S04. E06 Mrs. Table

[kitkat343]

 

 

Quote

Deborah receives the "Courage in Comedy" award, while Late Night books a last-minute guest. Meanwhile, Ava reaches her breaking point at the show.

From the moment Deborah popped all the balloons, I hoped this show finally found its footing this season, and thankfully it did.

 

I loved Deborah making excuses for not being there for DJ, but thankfully DJ has shown a tremendous amount of growth and was never looking to her mother for support.  I'm really proud to see how much DJ is thriving.  

Even the annoying throuple couple managed to make their scenes worth it by calling out Eva for not being ready to be in a relationship.  

Edited May 9 by kitkat343

[slowpoked]

Lots to love on this episode, but also there were little things that annoyed me. Like how can Ava not look herself in the mirror before she left the makeup store?! 
 

I’m glad they finally seemed to bury the hatchet. Deborah apologized for the shitty way she handled the head writer job offer, and Ava also acknowledging that she’s not the right person for the job and that she shouldn’t have forced it. But I wished she also apologized for the blackmail, because that’s what hurt Deborah the most. Good that there was a callback to the Krug that Ava bought in S3, and more hilarious that Deborah said it tasted like shit after being stuck in the trunk of the car.

Hopefully from this point forward, Ava also learns her lesson in leading the writers’ room. Deborah is right that it is a workplace and not a hangout. You want to be generous and “progressive” in how you work with people, but sometimes, people also abuse you and their privileges. 

[txhorns79]

I really enjoyed the episode, and was so glad the dog ended up being okay.  That was a very scary 30 seconds, and it was impressive watching Deborah spring into action to defend her dog (though I suppose the dog getting out must have been because she forgot to lock the doggy door) and then devolve into a crying mess once it was over and run out to try and find Ava. 

I am also happy that Ava and Deborah have gotten back to a healthier place in their relationship.   The ratings might continue to suck, but at least they will finally get to put on the show they want to do and go down swinging.  

 

[Francie]

51 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

But I wished she also apologized for the blackmail, because that’s what hurt Deborah the most.

100% agree. 

I also absolutely hated that Deborah told Ava she was her voice, and not that she helped her find her voice. That special -- that was Deborah telling her story. Not Ava speaking through her like some ventriloquist's doll. Even on Late Night, Deborah wasn't 'lost,' trying to find her voice. She was actively trying to chase down some mythical voice that mothers 25 to 25 would love rather than express herself. 

I've had to head canon it that Deborah assessed Ava's state of mind and made a calculated decision to overstate her contribution in order to get her to return on the spot. 

I finally feel like this season is starting, after spinning its wheels for five episodes. 

[aghst]

Deborah doesn't have anyone close to her.  Even Marcus was just an employee and while they are loyal and would do anything for her, like Damien driving back from Wyoming with a special blend of bear piss, there's nobody like her dogs or Ava, as she realizes.

She was frantic looking for her.  Fortunately they had shared their location in Find My -- it's interesting how often it's used as a plot device in various shows and movies.

But she jumped to the ocean when she thought it was Ava.  All the work antagonism melted away when she rescued one of her babies -- the dog -- and realized Ava was as dear to her as her babies.

It's kind of maternal and interesting that this was the first episode of the season in which DJ, her actual daughter, appeared.

 

[kitkat343]

2 hours ago, aghst said:

 

It's kind of maternal and interesting that this was the first episode of the season in which DJ, her actual daughter, appeared.

 

It's interesting particularly because DJ is about to go into labor (she's over 40 weeks and scheduled to be induced) and her chasing after Ava is a stark contrast to how she told DJ she couldn't be there for her when she thought DJ was asking her to be there for the birth of her first grandchild.  As noted above, Deborah really is all alone, but part of the interest in the show is seeing how these characters also cause themselves to be alone since they keep pushing everyone else away (that was the point of the scene of Ava with throuple couple).  

[maddie965]

3 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I really enjoyed the episode, and was so glad the dog ended up being okay.  That was a very scary 30 seconds, and it was impressive watching Deborah spring into action to defend her dog (though I suppose the dog getting out must have been because she forgot to lock the doggy door) and then devolve into a crying mess once it was over and run out to try and find Ava. 

I am also happy that Ava and Deborah have gotten back to a healthier place in their relationship.   The ratings might continue to suck, but at least they will finally get to put on the show they want to do and go down swinging.  

