S03.E04: I Feel Sorry For Me

[Midru]

And my thought is that Pam for the moment at least is good for Deacon. You got another glimpse last week of just what a miserable SOB Deacon seems to be. Just a gloomy, unhappy guy. And Pam is the only person on the show calling him on it.

 

And I love Deacon, definitely my favorite character after Juliette, but IMO he is definitely a slut. He has not screened any woman who has shown interest in him. If you wanna bang he'll bang, literally with no questions asked. So I don't see how Deacon, as presented on the show, is too good for anybody. Yes, he's a good looking artist who can pout with the best of them, but his personal issues overwhelm all his relationships. I think people let all the romance around Deacon obscure the fact that he's a pretty horrible user of women. The show wants us to forget, but I never will, how easily he jumped into bed with Juliette, who was literally half his age AND the main rival of the woman he supposedly loves. Way sleazy!

 

I'm wondering too how Pam will play out. I hope she bring Evil Luke Wheeler's true colors into the light. 

Edited October 19, 2014 by Midru

[madam magpie]

I wouldn't call Deacon a user of women. It's not like any of the women aren't willing participants. They do have control over what they do and how they are "used." But I will call him a bit of a man whore and certainly an addict. Deacon does use alcohol and sex as a means of trying to escape his life. I think he uses music for that as well. He's a sad sack without Rayna, and it seems no main character (save Teddy) on this show is allowed to be single for more than five minutes. They certainly aren't allowed to sort out their lives in a healthy way. So Deacon can't grow a pair and move on from Rayna. He needs to have sex with Pam to do it. Ok, I guess. If Pam will get him to stop moping like Rayna is a lifeline, I'm ok with that.

[Sutton]

I was hoping now that he has a 15 yrs old daughter he would think before he jumps on a washing maching to have a quickie. I know he's what is called a guy in his prime but think what the consequences would be before you act. It's not just you anymore Deacon you now have Maddie. I don't know what's going to do it but I want something big to happen when he cuts that so call lifeline from Rayna. I want them together but if it takes the rest of this season and half of next season (if they get a season 4) to work on their relationship I'm all for that but this is making me record the episodes and FF all the parts that I hate. The seies has him working to make himself a better man, he did say to Rayna I'm a different man now well act like one for heavens sake.

 

It does seem that nobody can stay single and why is that. Do they all have to be attached to someone even if that aren't IN LOVE with that person. The words I Love You are so easily said by these characters. Maybe it's my age but when someone says I Love You it was meant to mean more then just a casual remark. (Casual - Without definite or serieous intentions.) I'm wondering how long the series is going to keep Deacon never or ever being that man that Rayna wants him to be. I guess it will be like another series way back, they don't get another season so put those two main characters together before the series ends last episode and then fade to black. (Sarcasm) I guess it's to early in the morning to be non-judgemental but somebody in this series has to have some kind of moral character to think before they jump or is it just the music (movie) industry.

[DollEyes]

 

I seriously hope not. For one, I like Sadie so far and LOVE Laura Benanti. But also, they already sort of did a mini Eve Harrington thing with Layla and Juliette. Even if that line seems to have been since dropped, doing it again would be redundant.  Also I would like to think that this show which is run by a woman and stars two women wouldn't fall into the trap of making every ambitious woman a backstabbing, competitive bitch and/or borderline psychopath.

 

  The show hasn't made all its female characters into bitches and/or psychos. Emily, Juliette's assistant, for example, is smart, sweet and loyal. While the show has flirted with the Eve Harrington vibe via Juliette and Layla, if it went that way with Sadie too, I wouldn't be surprised. Also, there are plenty of male characters who are competitive and borderline psychos, not to mention controlling, manipulative and emotionally abusive, as Jeff and Luke prove.

 

  On another note, Zoe proves once again that she not just bugs, she bores. I've never bought Zoe and Gunnar together and Zoe can't leave fast enough for me. Zoe's going through Gunnar's phone was another nail in the coffin. Gunnar may be bad at reading other peoples' feelings like when he badly lied to Zoe about why he was talking to Scarlett and praising Juliette in front of Avery when he was in no mood or shape to hear it, but Zoe's invading his privacy crossed the line. One of the most important parts of love is trust. Trust and love should be mutually exclusive in a romantic relationship and when they're not, it's doomed and IMO this one is.

