Chit-Chat: The Feels

[Soapy Goddess]

1 minute ago, Annber03 said:

No, it's fragility, plain and simple. Anyone who gets that upset about transgender people in sports, it's because they have very fragile, narrow ideas of what it means to be a man or a woman. 

And I respectfully disagree. You can't begin to know what's on anyone's mind at any given time.

[Annber03]

If their attitudes towards transgender people result in them supporting policies that deny transgender people the same kinds of privilges and rights people who aren't transgender have, then yes, I think that reveals their mindset pretty well.

[Spartan Girl]

People that laugh at someone calling Puerto Rico an island of garbage, then get bent out of shape when they think they’re being called garbage is the very definition of white fragility.

[Enigma X]

15 minutes ago, meep.meep said:

At least you guys don't have to work for him.  Schedule F is headed my way.

Unfortunately, I do and for one of the departments he is itching to be free of. Le sigh!

[Anela]

17 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

It's more fact than fragility. Unless I'm missing the first winner? 🤷‍♀️

But then can change their gender.

I have friends who have trans kids, who will be affected by this. I also have a couple of adult trans friends, one in Scotland, so she's okay. But the other one? 

8 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Except it wasn't someone from the left who went after him. It was the culmination of his own hateful, violent rhetoric and easy access to guns coming back to bite him. The same shooter who went after him in the first attempt killed a man at the same rally and he showed absolutely zero compassion for him and never spoke of him. He literally doesn't care if his own supporters die (we saw that firsthand during COVID, when so many of his supporters were getting sick and dying after attenting his maskless rallies). 

So no. Not victimized. Every president has threats against them. We've literally had four presidents in our history who were actually killed. This is, unfortunately, nothing new, and he's not some special or unique case here. 

Exactly. they were conservatives, not democrats. We didn't try to take him out. 

[Soapy Goddess]

2 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

People that laugh at someone calling Puerto Rico an island of garbage, then get bent out of shape when they think they’re being called garbage is the very definition of white fragility.

It was said by a comic who usually does roasts. Under pressure, he admitted it was in poor taste via his apology. I've heard worse from insult comics. 

[Enigma X]

9 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Except it wasn't someone from the left who went after him. It was the culmination of his own hateful, violent rhetoric and easy access to guns coming back to bite him.

And I know I sound like a QAnon kook here but I question at least one of those attempts as being a stage gone awry. 

[Salacious Kitty]

2 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Is this supposed to be the opposite of childless cat ladies? 😉

Is tradwife better?

[bluegirl147]

4 minutes ago, Is Everyone Gone said:

I'm also the most worried about RFK Jr getting a top job in the administration. Unfortunately, the amount of crunchy granola moms who seem to have drunk the anti-vax kool-aid is disturbing, and it will only get worse with RFK Jr.

And the media is covering this like it's normal.  

It's not just crunchy granola moms.  I have a former friend who was an LPN.  She quit nursing because she became anti vax during covid.  She now does Door Dash. 

[tearknee]

1 hour ago, lookeyloo said:

Sure - why not. Except it is on the basis of their views, not on something they were born as.  Views can be changed.  I'm sure we all have biases or prejudices for one thing or another.  It doesn't have to be on ethnicity, race, gender, religion, etc.

Religion isn't something you are born as.

[Is Everyone Gone]

4 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

And the media is covering this like it's normal.  

It's not just crunchy granola moms.  I have a former friend who was an LPN.  She quit nursing because she became anti vax during covid.  She now does Door Dash. 

This is an OR nurse. She quit to become an energy healer.

[Soapy Goddess]

3 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I do not subscribe to biological "men are inherently stronger than women" rhetoric, no. I'm also not even one who cares for sports - I'm just looking at this debate from the outside and thinking it's just beyond stupid. Every athlete has some kind of advantage that others don't - some will be stronger than others, some will run faster than others, some will jump higher than others, etc. If we're going to start getting all bent out of shape about "fairness"* only when transgener people enter the scene, you'll excuse me for calling that out for the transparent bigoted bullshit that it is.

