S06.E14: Tossing Salads and Spilling Tea (Bags)

byrd · October 12, 2021

On 10/11/2021 at 12:10 PM, RealReality said:

If Andy Cohen takes suggestions, I'd like him to give Mia a few live, on air questions about various business terms that a "boss bitch" such as herself should know. And I don't just want a dryly recited definition, I want her to explain how she uses it in her daily live as a "boss business bitch" Because I doubt that Gordon even let her "take over" his businesses. I think there is probably a manager who does most of the work and Gordon let her play "business barbie" for a day or two for the cameras.

LOL @ the bolded....happy accidents.

Not sure whats going on with Chris, he should just be himself. I think Dre and Eddie are kinda efforlessly cool and Chris may feel loud and awkward around them.

This. Exactly. I'm not even entirely sure Candace holds grudges, she just wants to have the last word. And I think this is far more common than people want to admit.

Ashley held a grudge, even after she and Candace "cleared the air" and admitted that the grudge was the basis for her writing the statement for Monique.

Are they? Its sad that anyone would risk their freedom over a common insult joke genre that often doesn't even require the joke teller to have ever met the mother in question.

This is as ridiculous as someone trying to beat up Triumph, the insult comedy dog. Or trying to beat up a comedian for razzing you if you sit in the front row of a comedy show. Beating someone up for a 'yo momma joke doesn't say anything great about that person, other than that they can't take a joke so maybe its best they not be out and about in the community.

Yes, they are , people don't play that stuff about their mommy's, depends on who you talking to . I got some cousins who are about' that life," who will beat your ass just because ,and don't give a dam about going to jail. Candiance needs to watch her mouth because you don't know people .. everybody wasn't raised the same.

drivethroo · October 12, 2021

2 minutes ago, byrd said:

Also when I was growing up, those" Yo Mommy" insults were grounds for a ass whoopin !

The only time I ever saw anyone get hit for making a "yo momma" joke was when one person was not bright enough, quick enough or sharp enough to come back with an equal retort so they had to resort to using their fists. Most of the time "yo momma" ended up being a roast battle and may the best person win.

If you're an adult past 30 years old and you are triggered by a yo momma joke to the point where you want to physically fight somebody, the problem ain't the joke.

byrd · October 12, 2021

Just now, drivethroo said:

The only time I ever saw anyone get hit for making a "yo momma" joke was when one person was not bright enough, quick enough or sharp enough to come back with an equal retort so they had to resort to using their fists. Most of the time "yo momma" ended up being a roast battle and may the best person win.

If you're an adult past 30 years old and you are triggered by a yo momma joke to the point where you want to physically fight somebody, the problem ain't the joke.

I understand that , but many aren't and don't give a dam. some people never mature , they are street oriented and will die that way . Since she does not know the difference , she should keep her mouth shut and protect her teeth .

Sweet-tea · October 12, 2021

On 10/10/2021 at 7:41 PM, truthaboutluv said:

The problem is that Candiace goes into angry screaming and yelling mode in a second. It's like a switch just goes off in her head.

She is so volatile. Is she consumed with rage or is something wrong with her? Her reactions are way out of proportion to what's happening. She doesn't seem able to control her temper. Imagine if Chris or any man acted that way. They would've gotten thrown out of the place.

Quote

Candiace is not the worst housewife in history by any stretch but she is a soul sucking energy draining presence.

And a chihuahua (according to Mia).

Quote

G is really, really creepy.

He was at the ugly drunk stage of having absolutely no filter. The tongue thing was disgusting. Karen handled it well. I nominate her MVP of the episode. She was calm, cool and funny.

Quote

I'll say this for Ashley: She certainly knows an entry point when she sees one. She knows Candiace is incapable of walking away from an argument; she counts on that to keep shit going. She's just as bad with her grudge-holding as Candiace is, yet never receives nearly as much blow-back.

She's this show's Lisa Rinna (troublemaker).

RealReality · October 12, 2021

1 minute ago, byrd said:

Yes, they are , people don't play that stuff about their mommy's, depends on who you talking to . I got some cousins who are about' that life," who will beat your ass just because ,and don't give a dam about going to jail. Candiance needs to watch her mouth because you don't know people .. everybody wasn't raised the same.

A 'yo momma joke is a joke about a woman you've almost certainly never met. Its a common insult joke genre and the thought that anyone would beat someone up over a 'yo momma joke reminds me of that scene in Boondocks about some people going to war over absolutely nothing.

If someone takes their mother's honor so seriously that they can't handle a 'yo momma joke, there is a good chance that they cannot handle anything in life, because losing your mind and resorting to violence over a joke is not a normal response. Particularly one as benign as a 'yo momma joke. This would be like someone losing their shit at a Gallegher show.

Candace doesn't need to watch her mouth because there are insane people who would beat someone up over a 'yo momma joke anymore than I need to watch my mouth because someone may be offended that I order a diet coke.

I guess some people are raised for their sad fate, because if you go around with a skin so thin that you would beat someone up over a well recognized joke genre, its not long before you'll end up meeting your match or behind bars. I would hope that most people are raised not to risk their freedom over something as trivial as a 'yo momma joke. But if thats how someone is raised, they have probably been raised to physically attack someone over a LOT of things and are just as likely to find as offense as my diet coke order.

RealReality · October 12, 2021

15 minutes ago, byrd said:

I understand that , but many aren't and don't give a dam. some people never mature , they are street oriented and will die that way . Since she does not know the difference , she should keep her mouth shut and protect her teeth .

And those people will be the same ones who want to beat someone's ass when they don't get an extra ranch dressing with their order or will shoot up a grocery store when they are asked to wear a mask.

I don't think anyone should live their life in fear of what I hope is a relatively small minority.

drivethroo · October 12, 2021

1 minute ago, byrd said:

I understand that , but many aren't and don't give a dam. some people never mature , they are street oriented and will die that way . Since she does not know the difference , she should keep her mouth shut and protect her teeth .

If you're an adult and going around smacking up people for talking slick to you and you have nothing to lose, you probably have a record and you'll probably be separated from society again real soon because the people who do have something to lose will be making sure you lose your freedom.

"Talking slick" would require interaction and in real life, hoodboogers with nothing to lose would not be interacting with the Candiace/Robyn/Gizelle/Karen/Katie/Charrisse type of people; there would be no reason for the two types' paths to cross.

1 minute ago, RealReality said:

And those people will be the same ones who want to beat someone's ass when they don't get an extra ranch dressing with their order or will shoot up a grocery store when they are asked to wear a mask.

And when you see those videos of people jumping over McDonalds' counters, smacking the life out of the girl on fries because they got 2 ketchup packets instead of 3, when you see the videos of them leaping into the drive-thru window to beat up the cashier because the Frosty machine was down again, when you see the video of them pummeling the teacher in the face for the TikTok challenge, the very next video/picture you see of them is of them looking stupid in their mug shot. They proved they were big and bad at that moment. They're also a living example of "When Keepin' It Real Goes Wrong".

RealReality · October 12, 2021

WORLDSTAR!

Edited October 12, 2021 by RealReality

eXiled · October 12, 2021

50 minutes ago, drivethroo said:

*Karen absolutely strikes me as someone who would not fuss with say, Grace, but WOULD call Grace's job to try to get her fired.

During the last reunion didn't Candiace claim Karen called the show's producers in an attempt to get her fired? Yeah. Sounds about right.

Meanwhile, notice how Candiace has/hasn't handled her involvement with Karen this season. I've noticed that she seems to keep a cooler head when dealing with women she really liked or respects. Even believing Karen tried to get her fired only elicited tears and disappointment. Questions. Statements of distrust. She has yet to come for Karen (and Kern has PLENTY to work with if Candiace wanted to bite down to the white meat of Karen's notoriously thin skin).

I doubt we'll ever see Candiace go full buck on Karen, Gizelle, or Robyn. Hell, she even held back with Monique until the incident. I recall a few spicy words exchanged between Candiace and Charrisse during Candi's first season, but she never became unhinged in my recollection, despite voicing her displeasure.

The rest are fair game, however, though Wendy might be safer than the others. I believe Candiace's "friendship" with Wendy is show-driven (the same as with Karen/Mia's fake relationship). That said, Wendy is an educated woman with a career and a marriage to a man most would say is her equal. Askale might get some cover too because of the way she carries herself. Time will tell.

Point blank: I believe Candiace reserves the bulk of her rage for people she considers low-class or trashy, AKA, Ashley and Mia. The only reason Monique was able to slide before their falling out was because Mo took Candiace under her wing. But if Candiace is anything like Giz, she saw Mo the same way.

*Open to correction on this point; I watch a lot of shows and forget a lot. If you have evidence that ANYBODY can get it, please direct me to an episode/season. I'll gas up Hulu and re-watch.

RealReality · October 12, 2021

45 minutes ago, Sweet-tea said:

She is so volatile. Is she consumed with rage or is something wrong with her? Her reactions are way out of proportion to what's happening. She doesn't seem able to control her temper. Imagine if Chris or any man acted that way. They would've gotten thrown out of the place.

So, I'm rewatching episode 13, at the point I would consider the genesis of the Mia/Candace fight.

I don't think Candace is particularly volatile. Mia comes in and Candace explains that the reason why she made the momma comment was because of Mia called her stuff low budget and went to her mother to shit talk.

Mia immediately does what Mia does and immediately gaslights and denies any accountability. Because she is a CEO, she was just trying to see who was in charge, Candace should take it as constructive criticism, she was just trying to "get to know" Dorothy, and none of that really passes the stink test.

