Fix The Show

[Kromm]

Some might argue that the show doesn't need fixing.  It gets fairly good ratings for a cable reality TV show, I believe.

 

Others might argue it needs fixing even more, because it's getting those ratings by giving us the least common denominator.

 

So.. if you had the power... what would you change?

[Dirtybubble]

Please, please get some strong, talented, non-crazy female artists in here!  It's embarrasing to see these ladies either crumble under the slightest pressure or go ape shit villan.  Enough already

[thewhiteowl]

Talented artists of either gender would be an improvement, at this point. In 5 seasons we have gone thru less than 100 artists, surely there is a ton of untapped talent out there, it's a big country.  Cutting out the macho posturing would be good. I would like to see more of the design process and a lot less dick measuring.

[Kromm]

Talented artists of either gender would be an improvement, at this point. In 5 seasons we have gone thru less than 100 artists, surely there is a ton of untapped talent out there, it's a big country.  Cutting out the macho posturing would be good. I would like to see more of the design process and a lot less dick measuring.

It's easy to agree with all of that from a quality standpoint.

 

What I wonder is if the ratings this shitty show gets are actually contingent on the machismo displayed.  No clue, but I could see why Spike TV might think so.

[ShadowSixx]

I agree that they should find actual tattoo artists that are not all about the drama. Sure personalities will clash when you cram 16 people in one house but let it unfold naturally. The artists don't have to talk down to one another and being mean spirited, doesn't make people like me want to go to them to get a tattoo. The minute I see them I'm headed out the door. 

 

Spike and the producers need to reformat the show and stop with the choppy editing of inktestants shaking their heads or frowning when someone gets a good critique, just poor sportsmanship. I'm thinking during the application process there's a question with a check box next to it that reads, "Are you a hateful, drama starting twat with next to no artistic skills?" Of course they all check yes.

[AlliePK]

I agree that they should cast according to talent level, not drama level.  There's a lot more camaraderie in the tattoo community than Inkmaster would have you believe.  Yes, it's a competition, and there's no need to play all "nicey nice everyone wins" but there's also no need for over the top psychotic behavior every season.  I like "Face Off" a lot.  Yes, it's a competition, but you win based on your own merits, not on someone else's sabotage or mind games.  They should also have a respected tattooer in there each week as a guest judge. not a football player or MMA fighter.  For guest judges/mentors: Get a Jason Kundell. Steve Byrne, or George Campisi in there.  Or the Holy Grail of zen Tattooers, Thomas Hooper (he did the star on Oliver's palm.)  Get in positive female role models like Virginia Elwood, Maud Dardot, Valerie Vargas, Francella Salgado, or Marie Brennan.  Replace Nunez, his arrogance is just over the top.  Keep Oliver, if not as a judge, than in a mentor role, because in reality, he's a good mentor.  I think the cries of his being a misogynist come from the fact that he has no tolerance for over the top, whiny, borderline psychotic behavior from women OR men. He's actually been quite supportive of female tattoers in the "real world."  Let's face it, the pool of  women that have been on Inkmaster haven't exactly been straddling the sanity line very well.  Actually, the pool of contestants in general haven't.  Judging:  have very specific and very clear judging points for each challenge.  Make it more objective than subjective.

 

I think if you elevate the production, you elevate the contestants and that further elevates the show.

[Diane Mars]

Hi there !

 

i asked the mods to create a discussion forum regarding the other tattoo shows (Tattoo nightmares, Best ink, etc...) It's here : http://forums.previously.tv/topic/17891-tattoo-shows/#entry557653

 

So if you want to share other tattoo discussions, I'm in :)

[psychoticstate]

I wish if there was going to be a weekly challenge, the tattoos would actually be based just on that challenge and not necessarily on something they did three episodes ago.  If an artist does a decent tattoo but it doesn't meet the challenge (i.e., gradient not being met or Americana, etc.) they should be eliminated.

 

I also wish there would be back-up canvases so if one taps out/faints/storms off the inktestant gets someone (besides themselves) to tattoo.

[Kromm]

I also wish there would be back-up canvases so if one taps out/faints/storms off the inktestant gets someone (besides themselves) to tattoo.

Great idea!!!

 

 

 

 

 

That they'll never do... because it removes the unnecessary drama!

[mla40]

Hi all, new here :)

I want them to do away with the metal music, or at least turn it down or shorten it up a bit. And I am so sick of the begging for their lives (major eyeroll) 'I am here and this is my life! I want this more than anything in the whole wide world and I can and will do better! Please please! Don't send me home!' Shut up and take the critique and just shut up already!!

[selkie]

I think a change in network would help a lot. Right now it seems like the show has to try to aim for 18-24 year old male demographic because that's the viewer Spike wants, and they think that the douchebaggery is what gets them their desired ratings from the 'right' people.

