S05.E10: Liberty

[PrincessPurrsALot]

With victory in sight for his bank, Axe plots to secure his deposits by poaching from Prince, a move that proves more complicated than it seems. Chuck, Prince and Sacker wrestle with the personal cost of their plan. Taylor looks to enlist an old foe. Wags prepares for a big day.

Original air date 2021.09.19

[dwmarch]

I loved this episode. I'm not sure quite what is going on timeline-wise here (is the pandemic over or did it just start?) but other than that, I thought there was so much good stuff in this one.

I still think Chuck Sr. is entirely in league with Chuck Jr. I'm not entirely sure what the long con is but it seems like maybe they're going to encourage Axe to invest heavily in the cannabis sector and then trip him up with federal laws? I'm pretty sure they didn't have that dinner so everyone could figure out how to make Prince even richer and I'm pretty sure they didn't bring marijuana up by accident.

For no particular reason, I loved the silent scene where Chuck is making breakfast after smoking a joint with Prince. It was awkward but not cringe-worthy and I found it hilarious. It kind of reminded me of the shwarma scene at the end of the first Avengers.

I also loved that Chuck's daughter came in and asked "what's that smell?" Did Prince bring the cheeba with him? I guess in NYC you could probably get it delivered to your door any time of day or night.

Has Wendy carried a torch for Axe for a long time now? I'm sure if I rewatched earlier seasons it might be more apparent. And while on one hand I want to say that it's not particularly realistic to tell someone you tanked their relationship because you think they'd be better off with you and then have that person respond with affection, on the other hand Axe did just give Wendy 25 million dollars. "Things are different between us now" indeed.

Wags, you are so much fun. Seeing him put out various office fires while trying to have a romantic date in his glass office was gold for something that could have otherwise come across as too slapstick. Instead we get a steady parade of Axe employees interrupting him for entirely valid reasons until we get to poor Tuk who learns in detail that "NOBODY LIKES COLD COQ!" Wrapping it up with Wags finding out that the gal he was wooing was hesitant until he dropped the facade of a nice guy was great.

Speaking of dropping the facade of being nice, Taylor casually executes a lieutenant for disloyalty. That was also fantastic. Taylor has been through a lot and I can see how they got here.

[aghst]

Wendy walks in masked and then takes it off?  Only on TV.  Wags and Wendy maskless, everyone else had to wear masks.  Everyone else being lower on the org chart.

At some point they just dropped the pretense because they didn't want their actors masked.

I forget why Axe wanted the bank so bad.  He's suppose to be wildly successful, he can decide to give Wendy $25 million in an instant so I'm not sure how a bank makes him way more money than he already has.  I don't know that marijuana money is that great yet.  It's not legal at the federal level so he's kind of skipping ahead.

Also, he's been chasing a bank for a year now but didn't have a specific strategy until Mason told him -- they are part of the con -- about MJ money?  Kind of suggests that Axe flies by the seat of his pants and gets lucky most of the times.

Of course it's so obvious Chuck and Prince are trying to bait him, the way they're hanging out.  I thought the egg scene was ridiculous, no dialog for a couple of minutes or however long it was.  Point is that Chuck and Prince are best buds now, more than just allies with a common enemy?

Thing is, they're never going to catch Axe until maybe the end of the series -- maybe not even then.  So it's hard for the viewer to believe this scheme is going to succeed where all the previous schemes have failed.  It may seem like they're building towards some climax where Axe is brought down but the more likely outcome is that Prince will get broken and will be off the show long before Axe.  It'll probably be something like Rian telling Axe that Taylor oversold the marijuana strategy -- it's suppose to be red light but Taylor told Axe it was yellow light.  Or Lauren turning on Taylor after they broke off their relationship and Lauren was going to move out of Taylor's place.

 

Wags' date is suppose to be comic relief for the episode.  He keeps getting cockblocked and he's finally had it so he bullies the Indian guy and the date finds that an aphrodisiac, punching down on a beta as she calls him.  Otherwise, we're suppose to believe Wags has this incredible charm that he attracts these beautiful women younger than his own daughter when it's more likely his fat wallet.

 

Wendy is going to be paying alimony because she makes so much more than Chuck but Chuck demands $25 million so Wendy borrows from Axe and believes she's the only one he won't screw over.

She's flattered that Bobby sabotaged her relationship with "dime-store Pollock" and says she never allowed herself to think of them being together.  Give me a break.  He's been rewarding her like crazy for years.  As soon as she separated from Chuck and he was already divorced from Lara, they would have been fucking like rabbits.  She knows everything about Axe, what he's done.  Obviously she's into moral compromise or is willing to take a lot of money to enable him.  All of a sudden, after almost 5 full seasons, she's thinking for the first time that they could be a couple?