(To say nothing of how people will bend over backwards to defend and continue to support athletes who took steroids to benefit them in a sport. If they can excuse that, but draw the line at transgender people because of "fairness", I'm gonna call BS on that.)

I think people need to get over themselves and let women, ANY women, compete against each other, and let men, ANY men, compete against each other. 

*We're also not even going to get into how the same people who complain about "participation trophy culture" suddenly now want special categories when it comes to transgender people participating in a sport. 

Bottom line, the attitude towards transgender people in sports is based in transphobia and deeply backwards and misguided ideas of what makes men and women who they are. Plain and simple. 

While strength might be subjective, why is it that most women turn to their husbands when they can't seem to open a jar of (insert noun)?

Trophy culture is a catalyst for a lot angst. It's sad to think that a huge population of kids will never know how to deal with defeat. 

8 minutes ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Is tradwife better?

It was a rhetorical question.

[Ohiopirate02]

20 minutes ago, Is Everyone Gone said:

I'm also the most worried about RFK Jr getting a top job in the administration. Unfortunately, the amount of crunchy granola moms who seem to have drunk the anti-vax kool-aid is disturbing, and it will only get worse with RFK Jr.

I do have to wonder how long that particular relationship will continue. Trump is fickle, and could drop RFK Jr. at any moment between now and January. Just look at how he used Chris Christie. 

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I do have to wonder how long that particular relationship will continue. Trump is fickle, and could drop RFK Jr. at any moment between now and January. Just look at how he used Chris Christie. 

That's another thing that kills me about this. All these people thinking he'll be loyal to them...are they new? Were they in a coma the past decade (or longer, if they've been following his career since it began decades ago)? He'll dump them the moment they've outlived thier usefulness. 

[lookeyloo]

9 minutes ago, tearknee said:

Religion isn't something you are born as.

Then I stand corrected on that. 

[Anela]

8 minutes ago, tearknee said:

Religion isn't something you are born as.

It's something you can be born into. 

4 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I can think of plenty of women who don't do that, so no, it's not "most women". You are taking a specfic scenario, one that does not apply to women on a general level, and trying to make some larger point about biology with it. That's not how it works. 

You mean like the guy who's about to become president again, who literally encouraged his supporters to storm the Capitol because he couldn't deal with the fact he lost? 

Sure wish someone had taught him how to accept defeat. 

Yes!! Crikey, he said he would only accept the results, if he thought they were fair. Which means that he stopped complaining about fraud, as soon as it looked really good for him. 

And people ask him if he will accept the results, as if "no" is an acceptable answer, if he had lost. 

4 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I do have to wonder how long that particular relationship will continue. Trump is fickle, and could drop RFK Jr. at any moment between now and January. Just look at how he used Chris Christie. 

He also campaigned with Elon Musk, instead of his VP, and made remarks about choosing a really dull running mate, so they wouldn't try to get rid of you. 

[bluegirl147]

3 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I do have to wonder how long that particular relationship will continue. Trump is fickle, and could drop RFK Jr. at any moment between now and January. Just look at how he used Chris Christie. 

RFK scares me but Elon Musk is just as scary.   He is like a very poorly written big bad.

[tearknee]

1 minute ago, Anela said:

It's something you can be born into. 

Forced upon by family or community or culture, perhaps. Not inherent.

 

[Soapy Goddess]

7 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I can think of plenty of women who don't do that, so no, it's not "most women". You are taking a specfic scenario, one that does not apply to women on a general level, and trying to make some larger point about biology with it. That's not how it works. 

You mean like the guy who's about to become president again, who literally encouraged his supporters to storm the Capitol because he couldn't deal with the fact he lost? 

Sure wish someone had taught him how to accept defeat. 

Isn't your scenario specific too? It's how people try to make a point. By trying to relate an issue to something less offensive and easier to understand. Especially when it appears there will never be a meeting of the minds. 

I'm not here to be lectured on "how it works". If that's your only point, I'd rather not continue to spin my wheels.

[kittykat]

Trump will use Patty and Selma Kennedy Jr. Long enough until the evil fluoride is out of water then toss him aside.