[mousegirl]

I guess I haven't been watching the show long enough to understand who Deacon really is/was.  I've only been at it for a few weeks, although my family members who've watched faithfully from the beginning filled me in as best as they could.  

 

I can only say that based on what I've seen, and understood about the series, that Deacon, for all his sins of the past, is trying to move forward in a more positive direction.  He's going to stumble along the way, no doubt.  And for all that the Pam character is doing FOR him to help him lighten up, get over Rayna, and have some fun with life, she strikes me as the kind of so-called "friend" who's going to cause him, eventually, to move past fun into risky, irresponsible behavior again. And when the inevitable crash and burn happens, she'll laugh, dust herself off, and go look for another victim.

 

But then, why not?  This is soap opera, after all.  If all the characters acted only in the kindest, most thoughtful, most mature way possible, what would be the point in watching?  So I say, bring on the wreckers - the Pams, the Lukes, the Sadies (yeah, I don't trust her, either), the Jeffs, to tear up the place and keep us guessing as to what crisis they'll bring on next.  

[Quiche]

Hi all!  New to the board, and glad to read such frank discussions.

 

They quickly brought in this Pam and I don't know what to make of her.  She strikes me as tenacious.  I bet she is going to hang onto Deacon for dear life.  It will certainly be interesting to watch when she and Rayna crosses paths.  

 

I think next up in the cards for Rayna won't be Deacon but Jeff Fordham.  She had a lot of nerve to call him a "whore"!  The hatred between Rayna and Jeff is so much and so vigorous.  

I guess I haven't been watching the show long enough to understand who Deacon really is/was.  I've only been at it for a few weeks, although my family members who've watched faithfully from the beginning filled me in as best as they could.  

 

I can only say that based on what I've seen, and understood about the series, that Deacon, for all his sins of the past, is trying to move forward in a more positive direction.  He's going to stumble along the way, no doubt.  And for all that the Pam character is doing FOR him to help him lighten up, get over Rayna, and have some fun with life, she strikes me as the kind of so-called "friend" who's going to cause him, eventually, to move past fun into risky, irresponsible behavior again. And when the inevitable crash and burn happens, she'll laugh, dust herself off, and go look for another victim.

 

But then, why not?  This is soap opera, after all.  If all the characters acted only in the kindest, most thoughtful, most mature way possible, what would be the point in watching?  So I say, bring on the wreckers - the Pams, the Lukes, the Sadies (yeah, I don't trust her, either), the Jeffs, to tear up the place and keep us guessing as to what crisis they'll bring on next.  

 

 

Deacon is very quick to over-react.  This has been his problem with drinking.  He's very over-emotional.  Very little self-control.  Last season he went on a binger, all because he found out Maddie was his daughter and Rayna didn't tell him the truth.  This season he's been amazingly self-controlled around Luke.  

[Quiche]

And if the Jeff and Teddy really try to sign the girls I think I might lose it. It is so stupid it boggles the mind. Of course Teddy has not supported the girls' musical ambitions and Rayna has. Also as their inspiration you would think they would want direction and participation from their mom. 

 

And, uh, in case they seem to have forgot... Rayna has her own record label! If not for artistic reasons then for financial reasons it would make no sense for them to sign with anyone but Rayna. Are they really so short on ideas that THAT was the best they could come up with? They could read this board and literally get twenty better ideas from reader suggestions.

 

I always had the impression that Teddy was more against the girls' music.  I think Jeff was just blowing smoke.  He thinks he can talk Teddy into it, but I doubt it.

 

Who might have better luck with is Luke - when Luke becomes their step-father.  

[Bort]

I always had the impression that Teddy was more against the girls' music.  I think Jeff was just blowing smoke.  He thinks he can talk Teddy into it, but I doubt it.

Yeah, that's the thing. Rayna isn't against the girls being professional musicians, she just doesn't want them to do it right NOW, she wants them to have a childhood first. As previously established, Teddy would rather them not be pros at all. He knows full well how fickle and potentially damaging the music industry can be, he'd rather them do anything else. So if Jeff manages to talk Teddy into signing the girls, I call bullshit.

[Quiche]

Yeah, that's the thing. Rayna isn't against the girls being professional musicians, she just doesn't want them to do it right NOW, she wants them to have a childhood first. As previously established, Teddy would rather them not be pros at all. He knows full well how fickle and potentially damaging the music industry can be, he'd rather them do anything else. So if Jeff manages to talk Teddy into signing the girls, I call bullshit.