Even Askale points out that everytime Mia says anything she brings it back to her non-existent business experience and its kinda ridiculous.

Wendy points out that she will defend Mia because she knows what its like to have "two on one" and Candace rightfully points out that she saved Mia from the wrath of Gizelle and Robyn who were both ready to read her down at Candace's trip.

Then Mia takes a "call" from her "rich, boss babe, upscale friend" and proceeds to loudly refer to everyone else as being "broke bitches" who could never "understand her"

Candace calls after her with another 'yo momma joke and calls her a nightcrawler. But to me, this isn't a 0-100 response in light of the fact that Mia basically just called everyone else a broke bitch who cannot afford to understand her.

This is, to me seems more like mutual combatants since syrupy gaslighting seems as much as using your words to fight.

And I only say any of this because "volatile" was the same charge thrown at Wendy after three days of being picked apart and concern trolled by like four people. But at that point, I didn't think Wendy's reaction was over the top either.

RealReality · October 12, 2021

5 minutes ago, eXiled said:

During the last reunion didn't Candiace claim Karen called the show's producers in an attempt to get her fired? Yeah. Sounds about right.

Meanwhile, notice how Candiace has/hasn't handled her involvement with Karen this season. I've noticed that she seems to keep a cooler head when dealing with women she really liked or respects. Even believing Karen tried to get her fired only elicited tears and disappointment. Questions. Statements of distrust. She has yet to come for Karen (and Kern has PLENTY to work with if Candiace wanted to bite down to the white meat of Karen's notoriously thin skin).

I doubt we'll ever see Candiace go full buck on Karen, Gizelle, or Robyn. Hell, she even held back with Monique until the incident. I recall a few spicy words exchanged between Candiace and Charrisse during Candi's first season, but she never became unhinged in my recollection, despite voicing her displeasure.

The rest are fair game, however, though Wendy might be safer than the others. I believe Candiace's "friendship" with Wendy is show-driven (the same as with Karen/Mia's fake relationship). That said, Wendy is an educated woman with a career and a marriage to a man most would say is her equal. Askale might get some cover too because of the way she carries herself. Time will tell.

Point blank: I believe Candiace reserves the bulk of her rage for people she considers low-class or trashy, AKA, Ashley and Mia. The only reason Monique was able to slide before their falling out was because Mo took Candiace under her wing. But if Candiace is anything like Giz, she saw Mo the same way.

*Open to correction on this point; I watch a lot of shows and forget a lot. If you have evidence that ANYBODY can get it, please direct me to an episode/season. I'll gas up Hulu and re-watch.

This is an interesting point. I could see that being the case.

Though I also wonder if there is an element, as you said, of friendship. Despite being introduced on the show as Ashley's friend (I actually rewatched it on Hulu, because when someone else said it I was like "NOOOOOOOO") I don't think Candace and Ashley were ever really friends and I think both would admit that they just don't like each other.

But perhaps that also has something to do with their different upbringing and a lack of shared experiences. Even though both are pageant girls, I imagine their impetus for getting into it and experience on the circuit were different.

With Mia, she was never her friend and she does seem to see Mia as beneath her. The one person who feeds into that the most is Mia.

But, you're right. Candiace never really dug into Karen, Gizelle, Robyn, Wendy or even Katie.

Rlb8031 · October 12, 2021

On 10/10/2021 at 10:49 PM, drivethroo said:

If Wendy was going to tell the story, Wendy should've told Candiace the whole story and told her Mia, Karen, Robyn and Gizelle were gossiping with Dorothy too.

I'm not quite sure this is the way it happened. My recollection was that Wendy saw what was going on with Mia and Dot, discussed with Askala how inappropriate it was then walked away. Dot then talked to Mia and Karen, who pulled Dot away to remind her she had a mike on. Then Wendy spoke to Candiace, and finally Dot talked to Robyn and Gizelle. Now granted, this could have been edited out of sequence, but I'm not sure that Wendy necessarily knew more than what occurred in that initial conversation which started with a single question followed by a lot of eye-rolling, head-tilting and non-verbal responses from Dot.

On 10/10/2021 at 10:49 PM, drivethroo said:

*I'm going to need for black people in particular to stop clutching their pearls over "yo momma" when "yo momma" jokes have been a staple of comedy since elementary school. It's a childish insult that shouldn't be taken seriously but again Mia weaponizes her foster care upbringing and mother's drug woes to shield herself from being held accountable for her bullshit.

I don't clutch my pearls about behavior that everyone agrees in a private setting, where the rules are clearly known, and everyone has agreed to participate devolves to the lunchroom level of "yo mamma". But I'm gonna need folks to acknowledge that: 1) when we played the dozens amongst ourselves it was clearly understood that those jokes were not to be said in mixed company (where teachers or other parents could hear you) 2) you would certainly never say a "yo mamma" to someone's mamas face; 3) that a national television show that is not a comedy or roast is certainly not the forum for a 40 year old to be talking about someone's real live mother; and 4) that even in the schoolyard it was understood that not everyone knew everyone else's mama's backstory so those games often could and did devolve to face-slaps, punches, and a black eye or a bloody nose. Candice wants to play stupid games, then wants to say "I'm a classy black woman with a platform. Fighting is beneath me." When she wins stupid prizes, it always someone else's fault. If fighting is beneath her, so is an elementary school comedy staple - especially when it isn't funny,

I've said since last year, she absolutely has the right to do and say what she wants. But that comes with the responsibility of understanding that not everyone is going to react the way you would react, and you need to be prepared that a reaction could be outsized in one direction or another. Candice wants to light the match then proscribe how high and hot the flames get. I contrast her with Dr. Heavenly from Married to Medicine who is also famous for "yo mama". In Heavenly's case, I really do think that it is a knee-jerk argument comeback - because she uses it with everybody in every argument. And even Heavenly, who has zero social skills understands that sometimes those jabs hit in places unintended. She has actually apologized and tried to modify her behavior. In Candiace's case, she's never talked about anyone's mom - including Ashley, whose troubles have been part of this storyline since Candiace got on the show. Even if she didn't know the circumstances about Mia's mom, she certainly knew that it might be possible to get a rise out of her with that - which is why she said it.

On 10/10/2021 at 11:03 PM, mbaywife123 said:

Mia stating that no one knows how to act (herself included) was one of the most honest statements ever voiced.

Mia is as self-aware as Candiace claims to be.

On 10/11/2021 at 10:43 AM, drivethroo said:

If we're intellectually honest about the black community and "yo momma jokes" it's mainly "middle class" black people going around pretending like "they're about that life" and would "beat somebody's ass" for talking reckless and we know ain't nobody out here actually laying hands on anyone; it's all a bunch of puffery to sound big and bad and tough.

No, no, no. If we are intellectually honest we've normalized emotional insults, trauma and self-hating behavior as a part of communication within the group. Its not just the middle-class, it occurs within every social sub-group (place of origin, economic status, sexual identity, etc.) at every status level. And yes, this behavior does result in a lot of pain and injury - just not puffery but real black eyes and busted lips.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Rlb8031

Rambunctiouscurls · October 12, 2021

Thanks to all of your diverse and wonderful analysis of this conflict, I feel better about my guilty pleasures. Seriously, I feel like I learned some valuable lessons in conflict resolution. 😂

I read in some article once that the calmer you remain in conflict, the more wound up the other side gets and basically loses the argument.

Wendy’s style of confrontation is basically CNN anchors and commentators not letting anyone getting a word in edgewise and fighting for airtime.

Gizelle hazes and uses mean girl sorority antics. And all big sis mean girls need a minion hence Robyn.

Ashley is a chaos agent and loves to keep stirring shit. Her new mom act hasn’t fooled anyone.

Candiace goes for the jugular but doesn’t know when to quit. Relentless chihuahua style.

Karen’s style is most intriguing. And she keeps me guessing.

Mia’s still trying to figure out her style, her age and her job.

Edited October 12, 2021 by Rambunctiouscurls

spunky · October 12, 2021

2 hours ago, eXiled said:

During the last reunion didn't Candiace claim Karen called the show's producers in an attempt to get her fired? Yeah. Sounds about right.

Meanwhile, notice how Candiace has/hasn't handled her involvement with Karen this season. I've noticed that she seems to keep a cooler head when dealing with women she really liked or respects. Even believing Karen tried to get her fired only elicited tears and disappointment. Questions. Statements of distrust. She has yet to come for Karen (and Kern has PLENTY to work with if Candiace wanted to bite down to the white meat of Karen's notoriously thin skin).

I doubt we'll ever see Candiace go full buck on Karen, Gizelle, or Robyn. Hell, she even held back with Monique until the incident. I recall a few spicy words exchanged between Candiace and Charrisse during Candi's first season, but she never became unhinged in my recollection, despite voicing her displeasure.

The rest are fair game, however, though Wendy might be safer than the others. I believe Candiace's "friendship" with Wendy is show-driven (the same as with Karen/Mia's fake relationship). That said, Wendy is an educated woman with a career and a marriage to a man most would say is her equal. Askale might get some cover too because of the way she carries herself. Time will tell.

Point blank: I believe Candiace reserves the bulk of her rage for people she considers low-class or trashy, AKA, Ashley and Mia. The only reason Monique was able to slide before their falling out was because Mo took Candiace under her wing. But if Candiace is anything like Giz, she saw Mo the same way.

*Open to correction on this point; I watch a lot of shows and forget a lot. If you have evidence that ANYBODY can get it, please direct me to an episode/season. I'll gas up Hulu and re-watch.