12 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Trophy culture is a catalyst for a lot angst. It's sad to think that a huge population of kids will never know how to deal with defeat. 

Trophy culture is not to be blamed on today's kids.  There are plenty of schools teaching children about growth mindsets and learning from failure.  Coddled children in this world are nothing new no matter what hacks like Jonathan Haight says. I went to grade school in the 80s/90s and spoiled brats existed then.  There was just no TikTok or Facebook to complain about them back then. 

Angst amongst today's children can be attributed to a fragile economy and their parents having enough money to make ends meet and going to school hoping they're not going to get shot up that day because the incoming administration has decided that guns have more rights than a child or a woman.

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Isn't your scenario specific too? It's how people try to make a point. By trying to relate an issue to something less offensive and easier to understand. Especially when it appears there will never be a meeting of the minds. 

I'm not here to be lectured on "how it works". If that's your only point, I'd rather not continue to spin my wheels.

There's never going to be a meeting of the minds on this issue, because therei s no basis in truth to the anti-transgender mindset. Transgender people are not a threat to anyone's way of life, good god. All the fearmongering around them is just that, fearmongering. And it's based in people's incredibly insecure and backwards views about how men and women "should be" and "should look". 

And yes, people do use specific examples to make broader points, but they also usually try and make sure those examples are based in, like, facts, and not based off some ridiculously outdated and offensive stereotypes about women and men. 

2 minutes ago, kittykat said:

Trophy culture is not to be blamed on today's kids.  There are plenty of schools teaching children about growth mindsets and learning from failure.  Coddled children in this world are nothing new no matter what hacks like Jonathan Haight says. I went to grade school in the 80s/90s and spoiled brats existed then.  There was just no TikTok or Facebook to complain about them back then. 

For real, that's the biggest reason the "participation trophy culture" argument has always fallen flat with me. I remember this being a thing when I was in school, too, back in the '90s, and the kids were never the ones demanding special trophies. Sure, they might've been sad when they lost a game or didn't get an award or whatever, but they cried for a bit and then they got over it.

No, it was the ADULTS who kept wanting to give out these participation trophies, because they either didn't wnat any kids to feel left out or, more commonly, they were the parents having absolute meltdowns because "How dare you say my child isn't perfect/isn't the best athlete/etc.?!?!" and raised holy hell until the school bent to their will. 

So if we're going to blame anyone for this culture, blame the adults who expect to live vicariously through their children and can't handle it when their kids don't turn out to be complete mini-mes in that way. 

[Soapy Goddess]

3 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

There's never going to be a meeting of the minds on this issue, because therei s no basis in truth to the anti-transgender mindset. Transgender people are not a threat to anyone's way of life, good god. All the fearmongering around them is just that, fearmongering. And it's based in people's incredibly insecure and backwards views about how men and women "should be" and "should look". 

And yes, people do use specific examples to make broader points, but they also usually try and make sure those examples are based in, like, facts, and not based off some ridiculously outdated and offensive stereotypes about women and men. 

For the record (and this is my last comment on the subject), I personally do NOT fear any segment of LGBTQ+.  My only point is how it relates to sports (which btw not a huge sports fanatic either) and how some people might feel that pitting a bio male against a bio women is completely unfair. 

IOW, it's about competition, not fear. If you can't understand that's how some people view the issue, then there's really no point in any further discussion.

[PRgal]

