-fourth of the judges score which is only half of the results.

 

I would like to see more actual dancers on the judging panel as they provide useful insight - though I do understand the need to have "personalities" since this is (and always has been) first and foremost a television show.

 

That being said, and to get this back on track, I like hearing other dancers' perceptions and critiques of the performances - to me it only shows that there is a lot of subjectivity when it comes to judging dancing.

Yes!  Julianne's presence as a judge still bugs me. I'm assuming that bringing her back as a pro would be an admittance of failure on her part in her efforts to follow her "real" passions of singing and acting, so that wasn't an option.  But yes, she should have been a regular pro dancer. I also would not want any Ballas to be on the judging panel, or Maks.  It's all too incestual.  That's just it.  Everyone is closely intertwined. Is it possible to have an unbiased judge with experience in ballroom?  Aren't they all part of the same cliques?  Hasn't Len worked with some of the pros in the past? 

 

But hey, would it really matter who the judges are?  I completely believe the judges are told who to pimp, what scores to give, etc, so does it really matter who the mouthpiece is? 

 

 

Or simply that Julianne has other interest and does not want to commit full-time to be a competing pro on the show.  Being a judge allows her to come back to something she enjoyed while affording her enough free time to pursue other interests.

[Andiethewestie]

 

Julianne only accounts for one-fourth of the judges score which is only half of the results

 

Half of the results is still biased results. How about getting a judge with little or no family connection at all. Utah is not the only place on the planet for ballroom. Knowing someone who has taught you is not the same as a blood relative.  The show can do it, they chose not to. Her unfortunate wardrobe choices aside, the show can do better. .

Edited May 1, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[Bella]

Should the Julianne discussion move to the Grassy Knoll thread or the Judges thread? Please think about it - both seem like they would be a better fit.

[truthaboutluv]

If the voters mention it enough eventually the pink haired one will be Brooke Burked.

Edited after seeing Mod post. Comment moved to Judges' thread.

Henry was, in fact, shown in a package, and they spent a lot of time on him. He was interviewed in a talking head. They showed the back and forth with Derek over video. I don't know how much more shown he could have been.

And the thing is, that's kind of part of what the troupe does, along with the bumper dances. They are essentially there to assist the Pros in any way they can - whether it be dressing up in really stupid costumes as part of the Pro and celebrity's number, assisting in practice, etc. I read somewhere after last season that apparently Jenna was very present in almost all of Val and Janel's rehearsals, I guess helping Janel better get the moves down. We heard none of that. I don't remember that being mentioned in any of the packages, I don't remember Val or Janel mentioning it and publicly giving Jenna props. And for the record, not saying he didn't appreciate it and they didn't express that to her privately but it just wasn't something that was seen.

As you noted, everyone knew Henry was helping out. Derek and Nastia both mentioned Henry in their blogs and gave him his props. Henry's contribution was known even before the season started because GMA's preview of the season premiere had Nastia practicing with him and her mentioning working with him because Derek was still in NY. I think part of the problem (and yes this is speculation as I don't know any of the parties involved personally) is that Henry may have stupidly allowed himself to buy into his hype and some of the online talk.

I remembered reading that he was favoriting and/or retweeting a few comments that while not outright negative to Derek, may have been interpreted by some as passive aggressive. Things about him doing so much for Nastia, how amazing he is and deserves to be a Pro for all the work he's doing, he deserves credit for all the hard work he's doing, etc. And I just think all this created a perfect storm of issues. Henry allowed his ego to make him believe he was too good to just be a silent second banana, while Derek and his control freak tendencies was definitely not going to take kindly to someone wanting to change or insert themselves in his choreography.

Edited May 1, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[dwtsgueststars]

 

Derek and his control freak tendencies was definitely not going to take kindly to someone wanting to change or insert themselves in his choreography.

 THIS, THIS, THIS....

 

I cant' blame Henry for not wanting to be a prop; and I can't blame Sasha for agreeing to it. The only person i feel sorry for is Nastia (who's caught in the middle of all this) ... and she's the STAR.