Up until the fight Candiace actually thought that Monique and Karen were her friends, which is why she was more hurt than angry. She said on more than one occasion that she's learning to meet people where they are. She knows that Gizelle likes to gossip and is messy, hence her measured responses with Gizelle. She may give Robyn the Karen treatment soon as it seems, she's realizing that Robyn is not her friend.

As for Wendy they both confirmed that they were friends before the show. On one of her lives she said that she and Askale immediately bonded over their shared experience of going to Howard University.

I do think she was able to identify with Charisse and Katie. Charisse was the most connected on the cast and her children went to school with the Obamas. Candiace interned and worked with the Obama administration, so they might have some political connections in common. She has depression and anxiety, therefore she would have more empathy for Katie. Ashley making fun of Katie's mental health could be one of the reasons why she can't stand her.

Edited October 13, 2021 by spunky

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

4 hours ago, byrd said:

Also when I was growing up, those" Yo Mommy" insults were grounds for a ass whoopin !

I mean it’s true. Whether it’s sounds outlandish, unnecessary or ridiculous, where I grew up… there would have definitely been hands thrown for that. FO’ SURE. It ain’t some brag or some need to validate “that life” it just is. For me, the way Candace throws that tough chick bravado out there without really understanding the game she’s playing irks. Stop being so desperate to pretend flex. Flexing on people and buckin’ like you thug ain’t a game and she seems to think it is so for me I think her need to present herself like someone who’s “about that life” around these women to boot, cause please these woman are about messy boots and bone collecting while drinking wine so bucking is really outta place lol. It is absolutely ridiculous and somewhat insulting to be honest. It’s the role playing without the goods that has me sitting back and rolling my eyes at her dumb choices.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

4 hours ago, byrd said:

Yes, they are , people don't play that stuff about their mommy's, depends on who you talking to . I got some cousins who are about' that life," who will beat your ass just because ,and don't give a dam about going to jail. Candiance needs to watch her mouth because you don't know people .. everybody wasn't raised the same.

Exactly! I mean add the fact that she ACTUALLY did get her ass dragged. Like ummm okay boo boo keep rolling those dice..🤣🤣

4 hours ago, byrd said:

I understand that , but many aren't and don't give a dam. some people never mature , they are street oriented and will die that way . Since she does not know the difference , she should keep her mouth shut and protect her teeth .

Yooooo!!! LMFAO!!! For real!!

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

15 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

I'm not quite sure this is the way it happened. My recollection was that Wendy saw what was going on with Mia and Dot, discussed with Askala how inappropriate it was then walked away. Dot then talked to Mia and Karen, who pulled Dot away to remind her she had a mike on. Then Wendy spoke to Candiace, and finally Dot talked to Robyn and Gizelle. Now granted, this could have been edited out of sequence, but I'm not sure that Wendy necessarily knew more than what occurred in that initial conversation which started with a single question followed by a lot of eye-rolling, head-tilting and non-verbal responses from Dot.

I don't clutch my pearls about behavior that everyone agrees in a private setting, where the rules are clearly known, and everyone has agreed to participate devolves to the lunchroom level of "yo mamma". But I'm gonna need folks to acknowledge that: 1) when we played the dozens amongst ourselves it was clearly understood that those jokes were not to be said in mixed company (where teachers or other parents could hear you) 2) you would certainly never say a "yo mamma" to someone's mamas face; 3) that a national television show that is not a comedy or roast is certainly not the forum for a 40 year old to be talking about someone's real live mother; and 4) that even in the schoolyard it was understood that not everyone knew everyone else's mama's backstory so those games often could and did devolve to face-slaps, punches, and a black eye or a bloody nose. Candice wants to play stupid games, then wants to say "I'm a classy black woman with a platform. Fighting is beneath me." When she wins stupid prizes, it always someone else's fault. If fighting is beneath her, so is an elementary school comedy staple - especially when it isn't funny,

I've said since last year, she absolutely has the right to do and say what she wants. But that comes with the responsibility of understanding that not everyone is going to react the way you would react, and you need to be prepared that a reaction could be outsized in one direction or another. Candice wants to light the match then proscribe how high and hot the flames get. I contrast her with Dr. Heavenly who is also famous for "yo mama". In Heavenly's case, I really do think that it is a knee-jerk argument comeback - because she uses it with everybody in every argument. And even Heavenly, who has zero social skills understands that sometimes those jabs hit in places unintended. She has actually apologized and tried to modify her behavior. In Candiace's case, she's never talked about anyone's mom - including Ashley, whose troubles have been part of this storyline since Candiace got on the show. Even if she didn't know the circumstances about Mia's mom, she certainly knew that it might be possible to get a rise out of her with that - which is why she said it.

Mia is as self-aware as Candiace claims to be.

No, no, no. If we are intellectually honest we've normalized emotional insults, trauma and self-hating behavior as a part of communication within the group. Its not just the middle-class, it occurs within every social sub-group (place of origin, economic status, sexual identity, etc.) at every status level. And yes, this behavior does result in a lot of pain and injury - just not puffery but real black eyes and busted lips.

I LOVE THIS!!!
“A reaction could be outsized in one direction or another” BRILLIANT!

”Candice wants to light a match then prescribe how high and hot the flames get..” THIS!!

Does. Not. Work. That. Way. Never has, never will. 💁🏻‍♀️

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

drivethroo · October 13, 2021

2 hours ago, RealReality said:

Wendy points out that she will defend Mia because she knows what its like to have "two on one" and Candace rightfully points out that she saved Mia from the wrath of Gizelle and Robyn who were both ready to read her down at Candace's trip.

See, I don't even know what this means because Askale and Candiace were actually talking calmly to Mia. Candiace doesn't "gang up" on anyone; Candiace is usually the one being ganged up on. Unless Wendy feels that Candiace "ganged up on" Karen, in which case she was a willing participant.

2 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

3) that a national television show that is not a comedy or roast is certainly not the forum for a 40 year old to be talking about someone's real live mother;

A Housewives show...where the main objective is to READ somebody...is not a comedy or a roast.

If they aren't to talk about people's mothers, they need not ever bring up Dorothy again, either.

2 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

4) that even in the schoolyard it was understood that not everyone knew everyone else's mama's backstory so those games often could and did devolve to face-slaps, punches, and a black eye or a bloody nose.

By the kids who weren't swift enough with a comeback

2 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

I've said since last year, she absolutely has the right to do and say what she wants. But that comes with the responsibility of understanding that not everyone is going to react the way you would react, and you need to be prepared that a reaction could be outsized in one direction or another.

Which is a lesson all of them need to learn. Betcha Mia didn't think her calling Candiace's video "low budget" would result on an "attack" on her mother. Candiace went light on her with the "yo momma" joke; Ashley should only hope Candiace doesn't bring her mother up.

1 hour ago, Rambunctiouscurls said:

I read in some article once that the calmer you remain in conflict, the more wound up the other side gets and basically loses the argument.

This is actually true ---and hard to pull off.

1 hour ago, Rambunctiouscurls said:

Karen’s style is most intriguing. And she keeps me guessing.

Karen's style is to be a Karen. She's the type that will smile in your face, but let the other women in the circle know So N So would be a bad fit for XYZ organization. She's the type that would call Grace's afterschool job to get her fired and when Gizelle finds out, tell Gizelle she was "just concerned" (like she did with Candiace) and just wanted Grace to "get more training." Karen won't get you in the front, she'll get you in the back.

43 minutes ago, spunky said:

I do think she was able to identify with Charisse and Katie. Charisse was the most connected on the cast and her children went to school with the Obamas.

Candiace grew up in similar circumstances as Gizelle, Robyn and Katie. She would've had a similar childhood to Karen & Charrisse's daughters.

Remember, her continued friendship/association with Charrisse was a BIG reason why Monique wanted to beat Candiace's ass.

1 hour ago, spunky said:

Up until the fight Candiace actually thought that Monique and Karen were her friends, which is why she was more hurt than angry.

Candiace needs to keep her eye on Wendy, too.

StillHere · October 13, 2021

2 hours ago, drivethroo said:

Candiace needs to keep her eye on Wendy, too.

Yes ... and then she should throw something at her ...

then cry ...

then accuse Wendy of colorism ...

then Lather ... Rise ... Repeat

Edited October 13, 2021 by StillHere

Talented Tenth · October 13, 2021

8 hours ago, RealReality said:

A 'yo momma joke is a joke about a woman you've almost certainly never met. Its a common insult joke genre and the thought that anyone would beat someone up over a 'yo momma joke reminds me of that scene in Boondocks about some people going to war over absolutely nothing.

If someone takes their mother's honor so seriously that they can't handle a 'yo momma joke, there is a good chance that they cannot handle anything in life, because losing your mind and resorting to violence over a joke is not a normal response. Particularly one as benign as a 'yo momma joke. This would be like someone losing their shit at a Gallegher show.

Candace doesn't need to watch her mouth because there are insane people who would beat someone up over a 'yo momma joke anymore than I need to watch my mouth because someone may be offended that I order a diet coke.

I guess some people are raised for their sad fate, because if you go around with a skin so thin that you would beat someone up over a well recognized joke genre, its not long before you'll end up meeting your match or behind bars.  I would hope that most people are raised not to risk their freedom over something as trivial as a 'yo momma joke. But if thats how someone is raised, they have probably been raised to physically attack someone over a LOT of things and are just as likely to find as offense as my diet coke order.