 

I was thinking the same way.  Until I just remembered that scene of Teddy by himself at the bar and looking lonely and forlorn.  

 

Maybe Jeff will set him up in a compromising and scandalous situation, and thereby force Teddy to sign.  

[Sutton]

Okay, first LW won't be any time soon the girls step-father. If Jeff sets Teddy up in a scandalous situation I say about time. If he insists on signing the girls (which I doubt because he isn't into music because of Deacon) Rayna has her own situation to force Teddy to think about not signing any contracts. The bank deal that Peggy and him embezzled 2 million from to hold over his head. Now that would be one hell of a drama episodes...The mayor, handsome, wealthy nice person to talk to can't find someone nice to date with all the functions he goes to. Is he the only one that's going to take his time looking for someone he really cares about this time or does he still think he has a chance with Rayna?

[Quiche]

Okay, first LW won't be any time soon the girls step-father. If Jeff sets Teddy up in a scandalous situation I say about time. If he insists on signing the girls (which I doubt because he isn't into music because of Deacon) Rayna has her own situation to force Teddy to think about not signing any contracts. The bank deal that Peggy and him embezzled 2 million from to hold over his head. Now that would be one hell of a drama episodes...The mayor, handsome, wealthy nice person to talk to can't find someone nice to date with all the functions he goes to. Is he the only one that's going to take his time looking for someone he really cares about this time or does he still think he has a chance with Rayna?

 

I find Teddy's situation rather curious.  He is needed and necessary, because who else can Rayna leave her kids with while she is on tour?  

 

Rayna knows about the embezzlement, but does she have proof.  

 

I think there has to be a reason for that brief scene of Teddy sitting alone at a bar and looking lonely.  

[Quof]

who else can Rayna leave her kids with while she is on tour?

 

Their kids.  (While Maddie isn't biologically his, he is, if I recall correctly, still listed as the father on the birth certificate.)

[Quiche]

Their kids.  (While Maddie isn't biologically his, he is, if I recall correctly, still listed as the father on the birth certificate.)

 

Thanks for the correction.  I was only thinking thru Rayna's POV.  

[Quiche]

Burning questions regarding Pam, Deacon's new girl-friend.

 

Will Teddy steal her away from Deacon?

 

Has or does Luke Wheeler sleep with her?

 

Did Luke put her up to chase and bed Deacon?

 

Is Pam most likely to suck up to Rayna or insult her?

 

Could Pam be Avery's mother?  

 

Does Pam do drugs?

[Sutton]

WOW Quiche you've really got this topic on this forum going. Would love to have all of your questions answered. Like I've said before why in the world would Callie make me the viewer get to a point of disliking your main character if you want this series to go more than 3 years. If Rayna looks in her fathers files I bet he has all the info she would need to stop Teddy in his tracks. Your so right Teddy was (is) the only one to watch their kids while she was on tour for 13 yrs being emotionally involved with Deacon. OMG I'm now defending Teddy.

 

LW putting Pam up to getting something on Deacon wouldn't surpirse me because I think he's that slimy. Hope there aren't any naked pictures putting Deacon in that awkward situation of them being published in the tabloids.

[Irlandesa]

I guess I haven't been watching the show long enough to understand who Deacon really is/was. 

I can only say that based on what I've seen, and understood about the series, that Deacon, for all his sins of the past, is trying to move forward in a more positive direction.  He's going to stumble along the way, no doubt.  And for all that the Pam character is doing FOR him to help him lighten up, get over Rayna, and have some fun with life, she strikes me as the kind of so-called "friend" who's going to cause him, eventually, to move past fun into risky, irresponsible behavior again. And when the inevitable crash and burn happens, she'll laugh, dust herself off, and go look for another victim.

Pam isn't responsible for or to blame for Deacon's choices.  If Deacon messes up again, it won't be because he's her victim.  It'll be because he screws up.  He does want to do better but he makes poor choices.  His choices.  Not Pam.  He did it before he met her.  He'll do it after she leaves his vicinity. 

 

Maybe Jeff will set him up in a compromising and scandalous situation, and thereby force Teddy to sign.  

Blackmail is the only thing I can think of but I still think it'd be out of character.

[jazzpno]

Burning questions regarding Pam, Deacon's new girl-friend.

 

Interesting questions,but I doubt that TPTB are going to flesh out this character enough to find out. My thoughts?