Edited May 1, 2015 by dwtsgueststars

[truthaboutluv]

YMMV but I don't see that as a criticism of Derek. I don't think it is a matter of someone not being allowed to make suggestions but more wanting to change or arbitrarily add things. And there are MANY creative people who would not be okay with that. As I said, I think there was an issue of ego on both ends - not just "oh Derek is some huge egomaniac". And I'm sorry, it may be harsh, but at the end of the day it was Derek's celebrity and his pairing with Nastia, so his choreography and direction takes precedence.

Edited May 1, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[kitcloudkicker]

YMMV but I don't see that as a criticism of Derek. I don't think it is a matter of someone not being allowed to make suggestions but more wanting to change or arbitrarily add things. And there are MANY creative people who would not be okay with that. As I said, I think there was an issue of ego on both ends - not just "oh Derek is some huge egomaniac". And I'm sorry, it may be harsh, but at the end of the day it was Derek's celebrity and his pairing with Nastia, so his choreography and direction takes precedence.

Yep yep yep. Also, as a troupe member, it kinda is quite literally Henry's job to be a prop, so. I totally get why he might want more, but the fact is he's not the pro this year. Also, without optics into what happened, potentially, this all went down without much drama. Henry may have just approached producers and asked to be reassigned.

I don't feel too badly for Nastia, because she seems to have proven herself to be a rather chill person, and seems happy and upbeat about the whole thing.

[Stitsch]

YMMV, but I don't know if Nastia being happy and upbeat about the process should necessarily translate into said process being acceptable. She's got a great work ethic, sure, but a competitor of her caliber — and any competitor on the show, really — deserves more than what Derek has been giving her, regardless of the fact that she knew what she was getting into. She can be okay with it, that's fine and is a testament to the kind of individual she is, and I also understand that she is based in NY anyway, but Derek absolutely did not have to be a part of this season. He couldn't give her the same time that every other pro gives their celebrity, nor could he prioritize her/the show. And now, with his injury, he literally can't. Derek is a great choreographer and I will never say differently, but he only did himself and Nastia a disservice by participating this season.

 

Corky was completely on point when he critiqued Derek's choreography by all but insinuating that it was discombobulated. And I don't have a hard time imagining that said choreography is essentially an allegory for Nastia's experience on DWTS: messy and with Derek at the forefront. 

Edited May 1, 2015 by Stitsch

[skittl3862]

I read somewhere after last season that apparently Jenna was very present in almost all of Val and Janel's rehearsals, I guess helping Janel better get the moves down. We heard none of that. I don't remember that being mentioned in any of the packages, I don't remember Val or Janel mentioning it and publicly giving Jenna props. And for the record, not saying he didn't appreciate it and they didn't express that to her privately but it just wasn't something that was seen.

 

As you noted, everyone knew Henry was helping out. Derek and Nastia both mentioned Henry in their blogs and gave him his props. Henry's contribution was known even before the season started because GMA's preview of the season premiere had Nastia practicing with him and her mentioning working with him because Derek was still in NY.

 

"Everyone" didn't know that Henry was helping out. Not everyone who watches the show follows all the social media and insider gossip. If it wasn't mentioned on the show specifically, that's not an accurate assumption. This week, lots of people thought Nastia deserved immunity solely because it was so tough to all of a sudden have to rehearse with a new partner and this was totally brand new and different for her.

 

Since you made the comparison, Jenna has been shown in rehearsals with Val. A few times last season with Janel, and the season before with Danica, I remember specifically she was in the studio with Val when he got the call that Danica cracked her ribs. There's a whole internet contingent that speculates Val and Jenna are dating, so their onscreen interactions are well-documented by fangirls. Maybe if people thought Henry and Derek were getting it on and screencapped everything, it would stick out in my memory more.