During conflict, I don't want to hear anything negative and my mother in the same sentence. "Your mama" jokes were jokes told when I was in jr. high. I've never heard an adult ever say it and I've been in my fair share of arguments. Saying something negative about someone's mother, whether knowing the mother or not, is an insult in my book. Candiace wanted to hurt Mia; it was malicious and not a joke at all.

Chatty Cake · October 13, 2021

5 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

During conflict, I don't want to hear anything negative and my mother in the same sentence. "Your mama" jokes were jokes told when I was in jr. high. I've never heard an adult ever say it and I've been in my fair share of arguments. Saying something negative about someone's mother, whether knowing the mother or not, is an insult in my book. Candiace wanted to hurt Mia; it was malicious and not a joke at all.

Exactly,
Mia made the low budget comment about the video few episodes ago. Candiace was so bothered by it because there was some truth to the comment. She is still so upset that she’s (in the current episode)calling Mia a stripper, G a pimp....etc because she is insecure. Both about the video and her husbandger. An adult person would have cooled off about the original low budget comment by now. Candiace however will hurl as many insults until she strikes a nerve. Plus she knows her own mama is on the low budget side. Gossiping about her own son in law to anyone who will listen. Mia should take a page from Ashley and let the chihuahua bark until it tires and the husbandger calms her down.

spunky · October 13, 2021

10 hours ago, drivethroo said:

See, I don't even know what this means because Askale and Candiace were actually talking calmly to Mia. Candiace doesn't "gang up" on anyone; Candiace is usually the one being ganged up on. Unless Wendy feels that Candiace "ganged up on" Karen, in which case she was a willing participant.

A Housewives show...where the main objective is to READ somebody...is not a comedy or a roast.

If they aren't to talk about people's mothers, they need not ever bring up Dorothy again, either.

By the kids who weren't swift enough with a comeback

Which is a lesson all of them need to learn. Betcha Mia didn't think her calling Candiace's video "low budget" would result on an "attack" on her mother. Candiace went light on her with the "yo momma" joke; Ashley should only hope Candiace doesn't bring her mother up.

This is actually true ---and hard to pull off.

Karen's style is to be a Karen. She's the type that will smile in your face, but let the other women in the circle know So N So would be a bad fit for XYZ organization. She's the type that would call Grace's afterschool job to get her fired and when Gizelle finds out, tell Gizelle she was "just concerned" (like she did with Candiace) and just wanted Grace to "get more training." Karen won't get you in the front, she'll get you in the back.

Candiace grew up in similar circumstances as Gizelle, Robyn and Katie. She would've had a similar childhood to Karen & Charrisse's daughters.

Remember, her continued friendship/association with Charrisse was a BIG reason why Monique wanted to beat Candiace's ass.

Candiace needs to keep her eye on Wendy, too.

She said something on Twitter the other day about wanting to block her coworkers. She usually responds to Wendy's Robyn's and Gizelle's Instagram posts, but she hasn't done that recently. She even ignored Robyn's comment on her own post.

lamujerdecente · October 13, 2021

On 10/11/2021 at 5:12 PM, drivethroo said:

You actually prove my point that it doesn't matter what Candiace does or says, it doesn't matter if she's quiet or walks away, she's going to get her ass beat anyway so she might as well run her mouth.

Every time last season up to the barn fight, when Monique tried to start a fight, Candiace walked away. How is that not disengaging? If the real sentiment is "Candiace needs her ass beat until she disappears and goes away," just say that instead of saying she needs to disengage because as you say, she got dragged anyway.

You're not understanding because you want Candiace's ass beat because you don't like her. That's all.

And 99% of the people puffing and huffing about beating a bitch's ass will do *nothing* except cry about it on Facebook when it actually happens. Ya'll ain't out here "beating bitches' asses" because they talked to you sideways; it's simply not happening. It's just puffery from middle aged women who haven't been in a fight since 8th grade.

And all the middle aged women foaming that Candiace's ass needs to be beat for her mouth are one 911 call away from

Getting arrested

Losing jobs

Having to pay court costs, fees and fines

Catching a record

Possibly losing housing

Having a judgment on their record after losing the civil case

Getting their wages garnished because they lost the last job and the new job doesn't pay enough to pay the judgment

for "beating a bitch's ass."

Which is why they aren't doing it. It's all e-thuggery. Nobody is out here "beating bitches' asses" for talking sideways except hoodboogers with nothing to lose. Everyone else? Has something to lose. That's why so many love and cherish Monique and were cheering her on because she could do what they know they cannot in real life.

Say this louder. I ended a friendship with a 52 year plus woman whose response to any kind of venting was, " I am going to come see her. I don't talk." Yeah you do. All day. In the group of girls ironically, I am the one who LIVED in the HOOD the LONGEST. Well she got loud with me and threatening, I calmly told her, that was not happening, you will not speak to me like that or there will be consequences. Meaning Bitch - Bye til u learn how to act with friends. My 46 year old ass ain't 12 in the HOOD anymore getting teased for my emo pink hair in the projects. I have shit to lose now.

No one has the right to put their hands on you no matter what comes out your mouth. However HOOD or not, people have triggers. No one deserves a beat down for saying words but also know that not everyone is stable with their anger, just like Monique needs to keep her hands to herself, Candy needs to watch her anger with her mouth. Words can damage your career or legacy just as much as putting hands on someone. See all the dummies whose emails or tweets with racist, misogynistic or anti lgbtq rants have gotten their trifling asses fired. Candy is too loose with that mouth. Now Ashley is very calculated with her mouth. She says foul ass shit too but is never as unhinged as Candy is. Learn Candy.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

2 hours ago, lamujerdecente said:

Say this louder. I ended a friendship with a 52 year plus woman whose response to any kind of venting was, " I am going to come see her. I don't talk." Yeah you do. All day. In the group of girls ironically, I am the one who LIVED in the HOOD the LONGEST. Well she got loud with me and threatening, I calmly told her, that was not happening, you will not speak to me like that or there will be consequences. Meaning Bitch - Bye til u learn how to act with friends. My 46 year old ass ain't 12 in the HOOD anymore getting teased for my emo pink hair in the projects. I have shit to lose now.

No one has the right to put their hands on you no matter what comes out your mouth. However HOOD or not, people have triggers. No one deserves a beat down for saying words but also know that not everyone is stable with their anger, just like Monique needs to keep her hands to herself, Candy needs to watch her anger with her mouth. Words can damage your career or legacy just as much as putting hands on someone. See all the dummies whose emails or tweets with racist, misogynistic or anti lgbtq rants have gotten their trifling asses fired. Candy is too loose with that mouth. Now Ashley is very calculated with her mouth. She says foul ass shit too but is never as unhinged as Candy is. Learn Candy.

Unhinged is the perfect description. Obviously the show revolves around conflict and petty squabbles so even though I am not a huge fan of the extreme ridiculousness some of the more harmless back and forth does amuse. I don't enjoy the blatant attempts at true cruelty or attempts at dusting shit up to the point where someone is truly triggered.

Agreed, no one has the right to put hands on and I am very adamant about that but I also use that same disapproving energy towards anyone who gleefully fuels an already volatile situation. Back and forth name calling is one thing, upping the ante by shifting the tone in order to get it to a physical place is another. Personal space is a very real thing and during a conflict the body language and placement of appendages is very important.

My beef with Candace is that she doesn't just keep it to messy words like Ashley. She gets to a place where her body languages shifts and personal space becomes a problem. Look, I ain't tryna give people excuses but I just want to point out that Candace is a WILLING participator and CULPRIT to her unfortunate situations. She seems to think that being SLIGHTLY on the right side of the altercation (action wise) is gonna spare her a trip to the hospital. That's my biggest issue with her. If all Candace did was sit back and smugly lobby insults back and forth with a smirk on her face then sure. That has housewives written all over it but Candace has shown that when her words don't shut you up or get a rise she'll introduce something else that involves disrespecting personal space.

Someone who deliberately goes to that place in order to antagonize to that level doesn't get a pass from me. That's why I find Kenya from Atlanta so distasteful as well. When it goes beyond clever or witty or harsh reads and into Inviting, welcoming and provoking a physical confrontation thru OBVIOUS disrespectful invasions of personal space then I can no longer be on your side. Everyone needs to be responsible for their roles in these matters and Candace makes conscious decisions when she pulls these moves and I ain't gonna give her a pass. I'm not advocating (out loud) that she SHOULD get popped in the mouth I'm just saying I won't be overly distraught about it and I can't promise I won't giggle a bit. J/K

I grew up in The Bronx in the 80's which is why the showdown with her and Monique didn't really hit my radar. I mean I'm known as the cool headed person in my group and can usually manage to diffuse dumb shit but at the same time I'm not always successful in being the voice of reason between two friends so when I saw what went down with Candance and Monique it didn't really raise an eyebrow. I was like "yup, looks about what you would expect" and then shrugged my shoulders. Certain boundaries you don't cross and personal space is one of them if you want to keep the conflict hands free. Emotions are high and rational thinking can't be counted on so the best bet is to stay out of people's personal space EVEN if they are coming for you. If you decide to met them where they at then you've just agreed to rolling them dice. At least that's been the understanding where I come from. In my 30's, 40's 50's whatever age.

