Current Plots Discussion II: Discussing Today's Episode and Current Storylines

[brisbydog]

1 hour ago, Rodney said:

Belle's never met Liz or Marie before?  Crazy!

Could someone please tell me the bad blood between Liz and Marie?  I'm really curious as to why they wasted no time going at it with each other.  It had to have been bad for that to happen.

Liz was sleeping with Marie's husband and she shot her. Accidentally 

[Nique]

2 hours ago, Rodney said:

Belle's never met Liz or Marie before?  Crazy!

Could someone please tell me the bad blood between Liz and Marie?  I'm really curious as to why they wasted no time going at it with each other.  It had to have been bad for that to happen.

Belle wasn't born or conceived till 92/93 so both Liz and Marie are before her time. The characters were never around or seen through both Kirsten and Martha's tenure of Belle's till now for Douglas/Bill's memorial and death. While Belle has been aged through both actresses portrayal, her birthday being pushed back, the characters never crossed paths. You probably are thinking of Carrie or Sami both who were little kids & pre teens in the 80s

[DisneyBoy]

They explained it in the episode.

[Nique]

Thanks DisneyBoy 😊 I haven't watched 

[CanaryFan98]

This funeral made me realize that besides the glaring absences of Hope, Chad, JJ and lesser extent Claire.

Has anyone mentioned Mike at all in this? If they have I must've missed it. Julie is also his cousin and Doug was around for that whole paternity drama of Mike's. Yet he's MIA.

[norcalgal]

Was Doug and Julie’s marriage the longest on screen marriage where there was no infidelity by either person? If so, how rare for a soap opera!

[CanaryFan98]

10 minutes ago, norcalgal said:

Was Doug and Julie’s marriage the longest on screen marriage where there was no infidelity by either person? If so, how rare for a soap opera!

There was Robert/Holly on GH and probably others but that may be right. I agree it's rare. I do find it refreshing when soaps can still write compelling couples without going to predictable affair route. 

In some cases it's needed but in others it seems trite.

[Artsda]

The montage was wonderful and the service. 

I could have done without Paulina.  

 

[DisneyBoy]

2 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Has anyone mentioned Mike at all in this? If they have I must've missed it.

Huh. Such a good point.

45 minutes ago, Artsda said:

The montage was wonderful and the service. 

I could have done without Paulina.  

 

I love how she barely said or did anything and you're still like "get her the hell outta here!!!"

😆😂🤣😆😂

Ahhhh, I get it.

...is the day ever coming where we never have to worry anymore about shitty, deeply unlikable characters popping up?

Please lord deliver us.

 

Edit: I'm still emotional about Always. Maybe the best moment in the last decade of the show. Deeply touching.

Edited December 4 by DisneyBoy

[CanaryFan98]

This just reinforces why Horton men are afterthoughts on this show. Mike was around for the Doug/Julie years( with a lot of different actors). He would have wanted to know. I mean even when Alice passed they at least showed Jennifer telling Mike onscreen but he was in the hospital at the time so he couldn’t be at the funeral. 

[BuckeyeLou]

Such a beautiful & emotional show today!      Susan was so brave but I cried when it was just her standing in front of Doug's photo.  I really wish Hope had been there, also Claire.  And it might have been nice for Kate to be there with Roman. The actress portraying Ciara looked like she was crying real tears.  When Liz sang "ALways" and everyone joined in, I was crying.  The flashbacks were lovely to see.  When family members are gathered together are the episodes I enjoy the most.  Congrats to the show's cast & production crew for a well-done show today.

[SouthernChick]

Did Doug and Paulina actually interact? I mean, besides that time Doug grabbed Paulina’s butt when he was possessed and Paulina said, “Doug Williams. Did you grab my ass”?

[salvame]

Still thinking about how good today's show was. It was enough that Gloria Loring was back, but then, she actually sang! There were noticeable absences, but I could have done without Paulina's presence. I think part of what made Doug/Bill's memorial so moving was knowing that they were the same loving couple in real life as they were on screen. I'm betting SSH had a big say in how things played out. Her doing the eulogy was perfect, though I couldn't help but wonder what parts were Doug and what parts were Bill. 