I hate it when "reality" is thrown around because "reality" means something different to each and every one of us.  Reality for me is worried that my neurofibromatosis nodules can turn malignant and I'll need further treatment, or that the treatment doesn't work.  I have a young child.  Reality is needing to protect my son from bullies at school (okay, he's not a victim right now, but any child can be a bully's victim, just as any child can become a bully), make sure he's well-fed, educated, clothed and housed.  And that even though I can afford groceries and other necessities, that I still need to make sure everything is properly budgeted and that I don't overspend on "extras."  In my 30s, I'd spend a lot on fun things for me (which was primarily clothing and shoes).  Not now.  It's his stuff.  I just cleaned out his closet because I have been lazy we still had things he grew out of two years ago!  Then I realized that he needed a few extra pieces because he was on the verge of growing out of what we CURRENTLY have.  Yep, did a spree just for him.  And because I have a sizeable investment portfolio that investment specifically in his RESP (registered education savings plan.  Basically a post-secondary plan that kids can't touch until they're 18), I'm worried that we (he?) could end up losing money, at least temporarily due to economic policy/tariffs and its impact on the global community.  School is only going to get more expensive.  Right now, we are in a good place, but who knows what will happen in 2025 (I'm a little skeptical of those who say that the markets will continue to grow through next year)?  That's my reality.  Maybe it sounds a bit privileged to some of you, but it's what I'm experiencing.  I could go on, especially when it comes to me trying to DISCOURAGE the stigmatization of mental health care in my ancestral cultural community (and trust me, they're in the dark ages compared to Anglo-Protestant Canadian society). Confucianism and filial piety are still a big deal for many. 

[tearknee]

what is "toxic" is subjective as well.

[Annber03]

10 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

For the record (and this is my last comment on the subject), I personally do NOT fear any segment of LGBTQ+.  My only point is how it relates to sports (which btw not a huge sports fanatic either) and how some people might feel that pitting a bio male against a bio women is completely unfair. 

IOW, it's about competition, not fear. If you can't understand that's how some people view the issue, then there's really no point in any further discussion.

I was speaking on a general level with my "fear" comment. 

And no, I don't understand the competition element, either. The whole argument in general is going to be absurd to me no matter which angle people are coming at it from. 

[AstridM]

19 hours ago, Anela said:

My state lost Sherrod Brown. We really need to find a way to leave this place. 

Ohio here, also. I am devastated.

[bluegirl147]

I'm in a neighboring state and shocked Brown lost.  Some things just don't make sense.

[Annber03]

24 minutes ago, AstridM said:

Ohio here, also. I am devastated.

I'm in Iowa. Imagine how I felt about the results here after that poll from earlier in the week. I hesitated to get my hopes up too high, mind, but damn, I wanted to believe... 

We went for Obama twice. We were one of the earliest states to legalize same-sex marriage. My family was living in Colorado at that time, and I remember my dad excitedy coming home from work with a news article he'd printed out about same-sex marriage being legalized here and showing it to me. I remember feeling so proud of, and so proud to be from, my home state in that moment, and I was so quick to defend it against those who were like, "Iowa? Really?"

And now...this. 

Edited November 7 by Annber03

[marina to]

12 hours ago, SeanBug said:

I hate to quote Louis CK but he said something that is so true. 

Men are afraid of women laughing at them, women are afraid men will kill them. 

It's a Margaret Atwood quote. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, bluegirl147 said:

I have a former friend who was an LPN.  She quit nursing because she became anti vax during covid.  She now does Door Dash. 

Phew!

[Enigma X]

I am hearing there is currently a protest back home in Chicago that was planned for a ceasefire in Palestine protest before Trump's win, but many anti-Trump protest chants are happening and signs against his re-election are in hand. Proud of my city!

[FilmTVGeek80]

3 hours ago, Palimelon said:

Interestingly enough, most of the ire seems to be directed at transgender women athletes...you rarely hear cases about transgender male athletes.

This is always something I bring up when these debates spring up on Twitter. You have people like JK Rowling constantly whining about how women are being replaced by transwomen. They seem to conveniently forget that transmen exist, too. And, in either case, it's such a small minority that I can't understand how this became such a raging issue for some people. Like that idiot Megyn Kelly said the other day, it was her main issue. Why?! How is this really affecting your life?

2 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Because they can't win against biological males.

https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/06/22/patricio-manuel-trans-boxer-wins-fight-cisgender-rival/

[Gemma Violet]

22 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

A roast comedian made the garbage reference. He just spoofed the "joke" (which I agree was in very poor taste).

22 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

He embellished on a stupid comedian's comment. He can take a joke. We may not like it, but that's what happened.