 

 

[chocolatine]

Just to clarify, Axe didn't "give" Wendy $25M, he bought $25M worth of her Mason Carbon shares, with a verbal agreement to sell them back to her at par once she's more liquid. That, plus Wendy telling Taylor that she is the only person Axe would never screw over, probably means that he *will* screw her over regarding those shares, especially if Mason Carbon's valuation goes up.

Regarding the eggs scene, was anyone else bothered by how Chuck was cooking them? It was like he couldn't decide whether he was making scrambled eggs or an omelette. They came out looking overcooked. Maybe that was the point because Chuck was high.

Edited September 20, 2021 by chocolatine

[aghst]

2 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Just to clarify, Axe didn't "give" Wendy $25M, he bought $25M worth of her Mason Carbon shares, with a verbal agreement to sell them back to her at par once she's more liquid. That, plus Wendy telling Taylor that she is the only person Axe would never screw over, probably means that he *will* screw her over regarding those shares, especially if Mason Carbon's valuation goes up.

Sure but if she said "I need $25 million or else Chuck is going to get a look at Mason Carbon and Axe Capital's books."

Or she could have also said "I need $25 million to make Chuck go away forever and out of my life and I'm free to be yours."

$25 million is suppose to be nothing to Chuck and we're suppose to believe he's got all that marijuana money coming.

[janeta]

Have we seen Chelsea before? If so, someone pls remind me who she is?

The egg scene was ridiculous. 

[txhorns79]

41 minutes ago, janeta said:

The egg scene was ridiculous. 

I wondered if they realized they were running short, and had to come up with something last minute.  Otherwise, I really had no idea why the show dedicated so much time to a mostly wordless scene of Chuck going through the entire process of preparing eggs for his daughter and Prince.

[Cotypubby]

12 hours ago, dwmarch said:

I loved this episode. I'm not sure quite what is going on timeline-wise here (is the pandemic over or did it just start?) but other than that, I thought there was so much good stuff in this one.

They had made several references to the very beginning of the pandemic in previous episodes, Bobby mentioning something about “coronavirus” during the last episode before the hiatus last summer, and then more recently in these new episodes Rhodes Sr’s doctor mentioned how it was good he was getting the new kidney now because the hospitals will soon be overrun “by that Chinese bug.” I think there was also something on one of the TV screens in the premiere that referenced it. This appears to date the first two episodes of this season as being set around February/very early March 2020. This new one starts with Axe talking about how he was able to get most of his workforce vaccinated through loopholes, which means it is probably now around Jan 2021, when there was a vaccine but it was not yet available to everyone. So they basically jumped a full year between last week and this weeks episodes.

 

3 hours ago, aghst said:

Wendy walks in masked and then takes it off?  Only on TV.  Wags and Wendy maskless, everyone else had to wear masks.  Everyone else being lower on the org chart.

At some point they just dropped the pretense because they didn't want their actors masked.

Well but at least they immediately gave an explanation for that, they had all been vaccinated and Axe had them all rapid tested that morning. This isn’t like on Law & Order where the main characters would take off their masks while still in 2020. That was just stupid. 

Edited September 20, 2021 by Cotypubby

[spookyish]

2 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I wondered if they realized they were running short, and had to come up with something last minute.  Otherwise, I really had no idea why the show dedicated so much time to a mostly wordless scene of Chuck going through the entire process of preparing eggs for his daughter and Prince.

I recognized the egg scene immediately. It was an homage to the movie “Big Night” from 1996, and the end scene with Stanley Tucci making an omelette to share with Tony Shaloub and Marc Anthony. They even had the actors just copycat the original movements of the Big Night performers in the scene.

Big Night Omelette Scene

Loved that movie.

 

[Cotypubby]

12 minutes ago, spookyish said:

I recognized the egg scene immediately. It was an homage to the movie “Big Night” from 1996, and the end scene with Stanley Tucci making an omelette to share with Tony Shaloub and Marc Anthony. They even had the actors just copycat the original movements of the Big Night performers in the scene.

Big Night Omelette Scene

Loved that movie.

 

What a strange homage to do. I don’t get the point of adding that here or why it has any relation to this series. The scene in this show was just so whyyy? 

[l star]

Wags certainly tattles quick. Did he really believe that girl liked him because he was nice? Come on Wags. At least he was in the right lane this ep- Wags should always be no more than comic relief.

It's so fitting that Wendy was honest on her disclosures and prepared to write the check for however much needed and yet Chuck is still holding it up with his bullshit. Then he wouldn't even answer the phone. Asshole.