 

Ok, time to go back then!

[slowpoked]

3 hours ago, Francie said:

I also absolutely hated that Deborah told Ava she was her voice, and not that she helped her find her voice. That special -- that was Deborah telling her story. Not Ava speaking through her like some ventriloquist's doll. Even on Late Night, Deborah wasn't 'lost,' trying to find her voice.

That was also one of the things that annoyed me. I get what Deborah is saying, and like someone said above, maybe she also deliberately overstated Ava’s importance on purpose to get her back. But I wished that line could have been written better than the writers. I agree with you - on Deborah’s special, she got her aha-moment when she realized she needed to make fun of herself (even Ava was shown as surprised when she took the joke to another direction.)

35 minutes ago, kitkat343 said:

As noted above, Deborah really is all alone, but part of the interest in the show is seeing how these characters also cause themselves to be alone since they keep pushing everyone else away (that was the point of the scene of Ava with throuple couple).  

This was a good episode mirroring both of their loneliness. They both didn’t have anyone. The couple was right that Ava was just using them for sex. And Deborah not really having any human connection after the tapings are over.

[maddie965]

8 hours ago, Francie said:

100% agree. 

I also absolutely hated that Deborah told Ava she was her voice, and not that she helped her find her voice. That special -- that was Deborah telling her story. Not Ava speaking through her like some ventriloquist's doll. Even on Late Night, Deborah wasn't 'lost,' trying to find her voice. She was actively trying to chase down some mythical voice that mothers 25 to 25 would love rather than express herself. 

I've had to head canon it that Deborah assessed Ava's state of mind and made a calculated decision to overstate her contribution in order to get her to return on the spot. 

I finally feel like this season is starting, after spinning its wheels for five episodes. 

I think Deborah did whatever she had to do to try and get back Ava's trust. When you are in a relationship, sometimes you need to compromise. If the other person is at her lowest point, just after having a meltdown, you try to feel their pain and then heal it. And yes, you exaggerate certain things to make the other person feel better. Deborah did good.

I do want Ava to apologize. I demand that she does. But not right now. She needs to feel a little better, and then maybe they can fix this whole mess.

Hacks is back. *tears*

Edited May 9 by maddie965

[yesferatu]

I actually laughed out loud when Deborah was all "sorry I thought you were somebody else" in the middle of the ocean and at night no less! This was one of those special moments that make me love this show. 

[QQQQ]

Did Deborah seek out a vet for her dog before looking for Ava?

 

[MicheleinPhilly]

FINALLY! I could have wept not because I found anything particularly emotional but just because I feel like this show has been treading water all season. 

I absolutely hated Deborah during the interview with Ruby. She was being deliberately cruel and completely humiliated Ava for what? If I was Ava, I would have peaced out the second the director yelled "We're clear!" once the taping finished. 

I knew as soon as Josefina mentioned the doggy door it would come into play. My heart was pounding when she was searching for the pup. Deborah, you need a new, SOLID, door immediately. 

This episode should be Hannah Einbinder's Emmy submission. I think it was her best episode ever. 

[chaifan]

Great episode!  But I'll just start with this...

THAT was Rosie O'Donnell???  I only recognized her from her voice.  And even then, I kept thinking, no, that can't be her.  I had to google it to confirm.

Lots of good bits in this episode, from the popping of the balloons to the swigging of the champagne.  Ava and Deborah both hitting lows.  I really had no idea if they were going to kill off the dog or not.  I mean, that's pretty dark, but this show has had some dark moments.  But going from Deborah saving the dog to her crusade to save Ava was fabulous.  

Ava's make over...  years ago I was in one of the major department stores.  I was passing the makeup section, and there was some "famous" makeup artist to the stars that was there.  I had the time, I figured, oh hell, why not?  I've never been a big makeup kind of girl, but thought it would be fun.  I told them "fresh", "minimal", and gave them this scenario "First date, Sunday brunch, outdoor patio".  When I finally saw the end result, I had to really keep myself from screaming.  I looked like a pumpkin!  (I'm naturally very pale.)  I drove home very carefully, so afraid I'd get into a car accident and die looking like that.

[slowpoked]

17 hours ago, yesferatu said:

I actually laughed out loud when Deborah was all "sorry I thought you were somebody else" in the middle of the ocean and at night no less! This was one of those special moments that make me love this show. 