   

I don't see where Teddy and Pam's paths will cross, so I can't imagine a romance. Also, I wouldn't characterize Pam and Deacon's situation as one from which either party can be "stolen". They're still in "booty-call" status.

I would be surprised if she and Luke are "popping corn" (LOVE THIS!). While Luke is manipulative, sexist and shallow, I don't see him as a philanderer...yet. I am curious, however, about the demise of his first marriage. I wonder if Luke orchestrated the Deacon/Pam hookup, too. She went from zero to stalker at break-neck speed. Deacon is hot, but damn girl...take it easy!

Is Avery's mother a back-up singer? I assumed she was back in Ohio just being Mrs. Barkley.

I'm in the camp that takes Pam for her word when she said that she stumbled into the AA meeting by accident, but being flippant with an alcoholic about drinking is a bitch move. Her apology was insufficient, but I did chuckle at the "endless supply of denim shirts" comment. 

 

When I heard about the character being Deacon's muse, I hoped and still hope that she will encourage him to write. I liked their little impromptu duet...if that's what it takes to get more scenes with Deacon singing, I'll take it.

[Midru]

Pam as a pawn of Luke never occurred to me. She would obviously have some history with him. Maybe a spicy history? And a couple episodes back she was the only witness to an argument between Deacon and Luke, so I am hoping she adds to that story. I too doubt she will be around long enough for us to really get to know her. It would be nice if she were Avery's mom, but on this show that would mean bringing on more all-new characters, until they get the entire population of Nashville on Nashville.

 

I don't think there is any way Luke becomes the stepdad of the girls, because his evil plot/evilness will be revealed sometime just before the wedding!

 

Poor Juliette, the best character and we hardly ever talk about her! It looks like this season for her will be all about the baby. Sigh. I like her better as a musician and careerist!

[Bubbles]

I wouldn't call Deacon a user of women. It's not like any of the women aren't willing participants. They do have control over what they do and how they are "used."

They were all willing participants, but some of his past relationships had an air of false pretenses about them. Deacon being upfront with women about being in love with someone else before he sleeps with them is a very recent development. Certainly the veterinarian had no clue about Rayna at first, and the lawyer last season knew about their history but was under the impression that it was just that, history. I think Pam is the first woman he's been involved with where he's honest from the start that there's very little potential for the relationship to go anywhere because he's in love with Rayna.

[izabella]

Poor Juliette, the best character and we hardly ever talk about her! It looks like this season for her will be all about the baby. Sigh. I like her better as a musician and careerist!

 

Yes, I'm already sick of this baby and it only gets worse after they're born.  Ugh.  Babies ruin shows.

[jazzpno]

Deacon being upfront with women about being in love with someone else before he sleeps with them is a very recent development.

 

 

You're right. Lady Vet (what was her name?) was totally caught off guard when she found out. Megan seemed to be a little leery of Deacon's relationship with Rayna, but I don't think she realized how deeply he felt for her. 

 

Honestly,  I think that Deacon being upfront with himself about his love for Rayna is fairly recent, too.

[Sutton]

I don't think that Deacon is being upfront with himself about his love for Rayna fairly recent. "He's been In Love with Rayna since she was 16 yrs old" He has and always will be In Love with Rayna that will never change. Rayna has been In Love with Deacon since she was 16 yrs old and know matter what they throw at them that will never change either IMO...Someone on this forum could nail this down with her ability, common sense perfectly. Me, I get to emotional when it comes to Deacon.

[madam magpie]

They were all willing participants, but some of his past relationships had an air of false pretenses about them. Deacon being upfront with women about being in love with someone else before he sleeps with them is a very recent development. Certainly the veterinarian had no clue about Rayna at first, and the lawyer last season knew about their history but was under the impression that it was just that, history. I think Pam is the first woman he's been involved with where he's honest from the start that there's very little potential for the relationship to go anywhere because he's in love with Rayna.

That's not using people, though. That's just life and not being honest with one's self. Since he's started being honest with himself and the world, Pam is the only person he's been with. This idea that women are so easily taken advantage of doesn't sit well with me. On some level, everyone uses everyone else, but really Deacon's just been living his life and sleeping with women who want to sleep with him too.

[Midru]

I think it is a gray area, MM. But Deacon has been around the block. Women almost never want men just for sex, even if at first it seems that way. Young guys are often surprised that what they view as a casual thing is viewed more seriously, frequently a lot more seriously, than their partners. Whose fault that is can be debated, but as a guy you can only break so many hearts before you have to tell girls that you are only good for a casual fling. Failure to warn people, and pass on the fragile ones, makes you responsible for hurting them IMHO. 