 

If you look at them side by side and with the sound off, Ink Master and Face Off are structurally the same show down to even having the occasional essentially identical challenges. But Ink Master is what it is and Face Off is the Montessori experience of competitive reality television because SyFy is fine with the producers making it a lighter, more collaborative show.

 

Maybe it would work on TLC or similar better.

[fifty8th]

While I don't like the rivals theme, I do like the head to head competitions during the elimination tattoos, so I hope they keep that.

 

I'd like to see a season where they have the top 4 runner ups from each season compete, that way they are all pretty strong artists and we can see how artists from different seasons do against each other. Sort of like an all stars but no winners.

[Kelda Feegle]

I'd be happy to see the 'America voted" stuff go and the canvas vote - why make someone feel bad about a tattoo they just received, if it is bad it will be/should be in the judge's bottom 3 anyway.

And yes to back-up canvasses.

[Dirtybubble]

And yes to back-up canvasses.

I understand the desire to eliminate tattoo artists tatin' themselves but I worry that if every artists knows that there is a backup canvas just waiting to be tatted then there would be no need for finesse.  Any artist can simply behave as whats-her-face did (I've already forgotten her name) and there would be no consequence.  Difficult canvases force a tattooer to compromise and actually be kind (!!) to a potential client.

 

 

[dialyn]

I understand the desire to eliminate tattoo artists tatin' themselves but I worry that if every artists knows that there is a backup canvas just waiting to be tatted then there would be no need for finesse.  Any artist can simply behave as whats-her-face did (I've already forgotten her name) and there would be no consequence.  Difficult canvases force a tattooer to compromise and actually be kind (!!) to a potential client.

I tend to agree with that.   It is one thing for the unlamented Josh to talk his client out of a difficult tattoo, and quite another for Julia to be unprofessional in her interaction with her client.  She really earned that giant tattoo that she put on herself instead of working with her client (and I noticed her attitude changed the next episode -- the one she was eliminated on, ironically -- so maybe she did learn something from the experience).    I do think there should be a difference made between a client who walks out because he or she has a change of mind (that would be the appropriate time for a back up), a client who is dangerously aggressive or threatening (that would be the appropriate time for a back up),  and a client who is chased off by the tattoo artist (no back up allowed for unprofessional behavior). 

[LoneHaranguer]

 

I understand the desire to eliminate tattoo artists tatin' themselves but I worry that if every artists knows that there is a backup canvas just waiting to be tatted then there would be no need for finesse.

No reason why they need to have a backup canvas be automatic. Maybe run it by one of the judges for a quick yes/no (the on-scene production staff could give a quick summary of what's going on if necessary).

[phoenix780]

I like that this show has a more aggressive edge to it, I just preferred the way that was expressed in prior seasons.  The touch of heavy metal, the posing in the opening credits- I appreciated that.  I'm even cool with a little bit of the smirking/nodding when someone gets criticism.  We don't need more Emilys, but a little bit...I think it's a nice point of difference between this and other shows.

 

I think it flipped for the worst with the way they offer contestants a chance to assign human canvasses to one another.  In theory that could lead to the best people getting the hardest tattoos (and therefore likely doing well with them).  In practice it makes them all act like dicks, and I think it reduces the quality of work overall.  I'd like to see the canvasses pick.  Then you're testing their skills in attracting business, which I think is a big part of being a successful tattoo artist.  You'd still get drama too, because someone has to get picked last. 

 

Of course, you might need more backup canvasses in that case so they don't walk off when their first (or second) choice gets taken.  But that just adds another possible element of fresh drama- a reluctant canvas- and a place where an artist can shine- if they win the person over anyway (ooh- incentive to try!).

 

I would probably drop the flash challenges- they're kind of silly at this point and of questionable relevance to tattooing, imho.  And, the weekly themes should either follow a standard pattern or be dropped.  I'm a casual viewer, I'm not really picking up on the differences between gradation and shading and dimension, and I don't really care.  Sometimes, it seems like all they do is repeat the word of the week like it's this profound thing, and I find it all a bit unnecessary.

 

Last thing: I'd dump Nunez.  There has to be someone who's either less of a douchebag, or is a more of a fun douchebag.  He's just...annoying.

[whirlingdervish]

I would love it if they did away with tattooers assigning the human canvasses; it seems to really set those canvasses up for potentially terrible tattoos. I could also do with a good deal less petty pissy bitchery.  

[Diane Mars]

I would love it if they did away with tattooers assigning the human canvasses; it seems to really set those canvasses up for potentially terrible tattoos. I could also do with a good deal less petty pissy bitchery.  