And before that, Deborah was like “Ava, don’t go into the ocean! YOU CAN’T SWIM!!!” That was also LOL moment for me. And like you said, what makes this show special. They always throw easter eggs from previous seasons.

I also really like when Ava ranted about catching the janitor jerking off but that she didn’t want to report him because he’s most likely not getting paid a living wage. Still true to herself, even when raging mad! 

[maddie965]

5 hours ago, QQQQ said:

Did Deborah seek out a vet for her dog before looking for Ava?

 

Was the dog hurt? I thought Deborah had rescued him before any damage was done, but now I'm not so sure.

[aghst]

I'm sure Deborah would not have left the dog if it needed care.

She'd have rushed it to the vet but she felt urgency also about finding Ava, who sacrificed a lot to work with her again, as this episode reminded us with the re-appearance of Ruby.

 

 

[QQQQ]

To me, it looked like the coyote definitely got a hold of the dog. At the very least, I would have gone to the vet's for a thorough exam.

Perhaps Deborah is trained to assess for torn ligaments, broken bones, and other internal injuries.

Edited May 11 by QQQQ

[sskrill]

If they had killed Barry I would have been out forever.  My cousins idiot neighbor would leave their dog door open all night. Of course a coyote got their chihuahua one night. He chased it across the desert in his underwear. Got her back but the damage was done.

I'm glad they're finally speaking but Deborah was out of character. Maybe just because she was emotionally spent, but we'd never see her beg anyone for anything.

The makeup was great - it didn't look that bad but it was definitely a clubbing look not a work look. 

I don't even know what dish Mrs Table ordered.  And Merrill is an awful actress.

I missed DJ. "oh God no, I meant Josefina"

[txhorns79]

8 hours ago, maddie965 said:

Was the dog hurt? I thought Deborah had rescued him before any damage was done, but now I'm not so sure.

I think the dog was more frightened than anything else.  Deborah did have her hands going through his fur to check that he was okay.  I presume if she had seen wounds or noticed blood, the vet would have been there immediately.  

 

2 minutes ago, sskrill said:

I missed DJ. "oh God no, I meant Josefina"

Josefina is the person you'd want during labor.  She's practical and can get things done.  Deborah would do what she did at DJ's NA meeting, and make it all about Deborah. 

[iMonrey]

On 5/9/2025 at 9:30 AM, Francie said:

I've had to head canon it that Deborah assessed Ava's state of mind and made a calculated decision to overstate her contribution in order to get her to return on the spot. 

I didn't feel like it was manipulative. I think Rosie O'Donnell really reminded her how she got to where she is. She was a washed-up Vegas performer before hiring Ava. It's because of Ava she reinvented herself and became such a sensation she finally got her dream job of hosting Late Night. It may not be technically true that Ava is her voice, but Ava is definitely the reason she's where she is now.

12 hours ago, sskrill said:

If they had killed Barry I would have been out forever. 

Me too. Up until the end of this episode, this season has been a relentless bummer. That would have been the last straw for me.

12 hours ago, sskrill said:

I don't even know what dish Mrs Table ordered.  

Branzino. It's a Euroopean sea bass. I only know that because I watch Below Deck, LOL.

[Irlandesa]

9 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Branzino. It's a Euroopean sea bass. I only know that because I watch Below Deck, LOL.

It's the thing on cooking shows as well.  It's served whole, skin on and everything.

I do think that's the thing that made me laugh the most this season. That they ordered a 75 dollar meal "for the table" instead of just some good sandwiches.

[chaifan]

52 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I do think that's the thing that made me laugh the most this season. That they ordered a 75 dollar meal "for the table" instead of just some good sandwiches.

And I assume that's why it pushed Ava over the edge.  It's not like they ordered an extra order of fries or mozz sticks "for the table".  

But...  I have to wonder...  I'm pretty sure Ava would have done the same thing if she were in their position.  

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

I think Rosie O'Donnell really reminded her how she got to where she is. She was a washed-up Vegas performer before hiring Ava. It's because of Ava she reinvented herself and became such a sensation she finally got her dream job of hosting Late Night.

Totally agree with this.  That was the entire purpose of the scene with Rosie.  (Still can't believe that was Rosie O'D!)  Ava is the voice of Deborah that Deborah wasn't able to bring forward on her own.  

