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Laverne & Shirley - General Discussion

januaryman

By januaryman
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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

5 hours ago, Elizabeth Anne said:

I remember preferring this show to Happy Days, until they both went seriously downhill and I stopped watching.  In the case of Laverne and Shirley it was when they moved to California.  There were a few good episodes then, but not many.  I also hated the way they wrote Shirley out of the show.

I hated the way her departure was executed - her leaving in just a few hours while Laverne was out at a dance seemed silly. At least they should have had it happen while Laverne was away for the weekend. But the end game was always that one of them would get married and they’d no longer live together.

I do think Shirley’s farewell note is sweet where she says it’s hard to say good bye but she knows it’s not really goodbye, just happy trails until we meet again.

I think the show as a whole would play better in reruns if they had ended after five seasons. Even in season 5 (the last Milwaukee), it was starting to decline and they seemed too old to be living together anymore. They did the two part Army episode and the plan was that every fourth episode would be an Army show (they wound up in the reserves). But that really went nowhere.

I still love the first couple of years, before Frank became so prominent (he was best in small doses) and where we saw more of the girls’ high school friends like Rosie and Terri and other members of the Angora Debs. I liked when we saw rivals for the girls (Big Rosie or Karen Klopton for Laverne, and Carmine’s girlfriend Lucille for Shirley).

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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

After Cindy got pregnant, the original idea was that Shirley would marry an Army medic and quickly get deployed to a place where Shirley couldn’t go. And Shirley would find herself pregnant and continuing living with Laverne even after the baby came. But when Cindy left suddenly after the first two episodes of the final season, they had to pivot quickly.

I read a suggestion where someone said they should have had them both get married and wind up living next door to each other. That would have been better than what we got.

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GHScorpiosRule

GHScorpiosRule

19 hours ago, Egg McMuffin said:

After Cindy got pregnant, the original idea was that Shirley would marry an Army medic and quickly get deployed to a place where Shirley couldn’t go. And Shirley would find herself pregnant and continuing living with Laverne even after the baby came. But when Cindy left suddenly after the first two episodes of the final season, they had to pivot quickly.

I read a suggestion where someone said they should have had them both get married and wind up living next door to each other. That would have been better than what we got.

The reason they changed it was because the network expected her to sign the contract where she had to work until the day of delivery. She refused to do that. So they wrote her out. It was a SHIT move. Who knows if Shirley and Carmine would have ended up together? They should have.

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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

From what I remember, she understandably wanted a reduced schedule and Paramount wanted to reduce her salary. That would never fly today. But I also saw the two of them interviewed maybe about 10 years ago, and they talked about her departure. And Penny said in that gruff voice of hers, “It was the husband!”, referring to Cindy’s then-husband Bill Hudson. Cindy laughed and said, “I was in love!” I got the impression that he got involved with the negotiations or was making demands and Paramount didn’t want to deal with him.

I don’t get why MeTV only rolls L&S out on special occasions. It should be a regular part of the schedule. They’ve had the rights for years, but rarely air it.

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GHScorpiosRule

GHScorpiosRule

12 minutes ago, Egg McMuffin said:

From what I remember, she understandably wanted a reduced schedule and Paramount wanted to reduce her salary. That would never fly today. But I also saw the two of them interviewed maybe about 10 years ago, and they talked about her departure. And Penny said in that gruff voice of hers, “It was the husband!”, referring to Cindy’s then-husband Bill Hudson. Cindy laughed and said, “I was in love!” I got the impression that he got involved with the negotiations or was making demands and Paramount didn’t want to deal with him.

I don’t get why MeTV only rolls L&S out on special occasions. It should be a regular part of the schedule. They’ve had the rights for years, but rarely air it.

The article I posted in the milestone thread quoted Cindy about that; and she stated they wanted her to work up until the delivery date.

I think MeTV+ is airing the show. Last month I stumbled upon it and it was in the last season.

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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

20 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

The article I posted in the milestone thread quoted Cindy about that; and she stated they wanted her to work up until the delivery date.

That’s Cindy’s side of the story, which naturally presents her in the most positive light. I would have liked to have heard from Garry Marshall. But Cindy didn’t object in the interview when Penny blamed Cindy’s ex-husband. And at the time, the press reported that Paramount was trying to reduce Cindy’s salary, which I believe.

penbrat

penbrat

On 2/1/2023 at 8:27 PM, Egg McMuffin said:

That’s Cindy’s side of the story, which naturally presents her in the most positive light. I would have liked to have heard from Garry Marshall. But Cindy didn’t object in the interview when Penny blamed Cindy’s ex-husband. And at the time, the press reported that Paramount was trying to reduce Cindy’s salary, which I believe.

Who knows.   Bottom line for me is:  1.  Happy memories of this show from my childhood 2.  It still makes me laugh to this day even though I have seen most eppys multiple times  3.   Penny and Cindy had some of the best chemistry ever on any tv show I've ever watched. 