 

I don't assume everyone knows about Jenna either, or the Ballases' assistance with Mark. Corky mentioned on AfterBuzz that he was with Willow and Mark in rehearsal that morning when Willow said there was a surprise elimination. Whether audiences know that pros get outside assistance isn't the point in this case. Henry wasn't just in the room with Derek and Nastia giving tips or running the routine so Derek could see it from a different angle, he ran rehearsals while Derek wasn't there. I don't think there's been a case in the past that a troupe dancer completely took over teaching duties during the week in the absence of the pro. If anyone else has an example, I'd be curious to know. It's not outrageous to believe Henry should have gotten a specific shout-out from the show to acknowledge his contributions, instead of portraying it as Derek doing it all himself. So I don't know why Shirley (and others) had to frame it in such a negative light that he wanted credit where credit was due.

[truthaboutluv]

"Everyone" didn't know that Henry was helping out.

 

 

So I really had to state the obvious that when I said everyone I obviously didn't mean every person who watches the show? Okay, let me rephrase - pretty much most people who follow this stuff, as in actually invested in the DWTS fandom, knew Henry was helping out with Nastia. If one followed any of their social media, it was always there - including Derek's. It wasn't a secret, is the point being made. 

 

I don't think there's been a case in the past that a troupe dancer completely took over teaching duties during the week in the absence of the pro. If anyone else has an example, I'd be curious to know.

 

 

When Julianne had surgery many seasons ago, when she was competing with Cody Linley, Edyta came in for two weeks and acted as Cody's Pro. She came up with the choreography, taught him and danced for those two weeks. Back then they didn't have the troupe yet so Edyta came in because she'd already been eliminated at that point in the season. Some seasons later Derek hurt his back during his season with Joanna Krupa and couldn't perform and so Maks stepped in. I can't remember for sure if he was with her most of the week or he just stepped in on show day. 

 

It's not outrageous to believe Henry should have gotten a specific shout-out from the show to acknowledge his contributions, instead of portraying it as Derek doing it all himself.

 

 

But this seems to be the confusion here. I don't see where anyone said Henry was wrong to want acknowledgement for his efforts or that he didn't deserve it. What some are saying is that he was given that acknowledgement and credit, no matter some may have thought it wasn't enough. And I disagree that the show was portraying it like Derek was doing it all himself because his and Nastia's entire Samba package was dedicated to the crazy arrangement they had with Henry which seems some have just forgotten about.

 

The entire package focused on the cramped time she and Derek have together in New York, then her having to get on a plane and work with Henry until Derek showed up. The package even showed her saying how different the dances felt with the two of them and how that could be a challenge. If anything, I felt that package definitely was not favorable to Derek because it only added fodder in my opinion, (and judging by some of the comments after that episode, definitely seemed to be the case) to the notion that he should not have competed this season and he was cheating Nastia by not giving her his full attention. So I disagree that Henry was not given his due and ieveryone was making it seem like it was all Derek doing everything.

 

But as I said, I think it's exactly that kind of talk that Henry probably paid too much attention to and started making it go to his head. The fact is Derek and Nastia were both always giving Henry his props on their social media, in their blogs and so anyone who followed or liked them, knew about Henry's contribution. I imagine things became an issue when more and more people started pushing this idea that Henry was doing everything which simply was not the truth. Nastia and Henry himself, because he wouldn't flat out lie, made it clear that all those dances were solely Derek's choreography. So I imagine if Henry's ego was already getting inflated by all the online talk of how much he was doing and how important he was, then Derek's maybe getting irritated hearing people insinuate he wasn't doing anything but showing up on Monday, and Henry starts wanting to insert his ideas and opinions into the choreography - yeah perfect recipe for drama. 

Edited May 1, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[kitcloudkicker]

 I don't think there's been a case in the past that a troupe dancer completely took over teaching duties during the week in the absence of the pro. It's not outrageous to believe Henry should have gotten a specific shout-out from the show to acknowledge his contributions, instead of portraying it as Derek doing it all himself. So I don't know why Shirley (and others) had to frame it in such a negative light that he wanted credit where credit was due.

 

Per Henry's Instagram: 

 

https://instagram.com/p/0jExTjwuop/?taken-by=henrybyalikov

henrybyalikov

@mariaalverde @lauramejia63 Last week I spent Saturday and Sunday working with Nastia. This week only Sunday.