The old Las Vegas Deborah would have never even been considered for this job.  Ava isn't the 100% reason Deborah has Late Night, but it's clear Deborah wouldn't have this job if it weren't for Ava.  

[chitowngirl]

I wish all this happened in episode 3 or 4, not 6. Now we are just have 4 episodes left of “peace” before the next wrench in their lives.

[sskrill]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I didn't feel like it was manipulative. I think Rosie O'Donnell really reminded her how she got to where she is. She was a washed-up Vegas performer before hiring Ava. It's because of Ava she reinvented herself and became such a sensation she finally got her dream job of hosting Late Night. It may not be technically true that Ava is her voice, but Ava is definitely the reason she's where she is now.

Agree. There are only 2 people Deborah would have listened to: Rosie or Ellen, and Ellen isn't exactly loved these days.  If Marcus, DJ, Josefina, Jimmy, or Damien said anything of the sort she would have fired them.  And Rosie said it well - Deborah suddenly "learned how to dunk" upping her game. 

Its a yin-and-yang. Left to her own devices Deborah is going to return to "the same old hacky shit", but Ava helps her be better. 

Are they good enough together to be successful at late night? Guess we'll see.

[Francie]

On 5/9/2025 at 1:10 PM, maddie965 said:

Ok, time to go back then!

For me, it's time to check out. 

I can't wrap my head around a world where the evil of demoting someone from a No. 1 to No. 2 position (and you know Deborah would overpay Ava just to make up for that) and lying about being behind it is worse than taking personal information from a person whom you know has trouble opening up and connecting to people because her trust was violated in the most horrible way at a vulnerable time for her, and then twisting that personal information and threatening to lie about it in an endeavor to humiliate that person on a nationwide scale and take away from her the dream she held on to for decades, and then, on top of that, manhandling that person and forcing her through a semi-public humiliation ritual. I get others have no problem with the blackmail, but I can't stomach what Ava has justified herself doing. I held on for a few episodes, and let it marinate. Ultimately, I'm so disgusted by it, and by the show seemingly be totally fine with it, that I'm out. 

I think I see the handwriting on the wall, based on Deborah's groveling at the end of this episode. Ava still hasn't forgiven her, and Deborah still has more sacrifices she must make to settle accounts with Ava. Meanwhile, the gravity of what Ava did goes unaddressed. 

The other, far more minor, thing that's bugged me about this season is how much road is needed for these jokes. When Deborah went into the ocean, all I could think was "take off that damn coat first!" That weight could drown you (don't believe me google brides killed by water photo ops or Natalie Wood). I couldn't fathom why they didn't have Deborah take is off and leave it on the shore. But, if she had done that, Ava couldn't have said "Thanks for ruining your second favorite fur." Another example was the ludicrously long hair style Deborah wears in the cooking segment. I mean, it's a cooking segment. But if they didn't have her wear ludicrously long hair, she wouldn't have accidently dipped it in the jam, and we wouldn't have that ... bit? joke? I'm not sure what to call that. Whatever you call it, it wasn't funny. And it wasn't earned. 

I'm worn out. I loved this show seasons 1 to 3, and thought it was getting stronger every season. I think that's the only reason I've stuck it out this long. 

On 5/11/2025 at 10:30 AM, iMonrey said:

I didn't feel like it was manipulative. I think Rosie O'Donnell really reminded her how she got to where she is. She was a washed-up Vegas performer before hiring Ava. It's because of Ava she reinvented herself and became such a sensation she finally got her dream job of hosting Late Night. It may not be technically true that Ava is her voice, but Ava is definitely the reason she's where she is now.

 

The show likes to have it both ways about Deborah. On the one hand, yes, Deborah couldn't get a new residency on the strip in season 2. On the other hand, she wouldn't told Marty her numbers were strong, if they weren't. And she's worth well over $100 million to have a $1.69 offer not even cause her to blink. Deborah's supposedly beloved in Middle America, and she supposedly knows what they love. The issue was that she wasn't challenging herself or having fun, going on auto pilot. 