Meet people in the ring be ready to go a couple rounds. Simple. There are those of us who, like other posters have mentioned, have too much to lose and will steer clear and then there are those that will jump in ready and willing <cough> Monique <cough> and if you ain't got the goods to prevail it's just best NOT to ring that bell to begin with. My experienced eyes sees a fool who doesn't have the maturity to manage that 'knuck if you buck" persona she likes to throw out there every once in a while. Candace needs to learn how to keep shit as a spectator sport for our viewing pleasure and stick with her smug and her smirks and stop doing the most. The job does not require hospital stays for that paycheck so Imma need her to reevaluate her contract. LOL.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

drivethroo · October 13, 2021

9 hours ago, Talented Tenth said:

During conflict, I don't want to hear anything negative and my mother in the same sentence. "Your mama" jokes were jokes told when I was in jr. high. I've never heard an adult ever say it and I've been in my fair share of arguments. Saying something negative about someone's mother, whether knowing the mother or not, is an insult in my book. Candiace wanted to hurt Mia; it was malicious and not a joke at all.

But who started the conflict? Candiace didn't storm down to Mia and say "Bitch yo momma is low budget." Candiace initially asked her why she was asking Dorothy about if Chris was getting paid. Mia, knowing she was wrong and wanting to deflect from that, responded with "Well your video was low budget."

So who attacked who first? Who was hurtful and malicious first? Let's start there. Askale was the only person to ask Mia if she could see how calling Candiace's video "low budget" would be hurtful to Candiace. Not even Candiace's "friend" Wendy asked Mia those questions and Wendy is the one who lit the match in the first place. Wendy could've told Candiace even after she told her about Mia, that Karen, Gizelle and Robyn were gossiping with Dorothy too. But she singled out Mia. Ok.

2 hours ago, spunky said:

She usually responds to Wendy's Robyn's and Gizelle's Instagram posts, but she hasn't done that recently.

And she shouldn't respond to them, and Wendy/Gizelle/Robyn shouldn't even be upset about it because why would you be upset if a child is sulking in the corner and won't talk to you?

I don't think Candiace is too concerned with what Gizelle says but I think she is hurt by Robyn & Wendy's responses and actions.

1 hour ago, lamujerdecente said:

I am the one who LIVED in the HOOD the LONGEST. Well she got loud with me and threatening, I calmly told her, that was not happening, you will not speak to me like that or there will be consequences. Meaning Bitch - Bye til u learn how to act with friends. My 46 year old ass ain't 12 in the HOOD anymore getting teased for my emo pink hair in the projects. I have shit to lose now.

It's offensive to suggest "people from the hood" don't have anything to lose. People who don't have anything to lose don't have anything to lose ---whether they're from the hood or from Potomac.

1 hour ago, lamujerdecente said:

just like Monique needs to keep her hands to herself, Candy needs to watch her anger with her mouth. Words can damage your career or legacy just as much as putting hands on someone. See all the dummies whose emails or tweets with racist, misogynistic or anti lgbtq rants have gotten their trifling asses fired. Candy is too loose with that mouth. Now Ashley is very calculated with her mouth. She says foul ass shit too but is never as unhinged as Candy is. Learn Candy.

The only way Candiace is going to learn to watch her mouth is for people to ice her out until she acts right. Beatdowns will not make her watch her mouth because beatdown are equivalent to spankings and spankings are what you do to children and everyone (including her husband) sees her as a child.

In my opinion and I've said this before, this thirst from black female viewers in particular to see Candiace beat down, beat up, assaulted etc stems from wanting to control a bad child and many times, the way we try to control a bad child is to whoop their ass. You talking back to me, getting smart? I'm gonna go upside your head (Dorothy with the purse). I'm going to whoop your ass until you learn how to talk to people. Everytime you get out of line, I'm gonna whoop your ass. Oh, you wanna talk about somebody's mother? I'm gonna use this belt, this switch, this broom handle (fictional, but didn't we see Cookie from Empire beat her son's ass with a broomstick for getting buck with her?) and you're getting your ass whooped.

And you bet not cry about it either or we're going to whoop your ass again and really give you something to cry about.

Candiace is going to have to do the work and grow up and that will require her to do some introspection & separate from some people. What types of people trigger her and is she able to limit exposure to those type of people?

For example, in my life, the coworkers I have tended to butt heads with most are white women from a lower SES. I do not know why but this particular group of people loves to accuse me of doing/not doing tasks at work, having a tone/attitude etc. This is why I have learned to keep detailed receipts on everything, no matter how little. I limit my interactions with this particular group so I'm not triggered by microaggressions and when they happen, I keep it cute, mute and moving.

The real life response to someone like Candiace is almost always separation, not beatdown. Whether that's your job firing you because of your tantrums and mouth, or friends dropping you because they don't want to deal with it, or your man leaving you because he's tired. And in a sad way, IMO Dorothy is hoping all of the above happens so she can tell Candiace "I told you so, I told you you're a piece of shit."

And Chris is going to have to stop barking at her like a child and snatching her up as a child. This last episode gave me every bit the daddy/daughter that Candiace accuses Mia/G and Michael/Ashley of being.

Hiyo · October 13, 2021

Quote

this thirst from black female viewers in particular to see Candiace beat down, beat up, assaulted etc stems from wanting to control a bad child and many times, the way we try to control a bad child is to whoop their ass.

Just a guess here, but I am assuming it isn't just black female viewers...

Quote

That has housewives written all over it but Candace has shown that when her words don't shut you up or get a rise she'll introduce something else that involves disrespecting personal space.

She might even grab a knife and start ruining her momma's dining room table...

drivethroo · October 13, 2021

34 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

but I also use that same disapproving energy towards anyone who gleefully fuels an already volatile situation.

If someone is acting a fool, you have two choices. You can go oops upside their head or you can choose to walk away.

The problem is people are trying to control others by going ooops upside their head instead of trying to control themselves. You can't control anyone else. Beating up Candiace so she stops using her mouth will never work unless the goal is to permanently shut her up by killing her. That's what Monique expressed at the barn. Ironically Candiace sensed that bad energy radiating from Monique and kept walking away from her until the scene at the barn.

52 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

When it goes beyond clever or witty or harsh reads and into Inviting, welcoming and provoking a physical confrontation thru OBVIOUS disrespectful invasions of personal space then I can no longer be on your side.

Keep that same energy with Mia, who invaded both Candiace and Wendy's spaces. I suspect if Candiace had snatched up Mia for putting her finger in Candiace's face, the response to Candiace beating Mia would be very different from the response to Monique beating Candiace.

55 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

there are those that will jump in ready and willing and if ain't got the goods to prevail <cough> Monique <cough> it's just best NOT to ring that bell to begin with.

But why wasn't Monique ready to knuck and buck with Robyn, who physically came up in her space on the streets ready to go 10 rounds with Monique? Monique made a decision to walk away from that conflict when it escalated on the street; she could've done the same at the winery but Monique chose to escalate it by putting her hands on Candiace first.

And to be honest, Monique came out out that fight worse physically than Candiace because Candiace's wig was in turmoil but Monique had a busted/cut lip and injured tooth.

Monique isn't the Monique Mayweather she and the viewers have built her up to be. She was just someone who wanted to beat a bitch and instigated a fight so she could beat a bitch. She never would've laid hands on Gizelle and she sho' wouldn't have raised a fist to Gigi.

1 hour ago, Yours Truly said:

My experienced eyes sees a fool who doesn't have the maturity to manage that 'knuck if you buck" persona she likes to throw out there every once in a while.

My experienced self sees someone with a slick mouth and crazy behavior and chooses not engage with somebody like that beyond "hi and bye." Needing Candiace to be quiet, stop being slick etc...don't even give a Candiace a chance to be slick mouthed. Stop talking to her. Don't interact with her. The funny thing is, 99% of the time Candiace did not start the conflict, the other person did. Stop starting conflict with her. Stop trying to control this lady's responses when you start the conflict with her first. Leave her alone. If you ice her out, she'll either get the message that she needs to change or she won't, and it really doesn't matter what she chooses to do because YOU won't be dealing with her either way.

You can't throw somebody into a volcano, jump in the volcano after them, then complain your skin is burnt up.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

7 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

Just a guess here, but I am assuming it isn't just black female viewers...

She might even grab a knife and start ruining her momma's dining room table...

I'm saying!

It's not a "pretend" attack just because it was a butter knife and not a butcher knife and because she didn't get close enough to Ashley to do any harm. I mean, Candace has proven herself to be volatile and aggressive so I don't take her transgressions lightly or try to put them squarely into the other housewives laps. But that's just me.

byrd · October 13, 2021

19 hours ago, drivethroo said:

If you're an adult and going around smacking up people for talking slick to you and you have nothing to lose, you probably have a record and you'll probably be separated from society again real soon because the people who do have something to lose will be making sure you lose your freedom.

"Talking slick" would require interaction and in real life, hoodboogers with nothing to lose would not be interacting with the Candiace/Robyn/Gizelle/Karen/Katie/Charrisse type of people; there would be no reason for the two types' paths to cross.

And when you see those videos of people jumping over McDonalds' counters, smacking the life out of the girl on fries because they got 2 ketchup packets instead of 3, when you see the videos of them leaping into the drive-thru window to beat up the cashier because the Frosty machine was down again, when you see the video of them pummeling the teacher in the face for the TikTok challenge, the very next video/picture you see of them is of them looking stupid in their mug shot. They proved they were big and bad at that moment. They're also a living example of "When Keepin' It Real Goes Wrong".

I agree, but in this case, if you are going to talk shit, then know how to fight, or get ready to have your edges snatched !

Just now, byrd said:

I agree, but in this case, if you are going to talk shit, then know how to fight, or get ready to have your edges snatched !

Just now, byrd said:

I agree, but in this case, if you are going to talk shit, then know how to fight, or get ready to have your edges snatched ! It does not matter who she's interacting with , a castmate has already dragged that ass. I did not agree with it, but shit happens..