I'm a little late as I just discovered this thread, but I just wanted to say that, regarding the above, trump calling this country a garbage can happened before the Madison Square Garden comedian's joke.  It starts at the :13 mark: 

 

Edited November 7 by Gemma Violet

[partofme]

I am so depressed.  I’m ashamed to be an American and I’m especially ashamed to be a white female knowing most of us voted for that felonious rapist, it bothers me that people see me and think I might have voted for him and I’m suspicious of everyone I see wondering if they’re responsible for this nightmare.   The only consolation I have is that none of my immediate family support him.  I really didn’t see this coming and am so shocked today.   Things are going to get bad for everyone.  I wish I had a way to leave the country.  

[nokat]

1 minute ago, partofme said:

I am so depressed.  I’m ashamed to be an American and I’m especially ashamed to be a white female knowing most of us voted for that felonious rapist, it bothers me that people see me and think I might have voted for him and I’m suspicious of everyone I see wondering if they’re responsible for this nightmare.   The only consolation I have is that none of my immediate family support him.  I really didn’t see this coming and am so shocked today.   Things are going to get bad for everyone.  I wish I had a way to leave the country.  

I'm feeling the same. I did not vote for the felon. I too am ashamed at America.

[Annber03]

16 minutes ago, partofme said:

I am so depressed.  I’m ashamed to be an American and I’m especially ashamed to be a white female knowing most of us voted for that felonious rapist, it bothers me that people see me and think I might have voted for him and I’m suspicious of everyone I see wondering if they’re responsible for this nightmare.   The only consolation I have is that none of my immediate family support him.  I really didn’t see this coming and am so shocked today.   Things are going to get bad for everyone.  I wish I had a way to leave the country.  

White woman here as well, and I echo every sentiment of this. Holy shit, do better, white women of America. 

My mom and sister don't support him, either. I feel for anyone who's the lone one out in their family trying to reconcile their loved ones voting for this creep. 

[Bookworm 1979]

34 minutes ago, partofme said:

Things are going to get bad for everyone.  I wish I had a way to leave the country.  

I don't think anywhere is safe right now. I'm in Canada, and we have our own little Trump wannabe who will most likely get elected next year. It's scary.

[Kimboweena]

NM

Edited November 7 by Kimboweena

[Is Everyone Gone]

One of the thing that disgusts me so much is just how RACIST the MAGAs on my FB feed are. Today one lady was saying she didn't understand why politicians cared at all about black people, as they were only 13% of the population. It just churns my stomach.

[FilmTVGeek80]

I feel sick, gutted, frightened, angry as all hell. It feels like we all took the worst time travel trip, and we're back in 2016, but it's so much worse. Back in 2015, I had no real opinion of the bloated carcass, but I thought it was a joke that he was running and no one serious would vote for him. That changed because of a conversation with my MIL. I'll never forget it. We were at a Chinese buffet. The topic got around to politics, and she said she'd consider voting for him. I almost spit out my water. While the conversation stayed with me, I thought of it more as her being an outlier, especially since it was in such early stages. Then the Comey thing happened, and I became more fearful. Still, while I wasn't cocky on election night, I didn't think he would win. When he did, it was devastating. Later, I tried to console myself by thinking at least he would surround himself with some competent people so it won't be a total shit show. That was more or less the case. It was still a shit show, but it could have been so much worse.

But by 2020 - even before that - it was clear that orange humanoid was a narcissistic sociopath who had no business being in charge of the welfare of a houseplant, let alone a whole country - it didn't matter who was on his staff. Before him, I didn't believe that true evil existed. I thought most people have some redeeming qualities - at least one. That sentient trash bag has none. The relief and happiness I felt when he lost was immeasurable. I thought, "Now, we don't have to deal with him anymore."