The most we've actually seen Ava do is tell Deborah she should write about her life. It was Deborah who, herself, found "the click" that made the material sing. Ava offers jokes, but Deborah is more often than not tweaking and refining. It was Deborah who recognized the material was worthy of a special and not a showcase. Again, I think the "you *are* my voice" was a horrible overstatement and discredit to herself. Ava's a help. She's not the driving force behind Deborah's recent success. Her idea alone would not have gotten Deborah to the one hour of content she ultimately put together. 

By that logic, Deborah is responsible for Ava's success. Deborah giving Ava that job when she was unhireable allowed Ava to stay in show business. Without Deborah, Ava would be living in the guest bedroom with the litter box in her mother's house in Massachusetts. 

I'll catch you all after episode 10, maybe, if I hear through the grapevine things turned around!

 

Edited Monday at 03:35 PM by Francie
grammar

[khyber]

Chekhov's dog door.  This was the first episode of this season that I actually enjoyed. 

[ofmd]

I decided after 12 minutes that I didn't want to watch anymore. Ava being cringe and a loser everyone dunks on, Deborah being mean - have they always been this one-note? Anyway, it just isn't funny for me anymore.

Oh well, we had a nice 3 seasons, I guess.

[Ilovepie]

On 5/10/2025 at 7:53 PM, sskrill said:

I missed DJ. "oh God no, I meant Josefina"

Me too - that was the perfect amount of her and the perfect line! I thought it was funny that Deborah actually agreed with her.

Ava's meltdown over a fancy fish was hilarious. Hannah did a great job - the lead up to it was perfect. I bet she needed a throat lozenge and some tea with lemon after that screaming fit!

[MicheleinPhilly]

On 5/11/2025 at 11:41 AM, Irlandesa said:

It's the thing on cooking shows as well.  It's served whole, skin on and everything.

I do think that's the thing that made me laugh the most this season. That they ordered a 75 dollar meal "for the table" instead of just some good sandwiches.

On the post-show chat that they do with the creators, Lucia (I think it was) said that when she was a writer on Parks & Rec, they would order something "for the table" but it was always something like fries or chips and guac. 

Setting aside the whole expense of it, a whole branzino is a very specific taste to just casually throw in there "for the table." 

"I'm really enjoying this BLT but some branzino would really hit the spot." 

Loved the ridiculousness of the entire bit. 

[astrohip]

5 hours ago, ofmd said:

I decided after 12 minutes that I didn't want to watch anymore. Ava being cringe and a loser everyone dunks on, Deborah being mean - have they always been this one-note? Anyway, it just isn't funny for me anymore.

Oh well, we had a nice 3 seasons, I guess.

Should have kept watching. I felt similar to you, but then, in minute 13, the entire tone changed.

Seriously, go back and finish, and see if by the end of the episode you feel different.

[iMonrey]

16 hours ago, astrohip said:

Should have kept watching. I felt similar to you, but then, in minute 13, the entire tone changed.

Seriously, go back and finish, and see if by the end of the episode you feel different.

I concur. If nothing else give the full episode a chance then decide on the rest of the season. I had one foot out the door too, but now I'm curious to see where it goes from here.

[aghst]

I think this season has been just as strong as previous seasons.

But I'd never bail half way through after 3 very stellar seasons.

Tough crowd here.

[Ilovepie]

On 5/13/2025 at 10:07 AM, ofmd said:

Deborah being mean - have they always been this one-note?

Do you not remember Deborah driving off and leaving Ava in the desert? They have both traded insults and damage on each other since season 1, episode 1. There have been moments of kindness like Deborah being there for Ava this episode, or Ava u-turning and going to Deborah in the hospital, but ultimately, both are selfish and self-serving and eventually one turns on the other. I would say looking at the series as a whole, it's gone both ways. 

I just found this series a month or so ago, so I have been watching pretty continuously from episode 1, and I do not see any difference tonally or in their relationship from day one. I will say, I miss Las Vegas and Marcus. I'm not sure how long Deborah's night show stint will last, but because this is "Hacks", I would say it's going to be short lived....

[Night Cheese]

2 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Do you not remember Deborah driving off and leaving Ava in the desert? They have both traded insults and damage on each other since season 1, episode 1. There have been moments of kindness like Deborah being there for Ava this episode, or Ava u-turning and going to Deborah in the hospital, but ultimately, both are selfish and self-serving and eventually one turns on the other. I would say looking at the series as a whole, it's gone both ways. 