I was around for Tom, Alice, Caroline, and Stephano, the latter never really got a proper send off, but I don't remember any of the memorials. Kudos to SSH - she is truly a class act!

[SanDiegoInExile]

Doug goosed Paulina as they waited for the elevator at University Hospital.

Although we didn't get scenes, they did share grandchildren.  Doug spent a lot of time (off screen) with his (great)(step)grandchildren Jules and Carver.  

Also, Paulina is the current Mayor of Salem.  Doug was Mayor for many years.  

 

And although few of us admire Jackee's acting style, she is arguably the most well-known and famous cast member.  People have known her for decades.  And she does have a primetime Emmy.

[CanaryFan98]

54 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

Such a beautiful & emotional show today!      Susan was so brave but I cried when it was just her standing in front of Doug's photo.  I really wish Hope had been there, also Claire.  And it might have been nice for Kate to be there with Roman. The actress portraying Ciara looked like she was crying real tears.  When Liz sang "ALways" and everyone joined in, I was crying.  The flashbacks were lovely to see.  When family members are gathered together are the episodes I enjoy the most.  Congrats to the show's cast & production crew for a well-done show today.

I think they didn’t have Kate there given her history with the Hortons. Yes there’s Lucas but they don’t hate him like they do Kate. If anything I would have swapped Roman and Paulina for Chad and JJ. Or even Mike

56 minutes ago, SouthernChick said:

Did Doug and Paulina actually interact? I mean, besides that time Doug grabbed Paulina’s butt when he was possessed and Paulina said, “Doug Williams. Did you grab my ass”?

Yes at the twins christening he told her that he was at the time 95 years old. 

20 minutes ago, salvame said:

Still thinking about how good today's show was. It was enough that Gloria Loring was back, but then, she actually sang! There were noticeable absences, but I could have done without Paulina's presence. I think part of what made Doug/Bill's memorial so moving was knowing that they were the same loving couple in real life as they were on screen. I'm betting SSH had a big say in how things played out. Her doing the eulogy was perfect, though I couldn't help but wonder what parts were Doug and what parts were Bill. 

I was around for Tom, Alice, Caroline, and Stephano, the latter never really got a proper send off, but I don't remember any of the memorials. Kudos to SSH - she is truly a class act!

I remember Alice’s although it was really over weeks rather than a few days. Tom I don’t think I watched. Maybe it was on YT. Caroline had a wake she didn’t have a memorial. 
 

Stefano his victims were at the pub but it was more about Joe than Stefano tbh because they wouldn’t have come together otherwise 

[DisneyBoy]

1 hour ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I mean even when Alice passed they at least showed Jennifer telling Mike onscreen but he was in the hospital at the time so he couldn’t be at the funeral. 

Yes, there was a weird explanation for why he was absent yet present for that too...

They're weird about Mike.

54 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

The actress portraying Ciara looked like she was crying real tears.

She was. It was good to see.

16 minutes ago, SanDiegoInExile said:

And although few of us admire Jackee's acting style, she is arguably the most well-known and famous cast member.  People have known her for decades.  And she does have a primetime Emmy.

*long pause, followed by a cough*

👀

18 minutes ago, salvame said:

Stephano, the latter never really got a proper send off

You know, I hated Hope randomly shooting him,  but at least months later there was the memorial at the pub with flashbacks, and Hope's last encounter with his spirit at the cabin. That was good.

It was the rolling him up in a rug and tossing him into a building that blew up...followed by him being unearthed, moved and then impersonated by Steve that was messed-up and disrespectful. (Or Shane's brother - I forget his name). They just needed to stick to an ending in his case.

[CanaryFan98]

2 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

Yes, there was a weird explanation for why he was absent yet present for that too...

They're weird about Mike.

She was. It was good to see.

*long pause, followed by a cough*

👀

You know, I hated Hope randomly shooting him,  but at least months later there was the memorial at the pub with flashbacks, and Hope's last encounter with his spirit at the cabin. That was good.

It was the rolling him up in a rug and tossing him into a building that blew up...followed by him being unearthed, moved and then impersonated by Steve that was messed-up and disrespectful. (Or Shane's brother - I forget his name). They just needed to stick to an ending in his case.