Yep ! Canvases randomly assigned, and, as there needs to be an advantage of winning the "flash challenge", I suggest to give the winner a REAL advantage, as, for example, 15 extra minutes for the elimination tattoo !

[psychoticstate]

Yep ! Canvases randomly assigned, and, as there needs to be an advantage of winning the "flash challenge", I suggest to give the winner a REAL advantage, as, for example, 15 extra minutes for the elimination tattoo !

Agreed!  I understand this is a competition and the inkestants want to win and use whatever strategy but I can't help but think of the poor canvas who is assigned someone considered "weak" or who is expected to fuck up. 

 

I like the idea of giving the flash challenge winner an extra 15 minutes.  Or how about letting the challenge winner select his or her canvas for the elimination tattoo and then having the others be randomly assigned? 

 

As far as back up canvases go, I didn't suggest it with the idea that the inktestant being difficult would get a new canvas (like Julia.)  The back up would only be if the canvas didn't show up the next day (the inktestant would have absolutely nothing to do with that) or if the canvas fainted or tapped out. 

 

I liked the challenge last season of having to do a cover up - -although that challenge should definitely be towards the end of the competition so that the supposedly stongest artists are still standing.  Maybe that should be the determination of Ink Master.  Frankly, I don't really like the massive 18 or 20 something hour tattoos they do for the final competition. 

[fifty8th]

 

I'd be happy to see the 'America voted" stuff go and the canvas vote - why make someone feel bad about a tattoo they just received, if it is bad it will be/should be in the judge's bottom 3 anyway.

I'd like to see the canvas critique go I always feel bad for the people listening to someone say something they will wear forever is bad for whatever reason. Especially the ones that seem to like it, they then will have doubts about it.

[Monty]

I don't even see the point of the human canvas jury. If they pick a "worst" tattoo the judges liked, the judges ignore them. If they pick a tattoo the judges didn't like, that tattoo's already going to be in the bottom. At best, the judges will have picked the tattoos they think are the bottom three, and then the jury adds tattoo the judges think are the fourth-worst. Is that going to be enough to change the judges' opinions? I don't think it is.

Edited November 23, 2014 by Monty

[CorgiNarnia]

What about a rule that "locks in" a canvas's main idea and placement so as to avoid situations like Cris changing the shark tattoo or Josh convincing a rib tattoo to be somewhere else? I know that part of a tattoo artist's ability is talking to the canvas and molding the idea, but I would rather see canvases get the tattoos they came for.

[Dirtybubble]

Maybe a nice way to add excitement to the show is due an allstars edition or something.  Bring back fan favorites or past winners and have them compete again.

[Kromm]

Maybe a nice way to add excitement to the show is due an allstars edition or something.  Bring back fan favorites or past winners and have them compete again.

IMO enough people already come back to this show.

 

And does the show really need more excitement?  What it needs is integrity.

[fifty8th]

 

Maybe a nice way to add excitement to the show is due an allstars edition or something.  Bring back fan favorites or past winners and have them compete again.

 

I say top top 3 runners up for each season compete against each other, it would be interesting to see first how they have improved since they were on, if the show showed them where they needed work and they actually took it to heart and did something about it. Also I've always wondered how some from one season would do agains some from other seasons. I would say no winners though, mostly because I've not liked any of the winners, but also because they won already.

[Rancide]

If we must have a human canvas jury, I'd like to hear them saying good things about the tattoos and not just bad things.  In fact, maybe rather than having the human canvases vote on the worst tattoo of the day, they could vote on the best tattoo of the day, and whoever wins could get some sort of minimal advantage or reward.  It's just not fun to watch all these people who just got permanently marked for life sitting around talking about whose is ugliest.

[phoenix780]

What if they offered a mix of old and new as a reward for winning the flash challenges?

 

Contestants would get a choice between either assigning the tattoos to their competitors or getting additional time to complete their own work.  Maybe they could throw in immunity as an option at certain points just so nobody gets too comfortable with how things work.  

 

That would make it more of a choice between relying on talent, with a little boost, or relying on sabotage.  I'd be curious to see which route the contestants would deem the cowardly one, and which they'd embrace as legitimate competition.

[thewhiteowl]

I don't think the canvas jury adds anything because the judges are going to dismiss every opinion but their own so I would cut it.  Also, I don't want to see anyone return to  compete again. Kyle soured that for me. I just want talented inktestants! Too much to ask?

[Iguana]

Fix show?  Four words:  Fewer assholes.  More tattooing.

[NikSac]

So demanding, thewhiteowl. Next you're going to want good artists AND good designs. ;)

 

Add me to the list of people who are pretty uncomfortable with the human canvas jury. I originally thought I'd like the concept but after seeing it "in action" it bothers me. I especially feel bad for the canvasses who seem to like their tattoo, until everyone starts going off about how bad it is.  Some of them pretty clearly know their tattoo kinda sucks, but some of them seem to genuinely like it, and I'm sure they hate it by the time the "jury" is done talking about it.