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Yogisbooboo64

Yogisbooboo64

On 2/1/2023 at 11:54 AM, chessiegal said:

MeTV is going to be showing 4 L&V shows on Sunday, February 5 starting at 4 pm ET.

And Decades will be showing an all-day marathon tomorrow, with an Addams Family marathon (RIP Lisa Loring) on Sunday.

As for MeTV, I wonder which of the four they will show....I'd love these Shirley eppies:

Supermarket Sweep (Shirley and Laverne tried to get carts of food but wound up with Fish Sticks and Scooterpies)

Playing the Roxy (Shirley bumps her head and wakes up thinking she's a stripper named Roxy)

Call Me a Taxi (The girls are temporarily laid off and work as taxi dancers)

Laverne and Shirley Meet Fabian (Self-explanatory, lol)

There are so many but these never fail to crack me up.  I also loved Shirley's scream.

Still feels like a gut punch hearing of Cindy's passing.

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chessiegal

chessiegal

17 minutes ago, Yogisbooboo64 said:

And Decades will be showing an all-day marathon tomorrow, with an Addams Family marathon (RIP Lisa Loring) on Sunday.

As for MeTV, I wonder which of the four they will show....I'd love these Shirley eppies:

Supermarket Sweep (Shirley and Laverne tried to get carts of food but wound up with Fish Sticks and Scooterpies)

Playing the Roxy (Shirley bumps her head and wakes up thinking she's a stripper named Roxy)

Call Me a Taxi (The girls are temporarily laid off and work as taxi dancers)

Laverne and Shirley Meet Fabian (Self-explanatory, lol)

There are so many but these never fail to crack me up.  I also loved Shirley's scream.

Still feels like a gut punch hearing of Cindy's passing.

From the Retro Channel thread:

Quote

Specifically, these....

4P: #23: "Excuse Me, May I Cut In?"
4:30: #29: "Guinea Pigs"
5P: #77: "Supermarket Sweep"
5:30: #112: "The Diner"

 

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mmecorday

mmecorday

Quote

Friday at 08:24 PM

  On 2/3/2023 at 6:57 PM, chessiegal said:

From the Retro Channel thread:

 

I love The Diner episode! Betty please...

I used to love this episode, but now that I've waited tables it gives me a lot of anxiety! 

The Guinea Pigs episode is easily one of the funniest of the whole series. I feel for poor exhausted Laverne, though. 

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SiouxB

SiouxB

One of my favorite  episodes ever (and I actually think I would put this as one of my favorite episodes of any show of all time) was when Laverne and Shirley met Fabian

I remember the first time I saw it... I laughed for hours !! Never got old and oh my God Fabian was such a cutie...The way Shirley cried when she met him and then the screams were so funny !

Rest in peace Cindy and Penny...

♥️♥️

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Blergh

Blergh

I never got why they didn't just have Shirley and Carmine get married and have Miss Williams's pregnancy be the result?

Could it be that things had gotten SO stormy with Miss Williams and the Marshalls by the start of the season that they weren't sure she was going to stay (and they had no problems with Mr. Mekka) so they didn't want to chance Shirley suddenly leaving?

 What Miss Williams left out of the narrative was that she'd been battling with the Marshalls  before she got married/in the family way (e.g. counting numbers of lines,etc).

Well, I felt sorry for the poor soul who played Shirley's husband who not only had to spend the whole 'wedding' completely wrapped in bandages and didn't utter a word but never got ANY credit whatsoever!

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fishcakes

fishcakes

20 hours ago, Blergh said:

What Miss Williams left out of the narrative was that she'd been battling with the Marshalls  before she got married/in the family way (e.g. counting numbers of lines,etc).

I was just a kid at the time, but their arguments were public knowledge during the early seasons and it started before the show even began airing. I've forgotten most of the details but the one that sticks in my head is that they battled over who would get first billing and eventually compromised with staggered opening credits. Their names are onscreen at the same time, Penny's name is first, but Cindy's name is higher. I understand why it was an issue to each of them, but as a regular person who is content when people at work call me by my correct name, it seems like such a dumb thing.

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Blergh

Blergh

9 hours ago, fishcakes said:

I was just a kid at the time, but their arguments were public knowledge during the early seasons and it started before the show even began airing. I've forgotten most of the details but the one that sticks in my head is that they battled over who would get first billing and eventually compromised with staggered opening credits. Their names are onscreen at the same time, Penny's name is first, but Cindy's name is higher. I understand why it was an issue to each of them, but as a regular person who is content when people at work call me by my correct name, it seems like such a dumb thing.

I agree. Yes, it's great they reconciled and renewed their friendship in the last part of Miss Marshall's life .