It was Shane that impersonated him not Steve. I do think they should have had him actually die. Except I would have had Roman kill him instead of Hope. His life was destroyed by Stefano and it would have been full circle for Roman to end him for good 

[DisneyBoy]

Fully agree. That Rafe of all people was given screentime in that plot was galling.

And sadly Drake was left out because he was healing from an on-set accident.

I mean, Hope killing him might have been fine if it was earned. But she just incorrectly blamed him for Bo's death and popped off.

EDIT:

OMG - I'm watching black and white clips from 1965 and Marie is young and beautiful and JULIE'S AUNT!

I guess when they recast the original Julie into SSH, she was older than the previous actress? Because if Julie was a teen in 1965, she's mid-70s now...which would make Marie...what? 80s? 90s?!

She looks damn good! Hopefully they get some moments together tomorrow...

And Addie looks at least 40 in 1965, so I don't know how Doug was age appropriate for both her and her daughter...but I guess if he was roughly 15 years older than Julie, he could have also been 15 years younger than Addie. Was it stated back then that he was too young for Addie?

God this show has history...

Edited December 4 by DisneyBoy

[SanDiegoInExile]

DOOL and SORAS.  They go hand in hand.   Maggie is also Julie's aunt (via Mickey).  Maree Cheatham is 84, a few years older than Suzanne Rogers (81) and SSH (81).

Julie began as a high school student in 1965 and was aged into her 20s pretty quickly. Her son David was most famously portrayed by Richard Guthrie, who was just 9 years younger than SSH.  Even worse, her grandson Scotty was portrayed by Rick Hearst, who was born just 22 years after SSH.

It's not uncommon to be a grandmother at 46.  Except her grandson was 24.

[SouthernChick]

Shawn and Belle are divorcing. Shawn was the one who made the decision. His reasoning is their emotional distance over the last year. He said he has changed and not the same Shawn she fell in love with. Don’t know if I buy all of that, but I’m glad they are divorcing, for now anyway. I find Belle much more interesting with EJ.

[DisneyBoy]

3 hours ago, SanDiegoInExile said:

Maree Cheatham is 84, a few years older than Suzanne Rogers (81) and SSH (81).

No way! She did not look 84 to me!

3 hours ago, SanDiegoInExile said:

Julie began as a high school student in 1965 and was aged into her 20s pretty quickly. Her son David was most famously portrayed by Richard Guthrie, who was just 9 years younger than SSH.  Even worse, her grandson Scotty was portrayed by Rick Hearst, who was born just 22 years after SSH.

It's not uncommon to be a grandmother at 46.  Except her grandson was 24.

Wow. And here I thought the first few decades were free from crazy SORAS-ing...! Guess not. 

1 hour ago, SouthernChick said:

Shawn and Belle are divorcing. Shawn was the one who made the decision. His reasoning is their emotional distance over the last year. He said he has changed and not the same Shawn she fell in love with. Don’t know if I buy all of that, but I’m glad they are divorcing, for now anyway. I find Belle much more interesting with EJ.

Oh lord, they're doing an Ericole-style "I'm not good enough for you" breakup. And if emotionally insecure Shawn pushes Belle away, then she's in the clear to have other relationships.

Traditionally in his situation, Shawn would eventually get his mojo back and then fight for her and their love...but this Shawn? He's no fighter.

If he's saying he's "a different person now", boy did they miss the perfect opportunity to recast!

Edited December 4 by DisneyBoy

[SouthernChick]

2 hours ago, SouthernChick said:

Shawn was definitely in “woe is me” mode. 

[CanaryFan98]

2 hours ago, SouthernChick said:

Shawn and Belle are divorcing. Shawn was the one who made the decision. His reasoning is their emotional distance over the last year. He said he has changed and not the same Shawn she fell in love with. Don’t know if I buy all of that, but I’m glad they are divorcing, for now anyway. I find Belle much more interesting with EJ.

I am also glad Shawn got to leave her

[oceanblue]

The fact that Doug was younger than Addie was a huge deal in the 70s.   Doug and Julie were in love but Julie was married.   Doug was still a bad boy then.  Addie was no saint.  She got Doug to marry her for her money allegedly because she wanted to save her daughter's marriage.   But they did come to love each other which was awful for Julie to watch.   This was a very good story and I was riveted as an elementary school child.   And this was before vcr's when I actually had to stay home sick from school to watch.   I also loved the Doug Robert Rebecca storyline resulting in Dougie.  And I barely remember Steven Olsen and am totally uninterested in the amount of screen time he was given.  