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

10 minutes ago, byrd said:

I agree, but in this case, if you are going to talk shit, then know how to fight, or get ready to have your edges snatched !

Especially if you gonna be in proximity of getting those edges snatched. Talk your shit boo boo but make sure you close to the door or at a comfortable distance LOL. Oh and don't forget those running shoes too. Cause sometimes those edges DON'T come off and you end up pinned to a table. LMAO.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

RealReality · October 13, 2021

18 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

I don't clutch my pearls about behavior that everyone agrees in a private setting, where the rules are clearly known, and everyone has agreed to participate devolves to the lunchroom level of "yo mamma". But I'm gonna need folks to acknowledge that: 1) when we played the dozens amongst ourselves it was clearly understood that those jokes were not to be said in mixed company (where teachers or other parents could hear you) 2) you would certainly never say a "yo mamma" to someone's mamas face; 3) that a national television show that is not a comedy or roast is certainly not the forum for a 40 year old to be talking about someone's real live mother; and 4) that even in the schoolyard it was understood that not everyone knew everyone else's mama's backstory so those games often could and did devolve to face-slaps, punches, and a black eye or a bloody nose. Candice wants to play stupid games, then wants to say "I'm a classy black woman with a platform. Fighting is beneath me." When she wins stupid prizes, it always someone else's fault. If fighting is beneath her, so is an elementary school comedy staple - especially when it isn't funny,

I've said since last year, she absolutely has the right to do and say what she wants. But that comes with the responsibility of understanding that not everyone is going to react the way you would react, and you need to be prepared that a reaction could be outsized in one direction or another. Candice wants to light the match then proscribe how high and hot the flames get. I contrast her with Dr. Heavenly from Married to Medicine who is also famous for "yo mama". In Heavenly's case, I really do think that it is a knee-jerk argument comeback - because she uses it with everybody in every argument. And even Heavenly, who has zero social skills understands that sometimes those jabs hit in places unintended. She has actually apologized and tried to modify her behavior. In Candiace's case, she's never talked about anyone's mom - including Ashley, whose troubles have been part of this storyline since Candiace got on the show.

No, no, no. If we are intellectually honest we've normalized emotional insults, trauma and self-hating behavior as a part of communication within the group. Its not just the middle-class, it occurs within every social sub-group (place of origin, economic status, sexual identity, etc.) at every status level. And yes, this behavior does result in a lot of pain and injury - just not puffery but real black eyes and busted lips.

1) But Candace did not make her 'yo momma joke in mixed company, she made it around all of the other women.

2) Candace did not say anything in front of or around Mia's momma.

3) There was literally a national TV show on MTV called "Yo Momma" hosted by Wilmer Valderamma.

Please note that in the clip below, not only are the "yo momma" jokes nationally broadcast, but the guys mother is literally in the audience and is not even slightly phased or upset by the jokes.

You can say that "well, those are younger guys and not a woman in her 30s" but I think that a difference without a distinction, because the idea seems to be that 'yo momma jokes are just so terrible that no 30+ year old woman would be saying one on national TV., as they are clearly something so terrible that people have been beaten for making such a joke.

However, we've seen these women, even the women of Potomac engage in much worse behavior and commentary towards each other than a 'yo momma joke on national TV.....and the 'yo momma jokes do not seem to be that serious.

And while MTV may be a shit parade of a network, but like any network they try to avoid bad publicity and press when they can (see attempts to enforce contractual clauses by the network about arbitration and NDAs). I also think Wilmer Vladeramma (sp) at the time had his own reputation and career. So, I do not think that either MTV OR Wilmer would have agreed to a show that was based on something that routinely got children beaten to a pulp.

RealReality · October 13, 2021

15 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

I LOVE THIS!!!
“A reaction could be outsized in one direction or another” BRILLIANT!

”Candice wants to light a match then prescribe how high and hot the flames get..” THIS!!

Does. Not. Work. That. Way. Never has, never will. 💁🏻‍♀️

But this really seems to be what everyone else does to Candace.

"well, yeah, I just threw a little shade and you came for my throat! Unfair!"

But the person who threw the shade lit the match in the first place and then when Candace responds by verbally laying them out, they cry, complain and whine about it.

Candace didn't start that conflict with Mia, Mia started that and then got mad when Candace responded. Candace didn't start with Ashley at the table, Ashley started that, and then got mad when Candace responded.

RealReality · October 13, 2021

9 minutes ago, byrd said:

I agree, but in this case, if you are going to talk shit, then know how to fight, or get ready to have your edges snatched !

Disagree, this show isn't bad girls club or love and hip hop. This entire franchise hasn't been sold as one where physically fighting is an acceptable response to verbal annoyance.

Were this bad girls club or even love and hip hop, I could see the point, but this isn't. It would be like someone getting beaten up on Big Brother for shit talking, it may have happened, but thats not really what the franchise is known for.

In HW, your words are supposed to be your weapon and all of the women are supposed to shit talk. There isn't some Emily Post etiquette rulebook of what they can and cannot say, but there is a notion that physical attacks against other castmembers are unacceptable or an expected response. And this makes sense because it would have such a chilling effect.

byrd · October 13, 2021

4 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Disagree, this show isn't bad girls club or love and hip hop. This entire franchise hasn't been sold as one where physically fighting is an acceptable response to verbal annoyance.

Were this bad girls club or even love and hip hop, I could see the point, but this isn't. It would be like someone getting beaten up on Big Brother for shit talking, it may have happened, but thats not really what the franchise is known for.

In HW, your words are supposed to be your weapon and all of the women are supposed to shit talk. There isn't some Emily Post etiquette rulebook of what they can and cannot say, but there is a notion that physical attacks against other castmembers are unacceptable or an expected response. And this makes sense because it would have such a chilling effect.

what's suppose to be, and what's happening is two different things, you can't judge how a person would react no matter what the rules are. All of these shows can be love and hip hop , Basketball wives, or whatever, it depends on who you are messing with, just push the wrong button and you will get what you are looking for.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

I'm confused about Robyn and especially Gizelle's reaction to the room situation. First off, ya'll said ya'll weren't gonna be there. Second, you all showed up waaaaaayyy after everyone else and then proceeded to the bedroom WITHOUT even checking in with the host. Only to then chastise the host for your accommodations that she didn't even know you were occupying because AHEM you didn't even check in with her.

Had you greeted her discussed some stuff like the stair issue/period issue and how a dowstairs bathroom wouldn't really work then maybe she would have had an opportunity to work something with the other ladies. Looked like Karen and Ashley had separate rooms (one had two double beds) So I'm sure a compromise could have been made where Karen and Ashley could have shared that room and you and Robyn could have either shared the bed that Ashley was currently in or Robyn stays in that room while Gizelle stays in the room she's currently in and then shares the bathroom in Robyns room therefore solving the stair problem for Gizelle but giving Robyn more privacy and access since she's on her period.

Like damn. It ain't that hard to share a bathroom and since Robyn and Gizelle are such besties that should have been a workable solution. Actually it would have been a very gracious solution considering ya'll just rolled up unannounced and went straight to the bedroom to start the trash talk. LOL

So corny.

RealReality · October 13, 2021

4 minutes ago, byrd said:

what's suppose to be, and what's happening is two different things, you can't judge how a person would react no matter what the rules are. All of these shows can be love and hip hop , Basketball wives, or whatever, it depends on who you are messing with, just push the wrong button and you will get what you are looking for.

OK, but then by those rules you can never say or do anything because of the fear that a person would fly off the handle. You can push the wrong button for some people by just sitting on the bus and looking out the window. Does that mean you shouldn't get on the bus or you shouldn't look out the window? I don't think so, but by your logic, you should, because you cannot judge how a person reacts to anything so you should do nothing.

This is why the onus should be on the person who does the physical attacking, because if you try to deal with the sensitivities of thin skinned people then no one can ever say anything or do anything.

People who physically attack always have "a reason" Two women coming to blows over the last candle in the clearance section in Ross have "a reason" why they aren't at fault and the other woman just shouldn't have done or said "x,y and z" Trying to avoid their reaction by playing into "their reasons" is a fools errand because no matter what, they will make one up to justify their lack of self-control.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

25 minutes ago, byrd said:

what's suppose to be, and what's happening is two different things, you can't judge how a person would react no matter what the rules are. All of these shows can be love and hip hop , Basketball wives, or whatever, it depends on who you are messing with, just push the wrong button and you will get what you are looking for.

This is why how a housewife moves makes all the difference. Mia laughed that chick off, multiple times. Of course shit is gonna get started. That's the staple of the franchise. This whole who started what isn't the point cause we all know there's gonna be some petty drama started in some way shape or form. It's HOW it continues to proceed. Who are the one's that stick pretty much to the unspoken agreements of on air behavior and then there are those that want to step out of those parameters and test the waters bringing elements to the disagreement that take it to a whole other level. Those are the one's I scowl at cause it turns the amusing petty drama into very ugly experiences that most people don't want to see when watching these shows cause yeah, if we wanted that we'd tune into love and hip hop.

I take issue with any housewife Potomac, Atlanta, Jersey, Salt Lake, New York that steers away from that general format and knowingly and purposely introduces compromising antics that will escalate conflict into a more dire (physical) exchange. Don't get me wrong, if a housewife takes the bait and acts then that's between you and your lawyer and the unemployment office but I'm not gonna see it as a one sided offense.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

RealReality · October 13, 2021

9 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

I'm confused about Robyn and especially Gizelle's reaction to the room situation. First off, ya'll said ya'll weren't gonna be there. Second, you all showed up waaaaaayyy after everyone else and then proceeded to the bedroom WITHOUT even checking in with the host. Only to then chastise the host for your accommodations that she didn't even know you were occupying because AHEM you didn't even check in with her.