I think this is a great characterization of them. Neither are characters who are easy to sympathize with, save for some rare moments. They're not particularly good people either, save for some rare moments, mostly with each other, but occasionally with others too.

[WinonaDeer]

On 5/13/2025 at 12:07 PM, ofmd said:

I decided after 12 minutes that I didn't want to watch anymore. Ava being cringe and a loser everyone dunks on, Deborah being mean - have they always been this one-note? Anyway, it just isn't funny for me anymore.

Oh well, we had a nice 3 seasons, I guess.

 

4 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Do you not remember Deborah driving off and leaving Ava in the desert? They have both traded insults and damage on each other since season 1, episode 1.

I thought the moment in the desert is the exact opposite of being one-note. It revealed a lot about Deborah. Her fame and access got her the helicopter. The whole "talented is the mimumim" came from that moment. And being left there -- and she was not 'abandoned' there to her own devices -- AAA, or whatever equivalent, had been called, and was coming. Yes, it's hot and boring, but all Ava had to do was sit and wait. It also revealed a lot about Ava-- it's there that she came up with the idea of going back and not taking 'no' for an answer in acquiring that pepper shaker. 

 

4 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

just found this series a month or so ago, so I have been watching pretty continuously from episode 1, and I do not see any difference tonally or in their relationship from day one. I will say, I miss Las Vegas and Marcus. I'm not sure how long Deborah's night show stint will last, but because this is "Hacks", I would say it's going to be short lived....

I wonder if, having watching it all so fast together, you haven't had the time to let the show marinate and experience these characters over the years. Having watched it since 2021, I see a stark contrast. This season is not the show I remember, and if this season was the first, I wouldn't have made it to that season's end, let alone to the second. 

Regardless, I've had maybe about five minutes of enjoyment or interest this season. I can't think of a single joke that's made me laugh. The only scene that springs to mind that I truly enjoyed was the one between Marcus and Deborah where they came to terms with his leaving.

I really, really loved this show, so this season's decline has bummed me out. I haven't had an experience like this since the Game of Shows that I shall not name. I can only hope that the penultimate seasons of each series is the only commonality, and that Hacks rebounds in S5. 

It seems the only ones who brought their "A" game this season are the costumer, Kathleen Felix-Hager, and the actress paying Stacey, Michaela Watkins. 

Edited Thursday at 01:27 AM by WinonaDeer
added a comment about Ava

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 5/13/2025 at 4:59 PM, MicheleinPhilly said:

On the post-show chat that they do with the creators, Lucia (I think it was) said that when she was a writer on Parks & Rec, they would order something "for the table" but it was always something like fries or chips and guac. 

Setting aside the whole expense of it, a whole branzino is a very specific taste to just casually throw in there "for the table." 

"I'm really enjoying this BLT but some branzino would really hit the spot." 

Loved the ridiculousness of the entire bit. 

On 5/11/2025 at 12:44 PM, chaifan said:

And I assume that's why it pushed Ava over the edge.  It's not like they ordered an extra order of fries or mozz sticks "for the table".  

But...  I have to wonder...  I'm pretty sure Ava would have done the same thing if she were in their position.  

Maybe she would have ordered lobster rolls, but definitely not branzino; I hear it doesn't travel well.

On 5/13/2025 at 2:14 PM, Ilovepie said:

Ava's meltdown over a fancy fish was hilarious. Hannah did a great job - the lead up to it was perfect. I bet she needed a throat lozenge and some tea with lemon after that screaming fit!

You should watch the after-show for more details and outtakes from this scene.

 

[maddie965]

On 5/12/2025 at 11:20 AM, Francie said:

For me, it's time to check out. 

I can't wrap my head around a world where the evil of demoting someone from a No. 1 to No. 2 position (and you know Deborah would overpay Ava just to make up for that) and lying about being behind it is worse than taking personal information from a person whom you know has trouble opening up and connecting to people because her trust was violated in the most horrible way at a vulnerable time for her, and then twisting that personal information and threatening to lie about it in an endeavor to humiliate that person on a nationwide scale and take away from her the dream she held on to for decades, and then, on top of that, manhandling that person and forcing her through a semi-public humiliation ritual. I get others have no problem with the blackmail, but I can't stomach what Ava has justified herself doing. I held on for a few episodes, and let it marinate. Ultimately, I'm so disgusted by it, and by the show seemingly be totally fine with it, that I'm out. 