 

Dougie III stole the necklace

[oceanblue]

FYI that's not a spoiler its an opinion based on the cut to new Doug's face as she mentioned the necklace.

I was posting while watching so now I feel stupid that they showed Dougie with the necklace.   

[brisbydog]

I enjoyed Steve Olson very much. And Marie more than I thought I would. Eli and Lani, Belle and Shawn, are both as dullsville as I remember them. Nice but bland and I would never tune in for either of them. Nice to see Jack and Jennifer but they barely got to interact with each other, and Steve and Jack were again in scenes together where if you did not know they were brothers with a fraught history, you'd have no idea. Liz was never a favorite of mine and this outing did not change that for me.

Returns are fine for special events, but the show has had no plot movements in a week, which is fine given the material. I remember both Liz and Marie but I don't want to add them permanently to an already bloated cast. We are swimming in Greenes right now, and just added Joy and Javi and now Doug Jr.. And Shelle are back. I don't want to go to seeing characters once a week each because the cast becomes too big. 

Leo, Alex, Johnny, Joy, Paulina, Rafe, Stephanie and Ava could vanish tomorrow and I wouldn't notice.

[ASpring1900]

2 hours ago, oceanblue said:

Dougie III

I thought the actor looked familiar so I looked it up-- Peyton Meyer played Taylor's (Meg Donnelly) boyfriend Trip on American Housewife.

[Rodney]

12 hours ago, SouthernChick said:

Did Doug and Paulina actually interact? I mean, besides that time Doug grabbed Paulina’s butt when he was possessed and Paulina said, “Doug Williams. Did you grab my ass”?

Yes, they interacted a few times, actually, and got along decently.  But I think that Paulina was there more in support of Julie, since they had a good relationship with each other.

[chediavolo]

15 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

Huh. Such a good point.

I love how she barely said or did anything and you're still like "get her the hell outta here!!!"

😆😂🤣😆😂

Ahhhh, I get it.

...is the day ever coming where we never have to worry anymore about shitty, deeply unlikable characters popping up?

Please lord deliver us.

 

Edit: I'm still emotional about Always. Maybe the best moment in the last decade of the show. Deeply touching.

It’s such a moving song. I remember the first time I heard it in “pride of the Yankees” watching it on TV when I was a little girl…so sad.

[chediavolo]

2 hours ago, ASpring1900 said:

I thought the actor looked familiar so I looked it up-- Peyton Meyer played Taylor's (Meg Donnelly) boyfriend Trip on American Housewife.

Wow. I didn’t recognize him

I love how some of these families are so wealthy that they have a crazy expensive diamond necklace locked away in a puzzle box for decades and it’s just like oh well yeah. I would’ve taken a sledge hammer to that thing  ages ago and paid off my mortgage, car  and credit card, bills! 

[SouthernChick]

I usually don’t like Leo, but I loved him calling out Lucas and Ciara for their dirty deeds. I like the Hortons, but they can be self-righteous 

[methodwriter85]

6 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

Wow. And here I thought the first few decades were free from crazy SORAS-ing...! Guess not. 

Hope herself was a fairly heavy SORAS- she was born on-screen in 1974, and was 18 years old by 1983. Child Hope was played by Natasha Ryan from '75 to '80, and then in '81 Hope was aged out to a teenager by Tammy Taylor. Kristen Alfonso took over as 17 going on 18 in 1983. I had a teacher in college go on a rant about "Little Hope suddenly being a teenager and getting married" at one point.

25 minutes ago, chediavolo said:

Wow. I didn’t recognize him

I love how some of these families are so wealthy that they have a crazy expensive diamond necklace locked away in a puzzle box for decades and it’s just like oh well yeah. I would’ve taken a sledge hammer to that thing  ages ago and paid off my mortgage, car  and credit card, bills! 

I think they're having him wear facial hair because they don't want us to think he and Tate are the same age. LOL 

[DisneyBoy]

42 minutes ago, SouthernChick said:

I usually don’t like Leo, but I loved him calling out Lucas and Ciara for their dirty deeds. I like the Hortons, but they can be self-righteous 

Yeah, even I can't deny that was a well-deserved remark. Did you see Ciara's face afterwards?