Had you greeted her discussed some stuff like the stair issue/period issue and how a dowstairs bathroom wouldn't really work then maybe she would have had an opportunity to work something with the other ladies. Looked like Karen and Ashley had separate rooms (one had two double beds) So I'm sure a compromise could have been made where Karen and Ashley could have shared that room and you and Robyn could have either shared the bed that Ashley was currently in or Robyn stays in that room while Gizelle stays in the room she's currently in and then shares the bathroom in Robyns room therefore solving the stair problem for Gizelle but giving Robyn more privacy and access since she's on her period.

Like damn. It ain't that hard to share a bathroom and since Robyn and Gizelle are such besties that should have been a workable solution. Actually it would have been a very gracious solution considering ya'll just rolled up unannounced and went straight to the bedroom to start the trash talk. LOL

So corny.

The first words out of Gizelles mouth to Wendy were instigating and shady.

You literally just said that you wanted to deny the woman use of your bathroom when you invited her to your house!

Ashley had a bathroom and was willing to share the bathroom, so all the dramatics were for nothing, though I agree that had Gizelle been even mildly pleasant, Wendy would have been more accommodating.

Robyn and Gizelle should have stayed home. Wendy didn't seem to try to force them into coming and I understand why. Pushing people to come to something they don't want to be at makes them and everyone else miserable.

Rlb8031 · October 13, 2021

10 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Disagree, this show isn't bad girls club or love and hip hop. This entire franchise hasn't been sold as one where physically fighting is an acceptable response to verbal annoyance.

This comparison always seems to be made about RHOP and RHOA, and everyone seems to forget that in HWs shows generally - NJ, OC, Miami - physical fighting isn't unusual.

16 minutes ago, RealReality said:

In HW, your words are supposed to be your weapon and all of the women are supposed to shit talk. There isn't some Emily Post etiquette rulebook of what they can and cannot say, but there is a notion that physical attacks against other cast members are unacceptable or an expected response. And this makes sense because it would have such a chilling effect.

While that may be the intent, I disagree that there is the same level of disapproval for fighting among the other casts. No one in NJ refused to film with Theresa after she flipped a table at a restaurant. No one refused to film with the husbands after Joe and his brother-in-law went at it. Hell, even after both were convicted of a CRIME, they were still on the show and filming. None of their violence was seen as being a negative reflection of the show.

And don't get me started on the drink and food throwing which seems to be a staple across all the versions of this program, especially the franchises that historically did not contain women of color. The concept that if you push someone too far or you are too outrageous, you'll get met with a physical response is the same in the HW universe as it is in the real world. That possibility exists, which is why everyone needs to be mindful of both their words and actions. I don't think that it's fair to create this false reality for what level of behavior HWs are held to, then accuse everyone but Candace, of not behaving appropriately. She is completely aware of what she does and complicit in the negative outcomes from these interactions.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

7 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

This comparison always seems to be made about RHOP and RHOA, and everyone seems to forget that in HWs shows generally - NJ, OC, Miami - physical fighting isn't unusual.

While that may be the intent, I disagree that there is the same level of disapproval for fighting among the other casts. No one in NJ refused to film with Theresa after she flipped a table at a restaurant. No one refused to film with the husbands after Joe and his brother-in-law went at it. Hell, even after both were convicted of a CRIME, they were still on the show and filming. None of their violence was seen as being a negative reflection of the show.

And don't get me started on the drink and food throwing which seems to be a staple across all the versions of this program, especially the franchises that historically did not contain women of color. The concept that if you push someone too far or you are too outrageous, you'll get met with a physical response is the same in the HW universe as it is in the real world. That possibility exists, which is why everyone needs to be mindful of both their words and actions. I don't think that it's fair to create this false reality for what level of behavior HWs are held to, then accuse everyone but Candace, of not behaving appropriately. She is completely aware of what she does and complicit in the negative outcomes from these interactions.

Wow, I made my comments referencing the other cities before even seeing your response.. Just thought I would point out the coincidence. LOL

RealReality · October 13, 2021

2 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

This is why how a housewife moves makes all the difference. Mia laughed that chick off, multiple times. Of course shit is gonna get started. That's the staple of the franchise. This whole who started what isn't the point cause we all know there's gonna be some petty drama started in some way shape or form. It's HOW it continues to proceed. Who are the one's that stick pretty much to the unspoken agreements of on air behavior and then there are those that want to step out of those parameters and test the waters bringing elements to the disagreement that take it to a whole other level. Those are the one's I scowl at cause it turns the amusing petty drama into very ugly experiences that most people don't want to see when watching these shows cause yeah, if we wanted that we'd tune into love and hip hop.

I take issue with any housewife Potomac, Atlanta, Jersey, Salt Lake, New York that steers away from that general format and knowingly and purposely introduces compromising antics that will escalate conflict into a more dire (physical) exchange. Don't get me wrong, if a housewife takes the bait and acts then that's between you and you're lawyer and the unemployment office but I'm not gonna see it as a one sided offense.

The point about lighting a match seems to suggest that who starts the fight is important as you cannot be mad about how high the flames go when you light the match or start the fight, which Candace did not do either time.

What are these unspoken agreements? Not to involve family members who aren't castmembers? Because people have talked shit about Ray, who is not a castmember but was on the show.

What is the general format?

Your statement that "knowingly and purposely introduces compromising antics that will escalate conflict into a more dire (physical) exchange." seems nebulous and vague, what are compromising antics that escalate conflict? Because I certainly think that Robyn running after Monique in the street and daring her to "drag her" would qualify as an antic that would escalate conflict into a more dire and physical exchange, but I heard nary a word about it. I would think that Robyn putting her fingers in Ashley's face when she came into OZ wuld qualify as an antic that would escalate conflict into a more dire and physical exchange, but I never heard much feedback about that.

And so, it makes me wonder if different rules are applied to what some castmembers.

RealReality · October 13, 2021

14 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

This comparison always seems to be made about RHOP and RHOA, and everyone seems to forget that in HWs shows generally - NJ, OC, Miami - physical fighting isn't unusual.

While that may be the intent, I disagree that there is the same level of disapproval for fighting among the other casts. No one in NJ refused to film with Theresa after she flipped a table at a restaurant. No one refused to film with the husbands after Joe and his brother-in-law went at it. Hell, even after both were convicted of a CRIME, they were still on the show and filming. None of their violence was seen as being a negative reflection of the show.

And don't get me started on the drink and food throwing which seems to be a staple across all the versions of this program, especially the franchises that historically did not contain women of color. The concept that if you push someone too far or you are too outrageous, you'll get met with a physical response is the same in the HW universe as it is in the real world. That possibility exists, which is why everyone needs to be mindful of both their words and actions. I don't think that it's fair to create this false reality for what level of behavior HWs are held to, then accuse everyone but Candace, of not behaving appropriately. She is completely aware of what she does and complicit in the negative outcomes from these interactions.

Isolated incidents prove the general rule that this franchise is not about physically attacking other castmembers for saying things you don't like. Even if those thing are outrageous.

I don't count lettuce throwing and wine throwing as physical attacks, the same way I don't consider the affair of the butter knife a physical attack. And flipping a table, as abhorrent as it is, is not the same as physically attacking another castmember.

And there is not a notion, even in the real world that if you push someone too far with words, physical attack is an acceptable response. This isn't acceptable in the workplace, this isn't acceptable in public, this would even be jarring for most people to hear about in a domestic situation.

I don't care how much shit a woman is talking to a man, most anyone who hears that he hauled off and hit her is going to find that an unacceptable response.

And at least in my case, the reverse would be true as well. No matter how much shit a man is talking to you, hauling off and hitting him i an unacceptable response.

Edited October 13, 2021 by RealReality

drivethroo · October 13, 2021

5 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

Had you greeted her discussed some stuff like the stair issue/period issue and how a dowstairs bathroom wouldn't really work then maybe she would have had an opportunity to work something with the other ladies.

No, it wouldn't and it shouldn't. Wendy would've had the same reaction either way and she would have every right to have a negative reaction:

Let's say I'm allergic to meat. I have a problem with you and I text you and everybody in our friend group that I'm not coming to your party because I don't like your attitude. You say, ok whatever and plan your menu and the main course is meat.

I show up to your dinner party and see the main course is meat. Should I then be able to ask you to fix me a plate of fish when a) I wasn't expected to come and b) there's no fish in the house because I wasn't expected to come and the main course that was planned was meat?

If I don't like it, I can eat some green beans or nibble on a roll. Or, I could leave and go to a restaurant.

Under no circumstances should the host scramble to accommodate me and my meat allergy when I told them I wasn't coming in the first place.

None of the others should have to give up their rooms or scramble to accommodate Robyn or Gizelle either.

If Robyn & Gizelle don't like the accommodations, they are free to see if a room at the Sleep Inn is available and go there.

7 minutes ago, RealReality said:

People who physically attack always have "a reason"

If you want to physically attack somebody, you're going to do it. If I'm going to attack the girl at McDonalds by jumping over the counter and smacking her up I'm going to do it whether there's 2 bags of ketchup instead of 3, there's only 1 napkin in the bag, you gave me Fanta orange soda instead of Hi-C Orange or because the cheeseburger is cold and slid off the bun. There's always a justification and excuse.