 

 

I'll take the word of the man himself, he was not there "completely taking over teaching duties during the week." And again, I'm not saying that's no work. It's clearly work. It's just not "all the work." Here he is getting on-air credit for that by the way.

 

The fact that they all have egos is not necessarily negative for me. It's facts. (I was a big fan of Travis Wall on his season of SYTYCD, even though it was kind of clear he was a little shit.) It doesn't change that I'd like to see Henry get a pro again. And again, from Shirley, the thing I took is that Henry asked to not have Nastia duty anymore. It did not seem to be about credit. If I had to guess, it was probably about feeling like it was being rubbed in his face that they only gave him one shot at being a pro. That's human, I get it. It just feels like a thing though, that has more people riled up around the sidelines mad on his behalf than it might be to actually be living. Or maybe it does suck to be actually living it, I just don't feel like I have enough of any information to get riled up on anyone's behalf. 

 

Whether or not Derek should have come back is a different discussion for me than the Henry discussion. I actually kind of agree that he shouldn't have, even though I tend to like his dances. But I just don't think you can say that Derek's decision to come back has an A to B impact on Henry - Louis VanAmstel was being rumored about coming back, or they may not have been able to get the extra celebrity, the cast may have been set at one less, who knows? They do that. Nastia seems to have been signed specifically because they were looking for someone for Derek. There are too many variables for me to say Derek's decision to come back specifically robbed Henry. 

 

Re: Corky's comments on Nastia & Sasha's dance, I think for me, Derek's role in it didn't bother me because he didn't pull focus for me. My eyes were on Nastia and Sasha, the troupe movements in the back served to emphasize them rather than detract (again, for me), and I sort of barely registered when he pulled out the microphone. Watching it back and focusing on him, I agree it was self-indulgent at the end, and especially if he did pull focus for so many people. If he had just stuck to a "troupe role" minus the microphone, I think he would have been fine. 

 

Re: Other Ballas thoughts, I also rolled my eyes at all the "we's." "We have a show on HGTV! We got eliminated this week!" Yikes, helicopter much? ;) 

[Uke]

I don't assume everyone knows about Jenna either, or the Ballases' assistance with Mark. Corky mentioned on AfterBuzz that he was with Willow and Mark in rehearsal that morning when Willow said there was a surprise elimination. Whether audiences know that pros get outside assistance isn't the point in this case. Henry wasn't just in the room with Derek and Nastia giving tips or running the routine so Derek could see it from a different angle, he ran rehearsals while Derek wasn't there. I don't think there's been a case in the past that a troupe dancer completely took over teaching duties during the week in the absence of the pro. If anyone else has an example, I'd be curious to know. It's not outrageous to believe Henry should have gotten a specific shout-out from the show to acknowledge his contributions, instead of portraying it as Derek doing it all himself. So I don't know why Shirley (and others) had to frame it in such a negative light that he wanted credit where credit was due.

 

Not sure what you mean about the Ballases' assistance with Mark. Corky being in the rehearsal room with Willow & Mark doesn't mean anything more than he was present. When Corky's in LA, he does hang out w/Mark a lot and Shirley often visits the rehearsal studio a lot (or to use kitcloudkicker's word, she's definitely a helicopter mom).  One thing with Mark, he's always quick to acknowledge when he gets help with choreo....unlike some other pros. 

 

If Henry ran a rehearsal without Derek present, it had to have been sanctioned by the producers. As I understand it, they are not allowed to rehearse without a producer/camera operator present.

[crowceilidh]

Henry may also have asked to be taken off Nastia duty because of the insanity of some of those comments.  I didn't read very far, but I doubt there was only one troll attacking him.  I would find that unsettling.

[calipiano81]

Corky mentioned on AfterBuzz that he was with Willow and Mark in rehearsal that morning when Willow said there was a surprise elimination.

Sorry, but I just have to make this correction...Corky said on Afterbuzz that he and Shirley were teaching together that morning when SHIRLEY said she heard there was going to be a shocking elimination. They were not with Willow and Mark.