I skipped most of Chuck's dinner. I got at the end that apparently it was a setup? Somehow they knew that Wendy would call and Ira would show her the board and she would tell Axe and he would call Senior and Senior would show up uninvited. That's a step too far for me. Maybe if Chuck and Prince came up with the plan on the fly once Senior showed up I could buy it, but that's not what I understood.

I completely understood Lauren's position. Taylor was very presumptuous to assume that she would stay. I hope Lauren sticks around working for Axe. I like Lauren. Better than Taylor this ep. 

16 hours ago, dwmarch said:

Has Wendy carried a torch for Axe for a long time now? I'm sure if I rewatched earlier seasons it might be more apparent. And while on one hand I want to say that it's not particularly realistic to tell someone you tanked their relationship because you think they'd be better off with you and then have that person respond with affection, on the other hand Axe did just give Wendy 25 million dollars. "Things are different between us now" indeed.

I actually believed Wendy that she's never seriously thought about Axe that way. Not that she's never been attracted, but I don't think she ever took it seriously. If anything, I think he was her 'perfect' alternative to Chuck (like when her license was being threatened) that she looked to when he was pissing her off. He's her big moments, save the day guy. I think this has been coming from Axe for a while though. At least since last season. I was surprised he was so honest about it though. I expected him to stick with the passive aggression for awhile longer. The progressive honestly without any guaranteed, immediate payoff was unexpected but nice. I still think he's just been waiting on her to say go though.

I hope Wendy is right. In the midst of all his crap, Axe needs a positive relationship or trait. I liked knowing that he would say yes just because it was Wendy. I liked knowing that she could have just asked him to hand it to her and he would have though that method wouldn't have included the future loyalty test. He's even earned her faith at this point. So I'm going to be disappointed if this season ends with him screwing her over.

[NoReally]

8 hours ago, spookyish said:

I recognized the egg scene immediately. It was an homage to the movie “Big Night” from 1996, and the end scene with Stanley Tucci making an omelette to share with Tony Shaloub and Marc Anthony. They even had the actors just copycat the original movements of the Big Night performers in the scene.

Right down to the loaf of crusty bread (not toast) torn (not cut) into pieces.

Perfect.

[aghst]

Why would Billions viewers want to see a “homage” or copycat scene from a relatively obscure movie?

How does that movie or the characters there relate to Billions?

It is such a contrast to Billions, which is dialog-heavy, with lines full of pop cultural references.

Oh is the scene suppose to be a visual reference?  In any event, it wasn’t interesting to see Giamatti make eggs.  When he flipped it it splattered so he’s not some wiz in the kitchen.

Have they ever shown him cooking before?  Or Wendy for that matter when they lived together?  He had cooks and servers when he had that little dinner the night before.  So why show him cooking now?

BTW this reminds me, Wendy doesn’t seem to care about seeing the kids.  She left him with Chuck, who can make them eggs.  She lives in a spacious apartment and has millions.

To be fair kids have been mostly afterthoughts or props on the show.  The main characters are parents but it seems they all prioritize their work over their families or parenting.  They tried to have Bobby depicted as a dedicated parent early on but he let them go with Lara, only to have a recent episode where Axe goes to bully the teachers or headmaster at his son’s private school.

Bobby and Wendy are now unencumbered by kids from banging.

 

Edited September 20, 2021 by aghst

[dwmarch]

38 minutes ago, aghst said:

It is such a contrast to Billions, which is dialog-heavy, with lines full of pop cultural references.

Short answer: this is typically what happens after you smoke a joint.

Longer answer: this show rarely ever gives us quiet moments from these characters. Everyone is always rushing to a meeting or the next conflict. Everyone always has a deadline that they are trying to beat or some new opponent scheming against them. Scenes of downtime are typically edited out to keep the tension high. But in this case, we get to see Chuck casually making breakfast for daughter and his houseguest. A quiet moment in the midst of what I'm sure will be a tumultuous season. I can see why it didn't work for everyone but I thought it was great.

[Marley]

That egg scene was annoying as hell to me lol. I kept waiting for something to happen. The eggs looked kind of lame too. Then just a ripped off piece of bread lol.

I’m sure they’re setting Axe up tho somehow. I’m probably the only one but I’m rooting against Chuck. He bugs me and is Axe the only Person he ever investigates lol. Like is there no other crime going on?

I like Axe and Wendy getting together. Again I don’t know why but I hope it works out. It’s been clear for a while to me at least they have always had a thing for one another.

Not gonna lie too I’m pretty confused about what is going on with the bank lol.