Now, we're here. January 6th happened. Still, people voted for him. He was found liable for sexual assault.  More than half of voters still thought, "That incoherent draft dodger is who I want to have the nuclear codes." He was convicted on 34 FELONY COUNTS. Still, people decided he was best to lead us. So he didn't have to admit his prediction was wrong; he altered a hurricane map with a sharpie and tried to pretend it was totally normal. Enough people thought, stable genius - competent leader. He laughed about an elderly man getting brutally assaulted. Over 70 million thought he was best to represent our country and its values. He accused Haitian people - my family's culture - of being animals who eat cats and dogs. When he found out those people were being targeted with death threats, he shrugged. That microphone assaulter is who you've basically crowned King (thanks to the Supreme Court.) I could literally go on for days listing the atrocious things he's said and done that somehow didn't make a damn bit of difference.

Why? Most of the reasons I've seen are pure fantasy. He's going to fix the economy, inflation, border, etc.? Even if I believed that how is any of that more important than making sure the leader of the free world is SANE? But congrats, Drumpf supporters. I hope you enjoy your cheaper freaking eggs.  I hope that extra change in your pocket is worth it when the next generation is dumber than a box of rocks because he got rid of the Department of Education. Hope it's worth it when the brain worm roommate he puts in charge of all of our health leads to the next polio outbreak or the next pandemic. Can't wait to hear that wingnut with no soul tell us to shove magic beans up our butts because he heard someone say that's an actual thing that works. I hope it's worth it to tell yourself how pro-life you are as women continue to die because their doctors have to wait around to see if they're close enough to death to give them any freaking aid. I hope it's worth it when the country DOESN'T become the crime-free Utopia that he's promised after he rounds up all those scary Black and Brown people committing all the crimes. 

I so much want to wash my hands of all his supporters. I want to brush them all off as evil. And some of them truly are. So, screw those cult enthusiasts with no brains. But that's not all of them. Unfortunately, I know some of those voters, and I know they're not evil. I wrestle with how that's possible, but I know it is. Their reasons will never, ever, ever be something I understand. I have absolutely zero respect for them, but I don't hate them. And, if it weren't for the fact that I and everyone else who didn't vote for that festering boil would suffer, I would just sit back and wait for karma to hit them square in the face. I won't be sad when it happens though - not for them.

I hope we can survive this. I hope we can right this wrong, somehow. I truly do. I want to believe it's a possibility, but I'm too tired and disillusioned to even pretend that it's even close to a 50/50 shot.

29 minutes ago, Kimboweena said:

Case in point, Kathy Griffin.

There's no real comparison. Griffin made a joke about one specific person - and she paid the price for it. That idiot at MSG denigrated an entire freaking country. You can claim it didn't have anything to do with the bloated carcass-in-chief, but his team vetted that guy. They knew about that joke and still approved it. The garbage man cosplayer could have apologized for it or taken any culpability, but he never does. Reason one billion and seventy, he has no business being in office.

[partofme]

4 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Back in 2015, I had no real opinion of the bloated carcass

I’ve been aware of him since childhood.  I grew up in the nyc suburbs and my family spent a lot of time in Atlantic City and I remember when he was publicly caught cheating on Ivana with Marla Maples by the tabloids.   I actually saw him and Marla on of all things an escalator in one of his casinos that he ended up filing for bankruptcy SIX freaking times on.  And still I didn’t really have an opinion of him until the Apprentice when it quickly became obvious despite attempts by the show to show him in the best light that he was a phony, narcissistic, misogynistic, racist creep.  I naively never thought he’d be taken seriously when he first ran.  He never hides how hateful and evil he is so I have a very low opinion of anyone who votes for him. 

[Annber03]

27 minutes ago, Is Everyone Gone said:

One of the thing that disgusts me so much is just how RACIST the MAGAs on my FB feed are. Today one lady was saying she didn't understand why politicians cared at all about black people, as they were only 13% of the population. It just churns my stomach.

They've been emboldened. He can literally say and do whatever the fuck he wants without any real seriosu consequences, so they can, too. 

[Ancaster]

14 hours ago, SeanBug said:

 

Taxes enable the government to give you money, and regulations keep companies from poisoning the water, selling food that could be contaminated, gas cheaper, etc. 

 

Unless you live in Flint, Michigan . . . .