 

Deacon did warn Pam, but I think the other women were unaware. The musician/groupie relationship, which most of his seem to be some form of, is extremely unequal, and you would think a grown man would tire of that eventually. 

[Clemgo3165]

Hmm, I don't really see that. We've seen flings/relationships with Juliette, the Vet, Megan and Pam - correct me if I'm missing someone, I may be. Pam's the only one who has been a groupie of some kind and they both understand that this is a fun fling, nothing serious. Pretty sure Juliette understood that Deacon wasn't in it for a relationship either since SHE seduced HIM. She wanted him for her band and they do make beautiful music together.

 

The Vet and Megan are very different I think. Deacon was invested in both relationships. He didn't tell the Vet about Rayna, but then they hadn't been together all that long when he took her on tour with him. He was honest with her at that point and honest about his feelings. Megan knew all along and wasn't in the least bit threatened by their relationship. Deacon was fully invested in that relationship and seemed to really be moving on from Rayna until Teddy slept with Megan.

 

Deacon's had a lot of relationships, but he's no more a "whore" than any of the other main characters.

[madam magpie]

I think it is a gray area, MM. But Deacon has been around the block. Women almost never want men just for sex, even if at first it seems that way. Young guys are often surprised that what they view as a casual thing is viewed more seriously, frequently a lot more seriously, than their partners. Whose fault that is can be debated, but as a guy you can only break so many hearts before you have to tell girls that you are only good for a casual fling. Failure to warn people, and pass on the fragile ones, makes you responsible for hurting them IMHO.

Deacon did warn Pam, but I think the other women were unaware. The musician/groupie relationship, which most of his seem to be some form of, is extremely unequal, and you would think a grown man would tire of that eventually.

Grown men and women do and don't tire of empty relationships all the time. It really depends on the person. But I think women are capable of being responsible for themselves and their behavior. Sure, it would be nice if everyone we all met were so well adjusted as to be upfront and clear about how they feel all the time, but most people aren't. Deacon tried to be serious with and committed to both Stacey and Megan. With Stacey, he was just wrong, and he owned and felt bad for that. Megan cheated on him. To say that Deacon used either of them is just absurd to me. They dated, it didn't work out. That happens all the time, and neither relationship even lasted particularly long anyway. They weren't planning to get married or start a family or even move in together. Juliette and the one-night stands weren't inherently fragile; they were using Deacon just as much as he used them. He's not more responsible because he's the man. With Juliette, I could see an argument that she's young, but even so. She basically threw herself at him and never acted like she felt taken advantage of. It doesn't empower women not to hold them equally accountable for their choices. Edited October 21, 2014 by madam magpie

[ElectricBoogaloo]

We've seen flings/relationships with Juliette, the Vet, Megan and Pam - correct me if I'm missing someone, I may be. Pam's the only one who has been a groupie of some kind and they both understand that this is a fun fling, nothing serious. Pretty sure Juliette understood that Deacon wasn't in it for a relationship either since SHE seduced HIM. She wanted him for her band and they do make beautiful music together.

There was also the music journalist he slept with (I think it was S1) but IIRC they knew each other from back in the day and neither of them thought it was anything more than just sex for the night.

madam magpie, I agree with your entire post. These are all consenting adults who willingly have sex with each other for whatever reason. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. If we are supposed to judge Deacon for not immediately telling every woman about his emotional baggage, why aren't we judging Juliette for failing to disclose her entire luggage cart full of mommy issues, insecurity, and ulterior motives every time she sleeps with a new guy? I am pretty sure she holds the record on this show for the character who has had the most sex partners and she was using most of them more than Deacon was using his.

For the record, I am not here to slut shame Juliette, Deacon, or any of these characters but when comparing sex lives, Deacon wasn't sleeping with his employees or trying to get publicity out of his relationships or seducing people to get music out of them. I have also seen people criticize Rayna for being a slut/sleeping with too many men but by my count in three seasons she has slept with four people: her husband Teddy, her ex/boyfriend at the time Deacon, a coworker who she was attracted to (Liam), and her new boyfriend/now fiancé Luke. Liam is the only one I would classify as a fling, but again I don't have a problem with that because they were consenting adults.