Edited May 2, 2015 by calipiano81

[katha]

LOL, yeah Corky said that he and Shirley were talking about the supposed shocking elimination while they were teaching together that morning. They weren't with Mark and Willow. But this is exactly how these rumours are started: Someone mishears something, others repeat it, throw in bias for or against certain pros...voila: There you are with stories like "Derek doesn't do anything this season, it's really Henry who should have all the credit!", or "Henry is just a body double, and then he maliciously tries to pretend that he's doing all the work."

 

Perhaps it was about the two of them not seeing eye to eye. I don't see that what Shirley said was all that negative about Henry, either. Everything in this week's show demonstrated that Derek is into micromanaging and type A control freak tendencies, perhaps Henry felt he couldn't work with that in a productive manner. And yeah, Derek is the competing pro (no matter what you may think about that decision) and might not have liked that Henry (perhaps) made adjustments when he was with Nastia. Sasha seems more willing to just go along with things and not make a fuss.

[Uke]

It's also possible Henry had a scheduling conflict (imagine that!).
Rather than switch Nastia to Sasha temporarily and then back to Henry, Derek or Nastia or TPTB decided to just stick w/Sasha.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Uke

[skittl3862]

Sorry, my mistake re: Ballases in this instance, but in almost every interview Shirley gives, she mentions how they help Mark in various capacities. I remember one time on AfterBuzz, she mentioned Corky talking to Mark about getting Aly Raisman's costumes proportioned correctly. She may be overstating her own importance in the process, but Mark doesn't work in a vacuum.

With Henry, I guess I just disagree. I don't understand why Derek couldn't have taken a break from all that pimping of his Radio City show and summer tour with Julianne to specifically thank Henry on air, the way pros and celebs thank the troupe, the hair and make-up people, and the guest performers (guess he didn't do that either this week...) all the time. Not even during samba week, which would have been a great segue. YMMV.

[Morrigan]

And I watched a little 60 second promo Derek did of the Broadway show - saying he was injured but he'd be back as soon as he could but everybody should please go because it was just a great show blah blah blah some more.  What stood out to me is he never mentioned who his understudy was or that HE was great, as well.  I think that blaring omission (imo) speaks volumes.

 

And once he posted a photo of himself with Tristan on his (Derek's) Instagram. I was reading the comments and there were 5 that mentioned that Tristan was hot.  I hit refresh and all of a sudden there was only one mention of Tristan.  Since it was Derek's Instagram and he posted the photo, I think all that can mean is that he himself deleted four pro-Tristan comments.  Maybe he later got around to deleting the the last one but I never went back to check.  What a guy.  No wonder you don't see him to often hanging around with "friends" (other than "brother" Mark). For a while there were a lot of pix on his social media of him and his dog :)  Maybe that's his BFF.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Morrigan

[truthaboutluv]

With Henry, I guess I just disagree. I don't understand why Derek couldn't have taken a break from all that pimping of his Radio City show and summer tour with Julianne to specifically thank Henry on air, the way pros and celebs thank the troupe, the hair and make-up people, and the guest performers

 

 

Except Derek wasn't doing "all this pimping of the Radio City show and Move Live" on DWTS. In fact, I'm certain he's never mentioned the Radio City show - Tom has made little side comments meant to be funny, in a sort of "we all know Derek is doing this show." For example, when after Nastia and Derek's Jazz, one judge mentioned that it felt like a Broadway production and Tom cheekily said something like "it's almost like someone is performing on Broadway" and Derek just laughed. Same as Tom was the one who asked about the traveling and if the jet lag was getting to them. At no point has Derek mentioned or "pimped" the Radio City show on DWTS and as for the Move tour, again Erin was the one who brought it up. 

 

It really is a YMMV because in my opinion, as I noted above, the troupe is essentially there to help out in any way they can with the Pros' numbers as well as doing the bumper dances. How many times have Mark or anyone else thanked them after their numbers? Sure Mark has thanked the makeup people for his over the top looks but I can't remember too many times of thanking the troupe especially when they've had to put on some really stupid costumes for some of these numbers. And again, I brought up the Jenna and Val thing and not for anything about if they may or may not be diddling each other because I don't care.  My point though is if it is true she was helping out all season with Janel, I sure heard nothing about it and Val and Janel certainly never gave her any props on the show. 