I think I see the handwriting on the wall, based on Deborah's groveling at the end of this episode. Ava still hasn't forgiven her, and Deborah still has more sacrifices she must make to settle accounts with Ava. Meanwhile, the gravity of what Ava did goes unaddressed. 

The other, far more minor, thing that's bugged me about this season is how much road is needed for these jokes. When Deborah went into the ocean, all I could think was "take off that damn coat first!" That weight could drown you (don't believe me google brides killed by water photo ops or Natalie Wood). I couldn't fathom why they didn't have Deborah take is off and leave it on the shore. But, if she had done that, Ava couldn't have said "Thanks for ruining your second favorite fur." Another example was the ludicrously long hair style Deborah wears in the cooking segment. I mean, it's a cooking segment. But if they didn't have her wear ludicrously long hair, she wouldn't have accidently dipped it in the jam, and we wouldn't have that ... bit? joke? I'm not sure what to call that. Whatever you call it, it wasn't funny. And it wasn't earned. 

I'm worn out. I loved this show seasons 1 to 3, and thought it was getting stronger every season. I think that's the only reason I've stuck it out this long. 

The show likes to have it both ways about Deborah. On the one hand, yes, Deborah couldn't get a new residency on the strip in season 2. On the other hand, she wouldn't told Marty her numbers were strong, if they weren't. And she's worth well over $100 million to have a $1.69 offer not even cause her to blink. Deborah's supposedly beloved in Middle America, and she supposedly knows what they love. The issue was that she wasn't challenging herself or having fun, going on auto pilot. 

The most we've actually seen Ava do is tell Deborah she should write about her life. It was Deborah who, herself, found "the click" that made the material sing. Ava offers jokes, but Deborah is more often than not tweaking and refining. It was Deborah who recognized the material was worthy of a special and not a showcase. Again, I think the "you *are* my voice" was a horrible overstatement and discredit to herself. Ava's a help. She's not the driving force behind Deborah's recent success. Her idea alone would not have gotten Deborah to the one hour of content she ultimately put together. 

By that logic, Deborah is responsible for Ava's success. Deborah giving Ava that job when she was unhireable allowed Ava to stay in show business. Without Deborah, Ava would be living in the guest bedroom with the litter box in her mother's house in Massachusetts. 

I'll catch you all after episode 10, maybe, if I hear through the grapevine things turned around!

 

I understand and respect your decision, but I have faith the show will do the right thing and make Ava apologize profusely to Deborah. And then you will be able to come back, hopefully.

Edited Thursday at 04:33 AM by maddie965

[ofmd]

16 hours ago, aghst said:

I think this season has been just as strong as previous seasons.

But I'd never bail half way through after 3 very stellar seasons.

Tough crowd here.

I'm happy for anyone who enjoys it.

I'm confused about the framing as "bailing." I don't view watching a show as a commitment on my side, like joining the army, adopting a dog, or entering a relationship. (Even though I do like to use relationship metaphors for it, admittedly! Then again, if you leave a relationship that doesn't work for you anymore, I wouldn't call that bailing, either.)

So I will watch it as long as it brings me joy/ entertainment etc. I will certainly take one or two bad eps in a stride, but at some point, I'm done and will quit before I start to actively hate the show. (Funny that someone upthread mentioned GOT. For me, its deterioration began long before the final season, but I kept watching it and ended up hate-watching before I finally quit. I don't like hate-watching.)

 

[Ilovepie]

14 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

You should watch the after-show for more details and outtakes from this scene.

I did - it was pretty funny. "Hannah reached an octave I don't think we've heard before" 🤣

[MicheleinPhilly]

A few years ago I was watching one of those Variety roundtables with the Emmy nominees for Supporting Actress in a Comedy. One of the other women was talking about a scene and dialing it back or softening their reaction or something to that effect.

Hannah E. piped up and said, "For me it's the opposite. They're always telling me 'Hannah honey, you got to give us something.'"

The way I cackled. 

[peachmangosteen]

On 5/14/2025 at 12:09 PM, aghst said:

I think this season has been just as strong as previous seasons.

I agree. The first 2 episodes were outstanding imo. I wasn't as into 3 and 4 but they were still great. 5, 6, and 7 were fantastic. And I suspect the rest of the season will be just a good.