[Cotypubby]

Yeah I have completely forgotten why Axe wants a bank and why it’s such a big deal. Honestly most of time my eyes totally gloss over whenever they start going into the technical details of whatever stock market/banking/political intrigue thing they’re doing, they might as well be speaking Klingon. All I know is Axe wants to be a bank, Chuck doesn’t want Axe to be a bank, and now Chuck, Taylor & Prince are working together to stop Axe from getting a bank. 

[roughing it]

13 hours ago, Marley said:

It’s been clear for a while to me at least they have always had a thing for one another.

Ever since Season 1 (I think) when Axe made Wendy enter the pool naked I knew they would get together.  I don't like either of them so they can have each other.  

[ahpny]

Though this show has little in common with "Moonlighting," the "now, after all these years, they're finally getting together" plot development seems to pose some of the same risks as in "Moonlighting." Of course "Moonlighting" was light, situation comedy and this is a semi-serious drama.  But "Moonlighting" was never the same after the two lead characters got together because the central tension of that show was whether, how and when they would get together. While the central tension of "Billions" includes the Wendy-Axe relationship, it includes much more as well. I fear if they do get together, this will detract from the show and cause fundamental problems.

Axe is an interesting character because however great his misdeeds and motives may be, there were certain lines he would not cross. He never cheated on Lara, nor seemed even tempted to cheat on her. While he or Wendy were married (though I suppose Wendy is still technically married since the divorce isn't final), he was never sexually inappropriate with her (emotionally perhaps, which Lara did resent and pick up on that). A Wendy-Axe pairing would make both characters less interesting, more conventional, and soapy. That's not what makes this show interesting.

Who's playing the long con on whom is becoming a bit tedious. And why wasn't Wendy suspicious of being shown (by her soon to be ex husband's lawyer's phone!) who was at that dinner party? She should have picked up on that. In real life, that lawyer would never call Wendy and only speak with Wendy's lawyer, btw.

[aghst]

It might suggest they're out of ideas, to go there with Bobby and Wendy after all these seasons.

Wendy was mad at Axe for about a minute in season 3 or 4 and she's back in the fold, collecting the big paychecks.

The way Bobby blows her up as the most important person after him, even though she doesn't make a single trade or win over big clients, this would have happened much sooner.  

The other part of it is that all those traders do not question Wendy's importance whereas in real life, you better bet those trader bros would resent the hell out of her.

When they start sleeping with each other, their resentment would only grow, her getting 8-figure compensation for basically being a life coach, while the rest of them bust their tails to make their numbers every quarter, if not every day.

 

 

[l star]

On 9/20/2021 at 9:36 PM, Marley said:

I’m sure they’re setting Axe up tho somehow. I’m probably the only one but I’m rooting against Chuck. He bugs me and is Axe the only Person he ever investigates lol. Like is there no other crime going on?

I'm always rooting against Chuck. Even if he's arguably right, I dislike him so much that I don't care. To me, the only saving grace for Chuck's storyline right now is Prince. I get why Prince hates Axe. He deserves everything he's getting from Prince because this vendetta of his is stupid and entirely self-inflicted.

I don't know why Chuck is still so crazy for Axe unless he's supposed to be obsessed, which I don't buy. Originally I thought it was about Wendy. Chuck was always jealous of her relationship with Axe. But Chuck and Wendy have been over for awhile now. Maybe that's why they're hooking Wendy and Axe up- to give Chuck something new to be mad about and feel betrayed over.

10 hours ago, ahpny said:

Axe is an interesting character because however great his misdeeds and motives may be, there were certain lines he would not cross. He never cheated on Lara, nor seemed even tempted to cheat on her. While he or Wendy were married (though I suppose Wendy is still technically married since the divorce isn't final), he was never sexually inappropriate with her (emotionally perhaps, which Lara did resent and pick up on that). A Wendy-Axe pairing would make both characters less interesting, more conventional, and soapy. That's not what makes this show interesting.

I agree that those lines make Axe interesting. That's why I'm hoping he doesn't fail this loyalty test they've set up. Even if he's only a gentleman for Wendy, he needs to have some redeeming traits. I disagree that the pairing will make the characters less interesting. In the early part of the series, there was a lot more focus on the personal lives of Axe, Wendy and Chuck. They've gradually worked away from that with Axe. Lately all we see from Axe is power plays and vendettas. Losing his family and personal relationships has diminished him and left his character to be defined by the bro culture of Axe Cap. Giving him a life outside of Axe Cap and a relationship that is even remotely genuine can only help the character in my opinion.

I don't think much will change for Wendy. Axe has been her main relationship for awhile.