 

The fact is Henry's involvement was never hidden or a secret. He was thanked every week by Derek in his blog, he was mentioned by both Derek and Nastia on Instagram and complimented. To make it that they needed to give him some special, specific mention on the show is sort of making a mountain out of a molehill in my opinion and I maintain feeds into exactly what I think ended up being part of the problem. Yes, Henry's help was great and his contribution important but at the end of the day it was Derek's choreography, his teaching that choreography to Nastia and even when Nastia did her camera blocking and last rehearsals with Henry, Derek got video footage and he directed on little things through email, like telling her to watch her arms, watch her legs, etc. And I just think some, because well anything Derek is always an issue, quickly turned the whole thing into "Henry's doing everything and Golden Boy is getting the praise and Henry isn't a Pro because of Derek, etc." and some of that may have gone to Henry's head and I don't doubt for a minute Henry has just as much of an ego as Derek and things came to a head. 

 

What stood out to me is he never mentioned who his understudy was or that HE was great, as well.  I think that blaring omission (imo) speaks volumes.

 

 

I've seen many people who get injured or for personal reasons miss shows while performing and they rarely mention the understudy. It usually is just the apology for why they can't be there and they look forward to being back and hope people enjoy the show. 

Edited May 4, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[realdancemom]

I think if Derek didn't do the show and Henry was made a pro, I think Henry wouldn't have ended up with Nastia anyway.  IMHO, I believe the producers thought Nastia was the perfect fit for Derek since she is staying in New York.  So they were able to get their schedules to work.  Of course, she was also the perfect partner for Derek since she was a winning Olympic gymnast.  The producers went out of their way to find Nastia because Derek does have a lot of fans.

 

Even if Nastia did the show and Derek wasn't a pro this season, I don't think Henry would have gotten her.   I think Henry would have gotten a non-contender since this would have only been his second season as a pro.  I know Witney got Alfonso and Peta got Donald but for the male pros, there does seem to be certain pros that get contenders which doesn't necessarily apply to the female pros.

[Serendi]

Peta got Donald because he asked for her. He figured after going out first the previous season, she'd be hungry for a win. Donald *really* knew and loved the show.

[realdancemom]

Peta got Donald because he asked for her. He figured after going out first the previous season, she'd be hungry for a win. Donald *really* knew and loved the show.

That's right.  I did read that in TWP.  My point was really that certain male pros seem to get the contenders and I don't think Henry is one of them.

[Victura]

Witney probably got Alfonso due to his height. She's one of the shortest pros and with heels, was barely shorter than Alfonso.

In general, there seems to be more of an initiation process these days with new pros, unless they are lucky like these two were.

[2LeftFeet]

 

The entire package focused on the cramped time she and Derek have together in New York, then her having to get on a plane and work with Henry until Derek showed up. The package even showed her saying how different the dances felt with the two of them and how that could be a challenge. If anything, I felt that package definitely was not favorable to Derek because it only added fodder in my opinion, (and judging by some of the comments after that episode, definitely seemed to be the case) to the notion that he should not have competed this season and he was cheating Nastia by not giving her his full attention. So I disagree that Henry was not given his due and ieveryone was making it seem like it was all Derek doing everything.

 

 

I think this was AFTER Nastia and Henry outed the set up on SM. It wasn't presented from the start that Nastia was spending 2-3 days/week with another Pro in Cali. Instead, viewers like me simply thought another pro did the camera blocking. This to me is very different than Jenna openly being around and helping Val as he worked out his choreo during the middle of the night and possibly aiding a contestant with refinements.

To me, the way this all unfolded rubs me the wrong way, in the same way burying Riker's ballroom competitive background does. It's not what's happening/happened that is an issue: it's the apparent secrecy that just looks bad. YMMV.