1 hour ago, chediavolo said:

I love how some of these families are so wealthy that they have a crazy expensive diamond necklace locked away in a puzzle box for decades and it’s just like oh well yeah. I would’ve taken a sledge hammer to that thing  ages ago and paid off my mortgage, car  and credit card, bills! 

I know, right? Their indifferent reaction (not even locking it up for safety?) explains why their kids all seem to barely work, much less have careers.

Edited December 4 by DisneyBoy

[Rodney]

I knew that Julie had a half-brother named Steven.  But I had no idea that Steven had his own son, Spencer.  Was he ever in Salem onscreen?

[DisneyBoy]

Did anyone else find it weird that they made Cass so ambiguous at the end there? Like...you just reunited with your sister after a long time, why sound so shady?

I didn't feel it was the right time to shoehorn in a new Doug either, much less make him a virtual carbon copy of the original in terms of his origin. Ron did with with Stefan O. and did it again here.

I mean, Julie, your family JUST had an imposer relative pop up out of the woodwork. Maybe don't let this guy you met at the cemetery move into your house?

Hope we see Liz and/or Marie again soon, they were great and away for far too long.

Shawn can just go for good, as far as I'm concerned. What a weak-ass breakup that was...and in the exact spot where they made up, if I remember correctly, some three years ago or something? What a mess.

Is it the same Shawn sticking around for the foreseeable future? Or will they finally recast?

[Rodney]

6 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

Is it the same Shawn sticking around for the foreseeable future? Or will they finally recast?

Same one, and I'm fine with that.  Brandon's done a fine job in the role, so I'm glad that he's staying as Shawn.

[Desperado]

Just finished watching the funeral episode. 😭😭

15 hours ago, salvame said:

Still thinking about how good today's show was. It was enough that Gloria Loring was back, but then, she actually sang! There were noticeable absences, but I could have done without Paulina's presence. I think part of what made Doug/Bill's memorial so moving was knowing that they were the same loving couple in real life as they were on screen. I'm betting SSH had a big say in how things played out. Her doing the eulogy was perfect, though I couldn't help but wonder what parts were Doug and what parts were Bill. 

There’s a video of Susan giving Bill’s eulogy and she was wearing the same scarf and red earrings and necklace. The whole Doug eulogy was pretty much Bill’s. The strength to do, months apart, two eulogies about the man she loved for so long, is immense. Glad the show gave her a lot of leeway in these episodes.

I also suspect it was also SSH’s idea to bring back Stephen Schnetzer. Maybe they remained friends IRL? Never saw him on Days but loved him as Cass on Another World so it was great to see him and it would be nice to see his character again.

Gloria Loring looked fabulous and starting Always acapella after being emotional (she whispered something to Susan the mics didn’t pic up), was something. Only ever heard that song on DOOL and it always brings tears to my eyes.

It was also nice to see Maree Cheatham whom I remember from Search for Tomorrow.

A very nostalgic soap episode.

(But the new guy can’t act so that was a sucky ending.)

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, Rodney said:

I knew that Julie had a half-brother named Steven.  But I had no idea that Steven had his own son, Spencer.  Was he ever in Salem onscreen?

I checked his Wiki and it doesn't mention any children. It seems unlikely he would have had any kids during his time in Salem because it doesn't seem like he had any notable pairings. I'm assuming his kid was born and raised in Europe.

[boes]

•  

2 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I checked his Wiki and it doesn't mention any children. It seems unlikely he would have had any kids during his time in Salem because it doesn't seem like he had any notable pairings. I'm assuming his kid was born and raised in Europe.

His son was only mentioned, never shown and from what I've read on the DOOL Fandom page, and maybe on SOC's character page, Julie mentioned his existence years ago.

Edited December 5 by boes

[BuckeyeLou]

The scene with Leo & Steven Olsen was very amusing to me, I would like the character of Steven to stay around longer and add some "fizz" to the social scene, but I guess it looks like Steven is leaving.  I was "LOL" when Leo asked 'if everybody in Salem are related?"  Jennifer(Missy) is looking very pretty.  I've liked Ciara during her visit.  I dont know what to think of Doug 3rd....