However, I just thought it a bit much that, despite the onset battling having been public knowledge from way back (including fellow performers and crew who did what they could to do their jobs while avoiding the crossfire),Miss Williams increasingly spun it as though she'd been a perfectly sweet colleague to all until she got married and pregnant then had no choice but to passively let her then-spouse totally derail her position. IOW, I would have liked it had she just said before her passing ' My own two-bit complaints and my ego as a performer contributed to the tension that led to my parting ways with the show and I shouldn't have acted like I was Lady Guinevere and  while my now-ex was my Sir Launcelot.'

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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

Yeah, I find Cindy’s whole “they wanted me to work on the same day I delivered” explanation to be disingenuous. I just don’t buy it - I think it was more complicated than that. I’m sure Paramount’s position of paying her less for a reduced schedule was a factor. And I wouldn’t blame her at all for walking away over a salary cut.

There’s also a story where Cindy plowed through the Paramount gate in the early years of the show because the guard at the gate didn’t recognize her, and she was pissed. She was well known to have a temper.

I’m a big fan of Cindy’s, just for context. I think she was a very talented comic actress who should have gotten some Emmy recognition for her talents.

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Blergh

Blergh

(edited)
On 2/23/2023 at 11:29 AM, Egg McMuffin said:

Yeah, I find Cindy’s whole “they wanted me to work on the same day I delivered” explanation to be disingenuous. I just don’t buy it - I think it was more complicated than that. I’m sure Paramount’s position of paying her less for a reduced schedule was a factor. And I wouldn’t blame her at all for walking away over a salary cut.

There’s also a story where Cindy plowed through the Paramount gate in the early years of the show because the guard at the gate didn’t recognize her, and she was pissed. She was well known to have a temper.

I’m a big fan of Cindy’s, just for context. I think she was a very talented comic actress who should have gotten some Emmy recognition for her talents.

I agree  that she had excellent comic talent and timing(and wish she had attempted more dramatic roles like The Conversation).

Even a 'my parting ways with the show wasn't entirely other folks' doing' would have been better.I read her autobio and it was weird how she made no mention of how she and Bill Hudson met, them dating or her decision to marry him (despite him having recently gone through a rather public and acrimonious split with Goldie Hawn) before she abruptly dropped the bit of her having gotten married and becoming pregnant leading to the split with the show (and no mention of them later splitting).

Edited by Blergh
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Egg McMuffin

Egg McMuffin

Never noticed that before!

In one of the brewery talent shows, both Penny and Cindy’s mothers show up. Penny’s mom does a dance with her. Penny’s mom ran a dancing school in real life which is why Penny was such a good dancer. Carmine’s dance studio, Marjorie Ward’s, was named after her. Cindy’s mother sings “Pennies from Heaven” and throws real pennies around. The two mothers are crossed billed in the closing credits, just like their daughters.

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fishcakes

fishcakes

2 hours ago, andidante said:

I have asked for the complete DVD set for Christmas. Such talent on this show!

I got the DVD set a few years ago; it was a lot of fun to rewatch. It was also the first time I saw all of the later seasons. I'd seen a few of the Hollywood episodes here and there over the years, but not the whole thing. As bad a rap as the later seasons get, I thought they were pretty good. The early Milwaukee seasons were better, but overall I don't think the L&S decline was nearly as steep as the one on Happy Days after that show started to focus on Joanie and Chachi and their friends.

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andidante

andidante

11 hours ago, fishcakes said:

I got the DVD set a few years ago; it was a lot of fun to rewatch. It was also the first time I saw all of the later seasons. I'd seen a few of the Hollywood episodes here and there over the years, but not the whole thing. As bad a rap as the later seasons get, I thought they were pretty good. The early Milwaukee seasons were better, but overall I don't think the L&S decline was nearly as steep as the one on Happy Days after that show started to focus on Joanie and Chachi and their friends.

I think once Richie left it did go downhill quite a bit. I liked the L&S Hollywood episodes too. I still think Carmine and Shirley should have been end game!

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DXD526

DXD526

(edited)

Going to LA was such a big change, I think some fans were put off by it. But there were some classic episodes: the gang goes on The Dating Game; L&S are extras in a movie; L&S get drunk at Bardwells eating rum candy; L&S crash a hippie party, inadvertently get stoned and almost get married to a couple of hippies (played by Eric Idle and Peter Noone!). Classic stuff!

Edited by DXD526
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andidante

andidante

3 hours ago, Snow Apple said:

I like the California episodes fine even after Shirley left. But even with the decline of the writing, the only thing I hated was when Edna left Frank. It didn't make sense. I wish they'd just have her off stage "busy at work" or "visiting family." Remember her daughter Amy? She and Lenny were cute.

I hated that they did that to Edna and Frank. It didn't make any sense! Her daughter was in one episode and never mentioned again!

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Dimity

Dimity

I hardly saw any of the California episodes but is my memory right in saying in the opening scene they always had Laverne and Shirley either kissing, or at least touching, a poster of the Beatles?  I mean I guess this was to set the time frame of the show at this point but these gals were at least 30 by now.  Do many women in their 30s still put up posters of teen heart throbs?

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