[smiley13]

I think this was AFTER Nastia and Henry outed the set up on SM. It wasn't presented from the start that Nastia was spending 2-3 days/week with another Pro in Cali. Instead, viewers like me simply thought another pro did the camera blocking. This to me is very different than Jenna openly being around and helping Val as he worked out his choreo during the middle of the night and possibly aiding a contestant with refinements.

To me, the way this all unfolded rubs me the wrong way, in the same way burying Riker's ballroom competitive background does. It's not what's happening/happened that is an issue: it's the apparent secrecy that just looks bad. YMMV.

What is SM?

[Uke]

To me, the way this all unfolded rubs me the wrong way, in the same way burying Riker's ballroom competitive background does. It's not what's happening/happened that is an issue: it's the apparent secrecy that just looks bad. YMMV.

 

When will people learn, it's always the coverup that does you in.

 

What is SM and do you have a link? Thanks!

[truthaboutluv]

I'm pretty sure SM is just short-hand for social media and therefore referring to Henry and Nastia's social media. I looked at the social media of all three at different points and I did not think there was any attempt to mislead or hide what was really happening. But YMMV. 

[Andiethewestie]

Week 8  Afterbuzz is up 

[TeeMo]

I thought Afterbuzz was kind of boring this week which is sort of understandable since the show was uneventful overall. The correct people went home, no one had a major disaster, the remaining couples danced well. Not a whole lot to say. I did appreciate Gleb talking about Allison's dances and how he thinks she is doing a good job but that she often seems to leave important elements of the dance styles out - this week her Viennese Waltz had no right turn which is apparently a pretty basic element that makes a Viennese Waltz a Viennese Waltz. I think all of the pros are likely guilty of this at different points but I think she seems to pretty consistently create these sort of contemporary/jazzy versions of the standard ballroom and Latin styles. 

[truthaboutluv]

I agree about the show being slightly boring. I watched last night and was only able to pull some thoughts together now. And I feel bad to say that because I do think Gleb and Elena did a fairly good job of commenting on the dancing on a technical level but the whole show just dragged a bit for me. I agree with the above about enjoying how they both broke down exactly why Allison and Riker's Viennese Waltz was not exactly a VW. And I did appreciate the comments about Noah, even though I still don't think he's doing much dancing but like Shirley last week with the balance issue, I appreciated hearing specifics of the complexity of what Sharna has to do. Which for the record, I never doubted for a second. I give her all the credit in the world coming up with ways to make this work with Noah. 

Edited May 7, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[2LeftFeet]

I agree about the show being slightly boring. I watched last night and was only able to pull some thoughts together now. And I feel bad to say that because I do think Gleb and Elena did a fairly good job of commenting on the dancing on a technical level but the whole show just dragged a bit for me. I agree with the above about enjoying how they both broke down exactly why Allison and Riker's Viennese Waltz was not exactly a VW. And I did appreciate the comments about Noah, even though I still don't think he's doing much dancing but like Shirley last week with the balance issue, I appreciated hearing specifics of the complexity of what Sharna has to do. Which for the record, I never doubted for a second. I give her all the credit in the world coming up with ways to make this work with Noah. 

I enjoyed the show, even if there wasn't much drama. In a way, I prefer it that way! Really appreciate all of the Ballroom experts they've had on this season. To me, it's added depth and greater impartiality. There for a while it felt like the standards were SYTYCD and DWTS isn't that sort of show. I'm also not missing Anna. While extremely knowledgable, which I appreciate, I didn't appreciate the frequent snark in her commentary, even if it was about a pair I didn't particularly care for.

[crowceilidh]

I can't stand the general sycophancy that I assume the hosts feel they must display in order to maintain their access.  Anna doesn't need to, because she's in a different position.  I don't always agree with Anna's snark, but I think it is SO refreshing to hear somebody say something truthful instead of the general, "well I just like him" nonsense that doesn't address dancer's shortcomings.

[Thadeeeyus]

I can't stand the general sycophancy that I assume the hosts feel they must display in order to maintain their access.  Anna doesn't need to, because she's in a different position.  I don't always agree with Anna's snark, but I think it is SO refreshing to hear somebody say something truthful instead of the general, "well I just like him" nonsense that doesn't address dancer's shortcomings.