9 hours ago, aghst said:

When they start sleeping with each other, their resentment would only grow, her getting 8-figure compensation for basically being a life coach, while the rest of them bust their tails to make their numbers every quarter, if not every day.

She may only be a life coach, but she's supposedly a damn good one. One thing the show has told us repeatedly is that Wendy pulls her weight with the traders and Axe. What is there to resent? Just because her skills are different than the others doesn't make them less valuable. And I will be very surprised if the guys are shocked at the thought of Wendy and Axe anyway. Wendy and Axe are very close and their marriages have both fallen apart in recent years. It's not much of a leap to a sexual relationship between them at this point.

The only people I expect to have a problem with Wendy/Axe are Wags and Taylor. Maybe Mafee. I think we've already seen how Taylor will react. Wags should be very threatened by a new relationship status in their trio. He may be Axe's guy, but he hasn't been in first position with him in awhile. Every screwup (like this ep) is a threat to his influence. When Wendy and Axe get involved, that will push him even further aside.

Edited September 22, 2021 by l star

[anne uk]

Did anyone else notice Mike Prince's reaction to Chuck's daughter? Jumped to attention and straightened his clothing when she entered the room and then spent quite a lot of time fixated on her in the 'eggs' scene.  

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by anne uk
Edited in case I was being too weird...

[chick binewski]

On 9/20/2021 at 12:50 AM, spookyish said:

I recognized the egg scene immediately. It was an homage to the movie “Big Night” from 1996, and the end scene with Stanley Tucci making an omelette to share with Tony Shaloub and Marc Anthony. They even had the actors just copycat the original movements of the Big Night performers in the scene.

I could not figure out why the scene looked so familiar to me. Thanks.

On 9/20/2021 at 10:57 AM, dwmarch said:

we get to see Chuck casually making breakfast for daughter and his houseguest. A quiet moment in the midst of what I'm sure will be a tumultuous season. I can see why it didn't work for everyone but I thought it was great.

I may be off on this but watching the cooking scene I thought they were showing a comfortable trust of sorts between Chuck & Prince that we dont normally see on Billions - no posturing, no over the top pop culture (or Jeffersonian) references. And they purposely juxtaposed that with Wendy & Axe declaring feelings. Which will only end in lawsuits & tears. And unemployment for Wendy.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Weird bit of trickery Axe pulled to get rid of the unvaxxed people in a way they couldn't sue for. Just fire everyone!

Heritage bird. Where does one acquire such a thing and does one serve it with Freedom Fries? 😏

Who brings a date for a date at his office? Totally absurd to me that Wag's sweet young thing fell for him because she got to watch him swinging his d*ck around at work. She must have daddy issues.🙄

"We can trust him." Famous last words, Wendy. You're going to find out soon if your cooch is actually worth $25M.

[aghst]

I thought that word was "coach" when I first read it.😁

[Ottis]

Wendy and Ace are delusional. She’s just lonely. He will screw her over as soon as he believes he will gain enough personally.

Chuck Sr is definitely working with Chuck Jr.

Can’t quite figure out Prince’s angle. I suspect he is as bad as Axe but less obvious about it, and maybe less emotional.

Kept waiting for the breakfast scene to mean something. Chuck chuckled at one point. I wonder if he thought of a new idea.

Wags plays such a unique role at the firm. He does what he wants, amusing Axe, until Axe needs him, then he does whatever Axe wants. Then back to nuttiness. 

 

[Dianaofthehunt]

On 9/19/2021 at 9:56 PM, janeta said:

Have we seen Chelsea before? If so, someone pls remind me who she is?

The egg scene was ridiculous. 

The scrambled egg-making scene was a lovely tribute to “Big Night”  (1996).

Utterly bogus that Wag’s date would use the term “beta” to refer to Tuk. That’s how incels talk, not adult women.

 It takes 8 weeks to recover from a kidney transplant; probably longer, at Rhodes Sr.’s age. Get with reality, writers.

 

 

 

[Ottis]

On 8/7/2023 at 4:05 PM, Dianaofthehunt said:

The scrambled egg-making scene was a lovely tribute to “Big Night”  (1996).

Utterly bogus that Wag’s date would use the term “beta” to refer to Tuk. That’s how incels talk, not adult women.

 It takes 8 weeks to recover from a kidney transplant; probably longer, at Rhodes Sr.’s age. Get with reality, writers.

 

 

 

I have never seen The Big Night, but thank you for that. It clearly seemed to be a tribute, but I had no reference. Now, if they had shown the breakfast-making from the perspective of a fly, I would have gotten it!