3 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

I take issue with any housewife Potomac, Atlanta, Jersey, Salt Lake, New York that steers away from that general format and knowingly and purposely introduces compromising antics that will escalate conflict into a more dire (physical) exchange

Again, like Mia? Because we can excuse her for putting her hands in Candiace's face (the cast certainly has) but what's the excuse for putting her hands in Wendy's face on 3 separate occasions (and touching her unwanted)? Why is Candiace waving her hands in somebody's face Code Red but Mia waving her hands in Wendy's face is not even on the radar?

3 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

I don't think that it's fair to create this false reality for what level of behavior HWs are held to, then accuse everyone but Candace, of not behaving appropriately.

What's unfair is Candiace does X and she needs the death penalty.

Mia, Ashley, Monique, Robyn, Gizelle do X, it's well they were wrong but Candiace still needs the death penalty because of her slick mouth/provoking ways/she deserved it

...When 99% of the time Candiace did X in RESPONSE to Mia, Ashley, Monique, etc doing X to her.

That's what people are pointing out. The double standards and extreme standards that are applied to Candiace and only Candiace, when the vast majority of the time Candiace is responding to the bullshit the other cast members fueled.

Just now, Yours Truly said:

This comparison always seems to be made about RHOP and RHOA, and everyone seems to forget that in HWs shows generally - NJ, OC, Miami - physical fighting isn't unusual.

The difference between RHOP and RHOA is RHOA never pretended it was about classy upper crusty women in exclusive organizations and connections to important people. RHOP was "We're the Black Bill Gates, we associate with the Obamas etc." If we don't like you, we're not going to flip a table at you, we're going to call all of our friends and have you shut out of society (which is what Charrisse did to Monique in real life).

I don't think you're going to see Kathy Hilton or Lisa Vanderpump slugging a bitch like the New Jersey people. Monique celebrating her fight brought the Love & Hip Hop, table flipping element to this show and this crowd will not be satisfied until they see more fights. This is why Gizelle told Monique at Karen's house that barn incident destroyed everything they tried not to have RHOP become.

They can fire Candiace today but the new RHOP audience will not rest until somebody else's ass get beat. Why not hire Blac Chyna and her friends to join the cast next?

9 minutes ago, RealReality said:

And so, it makes me wonder if different rules are applied to what some castmembers.

That's what people are noticing and pointing out. It's not that people "love" Candiace and want to excuse her; it's that people see a standard being applied to Candiace (and only Candiace) but not to other people but we're being told X action means Y reaction needs to happen and Y reaction is not happening. Where are the calls for Mia's ass to get beat? Why aren't there calls for Mia's ass to get beat? And if we're not demanding Mia get her ass beat for doing the exact same thing Candiace does, then what Candiace does isn't really the issue, it's Candiace's existence that's the issue.

Example: Meghan Markle wore dark nail polish & caressed her pregnant belly and its against protocol. She doesn't know how to act right. Kate caresses her pregnant belly, it's crickets. Sophie wears dark nail polish, it's crickets. The problem isn't the belly or the nail polish, it's that you exist and you're here and we don't want you to exist or be here.

Talented Tenth · October 13, 2021

2 hours ago, drivethroo said:

But who started the conflict? Candiace didn't storm down to Mia and say "Bitch yo momma is low budget." Candiace initially asked her why she was asking Dorothy about if Chris was getting paid. Mia, knowing she was wrong and wanting to deflect from that, responded with "Well your video was low budget."

In this instance, it doesn't matter to me who started it. There are certain behaviors and words that are disgusting and cross a line. Everybody has to be accountable for their actions -- not just accountable depending on who starts it. If you flip me off unprovoked and I pull out a bazooka, you started it, but using the bazooka would be disproportionate to a finger. I wouldn't be off the hook because you started it. Let's be clear, we may be arguing two different points. My point is that this season, Candiace has done something that crossed a line for me which is insult someone's mother. It was a total turn off to me as someone who defended Candiace all last season and liked what appeared to be a maturing Candiace until the "your mother's low budget" comment.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

I mean picking up a butter knife and repeatedly slamming it against a table while having a heated disagreement with someone, then standing up and wagging it at that same someone while continuing to argue seems like a pretty obvious example of aggressiveness and escalation......

..any other examples of a housewives aggressiveness falls into this category as well. The chasing or approaching, or reaching out at all, fall into distasteful behavior for me. (Across the franchise) This suggests a physical altercation is the goal and I don't condone instigating physical altercations. Some need more schooling on what this actually entails and others not so much. It's a slippery slope and the women on these shows should really get spun up on what may or may not constitute a situation going all the way left.

Any cast member feigning ignorance won't help any of them from being snatched. I mean instinct should be a helpful guide. All I know is that I understand completely what creates the environment Candance continuously finds herself in and I truly believe Candace does too.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

24 minutes ago, RealReality said:

I don't count lettuce throwing and wine throwing as physical attacks, the same way I don't consider the affair of the butter knife a physical attack. And flipping a table, as abhorrent as it is, is not the same as physically attacking another castmember.

So physical aggression is okay it's only physical contact that's wrong?

That's an odd measuring stick but okay, I guess.

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

Imma need Mia to keep that laughing energy she applies to Candace all the live long day. Completely gets under her skin and I am here for it. LOL!

She needs to sit down with Ashley and get a few pointers so she can just keep sipping her drink (oh sit down with Wendy for that hysterical skill as well) and watch Candace start off with smirks and condescension but then spiral into her unhinged tantrums for Chris to sort out. Leave it at that and ignore the brat.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

drivethroo · October 13, 2021

22 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

If you flip me off unprovoked and I pull out a bazooka, you started it, but using the bazooka would be disproportionate to a finger.

So you would agree Monique beating Candiace's ass for twirling and saying GOODNIGHT was disproportionate, correct?

22 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

There are certain behaviors and words that are disgusting and cross a line. Everybody has to be accountable for their actions -- not just accountable depending on who starts it.

The problem is only CANDIACE is held accountable for her actions. Everyone else's actions get a "Yes, but."

Ashley was wrong at the table, BUT

Gizelle told Wendy she wasn't coming, BUT

Mia had her hands in Candiace's face, BUT

22 minutes ago, Talented Tenth said:

My point is that this season, Candiace has done something that crossed a line for me which is insult someone's mother.

And that's fine. Just keep that same energy when somebody says something slick about Candiace's mother.

19 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

I mean picking up a butter knife and repeatedly slamming it against a table while having a heated disagreement with someone, then standing up and wagging it at that same someone while continuing to argue seems like a pretty obvious example of aggressiveness and escalation......

So is continuing to go inside of the house of the person slamming the knife on the table. If somebody is slamming knives and throwing things and they tell you to get out of their house and you keep going back in their house and getting in their face to argue with them, who is actually escalating the situation?

19 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

and I don't condone instigating physical altercations.

But you will get your giggle on if a physical altercation happens to someone you don't like and feels deserves it.

14 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

So physical aggression is okay it's only physical contact that's wrong?

It was certainly ok when Ashley kept going inside of Candiace's house to get up in her face and yell about "her momma's house and her momma's table".

It was certainly ok when Robyn drove to another state to put her fingers in Ashley's face.

It was certainly ok when Robyn challenged Monique on the streets with an umbrella to Monique's neck.

It's apparently now ok when Mia puts her hands in Wendy's face and touches Wendy and says "Whatcha gon' do about it?"

4 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

Imma need Mia to keep that laughing energy she applies to Candace all the live long day. Completely gets under her skin and I am here for it. LOL!

Candiace's comment about Mia being "handsome" got under Mia's skin and she is much more bothered by that than "yo momma." Mia isn't up on social media crying every 5 minutes about "yo momma." Mia wasn't bothered by "yo momma," the rest of the cast was bothered by "yo momma."

Mia sho' is pressed about being called "handsome," though.

Edited October 13, 2021 by drivethroo

Yours Truly · October 13, 2021

1 hour ago, Talented Tenth said:

My point is that this season, Candiace has done something that crossed a line for me which is insult someone's mother. It was a total turn off to me as someone who defended Candiace all last season and liked what appeared to be a maturing Candiace until the "your mother's low budget" comment.

And yet Mia still didn't initially bring any other objects into the situation.

These physical reactions don't happen in some vacuum. There is a specific context involved especially in situations with one common denominator. Three guesses what that is..

Edited October 13, 2021 by Yours Truly

Rlb8031 · October 13, 2021

52 minutes ago, RealReality said:

What are these unspoken agreements? Not to involve family members who aren't castmembers? Because people have talked shit about Ray, who is not a castmember but was on the show.

"Families are off-limits" is an oft repeated phrase on camera across all the HW franchises along with its corollary "especially kids" - anytime someone goes too far.

That unwritten but frequently spoken rule is also accompanied by another rule which is "Husbands are off-limits unless and until they get into the women's business." That was true for Denise Richards husband on BH, for Peter on Atlanta, and for PK on BH. One reason I think Karen is still salty at Gizelle is that she broke that unwritten rule with her shirt and her Erica Lyles story. And Ray, who in the earlier seasons tried to be nothing but polite to all the women, is now noticeably catty whenever he gets the opportunity to speak on some HW drama. The true husband shit-talking seems to be limited to 1) husbands who have wronged their wife (Michael/Pot, Tom G./BH, Apollo/Atl.) 2) husbands who have direct beef with another HW (Todd/Phadra/Porsha, Michael/Candiace, Denise's Husband/everybody) and 3) husbands whose wife should be pissed at them but aren't (Robyn, Dorit/BH).

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