 

I do feel like Anna is truthful in her comments.  That's why I appreciate her view and miss her when she's not there.  She has the ballroom expertise and knows how the show works, and her comments reflect that.  If I were a super fan of a particular pro, her snark might bother me.  But since my favorite pro changes from  season to season, or even week to week, I can handle the negative comments. And most of the time I agree with her.  

[Avidviewer]

Heads up:  Per Kristyn Burtt's twitter, Val will be on Afterbuzz today (4pm PT)

 

https://twitter.com/KristynBurtt/status/598531398102687744

 

For those of you who want to listen live

http://site.afterbuzztv.com/

Edited May 13, 2015 by Avidviewer

[NextIteration]

I mostly find that all Afterbuzz coverage of any show that I've watched it for are relatively useless because they are all mostly an exercise in ass-kissing and not a lot real "truth" gets told about anything.

 

Just my experience and watching the Shirley and Corky hour pretty much confirmed my impression even though they said what I personally wanted to hear about Allison - which still doesn't change my mind about it's relative uselessness.  

[RemoteControl88]

Latest episode of Afterbuzz: Guest is Val.

 

[Andiethewestie]

Interesting show to have one of the finalist pros . Val is rattled by the vitriol against him from a small but vocal group of diehards.  I understand his need to explain the situation, but for me it really isn't necessary. It's unfortunate that the skype interview was tedious due to technical difficulties, but I think one thing comes through he's honest about his feelings. his shortcomings, and his desire to get it right this time in the finale. For me, it demonstrates that he feels he's not a genius choreographer, his training was about rigour not creativity, and so he over thinks and it overwhelms him.  Rumer appears to be a great match for him as she seems to be a leveling sounding board, encouraging him and yet she doesn't stress about things that other partners may have in the past.  Val is showing his vulnerability, and perhaps that might be the breakthrough he needs. 

Edited May 14, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[katha]

The show must be such a headache for the pros. The producers bait you into giving them good soundbites, into saying something negative. Then you're hung out to dry and have to deal with the following shitstorm. I agree that what he said was what he perceived as honest critique, not some malicious slam. Even the rumoured, longer "worse" version of what he supposedly said and was edited out that is floating around social media is blunt, but you can certainly see his point up to a degree. I think Derek learned with the "demented lines" thing that you can't ever go that honest on the show, or if you do expect the backlash. Val's been on for 8 seasons now, he should know how it works. Or if you want to be honest and real, expect the reactions and don't walk it back.

 

OTOH, I understand that he doesn't want this to jeopardize his and Rumer's chances. What to do? And hearing Derek talk about it did imply IMO that he was perhaps a bit hurt by it, and he usually doesn't admit to such things, he's usually all diplomatic, so that might play into Val's reaction here as well. The ones who are having a laugh about it are the producers, of course. I'm sure they think all this melodrama and outrage is just the best thing ever. This show is such a trainwreck.

[anony mouse]

I think the problem isn't necessarily what Val said, but also who he said it about. It felt this season like Nastia kept hearing the same thing from the judges over and over - she would get good scores, but the commentary was always about her lack of emotional presentation. Val's comments could have offended people who felt like he was piling on to an already unfair situation, rather than sound constructive criticism.

[dwtsgueststars]

Even the rumoured, longer "worse" version

 

If I was Val and Rumer, I would ask for that person who leaked that to pureBS to get fired.  i'm not associated with the show, and i can tell you with 98% accurancy  that that person is a field associate producer.

 

That said, Val must be the most boring person to interview...EVER.

 

I think the problem isn't necessarily what Val said, but also who he said it about.

 

Exactly...

If he had said the same thing about Noah, Riker, or Rumer(if she wasn't her partner,) nothing would have happened. It was made a big deal because he said it about Nastia and Derek.

[RemoteControl88]

http://bcove.me/s6fhxnww

 

Access Hollywood Interview: Derek & Nastia address Val's comment at 1:26 fyi.

Edited May 14, 2015 by RemoteControl88