Edited October 20, 2014 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Bubbles]

I don't see how saying that Deacon hasn't always demonstrated flawless relationship ethics is denying the women he dated agency or putting extra responsibility on him because he's a man. I have the same issues with Rayna. I think her relationships with both Teddy and Luke are comparable in a lot of ways to Deacon's relationship with Megan, in that there was knowledge there about Rayna and Deacon's history but something less than honesty about the extent to which their feelings for each other were still alive and flourishing. Megan, Teddy and Luke all willingly chose to be in those relationships knowing there was potentially something to be concerned about with respect to Rayna and Deacon. That doesn't negate the fact that Deacon and Rayna were not behaving entirely honorably in those relationships.

Stacy chose to date Deacon with the information she had at the time, and chose not to date him when she acquired new information about him. That's part of dating. Still, I suspect that in the 15 years or so since Rayna married Teddy, Deacon has had enough short-lived relationships that didn't get off the ground because of his feelings for Rayna to know full well that a lot of people don't want to be in a relationship with someone who's in love with someone else. Yes, it happens all the time that people choose to withhold information that they know would probably make someone decide not to sleep with them or date them. That doesn't make it not at least a little bit ethically questionable.

I get that people on this forum love Deacon, and I like him too, but he's not perfect. It doesn't empower women to give men a pass just because they're dreamy, when people here have been tearing Rayna to shreds for similar behavior. His dynamic with Rayna is kind of toxic at this point, and they're both hurting other people on their long and inevitable journey back to each other. I think part of the reason I want to see them back together is so they can stop dragging everyone else into their drama.

[madam magpie]

I don't see anyone saying Deacon has flawless relationship ethics because he's dreamy. All we're saying is he's not a user of women. He's just a regular, screwed-up person.

[slayer2]

Yeah, that's the thing. Rayna isn't against the girls being professional musicians, she just doesn't want them to do it right NOW, she wants them to have a childhood first. As previously established, Teddy would rather them not be pros at all. He knows full well how fickle and potentially damaging the music industry can be, he'd rather them do anything else. So if Jeff manages to talk Teddy into signing the girls, I call bullshit.

Add me to this list. Teddy was never more of an asshole than when he was strongarming Maddy out of singing/performing. His hate-on for her epic talent is legendary,, if Jeff talks Teddy "I'll never let you play music again" Conrad into signing both of his daughters when Maddy can barely get him to allow her to play in her room then I'll call so much bullshit you'll hear a perpetual busy signal.

Edited October 21, 2014 by slayer2

[Sutton]

Deacon is not perfect I (we) never said he was. He's an alcoholic and was for more than 13 plus years. I don't think he was much of a drinker before the age of 18 maybe a casual drinker but something happened to him that made him drink excessively and the only thing I remember back in season 1 was the death of his best friend that he felt responsible for because he let him drive himself home drunk, had an accident and was killed. I tried to add up a timetable. Deacon is 45 minus13 yrs he was sober leaves 32 yrs. He met Rayna when he was 19 yrs old don't think he was a heavy drinker then that leaves13 yrs of hard drinking. Season 2 we've seen Deacon change for the better not only for himself but mainly for the daughter he found out he had wanting to make her feel proud of him as a dad and a performer. Since season 1 Deacon has bedded Carmen, Juliette, Stacy, Megan, Pam and lets not forget Rayna and they all knew at the beginning, except for Stacy that Deacon Claybourne was and still is IN LOVE with Rayna Jaymes...Don't think I forgot anyone. You can say what you want about him but he's honest when he starts relatonships, doesn't make promises he knows he won't be able to keep.

[Quiche]

I think both Rayna and Deacon are losing propositions for any other people.  Look what happened to Teddy.  He basically played 2nd fiddle throughout his marriage to Rayna.  

[prican58]

I'm just along for the ride. The show isn't great but Hayden sure is. I'm paring down my must see tv list due to boredom or a recently acquired aversion to senseless violence. But Hayden just always keeps my interest. She is wonderful and she is this show's star. She looks so amazing during this pregnancy. I love her.

[Sutton]

Teddy knew from the start what he was getting into when he agreed to marry pregnant Rayna Jaymes, he was her second choice. He admitted to Rayna that for the 13 yrs they were married she was emotional involved with Deacon and he was absolutely right. I don't feel sorry for Teddy he was in love with a woman that was In Love with another man.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

While I agree that it would be totally out of character for Teddy to allow Jeff to sign Maddie and Daphne to Edgehill, in this episode they were trying to show how suspectible Teddy is to Jeff's mind games. He is the one who convinced Teddy to let the girls go to Sadie's show because that would make him the cool dad.