[Rodney]

1 hour ago, Desperado said:

Gloria Loring looked fabulous and starting Always acapella after being emotional (she whispered something to Susan the mics didn’t pic up), was something.

She said, "I love you" to her.  Susan's answer wasn't picked up, though.

[CanaryFan98]

7 hours ago, brisbydog said:

I enjoyed Steve Olson very much. And Marie more than I thought I would. Eli and Lani, Belle and Shawn, are both as dullsville as I remember them. Nice but bland and I would never tune in for either of them. Nice to see Jack and Jennifer but they barely got to interact with each other, and Steve and Jack were again in scenes together where if you did not know they were brothers with a fraught history, you'd have no idea. Liz was never a favorite of mine and this outing did not change that for me.

Returns are fine for special events, but the show has had no plot movements in a week, which is fine given the material. I remember both Liz and Marie but I don't want to add them permanently to an already bloated cast. We are swimming in Greenes right now, and just added Joy and Javi and now Doug Jr.. And Shelle are back. I don't want to go to seeing characters once a week each because the cast becomes too big. 

Leo, Alex, Johnny, Joy, Paulina, Rafe, Stephanie and Ava could vanish tomorrow and I wouldn't notice.

I don't know if people want Liz/Marie as regulars. I personally don't and I enjoy watching both characters but I do think it wouldn't hurt to have them visit more especially while their portrayers are still with us. 

Liz can take Doug's place in singing at funerals. Marie can show up for a Horton family event. It doesn't need to be more than that for me at least.

[DisneyBoy]

It is a little morbid to have someone only pop up for funerals. Of course it does happen in real life too that some people only surface in those situations.

[CanaryFan98]

59 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

It is a little morbid to have someone only pop up for funerals. Of course it does happen in real life too that some people only surface in those situations.

True but she probably could interact with Sarah (her daughter's half sister) and Julie while she visits. I would say Marlena too despite past history. However Liz doesn't really have much else to connect her to Salem like in years past I'm afraid.

Marie has at least a few Hortons.

[norcalgal]

4 hours ago, BuckeyeLou said:

I was "LOL" when Leo asked 'if everybody in Salem are related?" 

I viewed it as a wink/nudge to we viewers who have posted numerous times about the incestuous relationships on the show.  Maybe the writers read this forum!  😝

[salvame]

8 hours ago, Desperado said:

It was also nice to see Maree Cheatham whom I remember from Search for Tomorrow

This! I used to walk home from school for lunch just so I could watch Search with my mom! Mary Stewart will always be number one in my book!

[Rodney]

Whoa, there!  Hold on!  How are Hope and Steven brother and sister?

[Rodney]

So Claire missed the funeral because she got sick at the last minute.

Hey!  The pot doughnuts got a mention today, thanks to Ciara!

Surprised to see Shawn and Philip actually talking civilly for a change.  And that Shawn supports Philip getting Titan over Xander.

So is throwing one's sexual proclivities in one's face Xander's go-to when he doesn't get what he wants from a woman?  It's a step up from outright threatening or menacing them, at least.  But still . . . dude, that wasn't cool with Stephanie at all.  Still, it's good to see that there still are people who hate and/or distrust him, such as Shawn and Stephanie.

Hope with her kids?  Beautiful.

[brisbydog]

I mean, Xander is not wrong, Stephanie has slept with Chad, Alex and Everett, all while 'working' with them. Not nice to point it out but he has never been socially adept. I'm more worried that her PR company will be in serious trouble once it is discovered that she was helping Philip perpetuate a fraud that he was well aware of. She can say she didn't know but she will be tainted by it.

I have zero interest in Dougie the third, and he is on too much.

And less than zero interest in Belle and Shawn. Their latest marital break up was all off screen, so why would I care? I hope she makes a visit to EJ soon.

Hope with her kids was nice, I guess, but I dislike Ciara and find Shawn like watching paint dry. Her scenes with Jennifer though were wonderful, these two actresses have such a rapport going back 40 years.

[Rodney]

39 minutes ago, brisbydog said:

I have zero interest in Dougie the third, and he is on too much.

On too much?  He just started.