 

If they're going to keep the human canvas jury I really like the idea of having the canvasses choose the best (not worst!) tattoo and the artist getting some kind of bonus or benefit from that. I'd way rather see them complimenting the tattoos and finding positive things. I completely agree the judges aren't listening to the human canvas jury much anyway, so why not make it a positive thing and give some kind of benefit to the "winner"?

[txbowler]

For me a cool special show would be the winners vs Peck and Nunez where the canvases all want similar tattoos. Let's see how good the ink master's are versus the judges.

[phoenix780]

If they're going to keep the human canvas jury I really like the idea of having the canvasses choose the best (not worst!) tattoo and the artist getting some kind of bonus or benefit from that. I'd way rather see them complimenting the tattoos and finding positive things. I completely agree the judges aren't listening to the human canvas jury much anyway, so why not make it a positive thing and give some kind of benefit to the "winner"?

 

Wouldn't that lead to the same thing where they're highlighting flaws, just with a different end result in mind?  They'd still have to say that some tattoos aren't great, and then pick apart the best ones in ways they might ignore now. 

 

I agree with the idea- the two second human canvas jury adds nothing, and I'm not sure I always believe they're reporting results accurately.  I'm just not sure it's a concept that can be fixed.

[Muffyn]

I'm thinking during the application process there's a question with a check box next to it that reads, "Are you a hateful, drama starting twat with next to no artistic skills?" Of course they all check yes.

I think I love you.  No, really.  

 

If we must have a human canvas jury, I'd like to hear them saying good things about the tattoos and not just bad things.  In fact, maybe rather than having the human canvases vote on the worst tattoo of the day, they could vote on the best tattoo of the day, and whoever wins could get some sort of minimal advantage or reward.  It's just not fun to watch all these people who just got permanently marked for life sitting around talking about whose is ugliest.

I always feel sorry for the canvasses.  They get inked on TV then get to hear how bad their new tat sucks.  It's not like they can wash it off.  Either completely get rid of the canvas jury or let them vote on a top tattoo.  

 

And no more rivals.  What a waste of effort that is.  They have to find two tattoers that know each other and are willing to at least claim they are rivals and talk shit - enough.  

 

And while I'm shaking my fist at the sky - I really would like to see tattoo artists.  Yes, artists.  People who can design and create beautiful tattoos.  I don't care what their primary style is.  Beauty is possible in all forms of tattooing.  Just find artists. They need a combination of artistry and technical skills.  Okay, I'm asking too much. 

[Charlesman]

For me a cool special show would be the winners vs Peck and Nunez where the canvases all want similar tattoos. Let's see how good the ink master's are versus the judges.

 

 

I'd like this. I think Peck and Nunez should have to do one challenge alongside the inktestants every season. Also, the guest judges should tattoo as well under the same constraints before they can judge. Not just so they have an idea of the competition, but, I want to see what they can do, too. Especially in comparison to the idiots on the show. They have nice resumes but I wanna see their skills so I get at least one good tattoo to look at every week.

 

 

Also, I'd eliminate Dave's constant repetition of the rules and structure every week. He's worse than Probst. "This week, you'll also be judged by America. Their vote will have a huge impact on the live finale."  Cut to shots of everyone nodding. Yawn.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Charlesman

[psychoticstate]

I'd like to get rid of the human canvas jury but if they are determined to keep it, I'll second (or fourth or whatever) changing their vote from the worst to the best.  And not allow the canvas to vote for their own. 

 

And yes, get rid of the rival concept.  That makes as much sense as bringing back inktestants that were the first two or three voted off on their respective seasons.  Just bring in talented artists who'd like to highlight their work.  If they are so keen on America voting, why not let America nominate the next round of artists?  The best jury are the random people out there who love their own tattoos and artists. 

[Monty]

If I could make one change to improve this show, it would be a small one. I would just eliminate reaction shots during the judging. I don't need to see this guy shake his head in disgust because someone else got praised. I don't need to see someone smile because someone else got trashed. Devote all that screentime to showing the tattoos a little longer and stop trying to fill every second with people fighting.

 

Especially because I don't believe those shots happen when we're told they do. I think they just go down the line before every judging session and tell each person to look angry, disgusted, and happy so they can drop the shots in when they need them.

[AlliePK]

Mentoring and apprenticing happens all the time in the field.  I apprenticed for several years and have been mentored and taught by really good artists.  

[BigBlueMastiff]

 

Such a good idea.

Except how many of the winners would you really want to be mentored by? The only one I can think of is that guy from Vegas, Joey something...