 

Teddy has had issues with Maddie's music from the beginning, and he has become even more insecure about it because now her music also includes Deacon. Old Teddy would have said no to any offer that Jeff could possibly offer. But the new sadsack Teddy who is sitting in a bar by himself because Daphne is at a sleepover and Maddie is off being a teenager feels that his daughters are slipping away from him and he is all alone. If Jeff is truly the salesman that he bragged about being, he will use what Teddy has already told him to play on his insecurity and convince him to do something that would totally make Rayna mad. He might be able to sell it as a limited contract/job like having her be the opening act on Luke's tour over Christmas break so that she wouldn't have to miss any school or having her do some kind of special performance (maybe a tv special?). Either of those would generate huge publicity for Edgehill since she is Rayna and Deacon's daughter and it would help Jeff's "I only sign guys in cowboy hats" problem. I could totally see Jeff telling Teddy what a cool dad he would be if Maddie got this amazing experience where she would get to be on tour and he could come along and it would be a way for him to spend time with Maddie and bond with her and blah blah blah.

[slade3]

Interesting questions about Pam, Quiche.

 

I hope Pam isn't "working" for Luke. That would just be too weird. She has yet to grow on me, but I do want her attraction to Deacon to be real. I would also hate for that to be the reason Rayna eventually leaves Luke. I want Rayna to leave Luke because she realizes he's too controlling and she doesn't want/need a man she isn't 100% in love with.

 

I hope Pam doesn't do drugs. She looks like she did a lot of drugs in the 70s though. And, I think she'll ignore Rayna, or be short with her. After she made that motorcycle comment to Deacon, I felt she was trying to paint Rayna in a negative light, like Rayna is the reason Deacon missed out on fun. I disliked both Pam and Deacon in that scene.

[seacliffsal]

As far as Luke signing the girls to the label-he won't have any legal rights concerning the girls as their stepfather.  Unless Teddy was willing to sign over his rights to Luke, Luke will not be a legal guardian for the girls.  Teddy didn't even want Deacon in the same room as Maddie, so he is unlikely to sign his rights away.

 

However, I could see Luke trying to pressure Rayna into various things once they get married.  And, he has already tried to exert influence regarding the girls.  I think it will be an interesting storyline as he tries to control the girls and Deacon and Teddy resist his influence.

[bantering]

Is it wrong that I laughed when Avery told Scarlett "You're so needy!"

 

I don't really get what makes Jeff tick. He gets shocked when people play by the rules he set. What?

[CofCinci]

I don't really get what makes Jeff tick. He gets shocked when people play by the rules he set. What?

Jeff is the most poorly written character on this series. They don't know what to do with him and are most likely keeping him because ABC has a development/holding contact with Oliver. I'd love to see him and Rayna begin a hate/sex type of relationship. There's nothing else they can do with him.

[shron17]

I don't really get what makes Jeff tick. He gets shocked when people play by the rules he set. What?

 

I think he's being written as someone who does have a problem with women, which is why he's so upset when Rayna sees fit to play by "his" rules. And this is exactly why I don't want hate/sex between him and anyone else--he acts like it gives him power over them.

Edited October 22, 2014 by shron17

[Midru]

My thought on Jeff is that the actor has zero acting ability. He seems like every expression and vocal line are robotic. I can't tell about the writing because I am stuck on the actor. 

 

Regarding Deacon and women, I hadn't remembered a lot of details people have brought up here. I definitely don't think he was abusive or predatory. 

 

Hoping they ramp up the music. It seems like we have had less new music this season. 

[Sutton]

Deacon has never been predatory or abusive toward women. In fact I think he has been very kind, gentle and very understanding especially when a woman needs help. Example, helping Juliette with her mom who was an alcoholic and an abuser of drugs. That little flashback they very conveniently showed was a reaction when he was drunk in the early years, stretched out on the bed passed out and swatted someone trying to wake him up.

 

As far as Jeff goes if they (series) in any way bring together Rayna and Jeff have a hate/sex together situation I'm done with the series because that means the writers don't have any imagination on where to take this series and neither does Callie and Co. That would mean for me that Rayna would sleep with anyone and that's the  Rayna I want to invest myself in watching.

[Temperance]

Catching up on the season:

With so many women, this show needs lesbian/bi characters.