9 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

In 2016 an ESL coworker who did clerical work in both the college library where we worked and at the public library said she planned to vote for Trump "because I think he's funny." Another coworker took time to explain things to her, and she arrived at a different conclusion. But I suspect she is an atypical, quick-minded, openhearted exception to those who don't have the political experience to make the choices that really align with their beliefs and goals. 

 

 

I worked with a very intelligent young woman back when Obama was first running.  She was not intelligent about how she got her news, which was from her mother, who got hers from people like Rush Limbaugh.  I took it upon myself to educate her - for example, she was astonished to learn Obama was not actually a Moslem (not that she was necessarily prejudiced against that), and other oft-repeated lies.

It didn't help that her husband was an ignorant knucklehead who only supported his wife working because he couldn't hold down a job for, literally, more than a few months before being fired.

Edited November 7 by Ancaster

[Quickbeam]

I am a transplant to the Midwest but grew up in north Jersey. All my family has been hammering me for updates from my battleground state. IMO from where I sit you could see this coming miles away. My family is horrified. I’m not. I think there are large swaths of the Democratic Party which insulate themselves from the day to day of the flyover zone. It feels like coastal elitism. I think a stronger candidate would have beaten Trump. But here we are. 

[nokat]

4 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

They've been emboldened. He can literally say and do whatever the fuck he wants without any real seriosu consequences, so they can, too. 

This is it. The hateful people are emboldened. 

1 minute ago, Quickbeam said:

I think a stronger candidate would have beaten Trump. But here we are. 

You mean not a woman, and black.

[Quickbeam]

1 minute ago, nokat said:

This is it. The hateful people are emboldened. 

You mean not a woman, and black.

No. I mean a stronger candidate. 

[Makai]

21 minutes ago, nokat said:

You mean not a woman, and black.

I fucking hate it, but it is unfortunately true. Way too many people rejected her ability solely based on her race and gender. The number of times that I saw someone claim she was unqualified made me want to repeatedly bang my head against a wall. She had been elected to all three branches of the government and had worked at the local, state and federal level but was called unqualified. Her accomplishments were diminished with claims that she earned them “on her knees”. People insisted she had no policy even though she released far more policy details than the guy with concepts of a plan. 

[Annber03]

2 minutes ago, Makai said:

Her accomplishments were diminished with claims that she earned them “on her knees”. 

And the fact people have the nerve to say that while shrugging off Trump's numerous sexual assault accusations and his affair with a porn star just...really says it all. 

[marina to]

27 minutes ago, Makai said:

I fucking hate it, but it is unfortunately true. Way too many people rejected her ability solely based on her race and gender. The number of times that I saw someone claim she was unqualified made me want to repeatedly bang my head against a wall. She had been elected to all three branches of the government and had worked at the local, state and federal level but was called unqualified. Her accomplishments were diminished with claims that she earned them “on her knees”. People insisted she had no policy even though she released far more policy details than the guy with concepts of a plan. 

This drove me freaking insane. Screw this bullshit about her being a weak candidate. If it were a man with her resume and oratory skills no one would be saying it. I'm tired of being nice about it. I entered the workforce in the 80s and I can't believe we're still dealing with this bs. It's sexism, pure and simple.

[Annber03]

38 minutes ago, marina to said:

This drove me freaking insane. Screw this bullshit about her being a weak candidate. If it were a man with her resume and oratory skills no one would be saying it. I'm tired of being nice about it. I entered the workforce in the 80s and I can't believe we're still dealing with this bs. It's sexism, pure and simple.

I have seen comments in the past where people have complained about when Hilary Clinton ran, and how they were turned off by her in part because she "acted entitled" to the job.

Yes. How dare an intelligent woman with years of experience and knowledge of the job she was running for dare to feel like she's entitled to win the presidency over a guy who had no experience and no understanding of the job he was applying for (and no interest in understanding it besides). 

Nobody ever says that men like the Kennedys, or the Bushes, or so on, "acted entitled" to the presidency. No, their fathers/brothers had the job, so they just naturally assumed it was their birthright that they get the job, too. That's okay, I guess. No entitlement there. 

I'm just so tired of this shit.