Pam and Deacon are funny, but she has an agenda.

Avery needs to get a grip on his actions.

That wedding dress Rayna was wearing was ugly.

I missed on a lot of the second season, but I want to hear Jeff sing.

What makes Jeff think Teddy will sign the girls?

Right now, I don't care if any of these couples are together or not.

[pitchy]

... Sadie's a little too Eve Harrington from  All About Eve for me. For those who haven't seen All About Eve, it's about Eve Harrington, a struggling young theater actress who becomes the protégé of Broadway legend Margo Channing, whom Eve claims to idolize, but is secretly plotting against her. Sadie's definitely giving me Eve Harrington vibes...

 

However, Sadie was upfront or forthright with Rayna, telling her at first that she was going to sign with the bumpy golfer, because "I want to BE you" and told Reyna  she thought that Jeff would help her get there.  Eve's whole approach was furtive, with deadly sweetness.

[DollEyes]

  Sadie's honesty with Rayna about "want[ing] to be [her]" is IMO yet another reason why Rayna shouldn't trust her, but at this point, her head is way too far up her own ass to figure that out for herself before it's too late.

[smiley13]

I totally do not trust Sadie at all.    She is just being too "awesome" to be real.

[aradia22]

 

Betcha anything she goes to tell him, he says that, and leaves so she doesn't tell him. In any normal world she would have told him in episode 1 this season, but looks like they are going to stretch it out.

I'm getting so tired of the way they're stretching it out and having people talk past each other. I'm glad at least some people know now. Of course, the opposite side of that is where almost everyone knows the secret except for one person which is also incredibly frustrating.

 

I'm torn about how to feel about Glenn looking for pills and going to talk to Avery. On the one hand, he's looking out for her but on the other hand he's really overstepping. I feel like the show is also of two minds. Sometimes we get an awesome, capable Juliette. And sometimes they write her like a child who's about to fall apart at any moment.

 

I loves me some Laura Benanti so I might be feeling more positive about her character than other people. They're written Juliette as a lot of things but from Gasoline and Matches I think they might be making this Sadie character as more of a bad girl of country in that Miranda Lambert way. 

 

Deacon does not need another love interest but if it keeps him happy off in the corner until they're ready to split up Luke and Rayna I guess I'm OK with it. Also, I enjoyed their little country music rap battle. They should turn that into a song. I miss the duets.

 

Nice moment with Rayna's argument about why Sadie should sign to highway 65.

 

OK, I knew where the Jeff vs. Rayna story was going, but it really, really is baffling to me.  In what universe would Ted ever agree to letting Jeff sign Maddie/Daphine to Edgehill?  He's always been the one who has been against it the most, and, for all his flaws, he's not the type of guy who will fold, just because it makes the girls angry at him.  But, I got the feeling they're setting it up to happen, so how in the hell is Jeff going to do this?  Is he going to promise even more money for schools?  Somehow find out Ted let Lamar die, and hold it over him?  If this is the path they are going, they better have a damn good explanation for it.

I thought Jeff was going to go after Juliette and thought 'damn it, not again. Poor Juliette.' I really have no idea how he's going to go after her daughters. That makes no sense.

 

 

Damn you, Rayna, for helping Juliette and then making that whole I'm a champion of women and artists thing. I don't trust you at all to be that person.

It would have been awesome if she'd been that character all along but those of us who have been here since the beginning know that isn't true.

 

 

And I'm beyond sick and tired of whiney, mopey Scarlett---when she told Zooie "Not everything is about you" after going into yet another one of her psycho-trance pity-parties, I wanted to smack the bad extension glue right out of her scalp.

Scarlett claiming "not everything is about you" is pretty rich considering she sucks all the fun and energy right out of any room or party she enters.

That was HILARIOUS. "Not everything is about you" while I'm making your going away party all about me. As I make everything all about me.

 

Rayna's dress was ugly. It would be barely acceptable as a red carpet dress. Maybe something terrible will happen to it and she'll get a new one. Or she'll end up marrying Deacon and wear a different dress. Probably something simpler with lace. None of the gold on the dress did anything for her and it looked super cheap.

 

I can't tell if the show is trying to draw a million parallels on purpose or if the writers can only come up with a handful of plotlines. Does everyone have to have a plotline that echoes Rayna/Deacon? Before it was Gunnar and Scarlett. Now it's happening with Juliette being pregnant and Avery working his way to alcoholism.